[Australian & NZ Politics] Australia Decided. Hm.

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  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    The dairies is good news for me.

    My flatmate is being a muppet, fussing about how much they might be able to carry etc for shopping, and wanting to go into bloody town to do the shopping. (Because going to the new world in town is sure going to work out and not feature them being picked clean at all)

    I mean while am in the vulnerable population, already have some sort of cold/sniffles, and no access to car etc. Mind, flatmate dosent either, but they're much healthier than i. Grrrrarrrgh

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  • GvzbgulGvzbgul Ask me about my scrotalist agenda Registered User regular
    I know its my lizard brain but I hope there is some kind of punishment for the Warehouse beyond being told no.

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  • KelorKelor Registered User regular
    Everyone with a job is an essential worker.

    Get fucked Scomo.

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  • lonelyahavalonelyahava Call me Ahava Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    oh good no food delivery.

    that will stop us from having to hand deliver the Uber eats Pita pit to the neighbour since the delivery folks never ever get the right house.

  • FishmanFishman The most famous of which is "Never get involved in a land war in Asia!" HAHAHAHAHAHAH-Registered User regular
    exis wrote: »
    Some clarifications on what will and won't be open during the lockdown: https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/120512184/coronavirus-what-stores-and-services-are-still-open-during-lockdown
    * Dairies to stay open, with "one-in one-out" rule·

    * Food delivery prohibited, except meals on wheels and delivery of food not pre-cooked

    * Liquor stores closed, unless within a Licensing Trust Area and with "one-in one-out" rule

    * Self-service laundries can stay open, two-metre physical distancing to be enforced·
    All good to see. Pisses me off that the Warehouse earlier announced that they considered themselves an essential service and would be open. We really do not need retailers actively contributing to the confusion like that.
    Gvzbgul wrote: »
    I know its my lizard brain but I hope there is some kind of punishment for the Warehouse beyond being told no.

    I doubt it's that simple. There are plenty of essentials that people will need that aren't available at supermarkets, because in general they're not perishable - but if this lockdown extends, people are going to start needing heaters, blankets, and warm clothes when the cold snaps start (yes, some supermarkets carry these too, but I doubt their supply chain is set up to supply these things at a nationwide scale). There are real public health issues associated with having people locked down inside our worst housing stocks heading into winter and I don't doubt that this advice was forwarded to cabinet before decisions were made. I suspect that the decision was still up in the air throughout the day as to whether The Warehouse was needed to be locked down, because it does fall into a grey area, where the costs to removing those stores from availablity come much closer to the meeting the necessary standard than some other, more straight-forward choices - deciding where to set the bar is not simple, and I'm inclined not to start jumping at the big red shed because they too form an important component of our communities as well.

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  • exisexis Registered User regular
    edited March 24
    That's all true, but the right way to approach that is for the Warehouse to announce that they are seeking clarification from the government, and will update once they have it, not to declare themselves essential.
    In a trading update issued to the NZX, the company said it Warehouse stores fell under the Government's "essential services" criteria, as it provided a range of consumer goods essential for maintaining the wellbeing of people such as food and beverage, groceries, cleaning items, health and beauty items including toiletries, winter essentials.
    (edit: this was prior to the government announcement yesterday that TWH would not be opening)

    I fully anticipate that the essential service definition will need to be expanded as this continues on, which I think the government has been transparent about. But there is definitely a slippery slope involved. If the Warehouse is opened because it sells winter essentials, the same criteria would cover Kmart, Farmers, Briscoes, etc . I don't know how they'll manage that sort of issue but everything needs to be assumed closed by default, and only opened up by exception.

    exis on
    Gvzbgul
  • FishmanFishman The most famous of which is "Never get involved in a land war in Asia!" HAHAHAHAHAHAH-Registered User regular
    exis wrote: »
    That's all true, but the right way to approach that is for the Warehouse to announce that they are seeking clarification from the government, and will update once they have it, not to declare themselves essential.
    In a trading update issued to the NZX, the company said it Warehouse stores fell under the Government's "essential services" criteria, as it provided a range of consumer goods essential for maintaining the wellbeing of people such as food and beverage, groceries, cleaning items, health and beauty items including toiletries, winter essentials.
    (edit: this was prior to the government announcement yesterday that TWH would not be opening)

    I fully anticipate that the essential service definition will need to be expanded as this continues on, which I think the government has been transparent about. But there is definitely a slippery slope involved. If the Warehouse is opened because it sells winter essentials, the same criteria would cover Kmart, Farmers, Briscoes, etc . I don't know how they'll manage that sort of issue but everything needs to be assumed closed by default, and only opened up by exception.

    Also true, but there's an implicit assumption there that they didn't seek an indication from government prior to announcement (or try to) and recieved preliminary advice that ultimately proved inaccurate. These things are definitely occurring.

    To clarify, I used winter essentials as an example; don't get hung up on it. As pointed out, The Warehouse also supplies a number of grocery and household supplies that are essential. It does move The Warehouse much closer to a bright line test than most of the other department stores. I'm also not sure how many emergency hardship grants are processed through The Warehouse, but I suspect it's a not-insiginificant number. These would be, by definition, essential goods. The question becomes then, whether it is a reasonable action to consider themselves essential based on the information made available to them at the time and I'm not sure it's as cut and dried as people make out.

    I'm not saying we can't eye it with suspicion, but I am saying maybe we can pause and not rush to breaking out the torches and pitchforks straightaway.

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  • exisexis Registered User regular
    Yep, that's fair. I was more jumping on the winter essentials issue because I think it does pose an interesting problem for the coming weeks. The weather is starting to turn (we have been running the heating in our home in Christchurch for the first time this year). A lot of families do not have the disposable income to be prepared with heaters/blankets etc and will find themselves suddenly needing to purchase items that aren't really contained within the existing essential service list.

    I know retailers like Bunnings/Mitre 10 will be open but restricted to selling to tradies who are in turn supposed to be doing something essential. Maybe they will do something similar for cases like these - e.g. Warehouse can open but will only sell ****. Problem is that will lead to hordes of people turning up wanting to buy TV's and crap, because people are dumb.

  • AegeriAegeri Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    Looking at the two countries here, I feel NZ has got a clearer and more forceful current response than Australia.

    I seriously am becoming very worried now, because it looks like Morrison et al are making shit up as they go along. Things are just being closed at bloody random. You might as well envisage them throwing darts at a board with different kinds of businesses on it. You can have 10 people at a personal trainer boot camp, but no more than 5 at a wedding. How were those numbers derived!?!?!

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  • TefTef Registered User regular
    I've got to move into my new house on the 5th of April.

  • tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    My stuff is arriving tomorrow, having travelled through who knows how many states with who knows how many people.
    ... I should probably give everything a once-over with a household cleaner when it gets here.

    chrishallett83
  • plufimplufim Dr Registered User regular
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  • MorganVMorganV Registered User regular
    plufim wrote: »

    Wait, what?

    Scientists (of the appropriate fields), doctors, experts/bureaucrats in government and transport (with a focus on freight). And that should be pretty much it.

    Business interests, especially mining? Need to fuck right off. It's frustrating how the shamelessness of conservatives is just becoming so much more blatant and pronounced.

  • VikingViking Registered User regular
    pretty obvious where the governments interest/loyalty lies

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  • -Loki--Loki- Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining. Registered User regular
    edited March 25
    Deputy Chief Medical Commissioner has said that the majority of cases so far have come from overseas.

    Which would be great except they only test you at hospital if you’ve been overseas in the last 14 days or have been in contact with a confirmed case, or require hospitalisation due to an unknown pneumonia.

    What else were they expecting statistically with those limitations?

    -Loki- on
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  • TeeManTeeMan BrainSpoon Registered User regular
    I almost got through the entire message delivered by the PM last night to my work crew this morning before saying, "fuck it just stay at home when you're not here and don't be at work when we tell you or if you don't want to be".

    Who honestly gives a fuck about having 5 people at a wedding but 10 people at a funeral, about going out for a haircut but not nail treatments. I got a call from my dentist to reschedule my appointment for 6 months time - despite how painful granular and nit-picky in his ramble, he missed that and probably a hundred other things because of course you'd need to speak for 24hrs straight to get all the edge cases.

    I also like how his new national commission whose sole purpose is to give one unified message was undermined by the state's before the first meeting and then Scotty saying that it's up to the state's what they ultimately want to do. GG on the messaging there too

    Firm, direct, simple. Stay at home. Come on mate, this was your day job at one stage, apparently

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  • AegeriAegeri Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    edited March 25
    It’s even worse when the individual states are doing different things as well. Nobody is consistent.

    Aegeri on
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  • MorganVMorganV Registered User regular
    Aegeri wrote: »
    It’s even worse when the individual states are doing different things as well. Nobody is consistent.

    Also when they waffle with terms. I had to put my motorcycle in for a service this week (my only means of transport, as I do night shift at a hospital), and had no idea if I'd be able to put my bike in, or get it out, as I had no idea if that business qualified as "non-essential" or not. Use of vague terms, when talking about such stark consequences (business closures), just gets people overly stressed.

  • chrishallett83chrishallett83 A dagger in the dark is worth a thousand swords in the morningRegistered User regular
    Aegeri wrote: »
    Looking at the two countries here, I feel NZ has got a clearer and more forceful current response than Australia.

    I seriously am becoming very worried now, because it looks like Morrison et al are making shit up as they go along. Things are just being closed at bloody random. You might as well envisage them throwing darts at a board with different kinds of businesses on it. You can have 10 people at a personal trainer boot camp, but no more than 5 at a wedding. How were those numbers derived!?!?!

    Haircuts, perfectly safe up to 30 minutes.

    31 minutes?

    Nope, you've got the 'Rona!

  • tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    I saw a parody video of the announcement before I saw the real one and was like "oh, ha I guess, bit excessively silly"
    ... Then I saw the real one and was like "WAIT THAT WAS BARELY PARODY"

    chrishallett83
  • AntoshkaAntoshka Miauen Oil Change LazarusRegistered User regular
    tynic wrote: »
    I saw a parody video of the announcement before I saw the real one and was like "oh, ha I guess, bit excessively silly"
    ... Then I saw the real one and was like "WAIT THAT WAS BARELY PARODY"

    Let's be fair - this has been a problem with Parody of Australian government for a while. It's a difficult place for political satirists and comedians, I'd guess.

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  • lonelyahavalonelyahava Call me Ahava Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    Copying from the SE thread, in case there are folks that don't read that one

    So also for some insight to potentially essential services, The internet.

    Chorus will still be working (which means I am still working). Chorus will be giving priority for fieldwork in a specific manner

    Faults on the line
    Customers without any internet services New Connection orders
    Upgrades from Copper to Fibre


    Modem dispatch is still ongoing, although likely at a slower pace than previously.

    Anybody NZ based that has questions about internet (specifically fibre) continuity, hit me up. I'll do my best to answer without bogging y'all down or ruining corporate stuff.

  • plufimplufim Dr Registered User regular
    edited March 25
    Antoshka wrote: »
    tynic wrote: »
    I saw a parody video of the announcement before I saw the real one and was like "oh, ha I guess, bit excessively silly"
    ... Then I saw the real one and was like "WAIT THAT WAS BARELY PARODY"

    Let's be fair - this has been a problem with Parody of Australian government for a while. It's a difficult place for political satirists and comedians, I'd guess.

    Jesus christ, a day later and they're relaxing some of the new rules. Hairdresser and funeral rules are different.

    STOP CONFUSING PEOPLE. JUST MAKE A SIMPLE ANNOUNCEMENT.

    plufim on
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  • lonelyahavalonelyahava Call me Ahava Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    edited March 25
    The shooter for the Chch mosque attacks as plead guilty to all charges.

    Edit: warning. The face of evil is visible in the article.

    lonelyahava on
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  • GvzbgulGvzbgul Ask me about my scrotalist agenda Registered User regular
    I find his face so much more pathetic than his blacked out face. It's weird, they used the same picture that was first released, him in the antisuicide outfit flanked by guards. It's interesting that he looked quite intimidating with his face blurred out, in fact that picture was used in various white supremacist internet memes. But uncensored he looks well pathetic, it's a good photo they chose of him, he isn't smirking or anything, he's just looking up at the judge with a "I'm fucked" expression. I wonder why he plead guilty? He seemed intent on dragging it out kicking and screaming before. Maybe the court restrictions were going to prevent him from using it as a soapbox. Or maybe the virus overshadows everything and he knew he wouldn't get much attention. Which would be one positive from this current epidemic.

    lonelyahava
  • AegeriAegeri Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    Jacinta sitting up at home just answering peoples questions is the leadership we need right now.

    Rather than changing minds every few seconds.

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  • plufimplufim Dr Registered User regular
    It's the difference between a leader who believes the economy is there to serve the people, and a leader who believes the reverse.

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  • -Loki--Loki- Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining. Registered User regular
    My fiancée goes to a local hairdresser who closed last night and messaged his regular clients that 30 minutes is not enough to do anything more than a basic haircut so he was closed for the foreseeable future. Given that he has staff he probably had to have hard talks with about it, Morrison’s ‘lol joking no 30 minute restriction’ the very next day probably made his life even more complicated today.

    Morrison is so bad at everything.

  • exisexis Registered User regular
    Where did the 30 minute number even come from?

    Also based on conversations I have had with co-workers over here in NZ, where we have received reasonably straight-forward instructions (stay at home unless you getting groceries/medicine, a walk around the block for exercise is OK), people will fixate on details and misunderstand wherever possible. "They said exercise is OK - so I'm going to head to the bike park after work"

    So I can only assume that there are a bunch of people out there who heard the <30min hairdresser thing and are convinced that as long as you spend less than 30min with someone there's no risk. Nice one, Scotty.

  • Sanguinius666264Sanguinius666264 Registered User regular
    My wife is a hairdresser - we don't really know if she should work or not. We're in the ACT, she's largely by herself in her salon, so she can space out clients, sanitise afterwards and work. The 30 minutes thing meant she couldn't really do that. It's pretty clear Scotty from Marketing didn't really consult anyone about it - I don't really understand why hairdressers are open at all, given that nail salons and stuff aren't.

    TeeMan
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  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    exis wrote: »
    Where did the 30 minute number even come from?

    Also based on conversations I have had with co-workers over here in NZ, where we have received reasonably straight-forward instructions (stay at home unless you getting groceries/medicine, a walk around the block for exercise is OK), people will fixate on details and misunderstand wherever possible. "They said exercise is OK - so I'm going to head to the bike park after work"

    So I can only assume that there are a bunch of people out there who heard the <30min hairdresser thing and are convinced that as long as you spend less than 30min with someone there's no risk. Nice one, Scotty.

    Yeah, i went out for a walk to the shops and back today, and there were a lot of people out walking/running, some etc. People seemed to be mainting distance etc, but it was suprsing just how many people were out.

    Mostly people seemed to have goals though, so that's good.

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  • plufimplufim Dr Registered User regular
    edited March 27
    plufim on
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  • VivixenneVivixenne Remember your training, and we'll get through this just fine. Registered User regular
    exis wrote: »
    Where did the 30 minute number even come from?
    A dude.

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  • tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited March 27
    My sister said her only coherent takeaway from the PM's instructions was that the whole country should have "buzzcuts on top, but a full bush"

    tynic on
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  • chrishallett83chrishallett83 A dagger in the dark is worth a thousand swords in the morningRegistered User regular
    tynic wrote: »
    My sister said her only coherent takeaway from the PM's instructions was that the whole country should have "buzzcuts on top, but a full bush"

    Well it is ScumMo - nobody should ever touch their evil naughty no-no region, or allow anyone else to touch their evil naughty no-no region, because that's how the devil gets to you.

  • plufimplufim Dr Registered User regular

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  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    The thing I'm missing most on day three of lockdown is takeout.

    Got some persistent cold, and I just wanna order a burger or some butter chicken and naan

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  • TefTef Registered User regular
    Mmm chicken and naan. We’re trying to do up stew type meals to keep us going longer between cooks. Made up some spag bol earlier, gonna make up some Thai green chicken shortly

    chrishallett83
  • -Loki--Loki- Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining. Registered User regular
    The thing I'm missing most on day three of lockdown is takeout.

    Got some persistent cold, and I just wanna order a burger or some butter chicken and naan

    Menulog/Ubereats/DoorDash with a leave on arrival instruction?

    Stabbity Style
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