I was sure having a second child would kill me, and destroy my marriage to my wife. Probably because she would actually strangle me to death after some kind of breastfeeding induced frustration. I said 100% no, she was 100% yes. But, she was very determined to have kid #2 and its been a good decision from the moment he arrived. Kids are good friends, and I'm very happy I was over ruled.
So, pretty much who knows. Nothing you feel now about having #2 is much use at all. It's a roll of the dice.
"That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
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MichaelLCIn what furnace was thy brain?ChicagoRegistered Userregular
Having a second infant would destroy my mental health, my physical health, and almost certainly our marriage.
It didn't destroy our marriage, but having our second pretty much did all the other things for my wife. There was the added stress of my son (sorry to repeat it, but he's diagnosed with ASD and ADHD now, but at the time he was we just knew he was "extra"), and my wife's undiagnosed neurodivergency. She thinks probably autism, but hasn't pursued to very much since she's overloaded trying to figure out other health issues.
Turns out having a second kid just cranked up all the things that were triggers for her in terms of sensory overload. I love our daughter absolutely. Don't regret her existing, but the reality is that it has had a pretty detrimental effect on my wife. To be fair, the first kid as well, but the second was definitely exponential.
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lonelyahavaCall me Ahava ~~She/Her~~Move to New ZealandRegistered Userregular
Having a second infant would destroy my mental health, my physical health, and almost certainly our marriage.
It didn't destroy our marriage, but having our second pretty much did all the other things for my wife. There was the added stress of my son (sorry to repeat it, but he's diagnosed with ASD and ADHD now, but at the time he was we just knew he was "extra"), and my wife's undiagnosed neurodivergency. She thinks probably autism, but hasn't pursued to very much since she's overloaded trying to figure out other health issues.
Turns out having a second kid just cranked up all the things that were triggers for her in terms of sensory overload. I love our daughter absolutely. Don't regret her existing, but the reality is that it has had a pretty detrimental effect on my wife. To be fair, the first kid as well, but the second was definitely exponential.
yeah a lot of my still undiagnosed but likely ND of some flavour tendencies really started showing their faces after Ellie's birth. I've never really 'recovered' from the brain fog that came with 'baby brain' and considering the 'baby' is almost 7, along with a bunch of other things, it's really lead me to question my mental health.
The amount that my monthly cycle, and the emotional reactions around it, changed after Ellie was born (mostly when she was about 2) was marked and has gotten me to take herbal supplements just to find some balance.
Due to my brain and body working how they did, a lot of the infant care fell on hubby which has led to a close relationship between him and Ellie. The balance has evened out a bit now, but for a long time, He was the center of her world I provided discipline and food. adding another baby into this mix would be.... it would be intense.
but all of that aside, pregnancy sucked. I was exhausted the entire time, i was fortunate to not have morning sickness at all but I did have Gestational Diabetes and was on medication for that for pretty much the entire pregnancy (diagnosed at about 18 weeks). The physical toll and pain, the lack of sleep, the *dreams*
Yeah, no. I hated being pregnant the first time. Even thinking about doing it again...
This may be a weird/overly personal question but: for those of you with one kid... do you ever wish you had more?
My wife is pretty keen on a second, with a major consideration being that she worries about our daughter being lonely/bored as she gets older. I'm... less excited at the idea, because I find one to be a lot sometimes, and *gestures at last couple of pages of thread*. I think we're agreed that a second would make the next couple of years a lot more hectic, but aren't agreed on whether everything from there on would make it worthwhile.
I know this is the sort of thing that is up to individuals to decide, I'm just curious what other people's experiences are.
I had one and then we had another. First one was terribly difficult, so we figured it couldn't possibly be harder and that turned out to be true. The second one has been much easier, and the work for 2 has seemed negligible compared to one. Once you make a meal and clean up for one 2 seems the same. And the older one has aged out of just casually destroying things and making a huge mess so much.
That said it totally resets the clock on stuff you have to worry about like poop on the carpet.id have 2 years less of poop on the carpet with one kid.
and I wonder about my neighbors even though I don't have them
but they're listening to every word I say
Seven year old got sent to the principal’s office for not behaving in class because she didn’t want to stop playing a game and do the scheduled schoolwork, grumbling, growling, and stealing pieces of the game to play with later. I’m perplexed, because she rarely has an attitude like that at home. When her dad said she needed to go to her room for her behaviour at school, she sulked, but did as she was told and had a nap. And when it’s time to stop doing something she enjoys, and do something she doesn’t, she’s usually pretty good and following directions. I’m not saying the teacher is lying, but I’m scratching my head why mini muzz is so stubborn with her, and not with us. We’ve explained that she needs to follow instructions, and to not steal stuff, even if she’s just borrowing it, with the added threat of taking her electronic privileges away if she continues.
The teacher says she’s bright and a delight to teach, but she really needs to work on her social skills.
Kids are different with different adults. We got a bit lucky, our kids are defiant nightmares at home but mostly good for their teachers, but the opposite can absolutely be the case.
Don't underestimate how much you learn to subconsciously navigate your kids' triggers, either. You never realize how many ways you shift gears or redirect an impending tantrum and even a great teacher can't do that with a whole room full of kids.
Hevach on
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lonelyahavaCall me Ahava ~~She/Her~~Move to New ZealandRegistered Userregular
Ellie's teacher tells us how quiet she is in class and helpful and always anticipates things needing to be done and just doing them.
Her teacher is so very confused when we come into school and Ellie switches into her full on hype talk mode, as the teacher never sees it.
But, we just got an invite to the end of year prize giving ceremony because Ellie is being given an award this year.
The second one has been much easier, and the work for 2 has seemed negligible compared to one. Once you make a meal and clean up for one 2 seems the same. And the older one has aged out of just casually destroying things and making a huge mess so much.
Just throwing out that this all depends on how they get along. If they get along like typical siblings (or even worse), they'll be a whole lot of yelling and arguing - sometimes over things as trivial as whether or not one kid was looking at the other - that doesn't happen when you just have one. It's quite maddening.
I've heard of these families where the two siblings get along great all the time and are the best of friends that never fight. How I envy them but also somehow secretly hope they are lying.
I’m surprised nobody has mentioned the apparent amnesia you get as a parent after kid #1. You get through the infancy stage and then around 24-30 months in you forget how hard it was and think, “yeah, a second one wouldn’t be that hard.” Then you do 24 hour feedings and blowouts again and remember everything.
As for siblings, I think it’s worth it. Nobody else in your child’s life will occupy the same place as their siblings. Not their friends, not their cousins, and certainly not you or your partner. My 2 get along really well about 75% of the time though, so that may make me a bit biased.
Our son is 22 months now and we have not even brought up having another kid since he's been born. Just yesterday my wife suggested we sell the old car seat because "It would be a very long while before it got used again, if ever", and that's literally the first time she's ever said anything.
I want (well...sometimes want...) another simply because my son is the kindest boy and would be the best brother. And I want him to have someone when we're gone, even if he's an adult then. Unfortunately he has no cousins or anything (he does, but it's complicated), so I worry about what would happen to him. Maybe we'll live long lives and he'll have a partner and it will never matter. Who knows.
But I really am only wanting it for him. For myself, he's enough of a handful. And as others have said, the toll the pregnancy took on my wife - and whats still going on now - was just gigantic. I don't even want to bring it up because it's unfair to her to even potentially, by accident, lay some guilt on her. It was awful and I wouldn't want to ever ask her to go through that again.
So yeah - just echoing what others say - you just have to get on the same page, and be sure it's what you really want.
The other thing is, getting pregnant can be tough. We had a whole cycle of "should we have kids" - "ok yes, lets do it" and then a few years of it not working out. The mental toll of sitting there and struggling over if you should try, then finally going for it - THEN waiting another year because its just not happening is so brutal.
PSN: mxmarks - WiiU: mxmarks - twitter: @ MikesPS4 - twitch.tv/mxmarks - "Yes, mxmarks is the King of Queens" - Unbreakable Vow
I’m surprised nobody has mentioned the apparent amnesia you get as a parent after kid #1. You get through the infancy stage and then around 24-30 months in you forget how hard it was and think, “yeah, a second one wouldn’t be that hard.” Then you do 24 hour feedings and blowouts again and remember everything.
As for siblings, I think it’s worth it. Nobody else in your child’s life will occupy the same place as their siblings. Not their friends, not their cousins, and certainly not you or your partner. My 2 get along really well about 75% of the time though, so that may make me a bit biased.
We're having the second one now in January even though we have not forgotten how hard the first infant year was. But both wife and I have great relationships with our siblings now (though teenage years were basically a time out for both) so we are reasoning as you describe.
Also I don't want our first to be alone with her crazy parents when she is older. I don't know how I'd stand my parents without my brother to vent to.
To give another perspective on the only child/child with siblings: I have two older brothers. One is 3 years older and the other 4. As you can tell by that, they were very close in age (14 months) and were and still are buddies. Of course, that didn't stop the occasional fights, one notable one involving the younger chasing the older around the outside of the house trying to bash him with an axe handle.
But me? Not really close with them growing up. I was always the third wheel. My relationship with them ranged from casual acquaintance to straight up antagonistic and bullying. We went in separate directions when my mom divorced (when I was in my mid-teens) and I didn't live in the same state and only visited 1-2 times a year with them (they live 1,000 miles away).
When I got much older, I realized I liked being around them, as they were funny and good natured. This was probably about 10-20 years ago, in my 20s-30s. I was still never friends with them like they were with each other, and still felt like the outsider, but it was okay.
Now they're riding at the front of the Trump train, and I have no desire to see them at all. I think if I visited now, I'd wind up getting into an argument that would cause permanent damage (already got into a bit of that about five years ago with one brother over whether society should pay for health care for children whose parents can't pay). I'm just hoping they'll regain their sanity in about a decade and we can have a relationship again, but who knows. My brothers and I text each other on birthdays and that's it.
One of my best friends just lost her brother, who was in his mid-40s. They had a few ups and downs but otherwise a close relationship. She's now an only child and it's a huge loss for her. Her mom's brother is still living, but they haven't had a working relationship in decades (again, a big part of that due to vastly divergent politics). My wife has a brother a few years younger than her, but they had the worst relationship growing up, often involving knock-down drag out fights and her holding the bedroom door closed while he screamed and pounded on it because he wanted to attack her. Now they have a working relationship, but there's no real warm there. Her mom has a dozen siblings, and she doesn't really like any of them. Some she gets along with better than others.
So you really just never know, even with siblings.
One thing also to consider with siblings.. each kid is their own person.
Like, you can say it, and it's obvious. But really, you cannot think that kid #2 will be in anyway like kid #1. They could be- they share a lot of DNA and will be raised similarly. But..
Like, my daughter was easy. Sometimes cried, sometimes needed to be rocked to sleep, always needed a pacifier. But generally a happy baby.
She currently does well in school, has some anxiety and adhd we are working through but nothing holding her back in school.
Her younger brother.. colic. just.. colic. Wouldn't even take a pacifier.
Autistic, has pretty bad ADHD, has an IEP in school with a 1:1 paraprofessional for his behaviors. He's a great kid, and everybody mentions how kind he is when he is regulated. But needs a lot of help to stay regulated. Had to switch to special charter school because public school did not work out for him.
They get along well. They love each other and play together often. Yes, they can fight, but it's not that hard to keep them separated when younger brother gets overwhelmed. But #1 did not in any way prepare us for #2.
If that's all there is my friends, then let's keep dancing
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lonelyahavaCall me Ahava ~~She/Her~~Move to New ZealandRegistered Userregular
My brother and I are 4 years apart. Parents wanted it that way so we wouldn't be in the same school at the same time.
Of course the formative years being in the mid 1990s and both of our parents working late, meant that I ended up shouldering a lot of the actual parenting fort my brother. I cooked meals, made sure he did his homework, helped with reports, navigated his relationship with my father, defended him from bullies, etc.
And then I graduated high school and left for university, leaving my 14 year old brother to the ravages of high school and trying to get by with our parents all in his own. I was good at navigating the personality differences in the house, my brother, not so much. So in his eyes, I abandoned him when he needed me most.
He's the graduating class of 2003 and yeah he got good screwed over millennial life.
And he still tends to blame me for all of that.
We talk over messenger every 3 months maybe? We can talk for about 2 hours but a lot of that is him rambling about things and me just trying to keep up with whatever is going on.
I wouldn't say that we were even remotely close. And I'm sure that my not being there when Mom died in January is going to end up being another thing he hates me for in the future.
Found family can be just as important and crucial as a real sibling. It's all going to depend on the individual persons in question
The second one has been much easier, and the work for 2 has seemed negligible compared to one. Once you make a meal and clean up for one 2 seems the same. And the older one has aged out of just casually destroying things and making a huge mess so much.
Just throwing out that this all depends on how they get along. If they get along like typical siblings (or even worse), they'll be a whole lot of yelling and arguing - sometimes over things as trivial as whether or not one kid was looking at the other - that doesn't happen when you just have one. It's quite maddening.
I've heard of these families where the two siblings get along great all the time and are the best of friends that never fight. How I envy them but also somehow secretly hope they are lying.
These kids do be yelling and hitting each other.
But when there was just one he was yelling and hitting at me anyway so it's not really much different.
and I wonder about my neighbors even though I don't have them
but they're listening to every word I say
Kids are different with different adults. We got a bit lucky, our kids are defiant nightmares at home but mostly good for their teachers, but the opposite can absolutely be the case.
Don't underestimate how much you learn to subconsciously navigate your kids' triggers, either. You never realize how many ways you shift gears or redirect an impending tantrum and even a great teacher can't do that with a whole room full of kids.
My son is basically like "up yours dad, don't tell me what to do! f the police!" at home and then at school they say he is sweet.
and I wonder about my neighbors even though I don't have them
but they're listening to every word I say
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Kane Red RobeMaster of MagicArcanusRegistered Userregular
If you want your kids to be best friends just have an extremely acrimonious divorce that forces them to cling together as the only stability still left to them between the Scylla of court proceedings and the Charybdis of endless parental screaming matches.
Oh wait, maybe don't do that I only have one data point but it did work for my older sister and I.
More seriously, Mrs. Red Robe and I wavered back and forth after our first whether or not to have a second. We eventually settled on yes and so far it's going quite well but we're definitely not having another. I was never really into the "sibling friend" argument, if we'd had just our eldest I imagine we'd just make our house more available for friends to come over often. It's really a question that needs to be litigated in detail by each family imo.
I am the oldest and have a brother and sister, and there's two-ish years between. Which pair of us was closer varies - my brother and I had the "we're the boys" thing, but I'd move into middle school (etc.) while my brother and sister were together in elementary still, etc.
We're all on really different paths through life, but we're still close - we just all got together at my brother's house in Mississippi for Thanksgiving, and we wouldn't go to middle-of-nowhere-MS for just anyone.
My brother and his wife have one kid, and no plans to have more. We have two, about 4 years apart (not intentionally) and my guys occasionally fight, but they're otherwise pretty inseparable? Even though my oldest is in middle school and my youngest still has several years of elementary left. They bond over video games, board games, vague attempts at basketball ... They're extremely different people, though - my oldest gets angry at adversity, and my youngest tears up, as just one example. The cousins hadn't seen each other in years, but after an initial bit of shyness they got on like a house on fire.
So, like, children are a land of contrasts, I guess.
So there is an exhibit at our local museum on feces. All the ways we've handled them throughout history and throughout the world. It's actually quite an interesting exhibit. And the logo is a golden poop, which my 4yo absolutely loves. Unfortunately there were none for sale at the museum gift shop, so we've started making our own at home to use as Christmas tree golden poop ornaments.
I also have a miniature Dalek I received years ago. It is the same size as my Christmas village characters, so that's where it went. My 4yo actually relishes the tradition of her placing the Christmas Dalek in the village.
So between these two, it got me thinking about how weird her childhood Christmas traditions will sound when she describes them to her friends in the future. And it got me thinking about other people. What weird unique Christmas traditions did you accidentally make up for your kids?
Thanks to teething we're well into sleep regression, and he's back to waking up every 2 hours for the entire night while also spending the whole day kind of miserable.
Question for Parents who assist Tooth Faries: What do you do with your kids baby teeth? My kid is approaching the age in which teeth get wobbly, but I find it weird to keep all of her teeth, but feel awkward to throw them away.
Thanks to teething we're well into sleep regression, and he's back to waking up every 2 hours for the entire night while also spending the whole day kind of miserable.
Newborns are easy by comparison.
Ohh yeah, our daughter just got finished with the first of that about a month ago. She would wake 2-3 times a night. Every time she woke she expected a bottle which made things harder.
Of course we’re pretty sure her molars are starting to peak through now so she’s been super fussy and refuses to nap for more than an hour a day and waking during the night again.
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We ball the tooth up in a tissue and throw it away. My wife does scrapbooking and stuff for her small business and we couldn't come up with anything that wouldn't be weird to have a tooth on it lol.
So there is an exhibit at our local museum on feces. All the ways we've handled them throughout history and throughout the world. It's actually quite an interesting exhibit. And the logo is a golden poop, which my 4yo absolutely loves. Unfortunately there were none for sale at the museum gift shop, so we've started making our own at home to use as Christmas tree golden poop ornaments.
I also have a miniature Dalek I received years ago. It is the same size as my Christmas village characters, so that's where it went. My 4yo actually relishes the tradition of her placing the Christmas Dalek in the village.
So between these two, it got me thinking about how weird her childhood Christmas traditions will sound when she describes them to her friends in the future. And it got me thinking about other people. What weird unique Christmas traditions did you accidentally make up for your kids?
Every year I hide the baby Jesus from the nativity scene. It started as a joke with my wife the first year we were married, I made a comment about it not being Christmas yet so Jesus shouldn't be in the manager, she said I was overthinking it, while she was at work I stuck Jesus up on a shelf to see how long it would take for her to notice him missing. It became a tradition, it gets hidden in plain sight, no burying it in the back of a closet or something, if someone manages to find Jesus he goes in the nativity, otherwise he doesn't show up until Christmas day.
We saved them. The little lego treasure chest piece was enough for a while, but now my 11 y.o.'s big molars have caused us to have to move up to a generic bottle.
I assume at some point I'll make a clay model head with real teeth.
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ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
We saved them. The little lego treasure chest piece was enough for a while, but now my 11 y.o.'s big molars have caused us to have to move up to a generic bottle.
I assume at some point I'll make a clay model head with real teeth.
I don’t think it’s weird, but what we do is talk about the year as a family and all the different things that happened to us. We talk about the broad themes of what happened that year and we come up with a tree/bush/plant that matches how we felt about the year. I was never big on buying Xmas trees, so our yearly choice becomes our xmas tree, and we plant it outside later.
2020 was a lemon tree. It died before we could try planting it outside, which was fitting.
Question for Parents who assist Tooth Faries: What do you do with your kids baby teeth? My kid is approaching the age in which teeth get wobbly, but I find it weird to keep all of her teeth, but feel awkward to throw them away.
Put them in the back of your nightstand drawer and forget about them because you also don't know what to do with them, until one of the next kids gets old enough to rummage through said drawer and finds the teeth and promptly puts one of them into their mouth and then you panickedly get it out of their mouth and throw it away. Or just throw it away from the start, that works too.
So my girl is teething again and this morning she woke up at 5 AM screaming.
So I put her in the bed with me and she fell asleep hard in about 5 minutes. How much did I doom myself? Is she ever going to sleep in her crib again?
One offs are fine. Repeating a behavior is when you create an expectation. From what I’ve read/experienced, after about the third time in a row, or say 4 out of 7 times in a row, they will now expect this behavior from now on.
That doesn’t have to mean forever. You can change expectations by consistently doing things the right way for long enough, but expect the reverse process to take at least twice as long and be fairly miserable.
"The world is a mess, and I just need to rule it" - Dr Horrible
So there is an exhibit at our local museum on feces. All the ways we've handled them throughout history and throughout the world. It's actually quite an interesting exhibit. And the logo is a golden poop, which my 4yo absolutely loves. Unfortunately there were none for sale at the museum gift shop, so we've started making our own at home to use as Christmas tree golden poop ornaments.
I also have a miniature Dalek I received years ago. It is the same size as my Christmas village characters, so that's where it went. My 4yo actually relishes the tradition of her placing the Christmas Dalek in the village.
So between these two, it got me thinking about how weird her childhood Christmas traditions will sound when she describes them to her friends in the future. And it got me thinking about other people. What weird unique Christmas traditions did you accidentally make up for your kids?
Every year my family watched The Christmas Toy - a muppet/Henson movie that gets very little love. It is our absolute favorite, and we even named the family dog after one of the characters. I am 40 and still watch it every year. Last year the kiddo was 11 months so he just kinda bumbled around during it.
This year I was so excited to continue the tradition with him.
...I am less excited now as any time the TV turns on it is immediately met with him screaming "GAH-BEE! GAH-BEE!" demanding we watch Gabby's Dollhouse for the 8 billionth time.
mxmarks on
PSN: mxmarks - WiiU: mxmarks - twitter: @ MikesPS4 - twitch.tv/mxmarks - "Yes, mxmarks is the King of Queens" - Unbreakable Vow
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lonelyahavaCall me Ahava ~~She/Her~~Move to New ZealandRegistered Userregular
So my girl is teething again and this morning she woke up at 5 AM screaming.
So I put her in the bed with me and she fell asleep hard in about 5 minutes. How much did I doom myself? Is she ever going to sleep in her crib again?
There is nothing wrong with letting your kid sleep in your bed.
Ellie has been in our bed pretty consistently since she was 18 months.
It now takes the form of her starting in her bed and then coming into our bed in the middle of the night.
If it works for you and your family, everybody gets the sleep and comfort that they want and need, there is no shame in it. You are doing nothing wrong.
(Standard caveats about size and age of baby, maybe not so much with infants, but once they're crawling it's fine)
Eventually they will sleep on their own. But until then, they know they have a safe place and comfort
Yeah I'm glad that works for you but I can't imagine having to share my already small bed with a child lol. I'd like them to get used to not having to need me by their side while they sleep. They know if something happens and they cry we'll be in the room in no time at all so it's not like we aren't nearby.
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lonelyahavaCall me Ahava ~~She/Her~~Move to New ZealandRegistered Userregular
Oh I'm totally coming from the privilege of a king size bed and only one child. Ellie got a real bag chest infection at 18 months and having her in bed with us many we could hear her breathing.
It was also the first full night of sleep we had ever gotten in that full 18 months. She never slept through the night.
We were almost to the point of her sleeping in her bed through until at least 3am earlier this year. And then my mom died and we all regressed back and fuckit. She'll get there eventually.
We generally let our kids jump in our bed with the following rules:
1. No being restless sleeper mcgee. Knees in the back or flailing are a hard no.
2. Barring extraordinary circumstances - no consecutive nights.
Many times I've headed it off during a phase of nightmares by going to their bed (we bought our kids full beds partly for this) so they still get comfort.
In related news my daughter is a damned bed tyrant. Any inch she takes is never given back.
Yeah for our household the issue is my kids are so fucking nosey lol. We couldn't have the baby in the room for very long because if one of us coughed then that was it for the rest of the night. Even with noise machines. Light was also a problem so we had to ensure our phones never went off in the room lol.
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So, pretty much who knows. Nothing you feel now about having #2 is much use at all. It's a roll of the dice.
Not even a little bit.
We got a healthy little bundle of constant motion and that's been good enough.
It didn't destroy our marriage, but having our second pretty much did all the other things for my wife. There was the added stress of my son (sorry to repeat it, but he's diagnosed with ASD and ADHD now, but at the time he was we just knew he was "extra"), and my wife's undiagnosed neurodivergency. She thinks probably autism, but hasn't pursued to very much since she's overloaded trying to figure out other health issues.
Turns out having a second kid just cranked up all the things that were triggers for her in terms of sensory overload. I love our daughter absolutely. Don't regret her existing, but the reality is that it has had a pretty detrimental effect on my wife. To be fair, the first kid as well, but the second was definitely exponential.
yeah a lot of my still undiagnosed but likely ND of some flavour tendencies really started showing their faces after Ellie's birth. I've never really 'recovered' from the brain fog that came with 'baby brain' and considering the 'baby' is almost 7, along with a bunch of other things, it's really lead me to question my mental health.
The amount that my monthly cycle, and the emotional reactions around it, changed after Ellie was born (mostly when she was about 2) was marked and has gotten me to take herbal supplements just to find some balance.
Due to my brain and body working how they did, a lot of the infant care fell on hubby which has led to a close relationship between him and Ellie. The balance has evened out a bit now, but for a long time, He was the center of her world I provided discipline and food. adding another baby into this mix would be.... it would be intense.
but all of that aside, pregnancy sucked. I was exhausted the entire time, i was fortunate to not have morning sickness at all but I did have Gestational Diabetes and was on medication for that for pretty much the entire pregnancy (diagnosed at about 18 weeks). The physical toll and pain, the lack of sleep, the *dreams*
Yeah, no. I hated being pregnant the first time. Even thinking about doing it again...
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I had one and then we had another. First one was terribly difficult, so we figured it couldn't possibly be harder and that turned out to be true. The second one has been much easier, and the work for 2 has seemed negligible compared to one. Once you make a meal and clean up for one 2 seems the same. And the older one has aged out of just casually destroying things and making a huge mess so much.
That said it totally resets the clock on stuff you have to worry about like poop on the carpet.id have 2 years less of poop on the carpet with one kid.
but they're listening to every word I say
The teacher says she’s bright and a delight to teach, but she really needs to work on her social skills.
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Dear Satan.....
Don't underestimate how much you learn to subconsciously navigate your kids' triggers, either. You never realize how many ways you shift gears or redirect an impending tantrum and even a great teacher can't do that with a whole room full of kids.
Her teacher is so very confused when we come into school and Ellie switches into her full on hype talk mode, as the teacher never sees it.
But, we just got an invite to the end of year prize giving ceremony because Ellie is being given an award this year.
So
I'm prepared to be full emotional
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Just throwing out that this all depends on how they get along. If they get along like typical siblings (or even worse), they'll be a whole lot of yelling and arguing - sometimes over things as trivial as whether or not one kid was looking at the other - that doesn't happen when you just have one. It's quite maddening.
I've heard of these families where the two siblings get along great all the time and are the best of friends that never fight. How I envy them but also somehow secretly hope they are lying.
As for siblings, I think it’s worth it. Nobody else in your child’s life will occupy the same place as their siblings. Not their friends, not their cousins, and certainly not you or your partner. My 2 get along really well about 75% of the time though, so that may make me a bit biased.
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Our son is 22 months now and we have not even brought up having another kid since he's been born. Just yesterday my wife suggested we sell the old car seat because "It would be a very long while before it got used again, if ever", and that's literally the first time she's ever said anything.
I want (well...sometimes want...) another simply because my son is the kindest boy and would be the best brother. And I want him to have someone when we're gone, even if he's an adult then. Unfortunately he has no cousins or anything (he does, but it's complicated), so I worry about what would happen to him. Maybe we'll live long lives and he'll have a partner and it will never matter. Who knows.
But I really am only wanting it for him. For myself, he's enough of a handful. And as others have said, the toll the pregnancy took on my wife - and whats still going on now - was just gigantic. I don't even want to bring it up because it's unfair to her to even potentially, by accident, lay some guilt on her. It was awful and I wouldn't want to ever ask her to go through that again.
So yeah - just echoing what others say - you just have to get on the same page, and be sure it's what you really want.
The other thing is, getting pregnant can be tough. We had a whole cycle of "should we have kids" - "ok yes, lets do it" and then a few years of it not working out. The mental toll of sitting there and struggling over if you should try, then finally going for it - THEN waiting another year because its just not happening is so brutal.
We're having the second one now in January even though we have not forgotten how hard the first infant year was. But both wife and I have great relationships with our siblings now (though teenage years were basically a time out for both) so we are reasoning as you describe.
Also I don't want our first to be alone with her crazy parents when she is older. I don't know how I'd stand my parents without my brother to vent to.
But me? Not really close with them growing up. I was always the third wheel. My relationship with them ranged from casual acquaintance to straight up antagonistic and bullying. We went in separate directions when my mom divorced (when I was in my mid-teens) and I didn't live in the same state and only visited 1-2 times a year with them (they live 1,000 miles away).
When I got much older, I realized I liked being around them, as they were funny and good natured. This was probably about 10-20 years ago, in my 20s-30s. I was still never friends with them like they were with each other, and still felt like the outsider, but it was okay.
Now they're riding at the front of the Trump train, and I have no desire to see them at all. I think if I visited now, I'd wind up getting into an argument that would cause permanent damage (already got into a bit of that about five years ago with one brother over whether society should pay for health care for children whose parents can't pay). I'm just hoping they'll regain their sanity in about a decade and we can have a relationship again, but who knows. My brothers and I text each other on birthdays and that's it.
One of my best friends just lost her brother, who was in his mid-40s. They had a few ups and downs but otherwise a close relationship. She's now an only child and it's a huge loss for her. Her mom's brother is still living, but they haven't had a working relationship in decades (again, a big part of that due to vastly divergent politics). My wife has a brother a few years younger than her, but they had the worst relationship growing up, often involving knock-down drag out fights and her holding the bedroom door closed while he screamed and pounded on it because he wanted to attack her. Now they have a working relationship, but there's no real warm there. Her mom has a dozen siblings, and she doesn't really like any of them. Some she gets along with better than others.
So you really just never know, even with siblings.
Like, you can say it, and it's obvious. But really, you cannot think that kid #2 will be in anyway like kid #1. They could be- they share a lot of DNA and will be raised similarly. But..
Like, my daughter was easy. Sometimes cried, sometimes needed to be rocked to sleep, always needed a pacifier. But generally a happy baby.
She currently does well in school, has some anxiety and adhd we are working through but nothing holding her back in school.
Her younger brother.. colic. just.. colic. Wouldn't even take a pacifier.
Autistic, has pretty bad ADHD, has an IEP in school with a 1:1 paraprofessional for his behaviors. He's a great kid, and everybody mentions how kind he is when he is regulated. But needs a lot of help to stay regulated. Had to switch to special charter school because public school did not work out for him.
They get along well. They love each other and play together often. Yes, they can fight, but it's not that hard to keep them separated when younger brother gets overwhelmed. But #1 did not in any way prepare us for #2.
Of course the formative years being in the mid 1990s and both of our parents working late, meant that I ended up shouldering a lot of the actual parenting fort my brother. I cooked meals, made sure he did his homework, helped with reports, navigated his relationship with my father, defended him from bullies, etc.
And then I graduated high school and left for university, leaving my 14 year old brother to the ravages of high school and trying to get by with our parents all in his own. I was good at navigating the personality differences in the house, my brother, not so much. So in his eyes, I abandoned him when he needed me most.
He's the graduating class of 2003 and yeah he got good screwed over millennial life.
And he still tends to blame me for all of that.
We talk over messenger every 3 months maybe? We can talk for about 2 hours but a lot of that is him rambling about things and me just trying to keep up with whatever is going on.
I wouldn't say that we were even remotely close. And I'm sure that my not being there when Mom died in January is going to end up being another thing he hates me for in the future.
Found family can be just as important and crucial as a real sibling. It's all going to depend on the individual persons in question
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These kids do be yelling and hitting each other.
But when there was just one he was yelling and hitting at me anyway so it's not really much different.
but they're listening to every word I say
My son is basically like "up yours dad, don't tell me what to do! f the police!" at home and then at school they say he is sweet.
but they're listening to every word I say
Oh wait, maybe don't do that I only have one data point but it did work for my older sister and I.
More seriously, Mrs. Red Robe and I wavered back and forth after our first whether or not to have a second. We eventually settled on yes and so far it's going quite well but we're definitely not having another. I was never really into the "sibling friend" argument, if we'd had just our eldest I imagine we'd just make our house more available for friends to come over often. It's really a question that needs to be litigated in detail by each family imo.
We're all on really different paths through life, but we're still close - we just all got together at my brother's house in Mississippi for Thanksgiving, and we wouldn't go to middle-of-nowhere-MS for just anyone.
My brother and his wife have one kid, and no plans to have more. We have two, about 4 years apart (not intentionally) and my guys occasionally fight, but they're otherwise pretty inseparable? Even though my oldest is in middle school and my youngest still has several years of elementary left. They bond over video games, board games, vague attempts at basketball ... They're extremely different people, though - my oldest gets angry at adversity, and my youngest tears up, as just one example. The cousins hadn't seen each other in years, but after an initial bit of shyness they got on like a house on fire.
So, like, children are a land of contrasts, I guess.
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I also have a miniature Dalek I received years ago. It is the same size as my Christmas village characters, so that's where it went. My 4yo actually relishes the tradition of her placing the Christmas Dalek in the village.
So between these two, it got me thinking about how weird her childhood Christmas traditions will sound when she describes them to her friends in the future. And it got me thinking about other people. What weird unique Christmas traditions did you accidentally make up for your kids?
Newborns are easy by comparison.
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Dear Satan.....
Because I had no other ideas what to do
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Sell them to witches and/or sorcerers at a premium of course.
Ohh yeah, our daughter just got finished with the first of that about a month ago. She would wake 2-3 times a night. Every time she woke she expected a bottle which made things harder.
Of course we’re pretty sure her molars are starting to peak through now so she’s been super fussy and refuses to nap for more than an hour a day and waking during the night again.
Every year I hide the baby Jesus from the nativity scene. It started as a joke with my wife the first year we were married, I made a comment about it not being Christmas yet so Jesus shouldn't be in the manager, she said I was overthinking it, while she was at work I stuck Jesus up on a shelf to see how long it would take for her to notice him missing. It became a tradition, it gets hidden in plain sight, no burying it in the back of a closet or something, if someone manages to find Jesus he goes in the nativity, otherwise he doesn't show up until Christmas day.
I assume at some point I'll make a clay model head with real teeth.
2020 was a lemon tree. It died before we could try planting it outside, which was fitting.
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Put them in the back of your nightstand drawer and forget about them because you also don't know what to do with them, until one of the next kids gets old enough to rummage through said drawer and finds the teeth and promptly puts one of them into their mouth and then you panickedly get it out of their mouth and throw it away. Or just throw it away from the start, that works too.
So I put her in the bed with me and she fell asleep hard in about 5 minutes. How much did I doom myself? Is she ever going to sleep in her crib again?
One offs are fine. Repeating a behavior is when you create an expectation. From what I’ve read/experienced, after about the third time in a row, or say 4 out of 7 times in a row, they will now expect this behavior from now on.
That doesn’t have to mean forever. You can change expectations by consistently doing things the right way for long enough, but expect the reverse process to take at least twice as long and be fairly miserable.
Every year my family watched The Christmas Toy - a muppet/Henson movie that gets very little love. It is our absolute favorite, and we even named the family dog after one of the characters. I am 40 and still watch it every year. Last year the kiddo was 11 months so he just kinda bumbled around during it.
This year I was so excited to continue the tradition with him.
...I am less excited now as any time the TV turns on it is immediately met with him screaming "GAH-BEE! GAH-BEE!" demanding we watch Gabby's Dollhouse for the 8 billionth time.
There is nothing wrong with letting your kid sleep in your bed.
Ellie has been in our bed pretty consistently since she was 18 months.
It now takes the form of her starting in her bed and then coming into our bed in the middle of the night.
If it works for you and your family, everybody gets the sleep and comfort that they want and need, there is no shame in it. You are doing nothing wrong.
(Standard caveats about size and age of baby, maybe not so much with infants, but once they're crawling it's fine)
Eventually they will sleep on their own. But until then, they know they have a safe place and comfort
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It was also the first full night of sleep we had ever gotten in that full 18 months. She never slept through the night.
We were almost to the point of her sleeping in her bed through until at least 3am earlier this year. And then my mom died and we all regressed back and fuckit. She'll get there eventually.
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1. No being restless sleeper mcgee. Knees in the back or flailing are a hard no.
2. Barring extraordinary circumstances - no consecutive nights.
Many times I've headed it off during a phase of nightmares by going to their bed (we bought our kids full beds partly for this) so they still get comfort.
In related news my daughter is a damned bed tyrant. Any inch she takes is never given back.