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[WH40K] Previews galore!

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Posts

  • BurnageBurnage Registered User regular
    Pretty much all the small tournaments near me run 1500 points. I quite like it - it does force you to make hard decisions, but it gives you quite a bit more breathing room on the table both in terms of time and space.

    It does also mean that whenever I go to a bigger 2k tournament it feels like some serious shit.

  • BizazedoBizazedo Registered User regular
    Mazzyx wrote: »

    I like 2k. I get to bring a lot of fun toys and have pretty balanced games.

    1750 isn't that bad. 1500-1000 starts feeling constrictive. My base army build tends to be about 1k and then build 1k of fun things.

    That's exactly how I build my 2k lists as well. Start at 1k for necessities, rest is "fun". That being said....
    Burnage wrote: »
    Pretty much all the small tournaments near me run 1500 points. I quite like it - it does force you to make hard decisions, but it gives you quite a bit more breathing room on the table both in terms of time and space.

    It does also mean that whenever I go to a bigger 2k tournament it feels like some serious shit.
    ...I agree with this now, too. When my little group started, most of us could not hit 2k points with what we owned, so we stayed at 1000 or 1500 depending upon who was there and teams, etc.

    1500 makes you make very hard decisions in what you put in the list.

    That being said, since I started low, I always wanted to do 2k as I had never done them. I feel they both have their place and I don't really know what's best. I don't have a high opinion on tournaments for 40k, anyways, so that doesn't help.

    2k does allow you to bring enough stuff where you're like "Okay, I am now fully ready. Let's f'ng go."

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  • No-QuarterNo-Quarter Nothing To Fear But Fear ItselfRegistered User regular
    Lanlaorn wrote: »
    Lol, I don't think it's fair to say something is "basically" equivalent when it has fewer attacks with a weaker weapon, not a psyker, etc.

    Custodes bikes are decent, but it's pretty obviously the Guardsmen who are the problem here. Custodes have a lot of great strategems and relics, and giving them infinite CPs lets them actually use more than one a game. Suddenly everyone's a Victor of the Blood Games and two Captains have 3++'s and they're charging on your turn and etc.

    It's 160 pts for a S5 ( with a +1 from the spear) T6 7 wound 5 attack 14" flyer with 2+ 3++ saves that rerolls 1s to hit, rerolls all wounds in combat when charging, advances a flat 6", rerolls all charge rolls, hits at S6 -3 D3 wounds in combat, and ALSO has a hurricane bolter that you can jump up to the Salvo Launcher for another 15 pts.

    And that's BEFORE getting into Stratagems.

    It's a little weaker in combat but a LOT more survivable... and for 1 cp that monster can be yours in any Imperial list you can think of and hide in the midst of infantry.

  • NorgothNorgoth cardiffRegistered User regular
    the LGT (shambles that it was) limited you to one copy of a detachment maximum. It’s telling that every high performing imperial army chose to spend thier one battalion on imperial guard.

    Honestly I would of preferred they kept CPs at what they were, but got rid of the brigade for everyone except guard and replaced it a faction specific detachment that gave bonus CPs.

    So like the custodes one could be real simple and just be 2 HQ 3 Troops and an elite gets you 8-10 cp to incentivise taking wardens and stuff, or Tau get one HQ, one Troops, 2 elites to make you consider battlesuits and so on.

    In army news I’m currently working on an imperial list, which will be all deathwatch. I’ve got a competitive Chaos list, so this is going to be a purely for fun army, so no guard detachments for me. There’s some really silly stuff in this codex.

    Your veterans can swap thier bolter for any two options from the equipment list so you can give them double chainswords. A five man unit like this with a sarge and a black sheild has 22 attacks, can heroicly intervene, rerolls ones on the wounds, can get +1 to wound, and costs like 85 points.

    Primaris actually arnt bad with all the specialist ammo and buffs.

    They can deepstrike redemptors for some reason. (I need to check but in theory they can also deepstrike leviathans...)

    Primaris can’t fit in the Corvus, but motorbikes can?

    Twin assault cannon razorback is a codex option despite it being index for every other space marine faction.

    It’s a weird codex.

  • KetBraKetBra Dressed Ridiculously Registered User regular
    Yeah the primaris transport rules are :rotate:

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  • Mr_RoseMr_Rose 83 Blue Ridge Protects the Holy Registered User regular
    For Command Points, I think they need to replace the standard +3 for being battleforged with a variable Command Rating that is dependent on the Warlord. And also rule that the Warlord can only come from the Faction with the highest total Power in your army (except Imperium, Aeldari, etc.).

    ...because dragons are AWESOME! That's why.
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  • KetBraKetBra Dressed Ridiculously Registered User regular
    help a giant wasp flew into my apartment while I was priming on the balcony

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  • McGibsMcGibs TorontoRegistered User regular
    My local tourneys limit stratagems and "chapter-tactics" to come from you warlord's faction, which I think does a good job of curtailing weird power combos. You can take mixed allies, but they lose out on a lot of their special rules.

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  • BizazedoBizazedo Registered User regular
    edited May 2018
    KetBra wrote: »
    help a giant wasp flew into my apartment while I was priming on the balcony
    That new army is his, now.
    McGibs wrote: »
    My local tourneys limit stratagems and "chapter-tactics" to come from you warlord's faction, which I think does a good job of curtailing weird power combos. You can take mixed allies, but they lose out on a lot of their special rules.

    This always seemed like a good idea for nerfs. Keeps soups, which are fluffly, while limiting somewhat the power gamer reasons for it.

    Well, except the traits bit. Imo, they should still use their traits.

    Bizazedo on
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  • BurnageBurnage Registered User regular
    I think Soup itself isn't the issue, but it does make actual issues more noticeable. There are clearly some things that are too strong at the moment - Custodes Jetbikes, the Guard CP Generator, the Black Heart Spearhead - and they very quickly rise to the top when combined with other strong elements.

  • Gabriel_PittGabriel_Pitt (effective against Russian warships) Registered User regular
    No-Quarter wrote: »
    Stragint wrote: »
    My brother tends to immediately start quitting if he loses like two or three models. It is very annoying.

    I don't want to just say "don't play with him", but if you have other people you can play with you can and should make it a habit of calling him out on the fact that you could be playing with people who won't waste your time.
    I'm perfectly willing to call a game if the conclusion is completely forgone and it's just not fun anymore. In one 5th ed game vs leafblower IG, my entire SM army was wiped out by turn 3, except for my bike captain. I spent two turns with him popping wheelies in front of the entire IG line because they just couldn't manage to put him down. That was fun.

    I'm much more likely to concede a tournament game if it's absolutely clear I'm not going to win and that gives me more time to do something useful, like grab lunch.
    Badablack wrote: »
    Why do they want to keep women out anyway? I’ve never understood this. If gaming is their only real social interaction, you’d think they would want to introduce as many ladies as possible into the only place they frequent on the off chance one might be interested in them.

    Some of it is just basic gatekeeping. Even well meaning guys can be real dicks (even without realizing it) by going, 'wow, is she really into X too? That's awesome - now I'll just quiz her on various things about X because it's cool that she knows that stuff.' Which can be pretty indistinguishable from the ones who feel threatened about an outsider impinging on their turf (see complaints about 'fake gamer girls, fake geek girls, fake wtf ever).'

  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    McGibs wrote: »
    My local tourneys limit stratagems and "chapter-tactics" to come from you warlord's faction, which I think does a good job of curtailing weird power combos. You can take mixed allies, but they lose out on a lot of their special rules.

    I think really the problem comes from cp generation more than stratagems/chapter tactics now.

    If you are taking 180 points of guard, no one cares what their abilities are. Guard stratagems are meh which is why a pure guard army with a billion CP isn't a huge deal.

    In this case you just make the Custodes the warlord as they are what you use your CP on anyway and they do the damage.

    I want soup to live. I like the idea of it though even its semi-death doesn't effect my army which is pure CSM.

    I am planning on building deathwatch as my imperials because I love the mix and match nature and they are kind of absurd.

    But I am planning on giving them some guard but something fun like hellhounds, scout sentinals with flamethrowers backed up by Armageddon Steel Legion troops. Maybe even steel legion vets with flamers in chimeras because they are ork hunters.

    Its my fun list not my chaos competitive list.

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  • LanlaornLanlaorn Registered User regular
    I don't play Custodes so I don't have a horse in this race, but I really don't think there's a problem with their jetbikes. It's actually quite nice just to know GW is able to write rules for a viable Imperium elite unit.

    It's not like every weak Imperial army is allying in 3 Jetbike Shield Captains and dramatically improving their army. However, every single Imperial army is allying in an Imperial Guard Battalion, to the point where most people consider it mandatory for a serious list.

  • novaspikenovaspike Registered User regular
    Custodes are pretty damn good, but can be put down via weight of fire (gonna fail some 2+s) or semi-mass mortal wounds (not much FNP). That strikes me as pretty balanced actually, and as Lanlaorn said, them not being literally all over the place means they're a boogeyman, but not meta-breaking.

    Re: soup stuff. Same issues from me that I had before; I play Ynnari, so soup is how my army is made. I (for approximately the 80 billionth time) wish they would make a mini-dex to solidify Ynnari rules (strats, relics, and a couple more psyker powers would go a long way). Maybe after the Harlie dex comes out and GW makes sure nothing emerges as super broken they'll start to figure out how to make "final" rules for a Ynnari army.

    In that vein, I read Ghost Warrior (of whatever the Ynnari book is called) and enjoyed it. Some cool cross-faction fighting.

    For super plot spoilers:
    A craftworld that disappeared right after the fall re-emerges and makes contact with the asuyani and surprise! It's been completely taken over by a genestealer cult. Really cool setup and faction crossing you don't normally see in the fiction.

  • BrainleechBrainleech 機知に富んだコメントはここにあります Registered User regular
    Badablack wrote: »
    Where are these generous stores giving away armies and mega boxes, I win tournaments and get some store credit and a coupon for a free slice of Domino’s.

    Gone with the passage of time it seems
    The store I played at last was doing $50 buy in toruneys to rid himself of the Apoc armies since they were not selling but he was also doing this to attract different business other than Yu gi oh players since there is one of the few shops left that went all in with that. He had a Mtg thing but I didn't really play it as my cards were old and I did not feel like spending $$$ to get back into it since 40k was pretty much my extravagance. He closed his shop in 13 or early 14
    That comic shop in San Diego was huge I have no idea what it's like now but then he had a large following of people playing 40k so he had drawings or such
    He had a box by the register filled with cards saying what you won {mostly store credit} the only two times I pulled things was the mega force and a yu gi oh card when I came back in 2003

  • No-QuarterNo-Quarter Nothing To Fear But Fear ItselfRegistered User regular
    Bizazedo wrote: »
    KetBra wrote: »
    help a giant wasp flew into my apartment while I was priming on the balcony
    That new army is his, now.
    McGibs wrote: »
    My local tourneys limit stratagems and "chapter-tactics" to come from you warlord's faction, which I think does a good job of curtailing weird power combos. You can take mixed allies, but they lose out on a lot of their special rules.

    This always seemed like a good idea for nerfs. Keeps soups, which are fluffly, while limiting somewhat the power gamer reasons for it.

    Well, except the traits bit. Imo, they should still use their traits.

    Is it really an issue outside of Imperial armies, though? It doesn't seem to be a problem at all with Chaos, and time will tell with regards to tricross faction Eldar so that really just leavea Guard specifically.

    I also like the idea of soup lists, but they could probably find some rule to sneak in for match play to limit the lameness.

    That said, even Ad Mech lists can be a pain with conjoined allies (this is where I see the Custodes bike Captain kicking my ass the most often) because of the tricks Mars can pull with Cawl leading them.

  • BrainleechBrainleech 機知に富んだコメントはここにあります Registered User regular
    Really I feel soup works and doesn't work
    The Ynnari is fun imperial armies soup is not

  • Golden YakGolden Yak Burnished Bovine The sunny beaches of CanadaRegistered User regular
    So, this has the potential to be the most grimdark thing ever, if you think about it:

    https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/21/21st-may-warhammer-adventures-tales-for-younger-readersgw-homepage-post-1/

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  • H3KnucklesH3Knuckles But we decide which is right and which is an illusion.Registered User regular
    edited May 2018
    I think that's a terrible idea. WH40K is not at all kid appropriate, and I don't know that it's a good idea to introduce kids to a setting which is predicated on the notion that no side is even remotely good by giving them impression that they are heroes. I'm just trying to imagine explaining to someone under 10 that "well, Roboute Guilliman is fighting to save humanity, but he also participated in full-scale extermination of entire alien civilizations, so he's evil, but not as evil as these Dark Eldar that take pleasure from torturing people and injecting themselves full of drugs, but...". You can say that people don't need to pay attention to the background lore to play the game, but the whole point of this is to hook them through stories, so it's unavoidable. Like, even on the small scale it has problems: it calls one of the kid heroes a ganger. That's messed up.

    I think it's okay to have things that aren't for kids, that they just need to wait until they're older to be able to participate in.

    H3Knuckles on
    If you're curious about my icon; it's an update of the early Lego Castle theme's "Black Falcons" faction.
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  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited May 2018
    Eh, I picked up my first 40k stuff when I was 11 or 12. Got myself the 2nd edition starter set and read the books it came with over and over. Like, 40k is pretty dumb and goofy and kids are more media savvy than folks give them credit for.

    40k is pretty tame compared to a lot of stuff kids that age are getting into like CoD, GTA, etc. I think the much larger issue is parents being aware of the media their kids are consuming and having conversations with them about it. Sadly this basically never happens.

    I think for the most part though kids would rather engage with the actual 40k material instead of stuff aimed specifically at them.

    Inquisitor on
  • BrainleechBrainleech 機知に富んだコメントはここにあります Registered User regular
    I agree I saw a kind less than 5 begging his father for Black Ops because the cover looked firey
    That whole scene was just sad

  • see317see317 Registered User regular
    I'm kind of curious about this Disneyfied version of 40k.
    It seems kind of odd to me, but I grew up with Aliens vs. Predator, Robocop and Spawn action figures. All of which from original sources that really weren't meant for kids.
    I remember the Rambo and the Conan the Barbarian cartoons too. All took grimly violent settings and polished the rough edges off until the end result was A) suitable for sneaking past the watchful eyes of most parents and B) only passingly related to the source material anyway.

    Somehow I doubt these stories are going to get extensively into Dark Aelder or Chaos Cults in general (though I could see Papa Nurgle showing up), but robo-zombies and hooligan orks and all devouring space bugs being fought off by plucky preteens and their gritty Imperial Guard buddy? That's just good fun right there.

    I think I'd be more likely to read them if they were written in an in-universe style. Like, this is the kind of mass produced propaganda chap books that are given out to hive dwelling children at Christmas Emperor Day, filling their heads with grand adventures and larger than life heroes so they run off and join the Guard before they learn the brutally unpleasant realities of Guard life (and death).

  • McGibsMcGibs TorontoRegistered User regular
    edited May 2018
    I feel like making a watered down version of warhammer specifically for kids is sortof a fools errand. As a kid, warhammer is cool because its all grimdark and edgey and so diametrically opposed to the normal saccharine kid-friendly media. This is stuff that any moderately independent kid will just sidestep entirely and go right to the real shit, like Horus Heresy or Eisenhorn. It's not like any of the warhammer novels are grappling with massive weighty topics or copious sex and explicit material. They're all perfectly fine as teenager/young-adult books, so I don't really get who these new series are for?

    McGibs on
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  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    edited May 2018
    I still think we should embrace this. Imagine the amazing lessons to teach. Friendship, hope in humanity, loyalty, and an unwavering love and embrace of the God Emperor of mankind.

    Mazzyx on
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  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    I think this speaks mostly to how insanely heavily children are marketed directly to these days.

    As mentioned in this thread, when I was a kid I would basically just find media that wasn’t aimed at me like Battletech and Warhammer 40k to engage with even though I wasn’t the target market. Also I would just use generic backpacks like jansport or whatever and so would other kids.

    Now there are children’s versions of all the big franchises, little comics for kids, marvel backpacks, etc. When I was teaching first grade last year every item every student had was advertising for some media property. It’s a huge industry.

  • No-QuarterNo-Quarter Nothing To Fear But Fear ItselfRegistered User regular
    Those kids would be in for a hell of a shell shock when they stumble onto a wiki and click "Chaos"

  • McGibsMcGibs TorontoRegistered User regular
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I think this speaks mostly to how insanely heavily children are marketed directly to these days.
    .
    ftfy.

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  • KetBraKetBra Dressed Ridiculously Registered User regular
    In the grim darkness of the far future, there is only friendship

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  • novaspikenovaspike Registered User regular
    "Oh cool, old deamonette art...*click*"

  • No-QuarterNo-Quarter Nothing To Fear But Fear ItselfRegistered User regular
    KetBra wrote: »
    In the grim darkness of the far future, there is only friendship

    There's a response on the Black Library facebook page assuring people

    "It's still the grim darkness of the far future, we just leave the night-light on."

  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    novaspike wrote: »
    "Oh cool, old deamonette art...*click*"

    And many a kink was born...Slaanesh approves.

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  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    No-Quarter wrote: »
    KetBra wrote: »
    In the grim darkness of the far future, there is only friendship

    There's a response on the Black Library facebook page assuring people

    "It's still the grim darkness of the far future, we just leave the night-light on."

    The best response was, "Of course some kids survive, who grows up to die for the Imperial Guard if they don't?"*

    *Paraphrased from the Black Library Facebook.

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  • No-QuarterNo-Quarter Nothing To Fear But Fear ItselfRegistered User regular
    Calling it now- if they ever show a 40k Chaos faction, it'll be Thousand Sons because 1. they're the least outwardly horrific 2. the Rubrics being automata means they can blow holes in them without any blood and gore 3. Sorcerers are charismatic villains.

  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    McGibs wrote: »
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I think this speaks mostly to how insanely heavily children are marketed directly to these days.
    .
    ftfy.

    Nah it’s been a steadily increasing trend over time, I feel.

    I mean childhood as a concept only really took root and started evolving over the last 400 years or so.

  • BrainleechBrainleech 機知に富んだコメントはここにあります Registered User regular
    novaspike wrote: »
    "Oh cool, old deamonette art...*click*"

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  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited May 2018
    So genuine question as an all knight army is growing on me conceptually:

    Do you personally think it would be fun to play against a 2k all knight list? It would be a mix of armigers and super heavies.

    Obviously I will have to wait for the dex for exact point values but 4 armigers, 1 classic knight and 1 new dakka knight for 2 super heavy detachments is what it would probably be at 2k.

    Inquisitor on
  • Gabriel_PittGabriel_Pitt (effective against Russian warships) Registered User regular
    It's the kind of thing I'd let my opponent know ahead of time, because an all knight list is very different than most others. I try and build all-comers lists. Once the individual armiger kits come out, I'm certainly not going to spring my '4 arimgers, 2 knights, and a warhound' list on anyone.

  • BadablackBadablack Registered User regular
    Now that armor values aren’t a thing anymore knights are perfectly fine to fight against. Anything wounds everything, etc. and they’re balanced pointswise to not be overpowered. Probably underpowered slightly, honestly.

    Now whether or not it’s fun is completely up to your opponent. There’s plenty of regular codex armies out there right now that I’d say aren’t all that fun to fight. Tau gunlines, IG gunlines, gunlines in general honestly. But if you’re excited enough to wanna blow a ton of money and time and effort on this particular variety of cool miniature, then don’t let the fun quotients of your opponents stand in your way to enjoying the hobby.

    FC: 1435-5383-0883
  • BurnageBurnage Registered User regular
    Eldar gunlines are, of course, tremendous fun to fight because they're like trying to wrestle a greased-up pig that has a cannon strapped to its back.

  • MazzyxMazzyx Comedy Gold Registered User regular
    Burnage wrote: »
    Eldar gunlines are, of course, tremendous fun to fight because they're like trying to wrestle a greased-up pig that has a cannon strapped to its back.

    Sounds like the newest ork unit.

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