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The FBI is watching me. They put cameras in my computer.
Peter Principle
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Registered User regular
I recently found out that an immediate relative of mine is suffering from full blown delusional paranoia. What's the right way to handle it if their delusion manifests itself in conversation? The subject line is basically a direct quote. How should I respond if they say something like that to me? Play along? Redirect to something innocuous? Contradict, say that no one is out to get her and her family isn't part of a conspiracy? Try to prove that what she's imagining isn't real?
"A man is likely to mind his own business when it is worth minding. When it is not, he takes his mind off his own meaningless affairs by minding other people's business." - Eric Hoffer, _The True Believer_
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Ask her to open up Notepad and type "hello to my friends in the CIA!" and see if anyone responds!
3ds friend code: 2981-6032-4118
I would try to change the subject. I mean, it seems to me that playing along would only make their paranoia worse. Talk about other things, preferably unrelated. You may have to improvise.
Wow.
Bravo, H&A. Bravo.
To the OP: If the person is already getting treatment/therapy for it, I'd say to just take these comments in stride. Gloss them over in the conversation or whatever. Don't try to directly argue; that road just leads to frustration. A paranoid can argue a point with no logic or evidence backing him/her up longer than a creationist can.
If they're not getting or seeking therapy, well, that's the first step. Can't help you much on that one, though.
if you constantly change the subject
hey
these guys won't talk about the fbi monitoring me
they must be in on it
also Raslin please don't be so stupid
If possible, I would do the redirect to something innocuous, let the professionals handle delusions.
keep changing the subject, and keep treating them like a broken peice of shit, and they will never trust you, nor give a shit about you again.
3ds friend code: 2981-6032-4118
I'm going to offer you some advice. Shut up, you cunt.
Mods fuckin' notified.
Now, when you say she has full blown delusional paranoia, who diagnosed her?
Be careful when you talk to paranoids, they can get violent if they decide that you’re after them. For safety’s sake I would recommend being very careful around her until she is on medication and mentally stable. If you live with her, put a keyed lock on your bedroom door so she can’t get in at night if she loses it. It’s also important to watch for suicidal tendencies, when people who are detached from reality get depressed things can end badly.
Indeed. All that sort of business has been taken care of (such as it is, three cheers for deinstitutionalization). I wasn't part of the group that took her to the hospital, or I would have asked the doctors this. But I'm wondering if anyone knows what current psychiatric thought suggests - if anything - for family members dealing with this sort of situation.
In the end, he his 24 and from what I understand cannot be forced in to a mental institution. His parents try to talk him in to getting help every few months, but he has no desire to.
I remember him saying a couple weird things, nothing huge, but I remember kind of awkwardly pausing for a few seconds and then changing the subject. Like when someone makes a joke that isn't that funny. I can't tell you if it worked or not, but unfortunately I would say that the best thing you can do is leave the conversation for professionals, assuming your relative is getting help. In fact, if your relative IS getting help, try asking the person she is talking to how you may be able to respond.
Seriously, this and the changing the subject thing are about the only good bits of advice in this thread. What the hell happened to H/A? Who let all the freaking idiots in here?
The reason for that is that sometimes people can become violent or aggressive if you flat out say "That is wrong, that is untrue, you are mistaken" when they really believe something is true. With this in mind, please do not try to directly contradict anything your relative is saying, I don't know your relative's history - but it's a possibility.
We teach family members to become very facilitative with their relatives who have delusional thoughts. Ask questions, find out how such delusions make them feel, if anyone or anything is telling them to do anything. Remain supportive at all times and stress that right now they are safe. Regardless of how difficult it may be to hear a realtive say things that are not true or cling to beliefs that we know are false, we have to remember that it is very real for them and that reality is terrifying.
The above, of course, are just a few themes we're taught when dealing with psychiatric problems. More specifically you can facilitate more conversation by "How does that make you feel?" or "That must be scary, but you are safe here, now, no one can hurt you." These will sometimes help to calm the person down. We're told as professionals not to 'feed' into any delusions because it will strengthen the belief of the patient and may undo therapeutic goals.
Lastly, changing the subject will work, but it won't help your relative. I'm not saying that you need to help with any psychoanalysis, but simple facilitation of feelings and fear will go a long way demonstrating to your relative that you care and can help her (I don't know if you want that kind of responsibility, but it's certainly the relationship the staff will try to foster).
If you have any specific questions, feel free to PM me - however I won't be a licensed RN until the fall. I bring that up to try and establish some credibility.
She needs help, only a psychologist can really assist someone with kind of issue. Have her see a doctor about this.
Thank you. Really, thank you. It was advice of this quality that I was hoping for when I asked on here.
I've known three people with psychotic disorders, and the impression I got from all of them was that if they were going to flip out, there was literally nothing "right" I could say - including saying nothing at all.
The one firm recommendation I can give you is to have as many other family members involved as possible. It is *very* stressful being the only person dealing with the one who is psychotic, and if you can switch off with them it will help a lot.
http://www.thelostworlds.net/
Agreed. Listen to MM001 for sure, he has good advice that's 100% spot on in my experience (and more importantly has actual medical training, I do not), but also realize that sometimes there's nothing you can do to avoid some kind of negative reaction on their part. I know a girl who had (and maybe still has) paranoid delusions in addition to a whole host of other mental problems. She used to tell me about how she would see ghosts. Once when she was telling me about the lady with no eyes behind her who would sing to her but disappear if she turned around I very gently asked if she ever thought they might be schizophrenia or something. She warned me to never call her crazy again and quit talking to me until the next day but I'm not sure if she still remembered or cared about that little comment.
I also know a kid who thinks the CIA put a chip in his brain and is listening to his thoughts. I feel very very uncomfortable around him.
I'm sorry if this is going off the topic, so please disregard this post if it doesn't add anything to the conversation, but I'm curious. What is it with the whole 'CIA are watching me' thing when it comes to the stereotypical paranoid dillusion sufferer and real-life sufferers like you have mentioned here? I'm assuming it is just an 'easy target' for people with paranoid dillusions to focus their fears on a higher, important, secret sounding orginisation.
I've always wondered about that myself, and that's basically the conclusion I've reached, albeit without any evidence to back it up. It doesn make me wonder, though, how this manifested before the days of the CIA/NSA/FBI/what have you. I assume that it probably took the form of demons or spirits, or the church, or the monarchy, or such.
That said, I appreciated MegaMan's post very much, and I can appreciate the difficulty in dealing with this situation (I had a girlfriend in college who suffered from similar symptoms; specifically she was often convinced that there were corpses on the floor). I'm sure that I consistently said precisely the wrong thing; generally I tried to prove to her that they weren't there.
IOS Game Center ID: Isotope-X
What in the hell is wrong with you guys? Re-read what you've just said. Wait, say it aloud, actually.
Definitely make it much worse! It would show that the cameras in the computer are gone, BUT it would also make them believe SOLIDLY that they ARE being watched, and their delusion would grow beyond their computer to everything in life.
And I don't know what to say, 'cause ya, they pretty much are. It makes me uncomfortable when there is enough supporting evidence to make a case. Its like this guy at work who was convinced there were hidden cameras in the elevators and hallway lobbies, and that his boss was reading his chat and personal emails. Crazy as a loon.
Then I become heavily involved in CorpSec investigations. They totally had secret cameras in the lobby, and workstation monitors/keyloggers. This guy was on file, and we had been watching him for some time. His boss had access to the logs. Poor bastard, red flagged for 'acting crazy', about something completely legit.
I try avoid dealing with paranoia at length now, because I can't help but think if maybe its true. It's like its contagious or something. Needless to say I never belittle thier fears.
Most delusions are based around a higher power taking some vested interest with the person. The 'classic' delusions usually are surrounding large government organizations or religious figures. I couldn't really say why this happens, but I've been told that it's easier for a person with a disorder to manifest their paranoia or fear in a concrete organization - it's easier to deal with if you have something tangible to focus your fear on.
Thanks for the kind words on my advice. The fact that you care enough of your relative to seek out information on how to help also speaks volumes about your character. I hope everything goes well.
Uh. I apologize for asking a question on a subject the thread is about. It seems entirely possible that someone could be delusional about a single object, and once they FIX that object, their delusion would still exist in a way, but they would have solved the problem. Is that so difficult an idea? As you guys said, that's not how it works, but interesting to think that it might.
My bad for attempting to discuss something.
However I've got a new acquaintance who I suspect is harboring delusional paranoia as well. He is vehemently anti-government, to the point that he can lose all composure from a simple discussion of the government in anyway. Everything they do is out to screw us, on every level of government, from George W. to the local council. Any time I talk to him; if the conversation sways towards politics or government, and even religion; you can tell he's holding something back, he wants to say, but isn't sure if he should say.
I wonder if this type of thing is more common in the age of information, where anyone can read about anything they want at any time. With people who don't know jack shit about anything typing up whatever they want, and presenting it as fact for any who read. That allows more of the conspiracy theorists to thrive, because it's so easy to find support for their theories.
I think certainly in the age of information that it's easier to find support of any delusions a person may have, due to the all-encompassing amount of information available. As to your friend, there is a clear definition from simply having a strong opinion to having a delusion. According to the DSM IV TR (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual for Mental Disorders) in order for something to qualify for a 'disorder' it must have some measure of debilitating or destructive impact on the person's life. This can be manifested through a loss of support structures, inability to carry out meaningful relationships with loved ones or family, or an inability to function within society.
If your current friend falls into a similar theme, then it could very well be latent delusion manifestation - otherwise he could just be a strongly opinionated person (which at this time, is not a mental disorder).
As for helping her defeat the delusion, you could suggest she file a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request for information the government has on her. They have to own up to it if they have something, even if they choose to redact it. From Wikipedia again: "The Privacy Act of 1974 is, summarily, a similar act regulating government control of documents which concern a citizen. It gives one “(1) the right to see records about [one]self, subject to the Privacy Act's exemptions, (2) the right to amend that record if it is inaccurate, irrelevant, untimely, or incomplete, and (3) the right to sue the government for violations of the statute including permitting others to see [one’s] records unless specifically permitted by the Act.â€[3] In conjunction with the FOIA, the PA is used to further the rights of an individual gaining access to information held by the government."
She can continue to believe whatever she wants after that point though, and no amount of reason can convince someone otherwise if they already believe in invisible boogeymen. Just look at how successful organized religion is.