Q-build Rags requires you to stack Sulfuras Hungers on minions, to hit multiple enemies to trigger cooldown-reduction from Hand of Ragnaros, and is susceptible to counter-blinds.
E-build Ragnaros, in contrast, does not have to stack, does not have to hit multiple targets, is not susceptible to counter-blinds, and is equally effective.
Both builds have wave-clear, but E-build comes online faster. Both builds have burst potential, but E-build comes online faster.
E-build Ragnaros can do everything Q-build Rags can do, just faster, safer, and more consistently.
If you wanna get real technical if you are unhindered in a group of 5 people then Q build has the highest burst
Or you can get blinded/stunned and whoops you have eaten shit
If we're talking straight-Q versus straight-E ability damage, Q almost certainly does more, yeah. But I find a lot of the burst potential from E-build actually comes from Slow Burn at level 4, which snares enemies by 40% for 2 seconds so they move at the exact same speed as your Meatball and can't get out of it during a pick.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
If you wanna get real technical if you are unhindered in a group of 5 people then Q build has the highest burst
Or you can get blinded/stunned and whoops you have eaten shit
If we're talking straight-Q versus straight-E ability damage, Q almost certainly does more, yeah. But I find a lot of the burst potential from E-build actually comes from Slow Burn at level 4, which snares enemies by 40% for 2 seconds so they move at the exact same speed as your Meatball and can't get out of it during a pick.
The thing about E build is that your primary damage engage can be cast on the tank. It’s a ton of damage, helps with the tank’s engage, and helps them snare and secure targets.
And can help preload you with shields post 13. And goes off twice post 16 regardless of whether you have been stunned or blinded.
So many times I have lived through a stun chain because three guys were trying to beat my ass and E just exploded on their faces.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Q-build Rags requires you to stack Sulfuras Hungers on minions, to hit multiple enemies to trigger cooldown-reduction from Hand of Ragnaros, and is susceptible to counter-blinds.
E-build Ragnaros, in contrast, does not have to stack, does not have to hit multiple targets, is not susceptible to counter-blinds, and is equally effective.
Both builds have wave-clear, but E-build comes online faster. Both builds have burst potential, but E-build comes online faster.
E-build Ragnaros can do everything Q-build Rags can do, just faster, safer, and more consistently.
Oh, and it is provides more crowd control.
I mean Q build isn't hard locked into taking Hand of Ragnaros, you can easily go Blistering Attacks if you're not feeling confident about hitting 2+ targets with regularity.
The Blind thing might be a touch overstated; You're not a pure AA hero like Jimmy/ZJ/Butcher. They get completely shut out for the duration of the Blind, you can just wait it out. Also, if someone has the omega gosu reflexes to be able to ON-REACTION Blind a Q activation, then... sure. But hitting Q triggers an AA reset, so you can just AA -> Q -> instant AA. That's pretty fucking hard to get a Blind in during that window, I think. Even if you do get Blinded, like, Q is a 4 second cooldown. That's nothing.
The stacking isn't that difficult, honestly. Early on, maybe yeah, esp if you're getting bullied out in lane (but you can always let the minion waves push up to your towers instead for easy stacks). But later on it's a lot easier to get quick stacks. It's 4 total waves and some change.
In general, I do end up going E build most of the time, because it's just... good at everything, and it's safe and it's a good all-rounder build. But Q build is also quite good and definitely has its place. Giant Scorcher is some shit, man. 3% health every second for 3 seconds is a bit nuts. That's like old Malthael damage. And you can pop that off every 2-4 seconds, either having zero downtime or 1 second of downtime.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Q-build Rags requires you to stack Sulfuras Hungers on minions, to hit multiple enemies to trigger cooldown-reduction from Hand of Ragnaros, and is susceptible to counter-blinds.
E-build Ragnaros, in contrast, does not have to stack, does not have to hit multiple targets, is not susceptible to counter-blinds, and is equally effective.
Both builds have wave-clear, but E-build comes online faster. Both builds have burst potential, but E-build comes online faster.
E-build Ragnaros can do everything Q-build Rags can do, just faster, safer, and more consistently.
Oh, and it is provides more crowd control.
I mean Q build isn't hard locked into taking Hand of Ragnaros, you can easily go Blistering Attacks if you're not feeling confident about hitting 2+ targets with regularity.
The Blind thing might be a touch overstated; You're not a pure AA hero like Jimmy/ZJ/Butcher. They get completely shut out for the duration of the Blind, you can just wait it out. Also, if someone has the omega gosu reflexes to be able to ON-REACTION Blind a Q activation, then... sure. But hitting Q triggers an AA reset, so you can just AA -> Q -> instant AA. That's pretty fucking hard to get a Blind in during that window, I think. Even if you do get Blinded, like, Q is a 4 second cooldown. That's nothing.
The stacking isn't that difficult, honestly. Early on, maybe yeah, esp if you're getting bullied out in lane (but you can always let the minion waves push up to your towers instead for easy stacks). But later on it's a lot easier to get quick stacks. It's 4 total waves and some change.
In general, I do end up going E build most of the time, because it's just... good at everything, and it's safe and it's a good all-rounder build. But Q build is also quite good and definitely has its place. Giant Scorcher is some shit, man. 3% health every second for 3 seconds is a bit nuts. That's like old Malthael damage. And you can pop that off every 2-4 seconds, either having zero downtime or 1 second of downtime.
Yeah, except I can just take the Q at 16 if I feel like it'll be better and stick to every other E talent which gives more value.
Q-build Rags requires you to stack Sulfuras Hungers on minions, to hit multiple enemies to trigger cooldown-reduction from Hand of Ragnaros, and is susceptible to counter-blinds.
E-build Ragnaros, in contrast, does not have to stack, does not have to hit multiple targets, is not susceptible to counter-blinds, and is equally effective.
Both builds have wave-clear, but E-build comes online faster. Both builds have burst potential, but E-build comes online faster.
E-build Ragnaros can do everything Q-build Rags can do, just faster, safer, and more consistently.
Oh, and it is provides more crowd control.
I mean Q build isn't hard locked into taking Hand of Ragnaros, you can easily go Blistering Attacks if you're not feeling confident about hitting 2+ targets with regularity.
The Blind thing might be a touch overstated; You're not a pure AA hero like Jimmy/ZJ/Butcher. They get completely shut out for the duration of the Blind, you can just wait it out. Also, if someone has the omega gosu reflexes to be able to ON-REACTION Blind a Q activation, then... sure. But hitting Q triggers an AA reset, so you can just AA -> Q -> instant AA. That's pretty fucking hard to get a Blind in during that window, I think. Even if you do get Blinded, like, Q is a 4 second cooldown. That's nothing.
The stacking isn't that difficult, honestly. Early on, maybe yeah, esp if you're getting bullied out in lane (but you can always let the minion waves push up to your towers instead for easy stacks). But later on it's a lot easier to get quick stacks. It's 4 total waves and some change.
In general, I do end up going E build most of the time, because it's just... good at everything, and it's safe and it's a good all-rounder build. But Q build is also quite good and definitely has its place. Giant Scorcher is some shit, man. 3% health every second for 3 seconds is a bit nuts. That's like old Malthael damage. And you can pop that off every 2-4 seconds, either having zero downtime or 1 second of downtime.
Yeah, except I can just take the Q at 16 if I feel like it'll be better and stick to every other E talent which gives more value.
....But why would you take every other E talent and then swap off of the cornerstone of the E build
Ragnaros has somewhat unfortunate talent design in that you are kinda locked into a build path from level 1. His talents are far too synergistic to play pick-and-choose; you have to go full Q/W/E build. It'd be like if I were Nazeebo and went Pandemic at 1 and then didn't take Toads of Hugeness at 7.
I don't really agree. I mostly take the E talents for utility. If I need to chase or escape extra hard at 16, I'll grab the E. Otherwise, it's sometimes better to just grab the Q talent to punish their frontline. I'd rather do that than go all in on Q talents for the bulk of my games.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
There is zero reason to take the Q talent at 16 if you haven't taken the other shit to support it.
Yeah, 9% is very chunky. It's also not shit compared to having two blast waves on each cast or having your meatball explode exactly where you want it to.
Sixteen is a huge tier for Ragnaros and it gives you the lynchpin of each particular build. I cannot fathom why you would invest so deeply into E and then give up on it during its best tier.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Oh also to recreate the imperius bug you just queue a bunch of your actions together.
It's very easy to do but not exactly practical in every situation.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
I do feel like E build has some options. Level 7 has no blatant E talent, and I usually end up taking the Q cooldown ability. If you've got that and you're against like a dual tank comp and you're procing it often, I could see maybe taking Q at 16. Maybe the numbers don't work out vs. the extra E though, dunno.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
I do feel like E build has some options. Level 7 has no blatant E talent, and I usually end up taking the Q cooldown ability. If you've got that and you're against like a dual tank comp and you're procing it often, I could see maybe taking Q at 16. Maybe the numbers don't work out vs. the extra E though, dunno.
It doesn't work out because the level 1 increases the size by 15% and the damage by 75%, the 4 gives it a slow, and the 13 gives you survivability off of its damage.
And the sixteen effectively doubles the effect of all the previous talents.
So your choice is "9% max health damage on your Q" or "double the potency of your entire talent tree"
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Oh also to recreate the imperius bug you just queue a bunch of your actions together.
It's very easy to do but not exactly practical in every situation.
I tried to do it in an AI game but couldn't get it to launch more than once. I guess I don't get it.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Sounds like something my hands wouldn't be able to make good use of.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited May 2020
Oh, like I said, it's not very viable to do but it is absolutely hilarious to see done and pretty easy to do against say a boss and have the boss basically get solo'd by imperius
EDIT: Of course I say this as a friend of mine posts a video of imperius taking down a full health fort in about 1 second via spam swords
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Last night I decided to bang out the “play healer games” with Deckard in AI.
Our Diablo and Chromie both decide to DC and not return on Sky Temple, so most of the match was me leading a train of those two around to objectives and team fights, while trying to get Chromie to run over potions to heal herself.
I have never before missed the old “DCed player” AI, but I did last night.
We ended up winning after losing all of our buildings and being down in levels until 20 thanks to back to back Boss caps.
So all the Mythic Pantheon stuff is live. That's got to be a mistake, right? No Twitter post, no warning, no trailer, no nothing? I went ahead and crafted a pair of skins and a mount for fun.
Need a voice actor? Hire me at bengrayVO.com
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So wait.... does that mean that regular chests will have this new content??
ed: apparently so!
Thankfully I have 130+ chests I've been saving up ^^'
ed 2.0: After 100+ chests, 70+ who were toy chests and 30 dark nexus chests, the only Greek God theme item I've gotten was from a Zagara hero chest....
I played with it in Try Mode a while just to learn how to get it to go off. Then I took Imperius into an AI game and was able to one shot the big sword robot mercs on Hanamura. Those are like the perfect use case for it since they don't have as much health as a boss, so you can easily take one by yourself. I tried to do it to the Sky Temple boss in another game, but the problem is you can only get so many swords off and I could only get the boss down to like 1/3 health with it. And it turns out Imperius is really, really bad at killing bosses.
I think it'd be tough to pull off on Forts consistently.
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Inquisitor772 x Penny Arcade Fight Club ChampionA fixed point in space and timeRegistered Userregular
Wow, those are some major Cassia and Tracer changes. I haven't had time to read through them yet, but I'm assuming the intent behind a Tracer rework is to make her a little less "lol toxic Overwatch hero"?
Wow, those are some major Cassia and Tracer changes. I haven't had time to read through them yet, but I'm assuming the intent behind a Tracer rework is to make her a little less "lol toxic Overwatch hero"?
There's too many to really get a good feel, but it really seems like they moved a bunch of what she was getting in synergy with Old Tassadar into her talents in slightly weaker forms, so she has a shitload more sustain, but a bit less damage. There's no comments on her though, so it's kind of speculative.
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Inquisitor772 x Penny Arcade Fight Club ChampionA fixed point in space and timeRegistered Userregular
Yeah, the real problem with Tracer recently is that she became a dead hero at high levels of play due to her dependency on Tassadar.
Wow, those are some major Cassia and Tracer changes. I haven't had time to read through them yet, but I'm assuming the intent behind a Tracer rework is to make her a little less "lol toxic Overwatch hero"?
There's too many to really get a good feel, but it really seems like they moved a bunch of what she was getting in synergy with Old Tassadar into her talents in slightly weaker forms, so she has a shitload more sustain, but a bit less damage. There's no comments on her though, so it's kind of speculative.
Yeah, that's what I got as well. There's a big talent shakeup, but from 10,000 feet the main thing I'm gathering is that she's losing some damage but gaining baseline life steal and more/better sustain options in her talents. She also loses a bit of attack range that she'll have to talent into in order to get her old range.
So the hypermobility doesn't seem to be changing at all, but her damage and burst are definitely dropping. I guess that fixes some of her toxicity issues, but I get the feeling she's still going to be a weak hero overall. Turning a glass cannon into a squishy rifle that can stay alive a little longer probably doesn't make her a solid pick.
Dread [E]
Additional functionality: Enemies hit by Dread’s wave are Slowed by 25% for 2 seconds.
YOOOOOOO BASELINE FRIGHT FOR ORPHEA LET'S FUCKING GOOOO
LET'S GO!!!!
Holy shit I am SO GLAD they came around on this one, for real. Orphea was legit one of my favorite Heroes to play before her nerfs and removing Fright revealed a pretty glaring issue for her. Namely, that her kit relied on having that slow on the Dread wave and she felt HORRIBLE to play without it. I'm so fucking glad they baselined it. Also E build is back, which was my favorite way to play her! Let's fucking GO.
There's no comments on her though, so it's kind of speculative.
Oh and yeah, it's super weird that Tracer didn't even get a dev comment with all those changes. Hell, they'll put dev comments on heroes that get one single minor change.
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E-build Ragnaros, in contrast, does not have to stack, does not have to hit multiple targets, is not susceptible to counter-blinds, and is equally effective.
Both builds have wave-clear, but E-build comes online faster. Both builds have burst potential, but E-build comes online faster.
E-build Ragnaros can do everything Q-build Rags can do, just faster, safer, and more consistently.
Oh, and it is provides more crowd control.
If we're talking straight-Q versus straight-E ability damage, Q almost certainly does more, yeah. But I find a lot of the burst potential from E-build actually comes from Slow Burn at level 4, which snares enemies by 40% for 2 seconds so they move at the exact same speed as your Meatball and can't get out of it during a pick.
The thing about E build is that your primary damage engage can be cast on the tank. It’s a ton of damage, helps with the tank’s engage, and helps them snare and secure targets.
And can help preload you with shields post 13. And goes off twice post 16 regardless of whether you have been stunned or blinded.
So many times I have lived through a stun chain because three guys were trying to beat my ass and E just exploded on their faces.
I mean Q build isn't hard locked into taking Hand of Ragnaros, you can easily go Blistering Attacks if you're not feeling confident about hitting 2+ targets with regularity.
The Blind thing might be a touch overstated; You're not a pure AA hero like Jimmy/ZJ/Butcher. They get completely shut out for the duration of the Blind, you can just wait it out. Also, if someone has the omega gosu reflexes to be able to ON-REACTION Blind a Q activation, then... sure. But hitting Q triggers an AA reset, so you can just AA -> Q -> instant AA. That's pretty fucking hard to get a Blind in during that window, I think. Even if you do get Blinded, like, Q is a 4 second cooldown. That's nothing.
The stacking isn't that difficult, honestly. Early on, maybe yeah, esp if you're getting bullied out in lane (but you can always let the minion waves push up to your towers instead for easy stacks). But later on it's a lot easier to get quick stacks. It's 4 total waves and some change.
In general, I do end up going E build most of the time, because it's just... good at everything, and it's safe and it's a good all-rounder build. But Q build is also quite good and definitely has its place. Giant Scorcher is some shit, man. 3% health every second for 3 seconds is a bit nuts. That's like old Malthael damage. And you can pop that off every 2-4 seconds, either having zero downtime or 1 second of downtime.
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Wow. I hope that's not easy to recreate in-game.
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It is.
Yeah, except I can just take the Q at 16 if I feel like it'll be better and stick to every other E talent which gives more value.
....But why would you take every other E talent and then swap off of the cornerstone of the E build
Ragnaros has somewhat unfortunate talent design in that you are kinda locked into a build path from level 1. His talents are far too synergistic to play pick-and-choose; you have to go full Q/W/E build. It'd be like if I were Nazeebo and went Pandemic at 1 and then didn't take Toads of Hugeness at 7.
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
Yeah, 9% is very chunky. It's also not shit compared to having two blast waves on each cast or having your meatball explode exactly where you want it to.
Sixteen is a huge tier for Ragnaros and it gives you the lynchpin of each particular build. I cannot fathom why you would invest so deeply into E and then give up on it during its best tier.
It's very easy to do but not exactly practical in every situation.
It doesn't work out because the level 1 increases the size by 15% and the damage by 75%, the 4 gives it a slow, and the 13 gives you survivability off of its damage.
And the sixteen effectively doubles the effect of all the previous talents.
So your choice is "9% max health damage on your Q" or "double the potency of your entire talent tree"
You use the ult
The Swords comes down
you queue a long move option and then a lot of R presses with something to break up the commands between R presses
Once the first swords launch then you can't queue up any more swords
EDIT: Of course I say this as a friend of mine posts a video of imperius taking down a full health fort in about 1 second via spam swords
Our Diablo and Chromie both decide to DC and not return on Sky Temple, so most of the match was me leading a train of those two around to objectives and team fights, while trying to get Chromie to run over potions to heal herself.
I have never before missed the old “DCed player” AI, but I did last night.
The DCed Chromie won MVP
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
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ed: apparently so!
Thankfully I have 130+ chests I've been saving up ^^'
ed 2.0: After 100+ chests, 70+ who were toy chests and 30 dark nexus chests, the only Greek God theme item I've gotten was from a Zagara hero chest....
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
In Try Mode, right?
Are you a cop? You have to tell us if you're a cop
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HE'S A NARC! HE'S A NARC!!!!
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
I think it'd be tough to pull off on Forts consistently.
You can trust me. I'm your friend.
There's too many to really get a good feel, but it really seems like they moved a bunch of what she was getting in synergy with Old Tassadar into her talents in slightly weaker forms, so she has a shitload more sustain, but a bit less damage. There's no comments on her though, so it's kind of speculative.
So the hypermobility doesn't seem to be changing at all, but her damage and burst are definitely dropping. I guess that fixes some of her toxicity issues, but I get the feeling she's still going to be a weak hero overall. Turning a glass cannon into a squishy rifle that can stay alive a little longer probably doesn't make her a solid pick.
YOOOOOOO BASELINE FRIGHT FOR ORPHEA LET'S FUCKING GOOOO
LET'S GO!!!!
Holy shit I am SO GLAD they came around on this one, for real. Orphea was legit one of my favorite Heroes to play before her nerfs and removing Fright revealed a pretty glaring issue for her. Namely, that her kit relied on having that slow on the Dread wave and she felt HORRIBLE to play without it. I'm so fucking glad they baselined it. Also E build is back, which was my favorite way to play her! Let's fucking GO.
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