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[Heroes of the Storm] Coronavirus can't kill HotS if it's already dead #rollsafe

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    milk ducksmilk ducks High Mucky Muck Big Tits TownRegistered User regular
    edited May 2020
    Q-build Rags requires you to stack Sulfuras Hungers on minions, to hit multiple enemies to trigger cooldown-reduction from Hand of Ragnaros, and is susceptible to counter-blinds.
    E-build Ragnaros, in contrast, does not have to stack, does not have to hit multiple targets, is not susceptible to counter-blinds, and is equally effective.

    Both builds have wave-clear, but E-build comes online faster. Both builds have burst potential, but E-build comes online faster.
    E-build Ragnaros can do everything Q-build Rags can do, just faster, safer, and more consistently.

    Oh, and it is provides more crowd control.

    milk ducks on
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    milk ducksmilk ducks High Mucky Muck Big Tits TownRegistered User regular
    If you wanna get real technical if you are unhindered in a group of 5 people then Q build has the highest burst

    Or you can get blinded/stunned and whoops you have eaten shit

    If we're talking straight-Q versus straight-E ability damage, Q almost certainly does more, yeah. But I find a lot of the burst potential from E-build actually comes from Slow Burn at level 4, which snares enemies by 40% for 2 seconds so they move at the exact same speed as your Meatball and can't get out of it during a pick.

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    Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    milk ducks wrote: »
    If you wanna get real technical if you are unhindered in a group of 5 people then Q build has the highest burst

    Or you can get blinded/stunned and whoops you have eaten shit

    If we're talking straight-Q versus straight-E ability damage, Q almost certainly does more, yeah. But I find a lot of the burst potential from E-build actually comes from Slow Burn at level 4, which snares enemies by 40% for 2 seconds so they move at the exact same speed as your Meatball and can't get out of it during a pick.

    The thing about E build is that your primary damage engage can be cast on the tank. It’s a ton of damage, helps with the tank’s engage, and helps them snare and secure targets.

    And can help preload you with shields post 13. And goes off twice post 16 regardless of whether you have been stunned or blinded.

    So many times I have lived through a stun chain because three guys were trying to beat my ass and E just exploded on their faces.

    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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    DibbyDibby I'll do my best! Registered User regular
    edited May 2020
    milk ducks wrote: »
    Q-build Rags requires you to stack Sulfuras Hungers on minions, to hit multiple enemies to trigger cooldown-reduction from Hand of Ragnaros, and is susceptible to counter-blinds.
    E-build Ragnaros, in contrast, does not have to stack, does not have to hit multiple targets, is not susceptible to counter-blinds, and is equally effective.

    Both builds have wave-clear, but E-build comes online faster. Both builds have burst potential, but E-build comes online faster.
    E-build Ragnaros can do everything Q-build Rags can do, just faster, safer, and more consistently.

    Oh, and it is provides more crowd control.

    I mean Q build isn't hard locked into taking Hand of Ragnaros, you can easily go Blistering Attacks if you're not feeling confident about hitting 2+ targets with regularity.

    The Blind thing might be a touch overstated; You're not a pure AA hero like Jimmy/ZJ/Butcher. They get completely shut out for the duration of the Blind, you can just wait it out. Also, if someone has the omega gosu reflexes to be able to ON-REACTION Blind a Q activation, then... sure. But hitting Q triggers an AA reset, so you can just AA -> Q -> instant AA. That's pretty fucking hard to get a Blind in during that window, I think. Even if you do get Blinded, like, Q is a 4 second cooldown. That's nothing.

    The stacking isn't that difficult, honestly. Early on, maybe yeah, esp if you're getting bullied out in lane (but you can always let the minion waves push up to your towers instead for easy stacks). But later on it's a lot easier to get quick stacks. It's 4 total waves and some change.

    In general, I do end up going E build most of the time, because it's just... good at everything, and it's safe and it's a good all-rounder build. But Q build is also quite good and definitely has its place. Giant Scorcher is some shit, man. 3% health every second for 3 seconds is a bit nuts. That's like old Malthael damage. And you can pop that off every 2-4 seconds, either having zero downtime or 1 second of downtime.

    Dibby on
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    kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    So uh. Imperious is bugged atm.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gw9dG-ZYDYM

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    MNC DoverMNC Dover Full-time Voice Actor Kirkland, WARegistered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    So uh. Imperious is bugged atm.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gw9dG-ZYDYM

    Wow. I hope that's not easy to recreate in-game.

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    milk ducksmilk ducks High Mucky Muck Big Tits TownRegistered User regular
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    Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    MNC Dover wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    So uh. Imperious is bugged atm.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gw9dG-ZYDYM

    Wow. I hope that's not easy to recreate in-game.

    It is.

    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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    WhelkWhelk Registered User regular
    Dibby wrote: »
    milk ducks wrote: »
    Q-build Rags requires you to stack Sulfuras Hungers on minions, to hit multiple enemies to trigger cooldown-reduction from Hand of Ragnaros, and is susceptible to counter-blinds.
    E-build Ragnaros, in contrast, does not have to stack, does not have to hit multiple targets, is not susceptible to counter-blinds, and is equally effective.

    Both builds have wave-clear, but E-build comes online faster. Both builds have burst potential, but E-build comes online faster.
    E-build Ragnaros can do everything Q-build Rags can do, just faster, safer, and more consistently.

    Oh, and it is provides more crowd control.

    I mean Q build isn't hard locked into taking Hand of Ragnaros, you can easily go Blistering Attacks if you're not feeling confident about hitting 2+ targets with regularity.

    The Blind thing might be a touch overstated; You're not a pure AA hero like Jimmy/ZJ/Butcher. They get completely shut out for the duration of the Blind, you can just wait it out. Also, if someone has the omega gosu reflexes to be able to ON-REACTION Blind a Q activation, then... sure. But hitting Q triggers an AA reset, so you can just AA -> Q -> instant AA. That's pretty fucking hard to get a Blind in during that window, I think. Even if you do get Blinded, like, Q is a 4 second cooldown. That's nothing.

    The stacking isn't that difficult, honestly. Early on, maybe yeah, esp if you're getting bullied out in lane (but you can always let the minion waves push up to your towers instead for easy stacks). But later on it's a lot easier to get quick stacks. It's 4 total waves and some change.

    In general, I do end up going E build most of the time, because it's just... good at everything, and it's safe and it's a good all-rounder build. But Q build is also quite good and definitely has its place. Giant Scorcher is some shit, man. 3% health every second for 3 seconds is a bit nuts. That's like old Malthael damage. And you can pop that off every 2-4 seconds, either having zero downtime or 1 second of downtime.

    Yeah, except I can just take the Q at 16 if I feel like it'll be better and stick to every other E talent which gives more value.

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    DibbyDibby I'll do my best! Registered User regular
    Whelk wrote: »
    Dibby wrote: »
    milk ducks wrote: »
    Q-build Rags requires you to stack Sulfuras Hungers on minions, to hit multiple enemies to trigger cooldown-reduction from Hand of Ragnaros, and is susceptible to counter-blinds.
    E-build Ragnaros, in contrast, does not have to stack, does not have to hit multiple targets, is not susceptible to counter-blinds, and is equally effective.

    Both builds have wave-clear, but E-build comes online faster. Both builds have burst potential, but E-build comes online faster.
    E-build Ragnaros can do everything Q-build Rags can do, just faster, safer, and more consistently.

    Oh, and it is provides more crowd control.

    I mean Q build isn't hard locked into taking Hand of Ragnaros, you can easily go Blistering Attacks if you're not feeling confident about hitting 2+ targets with regularity.

    The Blind thing might be a touch overstated; You're not a pure AA hero like Jimmy/ZJ/Butcher. They get completely shut out for the duration of the Blind, you can just wait it out. Also, if someone has the omega gosu reflexes to be able to ON-REACTION Blind a Q activation, then... sure. But hitting Q triggers an AA reset, so you can just AA -> Q -> instant AA. That's pretty fucking hard to get a Blind in during that window, I think. Even if you do get Blinded, like, Q is a 4 second cooldown. That's nothing.

    The stacking isn't that difficult, honestly. Early on, maybe yeah, esp if you're getting bullied out in lane (but you can always let the minion waves push up to your towers instead for easy stacks). But later on it's a lot easier to get quick stacks. It's 4 total waves and some change.

    In general, I do end up going E build most of the time, because it's just... good at everything, and it's safe and it's a good all-rounder build. But Q build is also quite good and definitely has its place. Giant Scorcher is some shit, man. 3% health every second for 3 seconds is a bit nuts. That's like old Malthael damage. And you can pop that off every 2-4 seconds, either having zero downtime or 1 second of downtime.

    Yeah, except I can just take the Q at 16 if I feel like it'll be better and stick to every other E talent which gives more value.

    ....But why would you take every other E talent and then swap off of the cornerstone of the E build

    Ragnaros has somewhat unfortunate talent design in that you are kinda locked into a build path from level 1. His talents are far too synergistic to play pick-and-choose; you have to go full Q/W/E build. It'd be like if I were Nazeebo and went Pandemic at 1 and then didn't take Toads of Hugeness at 7.

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    WhelkWhelk Registered User regular
    I don't really agree. I mostly take the E talents for utility. If I need to chase or escape extra hard at 16, I'll grab the E. Otherwise, it's sometimes better to just grab the Q talent to punish their frontline. I'd rather do that than go all in on Q talents for the bulk of my games.

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    Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    There is zero reason to take the Q talent at 16 if you haven't taken the other shit to support it.

    Yeah, 9% is very chunky. It's also not shit compared to having two blast waves on each cast or having your meatball explode exactly where you want it to.

    Sixteen is a huge tier for Ragnaros and it gives you the lynchpin of each particular build. I cannot fathom why you would invest so deeply into E and then give up on it during its best tier.

    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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    Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    Oh also to recreate the imperius bug you just queue a bunch of your actions together.

    It's very easy to do but not exactly practical in every situation.

    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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    fortyforty Registered User regular
    I do feel like E build has some options. Level 7 has no blatant E talent, and I usually end up taking the Q cooldown ability. If you've got that and you're against like a dual tank comp and you're procing it often, I could see maybe taking Q at 16. Maybe the numbers don't work out vs. the extra E though, dunno.

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    Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    forty wrote: »
    I do feel like E build has some options. Level 7 has no blatant E talent, and I usually end up taking the Q cooldown ability. If you've got that and you're against like a dual tank comp and you're procing it often, I could see maybe taking Q at 16. Maybe the numbers don't work out vs. the extra E though, dunno.

    It doesn't work out because the level 1 increases the size by 15% and the damage by 75%, the 4 gives it a slow, and the 13 gives you survivability off of its damage.

    And the sixteen effectively doubles the effect of all the previous talents.

    So your choice is "9% max health damage on your Q" or "double the potency of your entire talent tree"

    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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    fortyforty Registered User regular
    Oh also to recreate the imperius bug you just queue a bunch of your actions together.

    It's very easy to do but not exactly practical in every situation.
    I tried to do it in an AI game but couldn't get it to launch more than once. I guess I don't get it.

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    Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    forty wrote: »
    Oh also to recreate the imperius bug you just queue a bunch of your actions together.

    It's very easy to do but not exactly practical in every situation.
    I tried to do it in an AI game but couldn't get it to launch more than once. I guess I don't get it.

    You use the ult

    The Swords comes down

    you queue a long move option and then a lot of R presses with something to break up the commands between R presses

    Once the first swords launch then you can't queue up any more swords

    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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    fortyforty Registered User regular
    Sounds like something my hands wouldn't be able to make good use of.

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    Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited May 2020
    Oh, like I said, it's not very viable to do but it is absolutely hilarious to see done and pretty easy to do against say a boss and have the boss basically get solo'd by imperius

    EDIT: Of course I say this as a friend of mine posts a video of imperius taking down a full health fort in about 1 second via spam swords

    Munkus Beaver on
    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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    NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    Last night I decided to bang out the “play healer games” with Deckard in AI.

    Our Diablo and Chromie both decide to DC and not return on Sky Temple, so most of the match was me leading a train of those two around to objectives and team fights, while trying to get Chromie to run over potions to heal herself.

    I have never before missed the old “DCed player” AI, but I did last night.
    We ended up winning after losing all of our buildings and being down in levels until 20 thanks to back to back Boss caps.

    The DCed Chromie won MVP

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    MNC DoverMNC Dover Full-time Voice Actor Kirkland, WARegistered User regular
    So all the Mythic Pantheon stuff is live. That's got to be a mistake, right? No Twitter post, no warning, no trailer, no nothing? I went ahead and crafted a pair of skins and a mount for fun.

    6cl0o2onvuwl.png
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    3n350sbf88e7.png

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    MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    edited May 2020
    So wait.... does that mean that regular chests will have this new content??

    ed: apparently so!
    Thankfully I have 130+ chests I've been saving up ^^'

    ed 2.0: After 100+ chests, 70+ who were toy chests and 30 dark nexus chests, the only Greek God theme item I've gotten was from a Zagara hero chest....

    w38uanls4yao.png

    MMMig on
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    Witty signature comment goes here...

    wra
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    milk ducksmilk ducks High Mucky Muck Big Tits TownRegistered User regular
    Uh. What? That stuff is fucking rad. I hadn't even heard of it, though? What are all the skins?

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    SeGaTaiSeGaTai Registered User regular
    Just the two he posted in different colors and a cerberus mount that is both cool and weird looking

    PSN SeGaTai
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    MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    edited May 2020
    ed: kime feeds

    MMMig on
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    Witty signature comment goes here...

    wra
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    fortyforty Registered User regular
    I was able to get the Imperius swordsplosion to work a few time last night. Pretty funny but I couldn't quite pull it off consistently.

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    Inquisitor77Inquisitor77 2 x Penny Arcade Fight Club Champion A fixed point in space and timeRegistered User regular
    forty wrote: »
    I was able to get the Imperius swordsplosion to work a few time last night. Pretty funny but I couldn't quite pull it off consistently.

    In Try Mode, right?

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    kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    forty wrote: »
    I was able to get the Imperius swordsplosion to work a few time last night. Pretty funny but I couldn't quite pull it off consistently.

    In Try Mode, right?

    Are you a cop? You have to tell us if you're a cop

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    DibbyDibby I'll do my best! Registered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    forty wrote: »
    I was able to get the Imperius swordsplosion to work a few time last night. Pretty funny but I couldn't quite pull it off consistently.

    In Try Mode, right?

    Are you a cop? You have to tell us if you're a cop

    HE'S A NARC! HE'S A NARC!!!!

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    fortyforty Registered User regular
    I played with it in Try Mode a while just to learn how to get it to go off. Then I took Imperius into an AI game and was able to one shot the big sword robot mercs on Hanamura. Those are like the perfect use case for it since they don't have as much health as a boss, so you can easily take one by yourself. I tried to do it to the Sky Temple boss in another game, but the problem is you can only get so many swords off and I could only get the boss down to like 1/3 health with it. And it turns out Imperius is really, really bad at killing bosses.

    I think it'd be tough to pull off on Forts consistently.

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    Inquisitor77Inquisitor77 2 x Penny Arcade Fight Club Champion A fixed point in space and timeRegistered User regular
    Dibby wrote: »
    kime wrote: »
    forty wrote: »
    I was able to get the Imperius swordsplosion to work a few time last night. Pretty funny but I couldn't quite pull it off consistently.

    In Try Mode, right?

    Are you a cop? You have to tell us if you're a cop

    HE'S A NARC! HE'S A NARC!!!!

    You can trust me. I'm your friend.

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    fortyforty Registered User regular
    Wow, those are some major Cassia and Tracer changes. I haven't had time to read through them yet, but I'm assuming the intent behind a Tracer rework is to make her a little less "lol toxic Overwatch hero"?

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    ArcTangentArcTangent Registered User regular
    forty wrote: »
    Wow, those are some major Cassia and Tracer changes. I haven't had time to read through them yet, but I'm assuming the intent behind a Tracer rework is to make her a little less "lol toxic Overwatch hero"?

    There's too many to really get a good feel, but it really seems like they moved a bunch of what she was getting in synergy with Old Tassadar into her talents in slightly weaker forms, so she has a shitload more sustain, but a bit less damage. There's no comments on her though, so it's kind of speculative.

    ztrEPtD.gif
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    Inquisitor77Inquisitor77 2 x Penny Arcade Fight Club Champion A fixed point in space and timeRegistered User regular
    Yeah, the real problem with Tracer recently is that she became a dead hero at high levels of play due to her dependency on Tassadar.

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    KorrorKorror Registered User regular
    Brightwing buffs! Not enough to make her a top tier support but the thought is nice.

    Battlenet ID: NullPointer
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    fortyforty Registered User regular
    ArcTangent wrote: »
    forty wrote: »
    Wow, those are some major Cassia and Tracer changes. I haven't had time to read through them yet, but I'm assuming the intent behind a Tracer rework is to make her a little less "lol toxic Overwatch hero"?

    There's too many to really get a good feel, but it really seems like they moved a bunch of what she was getting in synergy with Old Tassadar into her talents in slightly weaker forms, so she has a shitload more sustain, but a bit less damage. There's no comments on her though, so it's kind of speculative.
    Yeah, that's what I got as well. There's a big talent shakeup, but from 10,000 feet the main thing I'm gathering is that she's losing some damage but gaining baseline life steal and more/better sustain options in her talents. She also loses a bit of attack range that she'll have to talent into in order to get her old range.

    So the hypermobility doesn't seem to be changing at all, but her damage and burst are definitely dropping. I guess that fixes some of her toxicity issues, but I get the feeling she's still going to be a weak hero overall. Turning a glass cannon into a squishy rifle that can stay alive a little longer probably doesn't make her a solid pick.

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    DibbyDibby I'll do my best! Registered User regular
    edited May 2020
    Dread [E]
    Additional functionality: Enemies hit by Dread’s wave are Slowed by 25% for 2 seconds.

    YOOOOOOO BASELINE FRIGHT FOR ORPHEA LET'S FUCKING GOOOO

    LET'S GO!!!!

    Holy shit I am SO GLAD they came around on this one, for real. Orphea was legit one of my favorite Heroes to play before her nerfs and removing Fright revealed a pretty glaring issue for her. Namely, that her kit relied on having that slow on the Dread wave and she felt HORRIBLE to play without it. I'm so fucking glad they baselined it. Also E build is back, which was my favorite way to play her! Let's fucking GO.

    Dibby on
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    MNC DoverMNC Dover Full-time Voice Actor Kirkland, WARegistered User regular
    I like the mini-Artanis buffs. While it’s hard to give up Amateur Opponent, I’ll see if this attack damage buff is legit or not.

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    fortyforty Registered User regular
    ArcTangent wrote: »
    There's no comments on her though, so it's kind of speculative.
    Oh and yeah, it's super weird that Tracer didn't even get a dev comment with all those changes. Hell, they'll put dev comments on heroes that get one single minor change.

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