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Dinos and Druids, A Tasty Romp through Table Top Games

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Posts

  • ElddrikElddrik Registered User regular
    Melding wrote: »
    i trust you, but i have enough rpgs i'm never going to play already, so i'm not going to buy it to find out.

    I fully and completely approve of this decision and envy your ability to make it.

    Newest DTRPG:
    Starlight Express
  • ToxTox I kill threads he/himRegistered User regular
    All this talk of polearms reminded me of this
    The Real Way To Use A Polearm

    "Alright, listen up, for I am only going to say this once. I grow weary of seeing groups of bumbling amateurs running around with polearms, each person with a different type. One uses his halberd, another uses a pike, still another has a guisarme-voulge, and he cannot even pronounce it, let alone use it! This is ridiculous. If you are going to use a polearm, use it correctly! Here's how.

    "First of all, for the gods' sake, try to get some idea of where your group is going. Are you going to the jungle or a dense forest? You are? Then why buy a polearm, you fool!? You will have no room to wield it, and more often than not you'll wind up poking your comrade's eye out. Make sure that the terrain suits the weapon.

    "Next, once you know that the destination justifies a polearm, each person should get the same type of polearm. The weapons vary in the speed with which they can be swung and the amount of space needed to wield the things. Different polearms complicate what should be a simple operation.

    "When you see an enemy charging at you, have all the polearm bearers line up in the front row, with weapons set to receive the charge. In order to set for a charge, the wielder should stand sideways, leaning forward so the left shoulder faces the oncoming foe. The polearm should be set at an angle, with the head pointing away from the ground, facing up at the enemy. The end of the handle should rest against the instep of the right foot. Both hands hold the pole firmly. You are now ready to receive a charge.

    "Once the enemy impales himself on the blades, you cannot just pull out the staff weapon and begin hitting the creature. Your non-polearm-wielding comrades behind you should begin throwing spells, hurling missiles, spears, whatever, at the impaled foes. Try your best to keep the enemy on the blade, and out of your reach.

    "Now that's the way to use a polearm! It is a team effort that needs to be practiced often. Remember this, and perhaps it will save your life!''

    -- Fiona the Ranger, Daughter of Dierdre

    ElddrikRingotzeentchlingMetzger MeisterMatevBucketmanMvrcknever dieDarkPrimusJacobkosh
  • MeldingMelding Registered User regular
    i spent a lot of money on the dark eye books. i need to play that before buying any more is my rule.

  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    I think a way to make fighters more interesting in DnD/Fantasy games in general, and to toss in a dash of that historical accuracy I so crave, is give the fighter a reason to carry multiple weapons and use multiple weapons in a single fight by making them handle very differently, or by some other mechanic. Not sure what would be best, but, ya know historically a "fighter" might go into combat with a pole arm, a sword, a dagger, maybe a shield too if mounted, multiple ranged weapons, etc.

    Do polearms hit hard but break? Forcing you to swap off? Do weapons have range bands and it's hard to move between range bands and so when someone gets inside polearm range you really want to drop it and go for swords? Are daggers just insane if you get into a grapple? I don't know, but it would be nice if using different weapons made you feel different as a fighter in DnD.

    italianranma
  • webguy20webguy20 I spend too much time on the Internet Registered User regular
    Ringo wrote: »
    So 5e people - what's the most glass cannon build you can come up with? Are there any classes with good or interesting trade-offs between survivability and utility?

    I think the Bladesinger would be high on the list. It has a lot of abilities to keep it from being hit by melee, but only rocking d6 hit dice, so if something does get through their pretty fucked. They are a full caster though so they can alpha strike pretty card .

    Steam ID: Webguy20
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    Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
    Ringo
  • AnzekayAnzekay Registered User regular
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I think a way to make fighters more interesting in DnD/Fantasy games in general, and to toss in a dash of that historical accuracy I so crave, is give the fighter a reason to carry multiple weapons and use multiple weapons in a single fight by making them handle very differently, or by some other mechanic. Not sure what would be best, but, ya know historically a "fighter" might go into combat with a pole arm, a sword, a dagger, maybe a shield too if mounted, multiple ranged weapons, etc.

    Do polearms hit hard but break? Forcing you to swap off? Do weapons have range bands and it's hard to move between range bands and so when someone gets inside polearm range you really want to drop it and go for swords? Are daggers just insane if you get into a grapple? I don't know, but it would be nice if using different weapons made you feel different as a fighter in DnD.

    have you ever checked out Harnmaster? It's probably the most historically accurate tabletop RPG I've ever played, and the combat is super super brutal

  • ZonugalZonugal (He/Him) The Holiday Armadillo I'm Santa's representative for all the southern states. And Mexico!Registered User regular
    Ringo wrote: »
    So 5e people - what's the most glass cannon build you can come up with? Are there any classes with good or interesting trade-offs between survivability and utility?

    I think it'd likely be a build like 'Hexblade' Warlock 2/Fighter 2/Sorcerer 16.

    Putting everything into an Eldritch Blast attack?

    4d10 force damage +6 (Agonizing Blast invocation) +1d6 necrotic damage (Hex spell) +6 proficiency bonus (Hexblade's Curse)

    Now use the Sorcerer's quicken metamagic to make that into a bonus action.

    Now use your action to cast it again.

    Now use the Fighter's Action Surge to cast it again.

    That should be around 240 average damage in one turn.

    Ross-Geller-Prime-Sig-A.jpg
    Ringo
  • AnzekayAnzekay Registered User regular
    edited January 2019
    edit: wait nvm

    Anzekay on
  • MeldingMelding Registered User regular
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I think a way to make fighters more interesting in DnD/Fantasy games in general, and to toss in a dash of that historical accuracy I so crave, is give the fighter a reason to carry multiple weapons and use multiple weapons in a single fight by making them handle very differently, or by some other mechanic. Not sure what would be best, but, ya know historically a "fighter" might go into combat with a pole arm, a sword, a dagger, maybe a shield too if mounted, multiple ranged weapons, etc.

    Do polearms hit hard but break? Forcing you to swap off? Do weapons have range bands and it's hard to move between range bands and so when someone gets inside polearm range you really want to drop it and go for swords? Are daggers just insane if you get into a grapple? I don't know, but it would be nice if using different weapons made you feel different as a fighter in DnD.

    what if damage type mattered? so you can't just use a sword for everything. I would really like that to be a thing.

    but i would also like the play the dark eye, so what do i know?

  • webguy20webguy20 I spend too much time on the Internet Registered User regular
    edited January 2019
    Melding wrote: »
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I think a way to make fighters more interesting in DnD/Fantasy games in general, and to toss in a dash of that historical accuracy I so crave, is give the fighter a reason to carry multiple weapons and use multiple weapons in a single fight by making them handle very differently, or by some other mechanic. Not sure what would be best, but, ya know historically a "fighter" might go into combat with a pole arm, a sword, a dagger, maybe a shield too if mounted, multiple ranged weapons, etc.

    Do polearms hit hard but break? Forcing you to swap off? Do weapons have range bands and it's hard to move between range bands and so when someone gets inside polearm range you really want to drop it and go for swords? Are daggers just insane if you get into a grapple? I don't know, but it would be nice if using different weapons made you feel different as a fighter in DnD.

    what if damage type mattered? so you can't just use a sword for everything. I would really like that to be a thing.

    but i would also like the play the dark eye, so what do i know?

    At some point though it ends up the same thing as requiring a magic weapon. I think certain campaigns it could be fun to do the scouting and research like going after werewolves and finding out you need to silver your weapons and make sure they're piercing. In a big world spanning adventure though I think it would end up as busy work. You either have the weapon type or not and if you do it's trivial and if not then the fighter just sits in the corner while the wizard deals with it.

    webguy20 on
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  • AnzekayAnzekay Registered User regular
    So Harnmaster has a really fascinating system for combat and armour and suchlike, which kinda makes sense considering its roots from tabletop wargames.

    Whenever you make an attack, you're rolling against your opponent's chosen defence (block, parry, dodge, counterattack or no defence) and there's a little table that helps tell you who gets what based on what each of you roll. So say you land a regular success, and your opponent attempts to block and gets a regular failure, you'd hit them for a pretty usual strike. If that was in reverse, your attack hit their shield and (if your group is playing with durability rules) you might have to take some damage to your weapon or them their shield. Counterattacking is terrifying, but potent, because if you manage to succeed at your roll you'll hit them back regardless of whether they also hit you or not.

    This all sounds complicated, and it is, but the little table provided on their little combat how-to cards makes it significantly easier than you'd expect.

    If you hit someone, you gotta roll for hit location! Different sorts of armour will protect different parts of your body, and different types of armour will give varying degrees of damage resistance to the various damage types (blunt, piercing, slashing, fire are the main 4 iirc). So you'll roll for your damage, and subtract the armour from it, and then look another other quick table to see what sort of wound you inflict (and on occasion, if you just outright killed them)

    too many wounds and you die, and wounds also give you fatigue which just makes you worse at all your skills. heck, just fighting also makes you take fatigue, so everyone just gets worse and worse as a battle goes on, so most fights tend to either be short and extremely bloody or they stretch out and people just draw back in a stalemate

    it's a really crunchy system but I had a really fun time playing it and GMing it a while back

    InquisitorDuke 2.0
  • ZonugalZonugal (He/Him) The Holiday Armadillo I'm Santa's representative for all the southern states. And Mexico!Registered User regular
    edited January 2019
    Wait, @Ringo, I might have another idea regarding a glass cannon.

    You could go full villain and utilize Animate Object.

    With a fifth-level slot, you'll get 10 tiny objects [+8 to hit, 1d4+4 damage] for one minute.

    That comes around to 60 average points of damage per round, so potentially 600 points of damage once the spell concludes.

    Come on, become the Magneto.

    Zonugal on
    Ross-Geller-Prime-Sig-A.jpg
    Ringonever dieNeoToma
  • RingoRingo He/Him Bury me at Lone Tree DenRegistered User regular
    While an excellent suggestion, I've yet to be part of a 5e game that gets to 9th level

    I can't recall if I've even been past level 6 in 5e...

    Sterica wrote: »
    I know my last visit to my grandpa on his deathbed was to find out how the whole Nazi werewolf thing turned out.
    Edcrab's Exigency RPG
  • webguy20webguy20 I spend too much time on the Internet Registered User regular
    edited January 2019
    So I was trying to go to bed but I had the thought in my head about how to make hit dice, and healing in general, more interesting. My thoughts in the spoilers. What do you all think?


    1. Hit Dice can now be spent to improve the abilities of your character. A hit dice can be spent many ways. They are listed below. A hit die used once per round.
    a. Spend a hit die and roll it. The result is added to the “To Hit” result of the d20 roll. This can be declared after the roll has been made, but before results are revealed.
    b. Spend a hit die and roll it. The result can be added to the damage after an attack has been dealt. This is declared after the damage dice have been rolled but before the results are revealed.
    c. Spend a hit die and roll it, the result is added to any Save or Check that the chracter is making.
    d. Spend a hit die to generate disadvantage on any Save or Check that the chracter is causing an enemy to make.
    2. Any healing that adds actual hit points outside of a long rest now consumes a hit die when it is performed. When the healing is performed roll the hit die and add it to the healing received. Any healing that goes above your maximum is converted to temporary HP.
    a. Note that the Paladin’s Lay on Hands Cure Disease feature does not consume hit dice.
    3. Healing Potions now only add temporary HP. These do not consume hit dice. The rules about a new source of temporary HP replacing previous temporary HP are still in effect.
    4. Temporary HP go away after a short or long rest.
    5. If a Character runs out of hit dice, any healing will only bring them back to 1HP, and the character will not be able to gain any temp HP.



    webguy20 on
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  • GrogGrog My sword is only steel in a useful shape.Registered User regular
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I think a way to make fighters more interesting in DnD/Fantasy games in general, and to toss in a dash of that historical accuracy I so crave, is give the fighter a reason to carry multiple weapons and use multiple weapons in a single fight by making them handle very differently, or by some other mechanic. Not sure what would be best, but, ya know historically a "fighter" might go into combat with a pole arm, a sword, a dagger, maybe a shield too if mounted, multiple ranged weapons, etc.

    Do polearms hit hard but break? Forcing you to swap off? Do weapons have range bands and it's hard to move between range bands and so when someone gets inside polearm range you really want to drop it and go for swords? Are daggers just insane if you get into a grapple? I don't know, but it would be nice if using different weapons made you feel different as a fighter in DnD.

    Or swing the other direction in terms of realism and give the fighter advantage for using a weapon they haven't used before in the fight, then a bonus to damage if they break/plant their weapon in an enemy.

    Inquisitorwebguy20
  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Starting a Rogue Trader campaign and I decided to randomise some stuff.

    Anyway I'm a Navigator. Except I'm also a psyker! And my House has a hidden, terrible secret. I also rolled that I was on a Dark Voyage and my motivation is Fear.

    So basically my family has had a long interaction with some... thing. An entity. Not that they tell the Scion that! And on a warp jump, the ship was becalmed and it found me. Ever since then, I've been running from it, taking jobs on any vessel, staying mobile. And I've started to be able to read minds.

    Paranoid? It's only Paranoia when something isn't out to get you...

    Rhesus PositiveGrogwebguy20TynnanAuralynxDarkPrimus
  • StraightziStraightzi Here we may reign secure, and in my choice, To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered User regular
    Over the weekend I learned how to play Spirit Island and got a few two player games in. Won two, lost one.

    That's a pretty swell game. Every spirit feels distinctly different to play, and it's so cooperative. Like I'm used to cooperative games being everyone going and taking care of their own things essentially towards the same goal, but this one had us actively passing enemies and allied units back and forth to use for our various attacks and defenses and really needing to communicate a lot about our plans (and sometimes ballsing it up because we didn't communicate enough). But like, also in such a way that neither person was taking over and telling the other what to do, which is the flipside of cooperation usually.

    Also it is refreshing to see a game so decisively anti-colonial, in a genre that tends to have some problems with that. They do some weird stuff with it that I am very not sure about and am probably going to read up on, but I think their effort in that department, at very least, counts for something.

    webguy20BucketmanRingo
  • MolotovCockatooMolotovCockatoo Registered User regular
    edited January 2019
    Tox wrote: »
    All this talk of polearms reminded me of this
    The Real Way To Use A Polearm

    "Alright, listen up, for I am only going to say this once. I grow weary of seeing groups of bumbling amateurs running around with polearms, each person with a different type. One uses his halberd, another uses a pike, still another has a guisarme-voulge, and he cannot even pronounce it, let alone use it! This is ridiculous. If you are going to use a polearm, use it correctly! Here's how.

    "First of all, for the gods' sake, try to get some idea of where your group is going. Are you going to the jungle or a dense forest? You are? Then why buy a polearm, you fool!? You will have no room to wield it, and more often than not you'll wind up poking your comrade's eye out. Make sure that the terrain suits the weapon.

    "Next, once you know that the destination justifies a polearm, each person should get the same type of polearm. The weapons vary in the speed with which they can be swung and the amount of space needed to wield the things. Different polearms complicate what should be a simple operation.

    "When you see an enemy charging at you, have all the polearm bearers line up in the front row, with weapons set to receive the charge. In order to set for a charge, the wielder should stand sideways, leaning forward so the left shoulder faces the oncoming foe. The polearm should be set at an angle, with the head pointing away from the ground, facing up at the enemy. The end of the handle should rest against the instep of the right foot. Both hands hold the pole firmly. You are now ready to receive a charge.

    "Once the enemy impales himself on the blades, you cannot just pull out the staff weapon and begin hitting the creature. Your non-polearm-wielding comrades behind you should begin throwing spells, hurling missiles, spears, whatever, at the impaled foes. Try your best to keep the enemy on the blade, and out of your reach.

    "Now that's the way to use a polearm! It is a team effort that needs to be practiced often. Remember this, and perhaps it will save your life!''

    -- Fiona the Ranger, Daughter of Dierdre

    This is cool, but just curious, is it based on real practice? Planting a polearm handle on your own instep to receive a charge seems to my admittedly uneducated brain like a great way to seriously damage your own foot.

    MolotovCockatoo on
    Killjoy wrote: »
    No jeez Orik why do you assume the worst about people?

    Because he moderates an internet forum

    http://lexiconmegatherium.tumblr.com/
    BahamutZERO
  • BucketmanBucketman Call me SkraggRegistered User regular
    My D&D group man....

    So they killed this necromancer. Tortured him a bunch too. Turns out he was the son of a very influential local politician. They need to prove their innocence (well at least that he was actually a bad guy). They have his journal but its encoded, and they need to break the code. None of them could figure it out and so they tried finding someone to do it. They figured they could check out local academics, the city guard maybe, the local militia might employ one, maybe some of the bigger criminal organizations might.

    So of course they decide the best course of action is to go to "The shittiest, shadiest bar in town" and just walking up to people, buying them a drink and asking if they know anyone who is a professional criminal code breaker.

    It did not go well

    MvrckRingoRhesus Positivenever dieDarkPrimusGrey GhostchromdomRomanian My EscutcheonGennenalyse Rueben
  • Metzger MeisterMetzger Meister Registered User regular
    there's a joke here somewhere about nerds being bad criminals and how i bet prison inmates that play D&D are way better at it but i haven't had my coffee yet

    BucketmanSleepZonugalwebguy20ToxRingoBahamutZEROGrey GhostRomanian My Escutcheon
  • SleepSleep Registered User regular
    there's a joke here somewhere about nerds being bad criminals and how i bet prison inmates that play D&D are way better at it but i haven't had my coffee yet

    My favorite story ever was someone having to pause a game cause one of the players didn't get how a protection racket worked, or why the guy that clearly knew something about the bad guy and didn't like him was trying to brush them off because of it.

    Metzger MeisterZonugalnever dieBucketmanDarkPrimusRomanian My EscutcheonGennenalyse Rueben
  • StraightziStraightzi Here we may reign secure, and in my choice, To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered User regular
    edited January 2019
    Tox wrote: »
    All this talk of polearms reminded me of this
    The Real Way To Use A Polearm

    "Alright, listen up, for I am only going to say this once. I grow weary of seeing groups of bumbling amateurs running around with polearms, each person with a different type. One uses his halberd, another uses a pike, still another has a guisarme-voulge, and he cannot even pronounce it, let alone use it! This is ridiculous. If you are going to use a polearm, use it correctly! Here's how.

    "First of all, for the gods' sake, try to get some idea of where your group is going. Are you going to the jungle or a dense forest? You are? Then why buy a polearm, you fool!? You will have no room to wield it, and more often than not you'll wind up poking your comrade's eye out. Make sure that the terrain suits the weapon.

    "Next, once you know that the destination justifies a polearm, each person should get the same type of polearm. The weapons vary in the speed with which they can be swung and the amount of space needed to wield the things. Different polearms complicate what should be a simple operation.

    "When you see an enemy charging at you, have all the polearm bearers line up in the front row, with weapons set to receive the charge. In order to set for a charge, the wielder should stand sideways, leaning forward so the left shoulder faces the oncoming foe. The polearm should be set at an angle, with the head pointing away from the ground, facing up at the enemy. The end of the handle should rest against the instep of the right foot. Both hands hold the pole firmly. You are now ready to receive a charge.

    "Once the enemy impales himself on the blades, you cannot just pull out the staff weapon and begin hitting the creature. Your non-polearm-wielding comrades behind you should begin throwing spells, hurling missiles, spears, whatever, at the impaled foes. Try your best to keep the enemy on the blade, and out of your reach.

    "Now that's the way to use a polearm! It is a team effort that needs to be practiced often. Remember this, and perhaps it will save your life!''

    -- Fiona the Ranger, Daughter of Dierdre

    This is cool, but just curious, is it based on real practice? Planting a polearm handle on your own instep to receive a charge seems to my admittedly uneducated brain like a great way to seriously damage your own foot.

    You're not planting the handle on top of your foot, you're planting it on the ground and then stepping on it, so you're creating a nice little corner for it with the ground and your instep

    Is my understanding, at least

    With a significantly strong charge, it could still be disastrous, mind - you've got three points of contact on that polearm, and something that manages to effect the polearm significantly would probably effect the rest of your body as well

    Straightzi on
    Donovan Puppyfucker
  • StraightziStraightzi Here we may reign secure, and in my choice, To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered User regular
    Here's some Roman reenactors doing it:

    WTj5uDW.jpg

    BucketmanDonovan Puppyfucker
  • MolotovCockatooMolotovCockatoo Registered User regular
    Straightzi wrote: »
    Tox wrote: »
    All this talk of polearms reminded me of this
    The Real Way To Use A Polearm

    "Alright, listen up, for I am only going to say this once. I grow weary of seeing groups of bumbling amateurs running around with polearms, each person with a different type. One uses his halberd, another uses a pike, still another has a guisarme-voulge, and he cannot even pronounce it, let alone use it! This is ridiculous. If you are going to use a polearm, use it correctly! Here's how.

    "First of all, for the gods' sake, try to get some idea of where your group is going. Are you going to the jungle or a dense forest? You are? Then why buy a polearm, you fool!? You will have no room to wield it, and more often than not you'll wind up poking your comrade's eye out. Make sure that the terrain suits the weapon.

    "Next, once you know that the destination justifies a polearm, each person should get the same type of polearm. The weapons vary in the speed with which they can be swung and the amount of space needed to wield the things. Different polearms complicate what should be a simple operation.

    "When you see an enemy charging at you, have all the polearm bearers line up in the front row, with weapons set to receive the charge. In order to set for a charge, the wielder should stand sideways, leaning forward so the left shoulder faces the oncoming foe. The polearm should be set at an angle, with the head pointing away from the ground, facing up at the enemy. The end of the handle should rest against the instep of the right foot. Both hands hold the pole firmly. You are now ready to receive a charge.

    "Once the enemy impales himself on the blades, you cannot just pull out the staff weapon and begin hitting the creature. Your non-polearm-wielding comrades behind you should begin throwing spells, hurling missiles, spears, whatever, at the impaled foes. Try your best to keep the enemy on the blade, and out of your reach.

    "Now that's the way to use a polearm! It is a team effort that needs to be practiced often. Remember this, and perhaps it will save your life!''

    -- Fiona the Ranger, Daughter of Dierdre

    This is cool, but just curious, is it based on real practice? Planting a polearm handle on your own instep to receive a charge seems to my admittedly uneducated brain like a great way to seriously damage your own foot.

    You're not planting the handle on top of your foot, you're planting it on the ground and then stepping on it, so you're creating a nice little corner for it with the ground and your instep

    Is my understanding, at least

    With a significantly strong charge, it could still be disastrous, mind - you've got three points of contact on that polearm, and something that manages to effect the polearm significantly would probably effect the rest of your body as well

    Ok this makes WAY more sense in my head now, thank you.

    Killjoy wrote: »
    No jeez Orik why do you assume the worst about people?

    Because he moderates an internet forum

    http://lexiconmegatherium.tumblr.com/
    italianranmaRingoBahamutZEROBucketman
  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    That Polearm Guide is fun but I would largely say it is not based on real practice.

    For example the advice to not use a polearm is dense terrain is somewhat faulty. I mean, yes, if you are going to be fighting in a phonebooth you don't want a polearm. But dense terrain can largely work in the polearm users favor, especially on the defense. Good luck getting through a narrow choke when someone (or even better multiple people) is thrusting a spear repeatedly into that narrow choke. Polearms were used as weapons by guards for a reason, and the naginata was the favored weapon of women defending their homes in Japan, for example. You aren't going to be doing big circular cutting motions, sure, but that's why polearms are flexible.

    The advice for giving everyone the same polearm is sensible if you are equipping an army, but not super relevant for the skirmish sized conflicts that DnD typically are. You aren't doing much formation fighting when you have like four people to a side.

    Lastly, the idea of your target impaling themselves on your polearm is relatively faulty. While you can certainly ward off a charge, or convince someone to halt in their tracks by presenting a bunch of spears, rarely is anyone going to actually impale themselves on your spears (horses, contrary to popular belief, do not like to willingly impale themselves, for example). Though, getting a horse to rear up and stop within thrusting range of your spears, and arrow range of your archers (and magic range of your spellcasters in DnD) is pretty much the next best thing.

    Here's a nice picture that shows a way of bracing larger pikes beneath your foot, and also shows people on horses not being dumb enough to impale themselves for you:

    rocroi-a.jpg

    Replace the guns with steel prod crossbows and you get something that was done historically and looks a little closer to the type of kit you expect from DnD.

    BahamutZEROKayne Red RobeAlbino BunnyRingoDarkPrimusShadowenDuke 2.0doomybearMsAnthropyitalianranmaMolotovCockatooAnialosRomanian My EscutcheonGennenalyse Rueben
  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    Grog wrote: »
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I think a way to make fighters more interesting in DnD/Fantasy games in general, and to toss in a dash of that historical accuracy I so crave, is give the fighter a reason to carry multiple weapons and use multiple weapons in a single fight by making them handle very differently, or by some other mechanic. Not sure what would be best, but, ya know historically a "fighter" might go into combat with a pole arm, a sword, a dagger, maybe a shield too if mounted, multiple ranged weapons, etc.

    Do polearms hit hard but break? Forcing you to swap off? Do weapons have range bands and it's hard to move between range bands and so when someone gets inside polearm range you really want to drop it and go for swords? Are daggers just insane if you get into a grapple? I don't know, but it would be nice if using different weapons made you feel different as a fighter in DnD.

    Or swing the other direction in terms of realism and give the fighter advantage for using a weapon they haven't used before in the fight, then a bonus to damage if they break/plant their weapon in an enemy.

    I'm a "rules for effect" and not "rules for realism" type of person so I like the sound of this. What I mean is, as long as the rules produce the results you want, I don't care if the rules themselves are realistic.

    Your suggestion is getting me to think about something similar to 4E encounter powers, things you can only do once per fight, but unlike 4E make them require a specific weapon and/or circumstance. But yeah, some mechanic that promotes frequent weapon swapping would be great for the fighter.

    GrogDuke 2.0
  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Polearms were also good for attack, rather than defence. If a formation of guys holding their big pikes out in front of them charges into you, it's pretty devastating!

    Inquisitor
  • Metzger MeisterMetzger Meister Registered User regular
    i

    love

    pike formations.

    hedgehogs, pike rings, squars. spears and pikes ruled the battlefield for millenia and there's a reason and they're rad. lots of my d&d characters have been spear-and-shield types.

    InquisitorKayne Red RobeDesert LeviathanBucketmanShadowenMatevRomanian My Escutcheon
  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2019
    Solar wrote: »
    Polearms were also good for attack, rather than defence. If a formation of guys holding their big pikes out in front of them charges into you, it's pretty devastating!

    Yeah, and when it gets really hairy is when you have a formation of pikemen pushing into a defensive formation of pikemen, and get to the "push of pikes"

    I'm not actually sure if we have a good historical understanding of how that was resolved. I wonder if it's a not like Napoleonic warfare where the "press of bayonets" was more frequently the threat of the press of bayonets, and the defender would either give ground before the attackers got there, or drive off the attacker with musketry fire before it actually got to the bayoneting.

    The big knowledge gaps we have in historical warfare endless fascinate and frustrate me in turn.

    Inquisitor on
    italianranma
  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    Though by that point even that maneuver was largely falling out of favor. The wall of guns to the left of the pike made it rather a losing strategy.

    Inquisitor
  • StraightziStraightzi Here we may reign secure, and in my choice, To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered User regular
    I would love to play a game that relied on having an adventuring party that actually did like, formation fighting and maneuvers

    I've toyed around with the idea of Roman fantasy stuff a bunch before, although I've never actual run anything of the sort

    InquisitorMetzger Meister
  • Metzger MeisterMetzger Meister Registered User regular
    it's interesting too because if there's one thing that usually gets recorded and written about, it's war, but in a lot of cases it seems like so much military knowledge was orally passed down, or simply taken for granted in its day like the Roman use of seawater in their concrete, and so much stuff just didn't get recorded in a way that could survive to the modern era. i can't imagine how terrible it must be for historians, knowing that you really may never be able to do more than make (very good) educated guesses. but that's the nature of the science i suppose.

    InquisitorRingo
  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    I personally feel that probably one side broke extremely quickly. However one article I read suggested that you might not know you were in a push of pike until it was happening, because they fired a segment of the artillery and arquebuses that were on part of a battle line in some German conflict somewhere or others, and found that after a few volleys, you couldn't see anything at all. If they had marched pike up, you'd only see other pikes when they were yards away!

    But yes personally I feel like they fled because most reenactors think that more than a very short push would have resulted in casualties that just don't match the reports.

    InquisitorMetzger Meister
  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    Straightzi wrote: »
    I would love to play a game that relied on having an adventuring party that actually did like, formation fighting and maneuvers

    I've toyed around with the idea of Roman fantasy stuff a bunch before, although I've never actual run anything of the sort

    I've toyed around with the idea of a game where each player has their PC but also had like 2-3 active hirelings that they manage that participate in the combat. That puts a party of 4 PCs into a group of say, 16 total bodies, and then I think you could really start leaning into formations and maneuvers at a small scale.

    RingoMatev
  • Metzger MeisterMetzger Meister Registered User regular
    edited January 2019
    Solar wrote: »
    I personally feel that probably one side broke extremely quickly. However one article I read suggested that you might not know you were in a push of pike until it was happening, because they fired a segment of the artillery and arquebuses that were on part of a battle line in some German conflict somewhere or others, and found that after a few volleys, you couldn't see anything at all. If they had marched pike up, you'd only see other pikes when they were yards away!

    But yes personally I feel like they fled because most reenactors think that more than a very short push would have resulted in casualties that just don't match the reports.

    oh yeah, after the first few full-line volleys a battlefield could be almost completely obscured. given the right weather conditions the smoke would even linger and cling to the ground like sulfur-scented fog. dust in the air from artillery impacts would worsen the effect, sometimes even to the point where entire battlefields would be shrouded in like this thick gray-brown miasma.

    sometimes you'd fire without the intent of even hitting the enemy (though hey it's musket warfare you probably won't anyway) to conceal troop movements to the rear! that's fascinating! adapting what was seen as a drawback of the technology into an asset! classic!

    edit: by a lot of accounts pike-and-shot warfare wasn't really all that deadly, compared to earlier and later periods. armies would often break after even just a few volleys, like you said, simply because it was already obvious who'd won the positioning battle.

    then you get back to camp and die of cholera like 40% of the rest of the army.

    Metzger Meister on
    Kayne Red RobeSolartzeentchlingRingoMatevDonovan PuppyfuckerDuke 2.0Romanian My EscutcheonMvrck
  • StraightziStraightzi Here we may reign secure, and in my choice, To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered User regular
    Hmm

    Now I'm trying to figure out what an RPG where every player is by default controlling three characters would look like

  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Solar wrote: »
    I personally feel that probably one side broke extremely quickly. However one article I read suggested that you might not know you were in a push of pike until it was happening, because they fired a segment of the artillery and arquebuses that were on part of a battle line in some German conflict somewhere or others, and found that after a few volleys, you couldn't see anything at all. If they had marched pike up, you'd only see other pikes when they were yards away!

    But yes personally I feel like they fled because most reenactors think that more than a very short push would have resulted in casualties that just don't match the reports.

    oh yeah, after the first few full-line volleys a battlefield could be almost completely obscured. given the right weather conditions the smoke would even linger and cling to the ground like sulfur-scented fog. dust in the air from artillery impacts would worsen the effect, sometimes even to the point where entire battlefields would be shrouded in like this thick gray-brown miasma.

    sometimes you'd fire without the intent of even hitting the enemy (though hey it's musket warfare you probably won't anyway) to conceal troop movements to the rear! that's fascinating! adapting what was seen as a drawback of the technology into an asset! classic!

    edit: by a lot of accounts pike-and-shot warfare wasn't really all that deadly, compared to earlier and later periods. armies would often break after even just a few volleys, like you said, simply because it was already obvious who'd won the positioning battle.

    then you get back to camp and die of cholera like 40% of the rest of the army.

    If you haven't read Furies: War in Europe 1450-1700 by Lauro Martines you absolutely should, I think you'd love it. Fantastic book on the nature of warfare and it's impact on people, soldiers and civilians, at the time. The statistics are staggering! I read it while laid up post surgery and it definitely helped get the day by!

    InquisitorRingoKayne Red Robe
  • BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User regular
    Straightzi wrote: »
    Hmm

    Now I'm trying to figure out what an RPG where every player is by default controlling three characters would look like

    a computer game

    BahamutZERO.gif
  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Ars Magica!

    A duck!Desert LeviathanRhesus PositiveHappy Little Machine
  • DrDinosaurDrDinosaur Registered User regular
    At that point you're kinda pushing into wargame territory, aren't you?

    webguy20DoobhMaddocsee317
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