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[WoW] Battle for Azeroth has landed!

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    JavenJaven Registered User regular
    The community link is https://blizzard.com/invite/4DBAqq5fJM4

    It's set to have unlimited uses and never expire; is there a chance we could get it @Roe

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    JavenJaven Registered User regular
    I also changed the name since I don't actually think it's mostly Shambler Milk anymore

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    SpawnbrokerSpawnbroker Registered User regular
    Sweet, I will try out that link tonight. Sorry for all the confusion, didn't know there was already a community!

    Steam: Spawnbroker
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    November FifthNovember Fifth Registered User regular
    Dac wrote: »
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    Velen is no longer an Alliance. He has moved strongly into the Neutral Khadgar world-saving faction. They're like the Justice League.

    Okay, when can *I* join that faction?

    Maybe next epac. I don't think it's out of the question for the game to be rebalanced around Light and Void factions or move into some sort of post faction system. Especially since we will have Classic for players who are invested in the faction war.

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    MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    Something devil's advocate that popped into my head this morning while I was getting ready for work. Like, I know it's unlikely, but we're all making a few assumptions about how this all ends, many of them involving a return to status quo or Sylvanas getting deposed/beaten.

    What if the Horde wins?

    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
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    hippofanthippofant ティンク Registered User regular
    edited August 2018
    LD50 wrote: »
    Bizazedo wrote: »
    I'm confused about people asking about the blight. Isn't it just the blight that's been around since Wrathgate and was also used / referenced in Cataclysm?

    Who knows really. The blight used at wrathgate destroyed even undead in a way that kept them from being resurrected. Sylvanas was clearly able to use her evil cutscene magic to resurrect the soldiers slain by this blight.

    She didn't resurrect them, she just animated their remains.
    Except then that blight would have melted them all. Also all the Horde players who ran into it with gas masks.


    Maybe they diluted it or whatever, but none of this shit is explained, so, again, I'm just taking the blight usage in Lordaeron to just be a really powerful bomb analogue. Initially, I thought Saurfang was complaining about Sylvanas' use of the blight and whatnot... but upon closer reading, he is not. He doesn't even give a shit that Sylvanas used the blight on the battlefield. He's mad at the fact that Sylvanas is retreating. He wants them to all die "with honor" in defense of Undercity.

    hippofant on
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    NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    The Blight has the qualities that the writers need at that time.

    It can be an aerosol version of Ebola , a poison gas, or a localized version of the 40k life eater virus, and all in the same zone storyline

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    LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
    MuddBudd wrote: »
    Something devil's advocate that popped into my head this morning while I was getting ready for work. Like, I know it's unlikely, but we're all making a few assumptions about how this all ends, many of them involving a return to status quo or Sylvanas getting deposed/beaten.

    What if the Horde wins?

    What is winning?

    We don't really even know what the stakes are. There's just a lot of escalation and hurt feelings, but why?

    This conflict isn't really even that defined.

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    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    x5nihbzcir6j.png
    I was thinking about that and there's an added implication that she also bombed / caved the city in. Sylvanas is totally into destroying capital cities now, especially if it means her enemies can't use them.

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    SniperGuySniperGuy SniperGuyGaming Registered User regular
    edited August 2018
    You can see in the cutscene that Jaina
    Only temporarily froze that blight. It's all cloudy and hanging in the air. I'm guessing it eventually unfreezes and becomes an issue again. Freezing the entire city is probably out of the question. I didn't have a problem with it.

    As far as Sylvanas
    from the Alliance perspective she definitely caved in the undercity. Scorched Earth tactics are what she was going for. Saurfang objected to her killing all the wounded and those that couldn't get out in time. "If we can't have it, no one will" seems to be her plan.

    Also screw her for being all "you come to take what is mine?" Fuck you lady that was ours way before y'all rolled in with green sludge everywhere

    SniperGuy on
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    LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
    I mean, I'm still annoyed that Sylvanas is the faction leader of the Forsaken, since she herself is not a Forsaken. She's a banshee that has possessed her own corpse. She's a ghost.

    The Forsaken aren't ghosts.

    Also, why aren't there Forsake of other races besides humans?

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    reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    Also I guess Tyrande was too busy doting over Malfypoo to participate in the siege. I mean it's no big deal, Sylvanas just burned down your home and turned your people into an endangered species, feel free to sit this one out, general.

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    hippofanthippofant ティンク Registered User regular
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    I mean, I'm still annoyed that Sylvanas is the faction leader of the Forsaken, since she herself is not a Forsaken. She's a banshee that has possessed her own corpse. She's a ghost.

    The Forsaken aren't ghosts.

    Also, why aren't there Forsake of other races besides humans?

    Sylvanas is a banshee ghost because Arthas intentionally made her that.

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    Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    edited August 2018
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    I mean, I'm still annoyed that Sylvanas is the faction leader of the Forsaken, since she herself is not a Forsaken. She's a banshee that has possessed her own corpse. She's a ghost.

    The Forsaken aren't ghosts.

    Also, why aren't there Forsake of other races besides humans?

    That's an....odd complaint given she literally founded the nation of the Forsaken.

    The Forsaken covers all manner of undead that are free of the Scourge, you just play as the humanoid ones.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
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    BigityBigity Lubbock, TXRegistered User regular
    KiTA wrote: »
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    I'm probably just being unnecessarily grumpy here, since I pretty much don't like anything about BfA at this point...

    But I don't like the retcon of Jaina's imagery. She's not the ship mage. She hasn't been the ship mage. And this whole thing calling her the "Daughter of the Sea" and having her sail in with a giant magic boat is just all wrong. That is not who Jaina is. She is a member of the Kirin Tor and she wears a pant suit, and boats have never been a part of who she is.

    And I'm not talking about her being from Kul Tiras. That is established. But she's never used the iconography of her people. Not once. And now out of the blue they have changed her entire image and it's super annoying. Especially since right now, in pre-patch week 3 the Kul'Tirans are not even a part of the story. Not yet.



    It would make sense to have her start being the Boat Mage after a reunion with her mother and homeland. But they are doing it in the wrong order.

    J'Elsa. Let it boat, let it boat...

    The blight never bothered me anyway.

    Seriously, so far BFA has been pretty stupid. From their treatment of Sylvanas to trying to retcon Jaina into the boatmage and turning Anduin into... whatever that was in those cutscenes (because it wasn't Anduin).

    Only saving grace is that supposedly there's a hint in the novel / novellas that
    Azurite apparently fucks with your head pretty hard, turning you into an exaggerated version of yourself... and both Anduin and Sylvanas handled Azurite.
    If so... ok, that makes more sense.

    You know, I was doing that scenario and my 6 year old daughter walked by and got excited that I was watching something with Elsa in it. I facepalmed.

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    BigityBigity Lubbock, TXRegistered User regular
    edited August 2018
    Muzzmuzz wrote: »
    Battle for UC was a very good scenario, Horde Side.

    Still wish the two city destructions had been switched. Tweak some writing in the final cinematic, and I wouldn't feel so icky. I was with Sylvanas with her argument with Sarufang with using the Blight. After all, desperate times call for desperate measures. But..... then she had to bring up Sarufang Jr.

    Low Blow.

    Kinda peeved at the lack of dwarves so far.

    You'd think Turalyon would show up to retake Loderon too.

    Bigity on
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    BigityBigity Lubbock, TXRegistered User regular
    edited August 2018
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    Don't we already have a cross faction community that @Javen setup? Not sure we need specific ones for factions but maybe I'm wrong?

    If there's already one, I'll join that. I tried inviting a Horde friend of mine to my community and it wouldn't let me. I think Blizzard put some restrictions on it, I haven't been able to get cross-faction to work.

    I don't think that works outside of RealID groups maybe? I know a friends/family group I made lets us talk cross-faction.

    Bigity on
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    SniperGuySniperGuy SniperGuyGaming Registered User regular
    Alleria was involved so yeah where the hell is Turalyon? Are they still hanging out on Argus for some reason?

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    BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User, Moderator mod
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    I mean, I'm still annoyed that Sylvanas is the faction leader of the Forsaken, since she herself is not a Forsaken. She's a banshee that has possessed her own corpse. She's a ghost.

    The Forsaken aren't ghosts.

    Also, why aren't there Forsake of other races besides humans?

    because they didn't have time to make more than one male and female forsaken model probably

    BahamutZERO.gif
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    CiriraCirira IowaRegistered User regular
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    I mean, I'm still annoyed that Sylvanas is the faction leader of the Forsaken, since she herself is not a Forsaken. She's a banshee that has possessed her own corpse. She's a ghost.

    The Forsaken aren't ghosts.

    Also, why aren't there Forsake of other races besides humans?

    because they didn't have time to make more than one male and female forsaken model probably

    We have alt orcs, alt elves, alt taurens, and soon to be alt trolls for the Horde. It would not surprise me if we get alt undead next since goblins would make sense being last (since they were an expansion race.

    This lines up pretty well with the alliance side as they got alt draenei, and elves first with dwarves and then human next. That would leave gnomes and worgens for the alliance left so I imagine we find some seafaring or mecho-gnomes gnomes in Kul Tiras with some alt undead (maybe something similar to Nathanos?) as well by the end of the expansion. This is assuming they don't do something weird by giving completely different races rather than continuing the alternate versions of the main races.

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    MuzzmuzzMuzzmuzz Registered User regular
    Me, watching the mid scenario cinematic: I wish my mage could summon a floating boat.

    Mr. Muzz: Well, she is an ... ARK Mage.


    I hate him....he doesn't even play the damn game

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    LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    Goblins and Worgen need model updates before they need alt races. On the goblin model in particular, try to avoid looking at their feet.

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    KyanilisKyanilis Bellevue, WARegistered User regular
    Cirira wrote: »
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    I mean, I'm still annoyed that Sylvanas is the faction leader of the Forsaken, since she herself is not a Forsaken. She's a banshee that has possessed her own corpse. She's a ghost.

    The Forsaken aren't ghosts.

    Also, why aren't there Forsake of other races besides humans?

    because they didn't have time to make more than one male and female forsaken model probably

    We have alt orcs, alt elves, alt taurens, and soon to be alt trolls for the Horde. It would not surprise me if we get alt undead next since goblins would make sense being last (since they were an expansion race.

    This lines up pretty well with the alliance side as they got alt draenei, and elves first with dwarves and then human next. That would leave gnomes and worgens for the alliance left so I imagine we find some seafaring or mecho-gnomes gnomes in Kul Tiras with some alt undead (maybe something similar to Nathanos?) as well by the end of the expansion. This is assuming they don't do something weird by giving completely different races rather than continuing the alternate versions of the main races.

    I think if mechagnomes were made an allied race I could never play anything else.

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    cursedkingcursedking Registered User regular
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    MuddBudd wrote: »
    Something devil's advocate that popped into my head this morning while I was getting ready for work. Like, I know it's unlikely, but we're all making a few assumptions about how this all ends, many of them involving a return to status quo or Sylvanas getting deposed/beaten.

    What if the Horde wins?

    What is winning?

    We don't really even know what the stakes are. There's just a lot of escalation and hurt feelings, but why?

    This conflict isn't really even that defined.

    This is the real issue at the heart of the story. The azurite is being treated as a nuclear armament that has pushed slyvana into making preemptive strikes. By we’re not shown why she thinks this is worse than any other magical weapon or why she thinks the alliance is going to strike them in a similar way when anduin is such a peace boy.

    Her arc as far as I can tell is about her concern that the forsaken have no way to reproduce, but this doesn’t seem to advance that goal at all. There’s not enough lifting done either to show why she’s evil, like what her ultimate goal actually is, or why she feels forced into extreme action (even if those actions are ultimately indefensible).

    Types: Boom + Robo | Food: Sweet | Habitat: Plains
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    Eat it You Nasty Pig.Eat it You Nasty Pig. tell homeland security 'we are the bomb'Registered User regular
    I gotta be honest, when the flying ship showed up with the purpley guns I was pretty into it

    ...

    on another note, I'm pretty disappointed we seem to have gone this whole cycle without some sort of 'jet fuel can't melt steel beams' meme w/r/t teldrassil

    hold your head high soldier, it ain't over yet
    that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
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    hippofanthippofant ティンク Registered User regular
    cursedking wrote: »
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    MuddBudd wrote: »
    Something devil's advocate that popped into my head this morning while I was getting ready for work. Like, I know it's unlikely, but we're all making a few assumptions about how this all ends, many of them involving a return to status quo or Sylvanas getting deposed/beaten.

    What if the Horde wins?

    What is winning?

    We don't really even know what the stakes are. There's just a lot of escalation and hurt feelings, but why?

    This conflict isn't really even that defined.

    This is the real issue at the heart of the story. The azurite is being treated as a nuclear armament that has pushed slyvana into making preemptive strikes. By we’re not shown why she thinks this is worse than any other magical weapon or why she thinks the alliance is going to strike them in a similar way when anduin is such a peace boy.

    Her arc as far as I can tell is about her concern that the forsaken have no way to reproduce, but this doesn’t seem to advance that goal at all. There’s not enough lifting done either to show why she’s evil, like what her ultimate goal actually is, or why she feels forced into extreme action (even if those actions are ultimately indefensible).

    Can't the Forsaken just reproduce infinitely by... you know, waiting? Heck, get Gallywix on it. There's probably money to be made even from turning people with terminal diseases into Forsaken.

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    MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    MuddBudd wrote: »
    Something devil's advocate that popped into my head this morning while I was getting ready for work. Like, I know it's unlikely, but we're all making a few assumptions about how this all ends, many of them involving a return to status quo or Sylvanas getting deposed/beaten.

    What if the Horde wins?

    What is winning?

    We don't really even know what the stakes are. There's just a lot of escalation and hurt feelings, but why?

    This conflict isn't really even that defined.

    The end of the Alliance, the conquering of the Alliance races. That's her explicit goal in the novellas.

    Pre-emptive conquering before they do it to the Horde, because in her mind that is inevitable.

    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
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    3cl1ps33cl1ps3 I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    Basically they've made her into Magneto.

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    BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User, Moderator mod
    I gotta be honest, when the flying ship showed up with the purpley guns I was pretty into it

    ...

    on another note, I'm pretty disappointed we seem to have gone this whole cycle without some sort of 'jet fuel can't melt steel beams' meme w/r/t teldrassil

    goblin rocket fuel can't melt druid dreams

    BahamutZERO.gif
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    Jealous DevaJealous Deva Registered User regular
    LD50 wrote: »
    Goblins and Worgen need model updates before they need alt races. On the goblin model in particular, try to avoid looking at their feet.

    I tend to go out of the way to find robes/kilts/skirts for my male worgen because their legs look so damn weird.

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    hippofanthippofant ティンク Registered User regular
    3clipse wrote: »
    Basically they've made her into Magneto.

    Magneto's motivations have always been pretty transparent and obvious. We've seen him engage in deep philosophical conversations with Xavier about them. And there's never been a hint that Magneto's lost his mind, been corrupted, or is secretly working for some other dark mysterious force.

    In a lot of ways right now, Sylvanas is being written as an antagonist rather than a protagonist. Which is problematic when half the playerbase is "on her side."

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    MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    3clipse wrote: »
    Basically they've made her into Magneto.

    Sassy Magneto.

    Seriously not only is this writing weird, I have never seen this much personality from her EVER.

    It's always just been deadpan "I need to save the Forsaken" and smoldering with generic rage. Her taunting Anduin like that is just... strange. Funny, but super weird.

    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
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    CiriraCirira IowaRegistered User regular
    MuddBudd wrote: »
    3clipse wrote: »
    Basically they've made her into Magneto.

    Sassy Magneto.

    Seriously not only is this writing weird, I have never seen this much personality from her EVER.

    It's always just been deadpan "I need to save the Forsaken" and smoldering with generic rage. Her taunting Anduin like that is just... strange. Funny, but super weird.

    The taunting Anduin is very much in line with her taunting Arthas (who Anduin is almost mirroring in the cinematic as some people have pointed out). The reason she gets turned into the Banshee is that she pissed Arthas off so much with the defense of Silvermoon and her taunting that he basically said "You don't get to stay dead, I created a special hell for you" and made her into who she is now.

    It's in line with who she was in War3 but that characterization has been completely missing in WoW to this point that I can recall.

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    EnclaveofGnomesEnclaveofGnomes Registered User regular
    s
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    You can see in the cutscene that Jaina
    Only temporarily froze that blight. It's all cloudy and hanging in the air. I'm guessing it eventually unfreezes and becomes an issue again. Freezing the entire city is probably out of the question. I didn't have a problem with it.

    As far as Sylvanas
    from the Alliance perspective she definitely caved in the undercity. Scorched Earth tactics are what she was going for. Saurfang objected to her killing all the wounded and those that couldn't get out in time. "If we can't have it, no one will" seems to be her plan.

    Also screw her for being all "you come to take what is mine?" Fuck you lady that was ours way before y'all rolled in with green sludge everywhere

    She sets off more blight though. Jaina clearly got rid of some of it, you charge right through where it was.

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    hippofanthippofant ティンク Registered User regular
    edited August 2018
    MuddBudd wrote: »
    3clipse wrote: »
    Basically they've made her into Magneto.

    Sassy Magneto.

    Seriously not only is this writing weird, I have never seen this much personality from her EVER.

    It's always just been deadpan "I need to save the Forsaken" and smoldering with generic rage. Her taunting Anduin like that is just... strange. Funny, but super weird.

    My reading of that scene was that she was putting on a show just to provoke the Alliance leaders. She was intentionally going out of her way to ham it up, and then once that was over it was back to being her usual no nonsense badass bitch.

    Reminded me of Hexadecimal from Reboot. (Well, she was actually crazy, mind you, but....)

    hippofant on
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    SniperGuySniperGuy SniperGuyGaming Registered User regular
    s
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    You can see in the cutscene that Jaina
    Only temporarily froze that blight. It's all cloudy and hanging in the air. I'm guessing it eventually unfreezes and becomes an issue again. Freezing the entire city is probably out of the question. I didn't have a problem with it.

    As far as Sylvanas
    from the Alliance perspective she definitely caved in the undercity. Scorched Earth tactics are what she was going for. Saurfang objected to her killing all the wounded and those that couldn't get out in time. "If we can't have it, no one will" seems to be her plan.

    Also screw her for being all "you come to take what is mine?" Fuck you lady that was ours way before y'all rolled in with green sludge everywhere

    She sets off more blight though. Jaina clearly got rid of some of it, you charge right through where it was.

    You charge through
    a big frozen cloud that can't hurt you because it's frozen. It's all foggy. I'm guessing it'll unfreeze and be pretty bad for the surrounding plants. Sylvanas let a LOT more loose into the undercity. Jaina's was a temp fix, not a permanent removal.

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    EnclaveofGnomesEnclaveofGnomes Registered User regular
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    s
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    You can see in the cutscene that Jaina
    Only temporarily froze that blight. It's all cloudy and hanging in the air. I'm guessing it eventually unfreezes and becomes an issue again. Freezing the entire city is probably out of the question. I didn't have a problem with it.

    As far as Sylvanas
    from the Alliance perspective she definitely caved in the undercity. Scorched Earth tactics are what she was going for. Saurfang objected to her killing all the wounded and those that couldn't get out in time. "If we can't have it, no one will" seems to be her plan.

    Also screw her for being all "you come to take what is mine?" Fuck you lady that was ours way before y'all rolled in with green sludge everywhere

    She sets off more blight though. Jaina clearly got rid of some of it, you charge right through where it was.

    You charge through
    a big frozen cloud that can't hurt you because it's frozen. It's all foggy. I'm guessing it'll unfreeze and be pretty bad for the surrounding plants. Sylvanas let a LOT more loose into the undercity. Jaina's was a temp fix, not a permanent removal.

    What indication is there that it'll return to its previous state?

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    SniperGuySniperGuy SniperGuyGaming Registered User regular
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    s
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    You can see in the cutscene that Jaina
    Only temporarily froze that blight. It's all cloudy and hanging in the air. I'm guessing it eventually unfreezes and becomes an issue again. Freezing the entire city is probably out of the question. I didn't have a problem with it.

    As far as Sylvanas
    from the Alliance perspective she definitely caved in the undercity. Scorched Earth tactics are what she was going for. Saurfang objected to her killing all the wounded and those that couldn't get out in time. "If we can't have it, no one will" seems to be her plan.

    Also screw her for being all "you come to take what is mine?" Fuck you lady that was ours way before y'all rolled in with green sludge everywhere

    She sets off more blight though. Jaina clearly got rid of some of it, you charge right through where it was.

    You charge through
    a big frozen cloud that can't hurt you because it's frozen. It's all foggy. I'm guessing it'll unfreeze and be pretty bad for the surrounding plants. Sylvanas let a LOT more loose into the undercity. Jaina's was a temp fix, not a permanent removal.

    What indication is there that it'll return to its previous state?

    What indication is there that it won't?

    We may find out one way or the other, but every other ice nova spell only freezes things temporarily, not forever. There's clearly frozen bad guys in there too, so we know it's ice magic. Logically it makes sense to me.

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    OwenashiOwenashi Registered User regular
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    s
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    You can see in the cutscene that Jaina
    Only temporarily froze that blight. It's all cloudy and hanging in the air. I'm guessing it eventually unfreezes and becomes an issue again. Freezing the entire city is probably out of the question. I didn't have a problem with it.

    As far as Sylvanas
    from the Alliance perspective she definitely caved in the undercity. Scorched Earth tactics are what she was going for. Saurfang objected to her killing all the wounded and those that couldn't get out in time. "If we can't have it, no one will" seems to be her plan.

    Also screw her for being all "you come to take what is mine?" Fuck you lady that was ours way before y'all rolled in with green sludge everywhere

    She sets off more blight though. Jaina clearly got rid of some of it, you charge right through where it was.

    You charge through
    a big frozen cloud that can't hurt you because it's frozen. It's all foggy. I'm guessing it'll unfreeze and be pretty bad for the surrounding plants. Sylvanas let a LOT more loose into the undercity. Jaina's was a temp fix, not a permanent removal.

    What indication is there that it'll return to its previous state?
    Well, you can always visit the Glades and see it still there.

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    EncEnc A Fool with Compassion Pronouns: He, Him, HisRegistered User regular
    "One more thing in Lordaeron for the Emerald Circle and Argent Dawn to clear up." A tired looking clerk says, looking out from a tower in Hearthglenn with a spyglass.

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