The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
I feel like that's overly pedantic when "waggle" works well as a general dismissive term for motion controls in general (and was clearly the mode in which the word was being used), but if that distinction is important to you I guess that's a thing.
I have only ever seen "waggle" used to mean "motion control I don't like". When they like it, people say "oh, it has motion controls"; when they don't, they say "oh, it's got some dumb waggle".
edit: Dang, now I'm brainstorming. Something like this could actually work really, really well in the mold that BotW is already set. Say the game didn't give you all of the major items in the starting area, and when you activated a dungeon there was a sort of "authentication" to verify whether you had the ones necessary. Maybe even a "proceed anyway" option, since lord knows there's a bazillion ways to abuse the engine that the developers weren't aware of. So you go, dang, I can't do this one yet. But think about how BotW is structured: it's literally "you can go anywhere." Being that shrines and various points of interest are just dots on a map, not really walled off, you can just continue on whatever path you were already going. No backtracking necessary. And when you do get the right runes, well, you activated that shrine--just warp back.
In what way do you feel this would improve your gaming experience? To me, this would be exhausting - now I have to tag this on my map as something I haven't done yet, and then remember to come back to it later. Rather than being a piece of game I can do right now, it becomes a chore I will have to return to in the future. Or, well, that's how it seems to me, anyway.
The big thing that has me excited for BotW 2 is the fact that it'll be built elusively with the Switch in mind, instead of having to be cross-platform with the Wii U. Not sure how much further they'll push the engine or mechanics, but it's something that can be explored (and is exciting).
So long as it doesn't involve more waggle.
BotW doesn't have any waggle. Waggle is mapping a button-press action to an arbitrary movement, like the sword swinging in TP. It doesn't mean 'motion controls I don't like'.
what an oddly prescriptivist take
I don't think you'll get many people to agree with you that "waggle" has a strict definition in regards to video game control schemes
Well, we can have an actual useful word created to describe the 'bad' kind of motion controls or we can just say that words have no meaning, sure. While we're at it, BotW is a fighting game, because you fight people in it.
You're being an incredible goose.
PSN/XBL/Nintendo/Origin/Steam: Nightslyr 3DS: 1607-1682-2948 Switch: SW-3515-0057-3813 FF XIV: Q'vehn Tia
I really hope that BOTW2 either substantially changes the Hyrule Overworld, or doesn't feature it at all. I'd love to traverse a sort of Hyrule Underworld/DarkWorld/Subterranean Labyrinth System that Runs Under Hyrule. If I wanted to go back to BOTW Hyrule...I'd boot up BOTW.
I thought it was very interesting that someone said that they thought BOTW's overworld was empty, because I couldn't feel more opposite! It's packed with little oddities, treasures to find, small puzzles to solve, people to talk to, and just genuinely cool set pieces. I can see how it would seem empty if you get on your horse and let it guide you around, or just run from point A to point B. But if you're like me and like to stop and sniff the roses, there are a lot of roses for sure. In my 150+ hours with the game I never thought "this part of the overworld is boring" except for the Desert...but when I came back to play the DLC, I realized that there was a ton of stuff in the desert that I just hadn't bothered to find! To be fair, I haven't played many other open world games in recent years- if they've all gotten this good (or better!) I will need to rectify that, for sure.
Yeah, BotW's overworld never felt empty to me either. There's space, but I knew I was never more than a minute or two from something interesting, even if that something was just a hill to surf down.
I hope the new one hits up the Dark World, and goes full weird with it. Upside-down mountains, suspended seas, places that transform at different times of day.
I really hope that BOTW2 either substantially changes the Hyrule Overworld, or doesn't feature it at all. I'd love to traverse a sort of Hyrule Underworld/DarkWorld/Subterranean Labyrinth System that Runs Under Hyrule. If I wanted to go back to BOTW Hyrule...I'd boot up BOTW.
I thought it was very interesting that someone said that they thought BOTW's overworld was empty, because I couldn't feel more opposite! It's packed with little oddities, treasures to find, small puzzles to solve, people to talk to, and just genuinely cool set pieces. I can see how it would seem empty if you get on your horse and let it guide you around, or just run from point A to point B. But if you're like me and like to stop and sniff the roses, there are a lot of roses for sure. In my 150+ hours with the game I never thought "this part of the overworld is boring" except for the Desert...but when I came back to play the DLC, I realized that there was a ton of stuff in the desert that I just hadn't bothered to find! To be fair, I haven't played many other open world games in recent years- if they've all gotten this good (or better!) I will need to rectify that, for sure.
Post finishing the DLC, i spent SO MUCH time just biking all over the place. I will note i enjoyed the snowy areas and desert a whole lot less (As they curtail your choices/mobility a lot more) but still, exploring the overworld was just a joy. There's so many weird and fun little things to find
In what way do you feel this would improve your gaming experience? To me, this would be exhausting - now I have to tag this on my map as something I haven't done yet, and then remember to come back to it later. Rather than being a piece of game I can do right now, it becomes a chore I will have to return to in the future. Or, well, that's how it seems to me, anyway.
Something that qualifies Zelda to a gold standard, to me, is using the game world and what you find in it as a metric for character progression and fostering a relationship between the player and that world that deepens the further you get. With "go anywhere, do anything," everything starts to get...soupy. It feels less like progression and more like "a customized experience." Major game abilities all being available nigh from the start removes the gradual intimacy. Getting further in the game adds nothing to how you're able to interact with the world.
The formula as-is also suffers problems with hinging on a free-roaming shtick only to make apparent there really is more deliberate underlying pathing for certain parts, not by necessity but for a more optimal or logical sequence: For example, I did the desert before I did death mountain, only to discover the death mountain beast's gimmick is a simpler version of the exact same one in the desert's, with damage scaled way back to account for heat resistant gear that it assumes you haven't upgraded. Or exploring the Heron Mountain regions and finding the shack containing a diary that reads, "Hey there traveler, come sit here a spell, I have my own house here up the mountain, wonder if you can find it?" Yeah I'm pretty sure I can, I just met you like ten minutes ago.
I guess it boils down to a different-strokes situation. I don't find anything wrong with having to deduce a solution that might involve acknowledging a few wrong turns and getting back on the right path. The road to those discoveries still makes for a compelling experience. Meanwhile, a game that takes pains to spare me obstacles to progression just becomes boring, and all the ingenuous engineering quirks in the game become little more than novel means to occupy me in spite of itself.
Thoughts:
- Weather is neat. Make the new climbing outfit allow the player to climb in rain.
- Chests absolutely need unique stuff in them. I was pretty quick to stop fighting enemy outposts because there was no reward worth expending weapons and arrows for. Oh? An opal, I blew up a rock and got five about half a mile from here. A weapon? Yeah I’m full up.
- Let me pitch you: Unbreakable Charms! Stick an Unbreakable Charm on a weapon and it doesn’t break. Maybe there’s only five in the game. If you throw the Unbreakable Charm away with a weapon it reappears in your inventory because of the magic.
- More wands! They’re fun, underrated and hard to find.
- Wizzrobes don’t exist. I mean it. There’s a few of them dotted about the map, but why are they there? No reason. Bring them back exactly as they are and put them in a dungeon. They need purpose!
- If some version of the Korok seeds exist it’d be swell if they said something unique. Yes, that’s 900 unique sentences, I know, but if they talked about where you found them think of all the fun geographic lore and terrible plant puns!
- It'd be nice if enemy outposts were mini-dungeons. I mean, three or four rooms would do, or an interesting vista to fight in. There’s this one ruin infested with lizalfoes in the major river area that touches on what I think would be better than the current bunch of mooks in a hut.
- Last thought: Roaming bosses. The big monsters are pretty conveniently dormant or asleep in one place, making you the aggressor in the fight. It’d be cool if a gohma had a mile wide patrol path (with a bit of random direction choice to keep it loose) that went up mountainsides and underwater, forcing you to keep on your toes in their neighbourhood.
*Unless you make a puzzle mountain that needs some other way of being traversed, like internally, then the rain stops when you reach the top.
The formula as-is also suffers problems with hinging on a free-roaming shtick only to make apparent there really is more deliberate underlying pathing for certain parts, not by necessity but for a more optimal or logical sequence: For example, I did the desert before I did death mountain, only to discover the death mountain beast's gimmick is a simpler version of the exact same one in the desert's, with damage scaled way back to account for heat resistant gear that it assumes you haven't upgraded.
All of the Divine Beasts' gimmicks are the same. You need to weaken them by shooting things at them. The Death Mountain one is the easiest because you don't need to aim for specific targets on the Beast, but the general idea is the same for all of them.
Regarding the flow of the game, I think it depends on what your priorities are. If you just want the standard Zelda experience - clear dungeons, gain abilities, get the Master Sword, kill Ganon - then, yeah, it's probably a bit disappointing. For me, my main goal when playing was to find all the memories so I could learn Zelda's story. That leads to a lot of exploration (especially if you don't just go online to see where they are), which in turn leads to a lot of side quests and other activities. Buying and decorating your own home, building and populating a village, finding shrines and koroks, hunting the big monsters (the giants, the rock guys, the Lynels, the dragons), finding the great faries... There's a ton of stuff to do and people to interact with, but virtually none of it is on the main path.
PSN/XBL/Nintendo/Origin/Steam: Nightslyr 3DS: 1607-1682-2948 Switch: SW-3515-0057-3813 FF XIV: Q'vehn Tia
+3
Ninja Snarl PMy helmet is my burden.Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered Userregular
In what way do you feel this would improve your gaming experience? To me, this would be exhausting - now I have to tag this on my map as something I haven't done yet, and then remember to come back to it later. Rather than being a piece of game I can do right now, it becomes a chore I will have to return to in the future. Or, well, that's how it seems to me, anyway.
Something that qualifies Zelda to a gold standard, to me, is using the game world and what you find in it as a metric for character progression and fostering a relationship between the player and that world that deepens the further you get. With "go anywhere, do anything," everything starts to get...soupy. It feels less like progression and more like "a customized experience." Major game abilities all being available nigh from the start removes the gradual intimacy. Getting further in the game adds nothing to how you're able to interact with the world.
The formula as-is also suffers problems with hinging on a free-roaming shtick only to make apparent there really is more deliberate underlying pathing for certain parts, not by necessity but for a more optimal or logical sequence: For example, I did the desert before I did death mountain, only to discover the death mountain beast's gimmick is a simpler version of the exact same one in the desert's, with damage scaled way back to account for heat resistant gear that it assumes you haven't upgraded. Or exploring the Heron Mountain regions and finding the shack containing a diary that reads, "Hey there traveler, come sit here a spell, I have my own house here up the mountain, wonder if you can find it?" Yeah I'm pretty sure I can, I just met you like ten minutes ago.
I guess it boils down to a different-strokes situation. I don't find anything wrong with having to deduce a solution that might involve acknowledging a few wrong turns and getting back on the right path. The road to those discoveries still makes for a compelling experience. Meanwhile, a game that takes pains to spare me obstacles to progression just becomes boring, and all the ingenuous engineering quirks in the game become little more than novel means to occupy me in spite of itself.
The "go anywhere" thing was a total dud for me and everyone else I know that's a fan of the series. Enormous amount of bloat in the form of hugely repetitive temples and dungeons, and dropping the hallmark items from prior games means zero feeling of mastering the world via completing temples and expanding your abilities. There's like five hours of actual game buried under a hundred hours of doing the same things over and over, but there was really no choice except to do that once the devs decided to throw out progression and unique items from the game design. If you can't rely on having guided a player through a certain set of experiences, there's no way to build up the game experience and instead you just have to keep running the same low-level stuff endlessly.
I will be supremely disappointed if the next game is built the same way. It's a huge copout for putting together decent dungeons and story, thinly veiled by masses of doing the same thing over and over again.
Well I got the blue flame all the way to the place and now I don't know what to do with it. Guess I'm not supposed to do this yet.
Talk to the NPCs inside?
There's only a broken robot, a diary, and a korok up top.
I left and will go back later. Lost Woods time now. This is the best the Lost Woods has ever been, honestly. Though the stealth trial was kind of a pain keeping an eye on them in undocked mode.
Well I got the blue flame all the way to the place and now I don't know what to do with it. Guess I'm not supposed to do this yet.
Talk to the NPCs inside?
There's only a broken robot, a diary, and a korok up top.
I left and will go back later. Lost Woods time now. This is the best the Lost Woods has ever been, honestly. Though the stealth trial was kind of a pain keeping an eye on them in undocked mode.
Wait, are you in the southeast or Northeast of the map?
In what way do you feel this would improve your gaming experience? To me, this would be exhausting - now I have to tag this on my map as something I haven't done yet, and then remember to come back to it later. Rather than being a piece of game I can do right now, it becomes a chore I will have to return to in the future. Or, well, that's how it seems to me, anyway.
Something that qualifies Zelda to a gold standard, to me, is using the game world and what you find in it as a metric for character progression and fostering a relationship between the player and that world that deepens the further you get. With "go anywhere, do anything," everything starts to get...soupy. It feels less like progression and more like "a customized experience." Major game abilities all being available nigh from the start removes the gradual intimacy. Getting further in the game adds nothing to how you're able to interact with the world.
The formula as-is also suffers problems with hinging on a free-roaming shtick only to make apparent there really is more deliberate underlying pathing for certain parts, not by necessity but for a more optimal or logical sequence: For example, I did the desert before I did death mountain, only to discover the death mountain beast's gimmick is a simpler version of the exact same one in the desert's, with damage scaled way back to account for heat resistant gear that it assumes you haven't upgraded. Or exploring the Heron Mountain regions and finding the shack containing a diary that reads, "Hey there traveler, come sit here a spell, I have my own house here up the mountain, wonder if you can find it?" Yeah I'm pretty sure I can, I just met you like ten minutes ago.
I guess it boils down to a different-strokes situation. I don't find anything wrong with having to deduce a solution that might involve acknowledging a few wrong turns and getting back on the right path. The road to those discoveries still makes for a compelling experience. Meanwhile, a game that takes pains to spare me obstacles to progression just becomes boring, and all the ingenuous engineering quirks in the game become little more than novel means to occupy me in spite of itself.
OK, I feel you on all that - but I do think that this approach inherently conflicts with an open world design.
The Metroidvania school of design (Note: traditional Zelda is a Metroidvania) carves up a game space into zones, and then gradually doles out keys to those zones over the course of the game (the keys can be actual keys, or items, or spells, or whatever, so long as they get you past a barrier that you couldn't get past without that "key"). The path a character takes through the game is carefully planned and predictable. Sure, sometimes you can go down Corridor A or Corridor B, but you will always have to go down both corridors before you can go through Door C.
Open world games, typically, do not restrict the player in such a way. Some areas can be harder for a low-level/under-equipped character, or some encounter can be very hard one way or trivial if you first get an item from across the map, but usually you're not inherently blocked from an area/fight/etc until you get the right key.
I may be wrong, and maybe someone can figure out a way to combine the "open world" approach with the "metered progress" approach in a way that doesn't feel unsatisfying. I hope it happens! I just can't personally see how to.
Also, to be clear, I think a Metroidvania-style design - where you have to explore and feel out the boundaries of what's possible for you and then come back later once you've gotten some new tool - is cool and good and I'm into it. I thought you were proposing something like "BotW except sometimes the shrines are locked because you don't have the green keycard yet", which... seems less satisfying to me than "A dungeon where you can't unlock the third sub-basement because you don't have the slime-gun yet".
Well I got the blue flame all the way to the place and now I don't know what to do with it. Guess I'm not supposed to do this yet.
Talk to the NPCs inside?
There's only a broken robot, a diary, and a korok up top.
I left and will go back later. Lost Woods time now. This is the best the Lost Woods has ever been, honestly. Though the stealth trial was kind of a pain keeping an eye on them in undocked mode.
Wait, are you in the southeast or Northeast of the map?
I'm in the Lost Woods now, wherever that is. North middle?
Before it was the broken lighthouse in the NE. I'm trying to avoid death mountain because uuuugh climate hazards.
Well I got the blue flame all the way to the place and now I don't know what to do with it. Guess I'm not supposed to do this yet.
Talk to the NPCs inside?
There's only a broken robot, a diary, and a korok up top.
I left and will go back later. Lost Woods time now. This is the best the Lost Woods has ever been, honestly. Though the stealth trial was kind of a pain keeping an eye on them in undocked mode.
Wait, are you in the southeast or Northeast of the map?
I'm in the Lost Woods now, wherever that is. North middle?
Before it was the broken lighthouse in the NE. I'm trying to avoid death mountain because uuuugh climate hazards.
The broken lighthouse should have 2 people inside. You can't miss them so maybe you haven't done some other prerequisite that causes them to show up. They were there the first time i made it there.
Yeah it doesn't. Just an old dude's diary and a broken robot he realllllllly wanted to fuck until his (much) younger wife stepped up and said cut that shit out.
Well I got the blue flame all the way to the place and now I don't know what to do with it. Guess I'm not supposed to do this yet.
Talk to the NPCs inside?
There's only a broken robot, a diary, and a korok up top.
I left and will go back later. Lost Woods time now. This is the best the Lost Woods has ever been, honestly. Though the stealth trial was kind of a pain keeping an eye on them in undocked mode.
Wait, are you in the southeast or Northeast of the map?
I'm in the Lost Woods now, wherever that is. North middle?
Before it was the broken lighthouse in the NE. I'm trying to avoid death mountain because uuuugh climate hazards.
The broken lighthouse should have 2 people inside. You can't miss them so maybe you haven't done some other prerequisite that causes them to show up. They were there the first time i made it there.
Im going off memory here, so apologies if I'm misremembering
I believe you have to complete the Hateno Labs stuff before the lighthouse stuff is accessible.
Well I got the blue flame all the way to the place and now I don't know what to do with it. Guess I'm not supposed to do this yet.
Talk to the NPCs inside?
There's only a broken robot, a diary, and a korok up top.
I left and will go back later. Lost Woods time now. This is the best the Lost Woods has ever been, honestly. Though the stealth trial was kind of a pain keeping an eye on them in undocked mode.
Wait, are you in the southeast or Northeast of the map?
I'm in the Lost Woods now, wherever that is. North middle?
Before it was the broken lighthouse in the NE. I'm trying to avoid death mountain because uuuugh climate hazards.
The broken lighthouse should have 2 people inside. You can't miss them so maybe you haven't done some other prerequisite that causes them to show up. They were there the first time i made it there.
Im going off memory here, so apologies if I'm misremembering
I believe you have to complete the Hateno Labs stuff before the lighthouse stuff is accessible.
Yeah that spoiler makes sense. I had done that before i went to that Northeast area.
Good job nintendo, putting your combat tutorial up hidden out of the way on a hill behind Kakariko village. I only found it because I tried to warp back there, realized that I didn't have a warp there, and went looking for one.
but still. Good job everyone. That'll make some things easier I bet.
+3
HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
... That shrine is hardly hidden whatsoever. I think that complaint is a little disingenuous.
I mean if you play the game linearly, following the suggestion to go to Kakariko village, after talking to Impa you'll see a new NPC in the town - the old man that does some painting. He gives you a quest and runs up the hill and very much leads you to the shrine (and points you in the direction of the fairy fountain in the forest beyond).
Ok, if you do those things. And if you don't you don't see it because it's a game where you can go anywhere whenever you want and they put the tutorial in one spot outside of the tutorial area.
There is always the chance that somebody is going to miss "the thing". It doesn't matter how much you signpost it, put flashing lights on it, whatever. Somebody somewhere is going to fall through the cracks and miss it.
The only solution is to literally grab the player by the back of the neck and force them to look.
It's a "pick your poison" type of situation. Force the tutorial which everybody hates, but has a 100% success rate. Or go the organic route which everybody loves, but will always have a minimum 1% failure rate, regardless of how well you pull it off.
"The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
+3
HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
I'm confused, which do you want - the game to instruct you, or the ability to go wherever and learn as you go (and maybe not learn some things)? You can't have both.
This thread (and its previous incarnations) has been full of people learning things about Breath of the Wild well after their own playthrough. A lot of us didn't know that (RE: The Master Sword)
trying to 'throw' the Master Sword results in shooting the laser, for example.
0
The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
Y'all there's already 4 tutorial shrines on the plateau, this is just suggesting adding one more for thing you'll be doing more than every other tutorialized thing throughout the game.
Telling you a certain combination of inputs lets you dodge is not handholding, it's literally the basis of the entire combat system.
There's also a few missable tutorials on the Great Plateau - pretty much every area has the old man available for explaining how to cook food, hunt boars, or whatever.
And the whole Kakariko-Hateno bit is kind of an extended tutorial as well, really. It's got the advanced combat tutorial, the horse-catching tutorial, a guide-posted great fairy, a bunch of beginner-friendly sidequests, Hestu... Also, well, there's some stuff locked behind the Hateno bit of the main quest.
+2
AbsoluteZeroThe new film by Quentin KoopantinoRegistered Userregular
I appreciated the lack of hand holding in BOTW, personally.
Posts
You're being an incredible goose.
Switch: SW-3515-0057-3813 FF XIV: Q'vehn Tia
I thought it was very interesting that someone said that they thought BOTW's overworld was empty, because I couldn't feel more opposite! It's packed with little oddities, treasures to find, small puzzles to solve, people to talk to, and just genuinely cool set pieces. I can see how it would seem empty if you get on your horse and let it guide you around, or just run from point A to point B. But if you're like me and like to stop and sniff the roses, there are a lot of roses for sure. In my 150+ hours with the game I never thought "this part of the overworld is boring" except for the Desert...but when I came back to play the DLC, I realized that there was a ton of stuff in the desert that I just hadn't bothered to find! To be fair, I haven't played many other open world games in recent years- if they've all gotten this good (or better!) I will need to rectify that, for sure.
Let's Plays of Japanese Games
I hope the new one hits up the Dark World, and goes full weird with it. Upside-down mountains, suspended seas, places that transform at different times of day.
Post finishing the DLC, i spent SO MUCH time just biking all over the place. I will note i enjoyed the snowy areas and desert a whole lot less (As they curtail your choices/mobility a lot more) but still, exploring the overworld was just a joy. There's so many weird and fun little things to find
Steam: https://steamcommunity.com/id/TheZombiePenguin
Stream: https://www.twitch.tv/thezombiepenguin/
Switch: 0293 6817 9891
Bonus, the rain put out the nearby campfire so I can't rest past it. Guess I'll wait on this hill for the storm to pass.
Something that qualifies Zelda to a gold standard, to me, is using the game world and what you find in it as a metric for character progression and fostering a relationship between the player and that world that deepens the further you get. With "go anywhere, do anything," everything starts to get...soupy. It feels less like progression and more like "a customized experience." Major game abilities all being available nigh from the start removes the gradual intimacy. Getting further in the game adds nothing to how you're able to interact with the world.
The formula as-is also suffers problems with hinging on a free-roaming shtick only to make apparent there really is more deliberate underlying pathing for certain parts, not by necessity but for a more optimal or logical sequence: For example, I did the desert before I did death mountain, only to discover the death mountain beast's gimmick is a simpler version of the exact same one in the desert's, with damage scaled way back to account for heat resistant gear that it assumes you haven't upgraded. Or exploring the Heron Mountain regions and finding the shack containing a diary that reads, "Hey there traveler, come sit here a spell, I have my own house here up the mountain, wonder if you can find it?" Yeah I'm pretty sure I can, I just met you like ten minutes ago.
I guess it boils down to a different-strokes situation. I don't find anything wrong with having to deduce a solution that might involve acknowledging a few wrong turns and getting back on the right path. The road to those discoveries still makes for a compelling experience. Meanwhile, a game that takes pains to spare me obstacles to progression just becomes boring, and all the ingenuous engineering quirks in the game become little more than novel means to occupy me in spite of itself.
- Weather is neat. Make the new climbing outfit allow the player to climb in rain.
- Chests absolutely need unique stuff in them. I was pretty quick to stop fighting enemy outposts because there was no reward worth expending weapons and arrows for. Oh? An opal, I blew up a rock and got five about half a mile from here. A weapon? Yeah I’m full up.
- Let me pitch you: Unbreakable Charms! Stick an Unbreakable Charm on a weapon and it doesn’t break. Maybe there’s only five in the game. If you throw the Unbreakable Charm away with a weapon it reappears in your inventory because of the magic.
- More wands! They’re fun, underrated and hard to find.
- Wizzrobes don’t exist. I mean it. There’s a few of them dotted about the map, but why are they there? No reason. Bring them back exactly as they are and put them in a dungeon. They need purpose!
- If some version of the Korok seeds exist it’d be swell if they said something unique. Yes, that’s 900 unique sentences, I know, but if they talked about where you found them think of all the fun geographic lore and terrible plant puns!
- It'd be nice if enemy outposts were mini-dungeons. I mean, three or four rooms would do, or an interesting vista to fight in. There’s this one ruin infested with lizalfoes in the major river area that touches on what I think would be better than the current bunch of mooks in a hut.
- Last thought: Roaming bosses. The big monsters are pretty conveniently dormant or asleep in one place, making you the aggressor in the fight. It’d be cool if a gohma had a mile wide patrol path (with a bit of random direction choice to keep it loose) that went up mountainsides and underwater, forcing you to keep on your toes in their neighbourhood.
*Unless you make a puzzle mountain that needs some other way of being traversed, like internally, then the rain stops when you reach the top.
Talk to the NPCs inside?
All of the Divine Beasts' gimmicks are the same. You need to weaken them by shooting things at them. The Death Mountain one is the easiest because you don't need to aim for specific targets on the Beast, but the general idea is the same for all of them.
Regarding the flow of the game, I think it depends on what your priorities are. If you just want the standard Zelda experience - clear dungeons, gain abilities, get the Master Sword, kill Ganon - then, yeah, it's probably a bit disappointing. For me, my main goal when playing was to find all the memories so I could learn Zelda's story. That leads to a lot of exploration (especially if you don't just go online to see where they are), which in turn leads to a lot of side quests and other activities. Buying and decorating your own home, building and populating a village, finding shrines and koroks, hunting the big monsters (the giants, the rock guys, the Lynels, the dragons), finding the great faries... There's a ton of stuff to do and people to interact with, but virtually none of it is on the main path.
Switch: SW-3515-0057-3813 FF XIV: Q'vehn Tia
The "go anywhere" thing was a total dud for me and everyone else I know that's a fan of the series. Enormous amount of bloat in the form of hugely repetitive temples and dungeons, and dropping the hallmark items from prior games means zero feeling of mastering the world via completing temples and expanding your abilities. There's like five hours of actual game buried under a hundred hours of doing the same things over and over, but there was really no choice except to do that once the devs decided to throw out progression and unique items from the game design. If you can't rely on having guided a player through a certain set of experiences, there's no way to build up the game experience and instead you just have to keep running the same low-level stuff endlessly.
I will be supremely disappointed if the next game is built the same way. It's a huge copout for putting together decent dungeons and story, thinly veiled by masses of doing the same thing over and over again.
This game will not hold your hand and tell you exactly what you need to do every step of the way.
That wouldn't be a fun game at all.
This game is a quest.
Go explore.
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
There's only a broken robot, a diary, and a korok up top.
I left and will go back later. Lost Woods time now. This is the best the Lost Woods has ever been, honestly. Though the stealth trial was kind of a pain keeping an eye on them in undocked mode.
Wait, are you in the southeast or Northeast of the map?
The Metroidvania school of design (Note: traditional Zelda is a Metroidvania) carves up a game space into zones, and then gradually doles out keys to those zones over the course of the game (the keys can be actual keys, or items, or spells, or whatever, so long as they get you past a barrier that you couldn't get past without that "key"). The path a character takes through the game is carefully planned and predictable. Sure, sometimes you can go down Corridor A or Corridor B, but you will always have to go down both corridors before you can go through Door C.
Open world games, typically, do not restrict the player in such a way. Some areas can be harder for a low-level/under-equipped character, or some encounter can be very hard one way or trivial if you first get an item from across the map, but usually you're not inherently blocked from an area/fight/etc until you get the right key.
I may be wrong, and maybe someone can figure out a way to combine the "open world" approach with the "metered progress" approach in a way that doesn't feel unsatisfying. I hope it happens! I just can't personally see how to.
I'm in the Lost Woods now, wherever that is. North middle?
Before it was the broken lighthouse in the NE. I'm trying to avoid death mountain because uuuugh climate hazards.
The broken lighthouse should have 2 people inside. You can't miss them so maybe you haven't done some other prerequisite that causes them to show up. They were there the first time i made it there.
Can't wait to meet the old creepo.
Im going off memory here, so apologies if I'm misremembering
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Yeah that spoiler makes sense. I had done that before i went to that Northeast area.
So not 95+ hours,
but still. Good job everyone. That'll make some things easier I bet.
I mean if you play the game linearly, following the suggestion to go to Kakariko village, after talking to Impa you'll see a new NPC in the town - the old man that does some painting. He gives you a quest and runs up the hill and very much leads you to the shrine (and points you in the direction of the fairy fountain in the forest beyond).
Have that shrine be on the plateau and required.
The only solution is to literally grab the player by the back of the neck and force them to look.
It's a "pick your poison" type of situation. Force the tutorial which everybody hates, but has a 100% success rate. Or go the organic route which everybody loves, but will always have a minimum 1% failure rate, regardless of how well you pull it off.
This thread (and its previous incarnations) has been full of people learning things about Breath of the Wild well after their own playthrough. A lot of us didn't know that (RE: The Master Sword)
Telling you a certain combination of inputs lets you dodge is not handholding, it's literally the basis of the entire combat system.
Very similar to a lot of the previous games
hold button down to focus a target, another button to jump around
If you're brand brand new to these kinds of games, well then if you don't follow the "linear" story then that's on you buddy
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
And the whole Kakariko-Hateno bit is kind of an extended tutorial as well, really. It's got the advanced combat tutorial, the horse-catching tutorial, a guide-posted great fairy, a bunch of beginner-friendly sidequests, Hestu... Also, well, there's some stuff locked behind the Hateno bit of the main quest.