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Narwhal's Triumphant Return [Spaceflight & Exploration] Thread

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Posts

  • AimAim Registered User regular
    Water landing. Something went wrong.

  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    Sounds like the first stage may have had to abort the landing.

    "The shore does not dream of you." - Blind poet Gallan.
  • BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    Neat, they've never screwed up a RTLS landing before!

    Narwhal I think you should make "Sometimes while someone is explaining something to me, I am thinking about rockets" your signature
    Seal
  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    Delmain wrote: »
    What is that thing that flew across the camera's field of vision at T+3:20?

    E: I am having to watch without audio from work, so if they explained it, I apologize.

    It was frozen condensation.

    "The shore does not dream of you." - Blind poet Gallan.
  • BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    Brody wrote: »
    Delmain wrote: »
    What is that thing that flew across the camera's field of vision at T+3:20?

    E: I am having to watch without audio from work, so if they explained it, I apologize.

    It was frozen condensation.

    That was later in the flight, the event at +3:20 was the Dragon nosecone :)

    Narwhal I think you should make "Sometimes while someone is explaining something to me, I am thinking about rockets" your signature
    Zilla360Delmain
  • Mr_RoseMr_Rose 83 Blue Ridge Protects the Holy Registered User regular
    Ruh-roh! Spinny rocket did not come home today…

    ...because dragons are AWESOME! That's why.
    Nintendo Network ID: AzraelRose
    DropBox invite link - get 500MB extra free.
    BeNarwhalZilla360Seal
  • BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    Educated guess, first stage ran out of thruster propellant (for the second time), lost control authority

    Narwhal I think you should make "Sometimes while someone is explaining something to me, I am thinking about rockets" your signature
    Zilla360
  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    It looked to me like maybe it hit some turbulence. :shrug: Either way, we hopefully have enough to tear apart and see how the structure held up compared to the first v5 rocket.

    "The shore does not dream of you." - Blind poet Gallan.
    BeNarwhalZilla360
  • AimAim Registered User regular
    They cut the feed pretty fast, (and the presenters switched focus to the second stage pretty fast as well), but the fins seemed pretty static as well.

  • Mr_RoseMr_Rose 83 Blue Ridge Protects the Holy Registered User regular
    Just before they cut the video you could see the grid fins pegged at maximum roll trying to counter the rockets spin. No idea what caused that to start though.

    ...because dragons are AWESOME! That's why.
    Nintendo Network ID: AzraelRose
    DropBox invite link - get 500MB extra free.
    BeNarwhalZilla360
  • BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    I'm always excited when something doesn't go the way they expect :surprised:

    It means iteration and improvement, usually!

    And of course primary mission success, but failure in that regard would be REAL news for any rocket

    Narwhal I think you should make "Sometimes while someone is explaining something to me, I am thinking about rockets" your signature
    TynnanZilla360BrodyElvenshaeGennenalyse Rueben
  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    Its also a chance to check the RTLS abort protocol.

    "The shore does not dream of you." - Blind poet Gallan.
  • AimAim Registered User regular
    Never mind - just saw it again and they seemed to be reacting to the rotation. Just didn't seem to have enough control. Wonder if something broke out of camera sight.

  • BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    I gotta go again so someone else may break news if SpaceX provides an explanation any time today, but I suppose I'll have to live with that possibility :wink:

    Catch ya later, Space Thread! <3

    Narwhal I think you should make "Sometimes while someone is explaining something to me, I am thinking about rockets" your signature
    Aim
  • BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    Narwhal I think you should make "Sometimes while someone is explaining something to me, I am thinking about rockets" your signature
    a5ehrenElvenshaeZilla360AimDuke 2.0
  • AimAim Registered User regular
  • TynnanTynnan seldom correct, never unsure Registered User regular
    And also a video from the rocket itself (warning, spinny): https://mobile.twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1070399755526656000

  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    Tynnan wrote: »
    And also a video from the rocket itself (warning, spinny): https://mobile.twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1070399755526656000

    Reading people talking about the spin in the twitter thread, and who know how much any of it is accurate, but if the rocket did indeed use onboard controls to initiate a spin, then use a slightly off axis spin to put the center engine somewhere it could stabilize the spin, then holy shit, that is some serious programming, and forethought.

    "The shore does not dream of you." - Blind poet Gallan.
    ElvenshaeBeNarwhalMvrckZilla360
  • kaidkaid Registered User regular
    Brody wrote: »
    Tynnan wrote: »
    And also a video from the rocket itself (warning, spinny): https://mobile.twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1070399755526656000

    Reading people talking about the spin in the twitter thread, and who know how much any of it is accurate, but if the rocket did indeed use onboard controls to initiate a spin, then use a slightly off axis spin to put the center engine somewhere it could stabilize the spin, then holy shit, that is some serious programming, and forethought.

    The fact it still almost stuck the landing after the maneuvers it had to do is pretty damn impressive. And it set down well enough that some of it is likely salvagable is really impressive. Normally when stuff like that fails it is pancake city.

    BrodyElvenshaeBeNarwhalSealTynnanRchanenAbsoluteZeroZilla360a5ehrenDacDuke 2.0
  • SealSeal Registered User regular
    edited December 5
    Engines will be toast but maybe they can salvage the main body, legs and the expensive Ti grid fins. But the important thing is it looks like the space rats made it to orbit safely.

    Seal on
    ElvenshaeBrodyTynnanBeNarwhalCommunistCowRchanenAbsoluteZeroMvrckZilla360DacDuke 2.0
  • BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    Seal wrote: »
    Engine's will be toast but maybe they can salvage the main body, legs and the expensive Ti grid fins. But the important thing is it looks like the space rats made it to orbit safely.

    Elon tweeted about using it for "internal purposes" which Isuspect means they'll do testing on what they can until it explodes :D

    And also yeah, recovering the grid fins is a bonus and a priority I suspect, because those will be ready to fly again no problem!

    Our brave space rodents getting their food refreshed before flight and now bravely traveling in orbit en route to the ISS are the real heroes indeed <3
    Brody wrote: »
    Tynnan wrote: »
    And also a video from the rocket itself (warning, spinny): https://mobile.twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1070399755526656000

    Reading people talking about the spin in the twitter thread, and who know how much any of it is accurate, but if the rocket did indeed use onboard controls to initiate a spin, then use a slightly off axis spin to put the center engine somewhere it could stabilize the spin, then holy shit, that is some serious programming, and forethought.

    It's funny you mention forethought, because I think back to the loss of CRS-7, where they effectively lost the Dragon and the cargo (including that expensive docking adapter :bigfrown: ) all because they hadn't thought to program a routine for the Dragon to deploy its parachutes in the event of a launch failure. And I always wondered if that affected the company more than they let on - the idea of preparing for failure more robustly, having backups for backups, etc.

    We saw how crazy SpaceX went when it was revealed that an outside-sourced strut was the failure in that launch, too - they completely revamped their supply chain. I'll be interested to see what changes, redundancies, extra lube they introduce into the rocket :P

    Narwhal I think you should make "Sometimes while someone is explaining something to me, I am thinking about rockets" your signature
    Zilla360
  • dylmandylman Registered User regular
    Here's a better view of the landing, from Elon Musk's twitter:

    CommunistCowDelmainZilla360
  • SnicketysnickSnicketysnick The Greatest Hype Man in WesterosRegistered User regular
    Huh, wow if it had made it to the barge there's a good chance it would have stuck, impressive.

    pAJiEss.jpg
    D3 Steam #TeamTangent STO
  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    Huh, wow if it had made it to the barge there's a good chance it would have stuck, impressive.

    Shore, it was going to do a shore landing, and diverted because of the irregularity. Better safe than exploding closer to people than necessary.

    "The shore does not dream of you." - Blind poet Gallan.
    BeNarwhalSnicketysnickElvenshaeRchanenDelmainAbsoluteZeroZilla360Fencingsax
  • SealSeal Registered User regular
    What the heck was that puff of fire shooting out from the top of the kerosene tank, is that new? Some kind of mechanism to purge excess fuel after landing?

  • BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    Brody wrote: »
    Huh, wow if it had made it to the barge there's a good chance it would have stuck, impressive.

    Shore, it was going to do a shore landing, and diverted because of the irregularity. Better safe than exploding closer to people than necessary.

    You couldn't tell on the initial broadcast (because the hosts weren't sure how to interpret it), but the first stage knew it was in trouble and started diverting its course away from LZ-1 and toward the water before the entry burn even began (though technically it's the entry burn that accomplishes the task of putting the first stage on target for LZ-1, but you know what I mean).

    It made the decision to bail much earlier than it might appear!

    Narwhal I think you should make "Sometimes while someone is explaining something to me, I am thinking about rockets" your signature
    ElvenshaeZilla360Fencingsax
  • SnicketysnickSnicketysnick The Greatest Hype Man in WesterosRegistered User regular
    Brody wrote: »
    Huh, wow if it had made it to the barge there's a good chance it would have stuck, impressive.

    Shore, it was going to do a shore landing, and diverted because of the irregularity. Better safe than exploding closer to people than necessary.

    Ah I see. Yeah it's a very reasonable precaution, just impressed by the level of control in a damaged craft

    pAJiEss.jpg
    D3 Steam #TeamTangent STO
  • SealSeal Registered User regular
    edited December 6
    Apparently the venting is part of its safing procedure after touchdown.



    This incident really showcases how much control authority the fins have. The fins get stuck and the whole thing just starts spinning like a top.

    Seal on
    BeNarwhalTynnanElvenshaeZilla360
  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    Seal wrote: »
    Apparently the venting is part of its safing procedure after touchdown.



    This incident really showcases how much control authority the fins have. The fins get stuck and the whole thing just start spinning like a top.

    I saw it suggested that the spin was intentional, since it couldn't use the grid fins to control its flight normally, it used the three working fins to spin, which allowed it more control on the way down. It pitches around for a couple of seconds, and then enters a very controlled spin fairly quickly.

    "The shore does not dream of you." - Blind poet Gallan.
    BeNarwhalElvenshaeMvrckZilla360
  • AimAim Registered User regular
    Natural giroscope :)

  • BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    Also this drops us back below 50% for the number of Falcon 9s launched vs the number of Falcon 9s landed, but they have two more launches this year to make it right!

    Ninja edit: Though upon further inspection only one of the two remaining launches features a landing attempt (The GPS launch is flying expendable), so we'll have to wait 'til 2019 to get back to 50%, darn it :P

    Narwhal I think you should make "Sometimes while someone is explaining something to me, I am thinking about rockets" your signature
  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    edited December 5
    BeNarwhal wrote: »
    Also this drops us back below 50% for the number of Falcon 9s launched vs the number of Falcon 9s landed, but they have two more launches this year to make it right!

    Ninja edit: Though upon further inspection only one of the two remaining launches features a landing attempt (The GPS launch is flying expendable), so we'll have to wait 'til 2019 to get back to 50%, darn it :P

    This one landed, just not where they hoped it would! It didn't even explode!

    Edit: It's more intact than anything from the competitors would be.

    Brody on
    "The shore does not dream of you." - Blind poet Gallan.
    BeNarwhalZilla360
  • CommunistCowCommunistCow Registered User regular
    BeNarwhal wrote: »
    Also this drops us back below 50% for the number of Falcon 9s launched vs the number of Falcon 9s landed, but they have two more launches this year to make it right!

    Ninja edit: Though upon further inspection only one of the two remaining launches features a landing attempt (The GPS launch is flying expendable), so we'll have to wait 'til 2019 to get back to 50%, darn it :P

    Why is the GPS using an expendable rocket? Does it need to get to a different orbit that would make it hard to land the first stage?

    No, I am not really communist. Yes, it is weird that I use this name.
  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    BeNarwhal wrote: »
    Also this drops us back below 50% for the number of Falcon 9s launched vs the number of Falcon 9s landed, but they have two more launches this year to make it right!

    Ninja edit: Though upon further inspection only one of the two remaining launches features a landing attempt (The GPS launch is flying expendable), so we'll have to wait 'til 2019 to get back to 50%, darn it :P

    Why is the GPS using an expendable rocket? Does it need to get to a different orbit that would make it hard to land the first stage?

    It probably extends the life span of the satellite by using more fuel from the first stage.

    "The shore does not dream of you." - Blind poet Gallan.
    ElvenshaeTynnana5ehren
  • BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    Brody wrote: »
    BeNarwhal wrote: »
    Also this drops us back below 50% for the number of Falcon 9s launched vs the number of Falcon 9s landed, but they have two more launches this year to make it right!

    Ninja edit: Though upon further inspection only one of the two remaining launches features a landing attempt (The GPS launch is flying expendable), so we'll have to wait 'til 2019 to get back to 50%, darn it :P

    Why is the GPS using an expendable rocket? Does it need to get to a different orbit that would make it hard to land the first stage?

    It probably extends the life span of the satellite by using more fuel from the first stage.

    Yep, and GPS is tricky because they're direct deliveries to MEO - the rarely-visited Medium Earth Orbit - in this instance, exactly half of a geostationary orbit (12 hours rather than 24).

    So it actually needs all the performance it can to get there!

    Narwhal I think you should make "Sometimes while someone is explaining something to me, I am thinking about rockets" your signature
    a5ehren
  • kaidkaid Registered User regular
    Brody wrote: »
    BeNarwhal wrote: »
    Also this drops us back below 50% for the number of Falcon 9s launched vs the number of Falcon 9s landed, but they have two more launches this year to make it right!

    Ninja edit: Though upon further inspection only one of the two remaining launches features a landing attempt (The GPS launch is flying expendable), so we'll have to wait 'til 2019 to get back to 50%, darn it :P

    This one landed, just not where they hoped it would! It didn't even explode!

    Edit: It's more intact than anything from the competitors would be.

    Honestly had it tried to touch down on land there is a decent chance it would have stuck the landing it was damn close even on water. For a "failure" it was a reasonably controlled one that left basically fully intact rocket to hand to the engineers to get precise look at what happened and how to prevent it in the future.

    ElvenshaeBrody
  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    dylman wrote: »
    Here's a better view of the landing, from Elon Musk's twitter:


    Man, Elon Musk's Kerbal Space Simulator is so much better than mine.

    Rich people, am I right?

    ElvenshaeBrodyBeNarwhalAimZilla360
  • SealSeal Registered User regular
    Not that it means anything but I want to point out a rocket called Falcon is currently being rescued by a ship called Eagle.

    FencingsaxElvenshaeBeNarwhalZilla360
  • BeNarwhalBeNarwhal The Work Left Unfinished Registered User regular
    Seal wrote: »
    Not that it means anything but I want to point out a rocket called Falcon is currently being rescued by a ship called Eagle.

    We all need a little help from our friends from time to time!

    Narwhal I think you should make "Sometimes while someone is explaining something to me, I am thinking about rockets" your signature
    Zilla360Brody
  • AridholAridhol Registered User regular
    edited December 7
    Eagle Nest, this is Falcon, Mayday. Eagle Nest, this is Falcon, mayday.

    [Hearing Esperanza communicating over the radio instead of over the tower frequency, Garber hands Stuart a radio]

    Col. Stuart: Go ahead, Falcon.

    Gen. Ramon Esperanza: I've lost cabin pressure. Near zero visibility. I must get out of the storm, and land now, on the first accessible runway.

    Aridhol on
    BeNarwhal
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