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American Carnage - 31 Killed Between Mass Shootings in El Paso, Texas and Dayton, Ohio

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Posts

  • BurtletoyBurtletoy Registered User regular
    Just make the schools out of guns.

    If the guns always survive the gun fight, why don't we just make people out of guns?

    jungleroomxCouscousNobeardZilla360
  • [Expletive deleted][Expletive deleted] The mediocre doctor NorwayRegistered User regular
    On the Norway mosque attack: Local media are reporting that the police are saying there is nothing that indicates the attack is a terror attack.

    The shooter praised the Christchurch and El Paso shooters, stormed into a mosque with guns drawn.

    The police had better have a damned good reason for why this is not a (failed) terror attack.

    Sic transit gloria mundi.
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  • Kipling217Kipling217 Registered User regular
    On the Norway mosque attack: Local media are reporting that the police are saying there is nothing that indicates the attack is a terror attack.

    The shooter praised the Christchurch and El Paso shooters, stormed into a mosque with guns drawn.

    The police had better have a damned good reason for why this is not a (failed) terror attack.

    Probably because the Progress Party(FrP) controls the Ministry of Justice. (The Progress party is the local Islamophobe Party, they are in the governing coalition and have had the Minister of Justice post since 2013).

    Can't have a white Supremacist terror attack one month before local elections.

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  • [Expletive deleted][Expletive deleted] The mediocre doctor NorwayRegistered User regular
    Kipling217 wrote: »
    On the Norway mosque attack: Local media are reporting that the police are saying there is nothing that indicates the attack is a terror attack.

    The shooter praised the Christchurch and El Paso shooters, stormed into a mosque with guns drawn.

    The police had better have a damned good reason for why this is not a (failed) terror attack.

    Probably because the Progress Party(FrP) controls the Ministry of Justice. (The Progress party is the local Islamophobe Party, they are in the governing coalition and have had the Minister of Justice post since 2013).

    Can't have a white Supremacist terror attack one month before local elections.

    Good news! The police, in their press conference an hour ago, said they are investigating it as an an attempted terrorist attack.

    The police are also explicitly saying that the terrorist murdered the young woman found dead. (Yesterday, they had not yet concluded if it was murder or not.)

    Sic transit gloria mundi.
  • dispatch.odispatch.o Registered User regular
    edited August 11
    Out of curiosity and a fascination with the perspective from people not from the United States of America...

    What kind of coverage of the shootings here usually exists a few days after an event? Does coverage actually extend to the politics of gun legislation or is it a day or two of headlines about how gross and violent America is and then back to local coverage that matters?

    The shooting at Charlie Hebdo in 2015 was a big deal world wide. It was 12 dead, 11 injured. The only thing really different is the perpetrators weren't white. Is there a big failure to acknowledge that white power / actual Nazis are a big problem in Europe as well?

    Edit: To make the point if white nationalist violence is a thing everywhere, why is it exceptional they commit so much violence and murder in the USA. Surely it's something to do with the convenience of guns?

    dispatch.o on
  • mrondeaumrondeau Montréal, CanadaRegistered User regular
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Out of curiosity and a fascination with the perspective from people not from the United States of America...

    What kind of coverage of the shootings here usually exists a few days after an event? Does coverage actually extend to the politics of gun legislation or is it a day or two of headlines about how gross and violent America is and then back to local coverage that matters?

    The shooting at Charlie Hebdo in 2015 was a big deal world wide. It was 12 dead, 11 injured. The only thing really different is the perpetrators weren't white. Is there a big failure to acknowledge that white power / actual Nazis are a big problem in Europe as well?

    Bluntly, in Canada, Americans killing each others is no longer news, no matter who is doing the killing. It gets reported, but it's not exactly headline material anymore.
    It's basically taken as given, like car accidents and Trump being an idiot.

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  • NEO|PhyteNEO|Phyte They follow the stars, bound together. Strands in a braid till the end.Registered User regular
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Edit: To make the point if white nationalist violence is a thing everywhere, why is it exceptional they commit so much violence and murder in the USA. Surely it's something to do with the convenience of guns?
    convenience of guns and the political/media apparatus that is entirely structured around spewing a narrative that encourages it to happen.

    It was that somehow, from within the derelict-horror, they had learned a way to see inside an ugly, broken thing... And take away its pain.
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  • redxredx I(x)=2(x)+1 whole numbersRegistered User regular
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Out of curiosity and a fascination with the perspective from people not from the United States of America...

    What kind of coverage of the shootings here usually exists a few days after an event? Does coverage actually extend to the politics of gun legislation or is it a day or two of headlines about how gross and violent America is and then back to local coverage that matters?

    The shooting at Charlie Hebdo in 2015 was a big deal world wide. It was 12 dead, 11 injured. The only thing really different is the perpetrators weren't white. Is there a big failure to acknowledge that white power / actual Nazis are a big problem in Europe as well?

    We normally get a day or two about the event itself.
    Then another couple days about how both sides are reacting to each other.
    Then low level coverage about legislation which will never happen, hi-cap magazine or bumpstock restrictions vs. more guns in school.
    After about a week the media has found something else to cover, and they don't really cover all of the proposed legislation going nowhere, except as a congressional process piece a few months later.
    Maybe some students get uppity and organize demanding that they don't get murdered, and that will get a day or two of coverage.

    This machine kills threads.
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular


    Another one, where a dude posted he was going to kill more people at a walmart. Good fucking lord.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

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  • jungleroomxjungleroomx And I said, hol up Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »


    Another one, where a dude posted he was going to kill more people at a walmart. Good fucking lord.

    It's amazing what happens when the NRA and gun lobby empower and encourage this shit.

    Make. Time.
    dispatch.oIncenjucarPreacherSolarBlackDragon480TicaldfjamEmerlmaster999JaysonFourmcdermottmonikerFencingsaxJazzjoshofalltradesTNTrooperQuidShadowfireNobeardDee KaeMillLegacyDarkPrimusAegeriXaquinJohnny ChopsockyshrykeElldrenHacksawTofystedethToxHappy Little MachineLoisLaneLabelAbsoluteZeroiTunesIsEvilyossarian_livesNo-QuarterYoutubeboogedybooStabbity StyleFANTOMASZilla360MegaMekRMS OceanicMagellMrVyngaardKoopahTroopahMvrckFoolOnTheHillmarajiMild ConfusionSkeith
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »


    Another one, where a dude posted he was going to kill more people at a walmart. Good fucking lord.

    It's amazing what happens when the NRA and gun lobby empower and encourage this shit.

    Walmart just needs to not hire people on probation, he mentioned it IT MEANS SOMETHING!!

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    Http:// pleasepaypreacher.net
  • AegeriAegeri Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    edited August 12
    mrondeau wrote: »
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Out of curiosity and a fascination with the perspective from people not from the United States of America...

    What kind of coverage of the shootings here usually exists a few days after an event? Does coverage actually extend to the politics of gun legislation or is it a day or two of headlines about how gross and violent America is and then back to local coverage that matters?

    The shooting at Charlie Hebdo in 2015 was a big deal world wide. It was 12 dead, 11 injured. The only thing really different is the perpetrators weren't white. Is there a big failure to acknowledge that white power / actual Nazis are a big problem in Europe as well?

    Bluntly, in Canada, Americans killing each others is no longer news, no matter who is doing the killing. It gets reported, but it's not exactly headline material anymore.
    It's basically taken as given, like car accidents and Trump being an idiot.

    This is true here in Australia too.

    I will note that what broke a lot of people was Sandy Hook. That's where a lot of foreign media stopped focusing so much on these shootings, asking why it happened and what could be done. We know why now, there just isn't any will for a solution.

    Aegeri on
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  • lonelyahavalonelyahava Call me Ahava Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    Aegeri wrote: »
    mrondeau wrote: »
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Out of curiosity and a fascination with the perspective from people not from the United States of America...

    What kind of coverage of the shootings here usually exists a few days after an event? Does coverage actually extend to the politics of gun legislation or is it a day or two of headlines about how gross and violent America is and then back to local coverage that matters?

    The shooting at Charlie Hebdo in 2015 was a big deal world wide. It was 12 dead, 11 injured. The only thing really different is the perpetrators weren't white. Is there a big failure to acknowledge that white power / actual Nazis are a big problem in Europe as well?

    Bluntly, in Canada, Americans killing each others is no longer news, no matter who is doing the killing. It gets reported, but it's not exactly headline material anymore.
    It's basically taken as given, like car accidents and Trump being an idiot.

    This is true here in Australia too.

    I will note that what broke a lot of people was Sandy Hook. That's where a lot of foreign media stopped focusing so much on these shootings, asking why it happened and what could be done. We know why now, there just isn't any will for a solution.


    Also true in NZ.

    The local media just... what's the point in following the stories when nothing changes? They'll give us the headlines, like for El Paso. but almost anything smaller than that barely gets a mention. it's just America as usual. No more than attacks in Kabul or anywhere else get mentioned either.

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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Another planned attack thwarted. Sounds like it was someone inspired by Christchurch as the arrest was May 31, court case is proceeding now and the planned attack was part of the evidence prosecution is using to try to deny him bail. White supremacist stopped from buying a gun because his father had him committed at one point, it reads like. But he was actually arrested because he left his cell phone on a city bus and the good samaritan trying to identify the owner to return it found a ton of child porn.

    Boulder, Colorado this time.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
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  • JragghenJragghen Registered User regular
    He was stopped from buying a gun because of a background check, explicitly.

    In case anyone ever argues they can't work.

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  • BurtletoyBurtletoy Registered User regular
    edited August 12
    Jragghen wrote: »
    He was stopped from buying a gun because of a background check, explicitly.

    In case anyone ever argues they can't work.

    BuT wHaT aBoUt HiS rIgHtS?!?


    Gonna assume this was the first sentence in his thank you letter to his father for stopping him
    He texted a contact named “Dad” that same day that “you’ve permanently ruined my ability to buy a gun in CO and other states,” the warrant says.

    Burtletoy on
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  • AegeriAegeri Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    In case anyone needs a reminder of who opposes background checks.

    The problem I can see here, is that these assholes if they hadn't been caught doing another act of terrorism or similar, would have had every right to challenge their inability to get firearms in court and probably earn the backing of the NRA or 2A Lawyers. After that, those same people would have thrown up their hands and said "If only mental health was better, we couldn't possibly do anything about these shooters getting guns otherwise".

    I wonder how they would deal with the cognitive dissonance.

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  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    Aegeri wrote: »
    mrondeau wrote: »
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Out of curiosity and a fascination with the perspective from people not from the United States of America...

    What kind of coverage of the shootings here usually exists a few days after an event? Does coverage actually extend to the politics of gun legislation or is it a day or two of headlines about how gross and violent America is and then back to local coverage that matters?

    The shooting at Charlie Hebdo in 2015 was a big deal world wide. It was 12 dead, 11 injured. The only thing really different is the perpetrators weren't white. Is there a big failure to acknowledge that white power / actual Nazis are a big problem in Europe as well?

    Bluntly, in Canada, Americans killing each others is no longer news, no matter who is doing the killing. It gets reported, but it's not exactly headline material anymore.
    It's basically taken as given, like car accidents and Trump being an idiot.

    This is true here in Australia too.

    I will note that what broke a lot of people was Sandy Hook. That's where a lot of foreign media stopped focusing so much on these shootings, asking why it happened and what could be done. We know why now, there just isn't any will for a solution.


    Also true in NZ.

    The local media just... what's the point in following the stories when nothing changes? They'll give us the headlines, like for El Paso. but almost anything smaller than that barely gets a mention. it's just America as usual. No more than attacks in Kabul or anywhere else get mentioned either.

    I think it broke a lot of people here as well. but ignoring it is impossible when you're here.

    torchlight-sig-80.jpg
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  • DocDoc Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited August 12
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    Aegeri wrote: »
    mrondeau wrote: »
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Out of curiosity and a fascination with the perspective from people not from the United States of America...

    What kind of coverage of the shootings here usually exists a few days after an event? Does coverage actually extend to the politics of gun legislation or is it a day or two of headlines about how gross and violent America is and then back to local coverage that matters?

    The shooting at Charlie Hebdo in 2015 was a big deal world wide. It was 12 dead, 11 injured. The only thing really different is the perpetrators weren't white. Is there a big failure to acknowledge that white power / actual Nazis are a big problem in Europe as well?

    Bluntly, in Canada, Americans killing each others is no longer news, no matter who is doing the killing. It gets reported, but it's not exactly headline material anymore.
    It's basically taken as given, like car accidents and Trump being an idiot.

    This is true here in Australia too.

    I will note that what broke a lot of people was Sandy Hook. That's where a lot of foreign media stopped focusing so much on these shootings, asking why it happened and what could be done. We know why now, there just isn't any will for a solution.


    Also true in NZ.

    The local media just... what's the point in following the stories when nothing changes? They'll give us the headlines, like for El Paso. but almost anything smaller than that barely gets a mention. it's just America as usual. No more than attacks in Kabul or anywhere else get mentioned either.

    I think it broke a lot of people here as well. but ignoring it is impossible when you're here.

    It made me stop debating gun control with those who oppose it. I realized that it was nearly pointless. If 20 kids being murdered wasn't going to change their mind, I knew that I couldn't. I push for it wherever I feel like it can make a difference, but trying to pull someone over who is a staunch opponent is not a worthwhile endeavor.

    Doc on
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  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Fighting The Rising Odds Registered User, Moderator mod
    So, we've had about fifty pages of talk about gun control, the massacres, and now the thread seems to be turning into a repository for any and all gun related news around the world.

    This is not a warning to stay on topic, but is notice that the thread, like all gun control threads, has been through the familiar cyclical journey of horror, debate, personal insults, alt-history essays about how a certain brand of ammunition is the key to overthrowing tyranny and then a slow crawl back to the familiar numbness. It will be closed soon unless something happens like new gun control measures being bought forward by lawmakers.

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  • DonnictonDonnicton Hey it's me, your old pal Movie Sonic - let me in. LEMME IN. Registered User regular
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-shooting-texas-idUSKCN1V3013

    Reuters reporting that El Paso has seen an upsurge in hispanics purchasing handguns and taking firearms classes now that they feel they're targets for mass shootings.

    As well, the governor seems to agree that the solution to guns is more guns.
    Gun control is definitely not on the horizon for Texas, where Governor Greg Abbot recently signed into law nine bills, backed by the National Rifle Association, that will loosen up gun regulations starting on Sept. 1.

    One of the new laws lifts a ban on carrying firearms in places of worship. That ban came after a gunman fatally shot 26 people at a church in Sutherland Springs. Another stops landlords from prohibiting firearms on their rental properties.

  • CelestialBadgerCelestialBadger Registered User regular
    News from the future: troubled Hispanic teen steals his father's gun and shoots up an X. Trump calls for expulsion of Hispanic "terrorists."

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  • XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
    News from the future: troubled Hispanic teen steals his father's gun and shoots up an X. Trump calls for expulsion of Hispanic "terrorists."

    he's already said as much campaigning in 2015 =p

  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    Sadly if there is anything that would get gun control its minorities buying guns.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    Http:// pleasepaypreacher.net
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  • XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    Sadly if there is anything that would get gun control its minorities buying guns.

    but it would only be for minorities =/

    AbsoluteZeroElldren
  • CelestialBadgerCelestialBadger Registered User regular
    Xaquin wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    Sadly if there is anything that would get gun control its minorities buying guns.

    but it would only be for minorities =/

    Would it be unconstitutional to restrict arms to citizens only?

  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    If all these 2nd Amendment guys were out there protecting minorities from ICE agents, and tearing down the camps, and all that shit, then I'd be like "yeah fair do's go 2nd Amendment." Like for real! If that's what it's there for and they actually took action on that then alright then!

    But they don't. This is ultimately why it's bullshit. It's to defend against tyranny except the tyranny is real for some people, and it always has been, and they don't fight against it, they're the guys who allow it, who perpetrate it, who vote for it to happen. The AR-15 "but my rights!" crowd are the guys forming militias on the border to try to hunt down refugees, and shooting up malls. They are the tyrant's foot soldiers.

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  • monikermoniker Registered User regular
    Donnicton wrote: »
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-shooting-texas-idUSKCN1V3013

    Reuters reporting that El Paso has seen an upsurge in hispanics purchasing handguns and taking firearms classes now that they feel they're targets for mass shootings.

    As well, the governor seems to agree that the solution to guns is more guns.
    Gun control is definitely not on the horizon for Texas, where Governor Greg Abbot recently signed into law nine bills, backed by the National Rifle Association, that will loosen up gun regulations starting on Sept. 1.

    One of the new laws lifts a ban on carrying firearms in places of worship. That ban came after a gunman fatally shot 26 people at a church in Sutherland Springs. Another stops landlords from prohibiting firearms on their rental properties.

    So much for property rights.

  • ViskodViskod Registered User regular
    moniker wrote: »
    Donnicton wrote: »
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-shooting-texas-idUSKCN1V3013

    Reuters reporting that El Paso has seen an upsurge in hispanics purchasing handguns and taking firearms classes now that they feel they're targets for mass shootings.

    As well, the governor seems to agree that the solution to guns is more guns.
    Gun control is definitely not on the horizon for Texas, where Governor Greg Abbot recently signed into law nine bills, backed by the National Rifle Association, that will loosen up gun regulations starting on Sept. 1.

    One of the new laws lifts a ban on carrying firearms in places of worship. That ban came after a gunman fatally shot 26 people at a church in Sutherland Springs. Another stops landlords from prohibiting firearms on their rental properties.

    So much for property rights.

    It's got a right to be shot at. Just like everyone else.

    Artereis wrote: »
    It's not your fault, Viskod. 1 out of every 10 people just happens to be a monster.
  • CelestialBadgerCelestialBadger Registered User regular
    Solar wrote: »
    If all these 2nd Amendment guys were out there protecting minorities from ICE agents, and tearing down the camps, and all that shit, then I'd be like "yeah fair do's go 2nd Amendment." Like for real! If that's what it's there for and they actually took action on that then alright then!

    But they don't. This is ultimately why it's bullshit. It's to defend against tyranny except the tyranny is real for some people, and it always has been, and they don't fight against it, they're the guys who allow it, who perpetrate it, who vote for it to happen. The AR-15 "but my rights!" crowd are the guys forming militias on the border to try to hunt down refugees, and shooting up malls. They are the tyrant's foot soldiers.

    The "tyranny" they want to defend themselves from is liberalism. You can see that when they describe Barack Obama as a tyrant for reforming healthcare somewhat.

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  • monikermoniker Registered User regular
    Xaquin wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    Sadly if there is anything that would get gun control its minorities buying guns.

    but it would only be for minorities =/

    Would it be unconstitutional to restrict arms to citizens only?

    Yes.

  • Zilla360Zilla360 21st Century. |She/Her| Surreal. Immersive. Earth.Registered User regular
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Out of curiosity and a fascination with the perspective from people not from the United States of America...

    What kind of coverage of the shootings here usually exists a few days after an event? Does coverage actually extend to the politics of gun legislation or is it a day or two of headlines about how gross and violent America is and then back to local coverage that matters?

    The shooting at Charlie Hebdo in 2015 was a big deal world wide. It was 12 dead, 11 injured. The only thing really different is the perpetrators weren't white. Is there a big failure to acknowledge that white power / actual Nazis are a big problem in Europe as well?

    Edit: To make the point if white nationalist violence is a thing everywhere, why is it exceptional they commit so much violence and murder in the USA. Surely it's something to do with the convenience of guns?
    In America, and only in America, does it rain lead.

    In a darker time-line, mass shootings become so frequent, so normal, that they're only reported on by 'The Weather Channel', whilst I (from the UK) and the rest of the world looks on, exhausted and weeping.

    You have the NRA (who apparently formerly had their own TV channel?!) making reality-TV fashion shows about what clothing to wear to best enable concealed carry methods. AKA, the NRA 'does' feminism. :bigfrown:
    From an outsider's perspective it's simply madness writ large. Beyond satire, because they've already done it to themselves. :rotate:

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  • BurtletoyBurtletoy Registered User regular
    NRATV was an internet media company, not a television channel

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  • RickRudeRickRude Registered User regular
    New details coming out about the Dayton shooter. Reading the article now

    https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/08/13/us/dayton-mass-shooting/index.html?r=https://www.cnn.com/

  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    RickRude wrote: »
    New details coming out about the Dayton shooter. Reading the article now

    https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/08/13/us/dayton-mass-shooting/index.html?r=https://www.cnn.com/

    Man his friend is a piece of shit, like you didn't kill people but you hid the shit he used dude, and why the fuck and knew he was mentally disturbed as fuck.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    Http:// pleasepaypreacher.net
    RickRudeFencingsax
  • RickRudeRickRude Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    RickRude wrote: »
    New details coming out about the Dayton shooter. Reading the article now

    https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/08/13/us/dayton-mass-shooting/index.html?r=https://www.cnn.com/

    Man his friend is a piece of shit, like you didn't kill people but you hid the shit he used dude, and why the fuck and knew he was mentally disturbed as fuck.

    Police seem divided on if he intentionally killed his sister. I thought she was a target for sure. This one seems like it could have been prevented somehow.

    CelestialBadger
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited August 13
    RickRude wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    RickRude wrote: »
    New details coming out about the Dayton shooter. Reading the article now

    https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/08/13/us/dayton-mass-shooting/index.html?r=https://www.cnn.com/

    Man his friend is a piece of shit, like you didn't kill people but you hid the shit he used dude, and why the fuck and knew he was mentally disturbed as fuck.

    Police seem divided on if he intentionally killed his sister. I thought she was a target for sure. This one seems like it could have been prevented somehow.

    Best information we have is that you are misgendering his brother, FYI

    EDIT: As is CNN

    enlightenedbum on
    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
    Warren 2020
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  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    I don't want to post this without comment but it seems to completely undermine his own proposal. I basically never accept the notion that he's doing something strategic but if you wanted to create a scenario where a republican proposes gun control and democrats had to oppose it this would be a pretty good approach. say you want background checks just like them but make it blatantly obvious that you'd use it to punish political rivals.

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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited August 13
    Trump will do what the people on TV tell him to do. I will 100% guarantee that around 9:37 Fox aired a thing about Cuomo's encounter with an asshole last night.

    enlightenedbum on
    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
    Warren 2020
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  • RickRudeRickRude Registered User regular
    RickRude wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    RickRude wrote: »
    New details coming out about the Dayton shooter. Reading the article now

    https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/08/13/us/dayton-mass-shooting/index.html?r=https://www.cnn.com/

    Man his friend is a piece of shit, like you didn't kill people but you hid the shit he used dude, and why the fuck and knew he was mentally disturbed as fuck.

    Police seem divided on if he intentionally killed his sister. I thought she was a target for sure. This one seems like it could have been prevented somehow.

    Best information we have is that you are misgendering his brother, FYI

    EDIT: As is CNN

    ? I'm confused

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