[Board Games] Cardboard Action at a Distance

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  • jakobaggerjakobagger LO THY DREAD EMPIRE CHAOS IS RESTORED Registered User regular
    edited February 16
    jakobagger wrote: »
    Played Dogs of War again tonight, first time in a while. We haven't played it that much but it felt like a game where everybody had some idea of what was going on, enough that there were more deals and negotiation than we've seen before.

    Apart from me still being really crap at the game (as I am at anything similar with this particular kind of. . .area control auction??) a big takeaway was that Stormcrow's special ability seems far weaker than the other ones. Lady Macbeth's has seemed OP but this game backfired because everybody constantly tried to be on the other side of battles from the Lady Macbeth player. Consistent and conscious metagame is a kind of balancing I guess? As a fan of eg. CiTOW I guess I can't be too dismissive of that idea.

    But anyway, is Stormcrow really as bad as it seems? Am I overvaluing the character abilities? How can I become even just ok at this kind of game, apart from being psychic and/or counting cards.

    which is the stormcrow benefit? Tiebreaking? We've found that one to be pretty strong. I vaguely think we find the dollar for winning and the card for winning to be the weak ones. I don't remember our take on free retreats

    Stormcrow is 'free retreats' which just means you don't get points for their captains when they're on the losing side. Which seems like something you can't really actively play to much, and doesn't give you any benefit directly. I guess it makes it less attractive to fight against Stormcrow though.

    Tiebreaker for bonus rewards is MacBeth/Pink which as I said we also consider the strongest so far. The extra bonuses for winning amount to a few extra coin each turn which makes the economy of getting new soldiers much smoother but no, they're not spectacular.

    I guess the brown power to shift the battle track by two points is also kind of a tie-breaker, if that's the one you mean. Not completely sure how good the ability itself is, but the brown player was only 3 points from winning yesterday. Yellow (coins for being on the winning side in battles) won with 76 points.

    jakobagger on
  • PowerpuppiesPowerpuppies Registered User regular
    Brown and pink are really good. I'm not convinced stormcrow is bad, because it directly benefits you in that it robs your opponents of a source of points, so it's a nerf to everyone not you. It seems like it hurts them more if there are fewer players, just theorycrafting? So that's weird.

    I think you are overvaluing character abilities, probably, yeah - the heart of the game is being someone who wins a lot of shield points. I don't actually know how to affect that, though? It seems like it relies on nobody knowing you have a ton of that houses shield and tanking the value. So maybe that means we should try to keep track of who gets which shields, and announce it to the table so nobody sneaks 30 points past everyone?

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  • JonBobJonBob Registered User regular
    Brown and pink are really good. I'm not convinced stormcrow is bad
    I lost the topic of conversation, and briefly thought this was about Wingspan and probably that was an Australian bird from the next expansion.

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  • AmarylAmaryl Registered User regular
    Played a game of Splotter's Antiquity, and I liked it a lot. It was a bit light on interaction, but I was engrossed enough in the puzzle aspect, (not the tetris, but the turn planning) to not mind. I really like how the game board just changes over time with every action you take, and you're slowly getting squeezed out of the game. I'm not sure how well this game will hold up after 4-5 plays once you figure out the puzzle to optimize your play, but as of now, I really want to play again, as every turn I saw just how i had fucked up and set my progress back a turn.

    That al said, damn the production quality is a mess. its so fiddly, and the different goods and buildings are hard to differentiate, i played the version with the black pollution disks, and wooden inns, I don't know how the earlier versions were very playable.

  • TertieeTertiee Registered User regular
    Recently played Architects of the West Kingdom, a worker placement game with a few gameplay twists. Workers are plentiful and for most locations you don't block others from going there. You want to keep revisiting locations because you get more resources for each of your workers present. However, if your opponents feel you are getting too much they will send all your workers at a location to jail for a coin per head. I like the interaction the jail mechanic brings and it doesn't feel too "take that" since getting workers out of jail is cheaper than getting them back yourself. Also there's a virtue track where if you have a lot you score points but can't use black market locations. If you have too few then you lose points but get to avoid paying taxes.

    Overall I enjoyed the game quite a bit though next time I will pass on using the variable player powers. I felt they guided your gameplay strategy a bit too much for my liking.

    Evil Multifarious
  • jakobaggerjakobagger LO THY DREAD EMPIRE CHAOS IS RESTORED Registered User regular
    Brown and pink are really good. I'm not convinced stormcrow is bad, because it directly benefits you in that it robs your opponents of a source of points, so it's a nerf to everyone not you. It seems like it hurts them more if there are fewer players, just theorycrafting? So that's weird.

    I think you are overvaluing character abilities, probably, yeah - the heart of the game is being someone who wins a lot of shield points. I don't actually know how to affect that, though? It seems like it relies on nobody knowing you have a ton of that houses shield and tanking the value. So maybe that means we should try to keep track of who gets which shields, and announce it to the table so nobody sneaks 30 points past everyone?

    The brown player who almost won very much prioritized getting shields and the three houses he had the most from all ended up at 3 points.

    Before this game we'd been playing it wrongly I think, where houses got a minus every time they lost a battle. But checking the rules the other day as far as I understood it only crushing defeats (15 points against on the battle track) will give a minus, and the also advance the winner 2 spaces instead of the normal 1.

    Which seems to make shields more worthwhile and less risky than we thought. And also means there's not a huge disincentive to just getting a bunch of different shields, since you can pretty well ensure they'll at least be worth 1, maybe more.

  • LykouraghLykouragh Registered User regular
    edited February 18
    Picked up the new Terra Mystica expansion with ships yesterday and it looks great. Looks like it maybe adds a touch more player interaction, because you can trade with a player using your ship, which gives you some VP and resources and the person you're trading with additional power.

    Lykouragh on
  • PowerpuppiesPowerpuppies Registered User regular
    jakobagger wrote: »
    Brown and pink are really good. I'm not convinced stormcrow is bad, because it directly benefits you in that it robs your opponents of a source of points, so it's a nerf to everyone not you. It seems like it hurts them more if there are fewer players, just theorycrafting? So that's weird.

    I think you are overvaluing character abilities, probably, yeah - the heart of the game is being someone who wins a lot of shield points. I don't actually know how to affect that, though? It seems like it relies on nobody knowing you have a ton of that houses shield and tanking the value. So maybe that means we should try to keep track of who gets which shields, and announce it to the table so nobody sneaks 30 points past everyone?

    The brown player who almost won very much prioritized getting shields and the three houses he had the most from all ended up at 3 points.

    Before this game we'd been playing it wrongly I think, where houses got a minus every time they lost a battle. But checking the rules the other day as far as I understood it only crushing defeats (15 points against on the battle track) will give a minus, and the also advance the winner 2 spaces instead of the normal 1.

    Which seems to make shields more worthwhile and less risky than we thought. And also means there's not a huge disincentive to just getting a bunch of different shields, since you can pretty well ensure they'll at least be worth 1, maybe more.

    Yeah but at least one color will be worth a lot. Crazy that yellow managed to win it brown had three colors of 3 point shields, yellow must have played very well

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  • Ah_PookAh_Pook Registered User regular
    https://www.asmodeena.com/en/customer-service-faq/

    Asmodee's new parts replacement plan is, in essence, "go fuck yourself". Basically they say return a game with missing parts to the store you bought it from, and then the store can get a replacement copy from Asmodee for you.

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  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus premium Registered User regular
    Ah_Pook wrote: »
    https://www.asmodeena.com/en/customer-service-faq/

    Asmodee's new parts replacement plan is, in essence, "go fuck yourself". Basically they say return a game with missing parts to the store you bought it from, and then the store can get a replacement copy from Asmodee for you.

    Between this and killing off FFG's RPG division, it seems like the venture capitalists have decided that enough time has passed since their initial acquisitions to start gutting the shit out of everything for some quick returns before leaving the beast to bleed to death from self-inflicted wounds.

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  • DirtmuncherDirtmuncher Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Ah_Pook wrote: »
    https://www.asmodeena.com/en/customer-service-faq/

    Asmodee's new parts replacement plan is, in essence, "go fuck yourself". Basically they say return a game with missing parts to the store you bought it from, and then the store can get a replacement copy from Asmodee for you.

    Between this and killing off FFG's RPG division, it seems like the venture capitalists have decided that enough time has passed since their initial acquisitions to start gutting the shit out of everything for some quick returns before leaving the beast to bleed to death from self-inflicted wounds.

    Go capitalism!

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  • BloodySlothBloodySloth Registered User regular
    Hoh-lee shit. Their old system was so customer-friendly, too. I just passed this news to two of my roommates who used to work for FFG and their jaws dropped. One of them is legit pissed.

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  • GvzbgulGvzbgul Ask me about my scrotalist agenda Registered User regular
    It doesnt seem that bad to me. Am i missing something?

  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus premium Registered User regular
    Gvzbgul wrote: »
    It doesnt seem that bad to me. Am i missing something?

    Did you read the link?

    It used to be that you could email FFG about the issue, they ask for your proof of purchase or a picture of the issue, and they'd mail you the replacement pieces.

    My friend had a copy of Fury of Dracula that was missing the Dracula mini. I got a copy of Dungeonquest that came with a German-language board. Both of our issues were resolved quickly after an email.

    Under this new system, we would have to take the copy of our game back to where we bought it... and hope that they had another copy that we could exchange it for. Then the game store was stuck with the bum copy until they got a new replacement from Asmodee - or they would make you wait for the replacement copy!

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  • antheremantherem Registered User regular
    Guess I won't be giving any Asmodee products as gifts anymore!

    Magic Pink
  • GvzbgulGvzbgul Ask me about my scrotalist agenda Registered User regular
    I dunno, "return the defective item and get a new item" seems pretty standard to me. Their old system was very nice. But that only makes this system "not so nice", its hardly terrible.

    Fry
  • webguy20webguy20 I Spend too much time on the Internet Registered User regular
    Welp "A King's Dilemma" is sold out everywhere locally. Why do all the good SUSD reviewed games always seem to be in between printings. Last time I had this kind of trouble it was with "Welcome To", and only the sad rarely visited game store had a copy, so I got lucky. Not so much this time.

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  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus premium Registered User regular
    Gvzbgul wrote: »
    I dunno, "return the defective item and get a new item" seems pretty standard to me. Their old system was very nice. But that only makes this system "not so nice", its hardly terrible.

    "Return to the store where you originally purchased the game with proof of purchase, and they will be able to request a replacement copy of the game from Asmodee USA or their distributor. When they receive it, you will be able to exchange your defective copy for the new one, subject to availablity and store policy. For issues unrelated to missing or damaged components, your store’s regular return/exchange policies will apply."

    You have to return it to the store, and they have to accept it, for you to get a replacement. They don't just send you the piece that's defective or missing, they send you a totally new copy.

    Besides being unnecessarily convoluted and relying on the seller to assist you, it's also inefficient.

    Like with shuttering their RPG department, it's not that it was bad business for them. It's that they're trying to maximize profit at the expense of customer service and what we actually want.

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  • antheremantherem Registered User regular
    Trying to figure out how it would even work if you buy pre-release Asmodee products at GenCon or something, get it home, and it's suffered the incredibly common card-sorter-screwed-up error where you don't have the right components; would that count as their webstore? Do you have to wait for next year's GenCon to replace it?
    It doesn't seem like they thought this through at all. And retailers didn't even know this was happening.

    Elvenshae
  • ArcSynArcSyn Registered User regular
    Makes me think of when I got Kingdom Builder big box at a con, and all of the game boards were missing. Vendor didn't have another, and their store was almost 2 hours from me. Queen fortunately just sent me replacements from Germany, but with this deal? Would have been such a headache.

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    antherem
  • Mojo_JojoMojo_Jojo Like a bad lobster in a dark cellar Registered User regular
    webguy20 wrote: »
    Welp "A King's Dilemma" is sold out everywhere locally. Why do all the good SUSD reviewed games always seem to be in between printings. Last time I had this kind of trouble it was with "Welcome To", and only the sad rarely visited game store had a copy, so I got lucky. Not so much this time.

    It's not that they all happen to be between printings, SUSD reviews drive massive rushes on games and printing leadtimes are often longer than hype cycles

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  • MrBodyMrBody Registered User regular
    edited February 19
    Finished 5th game of War of Whispers.

    I don't dislike it, but I don't think I'm going to bring it out again. If someone asked for it I'd play, but I'm not going to propose it, and I bought the thing!

    I still think it's weighted too heavily on crazy out of nowhere card plays, and players who don't know what they can all do are sunk. Careful, long term positioning seems secondary.

    I also think that it only really works with exactly 3 players. 2 loses most of the intrigue feeling, and with 4 the action spaces get clogged up too quickly and it feels like there isn't much choice beyond the halfway point.

    There's also the issue of length. It has the same person problem I had with Terraforming Mar, where its entire appeal was quick, light play and if you have even one AP player (or someone insists on draft) that pushes the play time beyond a certain point, I have zero interest in playing it. In two games of WoW, we had an AP player who took forever and pushed the game well past an hour. I did not enjoy those games.

    I dunno. I've definitely lost any excitement for it. It seems I only like SU&SD games that come with conditional recommendations. Every single one of their gushing recommendations I've been lukewarm on or outright disliked.

    MrBody on
    antherem
  • Mojo_JojoMojo_Jojo Like a bad lobster in a dark cellar Registered User regular
    Ah_Pook wrote: »
    https://www.asmodeena.com/en/customer-service-faq/

    Asmodee's new parts replacement plan is, in essence, "go fuck yourself". Basically they say return a game with missing parts to the store you bought it from, and then the store can get a replacement copy from Asmodee for you.

    Rubbish. Hopefully the rest of the industry doesn't decide to follow this

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  • ArcticLancerArcticLancer Best served chilled. Registered User regular
    edited February 19
    [Edit] NVM, bad choice of wording on their part.
    Exchanges on websites is kind of insane, frankly ... That's such a headache for everyone involved. :|


    Unrelated, we played the 2nd edition of Endeavor last night, and man, the first edition wasn't bad, but this one is excellent. Thinning out Europe makes the game feel so much better and clip along so much faster. One of the rare games where it feels bigger and deeper than its play time. If you enjoyed the first version of the game at all, you really owe it to yourself to look into this one~

    ArcticLancer on
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  • antheremantherem Registered User regular
    MrBody wrote: »
    Finished 5th game of War of Whispers.

    I don't dislike it, but I don't think I'm going to bring it out again. If someone asked for it I'd play, but I'm not going to propose it, and I bought the thing!

    I still think it's weighted too heavily on crazy out of nowhere card plays, and players who don't know what they can all do are sunk. Careful, long term positioning seems secondary.

    I also think that it only really works with exactly 3 players. 2 loses most of the intrigue feeling, and with 4 the action spaces get clogged up too quickly and it feels like there isn't much choice beyond the halfway point.

    There's also the issue of length. It has the same person problem I had with Terraforming Mar, where its entire appeal was quick, light play and if you have even one AP player (or someone insists on draft) that pushes the play time beyond a certain point, I have zero interest in playing it. In two games of WoW, we had an AP player who took forever and pushed the game well past an hour. I did not enjoy those games.

    I dunno. I've definitely lost any excitement for it. It seems I only like SU&SD games that come with conditional recommendations. Every single one of their gushing recommendations I've been lukewarm on or outright disliked.

    I've noticed that too, like how they were lukewarm on Letter Jam but it's a smash hit here, and Welcome To fell super flat.

  • ArcticLancerArcticLancer Best served chilled. Registered User regular
    Whoa, whoa, whoa ... are you telling me that people have preferences?

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  • ArcSynArcSyn Registered User regular
    Whoa, whoa, whoa ... are you telling me that people have preferences?

    We don't stand for that kinda talk around here.

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  • antheremantherem Registered User regular
    Whoa, whoa, whoa ... are you telling me that people have preferences?

    Eh, more that theirs haven't been aligning with that of my group as much lately. Which is fine!

  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User regular
    Whoa, whoa, whoa ... are you telling me that people have preferences?
    My preference is to live within a house with walls made of board games.

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  • FryFry Registered User regular
    antherem wrote: »
    MrBody wrote: »
    Finished 5th game of War of Whispers.

    I don't dislike it, but I don't think I'm going to bring it out again. If someone asked for it I'd play, but I'm not going to propose it, and I bought the thing!

    I still think it's weighted too heavily on crazy out of nowhere card plays, and players who don't know what they can all do are sunk. Careful, long term positioning seems secondary.

    I also think that it only really works with exactly 3 players. 2 loses most of the intrigue feeling, and with 4 the action spaces get clogged up too quickly and it feels like there isn't much choice beyond the halfway point.

    There's also the issue of length. It has the same person problem I had with Terraforming Mar, where its entire appeal was quick, light play and if you have even one AP player (or someone insists on draft) that pushes the play time beyond a certain point, I have zero interest in playing it. In two games of WoW, we had an AP player who took forever and pushed the game well past an hour. I did not enjoy those games.

    I dunno. I've definitely lost any excitement for it. It seems I only like SU&SD games that come with conditional recommendations. Every single one of their gushing recommendations I've been lukewarm on or outright disliked.

    I've noticed that too, like how they were lukewarm on Letter Jam but it's a smash hit here, and Welcome To fell super flat.

    I'm hopeful that the lukewarm review of Marvel Champions means I'm going to enjoy it a lot. Still waiting on the discount game sellers to get it back in stock, I don't want to pay MSRP and I definitely don't want to pay above MSRP as I have seen several places.

    antherem
  • tyrantula22tyrantula22 Registered User regular
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    Whoa, whoa, whoa ... are you telling me that people have preferences?
    My preference is to live within a house with walls made of board games.

    I think I'd rather have the walls hidden by bookshelves of board games. You take the wrong game out of your wall of games and your whole house will come down! :biggrin:

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  • A Half Eaten OreoA Half Eaten Oreo Registered User regular
    Fry wrote: »
    antherem wrote: »
    MrBody wrote: »
    Finished 5th game of War of Whispers.

    I don't dislike it, but I don't think I'm going to bring it out again. If someone asked for it I'd play, but I'm not going to propose it, and I bought the thing!

    I still think it's weighted too heavily on crazy out of nowhere card plays, and players who don't know what they can all do are sunk. Careful, long term positioning seems secondary.

    I also think that it only really works with exactly 3 players. 2 loses most of the intrigue feeling, and with 4 the action spaces get clogged up too quickly and it feels like there isn't much choice beyond the halfway point.

    There's also the issue of length. It has the same person problem I had with Terraforming Mar, where its entire appeal was quick, light play and if you have even one AP player (or someone insists on draft) that pushes the play time beyond a certain point, I have zero interest in playing it. In two games of WoW, we had an AP player who took forever and pushed the game well past an hour. I did not enjoy those games.

    I dunno. I've definitely lost any excitement for it. It seems I only like SU&SD games that come with conditional recommendations. Every single one of their gushing recommendations I've been lukewarm on or outright disliked.

    I've noticed that too, like how they were lukewarm on Letter Jam but it's a smash hit here, and Welcome To fell super flat.

    I'm hopeful that the lukewarm review of Marvel Champions means I'm going to enjoy it a lot. Still waiting on the discount game sellers to get it back in stock, I don't want to pay MSRP and I definitely don't want to pay above MSRP as I have seen several places.

    Have they mentioned anything about a campaign expansion for Champions? I want to play it, but without a campaign mode I have a hard time justifying spending on it instead of more Arkham.

  • FryFry Registered User regular
    Fry wrote: »
    I'm hopeful that the lukewarm review of Marvel Champions means I'm going to enjoy it a lot. Still waiting on the discount game sellers to get it back in stock, I don't want to pay MSRP and I definitely don't want to pay above MSRP as I have seen several places.

    Have they mentioned anything about a campaign expansion for Champions? I want to play it, but without a campaign mode I have a hard time justifying spending on it instead of more Arkham.

    They have said it's coming, but not when, and there have been no details. I'm considering it vaporware until proven otherwise.

  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    Fry wrote: »
    Fry wrote: »
    I'm hopeful that the lukewarm review of Marvel Champions means I'm going to enjoy it a lot. Still waiting on the discount game sellers to get it back in stock, I don't want to pay MSRP and I definitely don't want to pay above MSRP as I have seen several places.

    Have they mentioned anything about a campaign expansion for Champions? I want to play it, but without a campaign mode I have a hard time justifying spending on it instead of more Arkham.

    They have said it's coming, but not when, and there have been no details. I'm considering it vaporware until proven otherwise.

    Actually, it was stated to be the July release. Back when they previewed the release layout for April-July.

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  • sullijosullijo mid-level minion subterranean bunkerRegistered User regular
    Hahnsoo1 wrote: »
    Whoa, whoa, whoa ... are you telling me that people have preferences?
    My preference is to live within a house with walls made of board games.

    I think I'd rather have the walls hidden by bookshelves of board games. You take the wrong game out of your wall of games and your whole house will come down! :biggrin:

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  • MrBodyMrBody Registered User regular
    antherem wrote: »
    Whoa, whoa, whoa ... are you telling me that people have preferences?

    Eh, more that theirs haven't been aligning with that of my group as much lately. Which is fine!

    The only thing that ultimately matters with a review is how useful it is to making a purchase decision or not. Their gushing reviews have been so consistently tepid with me, that I take them being in total love with a game as a red flag from now on. That ends up being more useful than a reviewer who's on the money half the time and wrong the other half.

    No need to get snippy about it, Mr Lancer.

    antherem
  • ArcSynArcSyn Registered User regular
    I think it was in jest. We've covered the topic again and again of trying to find a reviewer who can determine, either through a positive correlation, or a negative one, how you might feel about a game.

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  • FishmanFishman The most famous of which is "Never get involved in a land war in Asia!" HAHAHAHAHAHAH-Registered User regular
    Unrelated, we played the 2nd edition of Endeavor last night, and man, the first edition wasn't bad, but this one is excellent. Thinning out Europe makes the game feel so much better and clip along so much faster. One of the rare games where it feels bigger and deeper than its play time. If you enjoyed the first version of the game at all, you really owe it to yourself to look into this one~

    I agree with this review. I always felt the first edition had a slow build up but ended just as you got your engine set up; the new rules and map pushes you along into mid-game faster, allowing the end game to have more diversity. I need to give the kickstarter mini-expansions a spin as I think they should accentuate that end game even more.

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  • A Half Eaten OreoA Half Eaten Oreo Registered User regular
    ArcSyn wrote: »
    I think it was in jest. We've covered the topic again and again of trying to find a reviewer who can determine, either through a positive correlation, or a negative one, how you might feel about a game.

    I still haven’t found that person for me. I guess mashing ‘No Pun Included’ and ‘The Players Aid’ would come the closest, but still not quite right.

    I still watch a lot of the bigger reviewers, I just tend to prioritize the ones that give good and clear explanations on gameplay rather than on their opinion on the game.

    antherem
  • jakobaggerjakobagger LO THY DREAD EMPIRE CHAOS IS RESTORED Registered User regular
    edited February 19
    jakobagger wrote: »
    Brown and pink are really good. I'm not convinced stormcrow is bad, because it directly benefits you in that it robs your opponents of a source of points, so it's a nerf to everyone not you. It seems like it hurts them more if there are fewer players, just theorycrafting? So that's weird.

    I think you are overvaluing character abilities, probably, yeah - the heart of the game is being someone who wins a lot of shield points. I don't actually know how to affect that, though? It seems like it relies on nobody knowing you have a ton of that houses shield and tanking the value. So maybe that means we should try to keep track of who gets which shields, and announce it to the table so nobody sneaks 30 points past everyone?

    The brown player who almost won very much prioritized getting shields and the three houses he had the most from all ended up at 3 points.

    Before this game we'd been playing it wrongly I think, where houses got a minus every time they lost a battle. But checking the rules the other day as far as I understood it only crushing defeats (15 points against on the battle track) will give a minus, and the also advance the winner 2 spaces instead of the normal 1.

    Which seems to make shields more worthwhile and less risky than we thought. And also means there's not a huge disincentive to just getting a bunch of different shields, since you can pretty well ensure they'll at least be worth 1, maybe more.

    Yeah but at least one color will be worth a lot. Crazy that yellow managed to win it brown had three colors of 3 point shields, yellow must have played very well

    Brown messed up his last turn somewhat and didn't have soldier cards for all his captains. Think he only had like, three footmen.

    Edit: also, it was the brown player's first time playing the game, everyone else had played at least once.

    jakobagger on
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