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[Heroes of the Storm 2.0] "I'm only dooting you because I can't doot myself."

milk ducksmilk ducks regularRegistered User regular
edited July 2018 in Games and Technology
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What's new?
Heroes, in a nutshell, is a game in which two teams are trying to destroy the Core of the opposing team. The Core is similar to the Ancient in DotA or the Nexus in League. Each team has a base with Forts, Towers, Gates, Healing Wells, and Walls to help them defend their core.

At regular intervals waves of NPC Minions spawn in each base and march down pre-defined lanes to attack the enemy. It is the job of the players to help attack down these lanes and destroy the enemy team's base and ultimately their Core. To help with this, each of the maps has a special map objective that gives a big bonus of some sort to the team that completes the objective. Generally each objective will be completed 3-5 times per match before the core is destroyed.

Just like the waves of NPC Minions who spawn and march towards each other in battle, so too do the player characters respawn when they die and continue to fight. The amount of time it takes to respawn is directly related to how long the game has been running. In a new game that is only minutes old, a player will respawn almost immediately. In games over 15 minutes in length the spawn timers will reach a full 60 seconds.

Core: The first team to destroy their opponent's Core wins the map. The Core has a recharging shield which is worth about 15% of the total health of the Core. This shield regenerates very quickly when the Core is out of combat for 8 seconds. The Core also shoots a lightning blast at a target that will also damage enemies near that target. It follows the same targeting rules as Forts and Towers (see below), but is immune to many effect that shut down structures.

Tower: The first line of defense in each base. Towers have limited ammo which regenerates over time. Towers prioritize minions and summoned units and will ignore player characters as long as there is a minion or summoned unit within range. Unlike other MOBAs, the Towers in Heroes will not target a player character if that character attacks an enemy hero while within range.

Forts: Each lane has one Fort, which is located behind a wall and two towers. These Forts have a lot of HP and attack with ammo just like Towers do, but they also slow enemy movement and attack speed which makes them a decent place to defend from. Destroying a Fort yields a considerable XP payout, making them primary targets in the early game.

Keeps: After a Fort, the last line of a lane's defense before the Core are Keeps. These function similarly to Forts, and will also pay out big XP if destroyed. If a keep is destroyed, the opposing lane will start spawning long-range, high-damage catapults alongside the usual minions. Therefore, it's very important protect your keeps while destroying your opponents'.

Healing Wells: If you have played Warcraft 3 then you are probably familiar with the Healing Wells, as they operate similarly to the Moon Wells of the Night Elves. They are on a timer, and restore Health and Mana when you click them. The Health and Mana provided by these Wells is not instant, as the restoration happens over time.

Spawn Point: Each team spawns behind their Core in the safety of their base. There is a magical shield barrier that prevents the enemy team from entering the spawn location, and this shield stops all spells and attacks. Spawn Points also have instant-mounting while you are inside, and you regenerate Health and Mana at a very fast rate while standing in the spawn.

Minions spawn down the lane like merry lemmings just waiting to die to a tower or hero. They are...

1. Soldiers: Dudes with swords, they lead the minion waves. Tend to have higher-than-average HP and a weak melee attack.
2. Archers: Dudes with, get this, bows. They're in the back of the wave, boasting lower HP but a decent ranged attack.
3. Mages: Wizards that coast in the middle of the pack. They deal ranged damage, but the more important thing is that they drop a green orb on death that will give you and nearby teammates a little bit of HP and mana back. There's only one per minion wave, so try to get that orb!
4. Catapults: Beefy siege units that assault bases with a long-range attack. They only spawn when the enemy's final fort in that lane has fallen, giving you incentive to keep that damn fort alive. They can easily outrange towers/forts/cores, meaning they will slowly whittle down a base unless stopped.

Each map also contains a scattering of Mercenary Camps in the "jungle" area between the lanes. These Merc Camps are neutral NPCs that can be defeated by players and hired to fight for the team that captures them. To capture a Mercenary Camp, the players must defeat them in combat (or bribe them) and then stand within a capture circle for a few seconds to gain control of the camp. It is possible for the enemy team to steal the camps if they push you out of the circle or kill you before you can claim it.

1. Siege Camps: These camps contain two giant siege monsters which hurl large rocks at their enemies. They have long range and can out-range towers and forts, which make them very advantageous for lane pushing. These are the easiest camps to defeat and can be solo'd by most heroes by level 10.
2. Bruiser Camps: Formerly known as the "Knight Camps," these are squads of 4 soldiers (3 melee and 1 spellcaster) who possess a lot of HP and decent damage damage. These camps are more difficult to take and typically require 1-2 people to capture.
3. Boss Camps: These camps generally require 3+ heroes to kill, depending on team levels and what heroes are present. These are high HP / high Damage monsters that can do devastating amounts of damage in a lane. They ignore minions and other mercenaries and will only target enemy structures. They cast a Pound skill that can be avoided by moving out of the telegraphed smash circle. They also cast a targeted root spell on occasion against enemy heroes, telegraphed by a smaller circle.
4. Map-Specific Creeps: From pirates on Blackheart Bay to the plant monsters in the Garden of Terror, these mercs will NOT join your side, but instead drop objective-relevant items that help you win the game like skulls, coins, and so on. Difficulty and rewards vary by map.

So what else? There is no item shop. No in-game gold. No items to be bought. No shoes or rods of whatever. "Blasphemy!" you might say, but Heroes is feeling pretty heretical. Instead of items, you get talents roughly every 3-4 levels. These are anywhere from 2-5 choices that change how your character functions. It might be "killing minions gives you more damage" or "your auto-attacks now slow enemies." At level 10 you unlock your Heroic Ability (aka your ult), and even that has choices! Every character has two heroic abilities, so pick the one most suited for the current game.

If you have played other MOBAs and are accustomed to buying boots, this game doesn't have them. Instead it has Mounts (default Z key). Attacking or taking damage dismounts you, and re-mounting does have a brief cooldown. Not all characters can mount up, but instead have mobility skills that in most cases let them get to an area REALLY FAST but has a much longer cooldown.

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Posts

  • dav3ybdav3yb regular Registered User regular
    I know it's somewhere in the old thread, but here's the Diablo re-work video... i'm pretty hype for it

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  • milk ducksmilk ducks regular Registered User regular
    Heroes of the Storm is like four years old, and they're finally bothering to explain the fucking basics to the players.

    Bravo, Blizzard.



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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Knight_ wrote: »
    Lightning Breath once had its place as a solid ultimate but then everyone realized the Apoc combo actually requires basically no mechanical skill to land and that was that.

    characters also used to be a lot slower on average, so walking up to the team and pressing breath assured you a lot of damage.

    Yeah, I don't know if that was the only change of not but Lightning Breath used to be fairly solid. This was a whole rework back though. Good for comboing with stuns and was basically a giant "fuck off" button to the enemy team, who would all run.

  • Inquisitor77Inquisitor77 2 x Penny Arcade Fight Club Champion A fixed point in space and timeRegistered User regular
    Better late than never! Glad they're doing these.

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    milk ducks wrote: »
    Heroes of the Storm is like four years old, and they're finally bothering to explain the fucking basics to the players.

    It's nice they are doing them but it's not like the vast majority of games don't get by on letting the community handle the education issue too. Nothing weird about that.

    kime
  • The Escape GoatThe Escape Goat Brave Sir Robin Registered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    milk ducks wrote: »
    Heroes of the Storm is like four years old, and they're finally bothering to explain the fucking basics to the players.

    It's nice they are doing them but it's not like the vast majority of games don't get by on letting the community handle the education issue too. Nothing weird about that.

    The pits of despair that are mid-level ranked LoL and DotA aren't exactly shining examples of doing nothing being a defensible strategy.

    3clipse wrote: »
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    Moridin889
  • DibbyDibby Let us grieve existence, together Registered User regular
    Still super of the opinion that "educating/improving/leveling up the playerbase" won't work and is a fool's errand and a myth, BUUUUUT

    Ain't gonna poopoo it just cause of that. I mean, good on them for actually doing this sorta stuff.

    But I do agree with Ducks, four fucking years too late, r o f l.

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  • DibbyDibby Let us grieve existence, together Registered User regular
    edited May 2018
    Oh, from Reddit re: Diablo rework, clarification from the devs:
    Lightning Breath now has a ramping slow effect on it as well.
    From the Shadows is gone, but part of that range was put into the base Shadow Charge. We felt the ability felt bad to use without the Talent, but the increasing the range any more started to feel unfair to play against.

    Super super super pleased with that latter one. Agree 100%, that talent felt mandatory to take because baseline Shadow Charge just felt fuckin' awful otherwise. A good compromise.


    Edit: Ohhhh wow apparently Pyroblast was like, legit bugged?
    Bug Fixes
    Heroes, Abilities, and Talents

    Kael’thas: Fixed an issue causing Pyroblast to receive cooldown reductions from Presence of Mind prior to learning the Talent at level 20.

    But it's been fixed.

    Dibby on
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  • Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    bleh, just got a leaver queue because i was trying to decide what support to pick since everyone was shadowing stuff, and then the other guy i was picking with snap switched to lucio and i couldn't switch in time to an assassin to make it go and dropped.

    rip 2 qm games.

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  • morgan_cokemorgan_coke regular Registered User regular
    Just had a guy pick Medivh then proceed to whine at me for taking Tyrande. I got MVP that game. The idiots are real.

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  • Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    edited May 2018
    This was terrifying. I dodged genji killing me by dragonform ending just as he autoed.


    This was just satisfying

    Knight_ on
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  • StericaSterica When it comes to beauty, I rarely make boasts but I look quite good, compared to your posts!Registered User, Moderator mod
    Reminder that doing a stupid thing with your team is better than do a smart thing by yourself.

    If you can convince them of your superior strat, then go for it. But if they've committed to an objective/push/teamfight/etc. and YOUR ass is stubbornly hanging back to do whatever you wanted, then YOU'RE the bad player in this scenario. You got outvoted, so deal with it and do the thing. As a bonus, if the stupid thing they wanted to do goes as badly as you think, then next time maybe they'll heed your wisdom instead. As opposed to leaving yourself open to four angry players.

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  • fortyforty regular Registered User regular
    Well, since Diablo is already one of the top tanks in the meta, I highly suspect this rework will be of the "awesome rework" variety (read: nerf). Good for the game, but probably bad if you like playing Diablo.

    The best card in Hearthstone is your credit card.
  • HenroidHenroid Radio Demon Internet HellRegistered User regular
    I reinstalled this a couple weeks ago. Again. I dunno why. I have the most on-off relationship with this game out of any other I've played.

    Nobody likes me but that's okay. I'm used to it.
    morgan_coke
  • MNC DoverMNC Dover Game Designer/Stay-at-home Dad Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    Looking over my last two weeks of HL games:
    • 23 games
    • 14-9 W/L record
    • 12-2 M-F, 2-7 Sat-Sn
    • 17 Warriors (9-8), 3 Support (3-0), 3 Assassins (2-1)
    • Muradin (3-0), ETC (4-3), Johanna (1-0), Diablo (1-0), Varian (0-1), Garrosh (0-1), Blaze (0-1) Sonya (0-2)
    • Li Li (3-0)
    • Jaina (1-1), Zul'Jin (1-0)

    After a disastrous weekend of HL games two weeks ago (going 1-5), I vowed to stop playing HL on S/Sn. Because I was sleep deprived, my days blurred together last weekend and I accidentally played 3 games before I realized what I did (1-2).

    So if you only count the games I played during the weekdays, my record has been a bonkers 12-2. My rank went from demotion 4 to promo 3 and my total record is 55-49. Considering that prior to my new HL stance, I'd been running a sub 40% WR over the season, this is awesome.

    In addition to playing most on weekday gaming, I've also been focusing on improving my shotcalling. I no longer ask if people are cool with me shotcalling and just start making calls. I've noticed people usually don't care and fall in line. I think this more than anything else is the reason for my increased WR. I'd say about 75% of the time the team doesn't talk back, just listen in and follow what I say.

    To further justify this, my highest winning % characters over the season are Li Li (16-7), Muradin (7-5), and ETC (11-9). For Muradin and ETC, I'm not only shotcalling but determining the timing of our engagements. This means either playing aggressive with Dwarf Toss/Slides into the enemy of countering enemy dives with Stuns/Knockbacks. With Li Li, not only is she pretty strong, but her automatic healing style means I can spend more time watching the minimap while continuing to heal by holding Q. This is huge and indicates I need to work on it with my Tanks.

    Interestingly enough, most games I'm not MVP or even on the final score screen. I think my play has been average to good, but the numbers don't reflect it. In almost every game we win, I've had a teammate compliment me on my shotcalling in some form or fashion. I think that is the missing stat that simply can't be tracked outside of overall WR.

    One thing I should note is that my attempts to branch out into other lesser played heroes (Varian, Garrosh, Sonya) has resulted in losses. If I want to get better with these heroes, I need to spend more time with them in QM. Also, unless I plan on maining Tanks forever, I need to flesh out my Assassin pool. Fortunately, there seems to be no shortage of people wanting to do those roles. :)

    In summary, weekday HotS combined with comfort pick characters and an increased shotcalling effort has made a huge difference in not only my WR but my enjoyment of the game.

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  • Inquisitor77Inquisitor77 2 x Penny Arcade Fight Club Champion A fixed point in space and timeRegistered User regular
    Knight_ wrote: »
    This was terrifying. I dodged genji killing me by dragonform ending just as he autoed.
    Just going to point out that I juked the shit out of the Genji the whole game. :P

    MNC Dover wrote: »
    With Li Li, not only is she pretty strong, but her automatic healing style means I can spend more time watching the minimap while continuing to heal by holding Q. This is huge and indicates I need to work on it with my Tanks.

    Knight and I were just talking about this in queue today. LiLi is probably one of the strongest characters in the game for the majority of the playerbase, because her kit isn't even point-and-click - it's literally press-the-button. So she's likely even easier to play than a "beginner" hero like Raynor, and more powerful to boot. While playing her can dedicate the majority of your brainpower to macro and positioning instead of having to worry about things like aiming your skill shots.

    Also, it's great to see how much you've progressed, Dover. :) I don't think you should've landed in Bronze in the first place, so to me it's just watching you climb your way back to your rightful rank.

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  • SupagoatSupagoat regular Registered User regular
    Had a BHB game last night where our Gazlowe said "GG" before the start after he looked at the comps. I said "The last time someone said GG before the game we won handily." He politely asked us to promise to let it end fast if we get 3 levels behind.

    We won handily.

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  • dav3ybdav3yb regular Registered User regular
    Supagoat wrote: »
    Had a BHB game last night where our Gazlowe said "GG" before the start after he looked at the comps. I said "The last time someone said GG before the game we won handily." He politely asked us to promise to let it end fast if we get 3 levels behind.

    We won handily.

    all he has to do is run around taking camps and you win. the map is dumb that way.

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  • morgan_cokemorgan_coke regular Registered User regular
    Sometimes I think I'm the only one on this board who likes BHB. Now, Braxis? Yeah, that map can go die in a fire.

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited May 2018
    Yup. BHB is broken as fuck and super snowbally.

    Strategy is simple: send someone to grab as many coins as you can, clear lanes and either turn in or push top or something depending on what the other team decides to defend. Once you get a bit ahead just bully them off some of the coins and never take a fight. Either they defend the turn in and you or your mercs push, or they stop the push and you turn in. Either way, you win.

    Whoever holds the coins dictates the flow of the game and there's no way for the other team to stop you from doing it unless you make a mistake and do something really stupid.

    shryke on
    Knight_Dibby
  • morgan_cokemorgan_coke regular Registered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    Yup. BHB is broken as fuck and super snowbally.

    Strategy is simple: send someone to grab as many coins as you can, clear lanes and either turn in or push top or something depending on what the other team decides to defend. Once you get a bit ahead just bully them off some of the coins and never take a fight. Either they defend the turn in and you or your mercs push, or they stop the push and you turn in. Either way, you win.

    Whoever holds the coins dictates the flow of the game and there's no way for the other team to stop you from doing it unless you make a mistake and do something really stupid.

    That's cool and all, but what actually happens is people randomly walk into the turn in alone or take boss with all five up and get ganked all game. It's fun.

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Without coordination it can actually end up much more snowbally. Especially if the other team has even 1 person who vaguely knows what they are doing and just hordes coins and plays safe. When no one has a strategy the map is still awful because whoever gets an early lead generally wins because they can muscle people off the turn-in or chests.

    Most often what you see happen in games full of mouthbreathers is the losing team either ends up spending all their time trying to relieve lane pressure and just getting slowly bombarded to death or they try to dive the turn in in small groups and die and end up getting lane pressured and bombarded to death.

  • MMMigMMMig regular Registered User regular
    You know what'd be cool?

    If blizz included in the training mode the ability to try out and learn the various driveable units in the game like dragon, volskaya mech, garden terror, etc.


    You know what'd be even cooler?

    A brawl where everyone's in their own volskyaya mech or dragon or plant terror, fighting and breaking shit around them.
    With godzilla-like sound effects.

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    Witty signature comment goes here...

    wra
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  • morgan_cokemorgan_coke regular Registered User regular
    You know wath'd be even cooler? If Blizzard made the DK and terror autopilot to actually hit buildings. The number of morons I see take one and then just run around the map hitting people is enough to drive me up the wall.

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  • Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular

    lunara rework

    can't really tell much from there, seems similar with some minor changes, she's so squishy and slow to deal damage that i can't imagine this helps but hard to tell without seeing the whole talent tree.

    tbh i'm more sad we didn't get an in development for all the wrestling skins.

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  • morgan_cokemorgan_coke regular Registered User regular
    Sounds like they got rid of her "I don't have any talents at level 4" issue. And they appear to have made wisp at least theoretically useful.

    Honestly just those two things would be huge. [email protected]"her sustain is now a thing you can pick" Spoiler: it's probably not

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  • cptruggedcptrugged Time Dilated Registered User regular
    The wisp getting that insane vision over obstacles is pretty big. Vision is a premium in this game and that's an insane amount with the talent.

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  • DibbyDibby Let us grieve existence, together Registered User regular
    edited May 2018
    cptrugged wrote: »
    The wisp getting that insane vision over obstacles is pretty big. Vision is a premium in this game and that's an insane amount with the talent.

    That's basically the size of Brightwing's Peekaboo too, innit. Seems good! Rewards smart placement of Wisps.

    I actually like that her 1s and 4s looks rather appealing now. Nature's Culling at 4!


    Edit: Splintered Spear still in, FUCK YES. Natural Perspective still in too, rad. New talent at 20, increase poison damage by 40% when at 3 stacks. I THINK Unfair Advantage is still in, but moved up to 16 (I think 16s and 13s swapped positions, but they probably also pruned a bunch of shit too).

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  • PMAversPMAvers regular Registered User regular
    Feedback on Lunara rework:

    It should automatically play the laugh for enemy players when they hit max stacks of poison.

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  • Tim is on the InternetTim is on the Internet On the Internet Edmonton, ABRegistered User regular
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Feedback on Lunara rework:

    It should automatically play the laugh for enemy players when they hit max stacks of poison.

    And on every refresh at max.

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  • The Escape GoatThe Escape Goat Brave Sir Robin Registered User regular
    And also when Ana gets max doses on a hero it plays Lunara's laugh.

    3clipse wrote: »
    God is dead and life has no purpose.
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  • MMMigMMMig regular Registered User regular

    Third bans incoming?

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    wra
  • Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    I hope you do both bans at the same time, adding another 2 minutes to draft would be brutal.

    At least they moved them to the beginning of the draft. Support choke is gonna be kinda nuts lol.

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  • DibbyDibby Let us grieve existence, together Registered User regular
    edited May 2018
    MMMig wrote: »
    Third bans incoming?
    Knight_ wrote: »
    I hope you do both bans at the same time, adding another 2 minutes to draft would be brutal.

    At least they moved them to the beginning of the draft. Support choke is gonna be kinda nuts lol.

    Yes and yes (actually only guessing on this one! I don't know if you do both back to back or if it flips from Team A->Team B):



    https://heroesofthestorm.com/en-us/blog/21771817/ranked-play-enhancements-coming-with-2018-season-3-2018-5-11/

    Third Ban is at the START of the draft now, not in the middle like previously proposed. Super good.

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  • morgan_cokemorgan_coke regular Registered User regular
    You know what would really help with Support choke? Releasing more supports.

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  • FrozenzenFrozenzen regular Registered User regular
    You know what would really help with Support choke? Releasing more supports.

    I'd rather they fixed supports like uther and rehgar to be worth picking for any other reason than cleanse.

    morgan_cokeDibbyMNC DoverTim is on the InternetLord_AsmodeusMoridin889fortyNyht
  • morgan_cokemorgan_coke regular Registered User regular
    Frozenzen wrote: »
    You know what would really help with Support choke? Releasing more supports.

    I'd rather they fixed supports like uther and rehgar to be worth picking for any other reason than cleanse.

    Yeah, I mean, honestly, right now? I don't like picking anyone but Li Li or Cain or Lucio. Maaaayyybbee Brightwing. Their big support nerf just left too many of them with nothing to really do but heal, and a lot of them don't make great healbots.

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  • cptruggedcptrugged Time Dilated Registered User regular
    Uther still has a point and click stun though. If his talents were better I feel like it would be big for him.

  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    Frozenzen wrote: »
    You know what would really help with Support choke? Releasing more supports.

    I'd rather they fixed supports like uther and rehgar to be worth picking for any other reason than cleanse.

    Yeah, I mean, honestly, right now? I don't like picking anyone but Li Li or Cain or Lucio. Maaaayyybbee Brightwing. Their big support nerf just left too many of them with nothing to really do but heal, and a lot of them don't make great healbots.

    This isn't really right. Stukov is great, and he has a significant role besides healing.

    Malf is in a similar position, roots are quite important, albeit probably less so than Stukov's silence. Malf makes up for it though because his healing is so dynamic, you have to work for the heals.

    I agree supports could use some love, but you ignored two of the more powerful and non-healbot supports!

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  • Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    Uther is still pretty good. Huge burst heals, point and click stun, and 2 fight winning ults. You just have to fight quickly when you have him because he doesn't have the sustain.

    rehgar and ana are the 2 supports i'd most put in the need help bucket. ana because she's still weak to dive and reliant on 2 extremely small skillshots to get any value, and rehgar because his buttons just aren't strong enough anymore after round after round of nerfing.

    auriel close behind, she needs some way to sustain people between fights, even if it came at the cost of some of her extremely powerful in fight healing.

    i'd put everyone else in the viable bucket. malf/lucio/deckard/alex/li li/morales/uther/bw are all certainly viable. and I assume stukov still is, but probably have to use the trait built now which is harder to execute, and he has mana again which hurts, but if you're able to play him i expect he'll still be fine. kharazim is probably good, his winrate is high at least. i'm fuckin' terrible at him so i can't evaluate though.

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