Anyone drives an Electric Vehicle? I have a question about charging stations.

Casually Hardcore

So my mom decided to get a Chevy Bolt and I'm looking into getting a charging station install in her garage. From my understanding, the standard charging speed is about 4-5 miles per hour through a 120v outlet, and it only get quicker from there. I'm kind of tempted to get a 40amp charging outlet, but I can't justify it in my head. On a typical weekday, the car will be drive ~30-40 miles. She can recharge that in 10ish hours overnight easily using the 120v outlet. Worst case scenario the car will be driven 80-90 miles about once or twice a week. Weekends the car will be driven less then 20 miles.

So worse case scenario, the car is driven 360 miles a week. Assuming the car is charged 10 hours everyday, it'll be able to charge 280miles a week using a 120v outlet.

120v outlet doesn't quit meet the needs of the worse case scenario. So lets over engineer things a bit. A 220v 16amp charger can provide ~11 mile an hour. Using the above assumptions, this means the car can regain 770 miles a week. Which is more then twice the amount of the worse case scenario.

So, with this in mind, is there any reason to get a > 16 amp charger? I suppose I can consider 'future-proofing' but who knows what will be the standard 5-10 years from now.

mRahmani

If I remember correctly, the 220V charging is also more efficient than the standard 110V charger, resulting in a minor but notable energy savings. I would have to do some research on that to get solid numbers though. 220V also has the advantage of shorter charge times, making it easier to fully recharge the car during the "off peak" window to save money.

A lot of utility companies are (or were) offering subsidies to install the 220V chargers, which can bring down the cost a bit.

Do you deal with cold weather at all? Harsh cold can easily cut the range of the car in half, making a full charge every night a necessity.

bowen

The quality of life goes up with the better charging. If an emergency comes up your mother will be able to go places without having to make arrangements for travel because she's squeaking by on what the 120v will do.

Adding a 240v might be fairly inexpensive depending on where your panel is and if it has enough room and you have enough amperage coming in to support the new charger. If the panel is close to the garage the straight electrical costs of adding the line is probably maybe a couple hundred at the highest.

I would say go for it.

Casually Hardcore

I looked into rebates and it appears Colorado doesn't have any for residents. This is my biggest hesitation, because the government here is starting to push a EV initiative and it would kind of suck to spend a lot of money only to find out I could of saved a ton of money.

bowen

Yeah if you're moving over to a level 2 charging station that is probably costly too. So you're looking at probably at least 500-1000 for the charging station and 500-2000ish for the electrical work (depends on a lot of stuff though).

It's unfortunate they don't have any rebates for that. Maybe ask the dealership, might be some that aren't publicly searchable?

Radiation

State might not but city/county may so also check that out as well.

Where is the main breaker for the house in relation to the garage? Is a laundry room nearby?

Casually Hardcore

Sadly the bacon breaker is behind the house. Which is like 50 away from the garage.

Ketar

For us, the 120V outlet in our garage was only charging 3-4 miles worth of battery per hour. We had a 240V outlet installed and now charge ~23 miles worth per hour. I think the total cost for installation and permit/inspection was about $1,200. Our breaker was at the farthest possible point in the basement away from the garage.

mRahmani is absolutely right about cold weather though. Here in the Chicago area, when it gets really cold our actual range plummets. Trips can easily use twice the amount of battery they normally would. Not in typical winter cold, like now where the temp is in the 20s-30s, but when it starts getting down to less than 10 degrees you notice some drop off and it gets bad when the temp drops below zero. I wouldn't want to try to get through winter without faster charging - we would be visiting public charging stations regularly.

Donnicton

You can buy chargers that will use the 220-240v outlet, though you'll need to buy a charger within the amperage limits of that outlet. You can also have a charger installed that's wired directly into the breaker rather than through an outlet, and those can get kind of ludicrous charge speeds - though quite expensive to install if you're not an electrician yourself.

These higher amp chargers can be about $600-900 just for the unit, not counting any applicable electrician installation fees. There won't be significant enough energy savings(if any) to expect to recoup the cost for a long, long time - be fully aware that you'd mainly be going into this for convenience rather than savings.

Casually Hardcore

I'm not too concerned with winter weather because she'll most likely stay inside when it's super cold or she'll just me as her personal Uber during bad road conditions.

Looking around what's available around her, I notice there's a number of quick charge stations that can supplement her charging needs. So I think we're going to try the 120v outlet for now.

Ketar

Donnicton wrote: »

You can buy chargers that will use the 220-240v outlet, though you'll need to buy a charger within the amperage limits of that outlet. You can also have a charger installed that's wired directly into the breaker rather than through an outlet, and those can get kind of ludicrous charge speeds - though quite expensive to install if you're not an electrician yourself.

These higher amp chargers can be about $600-900 just for the unit, not counting any applicable electrician installation fees. There won't be significant enough energy savings(if any) to expect to recoup the cost for a long, long time - be fully aware that you'd mainly be going into this for convenience rather than savings.

We just plug our car straight into the 240V outlet with the cable and adapter that came with the car. 23 miles an hour is plenty for us, in 16 months with an EV we've never needed to charge faster than that.

dlinfiniti

there exist devices that can combine 2 120v outlets on different breakers into one 240 outlet, just make sure your wiring and load is good so as not to melt things or start fires

zepherin

bowen wrote: »

The quality of life goes up with the better charging. If an emergency comes up your mother will be able to go places without having to make arrangements for travel because she's squeaking by on what the 120v will do.

Adding a 240v might be fairly inexpensive depending on where your panel is and if it has enough room and you have enough amperage coming in to support the new charger. If the panel is close to the garage the straight electrical costs of adding the line is probably maybe a couple hundred at the highest.

I would say go for it.

This is going to be one of the few times I disagree with Bowen, the volt has an 8 gallon gas tank which kicks on when the vehicle runs low on juice. So in an emergency the vehicle is effectively a hybrid. I would save the money on a 220 unless the price is cheap.

mRahmani

dlinfiniti wrote: »

there exist devices that can combine 2 120v outlets on different breakers into one 240 outlet, just make sure your wiring and load is good so as not to melt things or start fires

That seems super sketchy and I would not recommend it for the sustained high draw an EV charger will pull unless a professional electrician specifically okays it.

zepherin wrote: »

bowen wrote: »

The quality of life goes up with the better charging. If an emergency comes up your mother will be able to go places without having to make arrangements for travel because she's squeaking by on what the 120v will do.

Adding a 240v might be fairly inexpensive depending on where your panel is and if it has enough room and you have enough amperage coming in to support the new charger. If the panel is close to the garage the straight electrical costs of adding the line is probably maybe a couple hundred at the highest.

I would say go for it.

This is going to be one of the few times I disagree with Bowen, the volt has an 8 gallon gas tank which kicks on when the vehicle runs low on juice. So in an emergency the vehicle is effectively a hybrid. I would save the money on a 220 unless the price is cheap.

This is a Bolt though, which doesn't have a gas backup.

bowen

zepherin wrote: »

bowen wrote: »

The quality of life goes up with the better charging. If an emergency comes up your mother will be able to go places without having to make arrangements for travel because she's squeaking by on what the 120v will do.

Adding a 240v might be fairly inexpensive depending on where your panel is and if it has enough room and you have enough amperage coming in to support the new charger. If the panel is close to the garage the straight electrical costs of adding the line is probably maybe a couple hundred at the highest.

I would say go for it.

This is going to be one of the few times I disagree with Bowen, the volt has an 8 gallon gas tank which kicks on when the vehicle runs low on juice. So in an emergency the vehicle is effectively a hybrid. I would save the money on a 220 unless the price is cheap.

Yeah bolt not volt, that threw me for a second too.

As for the panel not being in the garage, 50' isn't so bad... assuming there's a crawl space or attic that it can be run through.

zepherin

Well shit I was mistaken, without the gas backup, yeah she should probably get a 220 or 240, the fuse box should be there anyways so an electrician can run the home run in 15 ft.

evilmrhenry

Casually Hardcore wrote: »

I'm not too concerned with winter weather because she'll most likely stay inside when it's super cold or she'll just me as her personal Uber during bad road conditions.

Looking around what's available around her, I notice there's a number of quick charge stations that can supplement her charging needs. So I think we're going to try the 120v outlet for now.

Drive out to the quick charge stations to scope them out before you need them. These can be more complicated than they appear. You might find that some are private, with no provision for public use at all, while others might not have the correct charger for the car, and others might require a specific payment card, which you'll want to set up ahead of time.

As a side note: In general, the over 220v charging options are not designed for home use. While you can buy them, they're designed for the people installing commercial chargers.

bowen

110/120 and 220/240 are probably the two you will see with home use

There's also a hybrid ones that combine two 110/120 circuits to get to 220/240.

This is the one I see most recommended on the interweb: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B071CV8KVK/

E: they come in two varieties, hardwired and plug in... with the plug in one you can have the electrician run a 240v/32+A circuit with a NEMA 6-50 outlet and just plug that shit right in. Hardwired would require the electrician to also hook the unit into the circuit (which would require electricians to replace it if it breaks).

ceres

Quite a few gas stations around us have quick charge stations. My husband has talked once in a while about the possibility of picking up a cheap ev as his next car, but nothing in the entire valley is farther than 40 miles away. Our biggest problem is that we live in an apartment complex and we'd have to sit at a gas station for far too long waiting for a full charge.

bowen

ceres wrote: »

Quite a few gas stations around us have quick charge stations. My husband has talked once in a while about the possibility of picking up a cheap ev as his next car, but nothing in the entire valley is farther than 40 miles away. Our biggest problem is that we live in an apartment complex and we'd have to sit at a gas station for far too long waiting for a full charge.

Does your state require apartments to add a charging station if a resident requests it? I remember CA and I think Washington requiring it now.

evilmrhenry

bowen wrote: »

ceres wrote: »

Quite a few gas stations around us have quick charge stations. My husband has talked once in a while about the possibility of picking up a cheap ev as his next car, but nothing in the entire valley is farther than 40 miles away. Our biggest problem is that we live in an apartment complex and we'd have to sit at a gas station for far too long waiting for a full charge.

Does your state require apartments to add a charging station if a resident requests it? I remember CA and I think Washington requiring it now.

California has this law, but Washington does not. I suspect most non-California states don't have this yet if Washington doesn't have it. (Note that this law requires that the renter pay for installation and power, it's just that the landlord can't block the installation.)

ceres

I'm guessing not but I'd have to look into it. I think installing the better one is worth it if you don't have to spend however long sitting in a gas station one day because you don't have enough power to get home, though.

Donovan Puppyfucker

How much would it cost to have a 3 phase 415 volt 60 amp outlet fitted to your house? Charge your car battery in minutes! But also run a welder or an air compressor or a car hoist or any other industrial equipment you want, basically...

bowen

chrishallett83 wrote: »

How much would it cost to have a 3 phase 415 volt 60 amp outlet fitted to your house? Charge your car battery in minutes! But also run a welder or an air compressor or a car hoist or any other industrial equipment you want, basically...

A lot. I think you also need permission from the county to do it in residential buildings in some locations in the US if you're not using a phase converter.

Probably at least 5 digits at the bare minimum. Phase converter itself is probably going to run you 4k for something at that power level.