That's fair. Outside of assbacks I don't see a lot of Space Marine vehicles lately. I can't remember the last time I saw a basic Rhino on the table.
My next game I'm gonna bring a drop pod, some rhinos, and a landspeeder just to give my opponent something new to kill.
I bring rhinos all the time but I am Chaos not loyalist. I use them as transports too! Usually to deliver my possessed across the board. They work pretty well and usually actually live.
Edit:
For loyalist I see a lot of assbacks of course. I play Dark Angels so I see dark shrouds and their bombers a good amount. Flying fridges for wolves. Stormravens for all others are common to.
For me I tried three vindis and found they are decent if you get the stratagem off. They are castle breakers more than anything. My landraider absorbs gobs of fire and does okay but a basic landraider is still underwhelming verse the loyalist variants. Looks cool and still does better than it use to thanks to the machine spirit.
I also used dreads for a while. Usually just died but sometimes they didn't and are rather cheap. My maulerfiend is fun and has the reputation of dying first turn every game. Those he hasn't though usually mean he kills double his points. Its a real hot or cold unit.
Heldrakes are amazing I am really really loving him.
The value of Rhinos depends pretty heavily on what's inside of them. Berserkers are considered worth it while Tactical Marines aren't, etc.
Although honestly it just seems like most Space Marine stuff is overcosted by a large degree in comparison both to other things within their own codices but especially to new Xenos books.
Comparing Rhinos and Drop Pods to, say, Dark Eldar transports is pretty shocking, lol.
I only ask about predators cause I have an old one I paint stripped vs. This razorback I haven't built and trying to determine which I should focus on first.
I only ask about predators cause I have an old one I paint stripped vs. This razorback I haven't built and trying to determine which I should focus on first.
T7 vehicles with no invuln are really fragile to anti tank fire, especially plasma. The common tactic was to take 4 predators so even if you lose one you can still kill shot. That’s not a thing anymore with the 3 datasheet limit, and without killshot they don’t have enough firepower to offset how fragile they are (and expensive).
The 3 datasheet limit is only a "suggested limit" for organized events if you are playing at 1,001 to 2,000 points, you can bring as many Predators as you have open heavy support slots if you really want to (It's also a dumb rule in general, it prevents you from playing Legion of the Damned at 1,000 points). You might end up being "that guy" at your FLGS if you spam a million preds or whatever, though.
Bringing only three Predators can still be beneficial though, because depending on how you position them (having two deep in cover with one left slightly out to work as bait) you can effectively control where your opponent sends a significant portion of their firepower on their first turn. Every shot they take at your tank in an attempt to prevent you from using Killshot is a shot they aren't taking at your fast movers or infantry that you are moving into position for making runs on objectives or deepstrike screening, for example.
In my Khorne lists I kept my rhinos naked, and used them to assault everything in reach and generally be obnoxious metal boxes not worth blowing up once their cargo had all jumped out.
Could you do something similar with blood angels and death company? Or would it be cheaper and easier to slap jump packs on all of em and deep strike them?
I've had some luck a couple times disembarking ten Assault Marines out of a Rhino, moving the Rhino and the Assault Marines toward my opponent's dudes, charging with the Rhino to soak up overwatch, and then charging with the Assault Marines. It's pretty situational, but hilarious when you can pull it off.
Rhinos can also be used to mobile cover for small squads if you drive them sideways I guess.
Speaking of vehicles, I like to play with the house rule that destroyed vehicles that do not explode stay in place on the board and become terrain for the remainder of the game.
I've had some luck a couple times disembarking ten Assault Marines out of a Rhino, moving the Rhino and the Assault Marines toward my opponent's dudes, charging with the Rhino to soak up overwatch, and then charging with the Assault Marines. It's pretty situational, but hilarious when you can pull it off.
Rhinos can also be used to mobile cover for small squads if you drive them sideways I guess.
Speaking of vehicles, I like to play with the house rule that destroyed vehicles that do not explode stay in place on the board and become terrain for the remainder of the game.
I use that rule as well as the monolith did not blow up or go wherever it goes when it dies so it for a time it was a fort and then a large piece of cover
I've had some luck a couple times disembarking ten Assault Marines out of a Rhino, moving the Rhino and the Assault Marines toward my opponent's dudes, charging with the Rhino to soak up overwatch, and then charging with the Assault Marines. It's pretty situational, but hilarious when you can pull it off.
Rhinos can also be used to mobile cover for small squads if you drive them sideways I guess.
Speaking of vehicles, I like to play with the house rule that destroyed vehicles that do not explode stay in place on the board and become terrain for the remainder of the game.
I suppose assault marines don't have to have jetpacks but base 1 attack for a melee troop just feels bad.
I saw from my club. Some good changes and the index isn't bad. Its nice that they realized they could make another bucket of money giving chaos some parity there. Especially since they are selling a knight verse knight box. Also the reroll stratagem on a knight is pretty awesome.
I suppose assault marines don't have to have jetpacks but base 1 attack for a melee troop just feels bad.
They're not allstars by any means, but they're relatively cheap and a full 10 man squad of them with chainswords is 21 attacks.
In what is a recurring theme for astares, the DW version is just better. For 30 points more a squad of 10 veterans has 42 attacks and can heroically intervene. This is largely down to being able to dual wield chainswords. They also get mission tactics on top of this.
I suppose assault marines don't have to have jetpacks but base 1 attack for a melee troop just feels bad.
They're not allstars by any means, but they're relatively cheap and a full 10 man squad of them with chainswords is 21 attacks.
While true it still feels lackluster compared to assault troops of othet factions. Just over priced and under performing
If you want loyalist assault troops you use vanguard vets. The point increase is minimal. More diverse load outs. Base 2 attacks. If you look at DW vets they are vanguard/sternguard+better weapons.
I suppose assault marines don't have to have jetpacks but base 1 attack for a melee troop just feels bad.
They're not allstars by any means, but they're relatively cheap and a full 10 man squad of them with chainswords is 21 attacks.
While true it still feels lackluster compared to assault troops of othet factions. Just over priced and under performing
If you want loyalist assault troops you use vanguard vets. The point increase is minimal. More diverse load outs. Base 2 attacks. If you look at DW vets they are vanguard/sternguard+better weapons.
Yeah that's true. Just wishing that fast attack for imperial was better.
I suppose assault marines don't have to have jetpacks but base 1 attack for a melee troop just feels bad.
They're not allstars by any means, but they're relatively cheap and a full 10 man squad of them with chainswords is 21 attacks.
While true it still feels lackluster compared to assault troops of othet factions. Just over priced and under performing
If you want loyalist assault troops you use vanguard vets. The point increase is minimal. More diverse load outs. Base 2 attacks. If you look at DW vets they are vanguard/sternguard+better weapons.
Yeah that's true. Just wishing that fast attack for imperial was better.
Scout bikers and inceptors are excellent choices for loyalist fast attack.
Scout bikes are cheap and good at clearing chaff. The fall back mines are fun. Inceptors are 18 heavy bolter shots on jet packs that are assault weapons.
I was going through old models both painted and unpainted from when I was last in the hobby, about 2004. I found an old terminator librarian, and I mean old. It was old in 2004. It's a sculpt from 1993. So naturally I painted it! Pewter sucks, I lost it's base and had to cut off the metal connector bit between his feet, file it down and repaint it once I realized this.
I really liked how his base came out though, spent a bunch of time to get this particular effect.
The thrift store near me has a decent sized air hockey table that they want $50 for. It's not 6'x4' but with a $10 sheet of plywood (or a nicely built "topper" section) it can be.
Gonna go back tomorrow morning and check to see if it's still there, and if so I'll buy it and a friend with a truck is gonna help me lug it back to my apartment. I've been wanting to have a table at my place for a long time, but none of the stuff I've found on craigslist looked like it would work, and building my own required a lot of tools and workspace that I don't have, so I think this plus some plywood and felt will make a decent stopgap.
Honestly unless it’s really small, you don’t even need the plywood. 6’x4’ is just a recommendation, none of the deployment zones require it. Having a raised edge on the side of the table so dice don’t constantly fly off into the darkness is worth losing a couple inches on your board.
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I bought some gun metal silver primer for my Necrons since I'm not doing black anymore. I'm just kind of worried it will be too shiny. I'm hoping the nuln oil coat I put on dulls it down.
Still haven't finished cleaning the damn things. I have so many broken guns and feet to fix and some of the ends of the Warriors are broken off so that is a pain. I could replace them with the extra ones I have in the begin collecting box since I'm using those Warriors to make Deathmarks with the extras from the Immortals box.
Also not sure if I should clean off the Doomsday/Ghost Arks I bought off of ebay or prime over the black. They seem like a nightmare to clean. Just like those monoliths.
PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
The nice thing about secondhand necrons is it’s okay if they’re assembled poorly or in bad condition. Glue your broken-footed dudes then use basing to make it look like they’re coming out of the ground. Prime right over those thick paint jobs and paint it dark metallic with highlights on the lumpy spots like it’s rippling living metal. Get the broken Gauss guns, stick green tubes on them with the ends chopped up and paint the end like its fizzling with uncontained flesh-flaying energy. It’s all copacetic with the Mum-Ra bots.
I took another look at the table and realized that lugging 4'x7' of metal and plastic up to my secobd storey apartment sounded like a recipe for a hernia, I'm buying a shitball 'dining' table for fifteen bucks instead.
I can drive the plywood topper right into the wood of this thing without having to worry about damaging anything expensive. I think I'll be looking at around $25 plus the cost of felt plus the cost of lunch for my friend with a truck as a grand total, and this should hold me over for a few months until I can build something nicer/more permanent.
Did some napkin math for my Thousand Sons stuff. My primary focus right now is Disciples of Tzeentch for AoS, but if I double-dip I have about 1500 points of Thousand Sons once I get everything built.
Someone either on this board or elsewhere who I can’t remember made a Tech-Priest Dominus with the body flipped around so he wasn’t suffering from extreme scoliosis. It was so rad I made my own.
Someone either on this board or elsewhere who I can’t remember made a Tech-Priest Dominus with the body flipped around so he wasn’t suffering from extreme scoliosis. It was so rad I made my own.
I have one of those kits at home unbuilt from the Forgebane box.
How hard was the conversion? It doesn't look like you had to cut anything
There was some cutting involved. If you zoom in you can see the seam at his belt line. The model normally makes a curved C shape, but I chopped it in half at that point and turned the legs around. Actually pretty easy. You’ll need to sand it smooth as well for a clean fit.
The body has little slots at the shoulders for the arms to connect into that will need to be cut off as well, as the arm placement will be further back to account for the better posture. That’s about it as far as cutting though.
Played a game against a bro's Nova GT list. I was playing a more tournament focused list for CSM to try. As always I am sigh that I am not Emperor's Children. Sure they are close combat and that -1 to hit is great blah blah blah. But I play so many list that get in your face fast I rather always go first in combat.
My list was a huge chunk of cultist, 2 units of oblits, some zerkers (I am not use to them anymore so I feel I misused them), some noise marines, the Tsons supreme command detachment with Ahriman, a sorc, and a winged prince. And a rhino.
My opponent was DE. 4 venoms, two of the flyers with missiles, 3 5 man grotesque units, 4 warrior squads, 2 archons, 1 of the named coven character, 3 ravagers with disintegrators. So a lot of str 5 damage 2 weapons on the board.
I ended up being seized on though I planned on on going second probably anyway. Lost my heldrake turn 1, lost one cultist squad, lost half my noise marines, and lost my rhino.
My turn I kill two venoms, a unit of grotesque, and that was about it I think. He canceled my double shooting and rolled a six so I lost 2 cp, got 1 one off the Tson helm. He canceled my fury of khorne for a third round of attack, again rolled a six, poof goes 3 cp.
After this it was just me losing a few units each turn. I was tabled by turn 4. My opponent rolled extra lucky on 6+ fnp on his flyers keeping them alive. Was just very annoying. I knew going in I was in for a rough match. Oblits did okay. Cultist earned their points. Zerkers were okay but having that third attack canceled hurt. I lost 5 cps to will of vek over the game and that was basically what I got back from the helm.
I was trying to figure out if I was going to go with AL or just stick with my old EC's for trios at NoVA. I am staying EC+Tson supreme command detachment because I like it. Its a nice support group which fills a niche.
Its true guard will be better verse me but so many good armies (daemons, eldar, DE, ynnari, jet bike captains) are in my face I find AL might let me keep a few model alive one turn or so at most.
I had a tournament yesterday, and the saddest thing I saw was a 3 Wraithknight list someone took for funsies get absolutely destroyed by a Dark Eldar venomspam army. Wiped turn 1. Those things need to get made vehicles or given back their ignore poison weapons rule.
Posts
I bring rhinos all the time but I am Chaos not loyalist. I use them as transports too! Usually to deliver my possessed across the board. They work pretty well and usually actually live.
Edit:
For loyalist I see a lot of assbacks of course. I play Dark Angels so I see dark shrouds and their bombers a good amount. Flying fridges for wolves. Stormravens for all others are common to.
For me I tried three vindis and found they are decent if you get the stratagem off. They are castle breakers more than anything. My landraider absorbs gobs of fire and does okay but a basic landraider is still underwhelming verse the loyalist variants. Looks cool and still does better than it use to thanks to the machine spirit.
I also used dreads for a while. Usually just died but sometimes they didn't and are rather cheap. My maulerfiend is fun and has the reputation of dying first turn every game. Those he hasn't though usually mean he kills double his points. Its a real hot or cold unit.
Heldrakes are amazing I am really really loving him.
Although honestly it just seems like most Space Marine stuff is overcosted by a large degree in comparison both to other things within their own codices but especially to new Xenos books.
Comparing Rhinos and Drop Pods to, say, Dark Eldar transports is pretty shocking, lol.
T7 vehicles with no invuln are really fragile to anti tank fire, especially plasma. The common tactic was to take 4 predators so even if you lose one you can still kill shot. That’s not a thing anymore with the 3 datasheet limit, and without killshot they don’t have enough firepower to offset how fragile they are (and expensive).
Bringing only three Predators can still be beneficial though, because depending on how you position them (having two deep in cover with one left slightly out to work as bait) you can effectively control where your opponent sends a significant portion of their firepower on their first turn. Every shot they take at your tank in an attempt to prevent you from using Killshot is a shot they aren't taking at your fast movers or infantry that you are moving into position for making runs on objectives or deepstrike screening, for example.
Rhinos can also be used to mobile cover for small squads if you drive them sideways I guess.
Speaking of vehicles, I like to play with the house rule that destroyed vehicles that do not explode stay in place on the board and become terrain for the remainder of the game.
I use that rule as well as the monolith did not blow up or go wherever it goes when it dies so it for a time it was a fort and then a large piece of cover
I suppose assault marines don't have to have jetpacks but base 1 attack for a melee troop just feels bad.
Renegade knight index update.
Also knight faq changes the command point bonuses:
Have one super heavy in super heavy detachment? 3cp. Have three? 6cp.
Guess my army is 14 cp now, Jesus.
They're not allstars by any means, but they're relatively cheap and a full 10 man squad of them with chainswords is 21 attacks.
In what is a recurring theme for astares, the DW version is just better. For 30 points more a squad of 10 veterans has 42 attacks and can heroically intervene. This is largely down to being able to dual wield chainswords. They also get mission tactics on top of this.
While true it still feels lackluster compared to assault troops of othet factions. Just over priced and under performing
If you want loyalist assault troops you use vanguard vets. The point increase is minimal. More diverse load outs. Base 2 attacks. If you look at DW vets they are vanguard/sternguard+better weapons.
Yeah that's true. Just wishing that fast attack for imperial was better.
Scout bikers and inceptors are excellent choices for loyalist fast attack.
Scout bikes are cheap and good at clearing chaff. The fall back mines are fun. Inceptors are 18 heavy bolter shots on jet packs that are assault weapons.
Free index for renegade knights.
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I was going through old models both painted and unpainted from when I was last in the hobby, about 2004. I found an old terminator librarian, and I mean old. It was old in 2004. It's a sculpt from 1993. So naturally I painted it! Pewter sucks, I lost it's base and had to cut off the metal connector bit between his feet, file it down and repaint it once I realized this.
I really liked how his base came out though, spent a bunch of time to get this particular effect.
Album link (3 WHOLE IMAGES WOW!)
More grav tanks!
Gonna go back tomorrow morning and check to see if it's still there, and if so I'll buy it and a friend with a truck is gonna help me lug it back to my apartment. I've been wanting to have a table at my place for a long time, but none of the stuff I've found on craigslist looked like it would work, and building my own required a lot of tools and workspace that I don't have, so I think this plus some plywood and felt will make a decent stopgap.
Still haven't finished cleaning the damn things. I have so many broken guns and feet to fix and some of the ends of the Warriors are broken off so that is a pain. I could replace them with the extra ones I have in the begin collecting box since I'm using those Warriors to make Deathmarks with the extras from the Immortals box.
Also not sure if I should clean off the Doomsday/Ghost Arks I bought off of ebay or prime over the black. They seem like a nightmare to clean. Just like those monoliths.
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
I can drive the plywood topper right into the wood of this thing without having to worry about damaging anything expensive. I think I'll be looking at around $25 plus the cost of felt plus the cost of lunch for my friend with a truck as a grand total, and this should hold me over for a few months until I can build something nicer/more permanent.
I have one of those kits at home unbuilt from the Forgebane box.
How hard was the conversion? It doesn't look like you had to cut anything
Gamertag - Khraul
PSN - Razide6
The body has little slots at the shoulders for the arms to connect into that will need to be cut off as well, as the arm placement will be further back to account for the better posture. That’s about it as far as cutting though.
My list was a huge chunk of cultist, 2 units of oblits, some zerkers (I am not use to them anymore so I feel I misused them), some noise marines, the Tsons supreme command detachment with Ahriman, a sorc, and a winged prince. And a rhino.
My opponent was DE. 4 venoms, two of the flyers with missiles, 3 5 man grotesque units, 4 warrior squads, 2 archons, 1 of the named coven character, 3 ravagers with disintegrators. So a lot of str 5 damage 2 weapons on the board.
I ended up being seized on though I planned on on going second probably anyway. Lost my heldrake turn 1, lost one cultist squad, lost half my noise marines, and lost my rhino.
My turn I kill two venoms, a unit of grotesque, and that was about it I think. He canceled my double shooting and rolled a six so I lost 2 cp, got 1 one off the Tson helm. He canceled my fury of khorne for a third round of attack, again rolled a six, poof goes 3 cp.
After this it was just me losing a few units each turn. I was tabled by turn 4. My opponent rolled extra lucky on 6+ fnp on his flyers keeping them alive. Was just very annoying. I knew going in I was in for a rough match. Oblits did okay. Cultist earned their points. Zerkers were okay but having that third attack canceled hurt. I lost 5 cps to will of vek over the game and that was basically what I got back from the helm.
I was trying to figure out if I was going to go with AL or just stick with my old EC's for trios at NoVA. I am staying EC+Tson supreme command detachment because I like it. Its a nice support group which fills a niche.
Its true guard will be better verse me but so many good armies (daemons, eldar, DE, ynnari, jet bike captains) are in my face I find AL might let me keep a few model alive one turn or so at most.