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[Freedom Of Speech]: More Than The First Amendment

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    TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    Not to mention that is the same argument that social media uses to try to dodge their responsability as the ultimate authority on who is allowed and who isn't.

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    PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    People can say what they want. Freedom of speech is its own reward and does not entitle you to good PR.

    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
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    MonwynMonwyn Apathy's a tragedy, and boredom is a crime. A little bit of everything, all of the time.Registered User regular
    TryCatcher wrote: »
    Gawker kinda deserved what it happened to them since it was a judge that nailed them for actions that they decided to take.

    On Weinstein, fuck him. And fuck Downtime Bar for deciding that a rapist's money was the #1 priority.

    You mean the Florida judge who was given her post as a reward for defending the abuse of spousal rights who then abused Florida law to forestall any means of holding her accountable? Gawker's hands were far from clean, but there's a reason that Ventrue poster boy Peter Thiel manipulated the case to get it into that courtroom.

    Gawker posted revenge porn and defied a court order to take it down. The company deserved to die.

    uH3IcEi.png
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    AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Monwyn wrote: »
    TryCatcher wrote: »
    Gawker kinda deserved what it happened to them since it was a judge that nailed them for actions that they decided to take.

    On Weinstein, fuck him. And fuck Downtime Bar for deciding that a rapist's money was the #1 priority.

    You mean the Florida judge who was given her post as a reward for defending the abuse of spousal rights who then abused Florida law to forestall any means of holding her accountable? Gawker's hands were far from clean, but there's a reason that Ventrue poster boy Peter Thiel manipulated the case to get it into that courtroom.

    Gawker posted revenge porn and defied a court order to take it down. The company deserved to die.

    And now the way it was killed (which, mind you, was incredibly unethical/illegal given the way Thiel concealed his involvement in the matter) is now being used as a weapon against the press.

    The enemy of your enemy is your enemy's enemy, nothing more, as a wise pirate put it. And you should be careful about what you wish for, because you might just get it in a way you didn't intend.

    XBL: Nox Aeternum / PSN: NoxAeternum / NN:NoxAeternum / Steam: noxaeternum
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    ForarForar #432 Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    edited November 2019
    Wait, I remember going through a bunch of this in... I want to say one of the old Media threads, I don't recall it being hidden that Thiel was bankrolling the suit against Gawker. Unethical use of an entirely unrelated scenario to attack the company, sure, but "illegal" is quite the charge to put down.

    Sorry Hedgie, I'm by no means on Thiel's side here, but I'm gonna need a [Citation] on that.

    Edit: I'll note that a cursory Google search indicates some alleged illegal attempts to drop them prior to the suit, but I don't think "funding a suit for personal reasons" is illegal, though IANAL so I'm far from saying that definitively. It's certainly a bias, and I have no idea how much the courts need/require full disclosure up front on such things.

    Forar on
    First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
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    TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    Yep. When it was discovered that Thiel funded the Hogan lawsuit, he went and said: "Yes I did it, so what?":
    A 2007 article published by Gawker’s Valleywag blog was headlined, “Peter Thiel is totally gay, people.” That and a series of articles about his friends and others that he said “ruined people’s lives for no reason” drove Mr. Thiel to mount a clandestine war against Gawker. He funded a team of lawyers to find and help “victims” of the company’s coverage mount cases against Gawker.

    “It’s less about revenge and more about specific deterrence,” he said on Wednesday in his first interview since his identity was revealed. “I saw Gawker pioneer a unique and incredibly damaging way of getting attention by bullying people even when there was no connection with the public interest.”

    Mr. Thiel said that Gawker published articles that were “very painful and paralyzing for people who were targeted.” He said, “I thought it was worth fighting back.”

    Mr. Thiel added: “I can defend myself. Most of the people they attack are not people in my category. They usually attack less prominent, far less wealthy people that simply can’t defend themselves.” He said that “even someone like Terry Bollea who is a millionaire and famous and a successful person didn’t quite have the resources to do this alone.”

    Mr. Thiel said that he had decided several years ago to set his plan in motion. “I didn’t really want to do anything,” he said. “I thought it would do more harm to me than good. One of my friends convinced me that if I didn’t do something, nobody would.”

    You may say that Thiel was being manipulative. You may even call it unethical, though that's arguable. But so far, is not illegal.

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    PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    Funding someone else's lawsuit is called champerty, and while it used to be illegal, it isn't anymore

    Paladin on
    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
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    CoinageCoinage Heaviside LayerRegistered User regular
    I didn't wish for anything, I didn't get a vote in the results of Gawker defying a court order out of spite

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    HappylilElfHappylilElf Registered User regular
    Monwyn wrote: »
    TryCatcher wrote: »
    Gawker kinda deserved what it happened to them since it was a judge that nailed them for actions that they decided to take.

    On Weinstein, fuck him. And fuck Downtime Bar for deciding that a rapist's money was the #1 priority.

    You mean the Florida judge who was given her post as a reward for defending the abuse of spousal rights who then abused Florida law to forestall any means of holding her accountable? Gawker's hands were far from clean, but there's a reason that Ventrue poster boy Peter Thiel manipulated the case to get it into that courtroom.

    Gawker posted revenge porn and defied a court order to take it down. The company deserved to die.

    And now the way it was killed (which, mind you, was incredibly unethical/illegal given the way Thiel concealed his involvement in the matter) is now being used as a weapon against the press.

    The enemy of your enemy is your enemy's enemy, nothing more, as a wise pirate put it. And you should be careful about what you wish for, because you might just get it in a way you didn't intend.

    No, Gawker needed to die because they were a ridiculously unethical organization that preyed upon the worst in people in order to make a profit.

    I get that you don't like Thiel. I also don't like Thiel.

    But Gawker needed to be lanced like the ass boil that they were.

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    TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    Also: Gawker normalized doxxing as a legitimate tactic, instead of something that only the vile 4chan hordes did.

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    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    TryCatcher wrote: »
    Also: Gawker normalized doxxing as a legitimate tactic, instead of something that only the vile 4chan hordes did.

    British tabloids were doing it before Gawker.

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    TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    Just found out about this browsing MMO-Champion. A WoW Classic guild, The Enclave of the server Grobbulus (RP-PVP) had long been reported for being racist, and Rep. Lou Correa (D-California) asked Blizzard why is that being allowed again?:


    On a WoW thread of someone asking "Why Blizzard didn't do something before this?":
    I would like to bring a serious matter to the attention of the greater WoW classic community, and implore others to come to our assistance in letting Blizzard know that the WoW community does not tolerate racism/hate.

    Grobbulus (RP-PVP) has a guild that has been promoting racism/hate on our server for months now, and little has been done by Blizzard about it. Their guild is recruiting people and radicalizing them with hateful ideologies.

    Days before Blizzcon one of their racist screenshots which shows their guild leader in a white supremacist costume (with subtitles that were racist as well), attracted the attention of a US House Representative who represents the Anaheim area of California (where Blizzcon is held) and tweeted Blizzard about it. The person was only slapped on the wrist over it, and within days they will continue spreading hate/division on our server.

    Our server has been diligently reporting them every chance we can get, but Blizzard seems reluctant to fix the issue.

    Details @ {Removed - We do not allow player or guild callouts, please continue to report inappropriate chat/behavior}
    They are a mega guild on our server, and they have been causing great harm in the RP Events people organize here.

    At the halloween costume contest, their guild master (Who was dressed up as a white supremacist) had his guildies on Lvl 1 alts with Black skinned humans and he was dueling them and one-shotting them with his Gun as a caricature for murder/lynching.

    Their trolling of the RP event mixed with racism soured many on this server.

    Waiting for someone to defend this behavior

    Note that they waited until a US Representative called them out to ban the protagonist of that pic, the GM of The Enclave.

    A bunch of "hey, is free speech" posts later, they got this tepid response before the thread got locked:
    Unfortunately, an increasing number of the posts in this thread have focused at hurdling insults at other users so I am locking the thread as a result.

    Keep in mind, we do not allow call out threads. If you wish to discuss a topic related to World of Warcraft, please focus on that and not on a group or individuals. Please also do not insult others for their opinions. They may not be yours, but they have the right to them and to express them, as long as they are constructive and otherwise abide by our Code of Conduct.

    Lastly, we want our gaming communities to be a safe and welcoming place for all.

    If you witness language or subject matter that is inappropriate for this Teen Rated game, using the in-game right-click report 5 feature is the quickest way to bring it to our attention.

    TryCatcher on
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    PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    There is an argument for preserving Gawker's free speech rights, but it seems like the whole thing took place in the civil sphere, where you face consequences for all sorts of speech.

    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
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    VeeveeVeevee WisconsinRegistered User regular
    TryCatcher wrote: »
    Please also do not insult others for their opinions. They may not be yours, but they have the right to them and to express them, as long as they are constructive and otherwise abide by our Code of Conduct.

    Lastly, we want our gaming communities to be a safe and welcoming place for all.

    "They think you are a subhuman who deserves to be a slave and/or killed for entertainment. How dare you call them out on this."

    Fuuuuuuuuucckkk Yooooooouuuuu

    I am so very glad I stopped giving them my money a long time ago.

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    AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Paladin wrote: »
    There is an argument for preserving Gawker's free speech rights, but it seems like the whole thing took place in the civil sphere, where you face consequences for all sorts of speech.

    The problem is that Gawker wasn't killed for their actions - it was killed by a vindictive billionaire who didn't like how they held Silicon Valley to account, and was looking to bring the press to heel.

    Also, Paul Maidment is the first exec to G/O fuck himself:
    Paul Maidment resigned as editorial director of Deadspin’s parent company, G/O Media, on Tuesday just one week after the mass resignation of Deadspin staff in response to his “stick to sports” mandate.

    In a statement emailed to staff, Maidment wrote, “I wanted to let you all know that effective immediately I have resigned my position as Editorial Director of G/O Media. It is the right moment for me to leave to pursue an entrepreneurial opportunity.”

    XBL: Nox Aeternum / PSN: NoxAeternum / NN:NoxAeternum / Steam: noxaeternum
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    JuliusJulius Captain of Serenity on my shipRegistered User regular
    Monwyn wrote: »
    TryCatcher wrote: »
    Gawker kinda deserved what it happened to them since it was a judge that nailed them for actions that they decided to take.

    On Weinstein, fuck him. And fuck Downtime Bar for deciding that a rapist's money was the #1 priority.

    You mean the Florida judge who was given her post as a reward for defending the abuse of spousal rights who then abused Florida law to forestall any means of holding her accountable? Gawker's hands were far from clean, but there's a reason that Ventrue poster boy Peter Thiel manipulated the case to get it into that courtroom.

    Gawker posted revenge porn and defied a court order to take it down. The company deserved to die.

    An appeals court ruled that the injunction was a unconstitutional prior restraint on free speech, so Gawker wasn't wrong for not following it. Which seems reasonable given the nature of the case. Hogan initially requested an injunction in a different court and it was rejected, which explains Gawker's refusal.

    I don't think the sex tape qualifies as revenge porn, given that is lacks all the expected aspects of revenge porn. Hogan is a famous celebrity, and Gawker was obviously not trying to intimidate or blackmail him. Publishing a celebrity sex tape may well be an illegal violation of privacy, but it seems dubious to label it revenge porn.

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    JuliusJulius Captain of Serenity on my shipRegistered User regular
    like, a temporary injunction against speech is very rarely granted in the US for good reason. It is a restriction of first amendment rights before it is even determined by a court that the speech is not allowed. The ruling was completely demolished by the appeals court, which noted that the circuit court completely failed to explain why it was granting the order in the first place.

    The injunction was bullshit and Gawker was entirely right to defy it.

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    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    Paladin wrote: »
    There is an argument for preserving Gawker's free speech rights, but it seems like the whole thing took place in the civil sphere, where you face consequences for all sorts of speech.

    The problem is that Gawker wasn't killed for their actions - it was killed by a vindictive billionaire who didn't like how they held Silicon Valley to account, and was looking to bring the press to heel.

    Also, Paul Maidment is the first exec to G/O fuck himself:
    Paul Maidment resigned as editorial director of Deadspin’s parent company, G/O Media, on Tuesday just one week after the mass resignation of Deadspin staff in response to his “stick to sports” mandate.

    In a statement emailed to staff, Maidment wrote, “I wanted to let you all know that effective immediately I have resigned my position as Editorial Director of G/O Media. It is the right moment for me to leave to pursue an entrepreneurial opportunity.”

    gic2svqlsna3.png

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    TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    Well, posted around on the WoW Classic thread and it came up that Horrigan was bragging on 2009 that his guild, with the exact same name was being sponsored by goddamn Stormfront. Posted it on his guild website and all, the server subreddit digged out the archive.org link. Linking the reddit post since rather not link the original one.

    And of course that Blizzard banned only the GM and let the members split into splinter guilds and go "delete everything" until the heat dies off. If I was Rep. Correa, I would be pushing for an FBI inquiry about what the fuck is happening on Blizzard's mod team, since there's enough to suspect a racist mole inside it.

    TryCatcher on
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    TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    There was also an audio of a guild meeting and there's a Reddit thread with transcripts. Full blown cult behaviour there, picked some examples:
    "We decided to delete everything that had any guild or officer chat"

    "Many of us were in these videos saying things that could get us in trouble and Buzz (Horrigan) protected us by deleting it"

    "If you are going to be in <The Enclave> then you need to be smart and not associate your real life accounts with your Enclave persona"

    Yep, the Grand Wizard's answer to "we can get fired or arrested for being here" is "tough shit".

    And this bit:
    "You're dumb if you actually believe him saying he's a ghost is him fully believing he's a ghost"

    "It's clear that he wasn't, but the reason why there's deniability and no one wants to take responsibility for it is because of the insane dogpile that took place over a fucking r*******d joke costume. It shouldn't have escalated to this."

    Remember this every time that someone deflects with "Is just a joke, bro". Is always 100% arse-covering.

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    AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Bama on free speech - not fans:
    The Student Government Association at the University of Alabama is warning groups that protesting President Trump during the Tide’s Saturday game vs. LSU could result in loss of reserved seating for the remainder of the season.

    A letter from Jason Rothfarb, vice president of Student Affairs, said additional security will be in Bryant Denny’s student section during the Saturday afternoon football game. President Trump is expected to be in the audience.

    Disruptive protests against the president will have consequences, Rothfarb wrote.

    “Any organizations that engage in disruptive behavior during the game will be removed from block seating instantly for the remainder of the season,” he wrote.

    XBL: Nox Aeternum / PSN: NoxAeternum / NN:NoxAeternum / Steam: noxaeternum
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    SleepSleep Registered User regular
    If you boo the president you get kicked out? Fuckin lol he has to find the friendliest fuckin marketplace possible and still has to threaten the audience to not boo him or else.

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    TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    The story of racists on WoW Classic got picked up by VICE.
    A California congressman is calling out Blizzard for allowing online Nazis to roam Azeroth in World of Warcraft.

    Rep. Lou Correa of Anaheim shamed the company on Twitter after a member of his staff who plays the legendary MMORPG noticed other players hosting a racist Halloween costume contest inside of the game.

    The player, who runs a racist, anti-semitic guild called "Enclave" had his avatar dressed up in white robes and a white hood—an obvious allusion to the garb of the Klu Klux Klan—with two avatars appearing as slaves beside him (one named "Jesse Jackson," referring to the civil rights leader.) The player commented “next stop Charlottesville” in a screenshot taken by a staffer and posted by Correa, referring to the 2017 white nationalist rally in Charlottesville where a white nationalist terrorist killed an anti-racist protester with his car during the protest.

    The more steam it grabs, the more Blizzard will be forced to actually do something about it, like, for starters, banning everybody that is and was on that guild and pass their information to the FBI.

    EDIT: Also the mods of /r/wow and /r/classicwow are removing the news because they have a "No Politics" rule. Likely got told by Blizz to bury it in order to keep their "access".

    TryCatcher on
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    PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    Any lawyers want to tell me if that would hold up in court?

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    GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    If what would hold up in court?

    WOW stuff? Unless they're talking about taking actual illegal action then no, nothing will hold up in Court and the FBI can't really do much. (Besides monitor the groups and determine if they're a terrorist threat)
    Julius wrote: »
    Monwyn wrote: »
    TryCatcher wrote: »
    Gawker kinda deserved what it happened to them since it was a judge that nailed them for actions that they decided to take.

    On Weinstein, fuck him. And fuck Downtime Bar for deciding that a rapist's money was the #1 priority.

    You mean the Florida judge who was given her post as a reward for defending the abuse of spousal rights who then abused Florida law to forestall any means of holding her accountable? Gawker's hands were far from clean, but there's a reason that Ventrue poster boy Peter Thiel manipulated the case to get it into that courtroom.

    Gawker posted revenge porn and defied a court order to take it down. The company deserved to die.

    An appeals court ruled that the injunction was a unconstitutional prior restraint on free speech, so Gawker wasn't wrong for not following it. Which seems reasonable given the nature of the case. Hogan initially requested an injunction in a different court and it was rejected, which explains Gawker's refusal.

    I don't think the sex tape qualifies as revenge porn, given that is lacks all the expected aspects of revenge porn. Hogan is a famous celebrity, and Gawker was obviously not trying to intimidate or blackmail him. Publishing a celebrity sex tape may well be an illegal violation of privacy, but it seems dubious to label it revenge porn.

    To expand: Gawker should not have published the tape but it was both legal under the law and consistent with prior rulings. They died because Thiel wanted to kill them and because their CEO was a twat not because they were acting outside the bounds of journalistic integrity.

    wbBv3fj.png
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    reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    Hey, you guys remember that whole thing a while back when Activision-Blizzard went way overboard to prostrate themselves before China when a player on their stream had the temerity to say something political about a situation relating to China on Blizzard's video game stream, because they got scared that China wouldn't like such things and that might cause them to make less money in the Chinese market?

    Well, as it happens, China is placing restrictions on minors and gaming.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-50315960
    Gamers under 18 will be banned from playing online between 22:00 and 08:00. They will also be restricted to 90 minutes of gaming on weekdays and three hours on weekends and holidays.

    Its part of China's latest move to curb video game addiction, which officials say is damaging to children's health.

    ... Gamers eight to 16 years old can spend up to 200 yuan (£22, $29) per month, while those between 16 and 18 years can spend up to 400 yuan on their gaming accounts. ...

    Now, it's only for minors, there'll still be plenty of adults doing the video gaming. However, I can't help but wonder what kind of effect this will have on future generations who will have learned to spend only a small amount of their time gaming. I don't really see that generation growing into a robust video game purchasing audience.

    And of course, there's nothing stopping them from placing limitations like this on adults, either. If they do that, there goes that whole market.

    reVerse on
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    shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    reVerse wrote: »
    Hey, you guys remember that whole thing a while back when Activision-Blizzard went way overboard to prostrate themselves before China when a player on their stream had the temerity to say something political about a situation relating to China on Blizzard's video game stream, because they got scared that China wouldn't like such things and that might cause them to make less money in the Chinese market?

    Well, as it happens, China is placing restrictions on minors and gaming.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-50315960
    Gamers under 18 will be banned from playing online between 22:00 and 08:00. They will also be restricted to 90 minutes of gaming on weekdays and three hours on weekends and holidays.

    Its part of China's latest move to curb video game addiction, which officials say is damaging to children's health.

    ... Gamers eight to 16 years old can spend up to 200 yuan (£22, $29) per month, while those between 16 and 18 years can spend up to 400 yuan on their gaming accounts. ...

    Now, it's only for minors, there'll still be plenty of adults doing the video gaming. However, I can't help but wonder what kind of effect this will have on future generations who will have learned to spend only a small amount of their time gaming. I don't really see that generation growing into a robust video game purchasing audience.

    And of course, there's nothing stopping them from placing limitations like this on adults, either. If they do that, there goes that whole market.

    Korea has been doing this for almost a decade afaik. Hasn't hurt the industry there that I'm aware of.

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    kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    I kinda don't mind those regulations...

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    MortiousMortious The Nightmare Begins Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    I kinda don't mind those regulations...

    I don't like the fact that they need those types of regulations, but assuming they're doing this because it's an actual problem they have and not just for shit and giggles, I'm for it.

    And selfishly, maybe major publishers trying to get into the Chinese market will start making their games slightly less 2nd jobish if this has an impact.

    Move to New Zealand
    It’s not a very important country most of the time
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/mortious
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    Stabbity StyleStabbity Style He/Him | Warning: Mothership Reporting Kennewick, WARegistered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    I kinda don't mind those regulations...

    I dunno, I'm pretty sure I would've hated them as a kid. Though seeing how I turned out, maybe they'd be a good thing.

    Stabbity_Style.png
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    Blackhawk1313Blackhawk1313 Demon Hunter for Hire Time RiftRegistered User regular
    The problem I see with it is how do you enforce it, and the only answer I see or true enforcement is even more big brother style control and monitoring of people. Not sure something that sounds good on paper like that is worth how they are going to actually put it in to practice given their track record.

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    kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    I kinda don't mind those regulations...

    I dunno, I'm pretty sure I would've hated them as a kid. Though seeing how I turned out, maybe they'd be a good thing.

    Well sure, but I generally don't judge things by how I'd have felt about it as a kid :P

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    JuliusJulius Captain of Serenity on my shipRegistered User regular
    The problem I see with it is how do you enforce it, and the only answer I see or true enforcement is even more big brother style control and monitoring of people. Not sure something that sounds good on paper like that is worth how they are going to actually put it in to practice given their track record.

    Part of the proposal is implementing the (existing) real-name registration system for all online gaming accounts and more strictly enforcing it. It's not really going to require any more big brothering than already takes place. It's basically just requiring you to upload valid ID info for a steam account like you do for an airbnb account. With that it's trivial to limit gaming time for minors.

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    HappylilElfHappylilElf Registered User regular
    Julius wrote: »
    The problem I see with it is how do you enforce it, and the only answer I see or true enforcement is even more big brother style control and monitoring of people. Not sure something that sounds good on paper like that is worth how they are going to actually put it in to practice given their track record.

    Part of the proposal is implementing the (existing) real-name registration system for all online gaming accounts and more strictly enforcing it. It's not really going to require any more big brothering than already takes place. It's basically just requiring you to upload valid ID info for a steam account like you do for an airbnb account. With that it's trivial to limit gaming time for minors.

    Except that swiping mom or dad's driver's license for a couple of minutes isn't exactly epic heist territory.

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    The WolfmanThe Wolfman Registered User regular
    Julius wrote: »
    The problem I see with it is how do you enforce it, and the only answer I see or true enforcement is even more big brother style control and monitoring of people. Not sure something that sounds good on paper like that is worth how they are going to actually put it in to practice given their track record.

    Part of the proposal is implementing the (existing) real-name registration system for all online gaming accounts and more strictly enforcing it. It's not really going to require any more big brothering than already takes place. It's basically just requiring you to upload valid ID info for a steam account like you do for an airbnb account. With that it's trivial to limit gaming time for minors.

    Except that swiping mom or dad's driver's license for a couple of minutes isn't exactly epic heist territory.

    Up until the kid fucks up somewhere. Either by actively messing up and causing Big Brother to come knocking (threatens another player or spouts anti-government speech and gets ratted out). Or even passively, like say the parent applies for a job, and during the interview the company says they're not interested in an employee who spends 10 hours a day playing CoD. And I very much doubt a government willing to implement these rules is going to accept the excuse of "Well I had no idea, my child must have stolen my identity!".

    You're basically committing identity theft on the single worst identity to steal.

    "The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
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    RaijuRaiju Shoganai JapanRegistered User regular
    edited November 2019
    This seemed relevant to free speech and freedom of the press:

    John Oliver's Last Week Tonight has a brilliant episode on SLAPP lawsuits: the type of frivolous anti-libel/slander litigation that big corporations and rich douche-canoes use to sue critics, protestors, and investigative journalists in an effort to intimidate and financially destroy them into silence (the type of litigation that Trump loves to curb freedom of speech and the press).

    https://youtu.be/UN8bJb8biZU

    Raiju on
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    HappylilElfHappylilElf Registered User regular
    Julius wrote: »
    The problem I see with it is how do you enforce it, and the only answer I see or true enforcement is even more big brother style control and monitoring of people. Not sure something that sounds good on paper like that is worth how they are going to actually put it in to practice given their track record.

    Part of the proposal is implementing the (existing) real-name registration system for all online gaming accounts and more strictly enforcing it. It's not really going to require any more big brothering than already takes place. It's basically just requiring you to upload valid ID info for a steam account like you do for an airbnb account. With that it's trivial to limit gaming time for minors.

    Except that swiping mom or dad's driver's license for a couple of minutes isn't exactly epic heist territory.

    Up until the kid fucks up somewhere. Either by actively messing up and causing Big Brother to come knocking (threatens another player or spouts anti-government speech and gets ratted out). Or even passively, like say the parent applies for a job, and during the interview the company says they're not interested in an employee who spends 10 hours a day playing CoD. And I very much doubt a government willing to implement these rules is going to accept the excuse of "Well I had no idea, my child must have stolen my identity!".

    You're basically committing identity theft on the single worst identity to steal.

    And so we're back to the point Blackhawk was originally making
    The problem I see with it is how do you enforce it, and the only answer I see or true enforcement is even more big brother style control and monitoring of people. Not sure something that sounds good on paper like that is worth how they are going to actually put it in to practice given their track record.

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    The WolfmanThe Wolfman Registered User regular
    Julius wrote: »
    The problem I see with it is how do you enforce it, and the only answer I see or true enforcement is even more big brother style control and monitoring of people. Not sure something that sounds good on paper like that is worth how they are going to actually put it in to practice given their track record.

    Part of the proposal is implementing the (existing) real-name registration system for all online gaming accounts and more strictly enforcing it. It's not really going to require any more big brothering than already takes place. It's basically just requiring you to upload valid ID info for a steam account like you do for an airbnb account. With that it's trivial to limit gaming time for minors.

    Except that swiping mom or dad's driver's license for a couple of minutes isn't exactly epic heist territory.

    Up until the kid fucks up somewhere. Either by actively messing up and causing Big Brother to come knocking (threatens another player or spouts anti-government speech and gets ratted out). Or even passively, like say the parent applies for a job, and during the interview the company says they're not interested in an employee who spends 10 hours a day playing CoD. And I very much doubt a government willing to implement these rules is going to accept the excuse of "Well I had no idea, my child must have stolen my identity!".

    You're basically committing identity theft on the single worst identity to steal.

    And so we're back to the point Blackhawk was originally making
    The problem I see with it is how do you enforce it, and the only answer I see or true enforcement is even more big brother style control and monitoring of people. Not sure something that sounds good on paper like that is worth how they are going to actually put it in to practice given their track record.

    Well like some people said, it's my understanding that online games already have this system in place, requiring you to login to play online. That login simply requires real ID, and at that point all this is easily monitored and enforced. Now sure, there's probably no way to enforce how long you play something like a Game Boy under your bed covers, or a PS4 offline. But if they really wanted to go hog wild... well always online DRM consoles are extremely easy to make. If console makers actually got on board with this to appease the Chinese market, then it's trivial for a Chinese PS5 to require a login to play. Then we're right back to the identity problem. Steal your parents ID and potentially run it into the mud at your own peril.

    "The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
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    HefflingHeffling No Pic EverRegistered User regular
    I think we'll see Chinese game systems move to online only.

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    MortiousMortious The Nightmare Begins Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    And even if it's not 100% effective, you just need to put up enough barriers to stop if from being a population sized problem.

    Put out those regulations and most parents will probably start enforcing curfews/screen time since thye'll be on the hook when the school complains.

    Put active measures againsts online only games (which I am going to guess are the main culprit anyway these days) and that weeds out a number again.

    You wont get everybody, but you don't need to.

    (Also I can't help but wonder where I would be in life if we had something like that :P)

    Move to New Zealand
    It’s not a very important country most of the time
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/mortious
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