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[Canadian Politics] Scheer-denfreude

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Posts

  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    No chance for anything but conservative in rural Sask. Makes voting feel bad and a waste of time.

    This is why they need to bring back voting subsidies. At least your party of choice got a bit of $$$ from those locked down areas.

    Well, voted liberal grudgingly. My district is one of the few that went liberal last election in AB so might as well try again. Much better candidate this time but not sure that's going to be enough.

    Think I'm taking a social media/news cleanse after this for a month. Talking politics is straight up pointless anymore as very few people even try to understand issues and vote like lemmings or sports fans....

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  • T-boltT-bolt Registered User regular
    vsove wrote: »
    Going to go vote after work, go home and ignore the election until 1AM.

    I suggest emotionally preparing yourself for a CPC majority so that no matter what happens, it will never be worse than that.
    What about a CPC-PPC coalition?

    Sorry

  • ForarForar #432 Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    I have voted!

    Polling station was busy but with no lineup to speak of, just a fairly smooth flow of people coming and going while I was there.

    First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
  • mrondeaumrondeau Montréal, CanadaRegistered User regular
    T-bolt wrote: »
    vsove wrote: »
    Going to go vote after work, go home and ignore the election until 1AM.

    I suggest emotionally preparing yourself for a CPC majority so that no matter what happens, it will never be worse than that.
    What about a CPC-PPC coalition?

    Sorry

    If that happens, we unleash the corgis and let absolute monarchy have another go.

    Disco11ApogeeGnome-InterruptusAridholLordSolarMacharius
  • ShadowhopeShadowhope Baa. Registered User regular
    With regards to voting an electoral systems from the last thread: what I wish we had was a ballot with two votes, one for the House of Commons and one for the Senate.

    For the Commons, use ranked choice instant runoff voting, so you could go NDP > Liberal > Green > Independent > a literal goose, and not feel like you’re wasting your vote. And then for the Senate use proportional representation, choosing just one party. So if 30% of the country voted Conservative on that part of the ballot, 30% Liberal, 20% NDP, 10% Green, 10% Bloc, we’d have 30 Conservative senators, 30 Liberal, 20 NDP, 10 Green, and 10 Bloc. The parties would then fill the Senate from their ranks according to their allocation.

    With this, no matter how red or orange or green or blue your district, your senate vote matters. And you could vote for your conscience with regards to your MP, without fear of enabling a party you oppose. While the Senate would continue to have less power than the Commons, it could still act to prevent a tyranny of the majority in the Commons.

    I sometimes post pretty pictures to twitter: https://twitter.com/matthewandworld
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  • Al_watAl_wat Registered User regular
    My riding is probably going conservative but I am throwing my vote against them as best I can

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  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    shaw has no idea why my TV is broken

    sigh

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  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    shaw has no idea why my TV is broken

    sigh

    I believe CBC has a live youtube stream of the coverage.

    PSN: Canadian_llama
    Ed Gruberman
  • NosfNosf Registered User regular
    Yea, you can stream all the various stations I'd assume. We voted early, it was dead, my wife and I and some old dude showed up as we left - and yet they reported that a whole lot more people voted early, so I wouldn't sweat it. Lots will leave it till after work or lunch time.

    OR NOT ALL, THOSE LAZY FUCKS.

  • ShadowenShadowen Snores in the morning Registered User regular
    I live in a riding where 338 says Liberals have a slight but not insurmountable lead in the polls. Second place (about 4% behind) is NDP, distant third (almost 15 points back of the NDP) is Conservatives.

    It's nice when you feel like you can safely vote for a candidate/party, rather than against one you don't want.

    Gnome-InterruptusAridholTubularLuggage
  • DeciusDecius Registered User regular
    edited October 21
    Man, my political humour has some layers to it :lol:
    2019-10-21_13-19-42.jpg

    In other news, I'm rather concerned about a vote split in my riding giving the Cons an easy victory. It's also Alberta, so maybe the voters here are just suckers.

    Decius on
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  • SteelhawkSteelhawk Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    shaw has no idea why my TV is broken

    sigh

    Do you rent your cable box? Just have them just give you a new box.

  • El MuchoEl Mucho Registered User regular
    Voted this morning. Really hoping for the Liberal MP to hold his seat.

    My friend shared this tweet from former conservative MP now PPC candidate Steven Fletcher.

    http://www.minionsofmordak.com/ - My friend designed and illustrated a board game check it out! -

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  • ZibblsnrtZibblsnrt Registered User regular
    "Source: Publically available data."

    hmmmm.jpg

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  • AegisAegis Not Quite TorontoRegistered User regular
    edited October 21
    This has now been the second federal election in a row in which I have had poll workers not accept my voter information card + passport as valid ID (on account of the passport not having my address on it).

    I specifically looked up Elections Canada regulations on Voter ID Requirements before going today, and then physically pointed out the spot on the pamplet the poll workers had with them, that indicated "voter information card" as an accepted form of ID satisfying the address requirement.

    Aegis on
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  • Felonious PrimeFelonious Prime CanadaRegistered User regular
    Haven't voted yet but I dislike all of my choices, not sure what my plan is yet. Probably not going to vote to be honest.

    I was going to post a big long diatribe about how I feel but parsed it down to the following. I'm not looking for a fight and am genuinely curious on what an outside perspective is. A couple of questions that I wonder about but have never asked anyone from the rest of Canada;

    "What do we do in Alberta/Sask/Northern BC if we shut down oil production?"
    "How can BC claim they are against the pipeline on environmental/global warming grounds when Vancouver is the biggest coal exporter on the west coast, and growing?"
    "Why is Canada responsible for policing climate change when we are the 2nd biggest country by land mass and one of the lowest populated, when countries like China, and India pollute with impunity?"
    "We need to be better yes, but why cut our own throats to do so?"

    If anyone whats to know what it's like being a social progressive environmental proactive fiscally conservative who works for big oil(not really but close enough) hit me up. I know it seems like I'm whining, and I guess I am, sorry about that.

  • Al_watAl_wat Registered User regular
    Aegis wrote: »
    This has now been the second federal election in a row in which I have had poll workers not accept my voter information card + passport as valid ID (on account of the passport not having my address on it).

    I specifically looked up Elections Canada regulations on Voter ID Requirements before going today, and then physically pointed out the spot on the pamplet the poll workers had with them, that indicated "voter information card" as an accepted form of ID satisfying the address requirement.

    did they let you vote in the end?

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  • ShadowenShadowen Snores in the morning Registered User regular
    edited October 21
    i done did done a democracy frens

    edit: disappointed there don't seem to be many restaurants doing an "I Voted Today!" special frens

    Shadowen on
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  • AegisAegis Not Quite TorontoRegistered User regular
    Al_wat wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    This has now been the second federal election in a row in which I have had poll workers not accept my voter information card + passport as valid ID (on account of the passport not having my address on it).

    I specifically looked up Elections Canada regulations on Voter ID Requirements before going today, and then physically pointed out the spot on the pamplet the poll workers had with them, that indicated "voter information card" as an accepted form of ID satisfying the address requirement.

    did they let you vote in the end?

    They called over the (I presume) actual Elections Canada official who agreed with me.

    So yes, I was able to vote.

    We'll see how long this blog lasts
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  • HandkorHandkor Registered User regular
    Can't wait to see where the Maritimes fall. 338 is showing very close races between Libs and Cons but with significant NDP support. I'm guessing there will be a lot of strategic voting giving it to the Libs.

  • EntriechEntriech Registered User regular
    "Why is Canada responsible for policing climate change when we are the 2nd biggest country by land mass and one of the lowest populated, when countries like China, and India pollute with impunity?"

    I don't think we're responsible for policing climate change, but I've heard this kind of point made before, and I don't think we get to have the luxury of not doing our part regardless of how big or small our part is.

    I also think that it is economically prudent if we figure out how to transition off a carbon-based economy before the rest of the world figures it out, so that we're not locked into position where our resources are worth less and less on the global market. Someday there's not going to be a demand to extract oil/coal, and I'd rather be out of that business before then.

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  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    Firstly, you have to understand there will never be the perfect candidate or perfect party. You have to spend some time and energy deciding on what trade offs and concessions you are willing to make to vote for someone who best represents your interests or the interests of the nation.

    Secondly, I don’t think anyone wants to stop the Oil & Gas industry, they just want them regulated properly as they have shown time and again that when left to their own devices they create a huge mess that everyone else is left paying to clean up.

    A lot of the rest of your post is whataboutism and special pleading with some mild nationalism/racist flavouring.

    But then I spent 18 of the last 20 years living in Edmonton so maybe I don’t really count as being from the rest of Canada.

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  • Felonious PrimeFelonious Prime CanadaRegistered User regular
    I take offence to this.
    "A lot of the rest of your post is whataboutism and special pleading with some mild nationalism/racist flavouring"

    There was and is no "racist flavouring" and I don't want a separate country, or anything of the sort. There was no pleading either, I legitimately wanted to know the perspective of other Canadians, not media or social media posts but actual people, to expand my prospective and don't appreciate you spinning it .

    This is literally why I rarely talk about politics some one always wrecks the discourse by acting like you just did.

  • darkmayodarkmayo Registered User regular
    What do we do in Alberta/Sask/Northern BC if we shut down oil production?"

    Oil production isn’t going to be shutdown, not at least in our lifetime (well maybe not mine ) but we do need to figure out better means of energy production and Alberta needs to diversify instead of just being a slave to boom bust oil and gas.

    "How can BC claim they are against the pipeline on environmental/global warming grounds when Vancouver is the biggest coal exporter on the west coast, and growing?"

    Yea coal sucks too, but other than a coal mine catching fire there is far more risk with oil. I am reminded of the spills etc from pipelines in the recent years, then tankers in the Pacific Ocean on the coast and what damage they would do to that ecosystem and how many other people/ industries that relay on that ecosystem. They have good reason to be wary.

    "Why is Canada responsible for policing climate change when we are the 2nd biggest country by land mass and one of the lowest populated, when countries like China, and India pollute with impunity?"
    "We need to be better yes, but why cut our own throats to do so?"

    Well no matter what I think we are boned, how boned is up to us. It’s not going to be pretty as the climate gets more fucked. If we are looking to alternatives and get ahead of the rest of the world then maybe we can weather the storm.

    Gnome-InterruptusCanadianWolverine
  • vsovevsove ....also yes. Registered User regular
    Haven't voted yet but I dislike all of my choices, not sure what my plan is yet. Probably not going to vote to be honest.

    I was going to post a big long diatribe about how I feel but parsed it down to the following. I'm not looking for a fight and am genuinely curious on what an outside perspective is. A couple of questions that I wonder about but have never asked anyone from the rest of Canada;

    "What do we do in Alberta/Sask/Northern BC if we shut down oil production?"
    "How can BC claim they are against the pipeline on environmental/global warming grounds when Vancouver is the biggest coal exporter on the west coast, and growing?"
    "Why is Canada responsible for policing climate change when we are the 2nd biggest country by land mass and one of the lowest populated, when countries like China, and India pollute with impunity?"
    "We need to be better yes, but why cut our own throats to do so?"

    If anyone whats to know what it's like being a social progressive environmental proactive fiscally conservative who works for big oil(not really but close enough) hit me up. I know it seems like I'm whining, and I guess I am, sorry about that.

    Honestly, oil production isn't going to shut down overnight. But what you can do is start trying to transition to renewables and other forward-thinking industries now, as opposed to waiting until the global economy forces you to do so. The Conservative approach is to just double down on oil because it will never go away. The Liberal approach is to embrace oil, but start transitioning. The NDP approach is to start the transition now and be very aggressive about it.

    As to the 'why should Canada police climate change when we're not the largest polluter?', we are in the top three for pollution-by-capita. An analogy I heard (and liked) - if you're standing on the banks of a river, and everyone's pouring sludge in - but one out of 30 people is pouring three barrels for every half barrel other people are pouring in, wouldn't you try and get them to stop pouring so much sludge? That's Canada - we aren't a massive piece of the overall problem, but we're really bad per capita.

    We can also serve as an example. It's really easy for China/India to point at us/the US and say 'well, they're still polluting like crazy, where's their moral standing on this issue?', and they're not wrong. We're telling them they don't get to do what we all did to get to the economic stage we're at now. We should be leading on the issue, not following.

    As for 'cutting our own throats' - renewable energy and green tech produces jobs at something like 10x the rate of Oil and Gas per dollar spent. A transition away from O&G is actually a net positive for the economy, and the jobs it creates are a lot more forward-looking. O&G in Canada is already a shrinking industry, if for no other reason than automation (and there are lots of other reasons). Acknowledging and working with that reality is a much better plan than what the CPC proposes, which is essentially plugging our ears and shouting 'LA LA LA LA' and hoping it doesn't happen.

    WATCH THIS SPACE.
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  • SatanIsMyMotorSatanIsMyMotor Registered User regular
    I take offence to this.
    "A lot of the rest of your post is whataboutism and special pleading with some mild nationalism/racist flavouring"

    There was and is no "racist flavouring" and I don't want a separate country, or anything of the sort. There was no pleading either, I legitimately wanted to know the perspective of other Canadians, not media or social media posts but actual people, to expand my prospective and don't appreciate you spinning it .

    This is literally why I rarely talk about politics some one always wrecks the discourse by acting like you just did.

    I think @Gnome-Interruptus is coming off a little strong but you need to understand there is a bit of naivete in your post. And to post asking people to convince you to vote when you're probably not going to vote anyway is extra frustrating - particularly on election day. A few of the things you seem worried about aren't really political in nature and you'd probably understand them with a bit of googling (ie: why so much oil is exported out of BC).

    In short, just go vote. If you feel uninformed there's a bunch of great info in this very thread. Read up then go vote!

  • quovadis13quovadis13 Registered User regular
    Aegis wrote: »
    Al_wat wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    This has now been the second federal election in a row in which I have had poll workers not accept my voter information card + passport as valid ID (on account of the passport not having my address on it).

    I specifically looked up Elections Canada regulations on Voter ID Requirements before going today, and then physically pointed out the spot on the pamplet the poll workers had with them, that indicated "voter information card" as an accepted form of ID satisfying the address requirement.

    did they let you vote in the end?

    They called over the (I presume) actual Elections Canada official who agreed with me.

    So yes, I was able to vote.

    Tangentially related, but I did just check the site out as well and I noticed you can vouch for someone if they dont have the necessary ID. Am I misremembering this or was that removed or at least threatened to have been removed by the previous Conservative government? I could have sworn there was a big to do about vouching previously, but I cant seem to recall the details.

  • vsovevsove ....also yes. Registered User regular
    Or, much shorter -

    CPC cares about O&G from the perspective of the executives and investors.

    NDP cares about O&G from the perspective of the workers and employees.

    The former will give not one solitary shit if a bunch of people are unemployed, so long as the executives and investors are still making money.

    The latter will work to find new opportunities and will invest in re-training and placement opportunities.

    The LPC live somewhere in the middle.

    WATCH THIS SPACE.
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  • JragghenJragghen Registered User regular
    "Why is Canada responsible for policing climate change when we are the 2nd biggest country by land mass and one of the lowest populated, when countries like China, and India pollute with impunity?"

    Not Canadian, and the whole China/India bit is still a hugely open question, but I think it's important to also consider per-capita emissions. I'm a US citizen: a large part of our problems with our emissions is the per-capita combined with our population. California's doing better than most of the country (can't find the article somewhere, but we're already below 1990s emissions with roughly 33% more people, while much of the rest of the country is pulling in the other direction) at reducing, and if the rest of the country did the same we'd be in MUCH better shape, but that's all faffing around the core issue which is: when you've got higher per-capita emissions, it's easier for you to reduce emissions than it is for someone with a lower per-capita emissions.

    So like...we've got ZERO shade to cast from my country - but Canada's per-capita is almost as high as ours (wikipedia only has until 2014, I thought I saw something that in recent years Canada might be higher than us now?). The average person in Canada and the United States emits 2x as much as someone in China, 3x as much as someone in Spain. Almost 10x as much as someone in India. Now, a lot of that is industrial, etc, etc, but the end point is this: yes, we can point to China, but all things being equal, China will ALWAYS have more emissions than both of us COMBINED, because there's just that much larger a population. That still doesn't excuse us for emitting twice as much on a per-person basis.

    It also means we should be giving the middle east TONS more shit than we currently do, instead of awarding them the World Cup, but that's a whole separate argument.

    Rear Admiral ChocoCanadianWolverine
  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    I take offence to this.
    "A lot of the rest of your post is whataboutism and special pleading with some mild nationalism/racist flavouring"

    There was and is no "racist flavouring" and I don't want a separate country, or anything of the sort. There was no pleading either, I legitimately wanted to know the perspective of other Canadians, not media or social media posts but actual people, to expand my prospective and don't appreciate you spinning it .

    This is literally why I rarely talk about politics some one always wrecks the discourse by acting like you just did.

    The average Canadian has a carbon footprint more than twice the size of the average Chinese citizen. So why bring up China’s pollution level? (Special pleading/whataboutism) Why bring up China and India instead of the USA when the USA produces way more pollution than Canada and has an even higher average footprint (mild racism).

    Nationalism doesn’t mean that you want a separate country.

    I highly recommend informing yourself on issues you claim to care deeply about.

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  • Descendant XDescendant X Hank Facepunch Registered User regular
    edited October 21
    I take offence to this.
    "A lot of the rest of your post is whataboutism and special pleading with some mild nationalism/racist flavouring"

    There was and is no "racist flavouring" and I don't want a separate country, or anything of the sort. There was no pleading either, I legitimately wanted to know the perspective of other Canadians, not media or social media posts but actual people, to expand my prospective and don't appreciate you spinning it .

    This is literally why I rarely talk about politics some one always wrecks the discourse by acting like you just did.

    The average Canadian has a carbon footprint more than twice the size of the average Chinese citizen. So why bring up China’s pollution level? (Special pleading/whataboutism) Why bring up China and India instead of the USA when the USA produces way more pollution than Canada and has an even higher average footprint (mild racism).

    Nationalism doesn’t mean that you want a separate country.

    I highly recommend informing yourself on issues you claim to care deeply about.

    I’m not trying to answer for Felonious Prime here, but India and China are frequently brought up as climate villains in this sort of discussion, at least in my experience. I mean, you can’t tell me that you look at those pictures of smoggy air in Beijing and don’t think there’s a massive pollution problem in China.

    It is whataboutism, but it’s not racism inasmuch as nobody is pointing at those countries and saying that they pollute more because of their race.

    Descendant X on
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  • AegisAegis Not Quite TorontoRegistered User regular
    quovadis13 wrote: »
    Tangentially related, but I did just check the site out as well and I noticed you can vouch for someone if they dont have the necessary ID. Am I misremembering this or was that removed or at least threatened to have been removed by the previous Conservative government? I could have sworn there was a big to do about vouching previously, but I cant seem to recall the details.

    In 2014, Conservatives enacted the Fair Elections Act that removed Vouching as an option.

    In December of 2018, the Trudeau Government finally passed the Elections Modernization Act which repealed many aspects of the Fair Elections Act, including reinstating vouching as an option.

    We'll see how long this blog lasts
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  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    Disco11 wrote: »
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    shaw has no idea why my TV is broken

    sigh

    I believe CBC has a live youtube stream of the coverage.

    well that's good because after a 2 hour call with shaw they've had to escalate and it's gonna be 48 hours

    i'm incredibly annoyed

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  • vsovevsove ....also yes. Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    Disco11 wrote: »
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    shaw has no idea why my TV is broken

    sigh

    I believe CBC has a live youtube stream of the coverage.

    well that's good because after a 2 hour call with shaw they've had to escalate and it's gonna be 48 hours

    i'm incredibly annoyed

    Treat this as the gift it is. God does not want you to watch live results, why reject that blessing?

    WATCH THIS SPACE.
    mysticjuicerGnome-InterruptusCanadianWolverine
  • SteelhawkSteelhawk Registered User regular
    Aegis wrote: »
    Al_wat wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    This has now been the second federal election in a row in which I have had poll workers not accept my voter information card + passport as valid ID (on account of the passport not having my address on it).

    I specifically looked up Elections Canada regulations on Voter ID Requirements before going today, and then physically pointed out the spot on the pamplet the poll workers had with them, that indicated "voter information card" as an accepted form of ID satisfying the address requirement.

    did they let you vote in the end?

    They called over the (I presume) actual Elections Canada official who agreed with me.

    So yes, I was able to vote.

    I feel like that's an honest second look though. They probably tell the volunteers to check ID with something that confirms both name and address. Drivers licsence and Health card being the most common and most effective. Your passport indeed does not have an address.

    I think its fair that an inexperienced volunteer would need to get confirmation from "management" the first time that happens today.

  • djmitchelladjmitchella Registered User regular
    My wife has already made it along to vote today, and had an interesting time of it:
    Voted, but it was a bit dramatic! My name had already been crossed off the list for some reason. So before I was permitted to vote, I had to fill in a special form and sign (AND READ ALOUD) a declaration that I wasn't trying to commit voter fraud. I wasn't! I have no idea why I'd been crossed off.

  • ArcticLancerArcticLancer Best served chilled. Registered User regular
    edited October 21
    Steelhawk wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Al_wat wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    This has now been the second federal election in a row in which I have had poll workers not accept my voter information card + passport as valid ID (on account of the passport not having my address on it).

    I specifically looked up Elections Canada regulations on Voter ID Requirements before going today, and then physically pointed out the spot on the pamplet the poll workers had with them, that indicated "voter information card" as an accepted form of ID satisfying the address requirement.

    did they let you vote in the end?

    They called over the (I presume) actual Elections Canada official who agreed with me.

    So yes, I was able to vote.

    I feel like that's an honest second look though. They probably tell the volunteers to check ID with something that confirms both name and address. Drivers licsence and Health card being the most common and most effective. Your passport indeed does not have an address.

    I think its fair that an inexperienced volunteer would need to get confirmation from "management" the first time that happens today.

    I'm actually reasonably sure that an exact remark my partner made when they came home from the training day was that they learned "A passport isn't valid ID because it doesn't have an address on it", so without a good bit more context they might actually be teaching this incorrectly. I'll ask her when she gets home tonight, mostly as a curiosity.

    ArcticLancer on
  • ArcticLancerArcticLancer Best served chilled. Registered User regular
    I'll try to hold out as long as I can before checking, so that I don't stress myself out too much with inconclusive early results.
    Which means I'll probably check by 8:05 pm Atlantic time.
    My partner is working the polls today, so she'll be out until late-o'clock. Want to grab a beer? XD

    That's not a bad idea.

    I'm honestly like 50/50 on this. Had a long day at work and am only just now eating, but I live like 3 blocks from Good Robot so it wouldn't be too hard to twist my arm if you were actually interested. ;P

  • mysticjuicermysticjuicer [he/him] I'm a muscle wizard and I cast P U N C HRegistered User regular
    Voted. Staying away from the election results updates for the rest of the night. Praying for the best, hoping against the worst.

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  • TubularLuggageTubularLuggage Registered User regular
    I'll try to hold out as long as I can before checking, so that I don't stress myself out too much with inconclusive early results.
    Which means I'll probably check by 8:05 pm Atlantic time.
    My partner is working the polls today, so she'll be out until late-o'clock. Want to grab a beer? XD

    That's not a bad idea.

    I'm honestly like 50/50 on this. Had a long day at work and am only just now eating, but I live like 3 blocks from Good Robot so it wouldn't be too hard to twist my arm if you were actually interested. ;P

    It turns out I have to help my brother with something this evening anyway, so raincheck.
    Good luck to your partner with that. Having done that work myself in the past, it's a long day, but it can be very rewarding.

    ArcticLancer
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