I would expect anyone that is doing any serious towing is either going to buy the gas version, or get a F-250. Because for the average driver the biggest thing they put in the bed is a TV from WalMart.
Even towing a boat or camper with this thing could greatly reduce the range. Thats what I'm interested to see. Whats the 3500-7500lb trailer weight effects on the battery.
Even if it cuts range in half, that's still 150 miles of range. Plenty for a work crew to get to their site, work for a few hours, move to another site, and get back home. If they unhook the trailer and charge while grabbing lunch that's even more.
No you won't be hauling a horse trailer across three states, but having the capacity to haul a trailer full of furniture across town or a boat fifty miles to the lake or some soil home from the nursery is 95% of typical peoples use case.
Oh for sure, I think this will be a rocking fleet vehicle and close to home truck. It hits like 99% of my use case for an electric vehicle. I wonder if you put a roof rack on one, and could lay out solar panels how much of a charge could you generate. Like lets say you have the truck parked at the campground while you're out hiking and boating all day. Like could you get back 25% range?
I don't know what kind of magic juju I pulled for my rates, but I've never been able to match them - $86/month for two drivers on two vehicles. Both boring Subaru's and no accidents on our records, but still.
I would expect anyone that is doing any serious towing is either going to buy the gas version, or get a F-250. Because for the average driver the biggest thing they put in the bed is a TV from WalMart.
Even towing a boat or camper with this thing could greatly reduce the range. Thats what I'm interested to see. Whats the 3500-7500lb trailer weight effects on the battery.
Even if it cuts range in half, that's still 150 miles of range. Plenty for a work crew to get to their site, work for a few hours, move to another site, and get back home. If they unhook the trailer and charge while grabbing lunch that's even more.
No you won't be hauling a horse trailer across three states, but having the capacity to haul a trailer full of furniture across town or a boat fifty miles to the lake or some soil home from the nursery is 95% of typical peoples use case.
Oh for sure, I think this will be a rocking fleet vehicle and close to home truck. It hits like 99% of my use case for an electric vehicle. I wonder if you put a roof rack on one, and could lay out solar panels how much of a charge could you generate. Like lets say you have the truck parked at the campground while you're out hiking and boating all day. Like could you get back 25% range?
No, you would be picking up like a percent or two at most, not enough to offset the extra weight and impact on your aerodynamics of the panels.
A small solar panel integrated into the roof that runs fans to keep the cabin cool and maybe maintain battery temperature might be worthwhile, but probably more complexity than its worth.
Solar just isn't efficient enough per unit of area to power a general purpose vehicle. The solar race cars that are basically a giant ultra light solar panel do nothing but move them and one person under solar power and still barely maintain highway speeds on sunny days.
A lot of EV owners also already take advantage of charging using the RV electric hookups at sites that have them, assuming they have an adapter to use which are pretty easy to come by. Those could easily charge up the truck overnight, or even add a good amount of range in a couple of hours depending.
I would expect anyone that is doing any serious towing is either going to buy the gas version, or get a F-250. Because for the average driver the biggest thing they put in the bed is a TV from WalMart.
Even towing a boat or camper with this thing could greatly reduce the range. Thats what I'm interested to see. Whats the 3500-7500lb trailer weight effects on the battery.
Even if it cuts range in half, that's still 150 miles of range. Plenty for a work crew to get to their site, work for a few hours, move to another site, and get back home. If they unhook the trailer and charge while grabbing lunch that's even more.
No you won't be hauling a horse trailer across three states, but having the capacity to haul a trailer full of furniture across town or a boat fifty miles to the lake or some soil home from the nursery is 95% of typical peoples use case.
Oh for sure, I think this will be a rocking fleet vehicle and close to home truck. It hits like 99% of my use case for an electric vehicle. I wonder if you put a roof rack on one, and could lay out solar panels how much of a charge could you generate. Like lets say you have the truck parked at the campground while you're out hiking and boating all day. Like could you get back 25% range?
No, you would be picking up like a percent or two at most, not enough to offset the extra weight and impact on your aerodynamics of the panels.
A small solar panel integrated into the roof that runs fans to keep the cabin cool and maybe maintain battery temperature might be worthwhile, but probably more complexity than its worth.
Solar just isn't efficient enough per unit of area to power a general purpose vehicle. The solar race cars that are basically a giant ultra light solar panel do nothing but move them and one person under solar power and still barely maintain highway speeds on sunny days.
Oh I'm not talking about powering them while driving. I mean having the truck parked 12-14 hours in the sun. Like you would while camping/boating/at the cabin etc... I could see high end trailers start coming with solar roofs and such. I mathed it out and with a full roof rack of panels you could potentially get up to level 1 charging. If you were at a camp site for a few days out in the boonies in a well lit area you could potentially pick up between seventy five and a hundred fifty miles, depending. It wouldn't be practical for most things, but if you were going into the back country for a while it could potentially be useful, especially if you don't want to pack a gasoline generator.
Yea, I could totally see fancy trailers with solar roofs & fold out canopies.
I would expect anyone that is doing any serious towing is either going to buy the gas version, or get a F-250. Because for the average driver the biggest thing they put in the bed is a TV from WalMart.
Even towing a boat or camper with this thing could greatly reduce the range. Thats what I'm interested to see. Whats the 3500-7500lb trailer weight effects on the battery.
Even if it cuts range in half, that's still 150 miles of range. Plenty for a work crew to get to their site, work for a few hours, move to another site, and get back home. If they unhook the trailer and charge while grabbing lunch that's even more.
No you won't be hauling a horse trailer across three states, but having the capacity to haul a trailer full of furniture across town or a boat fifty miles to the lake or some soil home from the nursery is 95% of typical peoples use case.
Oh for sure, I think this will be a rocking fleet vehicle and close to home truck. It hits like 99% of my use case for an electric vehicle. I wonder if you put a roof rack on one, and could lay out solar panels how much of a charge could you generate. Like lets say you have the truck parked at the campground while you're out hiking and boating all day. Like could you get back 25% range?
No, you would be picking up like a percent or two at most, not enough to offset the extra weight and impact on your aerodynamics of the panels.
A small solar panel integrated into the roof that runs fans to keep the cabin cool and maybe maintain battery temperature might be worthwhile, but probably more complexity than its worth.
Solar just isn't efficient enough per unit of area to power a general purpose vehicle. The solar race cars that are basically a giant ultra light solar panel do nothing but move them and one person under solar power and still barely maintain highway speeds on sunny days.
Oh I'm not talking about powering them while driving. I mean having the truck parked 12-14 hours in the sun. Like you would while camping/boating/at the cabin etc... I could see high end trailers start coming with solar roofs and such. I mathed it out and with a full roof rack of panels you could potentially get up to level 1 charging. If you were at a camp site for a few days out in the boonies in a well lit area you could potentially pick up between seventy five and a hundred fifty miles, depending. It wouldn't be practical for most things, but if you were going into the back country for a while it could potentially be useful, especially if you don't want to pack a gasoline generator.
Yea, I could totally see fancy trailers with solar roofs & fold out canopies.
Oh yeah in that case I could see it as an over landing sort of thing. I think some of those roof popup tents have integrated panels. But roof racks in general kill economy so it would probably need to be a specific accessory for those longer term uses.
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webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
I would expect anyone that is doing any serious towing is either going to buy the gas version, or get a F-250. Because for the average driver the biggest thing they put in the bed is a TV from WalMart.
Even towing a boat or camper with this thing could greatly reduce the range. Thats what I'm interested to see. Whats the 3500-7500lb trailer weight effects on the battery.
Even if it cuts range in half, that's still 150 miles of range. Plenty for a work crew to get to their site, work for a few hours, move to another site, and get back home. If they unhook the trailer and charge while grabbing lunch that's even more.
No you won't be hauling a horse trailer across three states, but having the capacity to haul a trailer full of furniture across town or a boat fifty miles to the lake or some soil home from the nursery is 95% of typical peoples use case.
Oh for sure, I think this will be a rocking fleet vehicle and close to home truck. It hits like 99% of my use case for an electric vehicle. I wonder if you put a roof rack on one, and could lay out solar panels how much of a charge could you generate. Like lets say you have the truck parked at the campground while you're out hiking and boating all day. Like could you get back 25% range?
No, you would be picking up like a percent or two at most, not enough to offset the extra weight and impact on your aerodynamics of the panels.
A small solar panel integrated into the roof that runs fans to keep the cabin cool and maybe maintain battery temperature might be worthwhile, but probably more complexity than its worth.
Solar just isn't efficient enough per unit of area to power a general purpose vehicle. The solar race cars that are basically a giant ultra light solar panel do nothing but move them and one person under solar power and still barely maintain highway speeds on sunny days.
Oh I'm not talking about powering them while driving. I mean having the truck parked 12-14 hours in the sun. Like you would while camping/boating/at the cabin etc... I could see high end trailers start coming with solar roofs and such. I mathed it out and with a full roof rack of panels you could potentially get up to level 1 charging. If you were at a camp site for a few days out in the boonies in a well lit area you could potentially pick up between seventy five and a hundred fifty miles, depending. It wouldn't be practical for most things, but if you were going into the back country for a while it could potentially be useful, especially if you don't want to pack a gasoline generator.
Yea, I could totally see fancy trailers with solar roofs & fold out canopies.
Oh yeah in that case I could see it as an over landing sort of thing. I think some of those roof popup tents have integrated panels. But roof racks in general kill economy so it would probably need to be a specific accessory for those longer term uses.
Yea. It would be an interesting selling point. Definitely aftermarket of course. I wonder if instead of a rack you could have one of those bed canopies and once you park you just unfold the final panel or two over the cab. Keep the whole thing out of the slip stream while you drive. You might not get there fast, but you'd never need gas. Big problem is you're eating up 20%-25% of your payload capacity right there.
Most RV hookups are 30 amp, with some 50 amp. You'd get some, but to get the full charge in 8 hours you'd need Ford's fancy 80 amp charger.
80 amps can't be right...
*looks it up*
wow I didn't realize the spec went up that high... That is the max allowed. Most L2 chargers are 30 or 40 amp, 80 seems nuts... you'd need some monster calling... Like 2 gage wire in the walls and possibly even thicker for the charge cable since it needs to be robust.
I'm guessing those aren't gonna be super likely to be installed at homes, who even has that many amps to spare. I think I had an apartment with only 75 amp service once lol.
life's a game that you're bound to lose / like using a hammer to pound in screws
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
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webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
Welp looks like the entire 2022 production run of lightnings has been pre-ordered. Looks like I'm sticking with gas for one more generation
A standard car licence (the one you get without sitting a specialised test) is category B, which covers vehicles up to 3,500kg maximum authorised mass (the weight of the vehicle, plus its maximum load capacity)
For the F150 lightning, that's 6,500lbs plus 2,000lbs, which is a bit over 3,800kg
Manufacturers can downplate vehicles, by specifying a lower load capacity, which would make it legal but means if you were driving one about you can expect to get flagged down at weighbridges
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webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
A standard car licence (the one you get without sitting a specialised test) is category B, which covers vehicles up to 3,500kg maximum authorised mass (the weight of the vehicle, plus its maximum load capacity)
For the F150 lightning, that's 6,500lbs plus 2,000lbs, which is a bit over 3,800kg
Manufacturers can downplate vehicles, by specifying a lower load capacity, which would make it legal but means if you were driving one about you can expect to get flagged down at weighbridges
Ahh I missed the payload inclusion. Is this licenseing due to super old infrastructure/town layout or a driver skill thing?
It's just how EU licence categories work - once the vehicle is over three and a half tons you need to have completed a driving test in a vehicle of the relevant class. Anything above that weight is considered a Large Goods Vehicle or Heavy Goods Vehicle
The big cut-offs are 3,500kg (category C) and 7,500kg (category C+E)
The old category B, which is still grandfathered in if you obtained your licence more than 25 years ago, has a MAM limit of about 8,000kg
It's just how EU licence categories work - once the vehicle is over three and a half tons you need to have completed a driving test in a vehicle of the relevant class. Anything above that weight is considered a Large Goods Vehicle or Heavy Goods Vehicle
The big cut-offs are 3,500kg (category C) and 7,500kg (category C+E)
The old category B, which is still grandfathered in if you obtained your licence more than 25 years ago, has a MAM limit of about 8,000kg
Yeah, it's probably a good smart thing really.
Here in the US, you've get those 70 year old grandpas who haven't been tested or trained on their driving since 1965 driving some 45 foot / 30,000 lb monster towing a car behind it driving 75 on the interstate. Or some brodozer 3500 dually pulling a 5th wheel with four side by sides on it. Nothing special needed for that either.
Yet for some reason you need a special endorsement to ride a motorcycle. Which I think is a good thing, but hilarious you can do all that other shit with no special training or endorsement.
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webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
Honestly I feel it's a good requirement. I always hate seeing someone in a big f250 towing a 35ft 5th wheel knowing they weren't required to get any additional training/certification.
Honestly I feel it's a good requirement. I always hate seeing someone in a big f250 towing a 35ft 5th wheel knowing they weren't required to get any additional training/certification.
Yeah, and there's some terrifying about a 26' Uhaul towing a car.
They moistly come out at night, moistly.
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Red Raevynbecause I only take Bubble BathsRegistered Userregular
Honestly I feel it's a good requirement. I always hate seeing someone in a big f250 towing a 35ft 5th wheel knowing they weren't required to get any additional training/certification.
Yeah, and there's some terrifying about a 26' Uhaul towing a car.
Look I reserved a nice easy 16' truck for our cross country trip months in advance, but they did the classic big old load of bullshit "welp this is all we got" switcharoo on me and so there I was with a really big truck with a lot more of it behind the axle than I expected, towing the car. The pucker factor in the downhill portion of I-90 through Idaho was a downside, but a few things made it worth it:
the pride of backing that combination into a campsite (off a bend in the drive!)
the mileage we got out of playing pretend trucker with the dog on the big ol' bench seat
spending an evening in a quiet truck stop in Montana where we'd backed it up so it the open tailgate faced a beautiful sunset over fields and distant hills, which we watched from the queen-size mattress and couch that were easily laid out with our ridiculous amount of truck space
But I do agree, our licensing system is a complete joke.
Welp looks like the entire 2022 production run of lightnings has been pre-ordered. Looks like I'm sticking with gas for one more generation
I have 3 payments left on my Colorado, and am really really really looking forward to no car payments for hopefully at least 2 years. That's the biggest reason I didn't look at the Lightning right away.
Plus, I don't know that the range is quiiiiiite there to completely replace my ICE truck yet. I do a pretty fair amount of camping and outdoorsy stuff in far away places, and having to stop and charge for 30 minutes every 200 miles or so would really slow down travel. I think for me, to 100% replace my gas vehicle with a fully electric one, a 500 mile unloaded range would be ideal (which would make that 80% charge number 400 miles, which would make me feel fine spending a few days exploring a national park).
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webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
Welp looks like the entire 2022 production run of lightnings has been pre-ordered. Looks like I'm sticking with gas for one more generation
I have 3 payments left on my Colorado, and am really really really looking forward to no car payments for hopefully at least 2 years. That's the biggest reason I didn't look at the Lightning right away.
Plus, I don't know that the range is quiiiiiite there to completely replace my ICE truck yet. I do a pretty fair amount of camping and outdoorsy stuff in far away places, and having to stop and charge for 30 minutes every 200 miles or so would really slow down travel. I think for me, to 100% replace my gas vehicle with a fully electric one, a 500 mile unloaded range would be ideal (which would make that 80% charge number 400 miles, which would make me feel fine spending a few days exploring a national park).
See I'm already stopping every 2-3 hours or so to get out and stretch and walk around for a bit. I can't ride non-stop in cars for a long time anymore, so stopping to charge is just another chance to get out and move around.
Honestly I feel it's a good requirement. I always hate seeing someone in a big f250 towing a 35ft 5th wheel knowing they weren't required to get any additional training/certification.
Yeah, and there's some terrifying about a 26' Uhaul towing a car.
Now Uhaul is doing this thing where they will pay you to tow a trailer with one of their Pods on it, if you are renting one of their trucks. Coworker got paid like $700 to take one from Seattle area to Chicago. Which is like way too much money, in that it will be way too enticing for people who wouldn't trust themselves to do that otherwise.
When Ford unveiled the all-electric version of their best-selling F-150 last week, one of the major concerns was range. And it’s fair to say the F-150 ‘Lightning’ delivered – 230 miles per charge in standard-range spec and 300 miles in extended-range guise are impressive figures. However, Ford did not clarify how towing – an essential factor to any truck – would impact range.
That is until now. The automaker told popular YouTuber and tech-guru Marques Brownlee that the extended-range Lightning’s estimated 300-mile EPA range was actually when factoring in 1,000lbs of cargo. Brownlee also stated the prototype Ford lent him was showing 367 miles of range at only around 80% charge, meaning a range of over 400 miles per charge is more than plausible. In fact, if 367 miles is only the Lightning at 80%, 100% would be 458 miles per charge. Now, in reality that figure may not be entirely realistic accounting for most driving styles and conditions. But still, over 400 miles per charge is looking achievable.
When Ford unveiled the all-electric version of their best-selling F-150 last week, one of the major concerns was range. And it’s fair to say the F-150 ‘Lightning’ delivered – 230 miles per charge in standard-range spec and 300 miles in extended-range guise are impressive figures. However, Ford did not clarify how towing – an essential factor to any truck – would impact range.
That is until now. The automaker told popular YouTuber and tech-guru Marques Brownlee that the extended-range Lightning’s estimated 300-mile EPA range was actually when factoring in 1,000lbs of cargo. Brownlee also stated the prototype Ford lent him was showing 367 miles of range at only around 80% charge, meaning a range of over 400 miles per charge is more than plausible. In fact, if 367 miles is only the Lightning at 80%, 100% would be 458 miles per charge. Now, in reality that figure may not be entirely realistic accounting for most driving styles and conditions. But still, over 400 miles per charge is looking achievable.
Well....hot damn.
I didn't watch the entire video but 1000lb of cargo is very different than a 5k to 10k trailer. Impressive numbers for sure, but I still want to see a full trailer hauled around. I want to see it with a full bed hauling over a mountain pass. I want those stress tests.
This isn't to say I'm not excited for this truck. It is exactly what I want out of a 2nd vehicle for out here in the country. I just want to see the weaknesses have light shown on them and some real numbers.
When Ford unveiled the all-electric version of their best-selling F-150 last week, one of the major concerns was range. And it’s fair to say the F-150 ‘Lightning’ delivered – 230 miles per charge in standard-range spec and 300 miles in extended-range guise are impressive figures. However, Ford did not clarify how towing – an essential factor to any truck – would impact range.
That is until now. The automaker told popular YouTuber and tech-guru Marques Brownlee that the extended-range Lightning’s estimated 300-mile EPA range was actually when factoring in 1,000lbs of cargo. Brownlee also stated the prototype Ford lent him was showing 367 miles of range at only around 80% charge, meaning a range of over 400 miles per charge is more than plausible. In fact, if 367 miles is only the Lightning at 80%, 100% would be 458 miles per charge. Now, in reality that figure may not be entirely realistic accounting for most driving styles and conditions. But still, over 400 miles per charge is looking achievable.
Well....hot damn.
I didn't watch the entire video but 1000lb of cargo is very different than a 5k to 10k trailer. Impressive numbers for sure, but I still want to see a full trailer hauled around. I want to see it with a full bed hauling over a mountain pass. I want those stress tests.
This isn't to say I'm not excited for this truck. It is exactly what I want out of a 2nd vehicle for out here in the country. I just want to see the weaknesses have light shown on them and some real numbers.
Full tow over a mountain pass is a rarity and it can be hot garbage at that for all I care. People dealing with that out west aren't good candidates for the first wave given distance and inclines.
I’d be interested to see the efficiency of a loaded EV in the mountains. With regen braking I suspect it would have a long range at least relative to a gas truck, possibly even beating diesel.
I’d be interested to see the efficiency of a loaded EV in the mountains. With regen braking I suspect it would have a long range at least relative to a gas truck, possibly even beating diesel.
There are a few cases of mining operations where those giant dump trucks need to drive up to the mining site and back down with the material.
life's a game that you're bound to lose / like using a hammer to pound in screws
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
I need to move some stuff so I impulse bought a 4x4 with a towbar today
I may have also spent about (calculates) 7% of its value on car cleaning products, because I don't think this thing has ever been washed in its life
Finally picked this up after a protracted saga involving new gearbox mounts
The interior doesn't look that bad in this photo but it was ... bad
Every plastic surface tacky to the touch. Every fabric surface grimy, including (improbably) the headlining. All the leather shiny and greasy. The carpets, vile. Every less accessible nook and cranny stuffed with greasy dust. The spare wheel well was filled with what seemed to be beach sand (?) and grit. All the surfaces in the boot and cargo area covered in ground in mud.
It smelled very strongly of some kind of cheap valeting spray, which I assume probably accounts for the tacky surfaces, and may have been to cover up some other smell.
So:
Front seats out
Vacuumed
Scrubbed down the plastics with decent cleaner
Got some of the stains off the plastics with alcohol wipes
Made up a spray bottle of 5x concentrate upholstery cleaner and treated the fabrics and headlining
Did the same to the carpets and gave them a scrub with a stiff brush then left that to sit wet
Started in on the leather with a proper leather cleaner, but it was just turning into a disgusting brown foam as it lathered, so
Wiped down all the leather with neat white spirit until such time as I could wipe over it without the cloth coming away filthy
Used a carpet cleaning machine as a wet vac to lift the cleaner laid down earlier Then the leather cleaner, applied with a cloth and brushed into the folds and seams
More all purpose cleaner in the boot and spare wheel well to shift whatever the hell was ingrained into it
Steam cleaned the headlining and carpet
Then the carpet cleaning machine again:
The exterior was actually pretty much fine, I assume it was jet washed before being listed on auto trader. Just washed and spray waxed.
Anyway it is now at least a pleasant place to be. It doesn't smell, the leather feels like leather again, and it's possible to touch the surfaces without shuddering.
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webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
It sounds like someone set off a bug bomb in there. I had to do that to a jeep once that had been sitting for a while. It was the wrong thing to do. It left EVERY surface sticky, long after the smell went away.
I don't think it's that, if only because they aren't really a thing here.
I think it was just ordinary filth, just years and years of it. I'm the third owner in 12 years, according to the V5C, so it's feasible that someone had just used it for years without ever cleaning it
Anyway I've put a could of hundred miles on it and, touch wood, it seems mechanically sound. The deal was it was coming with a new clutch and a year's MOT, and the guy decided to replace all the gearbox mounts while the box was dropped. I've probably paid less than the cost of the clutch and mounts for it, all in.
Things actually wrong with it:
- No idea about the timing belt. I would hope it hasn't made it to 140k on the original belt, but you never know. There's a wad of service invoices in the owner's manual so I need to have a delve through those.
- The underbody looks pretty nasty, but there doesn't seem to be any serious corrosion on the body itself. Sills are fine and these aren't generally regarded as a corrosion nightmare as far as I can tell. It got a pile of new suspension components two MOT tests ago which really highlight how crusty some of the parts under there are.
- Spare tyre has a sidewall bulge, which should be an MOT failure point. I'm not going to fuss about it with the seller, but I do need to sort that.
- AC doesn't work. Might just need a regas but usually if that's the case people will just sort it, so not pinning my hopes on that
- Paint is pretty poor. Where it's undamaged it's fine, still holds gloss and takes a wax. Lots of stone chips and minor scratches, though
- Driver's sun visor flops down. Have taken it off for now and ebayed a replacement. I've ordered one for a later model because it looks like the same part and there was only one listed for this model specifically, at exorbitant cost
- I have my suspicions about the tailgate latch actuator, because when I first took a look at it the seller couldn't get it to unlock, but it's seemed fine since.
Jobs to do:
Fit this replacement sun visor
Take the timing cover off and play "guess the age of the belt"
New spare tyre
I got some leather stitching tools (ebay again) to have a go at closing up the burst seam on the driver's seat bolster
Also got a steering wheel reconditioning kit to seal and recover the leather where the colour layer has worn through
These are trivial costs. I'm not keen on the idea of actually sinking big money into this thing, so even if the timing belt is ancient I'm likely still not going to replace it. Similarly undersealing the body is probably daft at this point. The spare tyre I'm wavering on - the tyres on it are all budget ditchfinders, and my instinct is always to spend the extra for decent tyres, but I don't really want to do that for a spare, and if I replace a road wheel I should probably at least do both on an axle, which starts feeling like spending proper money on it
Compact pickups are an untapped and unproven market in the U.S.
Man screw CNBC. Neither of those statements are true. US auto makers just couldn't compete so they chicken taxed light trucks out of existence and sold everyone hulking behemoths. Then foreign makers started putting plants on US soil and selling them, and once again US auto makers are playing catch up.
matt has a problem on
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SummaryJudgmentGrab the hottest iron you can find, stride in the Tower’s front doorRegistered Userregular
When Ford unveiled the all-electric version of their best-selling F-150 last week, one of the major concerns was range. And it’s fair to say the F-150 ‘Lightning’ delivered – 230 miles per charge in standard-range spec and 300 miles in extended-range guise are impressive figures. However, Ford did not clarify how towing – an essential factor to any truck – would impact range.
That is until now. The automaker told popular YouTuber and tech-guru Marques Brownlee that the extended-range Lightning’s estimated 300-mile EPA range was actually when factoring in 1,000lbs of cargo. Brownlee also stated the prototype Ford lent him was showing 367 miles of range at only around 80% charge, meaning a range of over 400 miles per charge is more than plausible. In fact, if 367 miles is only the Lightning at 80%, 100% would be 458 miles per charge. Now, in reality that figure may not be entirely realistic accounting for most driving styles and conditions. But still, over 400 miles per charge is looking achievable.
Well....hot damn.
I didn't watch the entire video but 1000lb of cargo is very different than a 5k to 10k trailer. Impressive numbers for sure, but I still want to see a full trailer hauled around. I want to see it with a full bed hauling over a mountain pass. I want those stress tests.
This isn't to say I'm not excited for this truck. It is exactly what I want out of a 2nd vehicle for out here in the country. I just want to see the weaknesses have light shown on them and some real numbers.
Full tow over a mountain pass is a rarity and it can be hot garbage at that for all I care. People dealing with that out west aren't good candidates for the first wave given distance and inclines.
Tell you what, having recently spent some time in the Smokies and not finding ANY FUCKING GAS, I'm fine if it has shit range in the mountains if I can just plug it into a 220V instead of praying that this station will have gas, unlike the last 3 or 4 we hit
SummaryJudgment on
Some days Blue wonders why anyone ever bothered making numbers so small; other days she supposes even infinity needs to start somewhere.
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webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
Compact pickups are an untapped and unproven market in the U.S.
Man screw CNBC. Neither of those statements are true. US auto makers just couldn't compete so they chicken taxed light trucks out of existence and sold everyone hulking behemoths. Then foreign makers started putting plants on US soil and selling them, and once again US auto makers are playing catch up.
No one makes compact trucks right now, not even the japanese manufacturers. There is no catching up. The last compact truck was probably the Nissan Frontier in 2005, maybe the ranger in 2012. After that everything was midsized. I would agree at this point, 16 years later the compact market is unproven. Especially since the ford and Hyundai light trucks are unibody short bed long cab. Its a different market with different vehicles than the early aughts.
When Ford unveiled the all-electric version of their best-selling F-150 last week, one of the major concerns was range. And it’s fair to say the F-150 ‘Lightning’ delivered – 230 miles per charge in standard-range spec and 300 miles in extended-range guise are impressive figures. However, Ford did not clarify how towing – an essential factor to any truck – would impact range.
That is until now. The automaker told popular YouTuber and tech-guru Marques Brownlee that the extended-range Lightning’s estimated 300-mile EPA range was actually when factoring in 1,000lbs of cargo. Brownlee also stated the prototype Ford lent him was showing 367 miles of range at only around 80% charge, meaning a range of over 400 miles per charge is more than plausible. In fact, if 367 miles is only the Lightning at 80%, 100% would be 458 miles per charge. Now, in reality that figure may not be entirely realistic accounting for most driving styles and conditions. But still, over 400 miles per charge is looking achievable.
Well....hot damn.
I take some exception to "An essential factor to any truck". 75% of truck owners tow something 1 time a year or less.
Ford is going to be the only American Car company standing In The future, while GM and Chrysler continue to spiral.
I don't like saying that , as I have friends and family back in the Midwest, whom work for all the Big three respectively, but Ford has been really putting their money where their mouth is, when it comes to EV , other than Tesla in America.
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Oh for sure, I think this will be a rocking fleet vehicle and close to home truck. It hits like 99% of my use case for an electric vehicle. I wonder if you put a roof rack on one, and could lay out solar panels how much of a charge could you generate. Like lets say you have the truck parked at the campground while you're out hiking and boating all day. Like could you get back 25% range?
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In Canada, when I was 23 I paid $530 a month on a Pontiac Pursuit 2005, that I only paid maybe $7k for.
No tickets or points either, just near Toronto.
My A4 I got when I was 25 I paid about $290 a month.
Now at 32 on the Merc I only pay $130.
My house insurance is only $90 so it’s real bonkers.
No, you would be picking up like a percent or two at most, not enough to offset the extra weight and impact on your aerodynamics of the panels.
A small solar panel integrated into the roof that runs fans to keep the cabin cool and maybe maintain battery temperature might be worthwhile, but probably more complexity than its worth.
Solar just isn't efficient enough per unit of area to power a general purpose vehicle. The solar race cars that are basically a giant ultra light solar panel do nothing but move them and one person under solar power and still barely maintain highway speeds on sunny days.
Oh I'm not talking about powering them while driving. I mean having the truck parked 12-14 hours in the sun. Like you would while camping/boating/at the cabin etc... I could see high end trailers start coming with solar roofs and such. I mathed it out and with a full roof rack of panels you could potentially get up to level 1 charging. If you were at a camp site for a few days out in the boonies in a well lit area you could potentially pick up between seventy five and a hundred fifty miles, depending. It wouldn't be practical for most things, but if you were going into the back country for a while it could potentially be useful, especially if you don't want to pack a gasoline generator.
Yea, I could totally see fancy trailers with solar roofs & fold out canopies.
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Oh yeah in that case I could see it as an over landing sort of thing. I think some of those roof popup tents have integrated panels. But roof racks in general kill economy so it would probably need to be a specific accessory for those longer term uses.
Yea. It would be an interesting selling point. Definitely aftermarket of course. I wonder if instead of a rack you could have one of those bed canopies and once you park you just unfold the final panel or two over the cab. Keep the whole thing out of the slip stream while you drive. You might not get there fast, but you'd never need gas. Big problem is you're eating up 20%-25% of your payload capacity right there.
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80 amps can't be right...
*looks it up*
wow I didn't realize the spec went up that high... That is the max allowed. Most L2 chargers are 30 or 40 amp, 80 seems nuts... you'd need some monster calling... Like 2 gage wire in the walls and possibly even thicker for the charge cable since it needs to be robust.
I'm guessing those aren't gonna be super likely to be installed at homes, who even has that many amps to spare. I think I had an apartment with only 75 amp service once lol.
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
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I'm not actually sure if it could be driven in the UK on a standard car licence
Really? 6500lbs isnt terribly bad for a truck stuffed with batteries. Only a ton more than a tesla.
Edit just looked it up. You could probably be fine with the 230 mile range one, but the extended will probably put you over the top.
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
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For the F150 lightning, that's 6,500lbs plus 2,000lbs, which is a bit over 3,800kg
Manufacturers can downplate vehicles, by specifying a lower load capacity, which would make it legal but means if you were driving one about you can expect to get flagged down at weighbridges
Ahh I missed the payload inclusion. Is this licenseing due to super old infrastructure/town layout or a driver skill thing?
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
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The big cut-offs are 3,500kg (category C) and 7,500kg (category C+E)
The old category B, which is still grandfathered in if you obtained your licence more than 25 years ago, has a MAM limit of about 8,000kg
Yeah, it's probably a good smart thing really.
Here in the US, you've get those 70 year old grandpas who haven't been tested or trained on their driving since 1965 driving some 45 foot / 30,000 lb monster towing a car behind it driving 75 on the interstate. Or some brodozer 3500 dually pulling a 5th wheel with four side by sides on it. Nothing special needed for that either.
Yet for some reason you need a special endorsement to ride a motorcycle. Which I think is a good thing, but hilarious you can do all that other shit with no special training or endorsement.
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
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Yeah, and there's some terrifying about a 26' Uhaul towing a car.
- the pride of backing that combination into a campsite (off a bend in the drive!)
- the mileage we got out of playing pretend trucker with the dog on the big ol' bench seat
- spending an evening in a quiet truck stop in Montana where we'd backed it up so it the open tailgate faced a beautiful sunset over fields and distant hills, which we watched from the queen-size mattress and couch that were easily laid out with our ridiculous amount of truck space
But I do agree, our licensing system is a complete joke.I may have also spent about (calculates) 7% of its value on car cleaning products, because I don't think this thing has ever been washed in its life
I have 3 payments left on my Colorado, and am really really really looking forward to no car payments for hopefully at least 2 years. That's the biggest reason I didn't look at the Lightning right away.
Plus, I don't know that the range is quiiiiiite there to completely replace my ICE truck yet. I do a pretty fair amount of camping and outdoorsy stuff in far away places, and having to stop and charge for 30 minutes every 200 miles or so would really slow down travel. I think for me, to 100% replace my gas vehicle with a fully electric one, a 500 mile unloaded range would be ideal (which would make that 80% charge number 400 miles, which would make me feel fine spending a few days exploring a national park).
See I'm already stopping every 2-3 hours or so to get out and stretch and walk around for a bit. I can't ride non-stop in cars for a long time anymore, so stopping to charge is just another chance to get out and move around.
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
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My GF pays nearly 3X for her little Hyundai that I do for my R35.
She has a few tickets on there but it still seems crazy considering... well everything else there.
Now Uhaul is doing this thing where they will pay you to tow a trailer with one of their Pods on it, if you are renting one of their trucks. Coworker got paid like $700 to take one from Seattle area to Chicago. Which is like way too much money, in that it will be way too enticing for people who wouldn't trust themselves to do that otherwise.
Well....hot damn.
I didn't watch the entire video but 1000lb of cargo is very different than a 5k to 10k trailer. Impressive numbers for sure, but I still want to see a full trailer hauled around. I want to see it with a full bed hauling over a mountain pass. I want those stress tests.
This isn't to say I'm not excited for this truck. It is exactly what I want out of a 2nd vehicle for out here in the country. I just want to see the weaknesses have light shown on them and some real numbers.
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
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Full tow over a mountain pass is a rarity and it can be hot garbage at that for all I care. People dealing with that out west aren't good candidates for the first wave given distance and inclines.
You can't give someone a pirate ship in one game, and then take it back in the next game. It's rude.
There are a few cases of mining operations where those giant dump trucks need to drive up to the mining site and back down with the material.
Since they're so much heavier on the trip down somebody figured out you could make the thing an EV and never need to plug it in, just regenerative brake your batteries full as you coast downhill.
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
Finally picked this up after a protracted saga involving new gearbox mounts
The interior doesn't look that bad in this photo but it was ... bad
Every plastic surface tacky to the touch. Every fabric surface grimy, including (improbably) the headlining. All the leather shiny and greasy. The carpets, vile. Every less accessible nook and cranny stuffed with greasy dust. The spare wheel well was filled with what seemed to be beach sand (?) and grit. All the surfaces in the boot and cargo area covered in ground in mud.
It smelled very strongly of some kind of cheap valeting spray, which I assume probably accounts for the tacky surfaces, and may have been to cover up some other smell.
So:
Front seats out
Vacuumed
Scrubbed down the plastics with decent cleaner
Got some of the stains off the plastics with alcohol wipes
Made up a spray bottle of 5x concentrate upholstery cleaner and treated the fabrics and headlining
Did the same to the carpets and gave them a scrub with a stiff brush then left that to sit wet
Started in on the leather with a proper leather cleaner, but it was just turning into a disgusting brown foam as it lathered, so
Wiped down all the leather with neat white spirit until such time as I could wipe over it without the cloth coming away filthy
Used a carpet cleaning machine as a wet vac to lift the cleaner laid down earlier
Then the leather cleaner, applied with a cloth and brushed into the folds and seams
More all purpose cleaner in the boot and spare wheel well to shift whatever the hell was ingrained into it
Steam cleaned the headlining and carpet
Then the carpet cleaning machine again:
The exterior was actually pretty much fine, I assume it was jet washed before being listed on auto trader. Just washed and spray waxed.
Anyway it is now at least a pleasant place to be. It doesn't smell, the leather feels like leather again, and it's possible to touch the surfaces without shuddering.
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
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I think it was just ordinary filth, just years and years of it. I'm the third owner in 12 years, according to the V5C, so it's feasible that someone had just used it for years without ever cleaning it
Anyway I've put a could of hundred miles on it and, touch wood, it seems mechanically sound. The deal was it was coming with a new clutch and a year's MOT, and the guy decided to replace all the gearbox mounts while the box was dropped. I've probably paid less than the cost of the clutch and mounts for it, all in.
Things actually wrong with it:
- No idea about the timing belt. I would hope it hasn't made it to 140k on the original belt, but you never know. There's a wad of service invoices in the owner's manual so I need to have a delve through those.
- The underbody looks pretty nasty, but there doesn't seem to be any serious corrosion on the body itself. Sills are fine and these aren't generally regarded as a corrosion nightmare as far as I can tell. It got a pile of new suspension components two MOT tests ago which really highlight how crusty some of the parts under there are.
- Spare tyre has a sidewall bulge, which should be an MOT failure point. I'm not going to fuss about it with the seller, but I do need to sort that.
- AC doesn't work. Might just need a regas but usually if that's the case people will just sort it, so not pinning my hopes on that
- Paint is pretty poor. Where it's undamaged it's fine, still holds gloss and takes a wax. Lots of stone chips and minor scratches, though
- Driver's sun visor flops down. Have taken it off for now and ebayed a replacement. I've ordered one for a later model because it looks like the same part and there was only one listed for this model specifically, at exorbitant cost
- I have my suspicions about the tailgate latch actuator, because when I first took a look at it the seller couldn't get it to unlock, but it's seemed fine since.
Jobs to do:
Fit this replacement sun visor
Take the timing cover off and play "guess the age of the belt"
New spare tyre
I got some leather stitching tools (ebay again) to have a go at closing up the burst seam on the driver's seat bolster
Also got a steering wheel reconditioning kit to seal and recover the leather where the colour layer has worn through
These are trivial costs. I'm not keen on the idea of actually sinking big money into this thing, so even if the timing belt is ancient I'm likely still not going to replace it. Similarly undersealing the body is probably daft at this point. The spare tyre I'm wavering on - the tyres on it are all budget ditchfinders, and my instinct is always to spend the extra for decent tyres, but I don't really want to do that for a spare, and if I replace a road wheel I should probably at least do both on an axle, which starts feeling like spending proper money on it
Man screw CNBC. Neither of those statements are true. US auto makers just couldn't compete so they chicken taxed light trucks out of existence and sold everyone hulking behemoths. Then foreign makers started putting plants on US soil and selling them, and once again US auto makers are playing catch up.
Tell you what, having recently spent some time in the Smokies and not finding ANY FUCKING GAS, I'm fine if it has shit range in the mountains if I can just plug it into a 220V instead of praying that this station will have gas, unlike the last 3 or 4 we hit
No one makes compact trucks right now, not even the japanese manufacturers. There is no catching up. The last compact truck was probably the Nissan Frontier in 2005, maybe the ranger in 2012. After that everything was midsized. I would agree at this point, 16 years later the compact market is unproven. Especially since the ford and Hyundai light trucks are unibody short bed long cab. Its a different market with different vehicles than the early aughts.
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
I take some exception to "An essential factor to any truck". 75% of truck owners tow something 1 time a year or less.
Ford is going to be the only American Car company standing In The future, while GM and Chrysler continue to spiral.
I don't like saying that , as I have friends and family back in the Midwest, whom work for all the Big three respectively, but Ford has been really putting their money where their mouth is, when it comes to EV , other than Tesla in America.
GM, well, is gonna GM as usual. Sigh.