I have finished my rewatch (and in the case of some episodes, a first watch) of TOS. I was running out of enthusiasm towards the end, as the egregious sexism started to really grate at the same time the quality of the episodes began to sag noticeably, but still: glorious design, great score, lots of wonderful SF ideas throughout the course of the run and Spock, the best alien ever created. I like most of the crew more in the TOS films, where their characters are friendlier and more fun, I think, but Spock is fully, beautifully formed almost from the off.
The really sidelined Sulu and Uhura in the last season, I thought. Barely any action for them at all, and Scotty much more to the fore.
I have finished my rewatch (and in the case of some episodes, a first watch) of TOS. I was running out of enthusiasm towards the end, as the egregious sexism started to really grate at the same time the quality of the episodes began to sag noticeably, but still: glorious design, great score, lots of wonderful SF ideas throughout the course of the run and Spock, the best alien ever created. I like most of the crew more in the TOS films, where their characters are friendlier and more fun, I think, but Spock is fully, beautifully formed almost from the off.
The really sidelined Sulu and Uhura in the last season, I thought. Barely any action for them at all, and Scotty much more to the fore.
I've memorized a good portion of Modern Major General...so many things I know about only through Trek.
Wasn't that one Babylon 5?
Although, I guess Trek could've done it as well. Although I don't believe Star Trek ever had that song for their outro.
It was a combination of both. But yeah, in that Disaster episode. The only reason Beverly is in the cargo hold with Geordie is because she's trying to get him to play the....Major General.
Eh, this is Star Trek future stuff. It would be trivially easy to add some procedural generation and custom stuff in there, such that ordering up a thousand hamburgers produces a thousand "perfect", but slightly unique, hamburgers. And stuff like pickle slices would be easy enough to make individual files for, so ordering a hamburger would mean the system pulls up the bun, meat, and pickle files for those items, randomizes them a bit, and kicks out your burger.
At least on something like the Enterprise, the computer seems to have files for practically every dish known to the Federation as well. Klingon Gutworm Fricasse? Easy, all six top recipes, plus Spock's own extra-horrifying anatomically-correct deconstructed version. Tenubrian Ass-Blaster? No problem, the computer can even do the version that given you the polka-dot shits instead of polka-dot vision. Memory doesn't seem to really be a problem, as even Quark's replicators seem to be able to replicate whatever people ask for.
When they are working, that is.
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CambiataCommander ShepardThe likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered Userregular
"If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
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That_GuyI don't wanna be that guyRegistered Userregular
O'brien didn't even start as an engineer. He was chief tactical, then a transporter chief, then leveled up on DS9 to a fabled Starfleet engineer that could turn rocks into replicators.
For being an average joe that I don't think ever went through officer training, it's kind of nuts how capable he is. I mean, he's no Tom Paris, but who can be.
He was a Star Trek engineer, they're all pretty much hopeless like that.
(Except Miles, who has a different path of endless suffering.)
Counterpoint. That whole Dr Brahms thing was inceldom of the highest order, well in excess of "bad with women.". Also, that one time Geordie got cucked by a hologram, man.
O'brien didn't even start as an engineer. He was chief tactical, then a transporter chief, then leveled up on DS9 to a fabled Starfleet engineer that could turn rocks into replicators.
For being an average joe that I don't think ever went through officer training, it's kind of nuts how capable he is. I mean, he's no Tom Paris, but who can be.
There was a mediocre Star Trek book from the 90s or earlier that had non-Federation characters make the observation that one of the really impressive things about Starfleet was the level of training they gave to their crews. Other species/factions would train crews fairly quickly and only teach them what they needed to know to do their jobs, while having a smaller number of specialists that they could deploy where needed. Starfleet training, however was such that even non-specialists had a base level of knowledge sufficient to pretty much rebuild their equipment from scratch if needed, and an understanding of the theory behind their technology good enough that a Starfleet trained individual could pretty much reinvent/modify their equipment on the fly with an understanding of what works and why.
The different training approaches was speculated to be because for most species/factions, their space force was a military wing of their faction that operated closer to home bases where they could supply experts when needed. However, Starfleet was an exploration organization, first and foremost where crews would very likely be on long, multi-year missions exploring far away from any home base support. In this scenario, it would be important to have well rounded crews who could improvise or create what they needed with the supplies and capabilities on hand.
Edit: fixed all the wording and phrasing that made me sad at my own writing.
Plus, it speaks to institutional purpose. The Klingon Defense Force and the Romulan Star Navy are explicitly militaries—they exist to defend or expand the state and everything else is secondary at best. Defense is only one of Starfleet's jobs. Sure, a ship might get sent to handle an enemy incursion, but it also might end up exploring new systems or conducting high-level trade negotiations.
There's no real-world organization that combines jobs the way Starfleet does, and that's a big reason I want more slice-of-life and lower stakes stories; there's a lot of story to tell with how people respond to Starfleet, within the Federation and without. Using the O'Brien example, he adjusted to his changing role pretty well—so what about someone who doesn't?
I mean, I guess when your vaunted triple-backuped systems fail when anything sneezes at you, it behooves you to have as many people on hand as possible that can fix your shit.
I have finished my rewatch (and in the case of some episodes, a first watch) of TOS. I was running out of enthusiasm towards the end, as the egregious sexism started to really grate at the same time the quality of the episodes began to sag noticeably, but still: glorious design, great score, lots of wonderful SF ideas throughout the course of the run and Spock, the best alien ever created. I like most of the crew more in the TOS films, where their characters are friendlier and more fun, I think, but Spock is fully, beautifully formed almost from the off.
The really sidelined Sulu and Uhura in the last season, I thought. Barely any action for them at all, and Scotty much more to the fore.
Sulu not getting his due really made the whole Harry Kim situation in Voyager untenable for me.
Plus, it speaks to institutional purpose. The Klingon Defense Force and the Romulan Star Navy are explicitly militaries—they exist to defend or expand the state and everything else is secondary at best. Defense is only one of Starfleet's jobs. Sure, a ship might get sent to handle an enemy incursion, but it also might end up exploring new systems or conducting high-level trade negotiations.
There's no real-world organization that combines jobs the way Starfleet does, and that's a big reason I want more slice-of-life and lower stakes stories; there's a lot of story to tell with how people respond to Starfleet, within the Federation and without. Using the O'Brien example, he adjusted to his changing role pretty well—so what about someone who doesn't?
I have said more than once that a primary reason I chose a normal human late-capitalism career over a career of service, even as a callow youth, was that there’s nothing available to a modern denizen of Earth that could hold a candle to Starfleet.
I have finished my rewatch (and in the case of some episodes, a first watch) of TOS. I was running out of enthusiasm towards the end, as the egregious sexism started to really grate at the same time the quality of the episodes began to sag noticeably, but still: glorious design, great score, lots of wonderful SF ideas throughout the course of the run and Spock, the best alien ever created. I like most of the crew more in the TOS films, where their characters are friendlier and more fun, I think, but Spock is fully, beautifully formed almost from the off.
The really sidelined Sulu and Uhura in the last season, I thought. Barely any action for them at all, and Scotty much more to the fore.
Sulu not getting his due really made the whole Harry Kim situation in Voyager untenable for me.
Voyager was a huge step backwards for Trek's progressive reputation. From the blatantly racist Chakotay to their apparent inability to consistently write Janeway to making Harry the resident chew toy.
Janeway, the Doctor, Seven, and Paris change and grow over the course of the show—they make substantive decisions that affect the story. Things happen to Tuvok, Chakotay, and Harry. See if you can spot the difference between the two groups. And sure, B'Elanna changes a lot during the story, but her entire character is infected with racial stereotypes of Hispanic women that are just as noxious as Chakotay's "closer to nature" tripe.
I still have a real soft spot for it, but Voyager is part of a long line of SF stories that feature diverse characters as props rather than people.
Voyager has a pretty bad casual racism problem if you ask me. It was the main reason I couldn't manage to get through all of season 2 when I recently sat down to watch it. I feel like Paris' opening speech where he rips into Quark really sets the tone for what happens next. All I could think is how Sisko would have torn him 3 new assholes for his little speech.
If Paris had stopped there it would have been bad, but he kept on being this complete asshole towards everything different. The show did not take the stance that he was in the wrong to do it either. Not once did a character ever push back on his bullshit, and too often would join in. At most Chakotay would get mildly annoyed at requests to use his Native American magic and the scene would move on to the next terrible thing Paris would say.
I had some other examples once upon a time that I have since forgotten. I admit to never being excited for Voyager, but after powering through Enterprise I felt I should at least give it a try. Bad episodes I can ignore, but man the betrayal of the idea that Starfleet was an organization that didn't put up with racist/speciest bullshit just hit me too hard.
I wonder if someone could program custom settings into a replicator. Like, when Riker orders a cheeseburger, it knows to use pepperjack instead of cheddar or that it should always have bacon. And if so, would you have to add the program to every replicator you come across, or would your personal files include your preferences and you just have to log in as it were.
More slice of life Trek stories, please.
We have seen episodes with people traveling. The often carry little thin briefcases full of isoliner cards. I assume those are replicator patterns for things they like
If plopped in a galaxy that extensively proved itself to be entirely peaceful then the Starfleets of the Romulans, Klingons etc would need to pretty drastically change in order to adapt to becoming largely exploratory and scientific.
The Federation Starfleet would barely notice. They wouldn't change at all I expect, or maybe would but wouldn't really need to.
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daveNYCWhy universe hate Waspinator?Registered Userregular
Voyager has a pretty bad casual racism problem if you ask me. It was the main reason I couldn't manage to get through all of season 2 when I recently sat down to watch it. I feel like Paris' opening speech where he rips into Quark really sets the tone for what happens next. All I could think is how Sisko would have torn him 3 new assholes for his little speech.
If Paris had stopped there it would have been bad, but he kept on being this complete asshole towards everything different. The show did not take the stance that he was in the wrong to do it either. Not once did a character ever push back on his bullshit, and too often would join in. At most Chakotay would get mildly annoyed at requests to use his Native American magic and the scene would move on to the next terrible thing Paris would say.
I had some other examples once upon a time that I have since forgotten. I admit to never being excited for Voyager, but after powering through Enterprise I felt I should at least give it a try. Bad episodes I can ignore, but man the betrayal of the idea that Starfleet was an organization that didn't put up with racist/speciest bullshit just hit me too hard.
I'm not sure that Starfleet doesn't put up with at least some speciest bullshit. Consider Nog trying to get into Starfleet. The core issue unfortunately is that a good chunk of the main alien cultures in Trek seem to have been written as monocultures in order to let the Federation show off how progressive they are. The Ferengi are the obvious worst offenders there, but it's not like the Klingons and Romulans have a huge amount of nuance in their behavior. At least in the behavior that the average Federation citizen is going to see. As viewers we get to see Quark and his crew (who seem to be about the only 'good' Ferengi in existence), Worf and some of the more interesting Klingons, and the whole reunification plot with the Romulans in TNG. Joe Federation guy won't be getting any of that. To him, Ferengi will be that guy who sold the overprice gadget that broke the second his ship warped out of the system, Klingons will be the group of assholes who get into bar fights, and Romulans will be the never-actually-met-one, pointy-eared, perpetual threat to the Federation that have the invisible ships.
Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
Nog getting into Starfleet is a good example of how they don't follow that path to the end though. Everyone is suspicious of why Nog wants it because it just doesn't fit, but at no point do they road block him. The closest is when Sisko forces him to come clean about his motivations. You then have some grumblings about it being odd, and that's the worst of it. Worf gets a little weird I suppose, but he gets weird with pretty much everybody.
The average Federation citizen is not given depth on screen because it is treated as a monoculture as well really. They are all saints that are above the petty problems of the past. Earth is a planet full of people following their bliss and working together in perfect socialistic harmony. They would forgive the other species their failing and try to help them better themselves because that's all we ever learn about them. What they would logically think falls apart because there is not a ton of substance to them.
Starfleet is what we see on screen, and with vanishingly few exceptions they don't react that way in TNG, TOS, or DS9 to my memory. I have intentionally forgotten a lot of Enterprise so that could be a problem as well that I am unaware of.
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daveNYCWhy universe hate Waspinator?Registered Userregular
They don't tell him to get lost and then hang up a sign saying "No Ferengi Allowed", but they do question what he's doing and do so solely on the basis that he's a Ferengi.
Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
They don't tell him to get lost and then hang up a sign saying "No Ferengi Allowed", but they do question what he's doing and do so solely on the basis that he's a Ferengi.
It's not based solely off his race. They know Nog. He's not just some random ferengi they assume must be into profit and nothing else because he's ferengi. They know how he behaves because they've seen it and so this sudden change prompts the question about his motivations. But they give him a chance to explain himself and when he does, they accept it.
I was watching the two parter where worf gets his family's honor restored, and an interesting component is Data's role in the second part.
Despite the assembled fleet needing good command officers, Picard casually passes over Data for command until Data breaches the subject. Data then has to deal with a near seditious first officer in his command that "doesn't think his kind is suitable for command".
Then within a few episodes there was a civilian doctor that accused Data of collaborating with the crystalline entity, threatening to have him dismantled, before destroying the entity. Despite her hostility and telegraphing her hatred of the crystalline entity she was trusted and given enough access to write a program that would destroy the entity.
I think if I were to categorize the starfleet mentality it would be lawfully, but not intrinsically, good.
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CambiataCommander ShepardThe likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered Userregular
I was watching the two parter where worf gets his family's honor restored, and an interesting component is Data's role in the second part.
Despite the assembled fleet needing good command officers, Picard casually passes over Data for command until Data breaches the subject. Data then has to deal with a near seditious first officer in his command that "doesn't think his kind is suitable for command".
Then within a few episodes there was a civilian doctor that accused Data of collaborating with the crystalline entity, threatening to have him dismantled, before destroying the entity. Despite her hostility and telegraphing her hatred of the crystalline entity she was trusted and given enough access to write a program that would destroy the entity.
I think if I were to categorize the starfleet mentality it would be lawfully, but not intrinsically, good.
On the flip side of that though is that Data frequently puts the entire ship in danger any time he's being sent a signal from outside or is being impersonated by Lor. Like, Enterprise crew, we all know and love Data, but maybe there should be some special security measures involved with him such that he doesn't copy Picard's voice and lock everyone else out of the bridge a second time??
"If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
I was watching the two parter where worf gets his family's honor restored, and an interesting component is Data's role in the second part.
Despite the assembled fleet needing good command officers, Picard casually passes over Data for command until Data breaches the subject. Data then has to deal with a near seditious first officer in his command that "doesn't think his kind is suitable for command".
Then within a few episodes there was a civilian doctor that accused Data of collaborating with the crystalline entity, threatening to have him dismantled, before destroying the entity. Despite her hostility and telegraphing her hatred of the crystalline entity she was trusted and given enough access to write a program that would destroy the entity.
I think if I were to categorize the starfleet mentality it would be lawfully, but not intrinsically, good.
On the flip side of that though is that Data frequently puts the entire ship in danger any time he's being sent a signal from outside or is being impersonated by Lor. Like, Enterprise crew, we all know and love Data, but maybe there should be some special security measures involved with him such that he doesn't copy Picard's voice and lock everyone else out of the bridge a second time??
Star fleet security seems to be what you’d expect from a culture that hasn’t had to deal with any serious criminal activity for over a couple centuries.
Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
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CambiataCommander ShepardThe likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered Userregular
I was watching the two parter where worf gets his family's honor restored, and an interesting component is Data's role in the second part.
Despite the assembled fleet needing good command officers, Picard casually passes over Data for command until Data breaches the subject. Data then has to deal with a near seditious first officer in his command that "doesn't think his kind is suitable for command".
Then within a few episodes there was a civilian doctor that accused Data of collaborating with the crystalline entity, threatening to have him dismantled, before destroying the entity. Despite her hostility and telegraphing her hatred of the crystalline entity she was trusted and given enough access to write a program that would destroy the entity.
I think if I were to categorize the starfleet mentality it would be lawfully, but not intrinsically, good.
On the flip side of that though is that Data frequently puts the entire ship in danger any time he's being sent a signal from outside or is being impersonated by Lor. Like, Enterprise crew, we all know and love Data, but maybe there should be some special security measures involved with him such that he doesn't copy Picard's voice and lock everyone else out of the bridge a second time??
Star fleet security seems to be what you’d expect from a culture that hasn’t had to deal with any serious criminal activity for over a couple centuries.
Excusable before the first incident. Inexcusable after the second. Criminally negligent after the third.
"If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
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daveNYCWhy universe hate Waspinator?Registered Userregular
I was watching the two parter where worf gets his family's honor restored, and an interesting component is Data's role in the second part.
Despite the assembled fleet needing good command officers, Picard casually passes over Data for command until Data breaches the subject. Data then has to deal with a near seditious first officer in his command that "doesn't think his kind is suitable for command".
Then within a few episodes there was a civilian doctor that accused Data of collaborating with the crystalline entity, threatening to have him dismantled, before destroying the entity. Despite her hostility and telegraphing her hatred of the crystalline entity she was trusted and given enough access to write a program that would destroy the entity.
I think if I were to categorize the starfleet mentality it would be lawfully, but not intrinsically, good.
On the flip side of that though is that Data frequently puts the entire ship in danger any time he's being sent a signal from outside or is being impersonated by Lor. Like, Enterprise crew, we all know and love Data, but maybe there should be some special security measures involved with him such that he doesn't copy Picard's voice and lock everyone else out of the bridge a second time??
Star fleet security seems to be what you’d expect from a culture that hasn’t had to deal with any serious criminal activity for over a couple centuries.
Excusable before the first incident. Inexcusable after the second. Criminally negligent after the third.
The only way it isn’t criminally negligent from the get go is if every Mission Impossible or Ocean’s ## film got destroyed in WWIII.
Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
I was watching the two parter where worf gets his family's honor restored, and an interesting component is Data's role in the second part.
Despite the assembled fleet needing good command officers, Picard casually passes over Data for command until Data breaches the subject. Data then has to deal with a near seditious first officer in his command that "doesn't think his kind is suitable for command".
Then within a few episodes there was a civilian doctor that accused Data of collaborating with the crystalline entity, threatening to have him dismantled, before destroying the entity. Despite her hostility and telegraphing her hatred of the crystalline entity she was trusted and given enough access to write a program that would destroy the entity.
I think if I were to categorize the starfleet mentality it would be lawfully, but not intrinsically, good.
On the flip side of that though is that Data frequently puts the entire ship in danger any time he's being sent a signal from outside or is being impersonated by Lor. Like, Enterprise crew, we all know and love Data, but maybe there should be some special security measures involved with him such that he doesn't copy Picard's voice and lock everyone else out of the bridge a second time??
Star fleet security seems to be what you’d expect from a culture that hasn’t had to deal with any serious criminal activity for over a couple centuries.
Excusable before the first incident. Inexcusable after the second. Criminally negligent after the third.
Star Fleet Security is too busy violating the Treaty of Algeron, working with domestic terrorists, and being jobbers to the alien of the week to be an effective enforcement organization?
Black lives matter.
Law and Order ≠ Justice
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Captain of the SES Comptroller of the State
I was watching the two parter where worf gets his family's honor restored, and an interesting component is Data's role in the second part.
Despite the assembled fleet needing good command officers, Picard casually passes over Data for command until Data breaches the subject. Data then has to deal with a near seditious first officer in his command that "doesn't think his kind is suitable for command".
Then within a few episodes there was a civilian doctor that accused Data of collaborating with the crystalline entity, threatening to have him dismantled, before destroying the entity. Despite her hostility and telegraphing her hatred of the crystalline entity she was trusted and given enough access to write a program that would destroy the entity.
I think if I were to categorize the starfleet mentality it would be lawfully, but not intrinsically, good.
On the flip side of that though is that Data frequently puts the entire ship in danger any time he's being sent a signal from outside or is being impersonated by Lor. Like, Enterprise crew, we all know and love Data, but maybe there should be some special security measures involved with him such that he doesn't copy Picard's voice and lock everyone else out of the bridge a second time??
Star fleet security seems to be what you’d expect from a culture that hasn’t had to deal with any serious criminal activity for over a couple centuries.
Excusable before the first incident. Inexcusable after the second. Criminally negligent after the third.
I mean, Geordi's visor was responsible for at least as much shenanigans. See also: Reginald Barclay's existence
I ran across this clip and was once again reminded of the difference between TNG and Discovery: https://youtu.be/9eEGmC9FeFU
What a great fucking scene, man. Frakes has like 3 lines, but he's got emotions playing across his face at Picard's every word. And the way Picard held back the last part of the report—perfect cross-examination and shows how badly his trust in Riker is shaken.
Posts
...*raises hand*
The really sidelined Sulu and Uhura in the last season, I thought. Barely any action for them at all, and Scotty much more to the fore.
Choose Your Own Chat 1 Choose Your Own Chat 2 Choose Your Own Chat 3
Only a real Herbert would sideline Sulu and Uhura
It was a combination of both. But yeah, in that Disaster episode. The only reason Beverly is in the cargo hold with Geordie is because she's trying to get him to play the....Major General.
Enlist in Star Citizen! Citizenship must be earned!
Don't forget Freeman's version
When they are working, that is.
He was a Star Trek engineer, they're all pretty much hopeless like that.
(Except Miles, who has a different path of endless suffering.)
For being an average joe that I don't think ever went through officer training, it's kind of nuts how capable he is. I mean, he's no Tom Paris, but who can be.
PSN: ShogunGunshow
Origin: ShogunGunshow
Locarno
Why are you just repeating the same character back to me?
PSN: ShogunGunshow
Origin: ShogunGunshow
Counterpoint. That whole Dr Brahms thing was inceldom of the highest order, well in excess of "bad with women.". Also, that one time Geordie got cucked by a hologram, man.
There was a mediocre Star Trek book from the 90s or earlier that had non-Federation characters make the observation that one of the really impressive things about Starfleet was the level of training they gave to their crews. Other species/factions would train crews fairly quickly and only teach them what they needed to know to do their jobs, while having a smaller number of specialists that they could deploy where needed. Starfleet training, however was such that even non-specialists had a base level of knowledge sufficient to pretty much rebuild their equipment from scratch if needed, and an understanding of the theory behind their technology good enough that a Starfleet trained individual could pretty much reinvent/modify their equipment on the fly with an understanding of what works and why.
The different training approaches was speculated to be because for most species/factions, their space force was a military wing of their faction that operated closer to home bases where they could supply experts when needed. However, Starfleet was an exploration organization, first and foremost where crews would very likely be on long, multi-year missions exploring far away from any home base support. In this scenario, it would be important to have well rounded crews who could improvise or create what they needed with the supplies and capabilities on hand.
Edit: fixed all the wording and phrasing that made me sad at my own writing.
Plus, it speaks to institutional purpose. The Klingon Defense Force and the Romulan Star Navy are explicitly militaries—they exist to defend or expand the state and everything else is secondary at best. Defense is only one of Starfleet's jobs. Sure, a ship might get sent to handle an enemy incursion, but it also might end up exploring new systems or conducting high-level trade negotiations.
There's no real-world organization that combines jobs the way Starfleet does, and that's a big reason I want more slice-of-life and lower stakes stories; there's a lot of story to tell with how people respond to Starfleet, within the Federation and without. Using the O'Brien example, he adjusted to his changing role pretty well—so what about someone who doesn't?
PSN: ShogunGunshow
Origin: ShogunGunshow
Sulu not getting his due really made the whole Harry Kim situation in Voyager untenable for me.
I have said more than once that a primary reason I chose a normal human late-capitalism career over a career of service, even as a callow youth, was that there’s nothing available to a modern denizen of Earth that could hold a candle to Starfleet.
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Voyager was a huge step backwards for Trek's progressive reputation. From the blatantly racist Chakotay to their apparent inability to consistently write Janeway to making Harry the resident chew toy.
Janeway, the Doctor, Seven, and Paris change and grow over the course of the show—they make substantive decisions that affect the story. Things happen to Tuvok, Chakotay, and Harry. See if you can spot the difference between the two groups. And sure, B'Elanna changes a lot during the story, but her entire character is infected with racial stereotypes of Hispanic women that are just as noxious as Chakotay's "closer to nature" tripe.
I still have a real soft spot for it, but Voyager is part of a long line of SF stories that feature diverse characters as props rather than people.
If Paris had stopped there it would have been bad, but he kept on being this complete asshole towards everything different. The show did not take the stance that he was in the wrong to do it either. Not once did a character ever push back on his bullshit, and too often would join in. At most Chakotay would get mildly annoyed at requests to use his Native American magic and the scene would move on to the next terrible thing Paris would say.
I had some other examples once upon a time that I have since forgotten. I admit to never being excited for Voyager, but after powering through Enterprise I felt I should at least give it a try. Bad episodes I can ignore, but man the betrayal of the idea that Starfleet was an organization that didn't put up with racist/speciest bullshit just hit me too hard.
The Federation Starfleet would barely notice. They wouldn't change at all I expect, or maybe would but wouldn't really need to.
I'm not sure that Starfleet doesn't put up with at least some speciest bullshit. Consider Nog trying to get into Starfleet. The core issue unfortunately is that a good chunk of the main alien cultures in Trek seem to have been written as monocultures in order to let the Federation show off how progressive they are. The Ferengi are the obvious worst offenders there, but it's not like the Klingons and Romulans have a huge amount of nuance in their behavior. At least in the behavior that the average Federation citizen is going to see. As viewers we get to see Quark and his crew (who seem to be about the only 'good' Ferengi in existence), Worf and some of the more interesting Klingons, and the whole reunification plot with the Romulans in TNG. Joe Federation guy won't be getting any of that. To him, Ferengi will be that guy who sold the overprice gadget that broke the second his ship warped out of the system, Klingons will be the group of assholes who get into bar fights, and Romulans will be the never-actually-met-one, pointy-eared, perpetual threat to the Federation that have the invisible ships.
The average Federation citizen is not given depth on screen because it is treated as a monoculture as well really. They are all saints that are above the petty problems of the past. Earth is a planet full of people following their bliss and working together in perfect socialistic harmony. They would forgive the other species their failing and try to help them better themselves because that's all we ever learn about them. What they would logically think falls apart because there is not a ton of substance to them.
Starfleet is what we see on screen, and with vanishingly few exceptions they don't react that way in TNG, TOS, or DS9 to my memory. I have intentionally forgotten a lot of Enterprise so that could be a problem as well that I am unaware of.
It's not based solely off his race. They know Nog. He's not just some random ferengi they assume must be into profit and nothing else because he's ferengi. They know how he behaves because they've seen it and so this sudden change prompts the question about his motivations. But they give him a chance to explain himself and when he does, they accept it.
Despite the assembled fleet needing good command officers, Picard casually passes over Data for command until Data breaches the subject. Data then has to deal with a near seditious first officer in his command that "doesn't think his kind is suitable for command".
Then within a few episodes there was a civilian doctor that accused Data of collaborating with the crystalline entity, threatening to have him dismantled, before destroying the entity. Despite her hostility and telegraphing her hatred of the crystalline entity she was trusted and given enough access to write a program that would destroy the entity.
I think if I were to categorize the starfleet mentality it would be lawfully, but not intrinsically, good.
On the flip side of that though is that Data frequently puts the entire ship in danger any time he's being sent a signal from outside or is being impersonated by Lor. Like, Enterprise crew, we all know and love Data, but maybe there should be some special security measures involved with him such that he doesn't copy Picard's voice and lock everyone else out of the bridge a second time??
Star fleet security seems to be what you’d expect from a culture that hasn’t had to deal with any serious criminal activity for over a couple centuries.
Excusable before the first incident. Inexcusable after the second. Criminally negligent after the third.
The only way it isn’t criminally negligent from the get go is if every Mission Impossible or Ocean’s ## film got destroyed in WWIII.
Star Fleet Security is too busy violating the Treaty of Algeron, working with domestic terrorists, and being jobbers to the alien of the week to be an effective enforcement organization?
Law and Order ≠ Justice
ACNH Island Isla Cero: DA-3082-2045-4142
Captain of the SES Comptroller of the State
*Grumpy Worf face*
PSN: ShogunGunshow
Origin: ShogunGunshow
I mean, Geordi's visor was responsible for at least as much shenanigans. See also: Reginald Barclay's existence
What a great fucking scene, man. Frakes has like 3 lines, but he's got emotions playing across his face at Picard's every word. And the way Picard held back the last part of the report—perfect cross-examination and shows how badly his trust in Riker is shaken.
*chef kiss*