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[Michael Cohen thread] SDNY cases against Cohen, Stormy Daniels case, bribes through Cohen

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    ButtersButters A glass of some milks Registered User regular
    Is Rudy a double agent or something? Cause he seems to only act against Donald's interests. I've yet to see him say or do anything that didn't harm the guy!

    Part of me still thinks he's pissed because he shilled for Trump and basically didn't get squat for it.

    But it's looking more and more likely that Rudy is just super fucking incompetent.

    He's no double agent. Rudy is just happy with whatever gives him attention. It doesn't matter that he's been on the GOP reject list for most of the last decade. He, Newt Gingrich, Rick Santorum, and all the other single-digit percentage GOP primary broods of failure are more than happy to debase themselves for TV time. Their drug of choice is relevance.

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    enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Gyral wrote: »
    The whole EVERYTHING about this is double dumb. Trump has publicly stated that he could shoot someone in public and his voters wouldn't bat an eye. That admission did NOTHING to his numbers. We have a "Grab them by the pussy" tape. Likewise did little to stop him from being elected. Why the fuck does he need to commit campaign finance violations to pay hush money to a mistress? Clearly the voting block that got him into office doesn't care what he does.

    Just push onto the "Yeah I did it and it was awesome" stage of this embarrassment.

    He's been doing this for decades and doesn't learn very quickly.

    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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    KhavallKhavall British ColumbiaRegistered User regular
    edited July 2018
    Gyral wrote: »
    The whole EVERYTHING about this is double dumb. Trump has publicly stated that he could shoot someone in public and his voters wouldn't bat an eye. That admission did NOTHING to his numbers. We have a "Grab them by the pussy" tape. Likewise did little to stop him from being elected. Why the fuck does he need to commit campaign finance violations to pay hush money to a mistress? Clearly the voting block that got him into office doesn't care what he does.

    Just push onto the "Yeah I did it and it was awesome" stage of this embarrassment.

    I think that the more popular and sense-making theory around this that I've seen is that admitting to infidelity, or having provable infidelity, would probably violate a probably shitty prenup that he has? So if he went out and said "Yeah I fucked 'em all while married", while it somehow wouldn't affect his numbers, would cost him a fair amount of money.

    Khavall on
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    ButtersButters A glass of some milks Registered User regular
    Gyral wrote: »
    The whole EVERYTHING about this is double dumb. Trump has publicly stated that he could shoot someone in public and his voters wouldn't bat an eye. That admission did NOTHING to his numbers. We have a "Grab them by the pussy" tape. Likewise did little to stop him from being elected. Why the fuck does he need to commit campaign finance violations to pay hush money to a mistress? Clearly the voting block that got him into office doesn't care what he does.

    Just push onto the "Yeah I did it and it was awesome" stage of this embarrassment.

    I'm not sure when on the timeline of his candidacy this payoff occurred but there was a period where he was still in the process of winning over Evangelicals.

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    AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Gyral wrote: »
    The whole EVERYTHING about this is double dumb. Trump has publicly stated that he could shoot someone in public and his voters wouldn't bat an eye. That admission did NOTHING to his numbers. We have a "Grab them by the pussy" tape. Likewise did little to stop him from being elected. Why the fuck does he need to commit campaign finance violations to pay hush money to a mistress? Clearly the voting block that got him into office doesn't care what he does.

    Just push onto the "Yeah I did it and it was awesome" stage of this embarrassment.

    It's worth remembering that a large part of why the Access Hollywood tape wound up not doing much was that Wikileaks released the DNC emails shortly after it surfaced.

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    ChiselphaneChiselphane Registered User regular
    Gyral wrote: »
    The whole EVERYTHING about this is double dumb. Trump has publicly stated that he could shoot someone in public and his voters wouldn't bat an eye. That admission did NOTHING to his numbers. We have a "Grab them by the pussy" tape. Likewise did little to stop him from being elected. Why the fuck does he need to commit campaign finance violations to pay hush money to a mistress? Clearly the voting block that got him into office doesn't care what he does.

    Just push onto the "Yeah I did it and it was awesome" stage of this embarrassment.

    I think the admission that he had to end up paying for sex is too much for his ego to bear. That he had legal representation involved to manage it via campaign finances is also a big pointer that he doesn't actually have much money on hand to spend, which is likely an even bigger deal to him.

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    TomantaTomanta Registered User regular
    Gyral wrote: »
    The whole EVERYTHING about this is double dumb. Trump has publicly stated that he could shoot someone in public and his voters wouldn't bat an eye. That admission did NOTHING to his numbers. We have a "Grab them by the pussy" tape. Likewise did little to stop him from being elected. Why the fuck does he need to commit campaign finance violations to pay hush money to a mistress? Clearly the voting block that got him into office doesn't care what he does.

    Just push onto the "Yeah I did it and it was awesome" stage of this embarrassment.

    It's worth remembering that a large part of why the Access Hollywood tape wound up not doing much was that Wikileaks released the DNC emails shortly after it surfaced.

    That was a crazy, crazy day.

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    SyphonBlueSyphonBlue The studying beaver That beaver sure loves studying!Registered User regular
    Gyral wrote: »
    The whole EVERYTHING about this is double dumb. Trump has publicly stated that he could shoot someone in public and his voters wouldn't bat an eye. That admission did NOTHING to his numbers. We have a "Grab them by the pussy" tape. Likewise did little to stop him from being elected. Why the fuck does he need to commit campaign finance violations to pay hush money to a mistress? Clearly the voting block that got him into office doesn't care what he does.

    Just push onto the "Yeah I did it and it was awesome" stage of this embarrassment.

    It's worth remembering that a large part of why the Access Hollywood tape wound up not doing much was that Wikileaks released the DNC emails shortly after it surfaced.

    Boy what a coincidence that was!

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    SurfpossumSurfpossum A nonentity trying to preserve the anonymity he so richly deserves.Registered User regular
    An important breaking news update: water still wet, sky still blue.

    Less shocking: Clifford's arrest at that Ohio strip club was pre-planned.
    Inside the emails are news clippings discussing Daniels’ planned appearance in Columbus, pictures of Daniels with President Donald Trump, videos of her dancing, and even a map to the club where she would be performing, all sent days before she would pull into town on her tour bus.

    Source is a local news publication that was contacted by a whistleblower.

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    MarathonMarathon Registered User regular
    I hope she sues the shit out of that department and everyone who had anything to do with planning that arrest loses their job.

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    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    Marathon wrote: »
    I hope she sues the shit out of that department and everyone who had anything to do with planning that arrest loses their job.
    Avenatti already declared intent to do that when the arrest happened.

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    GaddezGaddez Registered User regular
    Yeah theres no way these guys aren't getting canned at a minimum; Even if this didn't wreak of entrapment with a law that's basically never been enforced, the fact remains that this has led to embarrassment for the department on a national level.

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    PantsBPantsB Fake Thomas Jefferson Registered User regular
    Gaddez wrote: »
    Yeah theres no way these guys aren't getting canned at a minimum; Even if this didn't wreak of entrapment with a law that's basically never been enforced, the fact remains that this has led to embarrassment for the department on a national level.

    They're cops, don't assume basic accountability rules apply

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    DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    PantsB wrote: »
    Gaddez wrote: »
    Yeah theres no way these guys aren't getting canned at a minimum; Even if this didn't wreak of entrapment with a law that's basically never been enforced, the fact remains that this has led to embarrassment for the department on a national level.

    They're cops, don't assume basic accountability rules apply

    Like worst case they have a few months off before they get rehired by a more rural/more conservative district.

    Nod. Get treat. PSN: Quippish
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    AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    SyphonBlue wrote: »
    Gyral wrote: »
    The whole EVERYTHING about this is double dumb. Trump has publicly stated that he could shoot someone in public and his voters wouldn't bat an eye. That admission did NOTHING to his numbers. We have a "Grab them by the pussy" tape. Likewise did little to stop him from being elected. Why the fuck does he need to commit campaign finance violations to pay hush money to a mistress? Clearly the voting block that got him into office doesn't care what he does.

    Just push onto the "Yeah I did it and it was awesome" stage of this embarrassment.

    It's worth remembering that a large part of why the Access Hollywood tape wound up not doing much was that Wikileaks released the DNC emails shortly after it surfaced.

    Boy what a coincidence that was!

    29 minutes between the Access Hollywood and Podesta email releases.

    Also, Paul Campos at LGM has an interesting theory:
    Consider the following:

    In September of 2016, Trump and Cohen want to buy Karen McDougal’s story of her nearly year-long affair with Donald Trump, featuring dozens of assignations, from David Pecker/AMI, but don’t, even though that would have cost a maximum of $150,000, assuming Pecker (this novel sucks) wasn’t willing to charge friend prices for his product.

    In October, Trump agrees to pay $130,000 to Stormy Daniels via Cohen. Cohen then defaults on the deal because he can’t come up with the money. (This information is in the legal filings). The original NDA is then rescinded, and a new NDA is entered into two weeks later. Cohen reportedly comes up with $130K at this point by tapping a HELOC on his house and lying to the lender about what the money is for. Cohen then spends several months bitching to people that Trump isn’t paying him back.

    What kind of “billionaire” can’t come up with $130K to avoid blowing up his chances to become President of the United States?

    I don’t think Trump has any money at all. As in: he went completely broke in the early 1990s, after no American banks were willing to lend him any more money for his various grifts.

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    BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    Maybe he said "No cash" because he had no cash?

    "I will write your name in the ruin of them. I will paint you across history in the color of their blood."

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    Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    SyphonBlue wrote: »
    Gyral wrote: »
    The whole EVERYTHING about this is double dumb. Trump has publicly stated that he could shoot someone in public and his voters wouldn't bat an eye. That admission did NOTHING to his numbers. We have a "Grab them by the pussy" tape. Likewise did little to stop him from being elected. Why the fuck does he need to commit campaign finance violations to pay hush money to a mistress? Clearly the voting block that got him into office doesn't care what he does.

    Just push onto the "Yeah I did it and it was awesome" stage of this embarrassment.

    It's worth remembering that a large part of why the Access Hollywood tape wound up not doing much was that Wikileaks released the DNC emails shortly after it surfaced.

    Boy what a coincidence that was!

    29 minutes between the Access Hollywood and Podesta email releases.

    Also, Paul Campos at LGM has an interesting theory:
    Consider the following:

    In September of 2016, Trump and Cohen want to buy Karen McDougal’s story of her nearly year-long affair with Donald Trump, featuring dozens of assignations, from David Pecker/AMI, but don’t, even though that would have cost a maximum of $150,000, assuming Pecker (this novel sucks) wasn’t willing to charge friend prices for his product.

    In October, Trump agrees to pay $130,000 to Stormy Daniels via Cohen. Cohen then defaults on the deal because he can’t come up with the money. (This information is in the legal filings). The original NDA is then rescinded, and a new NDA is entered into two weeks later. Cohen reportedly comes up with $130K at this point by tapping a HELOC on his house and lying to the lender about what the money is for. Cohen then spends several months bitching to people that Trump isn’t paying him back.

    What kind of “billionaire” can’t come up with $130K to avoid blowing up his chances to become President of the United States?

    I don’t think Trump has any money at all. As in: he went completely broke in the early 1990s, after no American banks were willing to lend him any more money for his various grifts.

    Well, Trump A. Pretty obviously didn't expect to win anyway and B. Can be cheap while also having serious money.

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    ShortyShorty touching the meat Intergalactic Cool CourtRegistered User regular
    I don't think trump is anywhere near broke

    he's been a notorious cheapskate his whole life, even before the early 90's

    he's certainly not as wealthy as he wants everyone to believe, though

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    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    https://www.wsj.com/articles/trumps-former-lawyer-michael-cohen-formed-delaware-company-to-pay-playboy-model-1532526807
    Michael Cohen recorded a conversation he had with a reporter this year in which he said he arranged “on my own” a $130,000 payment in 2016 to a former adult-film star who alleged an affair with Donald Trump, according to people familiar with the matter.

    In the nearly two-hour conversation with CNN reporter Chris Cuomo, which the people said appears to have been surreptitiously recorded by Mr. Cohen, the former Trump lawyer discussed at length the payment he arranged in October 2016, a month before the presidential election, to Stephanie Clifford, known professionally as Stormy Daniels.
    During the conversation with Mr. Cuomo, Mr. Cohen assured the reporter that he wasn’t running a tape, according to the people familiar with the matter. He told Mr. Cuomo he was placing the phone in his desk drawer and that the conversation was off the record. The phone appeared to record the entire conversation, the people said.
    That is amazingly sleazy.

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    Eat it You Nasty Pig.Eat it You Nasty Pig. tell homeland security 'we are the bomb'Registered User regular
    why would the reporter be concerned about whether the conversation was being recorded? I mean, if the roles were reversed it'd be sleazy, but Cohen insisting he wasn't recording just seems weird

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    ButtersButters A glass of some milks Registered User regular
    Shorty wrote: »
    I don't think trump is anywhere near broke

    he's been a notorious cheapskate his whole life, even before the early 90's

    he's certainly not as wealthy as he wants everyone to believe, though

    He's not broke anymore because like every vulture capitalist he transferred his debts from unprofitable ventures to profitable ones and bankrupted them instead of himself while paying himself a high salary.

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    RickRudeRickRude Registered User regular
    He once pointed to a homeless man and told ivanka how much more money that homeless man had than him and how lucky he was because he had so much debt. A true humble man....


    I think I see why the tape was released? I listened to it, and there's nothing really there. What I mean is, his base will dismiss all the tapes because there isn't much there. Talking vaguely about a payment we all kind of know about. I just see it being used to dismiss any other tapes out of hand.

    And correct me if I'm wrong, and while a crime, we just have some minor campaign finance law violations here right?

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    PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    RickRude wrote: »
    He once pointed to a homeless man and told ivanka how much more money that homeless man had than him and how lucky he was because he had so much debt. A true humble man....


    I think I see why the tape was released? I listened to it, and there's nothing really there. What I mean is, his base will dismiss all the tapes because there isn't much there. Talking vaguely about a payment we all kind of know about. I just see it being used to dismiss any other tapes out of hand.

    And correct me if I'm wrong, and while a crime, we just have some minor campaign finance law violations here right?

    They're felony violations so...

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    RickRudeRickRude Registered User regular
    But it doesn't feel like a felony. I feel like it's going to be a defense, the opposite of how they felt about perjury during clinton.

    Anyways watching Don lemon on cnn and he said wapo is reporting that the feds have more than 100 coheh recordings.

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    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    Michael Avenatti is claiming to have received evidence that there are more women Trump and Cohen conspired to pay off, as well as a related pregnancy. On the one hand he's not a verified media outlet and he does have a bias RE: his involvement in this case. On the other hand though, he's built up a pretty good track record of saying things and being able to back them up (or have them otherwise verified). Like the tapes we've all gone bananas for recently, he was talking about those months ago.
    Breaking: Donald Trump conspired with Michael Cohen to pay off multiple other women prior to Election Day in 2016. They were also concerned about a pregnancy. Cohen has evidence and info in his possession and it must be released to the public. Now! #Basta

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    Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    basta?

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    BurnageBurnage Registered User regular
    basta?

    "Enough is enough". It's a thing that Avenatti needs to stop trying to make happen.

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    InfidelInfidel Heretic Registered User regular
    Burnage wrote: »
    basta?

    "Enough is enough". It's a thing that Avenatti needs to stop trying to make happen.

    Agreed. #basta

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    ElvenshaeElvenshae Registered User regular
    #basta is so fetch, though!

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    enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Evangelicals probably still won't turn on him, but I'd love to know just how many abortions Donald Trump has paid for. I'm guessing it's in the dozens.

    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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    HandkorHandkor Registered User regular
    Trump could be an Ogre snatching and eating children from their home while performing satanic rituals and they'd support him as long as it means they get their way.

    We are dealing with Single Issue Voters. They really don't care about morals as long as they get what they want.

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    AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Handkor wrote: »
    Trump could be an Ogre snatching and eating children from their home while performing satanic rituals and they'd support him as long as it means they get their way.

    We are dealing with Single Issue Voters. They really don't care about morals as long as they get what they want.

    The funny part is that they're cutting their own throat doing this - evangelical youth are seeing this, and it's driving them away.

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    BurnageBurnage Registered User regular
    Handkor wrote: »
    Trump could be an Ogre snatching and eating children from their home while performing satanic rituals and they'd support him as long as it means they get their way.

    We are dealing with Single Issue Voters. They really don't care about morals as long as they get what they want.

    The funny part is that they're cutting their own throat doing this - evangelical youth are seeing this, and it's driving them away.

    Is there any evidence of this? I'm not disbelieving you, I'm just wondering what makes you say it.

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    HevachHevach Registered User regular
    Burnage wrote: »
    Handkor wrote: »
    Trump could be an Ogre snatching and eating children from their home while performing satanic rituals and they'd support him as long as it means they get their way.

    We are dealing with Single Issue Voters. They really don't care about morals as long as they get what they want.

    The funny part is that they're cutting their own throat doing this - evangelical youth are seeing this, and it's driving them away.

    Is there any evidence of this? I'm not disbelieving you, I'm just wondering what makes you say it.

    Not just this specifically, but Evangelical churches have a serious youth exodus problem - up to 75% (according to Evangelical sources, which are actually on the low side of the bell curve) of youths promptly abandon the church as soon as they're no longer being dragged by parents, and it's not college like the churches say, because that figure barely moves among students of Evangelical colleges. It's a complicated thing, but this kind of hypocrisy is absolutely an immense part of it.

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    ViskodViskod Registered User regular

    Kyle Griffin of NBC: Longtime Trump Organization CFO Allen Weisselberg has been subpoenaed to testify in the criminal probe of Michael Cohen, WSJ reports.

    This seems important.

    Notes about him from Bloomberg.
    Here's what you need to know about Allen Weisselberg:
    - Trump's closest business confidant
    - Also handles Trump’s personal finances
    - Served as treasurer of the president’s troubled philanthropy

    He also personally prepared Trumps tax returns for years.

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    joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades Class Traitor Smoke-filled roomRegistered User regular
    That’s the guy that has the account numbers for the money laundering

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    Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    Henroid wrote: »
    Michael Avenatti is claiming to have received evidence that there are more women Trump and Cohen conspired to pay off, as well as a related pregnancy. On the one hand he's not a verified media outlet and he does have a bias RE: his involvement in this case. On the other hand though, he's built up a pretty good track record of saying things and being able to back them up (or have them otherwise verified). Like the tapes we've all gone bananas for recently, he was talking about those months ago.
    Breaking: Donald Trump conspired with Michael Cohen to pay off multiple other women prior to Election Day in 2016. They were also concerned about a pregnancy. Cohen has evidence and info in his possession and it must be released to the public. Now! #Basta

    I don't think that releasing the recordings is Cohen's decision, as they are ostensibly attorney/client. I would hope Avenatti knows this and is just trying to whip up some public pressure or gain some personal influence.

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    cursedkingcursedking Registered User regular
    Hevach wrote: »
    Burnage wrote: »
    Handkor wrote: »
    Trump could be an Ogre snatching and eating children from their home while performing satanic rituals and they'd support him as long as it means they get their way.

    We are dealing with Single Issue Voters. They really don't care about morals as long as they get what they want.

    The funny part is that they're cutting their own throat doing this - evangelical youth are seeing this, and it's driving them away.

    Is there any evidence of this? I'm not disbelieving you, I'm just wondering what makes you say it.

    Not just this specifically, but Evangelical churches have a serious youth exodus problem - up to 75% (according to Evangelical sources, which are actually on the low side of the bell curve) of youths promptly abandon the church as soon as they're no longer being dragged by parents, and it's not college like the churches say, because that figure barely moves among students of Evangelical colleges. It's a complicated thing, but this kind of hypocrisy is absolutely an immense part of it.

    I don't know if the numbers are that stark, but they are definitely aging and not gaining newer, younger members (for specifically Evangelical denominations)

    https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/are-white-evangelicals-sacrificing-the-future-in-search-of-the-past/
    After dominating much of American politics for the past 40 years, white evangelical Protestants are now facing a sharp decline. Nearly one-third of white Americans raised in evangelical Christian households leave their childhood faith.2 About 60 percent of those who leave end up joining another faith tradition, while 40 percent give up on religion altogether. The rates of disaffiliation are even higher among young adults: 39 percent of those raised evangelical Christian no longer identify as such in adulthood. And while there is always a good deal of churn in the religious marketplace — people both entering and leaving faith traditions — recent findings suggest that membership losses among white evangelical Protestants are not being offset by gains.

    As a result, the white evangelical Protestant population in the U.S. has fallen over the past decade, dropping from 23 percent in 2006 to 17 percent in 2016. But equally troubling for those concerned about the vitality of evangelical Christianity, white evangelical Protestants are aging. Today, 62 percent of white evangelical Protestants are at least 50 years old. In 1987, fewer than half (46 percent) were. The median age of white evangelical Protestants today is 55.

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    tbloxhamtbloxham Registered User regular
    cursedking wrote: »
    Hevach wrote: »
    Burnage wrote: »
    Handkor wrote: »
    Trump could be an Ogre snatching and eating children from their home while performing satanic rituals and they'd support him as long as it means they get their way.

    We are dealing with Single Issue Voters. They really don't care about morals as long as they get what they want.

    The funny part is that they're cutting their own throat doing this - evangelical youth are seeing this, and it's driving them away.

    Is there any evidence of this? I'm not disbelieving you, I'm just wondering what makes you say it.

    Not just this specifically, but Evangelical churches have a serious youth exodus problem - up to 75% (according to Evangelical sources, which are actually on the low side of the bell curve) of youths promptly abandon the church as soon as they're no longer being dragged by parents, and it's not college like the churches say, because that figure barely moves among students of Evangelical colleges. It's a complicated thing, but this kind of hypocrisy is absolutely an immense part of it.

    I don't know if the numbers are that stark, but they are definitely aging and not gaining newer, younger members (for specifically Evangelical denominations)

    https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/are-white-evangelicals-sacrificing-the-future-in-search-of-the-past/
    After dominating much of American politics for the past 40 years, white evangelical Protestants are now facing a sharp decline. Nearly one-third of white Americans raised in evangelical Christian households leave their childhood faith.2 About 60 percent of those who leave end up joining another faith tradition, while 40 percent give up on religion altogether. The rates of disaffiliation are even higher among young adults: 39 percent of those raised evangelical Christian no longer identify as such in adulthood. And while there is always a good deal of churn in the religious marketplace — people both entering and leaving faith traditions — recent findings suggest that membership losses among white evangelical Protestants are not being offset by gains.

    As a result, the white evangelical Protestant population in the U.S. has fallen over the past decade, dropping from 23 percent in 2006 to 17 percent in 2016. But equally troubling for those concerned about the vitality of evangelical Christianity, white evangelical Protestants are aging. Today, 62 percent of white evangelical Protestants are at least 50 years old. In 1987, fewer than half (46 percent) were. The median age of white evangelical Protestants today is 55.

    I predict that rather than trying to do anything to change this problem, evangelical churches will double down on the issues causing it and try ever harder to brainwash the few children who remain.

    "That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
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    SyphonBlueSyphonBlue The studying beaver That beaver sure loves studying!Registered User regular
    tbloxham wrote: »
    cursedking wrote: »
    Hevach wrote: »
    Burnage wrote: »
    Handkor wrote: »
    Trump could be an Ogre snatching and eating children from their home while performing satanic rituals and they'd support him as long as it means they get their way.

    We are dealing with Single Issue Voters. They really don't care about morals as long as they get what they want.

    The funny part is that they're cutting their own throat doing this - evangelical youth are seeing this, and it's driving them away.

    Is there any evidence of this? I'm not disbelieving you, I'm just wondering what makes you say it.

    Not just this specifically, but Evangelical churches have a serious youth exodus problem - up to 75% (according to Evangelical sources, which are actually on the low side of the bell curve) of youths promptly abandon the church as soon as they're no longer being dragged by parents, and it's not college like the churches say, because that figure barely moves among students of Evangelical colleges. It's a complicated thing, but this kind of hypocrisy is absolutely an immense part of it.

    I don't know if the numbers are that stark, but they are definitely aging and not gaining newer, younger members (for specifically Evangelical denominations)

    https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/are-white-evangelicals-sacrificing-the-future-in-search-of-the-past/
    After dominating much of American politics for the past 40 years, white evangelical Protestants are now facing a sharp decline. Nearly one-third of white Americans raised in evangelical Christian households leave their childhood faith.2 About 60 percent of those who leave end up joining another faith tradition, while 40 percent give up on religion altogether. The rates of disaffiliation are even higher among young adults: 39 percent of those raised evangelical Christian no longer identify as such in adulthood. And while there is always a good deal of churn in the religious marketplace — people both entering and leaving faith traditions — recent findings suggest that membership losses among white evangelical Protestants are not being offset by gains.

    As a result, the white evangelical Protestant population in the U.S. has fallen over the past decade, dropping from 23 percent in 2006 to 17 percent in 2016. But equally troubling for those concerned about the vitality of evangelical Christianity, white evangelical Protestants are aging. Today, 62 percent of white evangelical Protestants are at least 50 years old. In 1987, fewer than half (46 percent) were. The median age of white evangelical Protestants today is 55.

    I predict that rather than trying to do anything to change this problem, evangelical churches will double down on the issues causing it and try ever harder to brainwash the few children who remain.

    That's literally exactly what the Republican party is doing

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    PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
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