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President George H.W. Bush has died, age 94.

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  • JuggernutJuggernut Registered User regular
    Apparently my Aunt met Sully the Service dog as he was getting off an elevator in DC.

    Spoilerd for possible huge because mobile
    ce63tmuxri93.jpg

    All signs point to him being a very Good Boy

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  • JuggernutJuggernut Registered User regular
    TOTP Senior is dead this is the Sully thread now

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  • TraceTrace GNU Terry Pratchett; GNU Gus; GNU Carrie Fisher; GNU Adam We Registered User regular
    Damn Bob Dole looks like a corpse they dug up.

    MrVyngaard
  • BlackDragon480BlackDragon480 Bluster Kerfuffle Master of Windy ImportRegistered User regular
    Trace wrote: »
    Damn Bob Dole looks like a corpse they dug up.

    Well, the man is 95, has had limited use of his arms since being wounded in WWII 73 years ago, has survived an abdominal aneurysm surgery and hip replacement in the last 15 years, and had a roller coaster ride in public service for 60+ years.

    His body is beyond high-mileage.

    First they came for the Muslims and we said...NOT TODAY MOTHERFUCKERS!
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  • monikermoniker Registered User regular
    Juggernut wrote: »
    Apparently my Aunt met Sully the Service dog as he was getting off an elevator in DC.

    Spoilerd for possible huge because mobile
    ce63tmuxri93.jpg

    All signs point to him being a very Good Boy

    I would trust that dog to land a plane on the Hudson.

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  • KrathoonKrathoon Registered User regular
    Government people are getting up there.

    SleepiTunesIsEvil
  • Desktop HippieDesktop Hippie Registered User regular
    CBS political correspondent with photos of the moment the Trumps arrive.


    He says the Clintons don’t acknowledge them but they do, particularly Hillary who nods a greeting to both while the Obamas (who are seated next to them so I guess they drew the short straw) shake hands. NBC news have the video.


    Yes, Bill’s face is a picture and yes, the Carters blank the Trumps entirely.


  • Desktop HippieDesktop Hippie Registered User regular
    I haven’t seen anyone post this yet, so here’s George “Dubaya” Bush’s eulogy to his father, via the Associated Press,

    The start will have you gritting your teeth, but the ending is surprisingly affecting. George breaking down for a second or two at the very end is particularly touching.

    And yes, half of it seem like digs at Trump, but let’s be real here; anything that mentions the need to be decent, honest and dedicated to the American people seems like a dig at Trump.


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  • EncEnc A Fool with Compassion The Land of Flowers (and Dragons)Registered User regular
    Both Bushes were problematic leaders at best, but goddamn if I don't miss their brand of conservative as the opposition party we have to work against.

    Doubly so when the camera pans to Trump tapping his foot and crossing his arms petulantly.

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  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. 5386-8443-8937Registered User regular
    edited December 2018
    No, he's a war criminal. That family has left a trail of blood, death, and suffering over generations. That they genuinely feel the personal tragedy of a family member dying comfortably at 94 means nothing.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
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  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    No, he's a war criminal.

    I agree with both of you!

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  • EncEnc A Fool with Compassion The Land of Flowers (and Dragons)Registered User regular
    And so do I!

  • kaidkaid Registered User regular
    Enc wrote: »
    Both Bushes were problematic leaders at best, but goddamn if I don't miss their brand of conservative as the opposition party we have to work against.

    Doubly so when the camera pans to Trump tapping his foot and crossing his arms petulantly.

    The problem their brand of conservative opposition lead directly to what we have today. George Senior probably saw what was coming less than JR who was clearly setting the stage for what was to come.

    EncDouglasDangerMan in the MistsDesktop HippieMartini_PhilosopherCouscousMegaMek
  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    I think Newt Gingrich did more than Senior to pave the way.

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  • EncEnc A Fool with Compassion The Land of Flowers (and Dragons)Registered User regular
    edited December 2018
    To fall back on terminology I am more comfortable with, I'd rather be opposed by lawful evil villains than chaotic evil ones.

    Both are evil in their policies, but one plays by norms and thinks about maintaining their reign long term while the other wants to literally burn everything down in a hissy fit.

    Enc on
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  • PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    Enc wrote: »
    To fall back on terminology I am more comfortable with, I'd rather be opposed by lawful evil villains than chaotic evil ones.

    Both are evil in their policies, but one plays by norms and thinks about maintaining their reign long term while the other wants to literally burn everything down in a hissy fit.

    Closer watchers of politics know that the GOP has staffed its administration with chaotic evil assholes for years, relying on the moderation of leaders like Bush I and a compliant press to make sure that the only people who notice are the ones who care enough to pay attention or whose lives are directly impacted by their decisions. That all started to fall apart under Bush II, who was not smart enough to play the game, and has completed come crashing down under Trump.

    Styrofoam SammichbrynhrtmnMan in the MistsAresProphetmrondeauLoisLane
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. 5386-8443-8937Registered User regular
    Table top morality systems aside its the same exact party. Its mean spirited, cruel, blood thirsty and greedy. Changing the head from a dimwitted pseudo cowboy to a dimwitted senile life style coach didnt change anything.

    YamiB.PreacherJuliusMegaMek
  • DouglasDangerDouglasDanger PennsylvaniaRegistered User regular
    Bush Sr was an errand boy for Nixon, propped Reagan nomics for eight years before taking a half assed reversal on it, and was a war criminal, he was just as much of a shit lord as anyone else, he just had a veneer of class on top of it

    I play games on ps3 and ps4. My PSN is DouglasDanger.
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  • PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    Bush Sr was an errand boy for Nixon, propped Reagan nomics for eight years before taking a half assed reversal on it, and was a war criminal, he was just as much of a shit lord as anyone else, he just had a veneer of class on top of it

    It's what Martin Luther King referred to as the moderate preference for "a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice." Leaders like Bush I make it much easier to ignore the victims than an obvious monster like Trump.

    FencingsaxBigJoeMbrynhrtmnIncenjucarYamiB.AngelHedgieAresProphetmrondeauJuliusLoisLaneGnome-InterruptusMegaMek
  • EncEnc A Fool with Compassion The Land of Flowers (and Dragons)Registered User regular
    True, though I find the agenda of Cheney/Koch and their ilk to be substantially different in direction of evil than the Tea Party. While they created the monster, where it led has been as destructive to their power base in the end as it was as a tool against the Democrats. One could argue (and successfully, I feel) that the Tea Party was created for one conservative agenda and co-opted for another, especially in seeing how the various wings of the party operate (or, more pointedly, don't) now that they hold all branches. Though this is on a scale of pointing out that turquoise and green are similar but different shades of color. Neither are yellow.

    Casting shade on me for agreeing but having a slightly different take on that part of history I lived through, and did so while being a close watcher of politics, is sorta gross dude.

    Elvenshae
  • EncEnc A Fool with Compassion The Land of Flowers (and Dragons)Registered User regular
    And, again. I'm also talking about what we face in opposition. It is much easier to both find compromise or (more likely) to overcome an agenda with set policy goals that are specifically repugnant when your opponent is more likely to actually stay put and defend them as their legacy. Trump's brand of straight up lying and moving to a totally different tangent and not really caring about any legacy aside from his pocketbook makes working against him notoriously difficult. It also empowers his base to be for whatever he is for and against whatever he is against, rather than arguing points of policy.

    Or, rather, debating voters on the merits of the Iraq war and the economic disasters of Bush's tax and housing policies was how Bush lost power over time. But Trump doesn't care about any policy agenda in particular as his administration. Debating voters is on their feelings about Trump, not what he does, which is arguing against their emotions rather than his policies. Which is hard to oppose and sway the needle on. It's also a lot more dangerous.

    And, again, which is not to say Bush and his father weren't dangerous in their own rights. But the debates were on particulars and not personalities.

    AuralynxFencingsaxElvenshaemonikerMartini_Philosopher
  • PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    Enc wrote: »
    True, though I find the agenda of Cheney/Koch and their ilk to be substantially different in direction of evil than the Tea Party. While they created the monster, where it led has been as destructive to their power base in the end as it was as a tool against the Democrats. One could argue (and successfully, I feel) that the Tea Party was created for one conservative agenda and co-opted for another, especially in seeing how the various wings of the party operate (or, more pointedly, don't) now that they hold all branches. Though this is on a scale of pointing out that turquoise and green are similar but different shades of color. Neither are yellow.

    Casting shade on me for agreeing but having a slightly different take on that part of history I lived through, and did so while being a close watcher of politics, is sorta gross dude.

    I apologize for the offense, but I think the fact we lived through it is the problem. In the pre-social media age, it was incredibly easy to ignore the context of politics outside the snippets that you saw on the TV news or in the newspaper. If you dug deeper, you started to encounter the authors and activists who were screaming "Pay attention!" to the horrors being done to people in the name of conservative ideology. Millions suffered and died early (or were outright murdered in minority communities) to satiate conservative ideology, and the only places where you could learn this from pop culture were from the lyrics of hip hop albums.

    It's a lot harder to hide our eyes in the age of social media and camera phones.

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  • TraceTrace GNU Terry Pratchett; GNU Gus; GNU Carrie Fisher; GNU Adam We Registered User regular
    Man W. couldn't get away from Trump fast enough.

    He snuck Michelle Obama a piece of candy though.

    ElvenshaeMartini_Philosopher
  • monikermoniker Registered User regular
    edited December 2018
    Bush the Greater also actually accomplished positive change along with all of the terrible things he also did/did nothing to prevent.

    ADA
    Eliminating acid rain
    1990 Immigration Act
    Like, at least 90% of NAFTA
    How he handled the dissolution of the USSR

    That doesn't ameliorate or minimize the harms that also occurred, but those legislative accomplishments are still accomplishments. Bush the Lesser has maybe two, and Trump has zero so far to accompany all the horrors they unleashed from the hellmouth. You shouldn't applaud him, but you can't just ignore that either.

    moniker on
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  • TraceTrace GNU Terry Pratchett; GNU Gus; GNU Carrie Fisher; GNU Adam We Registered User regular
    His handling of the dissolution of the USSR and reformation of Germany can't really be faulted. I think most of Europe at that point didn't -want- a reunited Germany.

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  • EncEnc A Fool with Compassion The Land of Flowers (and Dragons)Registered User regular
    The candy/cough drop thing between Bush and Michelle is strange. And seems to have pissed off Trump from the video.

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  • ElvenshaeElvenshae Registered User regular
    Strange how?

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  • DouglasDangerDouglasDanger PennsylvaniaRegistered User regular
    Enc wrote: »
    The candy/cough drop thing between Bush and Michelle is strange. And seems to have pissed off Trump from the video.

    It's a nice snapshot of the DC ruling class that Trump campaigned against

    I play games on ps3 and ps4. My PSN is DouglasDanger.
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  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. 5386-8443-8937Registered User regular
    Enc wrote: »
    The candy/cough drop thing between Bush and Michelle is strange. And seems to have pissed off Trump from the video.

    It's a nice snapshot of the DC ruling class that Trump campaigned against

    And has spent most of his life mad that he's not really welcome in.

    The whole thing is kind of pathetic from start to finish.

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  • TNTrooperTNTrooper Registered User regular
    Elvenshae wrote: »
    Strange how?

    Cause Trump is a kid and he didn't get a candy.

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  • Mild ConfusionMild Confusion Smash All Things Registered User regular
    What’s strange about sharing candy?

    Old people have candy and sometimes share it. Or do you mean Trump’s reaction to said sharing?

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  • iTunesIsEviliTunesIsEvil Registered User regular
    I some how more came away feeling like it was an inside thing between the two, or something that W does, but I don't recall having seen him do it before, and I don't recall any prior stories about him and Michelle. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    shryke
  • kaidkaid Registered User regular
    What’s strange about sharing candy?

    Old people have candy and sometimes share it. Or do you mean Trump’s reaction to said sharing?

    Its a cough drop and a running joke between bush jr and michelle. Due to protocol she almost always winds up sitting next to bush JR and apparently sharing cough drops between them is a running gag at this point.

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  • Mild ConfusionMild Confusion Smash All Things Registered User regular
    Well, at least Michelle isn’t giving him pretzels.

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  • EncEnc A Fool with Compassion The Land of Flowers (and Dragons)Registered User regular
    I did laugh and felt bad about it.

    But not too bad.

    AuralynxFencingsaxMild Confusion
  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    I some how more came away feeling like it was an inside thing between the two, or something that W does, but I don't recall having seen him do it before, and I don't recall any prior stories about him and Michelle. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    They did it at McCain's funeral as well. It's a thing.

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Enc wrote: »
    The candy/cough drop thing between Bush and Michelle is strange. And seems to have pissed off Trump from the video.

    It's a nice snapshot of the DC ruling class that Trump campaigned against

    Michelle Obama is part of the DC ruling class?

    ElvenshaeThawmus
  • So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    Enc wrote: »
    The candy/cough drop thing between Bush and Michelle is strange. And seems to have pissed off Trump from the video.

    It's a nice snapshot of the DC ruling class that Trump campaigned against

    Michelle Obama is part of the DC ruling class?

    Not on topic

  • HenroidHenroid Radio Demon Internet HellRegistered User regular
    I haven’t seen anyone post this yet, so here’s George “Dubaya” Bush’s eulogy to his father, via the Associated Press,

    The start will have you gritting your teeth, but the ending is surprisingly affecting. George breaking down for a second or two at the very end is particularly touching.

    And yes, half of it seem like digs at Trump, but let’s be real here; anything that mentions the need to be decent, honest and dedicated to the American people seems like a dig at Trump.

    I know people are probably gonna wanna be like "Hey Junior your dad wasn't THAT great a president" but I mean, that's his father he's talking about and they were on great terms. Of course he's going to speak highly of him (as he should).

    That was nice to listen to though. Most of it came across as government-official-giving-a-speech, until the very end as you noted.

    Nobody likes me but that's okay. I'm used to it.
  • KaputaKaputa Registered User regular
    edited December 2018
    Bush Sr. probably does better than most post-WWII presidents, including some Democratic ones, if judged by the number of catastrophes they contributed to or caused while in office. Like I'm not entirely convinced that he was a worse president than Obama. "US President" sets a pretty low moral bar, so I'm not saying the tone of the thread is necessarily unjustified, but by that set of standards I'm hard pressed to see why he was so terrible. Highway of Death is probably the worst thing brought up in this thread, and that is terrible, but it pales in comparison to, say, the invasion of Iraq or the Vietnam War or arguably the destruction of the Libyan government.
    I always kinda wondered why he stopped where he did with Iraq. A strange war for a US president.
    My theory is that it's because he wasn't a dumbass.



    Cheney fairly accurately explained in 1994 why the 2003 invasion was an idiotic idea. Which becomes disturbing when one considers his role in the Bush jr. administration.

    Kaputa on
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