Tricky to get a power card and a skill card with 3 attacks on your first turn, though, and play 5 cards, and have that one skill give you enough block to not eat a bunch of damage.
It's a nice combo, two great tastes that taste great together, but it seems like it should be as good as Fasting or hilarious and it really isn't either one.
Mm, it's not like it's an "always broken" affair, but I feel like you're underselling Watcher's access to weird recursion and easy draw. Like, a way to enter calm, Empty Mind and Flurry of Blows is +/-1 energy, 3 attacks and possibly break-even on cards. Those are all commons and there are numerous similar cards. In any sort of stance-dancing deck I can easily find myself playing 10-ish attacks a turn, which doesn't become hard to add on a skill and power if the former wasn't already involved. It's not like you need to gain more than 5-10 dexterity in most fights.
Like, the trickiest part of any of that working out is getting Duality and Orange Pellets in the same run. <_<
That said, Panacea definitely becomes a more interesting card if you find Duality.
Tricky to get a power card and a skill card with 3 attacks on your first turn, though, and play 5 cards, and have that one skill give you enough block to not eat a bunch of damage.
It's a nice combo, two great tastes that taste great together, but it seems like it should be as good as Fasting or hilarious and it really isn't either one.
Mm, it's not like it's an "always broken" affair, but I feel like you're underselling Watcher's access to weird recursion and easy draw. Like, a way to enter calm, Empty Mind and Flurry of Blows is +/-1 energy, 3 attacks and possibly break-even on cards. Those are all commons and there are numerous similar cards. In any sort of stance-dancing deck I can easily find myself playing 10-ish attacks a turn, which doesn't become hard to add on a skill and power if the former wasn't already involved. It's not like you need to gain more than 5-10 dexterity in most fights.
Like, the trickiest part of any of that working out is getting Duality and Orange Pellets in the same run. <_<
That said, Panacea definitely becomes a more interesting card if you find Duality.
Oh for sure, I would never pass either of them voluntarily. They're great on her, and together they're better than the sum of their parts. I just think they seem like they'll be even better than they are.
---
Yesterday I had 3 A20 heartkills in 4 games!
This one was my first ever wreath of flame deck! Shuriken was sadly trash, but the Singing Bowl I picked up before the first boss did great work. I had 97 max hp at the end. I took coffee dripper without a way to heal and just hoped I could path cautiously and use singing bowl. I caught a skill egg from a floor 3 event and on floor 21 the deck came together. From one shop: membership card, attack egg, wreath of flame +, ragnarok+. I already had a blasphemy+ from the first act. Turned down the vampires event even though I had singing bowl, because I'd already removed most of my strikes. Voluntarily went into the champ with 21 HP because I wanted to remove Shame and I thought I could burst him down. Took 2 damage before he died. Act 3 was mostly a walk. Lots of upgraded protect went a long way in a collar deck. I trashed the act 3 bosses, Mirrored Ragnarok, and took down S&S first turn with blasphemy. Took ~ 40 damage on the heart in 8 turns.
This one was starting snecko and bottled omniscience. Got a conjure blade before the first elite, an omni after, and a spirit shield from a hallway fight. Wish from the first boss. Again bought an egg in act 2, this time skill. Bottled the omni after the book and then got an alpha+ from a hallway fight. At that point every fight I had the option to alpha->omni-beta on turn 1, often for 2 energy or less. Corrupt heart did 85 damage to me, but with toy ornithopter and bird urn, I only took 64.
This one was the most fun of them all! A Watcher deck built around and relying entirely on Strange Spoon! My damage was almost entirely Expunger and Ritual Dagger. I thought I was doomed going into act 4 because it's practically a meme deck. In act 1 I went down to 1 hit point vs lagavulin! My deck didn't come together... ever? I just took good things and made standard choices (always upgrade apparition no matter how good your other upgrades are!) and I think I only won because I hit RNG luckily with the spoon.
AkimboEGMr. FancypantsWears very fine pants indeedRegistered Userregular
Reached A18 with Watcher and I now remember why that's where I stopped with the other characters. Game just goes absolutely brutal at that point.
Give me a kiss to build a dream on; And my imagination will thrive upon that kiss; Sweetheart, I ask no more than this; A kiss to build a dream on
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ArcticLancerBest served chilled.Registered Userregular
It's nice being set up for a good run. What if I basically only fought elites and grabbed relics? The only thing I was missing was a black star. :P
Disappointingly, I killed Hexaghost on turn 1 on the Act 3 event, but it didn't award the first turn kill achievement (the only one I'm missing ...). I also used most of my potions to do it, but thankfully didn't throw away the run in the process. Still a low enough Ascension for such things.
I this my a16 win used alpha to good effect. But I also removed it in act 3 at some event cause it seemed unnecessary after carrying me through the early acts
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Powerpuppiesdrinking coffee in themountain cabinRegistered Userregular
Hey it's legit, look at my run above. It's only trash without support!
Also they're not stupid decks, they're meme decks. You voluntarily took an empty cage! And won!
ArcticLancerBest served chilled.Registered Userregular
Sneko made it more reliable for block while setting up, because on bad draws it was significantly better than playing a defend.
Honestly, I take Empty Cage with some regularity, though in this case my other options were Sacred Bark (potions alone weren't making this deck tick, especially without belt or elephant on the side) and Cursed Bell. And if I have to choose between making my shit marginally more reliable or adding a dead card and several relics that probably won't save me ... :P
Disagree, with Snecko 3x wish is pretty freaking powerful. Lots of flexability in boss fights, and lots of gold outside of them to buy your way into power.
also, tbh Arctic that looks more like "Snecko is great for watcher + other stuff" than Alpha, but you do you =P
ArcticLancerBest served chilled.Registered Userregular
I just didn't find good cards early for it. The vast majority of my early card options were 0-1 cost, and few of them justifiable, whereas Alpha was the first rare I saw and presented an avenue to pursue. IIRC Lesson Learned was from my first boss fight, and I kind of only took it because it might pan out long-run and was a 2-cost attack, but that really wasn't the case. I didn't get that Ragnarok until the middle of Act 3 (Diva Form was act 2 boss, I believe), so I spent a long time with a lot of bad options, I felt.
Honestly, if you wanted to have a laugh you could play the seed and see how it goes for you? I'd certainly be curious.
Got a fun kunai/pyramid deck going on Silent, maybe this one will also topple the heart? Damage is pretty slow on it though, and only three energy + art of war/adrenaline. Guess we'll see :rotate:
Got a fun kunai/pyramid deck going on Silent, maybe this one will also topple the heart? Damage is pretty slow on it though, and only three energy + art of war/adrenaline. Guess we'll see :rotate:
Thorns pot is usually enough to push a deck that's slow on damage over the edge vs the heart. Or bronze scales. Or both! 45 damage minimum per multiattack stacks up fast.
Got a fun kunai/pyramid deck going on Silent, maybe this one will also topple the heart? Damage is pretty slow on it though, and only three energy + art of war/adrenaline. Guess we'll see :rotate:
Thorns pot is usually enough to push a deck that's slow on damage over the edge vs the heart. Or bronze scales. Or both! 45 damage minimum per multiattack stacks up fast.
Yeah, I do have fumes and a caltrops, but I'm worried about output on Donu/Deca and whatever the second boss will be. I do have a flex pot/clockwork at the moment... but I'd rather save that for the heart if I can. Just bad paths with few campfires for upgrades in Act 2 and 3 so far.
wow, that's a ballsy relic trade to start with. i'm not big on relic swaps for defect, cracked core is really good in A1 for the dualcast front loaded damage
I'm not sure how this could have been any more rude... about 10 minutes in I was untouchable. (all A3's down finally!)
Yeah, no kidding. Urn, Mummified Hand and Ice Cream on Defect is pretty guaranteed unless something goes very awry. Glad to see you got that Creative AI just to ensure your domination of the spire. :P
Yeah, they added a small set in the update to tag on to Anchor. Horn Cleat as mentioned, and Captain's Wheel which gives you 18 block on turn 3. It's a cute idea that's actually effective to boot~
@Noggin - a tip for future runs. If you get Mummified hand on Defect, it's often worth grabbing a Heatsinks (ideally, +) asap, and gambling on seeing Creative AI (pretty doable). This creates an exceptionally powerful draw and energy engine. Which get sillier the moment you get an Echo Form into play, as you can echo the power you draw, draw 4 cards, and get 2 cards for free..
etc.
i've perfected awoken one who got like +50 str with this approach. You know, as you do.
ArcticLancerBest served chilled.Registered Userregular
Sorry, this deck was far less janky. Play out 1 or 2 Deva Forms, play a ton of cards every turn several turns later. Wish I could have gotten a second Ragnarok, but it wasn't in the cards.
(Awoken One awoke to a 68x6 damage Raganok. I screwed up the screenshot. Sorry. :P )
Silent A20 + heart down with a very stupid pyramid/pandoras + burst, catalyst, nightmare and wraith form broken ass deck. who needs energy or block when you're a spooky ghost?
Almost beat the heart with Defect on A20 too, but lost too much HP to the elites unfortunately and just drew really poorly. Soon though.
Powerpuppiesdrinking coffee in themountain cabinRegistered Userregular
Shield and spear are rough sometimes. You have to do a lot in the first two turns to avoid taking huge damage
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ArcticLancerBest served chilled.Registered Userregular
After a couple of annoying losses, I got this "Pretty much literally cannot lose" deck going. That was pleasant~
I got Lesson Learned on floor 4 and probably got it to trigger every fight for the rest of the climb. Hilariously, it first targeted itself, so that made things slightly easier. Membership card in the first shop too. The only thing I never found was Orange Pellets, but with Kunai in this deck it didn't matter at all. I honestly forgot I even had philosopher's stone, for how often I could generate 60+ block a turn. Perfected Time Eater, so not even the combo-hating slug could slow me down (in his less-mean version anyway). Probably should have gone after the heart, but the deck didn't really come into its own until act 3 so I had no confidence, and by then it was too late. Alas, alack and all that. ;P
Hurgh, keep getting to the heart but get zero focus on Defect. I even had pellets this time! The only Biased Cog I saw was one from Enchiridion, once. Damn it.
edit: to be clear, I had to burn way too much energy in blocking (even with calipers) and not enough attacking. Even with three reloads, my best line only got the heart to below 150 HP before the 120 dmg multi attack.
On the one hand, I'm pretty happy we're finally getting caught up on the Switch in terms of content, but on the other I kind of irrationally feel like I wanted that Defect A20 heart kill without all the overall buffs to potions and boss relics that are in the Watcher patch, y'know? Hrmm.
The watcher is fun but very hard to play. "ok, so THIS card deals a billion damage but kills you the next turn, THIS card blocks for a trillion, but only on a Wednesday if your name ends with "h", otherwise it draws a card (which gives you block in case you had coffee instead of tea)".
+3
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Powerpuppiesdrinking coffee in themountain cabinRegistered Userregular
The watcher is fun but very hard to play. "ok, so THIS card deals a billion damage but kills you the next turn, THIS card blocks for a trillion, but only on a Wednesday if your name ends with "h", otherwise it draws a card (which gives you block in case you had coffee instead of tea)".
No way she's so easy!
1. Always take Talk To The Hand, Protect, and Vault.
2. Always trade in starting relic. Hunt elites in act 1. Never don't take snecko eye.
3. Meme hard if you can. 5 Omni, 5 Like Water... I beat the heart on A20 today with a deck that had 5 Paths to Victory!
(Disclaimer: this is lies, she's fun but hard, with multiple incompatible archetypes of a successful deck)
She's complex-ish, but i find once you get the hang of her she's easier than the other classes to wrack up wins on, at least at a20. Thoguh the heart is a real beast of a fight for her.
The main trick to udnerstand is she kills hallway fightas like nothing else does. Wrath form is bahroken. Divinity form is worse. "I am dead next turn" does not matter if your oppents are all dead, and there's lots of ways to sculpt things so she goes off and rips stuff to shreds.
My rules of thumb: 90% of the time, i trade boss relic. Snecko and Runic Pyramid are so stupid good on her, and both give you good ideas of what you can abuse. (All her amazing 2+ with snecko, esp swivel. Establishement/snecko is a real thing. Lots of great 0 costs to go with Pyramid, lots of ways to create card draw to get those back.)
From there, i try and figure out whether i'm a: A wrath deck (I win by getting into wrath and bursting, i need a plan to get out of wrath vs bosses), b: a divinity deck (How do i get into divinty as often as possible + how do i make sure i have things to do while i'm divine), oir a Calm deck (Get in calm, stay in calm, tank it up via Like Water. Almost never do this, it just doesn't come togther)
Figuring out how you defend is also important on her - You're often looking at either Fasting based approach (Ridc dex), or Talk to the Hand (When every hit getsyou ten block...). Or just big efficent cards combo with some of her powers like Mental Fortress or Like Water
Figuring out a way to break energy for her is also important - Establishment, 0 costs, or Deva Form are the main ways to do this.
Posts
Like, the trickiest part of any of that working out is getting Duality and Orange Pellets in the same run. <_<
That said, Panacea definitely becomes a more interesting card if you find Duality.
Perhaps I can interest you in my meager selection of pins?
Oh for sure, I would never pass either of them voluntarily. They're great on her, and together they're better than the sum of their parts. I just think they seem like they'll be even better than they are.
---
Yesterday I had 3 A20 heartkills in 4 games!
This one was my first ever wreath of flame deck! Shuriken was sadly trash, but the Singing Bowl I picked up before the first boss did great work. I had 97 max hp at the end. I took coffee dripper without a way to heal and just hoped I could path cautiously and use singing bowl. I caught a skill egg from a floor 3 event and on floor 21 the deck came together. From one shop: membership card, attack egg, wreath of flame +, ragnarok+. I already had a blasphemy+ from the first act. Turned down the vampires event even though I had singing bowl, because I'd already removed most of my strikes. Voluntarily went into the champ with 21 HP because I wanted to remove Shame and I thought I could burst him down. Took 2 damage before he died. Act 3 was mostly a walk. Lots of upgraded protect went a long way in a collar deck. I trashed the act 3 bosses, Mirrored Ragnarok, and took down S&S first turn with blasphemy. Took ~ 40 damage on the heart in 8 turns.
This one was starting snecko and bottled omniscience. Got a conjure blade before the first elite, an omni after, and a spirit shield from a hallway fight. Wish from the first boss. Again bought an egg in act 2, this time skill. Bottled the omni after the book and then got an alpha+ from a hallway fight. At that point every fight I had the option to alpha->omni-beta on turn 1, often for 2 energy or less. Corrupt heart did 85 damage to me, but with toy ornithopter and bird urn, I only took 64.
This one was the most fun of them all! A Watcher deck built around and relying entirely on Strange Spoon! My damage was almost entirely Expunger and Ritual Dagger. I thought I was doomed going into act 4 because it's practically a meme deck. In act 1 I went down to 1 hit point vs lagavulin! My deck didn't come together... ever? I just took good things and made standard choices (always upgrade apparition no matter how good your other upgrades are!) and I think I only won because I hit RNG luckily with the spoon.
Time for a short break before digging in to the watcher when she drops.
Disappointingly, I killed Hexaghost on turn 1 on the Act 3 event, but it didn't award the first turn kill achievement (the only one I'm missing ...). I also used most of my potions to do it, but thankfully didn't throw away the run in the process. Still a low enough Ascension for such things.
Perhaps I can interest you in my meager selection of pins?
Easiest way would be a double Omni deck with some starting strength and then do the good ol' worship Ragnarok combo
Steam: https://steamcommunity.com/id/TheZombiePenguin
Stream: https://www.twitch.tv/thezombiepenguin/
Switch: 0293 6817 9891
Perhaps I can interest you in my meager selection of pins?
Finally did it, beat A20 with the Heart. Ironlad corrupted and jaxxed his way to the top.
Perhaps I can interest you in my meager selection of pins?
Also they're not stupid decks, they're meme decks. You voluntarily took an empty cage! And won!
Honestly, I take Empty Cage with some regularity, though in this case my other options were Sacred Bark (potions alone weren't making this deck tick, especially without belt or elephant on the side) and Cursed Bell. And if I have to choose between making my shit marginally more reliable or adding a dead card and several relics that probably won't save me ... :P
Perhaps I can interest you in my meager selection of pins?
Disagree, with Snecko 3x wish is pretty freaking powerful. Lots of flexability in boss fights, and lots of gold outside of them to buy your way into power.
also, tbh Arctic that looks more like "Snecko is great for watcher + other stuff" than Alpha, but you do you =P
Steam: https://steamcommunity.com/id/TheZombiePenguin
Stream: https://www.twitch.tv/thezombiepenguin/
Switch: 0293 6817 9891
Honestly, if you wanted to have a laugh you could play the seed and see how it goes for you? I'd certainly be curious.
Perhaps I can interest you in my meager selection of pins?
Thorns pot is usually enough to push a deck that's slow on damage over the edge vs the heart. Or bronze scales. Or both! 45 damage minimum per multiattack stacks up fast.
Steam: https://steamcommunity.com/id/TheZombiePenguin
Stream: https://www.twitch.tv/thezombiepenguin/
Switch: 0293 6817 9891
Yeah, I do have fumes and a caltrops, but I'm worried about output on Donu/Deca and whatever the second boss will be. I do have a flex pot/clockwork at the moment... but I'd rather save that for the heart if I can. Just bad paths with few campfires for upgrades in Act 2 and 3 so far.
What is the relic after Empty Cage? That one doesn't exist on Switch (yet).
Yeah, they added a small set in the update to tag on to Anchor. Horn Cleat as mentioned, and Captain's Wheel which gives you 18 block on turn 3. It's a cute idea that's actually effective to boot~
Perhaps I can interest you in my meager selection of pins?
etc.
i've perfected awoken one who got like +50 str with this approach. You know, as you do.
Steam: https://steamcommunity.com/id/TheZombiePenguin
Stream: https://www.twitch.tv/thezombiepenguin/
Switch: 0293 6817 9891
(Awoken One awoke to a 68x6 damage Raganok. I screwed up the screenshot. Sorry. :P )
Perhaps I can interest you in my meager selection of pins?
Almost beat the heart with Defect on A20 too, but lost too much HP to the elites unfortunately and just drew really poorly. Soon though.
I got Lesson Learned on floor 4 and probably got it to trigger every fight for the rest of the climb. Hilariously, it first targeted itself, so that made things slightly easier. Membership card in the first shop too. The only thing I never found was Orange Pellets, but with Kunai in this deck it didn't matter at all. I honestly forgot I even had philosopher's stone, for how often I could generate 60+ block a turn. Perfected Time Eater, so not even the combo-hating slug could slow me down (in his less-mean version anyway). Probably should have gone after the heart, but the deck didn't really come into its own until act 3 so I had no confidence, and by then it was too late. Alas, alack and all that. ;P
Perhaps I can interest you in my meager selection of pins?
edit: to be clear, I had to burn way too much energy in blocking (even with calipers) and not enough attacking. Even with three reloads, my best line only got the heart to below 150 HP before the 120 dmg multi attack.
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
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Timing on that could have been better. Many of us are on a deserted developing island!
Games where I win I tend to take more damage from those two than the Heart itself.
No way she's so easy!
1. Always take Talk To The Hand, Protect, and Vault.
2. Always trade in starting relic. Hunt elites in act 1. Never don't take snecko eye.
3. Meme hard if you can. 5 Omni, 5 Like Water... I beat the heart on A20 today with a deck that had 5 Paths to Victory!
(Disclaimer: this is lies, she's fun but hard, with multiple incompatible archetypes of a successful deck)
The main trick to udnerstand is she kills hallway fightas like nothing else does. Wrath form is bahroken. Divinity form is worse. "I am dead next turn" does not matter if your oppents are all dead, and there's lots of ways to sculpt things so she goes off and rips stuff to shreds.
My rules of thumb: 90% of the time, i trade boss relic. Snecko and Runic Pyramid are so stupid good on her, and both give you good ideas of what you can abuse. (All her amazing 2+ with snecko, esp swivel. Establishement/snecko is a real thing. Lots of great 0 costs to go with Pyramid, lots of ways to create card draw to get those back.)
From there, i try and figure out whether i'm a: A wrath deck (I win by getting into wrath and bursting, i need a plan to get out of wrath vs bosses), b: a divinity deck (How do i get into divinty as often as possible + how do i make sure i have things to do while i'm divine), oir a Calm deck (Get in calm, stay in calm, tank it up via Like Water. Almost never do this, it just doesn't come togther)
Figuring out how you defend is also important on her - You're often looking at either Fasting based approach (Ridc dex), or Talk to the Hand (When every hit getsyou ten block...). Or just big efficent cards combo with some of her powers like Mental Fortress or Like Water
Figuring out a way to break energy for her is also important - Establishment, 0 costs, or Deva Form are the main ways to do this.
Steam: https://steamcommunity.com/id/TheZombiePenguin
Stream: https://www.twitch.tv/thezombiepenguin/
Switch: 0293 6817 9891