Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
I absolutely put thought into my picks. And right now I have been focusing on practicing heroes for NGS.
I think a lot of problems could be solved with more open communication, to be honest.
we had a game in unranked two days ago on braxis where you snap hovered maiev and we told you that maiev was not going to be a good pick (we already had leo/johanna which meant we were only getting two assassins), they drafted tychus against our double frontline and then picked up thrall/alarak and you snap picked maiev despite that
we went 4-18 because leo/jo/lucio/maiev/fenix can't do anything vs tychus/thrall/alarak/morales/anub
i don't think you do put thought into your picks, honestly
Maiev is a great pick on Braxis. I don't think the Maiev pick itself was what went wrong there.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
The topic of this thread, for multiple pages now, has been that it's becoming a serious problem, to the extent that I don't even want to log in anymore, that teammates pick whatever heroes they want, regardless of whether or not those heroes fit the rest of the team's composition in any meaningful way. And regardless of whether or not those choices are respectful of the play experiences of other teammates. Many people have chimed in to agree that it's an issue that they also find frustrating.
Often times, I'm left to fill in matches when my teammates have not drafted: enough frontline; any meaningful crowd control; an offlane; sufficient waveclear; etc. And I have to sit there thinking for ages about what I could possibly draft to make Tychus, Maiev, Li-Ming work.
To say that it's "blatantly untrue" that people fail to put any significant strategy into effect when locking in their QM picks, even in full PA 5stacks, is out of touch at best.
Your initial phrasing makes it sound like that's always the case, to me at least. That's certainly definitely not true, and probably what munkus meant?
I absolutely put thought into my picks. And right now I have been focusing on practicing heroes for NGS.
I think a lot of problems could be solved with more open communication, to be honest.
we had a game in unranked two days ago on braxis where you snap hovered maiev and we told you that maiev was not going to be a good pick (we already had leo/johanna which meant we were only getting two assassins), they drafted tychus against our double frontline and then picked up thrall/alarak and you snap picked maiev despite that
we went 4-18 because leo/jo/lucio/maiev/fenix can't do anything vs tychus/thrall/alarak/morales/anub
i don't think you do put thought into your picks, honestly
Maiev is a great pick on Braxis. I don't think the Maiev pick itself was what went wrong there.
munkus, you literally just said "i put thought into my picks" and then you instantly snap your most played hero without thinking about it despite us TELLING YOU that it wasn't a good choice!
maiev wasn't what went wrong? how do you kill people with maiev/fenix? we went 4-18.
so you're implying that you're completely free of fault and the burden of fault lies on the rest of us, then. alright. gotcha. got the message.
edit: like, i hovered leo initially because we needed an offlaner, and leo's pretty decent on braxis for both waveclear and point holding. this meant we were going to have a double tank comp, and only two assassins. we also had jo hovered because we needed a tank still. we were told to pick jo/leo in the first picks, despite knowing in my head the enemy team was instantly going to lock in Tychus or something to shred us.
lo and behold.
and then they drafted an insanely strong frontline with a backline morales whom we had NO WAY to stop or get on or counter at all. we had nothing. 4-18.
you can't sit there and tell me you put thought into your pick when you instantly snap hovered your most played comfort pick hero even when we TOLD YOU it wasn't the right choice there. at that point, that's just being selfish and neglectful to the rest of the team.
can someone give me a real non-meme answer for what a "strong 4-man" is please?
i wasn't joking or shitposting or memeing.
i legitimately don't know and answering with memes doesn't help me understand any further
There isn't a clear cut answer which is probably one of the reasons people struggle with what is a good draft or good comp. The answer is always going to be - well it depends on the map and what the other team has. And the "well it depends" answer is almost a meme unto itself for when ever anyone asks advice about HOTS.
Munkus's answer is fine place to start, but does it make sure you have a good 4-man, maybe?
Do you need sustain - if your going into double support, probably not, your never going to match their sustain - so you need more blow up potential to get a kill.
Do you need wave clear, sure, but really you only need as much as the other team has.
You do probably need a front line - but does that need to be one of 5 MT's? I bodied a muradin/illidan as blaze MT yesterday
A 4-man should have something it's playing towards that puts pressure on the other team to make mistakes, and that could be a lot of things - your 4 man can even just be well rounded and wait/hope your opponent makes mistakes (this is almost the arrogant nephalem special - of just holding onto the game long enough and using a bunch of counter-engage ults)
Important to remember that "drafts the correct hero" and "thinks about and tries to draft the correct hero" are not the same thing. Even if you want to put all the blame on that comp on Maiev, I guess, it doesn't really help what you're trying to say.
Unless the point is to argue the latter, which is fine! But that means the entire origin of this conversation is mostly invalidated, including when most others were agreeing and such, because that's definitely not how it started
Important to remember that "drafts the correct hero" and "thinks about and tries to draft the correct hero" are not the same thing. Even if you want to put all the blame on that comp on Maiev, I guess, it doesn't really help what you're trying to say.
Unless the point is to argue the latter, which is fine! But that means the entire origin of this conversation is mostly invalidated, including when most others were agreeing and such, because that's definitely not how it started
my point was never "maiev was the reason we lost".
my point was that munkus wasn't thinking about his pick. he always only plays maiev or ragnaros, regardless of if it fits into the teamcomp or not. we load into the draft screen and he's instantly hovered maiev!
if i'm being honest, the reason we lost that game was because we didn't build a good comp overall, and we didn't try to counterdraft the enemy team. the enemy team drafted this insanely strong aggressive dive/frontline comp and we sort of just.... let them do that.
which, again, pivots back to my original point of "not thinking about picks"
Dibby on
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Important to remember that "drafts the correct hero" and "thinks about and tries to draft the correct hero" are not the same thing. Even if you want to put all the blame on that comp on Maiev, I guess, it doesn't really help what you're trying to say.
Unless the point is to argue the latter, which is fine! But that means the entire origin of this conversation is mostly invalidated, including when most others were agreeing and such, because that's definitely not how it started
my point was never "maiev was the reason we lost".
my point was that munkus wasn't thinking about his pick. he always only plays maiev or ragnaros, regardless of if it fits into the teamcomp or not. we load into the draft screen and he's instantly hovered maiev!
Yeah, that's just not true at all.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Important to remember that "drafts the correct hero" and "thinks about and tries to draft the correct hero" are not the same thing. Even if you want to put all the blame on that comp on Maiev, I guess, it doesn't really help what you're trying to say.
Unless the point is to argue the latter, which is fine! But that means the entire origin of this conversation is mostly invalidated, including when most others were agreeing and such, because that's definitely not how it started
my point was never "maiev was the reason we lost".
my point was that munkus wasn't thinking about his pick. he always only plays maiev or ragnaros, regardless of if it fits into the teamcomp or not. we load into the draft screen and he's instantly hovered maiev!
Definitively proves @Munkus Beaver should play Tychus on Towers of Doom.
+1
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
My most played characters this season, in order have been
Maiev
Gul'dan
Tychus
Ragnaros
But I'm glad you decided to cherry pick a screenshot to whine about this.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
My most played characters this season, in order have been
Maiev
Gul'dan
Tychus
Ragnaros
But I'm glad you decided to cherry pick a screenshot to whine about this.
didn't you ignore one of my posts containing the crux of my argument to cherry pick an argument with something else unrelated?
Dibby on
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
That I picked Ragnaros on large maps and had an 80% winrate with them.
That part is actually true.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
I absolutely put thought into my picks. And right now I have been focusing on practicing heroes for NGS.
I think a lot of problems could be solved with more open communication, to be honest.
we had a game in unranked two days ago on braxis where you snap hovered maiev and we told you that maiev was not going to be a good pick (we already had leo/johanna which meant we were only getting two assassins), they drafted tychus against our double frontline and then picked up thrall/alarak and you snap picked maiev despite that
we went 4-18 because leo/jo/lucio/maiev/fenix can't do anything vs tychus/thrall/alarak/morales/anub
i don't think you do put thought into your picks, honestly
Maiev is a great pick on Braxis. I don't think the Maiev pick itself was what went wrong there.
munkus, you literally just said "i put thought into my picks" and then you instantly snap your most played hero without thinking about it despite us TELLING YOU that it wasn't a good choice!
maiev wasn't what went wrong? how do you kill people with maiev/fenix? we went 4-18.
so you're implying that you're completely free of fault and the burden of fault lies on the rest of us, then. alright. gotcha. got the message.
edit: like, i hovered leo initially because we needed an offlaner, and leo's pretty decent on braxis for both waveclear and point holding. this meant we were going to have a double tank comp, and only two assassins. we also had jo hovered because we needed a tank still. we were told to pick jo/leo in the first picks, despite knowing in my head the enemy team was instantly going to lock in Tychus or something to shred us.
lo and behold.
and then they drafted an insanely strong frontline with a backline morales whom we had NO WAY to stop or get on or counter at all. we had nothing. 4-18.
you can't sit there and tell me you put thought into your pick when you instantly snap hovered your most played comfort pick hero even when we TOLD YOU it wasn't the right choice there. at that point, that's just being selfish and neglectful to the rest of the team.
I'm on my phone and about to run out of batteries, but I do want to mention, Dibby, you can't say both "Maiev was the problem" and "I wasn't blaming Maiev".
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Oh. I don't think you spoke up? Only Cav did. Cav doesn't like my maiev in general and I thought that was his main issue with the pick. Braxis is one of the two best maps for Maiev so saying "I dunno about Maiev [on Braxis]" was something I disagreed with him about. No big deal, people can disagree on viability. I didn't think Fenix fit into what we had, but that pick was after my pick. I figured Voracity was gonna go Li-Ming or some other mage, but he didn't.
That's about all I remember about it. It was one loss and I didn't have the best maiev game either. So I shrugged and tried some different things later in the day.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Oh. I don't think you spoke up? Only Cav did. Cav doesn't like my maiev in general and I thought that was his main issue with the pick. Braxis is one of the two best maps for Maiev so saying "I dunno about Maiev [on Braxis]" was something I disagreed with him about. No big deal, people can disagree on viability. I didn't think Fenix fit into what we had, but that pick was after my pick. I figured Voracity was gonna go Li-Ming or some other mage, but he didn't.
That's about all I remember about it. It was one loss and I didn't have the best maiev game either. So I shrugged and tried some different things later in the day.
i literally said "i don't think we want maiev here" and i didn't say anything further because i know that you're stubborn about that so i simply said that and let it go and you picked maiev anyway
edit: my broader point that i've been trying to make this whole time is that like, when your team is trying to come together and make a good well rounded comp and have things fit together, it's not fun when one person just insists on slam picking, say, sgt hammer every single time.
Dibby on
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Looks like someone is DDoSing blizzard or something. I tried to log in, got told I was 150 minutes in queue and half an hour later I am told I need to wait 220 minutes in queue.
Just guessing on the DDoS thing, though
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Somehow, having to wait hours to login just makes me want WoW Classic even more
Just makes me think of those times where the raid got canceled after a patch because decursive didn’t work anymore and the healers thought it was impossible to raid without it.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Oh. I don't think you spoke up? Only Cav did. Cav doesn't like my maiev in general and I thought that was his main issue with the pick. Braxis is one of the two best maps for Maiev so saying "I dunno about Maiev [on Braxis]" was something I disagreed with him about. No big deal, people can disagree on viability. I didn't think Fenix fit into what we had, but that pick was after my pick. I figured Voracity was gonna go Li-Ming or some other mage, but he didn't.
That's about all I remember about it. It was one loss and I didn't have the best maiev game either. So I shrugged and tried some different things later in the day.
i literally said "i don't think we want maiev here" and i didn't say anything further because i know that you're stubborn about that so i simply said that and let it go and you picked maiev anyway
edit: my broader point that i've been trying to make this whole time is that like, when your team is trying to come together and make a good well rounded comp and have things fit together, it's not fun when one person just insists on slam picking, say, sgt hammer every single time.
The broader point makes sense and it's super annoying, yeah. I don't think this is a good example of that *shrug*
I'm on my phone and about to run out of batteries, but I do want to mention, Dibby, you can't say both "Maiev was the problem" and "I wasn't blaming Maiev".
Pick one and stick with it.
The point has been made repeatedly that people are frustrated when certain players refuse to flex into tank or healer. Whether or not Maiev is a good pick in Dibby's case is relevant only in the sense that it implies that munkus's hero choices are dictated more by what he wants to play than what is best for the group (either in the context of the game or socially). The underlying point is that munkus only plays the heroes he wants, period.
The screenshot points out that if he were in a group for many of those games, at some point he should have flexed just by virtue of basic mathematics and politeness. I'm pretty sure if you looked at your own match history you would find a much wider spread of heroes because at some point you flexed into a healer for the good of the team.
I think it's really unfortunate that people have tried to give this feedback multiple times in different ways and it seems to just not get through. I know for a fact that several people have flat out said that they refuse to play with someone in large groups specifically for this reason. This problem even extended itself to the PA tournaments, which we haven't had for at least six months. So it's not a new thing.
This is not an isolated case or a specific scenario being argued. Dibby is speaking to his own experience over time, and to be frank it mirrors my own.
Honestly at this point I think it's plain to everyone what is going on, and we all seem to have our own ways of approaching the issue. I don't think it's worth arguing given the message is clearly not being received.
I'm on my phone and about to run out of batteries, but I do want to mention, Dibby, you can't say both "Maiev was the problem" and "I wasn't blaming Maiev".
Pick one and stick with it.
The point has been made repeatedly that people are frustrated when certain players refuse to flex into tank or healer.
That's not what Dibby is arguing.
That was the original point. And I agree. I guess I'm slightly frustrated that it's now shifted to "you should have picked a different Assassin." Dibby is saying that Maiev was the wrong pick on Braxis with two Warriors already because it didn't give them enough kill pressure and Tychus was just gonna rush up and shred their Warriors and whatever.
Like, I'm not at all disagreeing with what you're saying, @Inquisitor77. The rest of your post, too, I 100% agree. Totally, completely agree with everything else you said. It's just not what anyone else was saying today
Edit: And, to be fair, maybe I've just totally misread what everyone was saying today. I'll admit to being slightly confused how the original point has been so lost. Maybe I'm the lost one! Apologies, if so!
I'm on my phone and about to run out of batteries, but I do want to mention, Dibby, you can't say both "Maiev was the problem" and "I wasn't blaming Maiev".
Pick one and stick with it.
The point has been made repeatedly that people are frustrated when certain players refuse to flex into tank or healer.
That's not what Dibby is arguing.
That was the original point. And I agree. I guess I'm slightly frustrated that it's now shifted to "you should have picked a different Assassin." Dibby is saying that Maiev was the wrong pick on Braxis with two Warriors already because it didn't give them enough kill pressure and Tychus was just gonna rush up and shred their Warriors and whatever.
Like, I'm not at all disagreeing with what you're saying, Inquisitor77. The rest of your post, too, I 100% agree. Totally, completely agree with everything else you said. It's just not what anyone else was saying today
Edit: And, to be fair, maybe I've just totally misread what everyone was saying today. I'll admit to being slightly confused how the original point has been so lost. Maybe I'm the lost one! Apologies, if so!
the original point has flown the coop, yes
even i'm having difficulty tracking the actual conversation/argument since it's been so fractured and split off into micro-arguments focusing on small individual things placed under a magnifying glass
w/e tho, it's very exhausting at this point. i'm done with it, at any rate
Dibby on
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
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Inquisitor772 x Penny Arcade Fight Club ChampionA fixed point in space and timeRegistered Userregular
Yeah, for the record, I think Maiev could've worked. And I think Fenix is a great pick, especially if Voracity is playing it. But it may be more important to ask why Dibby is so frustrated in this case when someone picks a hero he doesn't think is a good pick, rather than chalking it up to an honest disagreement in the draft. Most of us take the default position of "you do you", especially Dibby. If you play with him at all you know that he will enthusiastically champion your ability to play the dumbest heroes on the planet. And yet in this specific case he seems to be unwilling to give the benefit of the doubt.
tbh we were winning early but red team alarak was able to create kills where most would not be able to. And there's nothing short of prescience that I could do to prevent Alarak combos from nearly killing fenix.
I pick selfishly from time to time (e.g. I'll pick Medivh alongside Ant and proceed to fail miserably, or pick support when I know Saeris probably wants that spot), but I think even if you're practicing for something you should from time to time at least offer to fill a role. Just to be polite at least.
Somehow, having to wait hours to login just makes me want WoW Classic even more
Just makes me think of those times where the raid got canceled after a patch because decursive didn’t work anymore and the healers thought it was impossible to raid without it.
it was because the fight mechanics were so poorly designed that i'd rather jump off a bridge than try to heal chromaggus without decursive.
you couldn't pay me to play wow classic.
+1
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Somehow, having to wait hours to login just makes me want WoW Classic even more
Just makes me think of those times where the raid got canceled after a patch because decursive didn’t work anymore and the healers thought it was impossible to raid without it.
it was because the fight mechanics were so poorly designed that i'd rather jump off a bridge than try to heal chromaggus without decursive.
you couldn't pay me to play wow classic.
Paladin cleanse handled 3 Debuff types, it was crazy.
And I played a shaman on chromaggus before, was on cleanse duty and didn’t use decursive or think it was that big of a deal.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
tbh we were winning early but red team alarak was able to create kills where most would not be able to. And there's nothing short of prescience that I could do to prevent Alarak combos from nearly killing fenix.
I pick selfishly from time to time (e.g. I'll pick Medivh alongside Ant and proceed to fail miserably, or pick support when I know Saeris probably wants that spot), but I think even if you're practicing for something you should from time to time at least offer to fill a role. Just to be polite at least.
Jesus I forgot Alarak was even involved. That was the grandmaster Alarak, wasn’t it? Fuck, I have seen way too much Alarak lately,
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
tbh we were winning early but red team alarak was able to create kills where most would not be able to. And there's nothing short of prescience that I could do to prevent Alarak combos from nearly killing fenix.
I pick selfishly from time to time (e.g. I'll pick Medivh alongside Ant and proceed to fail miserably, or pick support when I know Saeris probably wants that spot), but I think even if you're practicing for something you should from time to time at least offer to fill a role. Just to be polite at least.
Oh man, that Medivh game.
Me, after the game: Did you even use him in Try Mode first?!!?
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
"i played the character that farted down a totem and cleared half the debuffs and it wasn't hard"
Totems only worked on your pod of five, only worked on one specific debuff each (one for poison, one for disease, both on the water totem slot) and they only removed debuffs when they pulsed.
I assure you I had to spam cleanse poison/disease like a chump
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
I still can't believe they literally removed self-dooting.
tbh we were winning early but red team alarak was able to create kills where most would not be able to. And there's nothing short of prescience that I could do to prevent Alarak combos from nearly killing fenix.
I pick selfishly from time to time (e.g. I'll pick Medivh alongside Ant and proceed to fail miserably, or pick support when I know Saeris probably wants that spot), but I think even if you're practicing for something you should from time to time at least offer to fill a role. Just to be polite at least.
Jesus I forgot Alarak was even involved. That was the grandmaster Alarak, wasn’t it? Fuck, I have seen way too much Alarak lately,
I believe the GM player on Alarak was the next game on Sky Temple. He wasn't particularly good at Alarak though.
I can't really make any excuses for the Medivh game....
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
tbh we were winning early but red team alarak was able to create kills where most would not be able to. And there's nothing short of prescience that I could do to prevent Alarak combos from nearly killing fenix.
I pick selfishly from time to time (e.g. I'll pick Medivh alongside Ant and proceed to fail miserably, or pick support when I know Saeris probably wants that spot), but I think even if you're practicing for something you should from time to time at least offer to fill a role. Just to be polite at least.
Jesus I forgot Alarak was even involved. That was the grandmaster Alarak, wasn’t it? Fuck, I have seen way too much Alarak lately,
I believe the GM player on Alarak was the next game on Sky Temple. He wasn't particularly good at Alarak though.
I can't really make any excuses for the Medivh game....
One of those Alaraks had a thousand games played on the bastard
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Posts
Maiev is a great pick on Braxis. I don't think the Maiev pick itself was what went wrong there.
Your initial phrasing makes it sound like that's always the case, to me at least. That's certainly definitely not true, and probably what munkus meant?
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munkus, you literally just said "i put thought into my picks" and then you instantly snap your most played hero without thinking about it despite us TELLING YOU that it wasn't a good choice!
maiev wasn't what went wrong? how do you kill people with maiev/fenix? we went 4-18.
so you're implying that you're completely free of fault and the burden of fault lies on the rest of us, then. alright. gotcha. got the message.
edit: like, i hovered leo initially because we needed an offlaner, and leo's pretty decent on braxis for both waveclear and point holding. this meant we were going to have a double tank comp, and only two assassins. we also had jo hovered because we needed a tank still. we were told to pick jo/leo in the first picks, despite knowing in my head the enemy team was instantly going to lock in Tychus or something to shred us.
lo and behold.
and then they drafted an insanely strong frontline with a backline morales whom we had NO WAY to stop or get on or counter at all. we had nothing. 4-18.
you can't sit there and tell me you put thought into your pick when you instantly snap hovered your most played comfort pick hero even when we TOLD YOU it wasn't the right choice there. at that point, that's just being selfish and neglectful to the rest of the team.
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
There isn't a clear cut answer which is probably one of the reasons people struggle with what is a good draft or good comp. The answer is always going to be - well it depends on the map and what the other team has. And the "well it depends" answer is almost a meme unto itself for when ever anyone asks advice about HOTS.
Munkus's answer is fine place to start, but does it make sure you have a good 4-man, maybe?
Do you need sustain - if your going into double support, probably not, your never going to match their sustain - so you need more blow up potential to get a kill.
Do you need wave clear, sure, but really you only need as much as the other team has.
You do probably need a front line - but does that need to be one of 5 MT's? I bodied a muradin/illidan as blaze MT yesterday
A 4-man should have something it's playing towards that puts pressure on the other team to make mistakes, and that could be a lot of things - your 4 man can even just be well rounded and wait/hope your opponent makes mistakes (this is almost the arrogant nephalem special - of just holding onto the game long enough and using a bunch of counter-engage ults)
Unless the point is to argue the latter, which is fine! But that means the entire origin of this conversation is mostly invalidated, including when most others were agreeing and such, because that's definitely not how it started
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my point was never "maiev was the reason we lost".
my point was that munkus wasn't thinking about his pick. he always only plays maiev or ragnaros, regardless of if it fits into the teamcomp or not. we load into the draft screen and he's instantly hovered maiev!
if i'm being honest, the reason we lost that game was because we didn't build a good comp overall, and we didn't try to counterdraft the enemy team. the enemy team drafted this insanely strong aggressive dive/frontline comp and we sort of just.... let them do that.
which, again, pivots back to my original point of "not thinking about picks"
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
Yeah, that's just not true at all.
?
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
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Definitively proves @Munkus Beaver should play Tychus on Towers of Doom.
Maiev
Gul'dan
Tychus
Ragnaros
But I'm glad you decided to cherry pick a screenshot to whine about this.
His point, I believe.
OK, then it doesn't :P
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didn't you ignore one of my posts containing the crux of my argument to cherry pick an argument with something else unrelated?
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
That part is actually true.
i meant that you never responded to this earlier post, which, again, contained the crux of my argument which you seem to now be sidestepping entirely:
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
Pick one and stick with it.
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That's about all I remember about it. It was one loss and I didn't have the best maiev game either. So I shrugged and tried some different things later in the day.
i literally said "i don't think we want maiev here" and i didn't say anything further because i know that you're stubborn about that so i simply said that and let it go and you picked maiev anyway
edit: my broader point that i've been trying to make this whole time is that like, when your team is trying to come together and make a good well rounded comp and have things fit together, it's not fun when one person just insists on slam picking, say, sgt hammer every single time.
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
Just guessing on the DDoS thing, though
Just makes me think of those times where the raid got canceled after a patch because decursive didn’t work anymore and the healers thought it was impossible to raid without it.
The broader point makes sense and it's super annoying, yeah. I don't think this is a good example of that *shrug*
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The point has been made repeatedly that people are frustrated when certain players refuse to flex into tank or healer. Whether or not Maiev is a good pick in Dibby's case is relevant only in the sense that it implies that munkus's hero choices are dictated more by what he wants to play than what is best for the group (either in the context of the game or socially). The underlying point is that munkus only plays the heroes he wants, period.
The screenshot points out that if he were in a group for many of those games, at some point he should have flexed just by virtue of basic mathematics and politeness. I'm pretty sure if you looked at your own match history you would find a much wider spread of heroes because at some point you flexed into a healer for the good of the team.
I think it's really unfortunate that people have tried to give this feedback multiple times in different ways and it seems to just not get through. I know for a fact that several people have flat out said that they refuse to play with someone in large groups specifically for this reason. This problem even extended itself to the PA tournaments, which we haven't had for at least six months. So it's not a new thing.
This is not an isolated case or a specific scenario being argued. Dibby is speaking to his own experience over time, and to be frank it mirrors my own.
Honestly at this point I think it's plain to everyone what is going on, and we all seem to have our own ways of approaching the issue. I don't think it's worth arguing given the message is clearly not being received.
That's not what Dibby is arguing.
That was the original point. And I agree. I guess I'm slightly frustrated that it's now shifted to "you should have picked a different Assassin." Dibby is saying that Maiev was the wrong pick on Braxis with two Warriors already because it didn't give them enough kill pressure and Tychus was just gonna rush up and shred their Warriors and whatever.
Like, I'm not at all disagreeing with what you're saying, @Inquisitor77. The rest of your post, too, I 100% agree. Totally, completely agree with everything else you said. It's just not what anyone else was saying today
Edit: And, to be fair, maybe I've just totally misread what everyone was saying today. I'll admit to being slightly confused how the original point has been so lost. Maybe I'm the lost one! Apologies, if so!
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the original point has flown the coop, yes
even i'm having difficulty tracking the actual conversation/argument since it's been so fractured and split off into micro-arguments focusing on small individual things placed under a magnifying glass
w/e tho, it's very exhausting at this point. i'm done with it, at any rate
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
At least there's more action in this here thread than in that dag gone nexus.
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wra
I pick selfishly from time to time (e.g. I'll pick Medivh alongside Ant and proceed to fail miserably, or pick support when I know Saeris probably wants that spot), but I think even if you're practicing for something you should from time to time at least offer to fill a role. Just to be polite at least.
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it was because the fight mechanics were so poorly designed that i'd rather jump off a bridge than try to heal chromaggus without decursive.
you couldn't pay me to play wow classic.
Paladin cleanse handled 3 Debuff types, it was crazy.
And I played a shaman on chromaggus before, was on cleanse duty and didn’t use decursive or think it was that big of a deal.
Jesus I forgot Alarak was even involved. That was the grandmaster Alarak, wasn’t it? Fuck, I have seen way too much Alarak lately,
Oh man, that Medivh game.
Me, after the game: Did you even use him in Try Mode first?!!?
Totems only worked on your pod of five, only worked on one specific debuff each (one for poison, one for disease, both on the water totem slot) and they only removed debuffs when they pulsed.
I assure you I had to spam cleanse poison/disease like a chump
I believe the GM player on Alarak was the next game on Sky Temple. He wasn't particularly good at Alarak though.
I can't really make any excuses for the Medivh game....
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One of those Alaraks had a thousand games played on the bastard
pfffft, that was a great change!
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