A word to the wise - allying with Nakai does NOT ally with his vassal faction for the purposes of victory conditions. If you are playing Mazdamundi or Gor-Rok do NOT military ally with him, kill him or confederate him.
I just had to abandon my gorrok campaign because he’s way too powerful to confederate and I don’t want to turn on a long-time ally for gamey reasons.
Allying with Nakai as Gor-rok in the Vortex campaign is also a bad idea on higher difficulties because he makes Lustria even worse. It can take a long time to secure your position and he will end up at war with every non lizardmen action he encounters so you'll end up fighting everyone earlier than is manageable.
It's better if he wanders down to contain Skrolk while you finish off the other nearby Skaven. If he buys enough time but dies doing it he's done his job.
If they carry over everything they've learned in Warhammer and especially 3 kingdoms, this could be so good.
In their latest dev blog, they mentioned their approach to designing the Saga games:
THE TELLING OF A SAGA
As has already been rumoured and mentioned lightly, we’re about to start singing an epic Saga. A tale of heroism and legendary events that has echoed down the ages.
We’re absolutely aware that Thrones of Britannia split its audience between those who felt it didn’t do enough, those who felt it was a roaring telling of the period, and some who list it as the best TW we’ve done.
Obviously, we’d love to make everyone happy, but these more experimental, extreme, and tightly scoped games have a real appeal for us. Thankfully Thrones was nevertheless a considerable success for us and continues to gain fans. This means we’ll be revisiting the Total War Saga format again, looking to drill down into one of those decisive events from history and tell it in a new and interesting way.
We want to get the balance right between making a conventional Total War game at a tighter scale, that a wide audience can enjoy, but being brave with new features and dynamics to push the series forward in interesting ways.
We’re probably going to edge more towards the route of bravery, because that’s how legends are made. More on the next Saga title very soon!Rest assured though, we are always listening, and excited to see what you think of Total War in the next 12 months.
I wonder if they get the statistics for who plays which mode in 3 Kingdoms? If they had that sort of data, I'm sure that would influence their decision. I haven't even looked at the realism mode in 3K.
That_GuyI don't wanna be that guyRegistered Userregular
IMO, any Total War game with monsters is a better Total War game. I love love LOVED Rome and Rome 2. Shogun was my jam back in the day, as terrible as I was at it. When Total Warhammer came along it brought a whole new element into the battles that just hasn't been replicated in other threads of the Total War series. An element that I absolutely love. Magic and monsters have rewritten the Total War formula for the better, IMO.
If they're putting magic and monsters into Tory, I am 150% on board.
+6
-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
edited September 2019
Yeah I feel the same. Historical settings just don't do it for me when I've seen a triceratops smash into a regiment of ratmen and just carve a bloody line through them by sheer momentum.
The 1v1 hero fights would also lend themselves spectacularly well to Troy.
Also to Warhammer.
-Loki- on
+1
That_GuyI don't wanna be that guyRegistered Userregular
Yeah I feel the same. Historical settings just don't do it for me when I've seen a triceratops smash into a regiment of ratmen and just carve a bloody line through them by sheer momentum.
The 1v1 hero fights would also lend themselves spectacularly well to Troy.
Also to Warhammer.
Oh man, a dueling system in Warhammer 3 would be awesome. There's a lot of sync animations we hardly ever get to see or would notice that could get highlighted in a proper duel.
The other thing with Troy- there just isn’t much meat on the bones there if you don’t go mythic/heroic.
In the actual time of the Myceneans war was pretty primitive in that part of the world. Like no hoplites, no formations, no cavalry, just individual guys with melee weapons and some light armor in a mob with some guys with bows and maybe a chariot or two here and there.
A bronze age game focusing on, say, the assyrians would be a totally different matter, but a “realistic” Myceneans vs Assuwa confederation game is basically like the Rise of Rome campaign if you took out the Romans, Greeks, and Celts.
Wow, playing lizardmen a lot lately trying out the new lords, it is amazing to me how they have gone from being probably the least developed faction before the last 2 lord packs to just being very solid. Just from a pretty good roster, to a lot of solid lord choices with a mix of playstyles, to a really nice selection of generic lords and heros, etc. Its hard to think of another faction that feels more complete at this point.
I think the monsters in Warhammer lend themselves to this very dynamic sense of theme to whichever race you're both playing and fighting against at the moment. You don't get that in historical titles because, really, how many different ways can you make actual historical soldiers look before they all start to look generally alike? Especially if you're trying to be accurate about the whole thing.
You don't have catapults firing goblins into a horde of undead in the historical games. I like them, but I didn't fall in love with total war until I got to play as all the cool fantasy races.
You would have to use the imperial support mechanism or something similar such that each troop was tied to a specific region and maintaining the troop was tied to maintaining that region in your alliance.
I think the monsters in Warhammer lend themselves to this very dynamic sense of theme to whichever race you're both playing and fighting against at the moment. You don't get that in historical titles because, really, how many different ways can you make actual historical soldiers look before they all start to look generally alike? Especially if you're trying to be accurate about the whole thing.
You don't have catapults firing goblins into a horde of undead in the historical games. I like them, but I didn't fall in love with total war until I got to play as all the cool fantasy races.
The closest thing you really get is in the ancient to classical era, where people like the gauls vs romans vs successor states vs parthians and horse nomads have vastly different fighting styles and ways of dress.
It seems like from the medeival era on though things get a bit samey.
0
-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
Its hard to think of another faction that feels more complete at this point.
In regards to having most of their army book represented, Vampire Counts are about as close to done as Lizardmen. I think both are just missing one unit/mount (Troglodon and Coven Throne) and both have a large variety of Legendary Lords, Lords and Heroes. They even got ranged units with the Bloodlines update (though not enough to run a gun line army).
A couple more Legendary Lords and Tomb Kings will be there too.
Its hard to think of another faction that feels more complete at this point.
In regards to having most of their army book represented, Vampire Counts are about as close to done as Lizardmen. I think both are just missing one unit/mount (Troglodon and Coven Throne) and both have a large variety of Legendary Lords, Lords and Heroes. They even got ranged units with the Bloodlines update (though not enough to run a gun line army).
A couple more Legendary Lords and Tomb Kings will be there too.
True, VC and Empire both have good rosters right now, the big thing with both is starting locations. Both only have 3 start locations in ME. Having ghorst and Volkmar move away from home would help a lot, or making Boris and the Red Duke playable, or both.
Norsca is basically the same issue, in a good place with units and mechanics but could use more starts (and maybe a generic lord option or two, fimir cheiftain or aspiring sorceror or the like))
Jealous Deva on
0
-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
edited September 2019
Vampire Counts just need Neferata starting in the Silver Spire in the Southlands and adding Coven Thrones, as a chariot choice like the Mortis Engine and as a mount for her and Lahmian Bloodline Vampires. Maybe give her a hybrid TK/Vampire army since she really was more on a TK than a Vampire. Make her very magic focused rather than a hybrid melee blender like Vlad, Isabella and Mannfred.
That’ll be a nice different start with some very different strategies.
I would love a large scale age of mythology. Take like 5 or 6 Europe/North africa/middle east cultures, do a greatest hits army for each one, add in a bunch of mythological creatures and heroes. Like start with say Celts, Greeks and Romans, Germanic/Norse, Egyptian, maybe Phonecian/Semetic to fill in the map.
You could have expansions covering say India and China , slavic mythology, central asia, Persia, Arabic mythology with Djinn and the like... possibilities are endless.
Through Total War’s unique blend of grand, turn-based empire management and spectacular real-time battles, Troy explores this epic conflict from both the Greek and Trojan perspectives – peeling back the layers of myth and legend to reveal the realities that may have inspired them.
Also can confirm ports in Warhammer have now been inserted.
Through Total War’s unique blend of grand, turn-based empire management and spectacular real-time battles, Troy explores this epic conflict from both the Greek and Trojan perspectives – peeling back the layers of myth and legend to reveal the realities that may have inspired them.
Also can confirm ports in Warhammer have now been inserted.
I'm too lazy to post from my phone but if you check out Eurogamer the writer (Tom Phillips) on the Troy announcement article said that they got to see a Minotaur in a demo while at Gamescom.
I also saw how "mythical units will be utilized in battle - such as the Minotaur. This interpretation of the half man half angry bull beast has the Minotaur as a beefy bloke who wears smelly cow skins and a skull on his head. It's enough to instil (sic) fear in other units in battle.
According to Polygon the game will run on a barter economy, and it will require players to "curry the very favour of the Gods themselves". I wonder I need to have random villagers praying at a temple...
Through Total War’s unique blend of grand, turn-based empire management and spectacular real-time battles, Troy explores this epic conflict from both the Greek and Trojan perspectives – peeling back the layers of myth and legend to reveal the realities that may have inspired them.
Also can confirm ports in Warhammer have now been inserted.
I'm too lazy to post from my phone but if you check out Eurogamer the writer (Tom Phillips) on the Troy announcement article said that they got to see a Minotaur in a demo while at Gamescom.
I also saw how "mythical units will be utilized in battle - such as the Minotaur. This interpretation of the half man half angry bull beast has the Minotaur as a beefy bloke who wears smelly cow skins and a skull on his head. It's enough to instil (sic) fear in other units in battle.
According to Polygon the game will run on a barter economy, and it will require players to "curry the very favour of the Gods themselves". I wonder I need to have random villagers praying at a temple...
Lame.
While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
0
That_GuyI don't wanna be that guyRegistered Userregular
I think it'd be cool if you could enable/disable mythological creatures/features as some have suggested, but ultimately the Trojan War is one couched in myth itself due to its association with Homer's epic. I'm all for historical strategy games but there's too much to like here for me.
Only thing that worries me is that it's a new team working on it.
I can imagine it being mission based. So you have a choice of gods to appease, which opens up different mission trees, which then unlocks specific unit types. Could be cool, or could be like WH1 where you send an agent to the other side of the map for 20 turns. They've got a lot better at making these things interesting, so I have faith.
0
That_GuyI don't wanna be that guyRegistered Userregular
WILL THERE BE ANY MYTHICAL CREATURES?
Our truth behind the myth approach has allowed us to draw from a multitude of mythology’s most renowned monsters and include them within the battlefields of Troy as realistic representations of what their true form may have been. This approach has allowed us to expand the unit diversity by including unique warriors to the roster whilst adding an extra layer of tactical versatility to the conflict.
So maybe instead of minotaurs we will get really big guys with bull hat. Maybe instead of harpies we'll get lady warriors that wear feather cloaks. I think they will effectively work like monsters in battles but won't be quite as crazy as a Warhammer monster.
WHAT ROLE DO THE GODS PLAY?
Gods and Favor is a new gameplay system for a Total War Saga: TROY. Similar to our truth behind the myth approach to mythical creatures, the Greek gods within TROY are a purely spiritual representation, but they influence the game in similar ways to their Homeric counterparts. Rather than the gods directly intervening with the conflict itself, it is the faction’s belief that the gods are intervening on their behalf which determines the bonuses they receive. Afterall, the more fervently a leader devotes themselves to a deity, the more likely their people are to espouse and live those beliefs. These bonuses are specific to each god and provide a range of benefits from strategic warfare buffs to growth and resource increases.
So they're Orks?
+2
KadokenGiving Ends to my Friends and it Feels StupendousRegistered Userregular
I wonder if they're making these weird adhoc mythological units to sell a DLC that gives you the mythology mode later.
WILL THERE BE ANY MYTHICAL CREATURES?
Our truth behind the myth approach has allowed us to draw from a multitude of mythology’s most renowned monsters and include them within the battlefields of Troy as realistic representations of what their true form may have been. This approach has allowed us to expand the unit diversity by including unique warriors to the roster whilst adding an extra layer of tactical versatility to the conflict.
So maybe instead of minotaurs we will get really big guys with bull hat. Maybe instead of harpies we'll get lady warriors that wear feather cloaks. I think they will effectively work like monsters in battles but won't be quite as crazy as a Warhammer monster.
Centaurs were pretty obviously steppe nomads and the greeks just didn’t understand how horse riding worked, for what it’s worth.
WILL THERE BE ANY MYTHICAL CREATURES?
Our truth behind the myth approach has allowed us to draw from a multitude of mythology’s most renowned monsters and include them within the battlefields of Troy as realistic representations of what their true form may have been. This approach has allowed us to expand the unit diversity by including unique warriors to the roster whilst adding an extra layer of tactical versatility to the conflict.
So maybe instead of minotaurs we will get really big guys with bull hat. Maybe instead of harpies we'll get lady warriors that wear feather cloaks. I think they will effectively work like monsters in battles but won't be quite as crazy as a Warhammer monster.
My dreams of crashing into Troy with a Hydra and squadron of Manticores are crushed, but I can live with that. I'm interested to see what their interpretations of different mythological creatures are. I imagine they'll be devotees of certain gods/secret orders and/or really big wild animals (maybe you'll get a Nemean Lion, aka a tamed version of the lions which according to Homer roamed Greece).
It's using the Vampire Coast model for sea battles! And there's a modified version of the duels/challenge system! But actually if they are able to make the different infantry types feel and play completely different, then that will be a huge step forward, especially for their historical titles.
+2
SpectrumArcher of InfernoChaldea Rec RoomRegistered Userregular
WILL THERE BE ANY MYTHICAL CREATURES?
Our truth behind the myth approach has allowed us to draw from a multitude of mythology’s most renowned monsters and include them within the battlefields of Troy as realistic representations of what their true form may have been. This approach has allowed us to expand the unit diversity by including unique warriors to the roster whilst adding an extra layer of tactical versatility to the conflict.
So maybe instead of minotaurs we will get really big guys with bull hat. Maybe instead of harpies we'll get lady warriors that wear feather cloaks. I think they will effectively work like monsters in battles but won't be quite as crazy as a Warhammer monster.
My dreams of crashing into Troy with a Hydra and squadron of Manticores are crushed, but I can live with that. I'm interested to see what their interpretations of different mythological creatures are. I imagine they'll be devotees of certain gods/secret orders and/or really big wild animals (maybe you'll get a Nemean Lion, aka a tamed version of the lions which according to Homer roamed Greece).
There’s evidence of what we would consider pretty exotic animals now in that general area that have gone extinct since. Elk, lions, tigers, wild goat, bison, aurochs(basically a giant wild cow), etc.
0
Zavianuniversal peace sounds better than forever warRegistered Userregular
yea, seems like the duels happen, but it acts more like a taunt; removing the other hero from other engagements for a temporary time. After, they can continue to fight, or retreat to battle on as normal.
Posts
Allying with Nakai as Gor-rok in the Vortex campaign is also a bad idea on higher difficulties because he makes Lustria even worse. It can take a long time to secure your position and he will end up at war with every non lizardmen action he encounters so you'll end up fighting everyone earlier than is manageable.
It's better if he wanders down to contain Skrolk while you finish off the other nearby Skaven. If he buys enough time but dies doing it he's done his job.
I'm just going to do this. I can't even win the first fight in an ambush.
If they carry over everything they've learned in Warhammer and especially 3 kingdoms, this could be so good.
In their latest dev blog, they mentioned their approach to designing the Saga games:
THE TELLING OF A SAGA
As has already been rumoured and mentioned lightly, we’re about to start singing an epic Saga. A tale of heroism and legendary events that has echoed down the ages.
We’re absolutely aware that Thrones of Britannia split its audience between those who felt it didn’t do enough, those who felt it was a roaring telling of the period, and some who list it as the best TW we’ve done.
Obviously, we’d love to make everyone happy, but these more experimental, extreme, and tightly scoped games have a real appeal for us. Thankfully Thrones was nevertheless a considerable success for us and continues to gain fans. This means we’ll be revisiting the Total War Saga format again, looking to drill down into one of those decisive events from history and tell it in a new and interesting way.
We want to get the balance right between making a conventional Total War game at a tighter scale, that a wide audience can enjoy, but being brave with new features and dynamics to push the series forward in interesting ways.
We’re probably going to edge more towards the route of bravery, because that’s how legends are made. More on the next Saga title very soon!Rest assured though, we are always listening, and excited to see what you think of Total War in the next 12 months.
I wonder if they'll do two modes? A more historical one and another that's got all the mythological stuff in it.
EDIT - But damn, no Total War Endless
If they're putting magic and monsters into Tory, I am 150% on board.
The 1v1 hero fights would also lend themselves spectacularly well to Troy.
Also to Warhammer.
Oh man, a dueling system in Warhammer 3 would be awesome. There's a lot of sync animations we hardly ever get to see or would notice that could get highlighted in a proper duel.
In the actual time of the Myceneans war was pretty primitive in that part of the world. Like no hoplites, no formations, no cavalry, just individual guys with melee weapons and some light armor in a mob with some guys with bows and maybe a chariot or two here and there.
A bronze age game focusing on, say, the assyrians would be a totally different matter, but a “realistic” Myceneans vs Assuwa confederation game is basically like the Rise of Rome campaign if you took out the Romans, Greeks, and Celts.
You don't have catapults firing goblins into a horde of undead in the historical games. I like them, but I didn't fall in love with total war until I got to play as all the cool fantasy races.
You would have to use the imperial support mechanism or something similar such that each troop was tied to a specific region and maintaining the troop was tied to maintaining that region in your alliance.
The closest thing you really get is in the ancient to classical era, where people like the gauls vs romans vs successor states vs parthians and horse nomads have vastly different fighting styles and ways of dress.
It seems like from the medeival era on though things get a bit samey.
In regards to having most of their army book represented, Vampire Counts are about as close to done as Lizardmen. I think both are just missing one unit/mount (Troglodon and Coven Throne) and both have a large variety of Legendary Lords, Lords and Heroes. They even got ranged units with the Bloodlines update (though not enough to run a gun line army).
A couple more Legendary Lords and Tomb Kings will be there too.
True, VC and Empire both have good rosters right now, the big thing with both is starting locations. Both only have 3 start locations in ME. Having ghorst and Volkmar move away from home would help a lot, or making Boris and the Red Duke playable, or both.
Norsca is basically the same issue, in a good place with units and mechanics but could use more starts (and maybe a generic lord option or two, fimir cheiftain or aspiring sorceror or the like))
That’ll be a nice different start with some very different strategies.
YESSSSSSSS
Steam: CavilatRest
You could have expansions covering say India and China , slavic mythology, central asia, Persia, Arabic mythology with Djinn and the like... possibilities are endless.
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1099410/Total_War_Saga_TROY/
Also can confirm ports in Warhammer have now been inserted.
I'm too lazy to post from my phone but if you check out Eurogamer the writer (Tom Phillips) on the Troy announcement article said that they got to see a Minotaur in a demo while at Gamescom.
According to Polygon the game will run on a barter economy, and it will require players to "curry the very favour of the Gods themselves". I wonder I need to have random villagers praying at a temple...
Steam: CavilatRest
Lame.
Only thing that worries me is that it's a new team working on it.
Steam: CavilatRest
https://www.totalwar.com/blog/a-total-war-saga-troy-faq/?utm_source=Total+War+Newsletter+GDPR+Consent&utm_campaign=e94f9adb85-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2019_09_18_11_22_COPY_01&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_94e55c10f9-e94f9adb85-70007133
So maybe instead of minotaurs we will get really big guys with bull hat. Maybe instead of harpies we'll get lady warriors that wear feather cloaks. I think they will effectively work like monsters in battles but won't be quite as crazy as a Warhammer monster.
So they're Orks?
Centaurs were pretty obviously steppe nomads and the greeks just didn’t understand how horse riding worked, for what it’s worth.
My dreams of crashing into Troy with a Hydra and squadron of Manticores are crushed, but I can live with that. I'm interested to see what their interpretations of different mythological creatures are. I imagine they'll be devotees of certain gods/secret orders and/or really big wild animals (maybe you'll get a Nemean Lion, aka a tamed version of the lions which according to Homer roamed Greece).
Steam: CavilatRest
There’s evidence of what we would consider pretty exotic animals now in that general area that have gone extinct since. Elk, lions, tigers, wild goat, bison, aurochs(basically a giant wild cow), etc.
I still hope it doesn’t become infantryfest: the infantrying but I am sure they will find a way to make it interesting.