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[Virtual Reality] is like normal reality, but butter

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    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    Mr_Grinch wrote: »
    Gvzbgul wrote: »
    Hello, I'm getting a VR next week, though I still haven't made up my mind as to what VR to get. I want to be relatively future proof.

    My heart was set on a Vive, as it was the best at the time, with room scale and all that. It seemed like the gold standard of VR. But... the recent releases by Valve and Occulus have changed that a little.

    The new Occulus is probably still a no, the price is nice but its still only almost a Vive. Am I going to use room scale? I did when I borrowed a friend's Vive for the week.

    The Valve headset is intriguing but I haven't found much about how well it works and how it compares to Vive (aside from the usual techblog "this is the second coming of Christ our Lord AMEN" posts).

    I like Vive Pro but they don't make it easy to get as a first VR headset do they? If there was a Vive Pro package I'd think about that, even with the price. But it seems like I need to have a Vive to start with?

    Currently my plan is to get the Vive, and I can always upgrade to a Pro later. Then I'll have two headsets, for... reasons? Or I can sell it. I dunno, but a basic Vive, while no longer the best, seems like the Goldilocks of VR and a good first choice. Not too expensive, not too cheap, has room scale, better tracking etc.

    The Rift S is, in my opinion, a far better buy than the vive. You seem to be under the impression it's not geared up for room scale? It very much is. Also better screen, better controllers (arguably), no external sensors, easy set up. Tracking following updates is top notch.

    And with the Rift S being so reasonably priced and well supported I think it rules out most WMR headsets.

    That said, if money isn't an object, go for the Index.

    As others have said, the vive just isn't a good purchase now (not to disparage vive owners, it's still a great piece of kit)

    I would agree with this probably, though I'm not as well informed onto individual prices/deals.

    The Rift S uses the same mechanism of tracking (and frankly, very similar controllers) as WMR headsets. The tracking works somewhat better, the controllers are marginally worse (in my opinion). With that in mind, unless you find a Samsung Odyssey at a competitive price, get a Rift S. And headphones that don't suck. All the WMR headsets have vastly superior built-in spatial audio, but this is not hard to remedy. I've yet to encounter someone who is happy with the Rift S's native audio solution.

    It's harder to compare it to the Vive, as a matter of fundamentally different tracking mechanisms. The Vive at least comes with competent in-ear headphones, they're not spatial audio (but you could replace them with them, I think?).

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    DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    It's not even accurate to say the original Rift isn't geared up for roomscale. It absolutely is. @Gvzbgul you seem to have your evaluation of VR headsets stuck in a time loop from 2016.

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    SyngyneSyngyne Registered User regular
    Gvzbgul wrote: »
    Hello, I'm getting a VR next week, though I still haven't made up my mind as to what VR to get. I want to be relatively future proof.

    My heart was set on a Vive, as it was the best at the time, with room scale and all that. It seemed like the gold standard of VR. But... the recent releases by Valve and Occulus have changed that a little.

    The new Occulus is probably still a no, the price is nice but its still only almost a Vive. Am I going to use room scale? I did when I borrowed a friend's Vive for the week.

    The Valve headset is intriguing but I haven't found much about how well it works and how it compares to Vive (aside from the usual techblog "this is the second coming of Christ our Lord AMEN" posts).

    I like Vive Pro but they don't make it easy to get as a first VR headset do they? If there was a Vive Pro package I'd think about that, even with the price. But it seems like I need to have a Vive to start with?

    Currently my plan is to get the Vive, and I can always upgrade to a Pro later. Then I'll have two headsets, for... reasons? Or I can sell it. I dunno, but a basic Vive, while no longer the best, seems like the Goldilocks of VR and a good first choice. Not too expensive, not too cheap, has room scale, better tracking etc.

    Coming from a Vive and Index owner, there’s no reason to get a Vive or a Vive Pro over a Rift S. Rift S does do roomscale, and you have the added bonus of not having to deal with HTC’s legendarily bad support.

    Re: Index vs Vive, the Index is pretty much an upgrade over the Vive in every way. The visuals are noticeably more clear, especially if you look towards the edges. With the Vive, the image got pretty blurry towards the outside of your field of view, whereas with the Index it stays pretty clear. God rays are still there, but they feel a lot more muted than the Vive, and appear more as a smudge of light rather than a sharp pattern from the fresnel lenses. SDE definitely isn’t gone, but it is much harder to notice. The reduced black levels from the LCD screens didn’t bother me, but some people are more sensitive to that.

    It’s a much more comfortable headset than the Vive, and easier to put on and take off. If you have wide framed glasses, though, you’ll have issues. The face gasket presses against the sides of your face pretty snugly, and if the arms of your glasses don’t sit flush against your temples, the headset will constantly squeeze your glasses out of place.

    There are some durability concerns with the Index controllers at the moment, so that’s something to be aware of. Some people’s thumbsticks won’t click when pressed unless the stick is centered, which causes problems for games that use that kind of input.

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    The_SpaniardThe_Spaniard It's never lupines Irvine, CaliforniaRegistered User regular
    edited July 2019
    I just ordered the Index and it said that some digital stuff got associated with my account as a result of the purchase. Can anyone tell me what the digital content that comes with the Index is?

    Edit: Is it Hand Lab, because I think I added that to my account when it came out.

    The_Spaniard on
    Playstation/Origin/GoG: Span_Wolf Xbox/uPlay/Bnet: SpanWolf Nintendo: Span_Wolf SW-7097-4917-9392 Steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/Span_Wolf/
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    GvzbgulGvzbgul Registered User regular
    Hmm. Index is not out yet in my country.

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    templewulftemplewulf The Team Chump USARegistered User regular
    As a Vive owner, I would say that it's not the best value per dollar at this point, especially since I would say the deluxe audio strap is (more or less) required. Even with all the much newer stuff on the market, they're somehow still charging 500 (+ 100 for the strap.)

    You won't be sad to own a Vive, I still love mine, but HTC's prices are complete nonsense in 2019.

    Twitch.tv/FiercePunchStudios | PSN | Steam | Discord | SFV CFN: templewulf
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    SyngyneSyngyne Registered User regular
    edited July 2019
    Gvzbgul wrote: »
    Hmm. Index is not out yet in my country.

    That’s another issue with the Index. Valve only ships to the continental US and the EU.

    Syngyne on
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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited July 2019
    Oh shit y'all -- word is the Index is now available for immediate shipping. At work so no links, buuut it sounds like everyone should be getting them soon.

    I don't have an email but they're supposedly filling backorders today.

    Edit: It looks like shipping today is just orders for the full bundle. But apparently the a la carte options will be shipping soon too.

    Fiatil on
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    jdarksunjdarksun Struggler VARegistered User regular
    Fiatil wrote: »
    Oh shit y'all -- word is the Index is now available for immediate shipping. At work so no links, buuut it sounds like everyone should be getting them soon.

    I don't have an email but they're supposedly filling backorders today.

    Edit: It looks like shipping today is just orders for the full bundle. But apparently the a la carte options will be shipping soon too.
    Confirmed that it's "Add to Cart" now instead of "Reserve Yours".

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    The_SpaniardThe_Spaniard It's never lupines Irvine, CaliforniaRegistered User regular
    edited July 2019
    I never got an email from my reserve from months ago, but I did put in a full order yesterday and it's still on processing.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-Hg8jM8YZQ

    The_Spaniard on
    Playstation/Origin/GoG: Span_Wolf Xbox/uPlay/Bnet: SpanWolf Nintendo: Span_Wolf SW-7097-4917-9392 Steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/Span_Wolf/
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    GvzbgulGvzbgul Registered User regular
    A friend offfered me his Vive for cheap. So... choice made I guess?

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    CampyCampy Registered User regular
    Gvzbgul wrote: »
    A friend offfered me his Vive for cheap. So... choice made I guess?

    Perfecto! Then if you want to upgrade, you can just buy the Index headset and that'll work with the Vive peripherals just fine.

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    Yeah, the Vive is still a great headset. Just HTC is ridiculous and charging waaaaaay too much for it in 2019.

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    Damnit I'm going to have to build a new computer now aren't I? 2070 super looks hot, new ryzens look hot....VR is evil.

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    templewulftemplewulf The Team Chump USARegistered User regular
    Fiatil wrote: »
    Damnit I'm going to have to build a new computer now aren't I? 2070 super looks hot, new ryzens look hot....VR is evil.

    This is the first time I've considered going AMD in forever, because Nvidia has been as bad as HTC at pricing.

    I miss there being a mid tier!

    Twitch.tv/FiercePunchStudios | PSN | Steam | Discord | SFV CFN: templewulf
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    DixonDixon Screwed...possibly doomed CanadaRegistered User regular
    I just bought my first AMD cpu, but still have my 2070 from last year so I won’t upgrade that yet.

    I just haven’t been sure if I want to go rift s or index. Although I don’t think I can get the index in Canada anyway.

    The standard rift just isn’t cutting it for me now

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    JayKaosJayKaos Registered User regular
    Jumped on the Index when my reservation finally popped in, but it's seeming like I need a cpu upgrade to really take advantage - was hoping my i5 4430 would cut it but it's struggling on any fancier games.

    Can confirm it's really fucking neato though.

    Steam | SW-0844-0908-6004 and my Switch code
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    SlortexSlortex In my chairRegistered User regular
    Gvzbgul wrote: »
    A friend offfered me his Vive for cheap. So... choice made I guess?

    Highly reccommend the wireless adapter if you've got some extra cash and a beefy CPU (I also know AMD processors were having trouble, not sure if that's still the case). I am planning on upgrading from the Vive wands to the Index controllers once Valve sorts out the thumbstick issue, but I can't see ditching the Vive headset until there's another wireless solution made available. Wireless is the single biggest immersion factor for me, not even a ceiling mounted cable/pulley system is close.

    If you do get the adapter, you'll want to monitor the adapter temperatures pretty closely (there's loghing options in the wireless software). Mine were routinely in the high 80s and it burned the motherboard out. Had to deal with HTC support (something I do not wish on anybody) and they took two months to fix it. Despite support claiming the issue would not occur again, the temps were just as high. I strapped a small USB fan to the top of the adapter and that instantly dropped the temps by about 30 degrees. I look (even more) ridiculous with a fan on my head, but its better than going back to tethered VR!

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    GnomeTankGnomeTank What the what? Portland, OregonRegistered User regular
    edited July 2019
    Got my Index yesterday. Was relatively easy to setup and get going (though I think I have some light pollution issues I need to solve with my current setup).

    Visually it's incomparable to any VR headset I've used previously. It's a huge visual upgrade over my OG Rift. I was able to basically turn super sampling off in iRacing and recover all those frames. The FoV has made a huge difference in racing. I can now glance over to see my mirrors without moving my head much at all. In the Rift I would have to move my head a good 20-30 degrees to the left or right to clearly see my mirrors. Cars in the distance, especially in mirrors, actually look like cars instead of pixel blobs. I can even identify what car is coming up behind me at much greater distances. I can look for distance boards and actually read the numbers on them at a reasonable distance rather than just seeing pixel blobs. The refresh rate bump is more subtle but definitely perceptible.

    Something I haven't seen talked about is that the vertical FoV of the index seems to be higher as well, not just the horizontal. This means I get a lot more stuff in my vertical peripheral vision. The most notable example is the steering wheel of the car. I drive a lot of modern formula and GT cars, so the steering wheels have big LCD screens in them. I can very easily read those now by just glancing. The text is clear and well within my vertical vision cone. I could always see them in my Rift, but the text wasn't clear near the edges of the lenses and I would have to look down (and thus take my focus off the road) to read things on the wheel.

    The switch from OLED to LCD screens is a talking point I see a lot. The contrast definitely doesn't pop as much on the LCD's of the Index. That said I feel the colors have been fine so far, they are still bright and colorful. I think it's a fair trade off to get rid of a lot of the sub-pixel issues OLED screens have. The screen door effect is nearly imperceptible on the Index and a big reason why is that LCD screens which have much better sub-pixel density than the OLED's being used previously. This was most notible in Elite Dangerous. Shocking no one, space is very dark. The inside of your cockpit tends to be much brighter and the contrast it creates causes space to be a lot more dark gray than black. Frankly I got used to it very quickly and it didn't bother me unless I actually sat and thought about it but this is something to consider.

    If I had a complain it would have to be the god rays. They are certainly worse in the Index than what I was used to with my Rift. Thankfully my use case doesn't have me regularly looking at light text on dark backgrounds, but if your use case does, the Index god rays may be an issue for you.

    I can't speak to any of the room scale stuff. That's not my use case for VR. That said for my use case, the Index has been a complete and total upgrade for me. I don't think I could go back to racing in my Rift.

    GnomeTank on
    Sagroth wrote: »
    Oh c'mon FyreWulff, no one's gonna pay to visit Uranus.
    Steam: Brainling, XBL / PSN: GnomeTank, NintendoID: Brainling, FF14: Zillius Rosh SFV: Brainling
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    NEO|PhyteNEO|Phyte They follow the stars, bound together. Strands in a braid till the end.Registered User regular
    I assuming the answer to "does this exist" is yes, do any of us have experience with VR exercise stuff? As an actual dedicated get fit thing, not just "beat saber is a hell of a workout"

    It was that somehow, from within the derelict-horror, they had learned a way to see inside an ugly, broken thing... And take away its pain.
    Warframe/Steam: NFyt
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    MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    NEO|Phyte wrote: »
    I assuming the answer to "does this exist" is yes, do any of us have experience with VR exercise stuff? As an actual dedicated get fit thing, not just "beat saber is a hell of a workout"

    Experience, no, but just stumbled across this.

    http://virtualrealitytimes.com/2019/07/22/viro-move-is-the-latest-vr-fitness-game-to-help-you-shed-those-calories/

    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
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    LawndartLawndart Registered User regular
    NEO|Phyte wrote: »
    I assuming the answer to "does this exist" is yes, do any of us have experience with VR exercise stuff? As an actual dedicated get fit thing, not just "beat saber is a hell of a workout"

    Check out BoxVR, since it's vaguely similar to Beat Saber in gameplay. You can also tweak duration and intensity in more of a workout fashion.

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    NEO|Phyte wrote: »
    I assuming the answer to "does this exist" is yes, do any of us have experience with VR exercise stuff? As an actual dedicated get fit thing, not just "beat saber is a hell of a workout"

    Not quite what you're asking for, but boxing is a pretty direct route to a workout. Thrill of the Fight will absolutely wreck me and probably gives me a better workout than a dedicated app would, because it's a lot more fun than jogging or something and makes you want to push yourself.

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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited July 2019
    Also yayyy! My reseserved Index is ready for purchase!

    If you didn't buy the bundle check your e-mails! Looks like the non-bundles are available for immediate purchase now too.

    Fiatil on
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    SlortexSlortex In my chairRegistered User regular
    The VR Institue of Health and Fitness/ is a great resource for... well, you can probably guess. I'll second @Fiatil and say that Thrill of the Fight is my favorite workout game.

    Honestly, just by virtue of playing VR instead of flat games improved health is inevitable. Substituting a mostly sedentary activity with something that has me standing and moving has helped shed a few pounds. I would say that unless you're doing mostly seated VR games, you'll see some fitness gains. That said, VR is basically only cardio, so its best complemented with some kind of strength exercise for best results.

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    NEO|PhyteNEO|Phyte They follow the stars, bound together. Strands in a braid till the end.Registered User regular
    Having finally gotten around to firing up GORN since knuckles support was added:
    Fuck the crab in particular. It's a mess of random flailing that makes it basically impossible to fight without getting hit, killing it does not stop the blackout timer, and if it is the last thing left in the first phase of the final battle, you end up locked in a black screen and have to exit and restart the game.

    It was that somehow, from within the derelict-horror, they had learned a way to see inside an ugly, broken thing... And take away its pain.
    Warframe/Steam: NFyt
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    Mr_GrinchMr_Grinch Registered User regular
    I use BOXVR for fitness purposes, it's not a game. I mean in terms of activity it's more fun than a gym session but it's not as fun as, say beat saber.

    Does it burn calories? I'm guessing yes but I couldn't say for sure that the calorie counter is accurate. I use it on days when I've been unable to fit anything else in, or if I'm away with work. It's more a substitute or filler but I come away knackered from some songs (whereas some are really sedate). My watch records a considerable increase in my pulse too.

    Steam: Sir_Grinch
    PSN: SirGrinchX
    Oculus Rift: Sir_Grinch
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    Big DookieBig Dookie Smells great! Houston, TXRegistered User regular
    Mr_Grinch wrote: »
    I use BOXVR for fitness purposes, it's not a game. I mean in terms of activity it's more fun than a gym session but it's not as fun as, say beat saber.

    Does it burn calories? I'm guessing yes but I couldn't say for sure that the calorie counter is accurate. I use it on days when I've been unable to fit anything else in, or if I'm away with work. It's more a substitute or filler but I come away knackered from some songs (whereas some are really sedate). My watch records a considerable increase in my pulse too.

    Have you tried RacketNX yet? In terms of combining fun gameplay with a solid workout, I haven’t played many other games that can compare. It’s also really great on the Quest since you no longer have to worry about getting twisted up in the cable.

    Steam | Twitch
    Oculus: TheBigDookie | XBL: Dook | NNID: BigDookie
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    SniperGuySniperGuy SniperGuyGaming Registered User regular
    I just played a half hour of accounting+

    and I'm never going to be able to play a VR horror game

    I would die. My heart would stop.

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    BonepartBonepart Registered User regular
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    I just played a half hour of accounting+

    and I'm never going to be able to play a VR horror game

    I would die. My heart would stop.

    Oh? One quick google search later and they have another copy sold! For $12 I’ll give that a try!

    I haven’t had a lot of time to play with my index, and sadly I only have enough free space for standing mode, but it is a lot of fun so far!

    XBL Gamertag: Ipori
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    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    I always thought Layers of Fear would make a good VR horror game, given the very methodical pacing and movement. Then again, I also think it's arguably the best take on the P.T. walking horror formula, including P.T. itself.

    I suppose Bloober thought their time was better spent elsewhere. They haven't ruled out a VR version of the sequel though.

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    ThirithThirith Registered User regular
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    and I'm never going to be able to play a VR horror game

    I would die. My heart would stop.
    This is to some extent why I'm glad/sad that Resident Evil 7 VR doesn't exist on PC. I love how tactile the locations look and I think that this would translate really well to VR. The actual game, though, and in particular its brand of horror? Nope. Nope, nope, nope, and triply so in VR.

    webp-net-resizeimage.jpg
    "Nothing is gonna save us forever but a lot of things can save us today." - Night in the Woods
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    DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    PA themselves summed up my feelings on VR horror.

    jv6g6ef2g5z9.jpg

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    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    Thirith wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    and I'm never going to be able to play a VR horror game

    I would die. My heart would stop.
    This is to some extent why I'm glad/sad that Resident Evil 7 VR doesn't exist on PC. I love how tactile the locations look and I think that this would translate really well to VR. The actual game, though, and in particular its brand of horror? Nope. Nope, nope, nope, and triply so in VR.

    It's not really that scary of a game, even in VR.

    Or at least I think so. I thought it was about as scary as RE4 when it first came out: that first hour of dread, and then exactly what you'd expect from a Resident Evil game in first person.

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    SniperGuySniperGuy SniperGuyGaming Registered User regular
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Thirith wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    and I'm never going to be able to play a VR horror game

    I would die. My heart would stop.
    This is to some extent why I'm glad/sad that Resident Evil 7 VR doesn't exist on PC. I love how tactile the locations look and I think that this would translate really well to VR. The actual game, though, and in particular its brand of horror? Nope. Nope, nope, nope, and triply so in VR.

    It's not really that scary of a game, even in VR.

    Or at least I think so. I thought it was about as scary as RE4 when it first came out: that first hour of dread, and then exactly what you'd expect from a Resident Evil game in first person.

    I definitely disagree with this, RE7 is way scarier. Except for maybe the Regenerators. RE4 is an action game with some horror elements, RE7 is terrifying. I didn't realize it wasn't on PC for VR though, that's a little disappointing I was hoping to try that for maybe 5 minutes sometime.

    Re7:
    Has the dad stalking you around, your hand getting cut off in first person, quite a few jump scares, etc.

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    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited July 2019
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Thirith wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    and I'm never going to be able to play a VR horror game

    I would die. My heart would stop.
    This is to some extent why I'm glad/sad that Resident Evil 7 VR doesn't exist on PC. I love how tactile the locations look and I think that this would translate really well to VR. The actual game, though, and in particular its brand of horror? Nope. Nope, nope, nope, and triply so in VR.

    It's not really that scary of a game, even in VR.

    Or at least I think so. I thought it was about as scary as RE4 when it first came out: that first hour of dread, and then exactly what you'd expect from a Resident Evil game in first person.

    I definitely disagree with this, RE7 is way scarier. Except for maybe the Regenerators. RE4 is an action game with some horror elements, RE7 is terrifying. I didn't realize it wasn't on PC for VR though, that's a little disappointing I was hoping to try that for maybe 5 minutes sometime.

    Re7:
    Has the dad stalking you around, your hand getting cut off in first person, quite a few jump scares, etc.

    Yeah, I don't find those particularly scary--but then again, the Regenerators weren't particularly scary either. Different scary strokes, I suppose.

    Emily Wants to Play VR was, for me, scary in a way Resident Evil 7 VR never was.

    Synthesis on
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    taliosfalcontaliosfalcon Registered User regular
    The quest got me back onto the VR train full hype so I went and picked up a Rift S...turns out I can't use the rift S due to my small PD (58) so had to return it and back to my CV1 for now. sigh.. god dammit oculus.

    steam xbox - adeptpenguin
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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    My index will be here tomorrow, hooray! Now the eager wait for the No Mans Sky VR update can begin. I have a bunch of stuff going on this week, but my PC building urge is getting very strong. I know I'm going to want to max the hell out of NMS, so it's only a matter of time.

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    ZavianZavian universal peace sounds better than forever war Registered User regular
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    FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited July 2019
    The Index is pretty great so far! I put it on and had no issues finding the sweet spot, which seems to come up a lot. It was immediately obvious that the optics were improved -- initially I could tell but it didn't really blow me away, but then you notice that reading text is so much better. You can 100% browse the forum or anything else in virtual desktop if you're so inclined. The screendoor effect was always most noticeable on text to me, and now you can't tell at all.

    I initially didn't plan on getting the controllers but wound up grabbing the bundle with them at the last minute. Being able to open handed throw stuff in Superhot is amazing -- that immediately sold the concept for me, and it works great. Initially it was getting my fingers mixed up on the tracking, but there does just seem to be a calibration period -- after a few minutes it reliably follows my fingers. I'm going to try Elite later in the day after I have a few friends over and have time to move the sensors to my desktop, and I can already tell it's going to look great based on the improvements I've seen so far.

    The camera is also usable now! I pull it up and can actually do things without it being super low res and screendor-ey; my dog was very happy to get pets in the middle of my session.

    Fiatil on
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