They seem pretty beastly. Gotrek is an unbreakable murderface (as expected), and Felix passively heals any lord or hero within 30m whenever he's engaged in melee combat. I wouldn't be surprised to see them show up a bit in multiplayer battles.
Kind of amusing to have a dwarf hero available in Empire/Bretonnia multiplayer battles, and a human one for Dwarfs (In multiplayer, Gotrek is a hero instead of a lord like he is in campaign).
+1
-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
edited September 2019
I watched a clip where the two of them fought off a Chaos Lord on Chaos Dragon and two regiments of Chaos Warriors.
Gotrek took the Dragon out in about 20-30 seconds, Felix just carved through the Warriors.
Huh Interesting. I saw them leading a Karak Norn army and thought it was an army for them
edit: They just showed up in my hunstmarshal game with no prompting and i don't have the code from white dwarf...
edit: so i did their thing and they didn't show up ok makes sense
Goumindong on
0
-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
edited September 2019
They’re already in the game for everyone, like any DLC. You need the code to be able to recruit them, or confederate with a faction that has them. If you confederate they will still bugger off after a while but you get to control them until then.
Also the guy that did the clip said Gotrek will go toe to toe with Kholek, but will sometimes lose. Only Archaon with his sword will wreck Gotrek.
I mean "in the game" like... The event poped up and i could run the dilemma to recruit them. (i did not recruit them though since i did not have the code
Aaand doing so killled my save. I cannot clear the event and so my save is dead
I decided to try Tehenuin on ME... Damn the vampire coast is tough. I have 2 stacks of skinks with a few support units... I keep blowing through their armies, but they keep popping up new stacks and raising dead up to full strength before I can seige the Awakening, which is their last city. Fortunately the Dark Elves took the southern city in the province so they are helping with untainted and I only have to attack and defend from one direction. Maybe in a few turns when I get corruption down below 50 and attrition goes away I can finally take them out. Their garrison is insane.
I’m not really losing anything I can’t replace, unfortunately they aren’t really losing anything they can’t replace either.
Shit maybe the DEs will just sack the place and save me some trouble.
Oh yeah, the garrison for Awakening is nuts. Absolutely needs a nerf. I've never even bothered trying to fight it because I'd need 2 full stacks anyway and my micro goes out the window with that many units. I just put my stacks there and autoresolve, eating the massive losses I inevitably take.
I’d be fine with just waiting out the 10 turns for the siege but by the time I beat out attrition and trash army #10 and siege the garrison is stronger than my two stacks and sallies.
With where Tehenuin starts there’s really not much better I would be fighting though. Itza is in the way to the south and north is just more humies and vampires.
One of the hunters has a quest to take the Awakening so I moved my two stacks into the Vampire Coast to try and do it and Luther's army and that garrison just obliterated them.
While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
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That_GuyI don't wanna be that guyRegistered Userregular
In my Wulfhart campaign, Luthor was running around for half the game with an army that consisted of 12 fucking terrorgeists and a handful of infantry. I eventually cornered him with 2 full stacks but still walked away from the fight with only a pyrrhic victory.
The thing is you really have to take it, because if you don’t you will not only have him sending out hostile armies but he has a really effective corruption building that will shit up your home provinces.
In my Wulfhart campaign, Luthor was running around for half the game with an army that consisted of 12 fucking terrorgeists and a handful of infantry. I eventually cornered him with 2 full stacks but still walked away from the fight with only a pyrrhic victory.
Mine had multiple bomb throwers. My halberds went in and just evaporated.
While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
Flat out basic skink cohorts are actually really good against bomb throwers apparently, I can run them in and engage before they take more than 1 volley and if they make it to melee they handle the bombers handily. If they don’t make it they run quick so they can just rally and try again rather than taking multiple volleys.
For empire just charging flagellants or free company at them would probably work. As long as they are engaged with something they aren’t throwing bombs, and even the most basic melee will beat them.
Flat out basic skink cohorts are actually really good against bomb throwers apparently, I can run them in and engage before they take more than 1 volley and if they make it to melee they handle the bombers handily. If they don’t make it they run quick so they can just rally and try again rather than taking multiple volleys.
For empire just charging flagellants or free company at them would probably work. As long as they are engaged with something they aren’t throwing bombs, and even the most basic melee will beat them.
But there's a line of zombies in front of the bomb throwers.
While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
Flat out basic skink cohorts are actually really good against bomb throwers apparently, I can run them in and engage before they take more than 1 volley and if they make it to melee they handle the bombers handily. If they don’t make it they run quick so they can just rally and try again rather than taking multiple volleys.
For empire just charging flagellants or free company at them would probably work. As long as they are engaged with something they aren’t throwing bombs, and even the most basic melee will beat them.
But there's a line of zombies in front of the bomb throwers.
Just run around them, or just charge in your pistoliers (anything will beat bombthrowers as long as they are in melee and not trading missile fire).
Vampire pirates are an exception to the “keep skirmishers with ranged weapons out of melee” rule. If you have light skirmishing cavalry or troops in their backfield like free company or pistoliers they are probably going to do a lot better just charging into the enemy handgunners/bombers/handcannons/deck gunners/etc than trading shots with them or shooting into the backs of monsters or zombie hordes.
Zombies with exclusively ranged weapons are enormously shit at melee and will get chopped up by anything with even a basic melee ability.
I upgraded my PC with some additional RAM (now I have 16 GB), so I want to test the improvement by some Warhammering. So far I've played as Malekith, Tyrion and Settra and I have all dlcs, which Lizardmen leader should I pick to have the most fun for my first campaign with them?
I upgraded my PC with some additional RAM (now I have 16 GB), so I want to test the improvement by some Warhammering. So far I've played as Malekith, Tyrion and Settra and I have all dlcs, which Lizardmen leader should I pick to have the most fun for my first campaign with them?
I love the Red Skink guy's starting location, you get to tussle with dark elves, rats, high elves, and undead right off the bat.
"The only way to get rid of a temptation is to give into it." - Oscar Wilde
"We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
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FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
Is there a rule of thumb for when undercity is better than conquering? When I play pirate, I just cove a bunch of stuff (especially stuff far away).
I upgraded my PC with some additional RAM (now I have 16 GB), so I want to test the improvement by some Warhammering. So far I've played as Malekith, Tyrion and Settra and I have all dlcs, which Lizardmen leader should I pick to have the most fun for my first campaign with them?
I love the Red Skink guy's starting location, you get to tussle with dark elves, rats, high elves, and undead right off the bat.
Are we talking ME?
If so, yeah, Tehenuin is fun but hard with unit restrictions and a big threat nearby. If you want an easier time of it Gor-rok is close by but has an easier start.
Mazdamundi is kind of hard too nowdays. He just has a lot of big threats nearby. Lots of opponent variety though.
Tiktaq has a neat flyer focus but you are going to be fighting tomb kings and more tomb kings for a long time.
Kroq-gar is pretty easy and fights some different enemies than Mazdamundi, Tehenuin, and Gor-Rok. The first three are mostly fighting skaven and vampire coast with some humans and elves thrown in, Kroq-gar fights skaven, Vampire counts, tomb kings, and greenskins. So it’s a change of pace.
Nakai is for if you really love the beastmen and chaos play styles but want lizardmen units...
No garrison is ever that difficult as Empire. Break their walls with a hero. Knock down their towers with some artillery. Shoot them with crossbowmen.
Or, if youre wulfhart, huntsmen. A lost a few hundred troops to their mortar and otherwise nothing much else and i didnt even have terribly good seige. Harkon was off somewhere else but he probably would not have made a huge difference
I finished a short campaign in ToB. It’s a lot of fun with some good idea but it also feels very... fiddly. The interface is pretty far behind what I would expect from them these days.
I finished a short campaign in ToB. It’s a lot of fun with some good idea but it also feels very... fiddly. The interface is pretty far behind what I would expect from them these days.
TOB seems to me like one of the trial runs for their ideas in Three Kingdoms
I would definitely say that everything Throne Of Britannia does right, Three Kingdoms does better.
Except sieges imho. Brittania settlements were awesome.
3K draws inspiration from Brittania settlements, but unlike villages and cities in britain chinese settlements were generally not built for their defensive value.
"The western world sips from a poisonous cocktail: Polarisation, populism, protectionism and post-truth"
-Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
In my Wulfhart campaign, Luthor was running around for half the game with an army that consisted of 12 fucking terrorgeists and a handful of infantry. I eventually cornered him with 2 full stacks but still walked away from the fight with only a pyrrhic victory.
Wulfhart is really really good at taking down those hilarious monster doomstacks if you have hunstmen. I don't like huntsmen in general against a regular army but if the enemy is stacked with monsters Wulfhart should wipe it like nothing.
Wulfharts main ability is slight of hand. Which gives huntsmen "double shot ammo"... which is to say it doubles their DPS. Top rank Huntsman with all the skills should have a pre-battle listed DP 10 of 90. Which makes 106 v large. For a 90 sized troop this is 9540 DP 10 vs monsters. 12 Terrorgeists might not even reach your line if you have a good number of huntsmen. Those that do are going to be dead soon afterwards.
The other tactic is massed Empire Captains/Witch Hunters. Stick one witch hunter next to a captain and have them follow each other around. When you find a big ass army block it and assault it
Holy hell these incursion battles with Wulfhart are no fucking joke. The entire enemy army is unbreakable, including Nakai's. I was down to tattered remains of my army and 3 lords. God they're fucking hard. It might be more worth it to auto resolve more of these battles.
One thing that really helped me was Flagellants if you have them. Especially with the 50% missile resistance from the warrior priest lord buff. The 50% missile resistance for Flagellants means that you don't feel bad shooting around them with Handgunners. They don't have any armor anyway and have effective 50% shields. Plus they're unbreakable.
In my Wulfhart campaign, Luthor was running around for half the game with an army that consisted of 12 fucking terrorgeists and a handful of infantry. I eventually cornered him with 2 full stacks but still walked away from the fight with only a pyrrhic victory.
Finally killed him... Now just have to see if I can wrap up Teclis and Skrolk before Wulfhart finishes off Cylostra and comes for me. (Has anyone noticed he seems to really hate her as AI more than the lizardmen he is supposed to be fighting? Not complaining though)
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KadokenGiving Ends to my Friends and it Feels StupendousRegistered Userregular
I kind of fell in love with Warhammer 2 again? The new update and units from the DLC really rounded out the Empire for me and the Empire's versatile unit selection you switch up per type of threat finally clicked for me. It was really cool to lose a two-stack vs two-stack battle by just an inch and then coming back with an army built against the type of army the vampires made rather than just trying to go for generally bigger and better units. Also, the archers and hunstmen are rad as fuck.
Finally figured out heroes as well and how to really get the most out of their abilities.
The Golden Order campaign has been going at a really fun pace. Empires are raising at a really good rate where I am allied with a giant dwarf Emprie but they're also fighting a forever war against united Greenskins in the badlands. The vampires were just the right size between overwhelming and me steamrolling them. There's now a clear new threat with a Skaven Empire around the size of mine that has taken over Estalia, Tilea, the Border Princes lands. I never got to face them as an ongoing campaign threat so it's really cool to be able to war of them for real rather than a one-off steamroll. The Empire decisions have been great. I don't know if it was always the case, but I like how the pirate factions now prevent you from just raising a general and gaining like 2000-10,000 gold per turn from the shipwrecks and feel like a natural threat where if you want to go oceanside you have to prepare for them.
The pirate factions are definitely more aggressive, I was going to do an amphibious invasion against Lorkhir only to get cut off by the orc pirate guy. Pretty cool, better than them just hanging around being useless.
I’m pretty excited for whatever the Christmas pack is and the greenskin update next year, it feels like they have really fine tuned a lot of things and made things work a lot better with the last 2 patches.
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BethrynUnhappiness is MandatoryRegistered Userregular
Gor-Rok is by far and away the easiest campaign in the game. Starts with Kroak, gets two provinces that are easy to take and control with gold mines, Itza has an insane garrison to begin with anyway, Oxyl gets a great garrison once upgraded, and the Short Victory is very short indeed.
Gonna have a fun ending in mine though, Skeggi took Hexoatl and I barely managed to save Mazdamundi through confedding. I look forward to digging the Ancient Enemy out of the Temple City.
Just thinking, I think you can really say most factions are in a good place now.
You basically have:
Excellent(only mild bugfixes or tweaks needed): Lizardmen
Good: (solid mechanics, possibly with some room for improvement, could use minor unit additions or additional starts):Empire, vampire counts, skaven, dwarfs, tomb kings, norsca, dark elves, high elves, vampire coast, Brettonia
Planned lord packs will probably get most or all of the core game 2 factions up to excellent and greenskins up to at least good. Empire and vampires are really pretty much excellent aside from that they could use an additional start.
I hope they can at least do a mechanics pass on wood elves and beastmen at some point before game 3 even if it doesn’t include units or lords, and chaos would be nice too.
Exactly what kind of overhaul do Vampire Coast need? I can agree that Greenskins, woodelves, beastmen and chaos need an overhaul.
However I'm like 90% sure that beastmen and chaos will only get an overhaul when WH3 is introduced....because WH3 is almost guaranteed to be chaos focused.
"The western world sips from a poisonous cocktail: Polarisation, populism, protectionism and post-truth"
-Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
Exactly what kind of overhaul do Vampire Coast need? I can agree that Greenskins, woodelves, beastmen and chaos need an overhaul.
However I'm like 90% sure that beastmen and chaos will only get an overhaul when WH3 is introduced....because WH3 is almost guaranteed to be chaos focused.
I didn’t really mean for those to be in order, but specifically Vamp Coast could use a bit of a look at the pirate ships to make them a bit more sea focused and a bit less of a generic all purpose horde.
What are people's preferred difficulties? I usually end up on Very Hard campaign difficulty (normal battle difficulty) because achievements and also I enjoy winning, but what do you all prefer?
What are people's preferred difficulties? I usually end up on Very Hard campaign difficulty (normal battle difficulty) because achievements and also I enjoy winning, but what do you all prefer?
Very hard for both. On a campaign level it strikes a good balance between difficulty and "Everyone hates me". Battles are probably still too easy if they were isolated events, but given the economical power stacked against me...
"The western world sips from a poisonous cocktail: Polarisation, populism, protectionism and post-truth"
-Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
What are people's preferred difficulties? I usually end up on Very Hard campaign difficulty (normal battle difficulty) because achievements and also I enjoy winning, but what do you all prefer?
Very hard/normal. Harder battles give enemies buffs that make it inefficient to run anything but tanky front lines and high amount of ranged damage*
Though i also play with all the red skills disabled(minus the last hunstman campaign since i wanted to witness the full glory of hunstmen) so that also makes things a bit more fair with regards to army strengths
*battle difficulty increases give enemy units pretty significant flat bonuses to attack(10% hard, 15% very hard) and defense(15% Hard, 12% Very Hard) such that your units will lose a straight counter match and will also lose matchups on the charge against units where you have charge advantages. So as an example the effect of VH is that if you're fighting units with 40 MA/MD (not too uncommon lategame) then your units will hit 32% of the time and get hit 46% of the time for 15% extra damage. Which translates to your units taking 65% more DPS than enemy melee does.
What this means is that you cannot ever really hope to win a fight with melee units. Your melee units will just lose. So you have to have a large amount of ranged units and all your melee has to be focused onto not dying. This is a strong composition as it is but its not nearly as much fun as playing with regular armies. I cannot imagine playing melee only armies on harder battle difficulties. You would have to have way more power than your enemy to make it work.
Downside is that it makes leadership too easy to manage.
Posts
They seem pretty beastly. Gotrek is an unbreakable murderface (as expected), and Felix passively heals any lord or hero within 30m whenever he's engaged in melee combat. I wouldn't be surprised to see them show up a bit in multiplayer battles.
Kind of amusing to have a dwarf hero available in Empire/Bretonnia multiplayer battles, and a human one for Dwarfs (In multiplayer, Gotrek is a hero instead of a lord like he is in campaign).
Gotrek took the Dragon out in about 20-30 seconds, Felix just carved through the Warriors.
edit: They just showed up in my hunstmarshal game with no prompting and i don't have the code from white dwarf...
edit: so i did their thing and they didn't show up ok makes sense
Also the guy that did the clip said Gotrek will go toe to toe with Kholek, but will sometimes lose. Only Archaon with his sword will wreck Gotrek.
Aaand doing so killled my save. I cannot clear the event and so my save is dead
Does help that the AI has gone crazy in attacking the Blue Vipers who were a huge thorn in my side last time.
Also helps that ports are giving more money now too.
I’m not really losing anything I can’t replace, unfortunately they aren’t really losing anything they can’t replace either.
Shit maybe the DEs will just sack the place and save me some trouble.
With where Tehenuin starts there’s really not much better I would be fighting though. Itza is in the way to the south and north is just more humies and vampires.
Mine had multiple bomb throwers. My halberds went in and just evaporated.
For empire just charging flagellants or free company at them would probably work. As long as they are engaged with something they aren’t throwing bombs, and even the most basic melee will beat them.
But there's a line of zombies in front of the bomb throwers.
Just run around them, or just charge in your pistoliers (anything will beat bombthrowers as long as they are in melee and not trading missile fire).
Vampire pirates are an exception to the “keep skirmishers with ranged weapons out of melee” rule. If you have light skirmishing cavalry or troops in their backfield like free company or pistoliers they are probably going to do a lot better just charging into the enemy handgunners/bombers/handcannons/deck gunners/etc than trading shots with them or shooting into the backs of monsters or zombie hordes.
Zombies with exclusively ranged weapons are enormously shit at melee and will get chopped up by anything with even a basic melee ability.
I love the Red Skink guy's starting location, you get to tussle with dark elves, rats, high elves, and undead right off the bat.
"We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
Are we talking ME?
If so, yeah, Tehenuin is fun but hard with unit restrictions and a big threat nearby. If you want an easier time of it Gor-rok is close by but has an easier start.
Mazdamundi is kind of hard too nowdays. He just has a lot of big threats nearby. Lots of opponent variety though.
Tiktaq has a neat flyer focus but you are going to be fighting tomb kings and more tomb kings for a long time.
Kroq-gar is pretty easy and fights some different enemies than Mazdamundi, Tehenuin, and Gor-Rok. The first three are mostly fighting skaven and vampire coast with some humans and elves thrown in, Kroq-gar fights skaven, Vampire counts, tomb kings, and greenskins. So it’s a change of pace.
Nakai is for if you really love the beastmen and chaos play styles but want lizardmen units...
Or, if youre wulfhart, huntsmen. A lost a few hundred troops to their mortar and otherwise nothing much else and i didnt even have terribly good seige. Harkon was off somewhere else but he probably would not have made a huge difference
TOB seems to me like one of the trial runs for their ideas in Three Kingdoms
Except sieges imho. Brittania settlements were awesome.
3K draws inspiration from Brittania settlements, but unlike villages and cities in britain chinese settlements were generally not built for their defensive value.
-Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
Wulfhart is really really good at taking down those hilarious monster doomstacks if you have hunstmen. I don't like huntsmen in general against a regular army but if the enemy is stacked with monsters Wulfhart should wipe it like nothing.
Wulfharts main ability is slight of hand. Which gives huntsmen "double shot ammo"... which is to say it doubles their DPS. Top rank Huntsman with all the skills should have a pre-battle listed DP 10 of 90. Which makes 106 v large. For a 90 sized troop this is 9540 DP 10 vs monsters. 12 Terrorgeists might not even reach your line if you have a good number of huntsmen. Those that do are going to be dead soon afterwards.
The other tactic is massed Empire Captains/Witch Hunters. Stick one witch hunter next to a captain and have them follow each other around. When you find a big ass army block it and assault it
One thing that really helped me was Flagellants if you have them. Especially with the 50% missile resistance from the warrior priest lord buff. The 50% missile resistance for Flagellants means that you don't feel bad shooting around them with Handgunners. They don't have any armor anyway and have effective 50% shields. Plus they're unbreakable.
https://i.imgur.com/pHbExlO.png
...Yeah
That Luthor sure is a kidder!
Finally figured out heroes as well and how to really get the most out of their abilities.
The Golden Order campaign has been going at a really fun pace. Empires are raising at a really good rate where I am allied with a giant dwarf Emprie but they're also fighting a forever war against united Greenskins in the badlands. The vampires were just the right size between overwhelming and me steamrolling them. There's now a clear new threat with a Skaven Empire around the size of mine that has taken over Estalia, Tilea, the Border Princes lands. I never got to face them as an ongoing campaign threat so it's really cool to be able to war of them for real rather than a one-off steamroll. The Empire decisions have been great. I don't know if it was always the case, but I like how the pirate factions now prevent you from just raising a general and gaining like 2000-10,000 gold per turn from the shipwrecks and feel like a natural threat where if you want to go oceanside you have to prepare for them.
I’m pretty excited for whatever the Christmas pack is and the greenskin update next year, it feels like they have really fine tuned a lot of things and made things work a lot better with the last 2 patches.
Gonna have a fun ending in mine though, Skeggi took Hexoatl and I barely managed to save Mazdamundi through confedding. I look forward to digging the Ancient Enemy out of the Temple City.
You basically have:
Excellent(only mild bugfixes or tweaks needed): Lizardmen
Good: (solid mechanics, possibly with some room for improvement, could use minor unit additions or additional starts):Empire, vampire counts, skaven, dwarfs, tomb kings, norsca, dark elves, high elves, vampire coast, Brettonia
Fair(need significant mechanical overhaul, unit additions, start location diversification, etc): Greenskins, wood elfs, beastmen, chaos
Planned lord packs will probably get most or all of the core game 2 factions up to excellent and greenskins up to at least good. Empire and vampires are really pretty much excellent aside from that they could use an additional start.
I hope they can at least do a mechanics pass on wood elves and beastmen at some point before game 3 even if it doesn’t include units or lords, and chaos would be nice too.
However I'm like 90% sure that beastmen and chaos will only get an overhaul when WH3 is introduced....because WH3 is almost guaranteed to be chaos focused.
-Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
I didn’t really mean for those to be in order, but specifically Vamp Coast could use a bit of a look at the pirate ships to make them a bit more sea focused and a bit less of a generic all purpose horde.
Very hard for both. On a campaign level it strikes a good balance between difficulty and "Everyone hates me". Battles are probably still too easy if they were isolated events, but given the economical power stacked against me...
-Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
Very hard/normal. Harder battles give enemies buffs that make it inefficient to run anything but tanky front lines and high amount of ranged damage*
Though i also play with all the red skills disabled(minus the last hunstman campaign since i wanted to witness the full glory of hunstmen) so that also makes things a bit more fair with regards to army strengths
*battle difficulty increases give enemy units pretty significant flat bonuses to attack(10% hard, 15% very hard) and defense(15% Hard, 12% Very Hard) such that your units will lose a straight counter match and will also lose matchups on the charge against units where you have charge advantages. So as an example the effect of VH is that if you're fighting units with 40 MA/MD (not too uncommon lategame) then your units will hit 32% of the time and get hit 46% of the time for 15% extra damage. Which translates to your units taking 65% more DPS than enemy melee does.
What this means is that you cannot ever really hope to win a fight with melee units. Your melee units will just lose. So you have to have a large amount of ranged units and all your melee has to be focused onto not dying. This is a strong composition as it is but its not nearly as much fun as playing with regular armies. I cannot imagine playing melee only armies on harder battle difficulties. You would have to have way more power than your enemy to make it work.
Downside is that it makes leadership too easy to manage.