Twilight Imperium 4e - Game 4: Round 7 - Action Phase / Game End

Preda

Damn...

Hedgethorn

MrBlarney wrote: »

Public Execution (Directive)
Elect Player: The elected player discards all of his action cards. If he has the speaker token, he gives it to the player on his left. The elected player cannot vote on any agendas during this agenda phase.

Voting Order
The Barony of Letnev (Ketar): Up to 12 votes
The Ghosts of Creuss (MrBody): Up to 8 votes
The Winnu (discrider): Up to 17 votes
Sardakk N'orr (Preda): Up to 4 votes
The Mentak Coalition (Hedgethorn): Up to 8 votes
The Naalu Collective (Mojo_Jojo): Up to 10 votes; Speaker

Action card count, per MrBlarney's previous post:
Naalu:7 + Speaker token
Creuss: 6
Letnev: 3
Mentak: 6
N'orr: 7
Winnu: 6

Mojo_Jojo

As ill-advised as it probably was keeping that one on the top, it just seemed too exciting to bury.

Preda

Does anyone as a veto? I'm interested to buy it...

Hedgethorn

Electing Naalu would do the most damage here, but it's hard to justify voting for them when they've already been so crippled by Letnev.

N'orr is the most obvious choice, given their commanding board position and VP lead.

Ketar

Wow.

Preda

Hedgethorn wrote: »

Electing Naalu would do the most damage here, but it's hard to justify voting for them when they've already been so crippled by Letnev.

N'orr is the most obvious choice here, given their commanding board position on the board and VP lead.

Mentak is an even better choice. I'm stuck with no expansion routes if not aganist Letnev (I fight that I really don't want). And all my resources will not help me, If I don't have counters to put in fleet (and I haven't). Mentak have space, a weak opponent on a flank and almost infinite resources (that will buy him this vote, that's why the offer to buy a veto).

Ketar

Preda wrote: »

Hedgethorn wrote: »

Electing Naalu would do the most damage here, but it's hard to justify voting for them when they've already been so crippled by Letnev.

N'orr is the most obvious choice here, given their commanding board position on the board and VP lead.

Mentak is an even better choice. I'm stuck with no expansion routes if not aganist Letnev (I fight that I really don't want). And all my resources will not help me, If I don't have counters to put in fleet (and I haven't). Mentak have space, a weak opponent on a flank and almost infinite resources (that will buy him this vote, that's why the offer to buy a veto).

Are you expecting him to buy votes from other players? He can't use the trade goods for influence to vote with.

Preda

Ketar wrote: »

Are you expecting him to buy votes from other players? He can't use the trade goods for influence to vote with.

To not eat this? Sure! I would.

Ketar

You shouldn't have moved those ships to Quann, @Preda. That made you my biggest threat, and I can't really justify voting for anyone other than you given the current situation.

Mojo_Jojo

I have three commodities that I'd like to turn into trade goods but nobody else has any.

And @MrBody I'm happy to take your note if you want to get your other wormhole out. Normally I'd want a TG for that but Hedgethorn will just whip it away from me, so how about I give you my 3commodities and you give me 4TG and your card? We aren't neighbours so we can't really defer the payment on placing the wormhole where you want but we're very honest freaky space mermaids

38thDoe

So are the agendas supposed to be like the crisis deck in BSG?

Ketar

Mojo_Jojo wrote: »

I have three commodities that I'd like to turn into trade goods but nobody else has any.

And @MrBody I'm happy to take your note if you want to get your other wormhole out. Normally I'd want a TG for that but Hedgethorn will just whip it away from me, so how about I give you my 3commodities and you give me 4TG and your card? We aren't neighbours so we can't really defer the payment on placing the wormhole where you want but we're very honest freaky space mermaids

Creuss only have 2TG right now, after spending 5 to get a VP.

MrBody

What are we going to do, not publicly execute someone? That's crazy!

Mojo_Jojo wrote: »

I have three commodities that I'd like to turn into trade goods but nobody else has any.

And @MrBody I'm happy to take your note if you want to get your other wormhole out. Normally I'd want a TG for that but Hedgethorn will just whip it away from me, so how about I give you my 3commodities and you give me 4TG and your card? We aren't neighbours so we can't really defer the payment on placing the wormhole where you want but we're very honest freaky space mermaids

Nah. I can generate my own wormholes now.

MrBody

I'm happy to vote for Mentak.

discrider

I'm not sure what ACs the Letnev has to worry about from the N'orr, or anyone else to be honest.
Seems like next turn they get their 2x Armoured regenerating Dreadnaughts that are impervious to ACs

Ketar

Did Direct Hit somehow become the only AC in the game that people need to be wary of? I know they changed a lot from 3rd edition to 4th, but I didn't realize they'd gone that far.

discrider

Well I don't know.
It's the only one I've ever been concerned about.
(Once-offs are once-off and not worth planning around)

At the very least, your war machine seems formidable, and looks more than enough to take on whomever you choose.

discrider

Not to mention you both have to wormhole to each other, naturally bottlenecking yourselves.

mindflare77

@Saryn could probably sound off about which action cards are threatening.

Ketar

No, that's alright.

Ketar

I think it's safe to say that Preda probably has a potent hand of cards given that he has discarded a Direct Hit, among others, while accumulating ACs. So I see pretty good value in wiping that hand out from the player in my territory, who also happens to be the point leader. We know he can get the first stage II objective easily in another round, which would put him at 8.

On the other hand, Mentak is in great position right now with their racial techs, accumulated TGs, and ease of acquiring additional TGs. It won't be pretty when they actually spend those TGs on an instant fleet beyond their network of Cruiser IIs.

On the gripping hand, Winnu holds Mecatol Rex and gets to use it for 2 tokens and 6 resources when Diplomacy gets played. I'm sure there are players who'd like to take Mecatol from the Winnu, and wiping out their hand would make that easier.

discrider

:/
MR stinks though.
Those points are on the board, as opposed to the SOs everyone else gets from me playing Impreial.

Ketar

Guaranteed point (well, assuming you maintain control of MR) vs objectives that can be near impossible to achieve...hmm...

discrider

:shrug:
It's how I won last game.
Whereas this game no-one seemed to want MR, so I took it.

discrider

In any case, as I said, my points are on the board, and I don't believe I'm a contender unless N'orr and Mentak are hampered, and Mentak doesn't have the Letnev bearing down on them, so..

discrider

Ketar wrote: »

Guaranteed point (well, assuming you maintain control of MR) vs objectives that can be near impossible to achieve...hmm...

I would also maintain that unscored SOs are worth more than the equivalent MR points, and would not take Imperial except to score two Public Objectives or in this case for the three TG.

Hedgethorn

discrider wrote: »

Ketar wrote: »

Guaranteed point (well, assuming you maintain control of MR) vs objectives that can be near impossible to achieve...hmm...

I would also maintain that unscored SOs are worth more than the equivalent MR points, and would not take Imperial except to score two Public Objectives or in this case for the three TG.

Scoring 1 point is less valuable than spending a strategy token for the possibility of maybe scoring a point later? What sort of madness is this?

discrider

Hedgethorn wrote: »

discrider wrote: »

Ketar wrote: »

Guaranteed point (well, assuming you maintain control of MR) vs objectives that can be near impossible to achieve...hmm...

I would also maintain that unscored SOs are worth more than the equivalent MR points, and would not take Imperial except to score two Public Objectives or in this case for the three TG.

Scoring 1 point is less valuable than spending a strategy token for the possibility of maybe scoring a point later? What sort of madness is this?

Yes.
Because the unscored SO doesn't put you on the list for these agendas and ACs and war and so forth, yet nonetheless may place you at equivalent VP.

MrBody

discrider wrote: »

I'm not sure what ACs the Letnev has to worry about from the N'orr, or anyone else to be honest.
Seems like next turn they get their 2x Armoured regenerating Dreadnaughts that are impervious to ACs

That was yet another of the things that lovely gentlemen was yelling about during the TTS game why I "shouldn't even be playing the game".

I had gotten war suns as Letnev but no dreads, and apparently it was "stupid amateur" not to get Non-Euclidean Shielding for them.

So am I the dummy for thinking not only isn't it worth researching the tech just for 2 war suns, but no way in hell is it worth assigning a hit to a war sun and risking a direct hit just so it can absorb an extra hit? That it's only worth doing that for lower cost dreads, preferably dread IIs?

MrBody

So I've got no riders or other cards to play.

Ketar

I wouldn't take a hit on a war sun unless I was very sure that my opponent didn't have a Direct Hit. It's definitely much safer with dreads, and the ideal would be dread IIs, yeah.

discrider

MrBody wrote: »

discrider wrote: »

I'm not sure what ACs the Letnev has to worry about from the N'orr, or anyone else to be honest.
Seems like next turn they get their 2x Armoured regenerating Dreadnaughts that are impervious to ACs

That was yet another of the things that lovely gentlemen was yelling about during the TTS game why I "shouldn't even be playing the game".

I had gotten war suns as Letnev but no dreads, and apparently it was "stupid amateur" not to get Non-Euclidean Shielding for them.

So am I the dummy for thinking not only isn't it worth researching the tech just for 2 war suns, but no way in hell is it worth assigning a hit to a war sun and risking a direct hit just so it can absorb an extra hit? That it's only worth doing that for lower cost dreads, preferably dread IIs?

:/
If you've got the fighter screen, war suns on Letnev seem good.
You'd reroll the fighters.
And try for the shielding too.

And really, taking hits is sorta okay as long as you have Sabs to kill off the Direct Hit, otherwise that's a lot of resources you're risking.

Ketar

Actually having enough TG as Letnev to be able to reroll at will is easier said than done. I think this round was the first time I'd had 2 TG at the same time all game, and I needed to spend them for a VP.

discrider

That's something they changed in TI4 actually; the TI3 tech protected war suns and dreads

discrider

Ketar wrote: »

Actually having enough TG as Letnev to be able to reroll at will is easier said than done. I think this round was the first time I'd had 2 TG at the same time all game, and I needed to spend them for a VP.

Eh
You save 6I on Fleet CCs so..

discrider

It probably has something to do with Mentak wanting Trade all the time though

Ketar

It has more to do with just having 2 commodities, and the expected payment for a refresh being 1 of those 2. It's not worth spending a token for 1 extra TG. I could take Trade myself, but Mentak would wipe out all of the extra benefit one should get from playing Trade and that makes it far less attractive.

Ketar

Wait a second! Hedgethorn still has my action card that he stole from me early on. Ok, yes, burn Mentak to the ground with this one.

Hedgethorn

Well, lose one or lose six...

Play Veto.

@MrBlarney for a new agenda.