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Posts

  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    edited April 2018
    Norgoth wrote: »
    Mazzyx wrote: »
    So we finally had one of our 4-5 hour club days after a month of missing them and such. I was going to start testing my NOVA 2k list for trios but a bro was like you want to play my Slaanesh daemons yesterday so I was like fuck it, my EC are coming out instead of Alpha Legion. And also again I just can't give up the strike first or in this case go back and forth. Which again is huge verse always going last due to the Slaanesh daemon ability.

    First the first turn charge is dead, long live the first turn charge. Slaanesh daemons are crazy fast. We got the deployment where at the closest we were 15" apart. This mean I had to be really smart with my screen placement so if they killed a screen I had some room between my noise marines and worthwhile units so they couldn't be consolidated into and I at least would get some overwatch. My opponent was smart and played the melee rules well. He didn't strike with his stuff on his turn giving my cultist free swings but on my turn he would wipe out the unit. The fiends were huge on preventing me from backing up and shooting the daemonettes to death.

    He got first turn though I had the +1 by rolling a six and me rolling 2. In the first turn 40 daemonettes, two fiends, and the Forgeworld super Keeper of secrets got in my line. Killed my maulerfiend, continuing his record of dying turn 1 in 90% of games, and just locked themselves in combat with my front line of cultist which I couldn't do anything about. He didn't attack me during his turn keeping himself in combat and my cultist failed at killing the fiends so they stuck.

    My turn was my heldrake almost killing a daemonprince, killing seekers, wiping out 20 more slaanesh daemonettes and mostly clearing the back line trying to find a way to get points with my shit cards. I keep my termis in deep strike and failed a charge with possessed even though it was 5" and I rerolled one dice by rolling a 4. My cultist still couldn't kill a fiend. The first line gets evaporated but I kept the super keeper out of my main lines for a turn. Also daemonettes tie up my defiler. Takes till turn 4 for him to clear up the daemonettes but he kills like 40.

    His turn charges and gets into combat with the second cultist line and some noise marines but at least eats overwatch. Lost most of my noise marines, but they took out their worth in return fire mostly. At the end of my turn my possessed get into combat along with their supporting characters. My DP rips up another one. My drakes finishes off the daemon's DP with the flamer. My possessed even with him blowing a lot of CP for the -1 attack, the additional attacks on 6s to wound and the masks -1 go beserk and kill about 18 daemonettes. They end up basically clearing out the daemonettes, the mask, and a herald on foot.

    My termis take a point I needed to capture and finish off a herald on a seeker also.

    Most of the rest of the game was the lord of war keeper running around scoring points while my backline finished off the rest of his army leaving him with just the big keeper slightly wounded. But I had enough fire with a rhino, noise marines, possessed, and some termis and good ol' deffy to finish and table my opponent.

    It went 5 full rounds. Game ended at the bottom of 5 in combat with my possessed killing the thing as my opponent didn't realize they were strength 5 not strength 4. I won via tabling but would of lost via points by about 2 due to my cards unless there was at turn 6.

    Close game. Slaanesh daemons are nasty and fast and I really under estimated their range. The super keeper with the right warlord trait has like a standard 25" threat range on turn one. Its mean.

    He apparently knows the combat rules so well that he super cheated in your game
    A er all charging units have fought, the players alternate choosing eligible units to fight with (starting with the player whose turn it is) until all eligible units on both sides have fought once each

    Edit: Realized you were talking about something else. I think we were both off reading the main rule book, didn't effect the main outcome outside I might have gotten a little more shooting off.

    Mazzyx on
    03x29di.png
  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    Dayspring wrote: »
    What are your thoughts on mixing blastmasters/sonic blasters?
    I always used to split them, keep the blastmasters in small 5 man teams hanging out at the back, and keep the sonic blasters with doom siren champs who get closer

    In the old days I agreed with this. But since I can not split fire it doesn't matter and mixing tends to work out really well.

    Also to top it off I have been using the assault mode a lot in my last few games anyway due to facing more hordes than tanks. And even then I can use the heavy if I don't advance.

    03x29di.png
    Dayspring
  • BizazedoBizazedo Registered User regular
    Mazzyx wrote: »

    You have to take three then, though. So your options are 3 Assassins or 1 Assassins and -1 CP.

    I really like them but honestly they were never overpowered and with the deep strike change, well =/

    I'm hoping they get a more lenient custom rule in the future, possibly in whatever rework Inquisitors get (Imperial Agents book again?)

    That is part of the beta rules. Write in your thoughts. They actually changed the psyker one to not fuck GK and Tsons with smites because of that. Also it went from a -1 to cast penalty to a +1 to the warp charge which is a pretty big change since now you still get the chance of a d6 smite where with the -1 after two casts you couldn't.

    This was all due to feedback from folks playing.

    Edit: Send your feedback to this email address [email protected][/quote]
    Funny bit, I and my friends completely misread the beta rule for months and always assumed it was a +1 to the warp charge, not a -1 to cast penalty. The revision is finally what made us realize we had been doing it wrong, but due to the change, had been doing it right.

    Naturally, we now consider ourselves geniuses.

    XBL: Bizazedo
    PSN: Bizazedo
    CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
    KhraulH3Knuckles
  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    So talk to the dude I played Sunday we both kind of messed up because I always want to punch when I attack and this is his first melee army as he is normally the guard player with super heavies. Not really a win at all cost guy either. He got the idea watching a battle report so we both just kind of screwed up. Probably would made the game a lot more lop sided so I am okay with it as it was a close game that went 5 turns which is something I haven't had a lot of in 5th recently. Especially verse a few armies where usually by turn 3 it is decided for one side or the other and it is just clean up or move towards tabling. If we played it right it would of probably been one of those move towards tabling situations as I would of of wiped his entire front line turn 1/2 instead of having to do it piecemeal over 3-4 turns.

    Luckily it is a good learning moment and the joy of having a consistent club you can give people the benefit of the doubt when we screw up. I remember one game both me and the guy got AoS rules in our head for deny the witch (18" range verse 24" in 40k). It wasn't malicious it was just both of us getting the game rules confused.

    Helps that it is a club of for fun players not really tourney folks so you get a lot of fluff list.

    Probably why my Defiler is a constant all star.

    03x29di.png
    Khraul
  • LanlaornLanlaorn Registered User regular
    edited April 2018
    If you have a bunch of screening units it would have been easy for him to do the no-attack thing the right way anyway, so the way it played out is probably entirely as it would have anyway.

    Edit: Also, hey what's this, just checked the warhammer community page and the online army builder is apparently just suddenly live?!

    https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/04/30/combat-roster-now-live-apr-30gw-homepage-post-1/

    Lanlaorn on
  • DayspringDayspring the Phoenician Registered User regular
    Its power level only for now though

  • LanlaornLanlaorn Registered User regular
    Yea and, having looked at it now, honestly not that useful.

    IMHO this is the gold standard every wargame should copy

    https://army.infinitythegame.com/

    Online list builder with full unit stats, save and export options, each special rule is a link that directs to their comprehensive rules wiki. Oh, and you can download an offline copy too, if you want.

  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    Lanlaorn wrote: »
    Yea and, having looked at it now, honestly not that useful.

    IMHO this is the gold standard every wargame should copy

    https://army.infinitythegame.com/

    Online list builder with full unit stats, save and export options, each special rule is a link that directs to their comprehensive rules wiki. Oh, and you can download an offline copy too, if you want.

    Until GW moves away from rules based codexes this will never ever happen. In AoS they did with the free warscrolls and that builder is much better with links to rules and so on.

    The most you will get is a detailed builder with no rules from GW. Which makes sense with how they sell books.

    03x29di.png
  • SmokeStacksSmokeStacks The Myth, the Legend, the Bowman, the Shambler FuckerRegistered User regular
    Combat Roster is filled with typos and is a pain in the ass to use (especially compared to the old free web based army builder that they C&D'd at the beginning of 8th), but it's a step in the right direction I guess.

    Also, I hate to go all Mean Girls here, but I really wish they would stop trying to make Power Points happen.

    73CQcJZ.png
    Lanlaorn
  • TheInspectorTheInspector Registered User regular
    I'm looking at getting back into this game for the first time since the mid-nineties. The last time I played, Dark Eldar were nothing but a rumour, Tau straight up didn't exist and Necrons were called androids and just appeared in Space Crusade. But some friends are starting to gather armies for the first time in twenty years, and I don't want to be the only guy not trading money for plastic men.

    I used to play Space Marines, and I don't want to retread old ground so could people let me know their thoughts on these questions?

    Genestealer Cults - they're cool in theory and I was thinking I could convert some Necromunda models into cultists. Are they decent in 8ed? They seem to rely on sneak attacks, and while I have no idea how that works yet, it seems like it would be cool but gimmicky and easy to counter if that's your only tactic.

    Adeptus Mechanicus - they look great, and were my number one choice but apparently the new FAQ screws them over. I'm not looking at playing competitively, but I don't want to feel sad for my guys either. Are they actually bad, or is it just post-nerf blues that is making people say they're no good now?

    Back in the 90s, Imperial Agents were a thing. This was assassins, inquisitors and anyone else who wasn't Space Marines, Imperial Guard and maybe Sisters of Battle. Is there some way to play an equivalent army? I see mention of Imperial Soup, which seems to be IG or SM, with some allies from the other imperial factions to shore up gaps in the primary faction. But is it possible to say, play an Inquisition army with stormtroopers, Sisters of Silence and other Imperial oddballs? I see Deathwatch are getting a new codex, but I can't commit myself to power armour again. There's no mention of this dream army in the front page post, but I can hope.

    Thanks for any answers.

    xbox360/WiiU: AnEvilHypnotist
  • TIFunkaliciousTIFunkalicious Kicking back in NebraskaRegistered User regular
    edited April 2018
    Just a few of my thoughts
    Genestealer Cults - they're cool in theory and I was thinking I could convert some Necromunda models into cultists. Are they decent in 8ed? They seem to rely on sneak attacks, and while I have no idea how that works yet, it seems like it would be cool but gimmicky and easy to counter if that's your only tactic.

    It's kinda as you say, GSC on their own live or die on their infiltrate rolls. Because of the new army building rules though, they can be freely taken with Tyranids in other detachments or Imperial Guard in their own (single) detachment. I haven't seen an army yet that has a majority of it's points in Cult. They seem to be a fun supplemental force though. Having some of them is the only way you can take a hive tyrant and a baneblade in the same list
    Adeptus Mechanicus - they look great, and were my number one choice but apparently the new FAQ screws them over. I'm not looking at playing competitively, but I don't want to feel sad for my guys either. Are they actually bad, or is it just post-nerf blues that is making people say they're no good now?

    If anything the FAQ gave armies like ad mech more room to breathe. The armies that they had the biggest problems with had some of their gimmicks broken
    Back in the 90s, Imperial Agents were a thing. This was assassins, inquisitors and anyone else who wasn't Space Marines, Imperial Guard and maybe Sisters of Battle. Is there some way to play an equivalent army? I see mention of Imperial Soup, which seems to be IG or SM, with some allies from the other imperial factions to shore up gaps in the primary faction. But is it possible to say, play an Inquisition army with stormtroopers, Sisters of Silence and other Imperial oddballs? I see Deathwatch are getting a new codex, but I can't commit myself to power armour again. There's no mention of this dream army in the front page post, but I can hope.

    Yes you can actually make a pretty mean army with that theme. You can include any units in your army as long as they are under one of the 7 big umbrellas (Imperial, Chaos, Eldar, Nids, Orks, Necrons, Tau) but the subfactions like Space Marines, Guard, Sisters of Battle, Assassins etc. have to match within a detachment and you can only take up to 3 detachments in matched play rules. So single detachments for Deathwatch, militarum tempestus (stormtroopers), and assassins would be a legal army

    TIFunkalicious on
    KhraulTheInspector
  • SmokeStacksSmokeStacks The Myth, the Legend, the Bowman, the Shambler FuckerRegistered User regular
    Imperial Dream Teams are kind of broken right now (the beta rules don't allow you to group Imperial units together as easily as you could in the past), plus the out of the way models tend to be expensive compared to other armies. There is a chance we might see some sort of Imperial Agents codex at some point in the future (and there is supposed to be a fullblown Sisters release coming in a year or two), but outside of that it seems like anything Imperial that isn't Space Marines or Guard has kinda been backburnered.

    I have a friend who plays GSC and he's kinda butthurt about where they are right now, but he gets kinda butthurt about every army he plays so I can't confirm or deny how they are doing on the board. They get some really cool looking transports though, and it's possible (although I don't know how easy or useful it is) to ally in both Tyranids and Imperial Guard units for some variety/adaptability as well as some cool painting opportunities.

    Admech and Necrons are both part of the new campaign starter box (Forgebane), so if you wanted to start one of those armies it would be fairly cheap if you split the box with someone who wanted whatever army you weren't picking.

    I know you mentioned not wanting to dip back into spess mehreens, but the rules are so different now (and the sculpts are so much better) that it might be something to look at as an option. Some of the really idol heavy chapters like the Blood Angels have some really cool models that are covered with chapter specific iconography, and while there is some debate about their usefulness the new Primaris models do look pretty cool.

    Are you guys going to start off small and build armies over time? You could just look at the Start Collecting boxes and go from there.

    73CQcJZ.png
    BrainleechTheInspector
  • ForceVoidForceVoid Registered User regular
    I'd happily take the Necron half of that box if you are interested

  • novaspikenovaspike Registered User regular
    Hey all, new list composition to run by everyone.
    ++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Aeldari - Drukhari) [51 PL, 968pts] ++

    + No Force Org Slot +

    Detachment Attribute: Ynnari

    + HQ +

    Archon [4 PL, 91pts]: Agoniser, Blaster

    The Yncarne [17 PL, 337pts]: Ancestors' Grace, Word of the Phoenix

    + Troops +

    Kabalite Warriors [2 PL, 47pts]
    . 3x Kabalite Warrior
    . Kabalite Warrior with special weapon: Blaster
    . Sybarite: Splinter Rifle

    Kabalite Warriors [2 PL, 47pts]
    . 3x Kabalite Warrior
    . Kabalite Warrior with special weapon: Blaster
    . Sybarite: Splinter Rifle

    Wyches [4 PL, 73pts]
    . Hekatrix: Agoniser, Splinter pistol
    . 6x Wych
    . Wych with Wych Weapon: Shardnet and impaler

    Wyches [4 PL, 81pts]
    . Hekatrix: Agoniser, Splinter pistol
    . 7x Wych
    . Wych with Wych Weapon: Shardnet and impaler

    + Dedicated Transport +

    Raider [5 PL, 81pts]: Disintegrator cannon, Shock Prow

    Raider [5 PL, 81pts]: Disintegrator cannon, Shock Prow

    Venom [4 PL, 65pts]: Splinter Cannon, Twin splinter rifle

    Venom [4 PL, 65pts]: Splinter Cannon, Twin splinter rifle

    ++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [44 PL, 792pts] ++

    + No Force Org Slot +

    Craftworld Attribute: Ynnari

    + HQ +

    Farseer [6 PL, 110pts]: 2. Doom, 3. Fortune, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

    Warlock [2 PL, 55pts]: 5. Quicken/Restrain, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

    Yvraine [7 PL, 132pts]: 3. Tenacious Survivor, Gaze of Ynnead, Word of the Phoenix, Ynnari Warlord

    + Troops +

    Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger

    Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger

    Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger

    + Elites +

    Wraithguard [20 PL, 315pts]: D-scythe, 7x Wraithguard

    ++ Outrider Detachment +1CP (Aeldari - Drukhari) [13 PL, 240pts] ++

    + No Force Org Slot +

    Detachment Attribute: Cult of the Red Grief

    Fixed Combat Drug Selections

    Prizes from the Dark City (1 Relic)

    + HQ +

    Succubus [4 PL, 60pts]: Blast Pistol, The Blood Glaive

    + Fast Attack +

    Reavers [3 PL, 60pts]: Arena Champion, Grav-Talon, 2x Reaver

    Reavers [3 PL, 60pts]: Arena Champion, Grav-Talon, 2x Reaver

    Reavers [3 PL, 60pts]: Arena Champion, Grav-Talon, 2x Reaver

    ++ Total: [108 PL, 2000pts] ++

    Created with BattleScribe

    With KingdomCon over I'm finally getting to come to grips with the new Drukhari codex and post-FAQ Ynnari. Luckily my LGS is running a 1250 league so I can experiment with little parts and test crazy strategies.

    For the spoilered list the idea is to run Yvraine, the archon, and succubus in the raiders with the wyches. Yvraine will probably jump out during T1 in order to move with the farseer/warlock/wraithguard. The wraiths with quicken can move 22" and still shoot 8". If I really need to they could get WotP to go for 33" then shoot. The two blaster venoms generally get aggressive and annoying, but also serve as great ways to summon the Yncarne (when they inevitably blow up). Rangers sit on/near objectives so the Drukhari can focus on combat. The reavers advance 26", then charge backline shooters to tie them up. The way I play Ynnari is a little odd: I like lots of melee and strong short to medium range shooting to try and get several units to soulburst (even just extra movement can be really strong). I finally feel like I'm taking advantage of mixing cults and kabals by having legitimate access to both the agents of vect strat and the cult of strife strat.

    Overall one of my biggest debates is big blob of reavers vs MSU, and if they should be armed with blasters or not.

  • TheInspectorTheInspector Registered User regular
    Just a few of my thoughts

    It's kinda as you say, GSC on their own live or die on their infiltrate rolls. Because of the new army building rules though, they can be freely taken with Tyranids in other detachments or Imperial Guard in their own (single) detachment. I haven't seen an army yet that has a majority of it's points in Cult. They seem to be a fun supplemental force though. Having some of them is the only way you can take a hive tyrant and a baneblade in the same list
    Hmm, I have a friend who's going IG and another who's considering Tyranids, so I'll probably go a different way so there's a bit more variety at the table.
    If anything the FAQ gave armies like ad mech more room to breathe. The armies that they had the biggest problems with had some of their gimmicks broken
    Interesting, thanks.
    Yes you can actually make a pretty mean army with that theme. You can include any units in your army as long as they are under one of the 7 big umbrellas (Imperial, Chaos, Eldar, Nids, Orks, Necrons, Tau) but the subfactions like Space Marines, Guard, Sisters of Battle, Assassins etc. have to match within a detachment and you can only take up to 3 detachments in matched play rules. So single detachments for Deathwatch, militarum tempestus (stormtroopers), and assassins would be a legal army
    I do like the sound of that, I'll take a long look at that possibility.
    Imperial Dream Teams are kind of broken right now (the beta rules don't allow you to group Imperial units together as easily as you could in the past), plus the out of the way models tend to be expensive compared to other armies. There is a chance we might see some sort of Imperial Agents codex at some point in the future (and there is supposed to be a fullblown Sisters release coming in a year or two), but outside of that it seems like anything Imperial that isn't Space Marines or Guard has kinda been backburnered.
    I saw about the plastic Sisters of Battle, and truth be told I'd probably go for them if they were out now. Maybe I can get a detachment of them when they're released.
    I have a friend who plays GSC and he's kinda butthurt about where they are right now, but he gets kinda butthurt about every army he plays so I can't confirm or deny how they are doing on the board. They get some really cool looking transports though, and it's possible (although I don't know how easy or useful it is) to ally in both Tyranids and Imperial Guard units for some variety/adaptability as well as some cool painting opportunities.
    The goliaths do look cool, and there's a lot of room for conversions, but as I said above I think I'll steer away from Genestealers if they're so reliant on IG and Tyranids..
    Admech and Necrons are both part of the new campaign starter box (Forgebane), so if you wanted to start one of those armies it would be fairly cheap if you split the box with someone who wanted whatever army you weren't picking.
    I had a look at forgebane, but the knights in that look pretty goofy to be. Seems like a good deal though.
    I know you mentioned not wanting to dip back into spess mehreens, but the rules are so different now (and the sculpts are so much better) that it might be something to look at as an option. Some of the really idol heavy chapters like the Blood Angels have some really cool models that are covered with chapter specific iconography, and while there is some debate about their usefulness the new Primaris models do look pretty cool.
    I may get some to supplement an Imperial army of some description, as they are the most iconic 40k army, but I'm not keen on making them the core.
    Are you guys going to start off small and build armies over time? You could just look at the Start Collecting boxes and go from there.
    The box for Adeptus Mechanicus seems very good, so that might be where I start. I guess we'd look to start at 1000 points or so, so I think I'd need to pass that box out if I went that way.
    ForceVoid wrote: »
    I'd happily take the Necron half of that box if you are interested
    Thanks, I'll let you know if I end up going with Forgebane, but those knight models put me off in comparison with the start collecting box. I may still go with it though.

    xbox360/WiiU: AnEvilHypnotist
  • BurnageBurnage Registered User regular
    novaspike wrote: »
    Hey all, new list composition to run by everyone.
    ++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Aeldari - Drukhari) [51 PL, 968pts] ++

    + No Force Org Slot +

    Detachment Attribute: Ynnari

    + HQ +

    Archon [4 PL, 91pts]: Agoniser, Blaster

    The Yncarne [17 PL, 337pts]: Ancestors' Grace, Word of the Phoenix

    + Troops +

    Kabalite Warriors [2 PL, 47pts]
    . 3x Kabalite Warrior
    . Kabalite Warrior with special weapon: Blaster
    . Sybarite: Splinter Rifle

    Kabalite Warriors [2 PL, 47pts]
    . 3x Kabalite Warrior
    . Kabalite Warrior with special weapon: Blaster
    . Sybarite: Splinter Rifle

    Wyches [4 PL, 73pts]
    . Hekatrix: Agoniser, Splinter pistol
    . 6x Wych
    . Wych with Wych Weapon: Shardnet and impaler

    Wyches [4 PL, 81pts]
    . Hekatrix: Agoniser, Splinter pistol
    . 7x Wych
    . Wych with Wych Weapon: Shardnet and impaler

    + Dedicated Transport +

    Raider [5 PL, 81pts]: Disintegrator cannon, Shock Prow

    Raider [5 PL, 81pts]: Disintegrator cannon, Shock Prow

    Venom [4 PL, 65pts]: Splinter Cannon, Twin splinter rifle

    Venom [4 PL, 65pts]: Splinter Cannon, Twin splinter rifle

    ++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Aeldari - Craftworlds) [44 PL, 792pts] ++

    + No Force Org Slot +

    Craftworld Attribute: Ynnari

    + HQ +

    Farseer [6 PL, 110pts]: 2. Doom, 3. Fortune, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

    Warlock [2 PL, 55pts]: 5. Quicken/Restrain, Shuriken Pistol, Witchblade

    Yvraine [7 PL, 132pts]: 3. Tenacious Survivor, Gaze of Ynnead, Word of the Phoenix, Ynnari Warlord

    + Troops +

    Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger

    Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger

    Rangers [3 PL, 60pts]: 5x Ranger

    + Elites +

    Wraithguard [20 PL, 315pts]: D-scythe, 7x Wraithguard

    ++ Outrider Detachment +1CP (Aeldari - Drukhari) [13 PL, 240pts] ++

    + No Force Org Slot +

    Detachment Attribute: Cult of the Red Grief

    Fixed Combat Drug Selections

    Prizes from the Dark City (1 Relic)

    + HQ +

    Succubus [4 PL, 60pts]: Blast Pistol, The Blood Glaive

    + Fast Attack +

    Reavers [3 PL, 60pts]: Arena Champion, Grav-Talon, 2x Reaver

    Reavers [3 PL, 60pts]: Arena Champion, Grav-Talon, 2x Reaver

    Reavers [3 PL, 60pts]: Arena Champion, Grav-Talon, 2x Reaver

    ++ Total: [108 PL, 2000pts] ++

    Created with BattleScribe

    With KingdomCon over I'm finally getting to come to grips with the new Drukhari codex and post-FAQ Ynnari. Luckily my LGS is running a 1250 league so I can experiment with little parts and test crazy strategies.

    For the spoilered list the idea is to run Yvraine, the archon, and succubus in the raiders with the wyches. Yvraine will probably jump out during T1 in order to move with the farseer/warlock/wraithguard. The wraiths with quicken can move 22" and still shoot 8". If I really need to they could get WotP to go for 33" then shoot. The two blaster venoms generally get aggressive and annoying, but also serve as great ways to summon the Yncarne (when they inevitably blow up). Rangers sit on/near objectives so the Drukhari can focus on combat. The reavers advance 26", then charge backline shooters to tie them up. The way I play Ynnari is a little odd: I like lots of melee and strong short to medium range shooting to try and get several units to soulburst (even just extra movement can be really strong). I finally feel like I'm taking advantage of mixing cults and kabals by having legitimate access to both the agents of vect strat and the cult of strife strat.

    Overall one of my biggest debates is big blob of reavers vs MSU, and if they should be armed with blasters or not.

    That's a pretty solid list and looks fairly similar to the Drukhari/Craftworld mash up that I want to be running at 2k. Depending on how competitive you want to be I'd have the following suggestions;
    1. If you can, take Phantasm Grenade Launchers on every unit that can have them. They're only 3 points a piece, it's hilarious when they actually kill something, but more importantly they give you access to the closest thing that Drukhari have to Smite - the Torment Grenades stratagem. Invaluable for chipping wounds off high armour targets.
    2. Wych Cults, despite getting buffed by the Codex, still flat out don't seem that good to me. Especially in an Ynnari list you might want to consider switching out the Reavers for Shining Spears or even Windriders. Caveat: I might need to play around with them some more. However, if you do run Reavers I'd definitely recommend keeping them as cheap and disposable as possible - there's a good chance that they're only getting a single turn of shooting with the Blasters, which doesn't seem worth it to me.
    3. Similarly, I'd be very hesitant to run Ynnari at the moment. There's very little in your list that looks like it would benefit from Strength From Death over, say, a constant -1 to hit or a bonus 6" range, and the Yncarne is a huge points sink for something that isn't actually that scary.
    4. Psychic powers on your Craftworlders. Doom is great, but in a mixed list Fortune doesn't have that many valid targets - something damaging like Executioner or Mind War (another reason to take PGLs!) tends to work much more effectively for me. I've also found Jinx invaluable on Warlocks for chewing through deathstar units.

    For reference, the 2k list that I'm thinking about currently looks like this;
    Alaitoc Battalion
    Farseer Skyrunner (Doom, Executioner, Warlord - Fate's Messenger, The Phoenix Gem, Singing Spear)
    Warlock Skyrunner (Jinx, Witchblade)
    5 x Rangers
    5 x Rangers
    5 x Rangers
    Hemlock Wraithfighter (Jinx)

    Flayed Skull Battalion
    Archon (Splinter Pistol, Venom Blade, PGL)
    Archon (Splinter Pistol, Venom Blade, PGL)
    5 x Kabalite Warriors (Blaster, PGL)
    5 x Kabalite Warriors (Blaster, PGL)
    5 x Kabalite Warriors (Blaster, PGL)
    5 x Kabalite Warriors (Blaster, PGL)
    5 x Mandrakes
    Ravager (3 x Disintegrator Cannons)
    Ravager (3 x Disintegrator Cannons)
    Ravager (3 x Disintegrator Cannons)
    Venom (2 x Splinter Cannons)
    Venom (2 x Splinter Cannons)
    Venom (2 x Splinter Cannons)
    Venom (2 x Splinter Cannons)
    Razorwing Jetfighter (2 x Disintegrator Cannons)
    Razorwing Jetfighter (2 x Disintegrator Cannons)

    With some possible tweaking depending on event restrictions (e.g., if two Battalions aren't allowed).

  • novaspikenovaspike Registered User regular
    Burnage wrote: »
    That's a pretty solid list and looks fairly similar to the Drukhari/Craftworld mash up that I want to be running at 2k. Depending on how competitive you want to be I'd have the following suggestions;
    1. If you can, take Phantasm Grenade Launchers on every unit that can have them. They're only 3 points a piece, it's hilarious when they actually kill something, but more importantly they give you access to the closest thing that Drukhari have to Smite - the Torment Grenades stratagem. Invaluable for chipping wounds off high armour targets.
    2. Wych Cults, despite getting buffed by the Codex, still flat out don't seem that good to me. Especially in an Ynnari list you might want to consider switching out the Reavers for Shining Spears or even Windriders. Caveat: I might need to play around with them some more. However, if you do run Reavers I'd definitely recommend keeping them as cheap and disposable as possible - there's a good chance that they're only getting a single turn of shooting with the Blasters, which doesn't seem worth it to me.
    3. Similarly, I'd be very hesitant to run Ynnari at the moment. There's very little in your list that looks like it would benefit from Strength From Death over, say, a constant -1 to hit or a bonus 6" range, and the Yncarne is a huge points sink for something that isn't actually that scary.
    4. Psychic powers on your Craftworlders. Doom is great, but in a mixed list Fortune doesn't have that many valid targets - something damaging like Executioner or Mind War (another reason to take PGLs!) tends to work much more effectively for me. I've also found Jinx invaluable on Warlocks for chewing through deathstar units.

    Thanks for the feedback! I'm starting to settle into the idea of MSU reaver squads vs blaster blob; it's easier to fill a outrider and I'm not saddled with a bunch of min wych squads. Reavers and wyches both fulfill the same role for me, tying up the enemy and allowing me to engage on my terms. Reavers on T1 can tie up backline units/tanks and stop them from shooting pretty easily as red grief, which is not something that shining spears or windriders can do. Reavers are also dirt cheap comparatively. I fully admit I love wyches as a unit, so I'm always trying to make them work. The all the time invuln, the wych weapon changes, dropping the price, and giving them more base attacks have all been pretty amazing. So far I've been pleasantly surprised, but min squads are still pretty useless (especially compared to min warrior squads). One of the next steps of experiment will be to see if the squad of 8 is too few (I think I'd like a full 10 man for all the wych weapons, but then I've got no ride for my HQs). Harlies can fill a role similar to wyches, but they're still very expensive for what they do (even if their damage cap is higher) and they can't lock down units like a shardnet wych squad can.

    I really like the Ynnari as a concept, and the Yncarne in particular I love to run for looks alone. That being said, if you have enough troops for it to buff/hide behind it can be very hard to get to and it will absolutely destroy anything it can get near (flyers, tanks, troops, HQs). It can also help focus where the enemy shoots: if they don't focus fire then I'll pop it up when something dies in a place advantageous for me, if they do focus fire then I'll pop it near something pretty hardy (which then gets the 6+++) so I'm taking fire where I want it - at the units that are hard to hit or high toughness. I hate losing detachment bonus, but so far the red grief one is the only bonus I feel like I need (since it can't be replicated through psychics or stratagems).

    Absolutely agree about the craftworld powers, I had been running quicken and fortune for the foot wraithguard, but wasn't particularly happy having a big exposed unit with no invuln. I also love Jinx, there are armies/units where the ability to go from a 3++ to 4++ makes it much more manageable to fight. My solution is to drop the 2nd wych squad and raider. That gives me points to make the wraithguard a 6 man unit and put them in a wave serpent (yay more pseudo smite!), up the farseer and warlock to skyrunners (with doom/executioner and protect/jinx respectively), and put PGLs on pretty much everything that can have them. I'm also playing with the idea of trying to get a third venom for the 3 HQs (but if that thing blows up and I roll ones I'll be in trouble).

  • McGibsMcGibs TorontoRegistered User regular
    New deathwatch stuff on the community page looks interesting. Possible shot in the arm for Primaris marines with special ammo and mission tactics (reroll 1 to wound). Depending on how the points shake out, massed intercessors might actually be sorta neat.

    website_header.jpg
    Khraul
  • BrainleechBrainleech Registered User regular
    edited May 2018
    I really never saw Deathwatch as an army more of a kill team thing

    But then I tend to play smaller games so they might show up there

    Brainleech on
  • BizazedoBizazedo Registered User regular
    So after I gorged on Necrons, I had enough store credit to get a "free" Mortarion. Naturally, I then got a painter because of the "free" money. I think he turned out gorgeous.

    3s7idy8wulr4.jpg
    nr01wzw7h82i.jpg

    XBL: Bizazedo
    PSN: Bizazedo
    CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
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  • No-QuarterNo-Quarter Nothing to Fear But Fear ItselfRegistered User regular
    He's such a great model. I can't wait to drybrush his wings <3

  • BrainleechBrainleech Registered User regular
    Since I don't play with or against Primus Marines why are they in deathwatch so nasty?

  • McGibsMcGibs TorontoRegistered User regular
    In regular marine armies, they're basically just "double marines", but with a very much "eggs in one basket" sort of mentality. Intercessors and reivers just have bolters, which arent so hot by themselves, and hellblasters/agressors/inceptors can put out a lot of firepower, but they're not very durable without any chaff bodies to suck up damage.

    In deathwatch, you can mix and match models in a single squad, so suddenly you get cheaper Inceptors able to tank hits for plasma hellblasters. Also, you get corssover of special rules, so Inceptors let units leave combat and shoot as if they had fly, and agressors let units advance/move and fire assault/heavy weapons, which make things like stalker boltrifles and heavy plasma incinerators awesome (normally heavy), or assault bolters really mobile. And THEN everything gets access to special ammo, which makes the primaris bolters actually awesome, because now you're shooting out ap-3 shells, or wounding on 2+ with ap-1, etc etc. Suddenly their bolters are able tackle pretty much any target. Incing on the cake is the mission tactics, which let them reroll wounds of 1 against specific target roles (troops, hq, elite, etc)

    I'm totally interested in seeing what the codex looks like, because it might actually get me to pick up some primaris to run as a true elite tactical army.

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    KhraulMazzyxBrainleechVahraan
  • StragintStragint Do Not Gift Always DeclinesRegistered User regular
    Primaris with Deathwatch sounds awesome. I wish they melded better with Space Wolves. I really want some Primaris stuff for my Space Wolves but I'm not sure it is really worth while.

    PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
    What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak

    I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
    Khraul
  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    McGibs wrote: »
    In regular marine armies, they're basically just "double marines", but with a very much "eggs in one basket" sort of mentality. Intercessors and reivers just have bolters, which arent so hot by themselves, and hellblasters/agressors/inceptors can put out a lot of firepower, but they're not very durable without any chaff bodies to suck up damage.

    In deathwatch, you can mix and match models in a single squad, so suddenly you get cheaper Inceptors able to tank hits for plasma hellblasters. Also, you get corssover of special rules, so Inceptors let units leave combat and shoot as if they had fly, and agressors let units advance/move and fire assault/heavy weapons, which make things like stalker boltrifles and heavy plasma incinerators awesome (normally heavy), or assault bolters really mobile. And THEN everything gets access to special ammo, which makes the primaris bolters actually awesome, because now you're shooting out ap-3 shells, or wounding on 2+ with ap-1, etc etc. Suddenly their bolters are able tackle pretty much any target. Incing on the cake is the mission tactics, which let them reroll wounds of 1 against specific target roles (troops, hq, elite, etc)

    I'm totally interested in seeing what the codex looks like, because it might actually get me to pick up some primaris to run as a true elite tactical army.

    I think GW just sold me a loyalist army.

    Jesus it looks fun.

    Like a lot of fun.

    Also their special flyers the Corvus Darkstars are really neat.

    A DW elite force of Primaris with a small force of guard back up would be really cool on the table.

    03x29di.png
    Khraul
  • novaspikenovaspike Registered User regular
    Beyond the flexibility of the reroll to wound vs unit type that they've shown there's almost definitely going to be rules/strats/relics that give bonuses vs xenos/heretics/psykers (since that's also part of the DW schtick).

  • StragintStragint Do Not Gift Always DeclinesRegistered User regular
    I can't wait for the Space Wolves codex. I really want some new Space Wolves stuff to play with.

    PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
    What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak

    I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
  • LanlaornLanlaorn Registered User regular
    I love Deathwatch as I love all Inquisition stuff, but this all will depend on the point costs. Current Deathwatch units also get special ammo and neat rules for mixing Vanguard Vets and Terminators and etc.... but they cost so many points it's terrible anyway.

  • novaspikenovaspike Registered User regular
    Lanlaorn wrote: »
    I love Deathwatch as I love all Inquisition stuff, but this all will depend on the point costs. Current Deathwatch units also get special ammo and neat rules for mixing Vanguard Vets and Terminators and etc.... but they cost so many points it's terrible anyway.

    To repeat something oft said by others, almost every codex has gotten price drops from their index costs.

    That's been the pattern anyway. Vanilla marines got kinda shafted on points and overall rules since they were early on, (it really did look like GW was taking soft swings at first, as opposed to now, where the codexes are pretty well balanced and have good flavorful rules that aren't over the top powerwise).

    Khraul
  • BrainleechBrainleech Registered User regular
    Stragint wrote: »
    I can't wait for the Space Wolves codex. I really want some new Space Wolves stuff to play with.

    That is what my brother says everytime I point out something 40k related

  • KhraulKhraul Registered User regular
    Mazzyx wrote: »
    McGibs wrote: »
    In regular marine armies, they're basically just "double marines", but with a very much "eggs in one basket" sort of mentality. Intercessors and reivers just have bolters, which arent so hot by themselves, and hellblasters/agressors/inceptors can put out a lot of firepower, but they're not very durable without any chaff bodies to suck up damage.

    In deathwatch, you can mix and match models in a single squad, so suddenly you get cheaper Inceptors able to tank hits for plasma hellblasters. Also, you get corssover of special rules, so Inceptors let units leave combat and shoot as if they had fly, and agressors let units advance/move and fire assault/heavy weapons, which make things like stalker boltrifles and heavy plasma incinerators awesome (normally heavy), or assault bolters really mobile. And THEN everything gets access to special ammo, which makes the primaris bolters actually awesome, because now you're shooting out ap-3 shells, or wounding on 2+ with ap-1, etc etc. Suddenly their bolters are able tackle pretty much any target. Incing on the cake is the mission tactics, which let them reroll wounds of 1 against specific target roles (troops, hq, elite, etc)

    I'm totally interested in seeing what the codex looks like, because it might actually get me to pick up some primaris to run as a true elite tactical army.

    I think GW just sold me a loyalist army.

    Jesus it looks fun.

    Like a lot of fun.

    Also their special flyers the Corvus Darkstars are really neat.

    A DW elite force of Primaris with a small force of guard back up would be really cool on the table.

    Yeah, I've been thinking hard on what armies I want to play and how many I feel like supporting.

    I am having trouble picturing a scenario where I'm not building some Deathwatch in the next 18 months.

    Bnet - Khraul#1822
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    italianranmavalhalla130
  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    I kind of want to combine my knights with Primaris deathwatch for a super elite army.

    Not sure if there is a good lore set up for this though. A free blade house and an inquisitor that really, really hates xenos?

  • LanlaornLanlaorn Registered User regular
    If you use an Inquisitor as your justification you can do damn near anything you want, lol ;-)

    I've kitbashed basic infantry models from every Xenos race as Inquisitorial Acolytes, just throw on a bolter and plenty of purity seals. Lately I've been tinkering with a big unit of Crusaders from Ad Mech, Chaos Cultists, Necromunda Gangers, old Warhammer Fantasy models, etc. Since the best way to run Crusaders is out of the Guard codex I think I'll fluff them as Cadian survivors from all walks of life incensed by the Fall of Cadia and recruited by an Inquisitor.

    Anyway, the response to this sort of thing has always been overwhelmingly positive, even the most hardcore grognard lore guys just chuckle when looking at an Ork covered in purity seals, "I don't think that's what they mean when they say Ordo Xenos!". The lore just establishes so hard that an Inquisitor can do whatever the fuck they want, and that an inquisitorial retinue especially is composed of the craziest fucking guys, that the more lore-obsessed a person is the less they blink at this sort of thing.

    TL;DR, the best lore set up would be saying that it's an Inquisitor inside the Knight but if that doesn't fly with your heraldry I think your idea of "well, the Ordo Xenos called in the big guns on this one" is great.

    InquisitoritalianranmaKhraulH3Knuckles
  • BadablackBadablack Registered User regular
    I’d like to see a Rogue Trader codex in a similar vein. Access to damn near anything in the warhammer universe, Heresy be damned. Anything and everything goes when profiting in the name of the Emperor.

    FC: 1435-5383-0883
  • SmokeStacksSmokeStacks The Myth, the Legend, the Bowman, the Shambler FuckerRegistered User regular
    I'm ordering some 50mm bases for a couple of baseless old metal Killa Kans that I got ahold of. These models originally came on 40s, which is insane (their feet overflow off of the sides like crazy). New kans are bigger and come with 60s, but old kans on 60s look ridiculous due to how small they are.

    I'm thinking this will be a nice middle ground, and wouldn't be modeling for advantage since the models originally came on a small base.

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  • BrainleechBrainleech Registered User regular
    Deathwatch gets tons of CP making the guard jealous.
    They even get strats for certain armies

  • SmokeStacksSmokeStacks The Myth, the Legend, the Bowman, the Shambler FuckerRegistered User regular
    Brainleech wrote: »
    Deathwatch gets tons of CP making the guard jealous.
    They even get strats for certain armies

    I was wondering how that was going to work, since GW has been giving every army "chapter tactics" in 8th edition. Re-rolling misses against certain unit types seems like a cool way to dembstrate their ability to tailor their tactics based on the situation, which is pretty fluffy and should help punish spam lists a little bit. Having options for changing it is cool, and since they're limited in execution it's a nice way to make them adaptable but not overpowered. Between that and their special issue ammunition they should be a lot of fun to play with.

    73CQcJZ.png
  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    Brainleech wrote: »
    Deathwatch gets tons of CP making the guard jealous.
    They even get strats for certain armies

    CP is the same as other armies they just get the Ultramarines warlord trait where you get a CP battery on a marine.

    Also their votlw cost twice the points and requires you to choose the type of target.

    Still because they are Imperium and I think DW will be best with some guard back ups they should have CP to burn.

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  • KhraulKhraul Registered User regular
    Will inquisitors be part of the Deathwatch codex, or will they get their own or be left as an index?

    What do you guys think?

    Bnet - Khraul#1822
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  • McGibsMcGibs TorontoRegistered User regular
    I'm 99% sure they won't be in the DW codex, same as they weren't in the GreyKnight's. Eventually, I expect Imperial Agents will get their own minicodex, hopefully with a new wave of models. If we're lucky, they might come along with the new plastic sisters.

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