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Car buying, Where should I start? (Hatchback, or SUV?)

IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator mod
I'll try to keep the backstory down, but my partner and I have been considering another car for like 2 years. When I first proposed we needed car #2, I was planning to find the cheapest beater I could. The plan was that I could just use a hunk of junk to get around the neighborhood, while our (knock on wood) relatively reliable 2012 Nissan versa would stand as the main car.

At some point, the idea of the beater turned into my partner wanting a pickup truck, the versa has no fold down seats which has bitten us in the ass, and we could have a less fuel efficient car for and use the versa for longer drives. The problem we are finding is:

- He wants a v6 in a used truck and they dont seem to pop up used
- They cost a lot. Even used 20-25k is seemingly where it starts


The cost put the breaks on the entire process, and I'm back to being frustrated and stuck at home too much. I'd like to meet half way and see if I can find a hatchback. We bought the Nissan under duress when my beautiful lancer was rear ended, and just went to car max and got what we could afford. We have much more time to shop around now, but I think if I gather some options myself I can speed this choice up. Problem is, I dont pay attention to cars at all, and I dont know what reviews to trust.

So what I'm looking for

- Budget is 12-15K (2-3 as a down payment)
- Something easy to repair and reliable is generally my highest concern
- Some sort of compromise on the truck, maybe a small SUV that sits higher on the road than the versa, or a hatchback?
- Automatic
- A rear view camera if its an suv

My actual questions:

- Carmax is easy, but we have options now, should I fuck with local dealers considering I get exhausted with haggling (were in austin TX)
- Has anyone looked at Carvana and actually bought something off of it
- Do any of you own a car that has served you well and fits the criteria?


I'd like to keep payments down to $200 or so and we both have good-ish credit.

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Posts

  • Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    What are you looking to carry in the car? I have a 2011 Golf and it's pretty small and efficient, but with the fold down rears it can hold a whole lot as long as it's not very long. In the 8 years I've owned it I've needed to get someone else to help me one time with something too big to fit.

    Personally I love hatchbacks for their versatility while still being smaller, but it depends a lot on what you're transporting.

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  • IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator mod
    Occasionally camping gear, Art supplies, and if we ever get a house things for house projects as I learn to be a real handy man like I want to.

    The truck started to become something that my partner just wanted, rather than a huge necessity. It would come in handy when we try to move out, but that's not immanent, and we could replace one of these cars for a truck if it makes sense in the future.

    Main thing is he would like something higher off the ground for his lower back issues (so he doesn't have to get down into the car), but when his back is particularly bad he cant drive (or generally sit) at all, really, so I'm not sure stepping up will help.

    Trying to get some ideas of reasonable options and compromises before I get more impatient about the whole thing in general.


    The golf certainly fits my budget, but seems super tiny. Partner is 6ft and doesn't like being cramped up. Aren't Volkswagen's generally expensive to repair, as well?

  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    Up until you mentioned the road height I was going to point you towards a Honda Fit which hits most of your other requirements, have good reliability and can hold much more than you expect. I'm 6' and have driven one for 8+ years now and fit fine. (It is close though, another inch or two and I think you'd have serious problems.) However, they are pretty low to the ground which isn't going to be great for back issues.

  • dispatch.odispatch.o Registered User regular
    edited March 1
    I had a Hyundai Santa Fe for 9 years. It was very reliable, had AWD and a V6. It's smaller for an SUV but not the smallest. I'd probably get one again if I could find a good deal.

    Most vehicles now come with a reverse camera. It's not as useful as you'd think while moving because you can't turn it on when you're driving. I do like that they are good for low-light and can help see wide angles that the rear window may not allow. I think there are kits that aren't that expensive that allow you to mount one to just about any car though. You might find that the perfect truck exists and it doesn't have a camera, don't let that stop you.

    In my limited experience, good trucks maintain value and will be expensive without going back quite a few years (8+). Lemon year trucks can be all modern and nice looking and be total pieces of junk. Ford has had a few years with a V6 that self-destructs on a pretty regular basis... I've known three people who owned one and all are currently dead in a driveway in need of a new engine that costs more than the truck is worth. It was something about the V6 they used for a 3-4 year window that is just awful.

    IMHO very few things you can do in a truck can't be done in an SUV and if you want to haul a bunch of stuff, I'd rent a truck from UHAUL and save the wear on your own vehicle anyway.


    Edit: I have a herniated L5-S1 disc. It's not so much the step up / sit down height that changes how hard it is to get into a car... It's how much space you have to get in to the vehicle from the height of the seat to the top of the door. My SUV had a smaller door and even though I didn't have to bend to sit down, I had to bend to get my head in. My current Ford Fusion requires that I sit down and then turn to get in but because the seat is lower and I have more clearance to get my head under the top of the door I don't have to round my back and slouch down to get in. Also my car has way more leg room than my SUV did and I can sit in a more comfortable reclined position. I've driven a Ford Explorer and my old Hyundai Santa Fe enough to really like both vehicles, but I had the same issue in both with a lack of viable adjustments to the seat that would reduce pressure on my lower back.'

    Edit2: I'm 6'3"

    The TLDR of it is don't read too much into the size of the vehicle being more/less comfortable for someone who's tall. There are exceptions of course... huge trucks have crazy leg room. Typical SUV style vehicles aren't necessarily better than a 2 door hatchback or sedan. I literally can't fit into a Ford Bronco and drive it, if it's the wrong year.

    dispatch.o on
  • Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    I’m 6’1” and very large and I bought the golf because it was so big inside! The key to spacious hatchback life is don’t get a sunroof.

    My golf has been very maintenance light knock on wood, mostly tires because i95 is a hellscape. But I’d probably go with something more in line with a Honda fit if I was concerned about that because they’re also very nice and pretty much tanks.

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  • IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator mod
    Nice, this is all great info!

    I'm willing to keep the options open at the moment, hopefully I can just keep an eye around for certain cars to go test drive. We have a carmax pretty close by, so we can just go over there and do some test driving, I think.

    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Edit: I have a herniated L5-S1 disc. It's not so much the step up / sit down height that changes how hard it is to get into a car... It's how much space you have to get in to the vehicle from the height of the seat to the top of the door. My SUV had a smaller door and even though I didn't have to bend to sit down, I had to bend to get my head in. My current Ford Fusion requires that I sit down and then turn to get in but because the seat is lower and I have more clearance to get my head under the top of the door I don't have to round my back and slouch down to get in. Also my car has way more leg room than my SUV did and I can sit in a more comfortable reclined position. I've driven a Ford Explorer and my old Hyundai Santa Fe enough to really like both vehicles, but I had the same issue in both with a lack of viable adjustments to the seat that would reduce pressure on my lower back.'

    Edit2: I'm 6'3"

    The TLDR of it is don't read too much into the size of the vehicle being more/less comfortable for someone who's tall. There are exceptions of course... huge trucks have crazy leg room. Typical SUV style vehicles aren't necessarily better than a 2 door hatchback or sedan. I literally can't fit into a Ford Bronco and drive it, if it's the wrong year.

    This is very good info and I really appreciate it. I don't want to torture him, but we just don't have the cash to throw down on a really large truck. I'll keep this door/seat ratio in mind as I make a list of cars to look further into.

  • dispatch.odispatch.o Registered User regular
    edited March 1
    A friend at work who is 6'5" drives a Mazda CX-5 and loves it. It's a good size crossover hatchback/suv and having been in it, it has a lot of good space. It also has held value well and in his experience been excellent to own. I know there are newer crossovers by Mazda but the price for a used one might be right where you're at. A 2014 CX5 is listed at 17k on Carmax. I'm sure you can find one with a better price.

    Edit1: I know there are some mechanics here and previous recommendations for the CX-5. I wish I could batsignal them but honestly can't remember who to @ and I don't want to recommend a vehicle I've only been a passenger in but maybe check it out anyway?
    Edit2: Keeping payments down is why I ended out opening up a new account at a credit union. Just browsing online at credit unions in your area you can probably find out what you can get ahold of and then ask your current bank to match.

    dispatch.o on
  • mtsmts Registered User regular
    i would just find a used subaru

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  • BlindZenDriverBlindZenDriver Registered User regular
    Possible outside contender. Kia Soul. I won't go so far as to claim it is bigger on the inside as some telephone boxes, but it is not far from.
    Also I'd say Mazda is worth considering. They drive well, are reliable with them perhaps being a bit over looked good deals should be possible to find.

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  • zepherinzepherin Registered User regular
    edited March 1
    So Costco car buying is a great place for buying cars new and used. Both of my credit unions also offer comparable services and the prices were within a hundo of the Costco price.
    I've heard mixed feelings about carvana
    Chevy Colorado is not feature rich but they are cheap and reliable you can get a 2014 2015 in the price range and it is a v6.

    When I'm spinning up a job I generally try to budget one in, Nissan frontiers are cheaper (which means I've had to get those for jobs) but I find they break down more.

    zepherin on
  • Descendant XDescendant X Hank Facepunch Registered User regular
    I’m with mts on this one. Go to your local Subaru lot and have a look at their used stock. I’m guessing that you could pick up a Crosstrek, which is what I have and is a great vehicle, for a decent price.

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  • djmitchelladjmitchella Registered User regular
    We have a subaru legacy station wagon, and it's done us fine. That said, we wanted AWD because it gets snowy around here at times -- if that's not a concern then you can save some money and have simpler maintenance by finding a 2wd car.

  • XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
    I'm going to dissent on Subaru

    My sisters is about the biggest lemon since the 2000 ford focus. It leaks oil like a sieve and is all around garbage.

    zepherinShadowfire
  • zepherinzepherin Registered User regular
    Xaquin wrote: »
    I'm going to dissent on Subaru

    My sisters is about the biggest lemon since the 2000 ford focus. It leaks oil like a sieve and is all around garbage.
    Year and model matter. I personally don’t find Subaru’s very comfortable, I hear the new ones are better, but the old ones were not great for me, and there isn’t a lot of power with them.

    bowenXaquin
  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    edited March 1
    I'd personally try to find an affordable used Escape. They're on the lower end of the SUV price ranges (they start at $25k for new) and tend to be one of Ford's better models (after 2008). They are especially great for camping and those kind of activities, I used mine to haul kayaks.

    Crossovers always feel like they don't really offer anything that car doesn't already give you... and trucks are expensive in that they hold their price well that it's almost better to just buy new instead.

    bowen on
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  • PowerpuppiesPowerpuppies Registered User regular
    Used escapes are probably not going to be in the stated price range

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  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    I used carmax before I posted that, they start at 12k. Obviously iruka's location may vary.

    Ladies.
    zepherin
  • XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
    I generally like to buy GM simply because everyone and their brother knows how to work on them and the parts are half the cost of other car parts.

    zepherin
  • Lindsay LohanLindsay Lohan Registered User regular
    My wife drives a newer Kia Sorento and it was a bit pricier but I think the older ones (like 2013ish) probably hit that price point, especially if you're not in snow country to need four wheel drive. We love ours, plenty of space and sits super comfortably for long drives.

  • IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator mod
    zepherin wrote: »
    So Costco car buying is a great place for buying cars new and used. Both of my credit unions also offer comparable services and the prices were within a hundo of the Costco price.
    I've heard mixed feelings about carvana
    Chevy Colorado is not feature rich but they are cheap and reliable you can get a 2014 2015 in the price range and it is a v6.

    When I'm spinning up a job I generally try to budget one in, Nissan frontiers are cheaper (which means I've had to get those for jobs) but I find they break down more.

    carvana seems a bit too good to be true, and lacks the convenience of being able to test drive thing. Seemed worth asking about since the prices and the calculation tools on their website are appealing.

    Looks like the Chevy Colorado on carmax starts at 18K, but I'll keep an eye out.

    bowen wrote: »
    I'd personally try to find an affordable used Escape. They're on the lower end of the SUV price ranges (they start at $25k for new) and tend to be one of Ford's better models (after 2008). They are especially great for camping and those kind of activities, I used mine to haul kayaks.

    Crossovers always feel like they don't really offer anything that car doesn't already give you... and trucks are expensive in that they hold their price well that it's almost better to just buy new instead.

    I've never owned a Ford, any experiences with repairs? My family has only ever owned nissans and mitsubishis.

    This looks affordable: https://www.carmax.com/car/16857124


    We for sure dont need any AWD, Austin is prone to flooding the most rugged car wont save us if the street becomes a river. Very unlikely that anything we buy will see anything other than sun, rain and a hail storm or two.

  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    The Taurus-es I've owned ate me alive in repair costs, but my Escape was relatively low (I think I spent a total of $3500 over 10 years). The AWD models are overkill for, TX I agree.

    They're definitely spacey enough.. I was able to get a treadmill and a 55" TV into the back of mine without much jiggering but that was the 2008 model. Mileage sucks (best case I got 23mpg) but otherwise I liked mine and if I didn't get the Tacoma 2 years ago I'd likely have bought another one.

    Ladies.
  • DeadfallDeadfall Registered User regular
    edited March 1
    I owned a 2001 Escape and that thing was an absolute tank. Nothing stopped it. I'd be the only one on the road in a blizzard and I couldn't even feel it. I kept up on maintenance and I think the only repairs I had were spark plugs and a fuel filter. Yeah Escapes are beasts.

    I drive a Crosstrek now, 2018 and I absolutely love it. It's the second generation so the oil leaks have been fixed (for mine at least). It holds a surprising amount of cargo and is good in the snow.

    I looked at used Crosstreks and honestly they aren't much cheaper than new ones. So I got it new at a pretty great interest rate.

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  • dispatch.odispatch.o Registered User regular
    edited March 1
    I've helped people move in an Escape. The space in the back with seats down was really impressive. A lot of SUVs have weird wheel wells and stuff that shrink the actual footprint size of the objects you can pile in quite a bit.

    She took a 55" DLP TV like a champ.

    My only concern would be room for someone tall in the back seat or driving. Passenger front was fine.

    dispatch.o on
  • ArtereisArtereis Registered User regular
    I've never looked inside a Scion xB, but my xD has a ton of room inside with its folding rear seats. I've driven around a lot more stuff than it looks like it should be able to handle from the outside. I don't think either would be able to handle, like, a mattress, but it can take a lot.

  • schussschuss Registered User regular
    This screams CUV. Forrester,RAV4, CX5, CRV are all good, get the one you like most.

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  • Red RaevynRed Raevyn because I only take Bubble Baths Registered User regular
    edited March 1
    Looking at what you want to do with the car, I think you're right about a Honda Fit. I was in a similar boat a few years ago - I'd been bicycle/bus/motorcycle only for years while my wife used our car (07 VW GTi), but when we moved out of the city and things changed I wanted a second auto. My first thought was a small pickup because I like to both do outdoors things and projects where it would be useful. But as you found, pickups are really expensive and get terrible gas mileage* which was important for me (*caveat - the very expensive modern trucks manage mediocre gas mileage).

    A big draw of the Fit is that it gets superb mileage without being hyper modern and computerized. It's just a light car with a small motor, so I expected maintenance to be inexpensive and that's very much been the case. I bought my 2009 Fit Sport in November 2014 for $14,500 (edit: it was $14,500 out the door, listed was $13,281) with 45,000 miles on it. I paid a little more to find one that was manual (they're less common) with lower mileage. If I did it again I would have gone with the automatics slightly higher in miles and saved a couple thou.

    Since 2014 we've put 35,000 miles on it and spent a total of $358 in maintenance - cheap oil changes and a replacement of the original battery a couple years in. Brakes still have plenty of life, nothing expensive on the horizon. Lifetime average gas mileage is 35.92, usually 33-36 depending on whether the tank was more city or long trips. On actual all highway instances it gets a genuine 39-40.

    The way the Fit's seats fold is rad, and I've fit all kinds of things in mine. Big pieces of wood, loads of 8 ft lumber, bicycles, lawn mowers, boxes yada yada. The only downside for the car is that with all that glass and the light weight you do hear road noise. It's minor in my opinion and I'm still wearing out the cheap tires it came with (dealers in WA have to put new tires on used cars) so it will probably improve, but it might bother some. Of course it isn't a high power car either but it's not a total dog. (edit edit: Here in WA the huge windshield and windows make for great views. In TX you'll probably want to tint the windows, because the car is a rolling greenhouse.)

    Over all it's been a great inexpensive car and I'd recommend it for that - I'd expect to be able to find used second gens for well under your budget now.

    Red Raevyn on
  • zepherinzepherin Registered User regular
    Iruka wrote: »
    zepherin wrote: »
    So Costco car buying is a great place for buying cars new and used. Both of my credit unions also offer comparable services and the prices were within a hundo of the Costco price.
    I've heard mixed feelings about carvana
    Chevy Colorado is not feature rich but they are cheap and reliable you can get a 2014 2015 in the price range and it is a v6.

    When I'm spinning up a job I generally try to budget one in, Nissan frontiers are cheaper (which means I've had to get those for jobs) but I find they break down more.

    carvana seems a bit too good to be true, and lacks the convenience of being able to test drive thing. Seemed worth asking about since the prices and the calculation tools on their website are appealing.

    Looks like the Chevy Colorado on carmax starts at 18K, but I'll keep an eye out.

    bowen wrote: »
    I'd personally try to find an affordable used Escape. They're on the lower end of the SUV price ranges (they start at $25k for new) and tend to be one of Ford's better models (after 2008). They are especially great for camping and those kind of activities, I used mine to haul kayaks.

    Crossovers always feel like they don't really offer anything that car doesn't already give you... and trucks are expensive in that they hold their price well that it's almost better to just buy new instead.

    I've never owned a Ford, any experiences with repairs? My family has only ever owned nissans and mitsubishis.

    This looks affordable: https://www.carmax.com/car/16857124


    We for sure dont need any AWD, Austin is prone to flooding the most rugged car wont save us if the street becomes a river. Very unlikely that anything we buy will see anything other than sun, rain and a hail storm or two.
    Check edmunds used car listing for your area. I saw a few that were pretty decent deals.

  • Inquisitor77Inquisitor77 2 x Penny Arcade Fight Club Champion A fixed point in space and timeRegistered User regular
    If you can test drive a Fit to see if it will work, I think it's probably the best car for what you're looking for, especially within your price range. The rear folding seats, in particular, are always considered best-in-class, and it actually offers the most volume capacity (both in terms of usefulness and sheer space) than comparable hatchbacks.

    I have a Mazda3 and I love it, but I bought it for personal reasons. If I were being objective, I would've just gotten a Honda Fit.

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  • chrishallett83chrishallett83 Hi! Registered User regular
    I can comfortably fit 4 large adults in my 5 door Golf, and during the week I use it to tow around an 8x5 trailer full of gardening equipment and green waste for my business.

  • WassermeloneWassermelone Registered User regular
    Its been a while since we owned it and we haven't owned a car in quite a while now, but the Honda Fit was a great car for us. The folding back seats were amazing and we only very very very rarely had space issues. We even moved completely cross country in the car (Rhode Island to LA). Only sold it because we then moved overseas. Our only wish was that we had gotten the sport instead of the regular as there were occasionally some acceleration woes with getting on highways if the car was loaded.

    Also for reference, I'm 6'4 and it was very comfortable size wise.

  • zepherinzepherin Registered User regular
    The Honda Fit is a nice little hatchback, and the Msrp new can be nabbed for about 16200, Costco can likely get it for you at 15k which is a good price for a new Honda. I’m 6ft 3 and I fit in the front seat ok, not so much in the back seat.

    I thought you were looking for a cheap truck.

  • PowerpuppiesPowerpuppies Registered User regular
    I like my Escape a lot but if it's a choice between a new or nearly new Fit and an Escape with 80k miles on it, you should go for the Fit I think

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  • Lord PalingtonLord Palington Registered User regular
    If you like the Fit and want something you can climb into, take a look at the Honda HRV. It is the crossover version of the Fit, and it has the same foldable seats as the Fit.

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  • zepherinzepherin Registered User regular
    If you like the Fit and want something you can climb into, take a look at the Honda HRV. It is the crossover version of the Fit, and it has the same foldable seats as the Fit.
    HRVs are good CRVs are better (I just purchased a CRV), but they cost more money, and because Honda’s retain value really well its pretty expensive to get one used. The fit Iruka can get brand new for within the budget, also new cars have vastly superior finance options than used. My credit union rate is 1 percent lower for new cars, so if Iruka is financing it is important to consider that.

  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    I would be skeptical that a Fit would meet Iruka's use-case there. The HRV would be a better choice if she's looking for something that has some carrying capacity. The Fits are unimpressive in comparison and my ex's step-dad had one and was always making comments of "I really should've gotten the SUV instead" every time he visited us with his fishing stuff to go up to the St Lawrence.

    They absolutely are cheaper and they fit people but beyond that there isn't much to them. I agree that HRV/CRV are the better choices. Though check the maintenance on them, because I think they are on the higher end of maintenance costs in the Hondas too. Though if you're going CRV you're back in the boat of what the Escape offers and I think the Escape is a better choice than the CRV.

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  • VishNubVishNub Registered User regular
    In all seriousness, show up at a car max with a representative portion of the stuff you might want to fit in the new vehicle, then after test driving try to pack it in. You’ll get a much better idea of the space than looking at cubic feet measurements.

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  • Inquisitor77Inquisitor77 2 x Penny Arcade Fight Club Champion A fixed point in space and timeRegistered User regular
    bowen wrote: »
    I would be skeptical that a Fit would meet Iruka's use-case there. The HRV would be a better choice if she's looking for something that has some carrying capacity. The Fits are unimpressive in comparison and my ex's step-dad had one and was always making comments of "I really should've gotten the SUV instead" every time he visited us with his fishing stuff to go up to the St Lawrence.

    They absolutely are cheaper and they fit people but beyond that there isn't much to them. I agree that HRV/CRV are the better choices. Though check the maintenance on them, because I think they are on the higher end of maintenance costs in the Hondas too. Though if you're going CRV you're back in the boat of what the Escape offers and I think the Escape is a better choice than the CRV.

    I don't think anyone disagrees that there is more space with an actual SUV or crossover. The issue is that Iruka's specified cost puts many of them out of reach.

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  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    bowen wrote: »
    I would be skeptical that a Fit would meet Iruka's use-case there. The HRV would be a better choice if she's looking for something that has some carrying capacity. The Fits are unimpressive in comparison and my ex's step-dad had one and was always making comments of "I really should've gotten the SUV instead" every time he visited us with his fishing stuff to go up to the St Lawrence.

    They absolutely are cheaper and they fit people but beyond that there isn't much to them. I agree that HRV/CRV are the better choices. Though check the maintenance on them, because I think they are on the higher end of maintenance costs in the Hondas too. Though if you're going CRV you're back in the boat of what the Escape offers and I think the Escape is a better choice than the CRV.

    I don't think anyone disagrees that there is more space with an actual SUV or crossover. The issue is that Iruka's specified cost puts many of them out of reach.

    I don't disagree, cars like the Fit have like 0 carrying capacity if you're carrying two adults and like, a dog or a child or another person though. You'd be better off with an actual car instead of a car with a hatchback. Just make sure the car has the ability to lower the back seats and you'll likely have about twice as much ability to carry things.

    Ladies.
  • IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited March 4
    Just to clarify, Seeing if there were options in my range that fit the criteria was for sure my first goal. If there was some really obvious option for 12,000ish that was a large car, I didn't want to squash my partners wants and needs for price alone.

    It it seems like something like the escape could work, if hes willing to pick up a car with an extra 100k in miles on it. Its worth noting that, the reason I considered a hatchback is that he was mostly considering very small, 2 door trucks, like a toyota tachoma. So, hatchback with the seats down is still an upgrade from our versa with no fold down seats. And we very rarely are in the car with a 3rd passenger.

    When this one popped up on carmax, he balked at the color and the miles on it: (https://www.carmax.com/car/17155374), and I crossed over from being accommodating to being tired of waiting, and needing to understand what options are actually available so I can just get this shit done. In my opinion, cheapness is a pretty high priority. Getting a Fit that has a 150 monthly payment appeals to me since that's almost as cheap as getting a piece of shit off craigslist and being done with this two fucking years ago when I decided I wanted a car, and probably more responsible repairs wise.

    I could vent a lot about this, but I made the thread because when it comes down to it, I haven't been looking at our various options and expressing my needs with the sort of clarity that gets this sort of major purchase done and out of the way. I need to come at it knowing if we could compromise reasonably and consider the factors he wants without having to split a 350+ payment, which is just not the stage of finances we are at.

    Iruka on
  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    Shit for a 2013 tacoma that thing looks brand new.

    I wasn't sure how important the actual doing things part of all the stuff you wanted was, but if the price is the #1 priority (I hear ya) it's a good choice still. You just won't be able to chuck a bike or two in the back or something. But I suppose there are bike racks and rail kits for that (do the fits still come with roof racks??)

    Ladies.
    zepherin
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