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Final Fantasy 14! Shadowbringers! The best expansion to an MMO ever!

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Posts

  • NightslyrNightslyr Registered User regular
    Something, too, that was touched upon with the DRK arc and continues with ShB (same writer, so it's to be expected) is that XIV is trying to nudge the WoL away from simply being a digital puppet. What the WoL can do - even dialogue choices - and what the player would do are diverging by design by this point. Obviously there are some severe limits to what they can do both because of the genre (MMOs don't lend themselves to good player character characterization) and the history of the character being, essentially, a blank slate up until this point. But it's definitely there. And, frankly, I applaud the game for (heh) taking the reins every so often. I find it to be a nice surprise when the WoL doesn't do or react exactly as I would, even if that means the WoL is 'stupid' or whatever.

    --

    In other XIV news, I'm 2/3rds of the way through the HW alliance raids, and they're pretty cool. I've been doing them blind, but haven't been dying very often. I'm kind of surprised that Ozma was a thing back in the day. Maybe it's because I played a lot of the StB alliance raids (especially the 3rd one), but it was really simple. Obviously, the rest of the group knew what they were doing, but even so it didn't seem that involved from a mechanics standpoint.

    In any event, I wish we could do some more sky pirate stuff.

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  • lionheart_mlionheart_m Registered User regular
    I mean at the time, Ozma was quite a complex fight when it was released. Most mechanics in an undergeared group could wipe you. Between the meteors, the orbs you have to catch, the debuff that makes you explode if you use skills, and the beam you had to pay attention on what form he was to survive. Contrary to other fights if one group died it was over.

    Now compared to the nightmare that is TG Cid, yeah it is pretty easy.

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  • IlpalaIlpala Just this guy, y'know Texas booniesRegistered User regular
    I mean at the time, Ozma was quite a complex fight when it was released. Most mechanics in an undergeared group could wipe you. Between the meteors, the orbs you have to catch, the debuff that makes you explode if you use skills, and the beam you had to pay attention on what form he was to survive. Contrary to other fights if one group died it was over.

    Now compared to the nightmare that is TG Cid, yeah it is pretty easy.

    There is one key difference between TG Cid and Ozma

    Aint no rails on the Ozma platform.

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  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    Nightslyr wrote: »
    Something, too, that was touched upon with the DRK arc and continues with ShB (same writer, so it's to be expected) is that XIV is trying to nudge the WoL away from simply being a digital puppet. What the WoL can do - even dialogue choices - and what the player would do are diverging by design by this point. Obviously there are some severe limits to what they can do both because of the genre (MMOs don't lend themselves to good player character characterization) and the history of the character being, essentially, a blank slate up until this point. But it's definitely there. And, frankly, I applaud the game for (heh) taking the reins every so often. I find it to be a nice surprise when the WoL doesn't do or react exactly as I would, even if that means the WoL is 'stupid' or whatever.
    Main problem with trying to turn WoL into an actual character, is that it is working against the inertia of ARR and 2 expansions.
    You can make mmo character into a distinct, well, character. Star Wars The Old Republic did just that with 8 different characters, that had a story as rich as, if not richer than, most single player games.
    But i feel that ShB is not really committing to it, or atleast has not yet.
    WoL remains a voiceless blank slate, with occasional dialogue options that can serve to highlight how little anything you pick matters.
    Now, i do enjoy the dialogue choices more often than not. But i can't help but feel that the WoL as a character would be served better without having them, and instead there being actual dialogue and characterization all through the story.

  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    edited September 10
    Did some more story after leaving Greatwoods.
    Not much to say but i wanted to say it now anyway instead of waiting when it might get drowned out by other things.
    The whole invasion was beautifully done.
    Well, the fighting parts were as mediocre as i have come to expect. But apart from that, this whole scene was so beautifully terrible.
    Magnificently heartbreaking. The despair, sadness, heartbreak, it was shown so vividly with no need for huge exposition.

    And i think this was the first time in the whole expansion where i reacted to Ardbert with something else than annoyance.
    Here, the pain he is going through was clearly out front.
    What have you done to deserve this mercy? Good question. I suspect nothing.

    Vauthry's ships coming with loudspeakers after the fight was just the kick in the groin needed to crown this tragedy.

    Some thoughts on Eulmore, Garlemard, and politics in gaming.
    Game is really not pulling any punches on just how, evil, Eulmore and Garlemard are.
    Petty cruelty. Unprovoked invasions. Chemical weapons used on civilian population.

    Where do you go from here? What do you do after you win against and opponent like that? What should you do?
    How much should be forgiven once dust settles to secure peace?
    I'm not sure the writers have it in them to answer these questions.

    Everything is political, everything has a message.
    Gaius van Baelsar is very explicitly a fascist, i've been hearing his speech from the ARR a lot lately.
    Yet now he is our ally. Or atleast Estinien is working with him. And i get the in setting reasoning.
    But in todays political climate, i am not really happy about a message of working with the "decent" fascist.
    Especially given how in denial Japan can be about its own past.

    Yes, i know, "it's just a game", i've heard that.
    The story takes itself too seriously, takes too close a look at the attrocities, for me to accept that excuse in this case.
    I may be a bit hypocritical here consider other games i've played and not had anywhere near as big a reaction to.
    But the story in this game is too, strong? good? impactful? to be just dismissed, i think.
    TL:DR: Nyysjan thinks too much and needs to chill.

    Nyysjan on
  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    I mean at the time, Ozma was quite a complex fight when it was released. Most mechanics in an undergeared group could wipe you. Between the meteors, the orbs you have to catch, the debuff that makes you explode if you use skills, and the beam you had to pay attention on what form he was to survive. Contrary to other fights if one group died it was over.

    Now compared to the nightmare that is TG Cid, yeah it is pretty easy.

    There's an even harder version of Ozma in the Arsenal as well.

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  • DonnictonDonnicton Hey it's me, your old pal Movie Sonic - let me in. LEMME IN. Registered User regular
    Which may as well not exist as that zone is dead until Square nerfs it.

    destroyah87BahamutZEROSkeithThatDudeOverThereMan in the Mists
  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Tales from the Shadows goes all Second Renaissance as the history of the Eighth Umbral Calamity is recounted.

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    destroyah87
  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    edited September 10
    So, a trolley...
    Did we establish why we need to fix the trolley instead of walking through the tunnels?
    We do just fine walking everywhere else...

    I'm not against this story, it's a very familiar one and can be quit enjoyable when done well.
    And who does not like trolleys.
    But i must have missed us establishing why we are doing this.

    edit-
    Holy fuck that's a lot of sidequests all of a sudden.

    Nyysjan on
  • destroyah87destroyah87 Registered User regular
    Nyysjan wrote: »
    So, a trolley...
    Did we establish why we need to fix the trolley instead of walking through the tunnels?
    We do just fine walking everywhere else...

    I'm not against this story, it's a very familiar one and can be quit enjoyable when done well.
    And who does not like trolleys.
    But i must have missed us establishing why we are doing this.
    It is established and you missed it. The door doesn’t open without a cart and working golem passing through. So you can’t walk into the tunnels.

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  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    Nyysjan wrote: »
    So, a trolley...
    Did we establish why we need to fix the trolley instead of walking through the tunnels?
    We do just fine walking everywhere else...

    I'm not against this story, it's a very familiar one and can be quit enjoyable when done well.
    And who does not like trolleys.
    But i must have missed us establishing why we are doing this.
    It is established and you missed it. The door doesn’t open without a cart and working golem passing through. So you can’t walk into the tunnels.
    Ah, thanks.
    Why are we not breaking the doors? Get a metal saw or something?
    I'm over thinking things again. Time to go fix a trolley. :D
    Right after these sidequests.

  • LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
    I had very mixed feelings about the trolley quest chain.

    On the one hand, it was actually a very enjoyable side quest, it introduces some new good characters, and as you dive into the quest chain, you will quickly learn that there's a whole lot of emotional depth packed into that trolley quest.

    On the other hand, it really killed the momentum of the main plot and I was ready to be done with it almost as soon as I began.

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  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    I had very mixed feelings about the trolley quest chain.

    On the one hand, it was actually a very enjoyable side quest, it introduces some new good characters, and as you dive into the quest chain, you will quickly learn that there's a whole lot of emotional depth packed into that trolley quest.

    On the other hand, it really killed the momentum of the main plot and I was ready to be done with it almost as soon as I began.

    And it comes right after
    the magnificently done sin eater invasion.
    Which might make it feel worse by contrast.

  • IlpalaIlpala Just this guy, y'know Texas booniesRegistered User regular
    Post Greatwoods
    Really drives home how much better the voice acting is compared to the ARR days. Got surprisingly choked up at Lyna's lament

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  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    I find that voice acting bit of a hit and miss.
    Sometimes it works great, other times less so.
    Overall decent though.
    I used to have it on Japanese because i simply can't tell if the voice acting is good or bad.
    But after there was the talk without subtitles on arrival, i changed it to english.

  • IlpalaIlpala Just this guy, y'know Texas booniesRegistered User regular
    I've been playing through the beginning of the MSQ on an alt recently and boy howdy was it "miss" a lot more often.

    FF XIV - Qih'to Furishu/Auldhaerz Swygkhansyn (both on Mateus), Battle.Net - Ilpala#1975
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  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    There's a reason why i switched to japanese very quickly.

  • McMoogleMcMoogle Registered User regular
    The trolley also serves as an example for why you should never skip leg day, as Ranjit clearly never does.

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  • KreutzKreutz Registered User regular
    Ilpala wrote: »
    I've been playing through the beginning of the MSQ on an alt recently and boy howdy was it "miss" a lot more often.

    I still miss ARR Merlwyb, though not so much the original Alphinaud. I can't tell if it's because I didn't like the VA or because I associate that voice with being bossed around for hours by a teenaged elf with a chip on his shoulder. Probably both.

  • lionheart_mlionheart_m Registered User regular
    ugh the trolley feels so bad especially after what comes after. Yes, I know they want to show how far you've come but still GRAAH.

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  • SabreMauSabreMau ネトゲしよう 판다리아Registered User regular
    I like the trolley just because it made this video happen.
    Contains spoilers for that part and some from later in MSQ too.

    Stabbity StyleBucketmandrunkenpandarenThatDudeOverThere
  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    Now now, i'm sure we are just all too media literate and this is a perfectly polished diamond for the average consumer.
    :D

  • destroyah87destroyah87 Registered User regular
    edited September 10
    Nyysjan wrote: »
    Now now, i'm sure we are just all too media literate and this is a perfectly polished diamond for the average consumer.
    :D

    Is the snark really helpful or warranted?

    Edit: I’m actually gonna elaborate more. The snark feels very unnecessary and is taking a dig at someone for an unrelated conversation from the past.

    destroyah87 on
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  • BucketmanBucketman Call me SkraggRegistered User regular
    Beat the story this past weekend, now I wanna level other classes but man, even in level 70 gear my Dragoon is doing shit damage and getting wrecked by FATEs

  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Bucketman wrote: »
    Beat the story this past weekend, now I wanna level other classes but man, even in level 70 gear my Dragoon is doing shit damage and getting wrecked by FATEs

    Are you in the i400 set? One goal I set for every expansion is to get all my jobs into the previous expansion's endgame gear.

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  • TcheldorTcheldor Registered User regular
    Bucketman wrote: »
    Beat the story this past weekend, now I wanna level other classes but man, even in level 70 gear my Dragoon is doing shit damage and getting wrecked by FATEs

    Just do Castrum Abania 3 times. Make sure to use the pre order earring if you have it.

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  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    edited September 10
    Nyysjan wrote: »
    Now now, i'm sure we are just all too media literate and this is a perfectly polished diamond for the average consumer.
    :D

    Is the snark really helpful or warranted?

    Edit: I’m actually gonna elaborate more. The snark feels very unnecessary and is taking a dig at someone for an unrelated conversation from the past.
    It was not intended towards anyone specific.
    Probably should have gone with "well it's a JRPG so this is not only expected, but necessary".

    I get that i tend to be the only person making any complaints (except about couple specific things) about the story, and even in Stormblood i was having a very different opinion from everyone.
    But sometimes it feels that any complaint i have, gets just pushed away with "well it's an mmo" or "it's an jrpg" and even once with "you're culturally insensitive" which kinda felt weird.
    Weird pacing is prety regular on jrpg's, and mmo's both, does not make it good, but it's not really surprising.

    Like side quests, when are they meant to be happening anyway? Because if you do them asap, like i am, it introduces some pacing issues of their own especially in the
    Ran'Jit is coming
    parts of the story.
    sidequests are a good additional source of xp, especially for people who do not chain run dungeons to gear up like i do.
    But they do introduce pacing issues, which has lead me to toy with an idea of just removing them during MSQ, and introducing them after MSQ is over.
    But that would remove lot of the color and depth the setting has because of them, so that's not really a solution.

    edit-
    Also, the "perfectly polished diamond" is completely snark.
    Average consumer, is not, atleast not completely. Because average consumer might not even notice, or care.
    I don't think most (if any) people here are going to be the "average consumer", whatever that is, simply because we are here talking about the game.

    Nyysjan on
  • ArcanisTheImpotentArcanisTheImpotent Registered User regular
    it's because everyone gets tired of the conversation being washed under a tide of negativity if we're being honest, and you can stop being coy about it, just @ me next time

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  • CaedwyrCaedwyr Registered User regular
    The WoL has been conversing with the scions since ARR. We have only recently been getting more dialogue choices, so we can see what the WoL is saying, but they have been present as a character somewhat independent from the player's avatar right from near the start.

    destroyah87ArcanisTheImpotentStabbity StyleNightslyrBucketmanMan in the Mists
  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    edited September 10
    it's because everyone gets tired of the conversation being washed under a tide of negativity if we're being honest, and you can stop being coy about it, just @ me next time
    I hardly think my comments create a tide, especially among all the people praising the game.
    And my comments have been lot more positive once i moved from Stormblood to Shadowbringers.
    Also, as i explained, i was not specifically thinking about you when making the post.

    edit-
    And yes, WoL does talk.
    They just never bother to write the dialogue to keep them a blank slate as much as they can.
    It's an old trick used since before Chrono Trigger.
    I wish they had just written proper dialogue.

    Nyysjan on
  • NightslyrNightslyr Registered User regular
    Bucketman wrote: »
    Beat the story this past weekend, now I wanna level other classes but man, even in level 70 gear my Dragoon is doing shit damage and getting wrecked by FATEs

    Are you in the i400 set? One goal I set for every expansion is to get all my jobs into the previous expansion's endgame gear.

    To add to this, every new expansion assumes that you're around the previous expansion's highest level tome gear. So, 390+ for the end of Stormblood, 260+ for the end of Heavensward, etc. Thankfully, previous expansion tome gear is obtained through Poetics and comparatively cheap compared to their original prices, so it's not too hard to get caught up.

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  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    Yeah, doing the duty roulette while you level should get you enough tomes to gear up a single class fairly easily.
    Assuming you are not speeding through the content super fast.

  • lionheart_mlionheart_m Registered User regular
    If you have to focus on something go weapon, chest/legs x2 and then hands/feet/helmx3. The first three give the biggest stat increase.

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  • NightslyrNightslyr Registered User regular
    You can also buy green gear off of the market board for gil, but while the ilevel may be the same as blue/tome gear, the stats are a bit worse.

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  • lionheart_mlionheart_m Registered User regular
    a lot worse unless you get HQ stuff.

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  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    Nyysjan wrote: »
    Yeah, doing the duty roulette while you level should get you enough tomes to gear up a single class fairly easily.
    Assuming you are not speeding through the content super fast.

    I'd be impressed if someone managed to get through an expansion without capping tomestones at least once. Just the MSQ dungeons and duties should get you most of the way there, and at some point you'll be underleveled and need to run a roulette. Maybe if you do every sidequest in every zone?

    Bucketman
  • lionheart_mlionheart_m Registered User regular
    and I still find people doing level 58 and 68 dungeons with level 50 and 60 weapons.

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  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    But good enough for MSQ, even if it takes lot longer.
    Also make sure to get best materia you can, those can add up a lot.
    I have lot of +12 materia instead of +40 in my current levelling gear, but even those help up.
    And i am gathering up the stuff needed to buy better materia through roulettes so i can get as good materia as i can for my main job gear once i hit 80.

  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    and I still find people doing level 58 and 68 dungeons with level 50 and 60 weapons.

    That's a game design problem imo. It expects you to get weapon upgrades through the MSQ, so dungeons are terrible at providing them.

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  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    and I still find people doing level 58 and 68 dungeons with level 50 and 60 weapons.
    Those weapons can be really hard to find unfortunately.
    The tomestone weapons are pretty good compared to store bought ones.
    So if you are levelling jobs after the fact, you simply might not find a weapon as a drop.
    But atleast the gear now drops guaranteed.

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