Because one is a rocket-powered war machine and the other just kinda jumps forward a few feet.
Maybe it's just that stun > pin? I mean, if you hit me in the face hard enough the jet engine I wear on my back does short out (well, most of the time). It's grounded in reality.
'Chance, you are the best kind of whore.' -Henroid
The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
As anyone I've ever played with can probably attest to (sorry for being broken record, btw), I often go back to the line "gee, I sure wish I could control my character" after spending 4 consecutive seconds getting knocked around and stunned until my eventual death. The thing that made it really absurd is they added two characters with multitudinous control-deprivation tools in Doomfist (punch, uppercut, and slam all fuck with your ability to control yourself) and Brigitte (who can basically go stun -> whip -> stun at her leisure).
So if you have either of those two, and then say an Orisa or a Roadhog, you can spend an entire fight alive but incapable of actually doing anything. Which feels shitty. (Going back to the old argument about why Mei's freeze feels worse to be on the end of than Flashbang.)
Yeah, I think diminishing returns in CC should be considered to stop complete stunlock. Things like Graviton Surge should be able to overcome this, however, since it's an ULT and should have its power retained.
I must be lucky or blind, because I see all the crowd control going around and recognise it's a problem...but it doesn't seem to hit me that much. Maybe I got all my bad luck out in a past life or something.
That said, my three mains are Lucio, Roadhog and Doomfist, and I'm starting to like the look of Brigitte too. So maybe I am the problem and the target audience for Blizz's new CC meta.
If anyone is looking to partner / group up, hit me up. I play a not completely terrible, ana, brig, or moira, or if desperate i'll play orisa or d.va. I usually play around 8:30pm Mountain (-7 gmt) but can play a little earlier or later. I have a headset that i'll listen in on but don't usually speak as my kids are sleeping.
KasynI'm not saying I don't like our chances.She called me the master.Registered Userregular
That's a good change for Brig and probably needs to go even further. Looking at how different Mercy's Valkyrie is compared to what it was upon release, I wonder if the persistent armor component will even exist in a month or two.
As far as CC goes, I think people are exaggerating and insisting on playing the way they're used to playing, against a character that just hard punishes that. I've played a decent amount of Brig games at basically every SR range now and I have not once seen a Tracer play against her correctly, they just insist on doing the same kinds of things that Tracers have always gotten away with, and then whine as they swap heroes. (Though swapping is arguably the correct move.) But in reality, you can function as a flanker against Brigitte, you just have to respect her space and track cooldowns. Treat her zone of control like you would a Roadhog who just doesn't miss hooks.
Everyone's talking about Reinh but he gets enabled hardcore by Brigitte, the real loser among the tanks is poor Winston. He was already operating on razor thin margins against teams that actually bother shooting him, and a single shield bash is already going to put him behind the eight-ball on getting a kill, let alone the passive heal that is almost optimally designed to fuck him over. I put him at first or second on the list of heroes whose stock dropped the most with the Brigitte era.
The boops in Rialto are kind of infuriating. And unsurprisingly, Junkrat is still complete bullshit
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H3KnucklesBut we decide which is rightand which is an illusion.Registered Userregular
edited May 2018
I feel like new!Handsoap should be an offense hero now? Like, he's got serious mobility between wall climb and lunge, and that's kind of Offense's thing. My understanding was that the idea behind the split is defense does best when they can post up and/or ambush, where offense wants to seek the enemy out either as flankers or as part of the main formation. Also, his ult is just as good at punishing campers as for cutting off a line of approach. Sonic Arrow doesn't really seem to prefer one role or another either. None of his kit seems defense-biased like the other characters.
I thought that defense was specialized at denying the team access to an area by locking it down with damage, traps, or actual physical walls. Sniping is still pretty solidly in that camp, and dragonstrike is still very much a "You can't be here right now" ultimate.
The all-new extra-sticky Lucio is pretty amazing. I just wish holding down spacebar/jump for wallride wasn't such a pain on my thumb. There's a reason I right-click for Pharah's thrusters
The distinction between Offense/Defense really doesn't matter, except as a way of visually breaking up the heroes into rough categories of playstyle.
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
+5
H3KnucklesBut we decide which is rightand which is an illusion.Registered Userregular
edited May 2018
Sure, but that's my point though, new Hanzo seems like he should be played as a mid-range aggressor. You can totally still play him as a sniper (increased projectile speed will definitely help there), but that feels like an under-utilization with all the changes they've made.
Widow is historically stronger on O than D because the enemy team is grouped up to defend the objective and it's easier to capitalize on picks when you're the offensive team. Classifying her as defense just because she's a sniper isn't accurate.
Classifications are broad at best and useless at worst, especially when we start getting into hybrids like Zen, Hog, Brig, or Mei. Well built lineups take a lot more consideration than just saying to get shield tank/off tank/main healer/off healer/2 dps.
As anyone I've ever played with can probably attest to (sorry for being broken record, btw), I often go back to the line "gee, I sure wish I could control my character" after spending 4 consecutive seconds getting knocked around and stunned until my eventual death. The thing that made it really absurd is they added two characters with multitudinous control-deprivation tools in Doomfist (punch, uppercut, and slam all fuck with your ability to control yourself) and Brigitte (who can basically go stun -> whip -> stun at her leisure).
So if you have either of those two, and then say an Orisa or a Roadhog, you can spend an entire fight alive but incapable of actually doing anything. Which feels shitty. (Going back to the old argument about why Mei's freeze feels worse to be on the end of than Flashbang.)
Let people play the game, dammit.
What's the dream/nightmare CC team? Doomfist, Brigette, Mei, Orisa, Lucio, McCree? If you aren't being booped, gooped or stunned your being frozen...
I thought I had a Sombra and a Genji in the Ilos well the other day with Orisa's alt-fire ... and they both escaped with their bullshit powers. I felt so cheated.
Almost every Offense hero (besides McCree, whom I consider a misclassified Defense character) has extreme horizontal mobility in a highly-reusable format. The four-second cooldown on Hanzo's new Lunge is shorter than any other mobility skill bar Mercy's that isn't on an Offense character, but I'm not sure that it quite qualifies him for Offense on those grounds.
My favorite musical instrument is the air-raid siren.
0
KasynI'm not saying I don't like our chances.She called me the master.Registered Userregular
What is the most satisfying form of environmental kill in the game?
Whipshotting enemy Brigittes off the map is pretty fucking satisfying, I will admit.
Hanzo is the most mobile defense character now by far. I'd compare him to McCree who has almost no mobility and yet is still in offense. I think Hanzo is still more vulnerable than McCree in a front line situation though. His damage is less reliable so if his aim is not completely on point it's easy for him to get overwhelmed. He's a lot better at area control than he is at pushing, which makes him still more suitable for defense I think.
Yeah, if shields are still his most potent foe he's not going to be good versus Orisa or Rein still. Unless he just walks through and leaps back I guess? Still, risky. He's not a dive character now.
On the PTR does that Ana patch mean she doesn't shoot allies that are full or she hits them but it does nothing? Because being able to shoot through full health allies would be amazing.
As anyone I've ever played with can probably attest to (sorry for being broken record, btw), I often go back to the line "gee, I sure wish I could control my character" after spending 4 consecutive seconds getting knocked around and stunned until my eventual death. The thing that made it really absurd is they added two characters with multitudinous control-deprivation tools in Doomfist (punch, uppercut, and slam all fuck with your ability to control yourself) and Brigitte (who can basically go stun -> whip -> stun at her leisure).
So if you have either of those two, and then say an Orisa or a Roadhog, you can spend an entire fight alive but incapable of actually doing anything. Which feels shitty. (Going back to the old argument about why Mei's freeze feels worse to be on the end of than Flashbang.)
Let people play the game, dammit.
What's the dream/nightmare CC team? Doomfist, Brigette, Mei, Orisa, Lucio, McCree? If you aren't being booped, gooped or stunned your being frozen...
I'd put Hog over McCree, just to have the maximum amount of "well fuck I guess I'm over here now."
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+4
TexiKenDammit!That fish really got me!Registered Userregular
New Naruto is getting wrecked and it's delicious to see because he can't just rush in and block things he had not reason to block in the first place, but this new Junkrat is off. The spread wasn't the problem, it was the reload time or ult buildup, and now he's basically promoting spamming more than before because you have very little defense up close (and trap isn't something you need to save for nearby you) and you're trying to aim in a smaller area with something that isn't linear like a Pharah rocket. That was silly, Blizzard.
Rialto is nice, lots of turns. But a bit too rewarding for Orisa.
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You're called the Outlaws and you suck on 66, I literally can't even.
Maybe it's just that stun > pin? I mean, if you hit me in the face hard enough the jet engine I wear on my back does short out (well, most of the time). It's grounded in reality.
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So if you have either of those two, and then say an Orisa or a Roadhog, you can spend an entire fight alive but incapable of actually doing anything. Which feels shitty. (Going back to the old argument about why Mei's freeze feels worse to be on the end of than Flashbang.)
Let people play the game, dammit.
That said, my three mains are Lucio, Roadhog and Doomfist, and I'm starting to like the look of Brigitte too. So maybe I am the problem and the target audience for Blizz's new CC meta.
hAmmONd IsnT A mAin TAnk
Blizzard: Pailryder#1101
GoG: https://www.gog.com/u/pailryder
New PTR is going up with reduced max armor from Brigette's ult and maybe some other stuff including Ana tweaks.
As far as CC goes, I think people are exaggerating and insisting on playing the way they're used to playing, against a character that just hard punishes that. I've played a decent amount of Brig games at basically every SR range now and I have not once seen a Tracer play against her correctly, they just insist on doing the same kinds of things that Tracers have always gotten away with, and then whine as they swap heroes. (Though swapping is arguably the correct move.) But in reality, you can function as a flanker against Brigitte, you just have to respect her space and track cooldowns. Treat her zone of control like you would a Roadhog who just doesn't miss hooks.
Everyone's talking about Reinh but he gets enabled hardcore by Brigitte, the real loser among the tanks is poor Winston. He was already operating on razor thin margins against teams that actually bother shooting him, and a single shield bash is already going to put him behind the eight-ball on getting a kill, let alone the passive heal that is almost optimally designed to fuck him over. I put him at first or second on the list of heroes whose stock dropped the most with the Brigitte era.
THUD THUD THUD THUD THUD THUD.
Turns out everyone is a hanzo main and it was in all of us the whole time.
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The all-new extra-sticky Lucio is pretty amazing. I just wish holding down spacebar/jump for wallride wasn't such a pain on my thumb. There's a reason I right-click for Pharah's thrusters
Classifications are broad at best and useless at worst, especially when we start getting into hybrids like Zen, Hog, Brig, or Mei. Well built lineups take a lot more consideration than just saying to get shield tank/off tank/main healer/off healer/2 dps.
What's the dream/nightmare CC team? Doomfist, Brigette, Mei, Orisa, Lucio, McCree? If you aren't being booped, gooped or stunned your being frozen...
And it rhymes with booping which is another enviro bullshit kill mechanism, just push instead of pull.
Whipshotting enemy Brigittes off the map is pretty fucking satisfying, I will admit.
Blizzard: Pailryder#1101
GoG: https://www.gog.com/u/pailryder
I'd put Hog over McCree, just to have the maximum amount of "well fuck I guess I'm over here now."
Rialto is nice, lots of turns. But a bit too rewarding for Orisa.
Blizzard: Pailryder#1101
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I dunno if this will push her back into the meta, but this is a REALLY good change.