If you immediately know the [Stargate] is fire, then the meal was cooked a long time ago

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  • The GeekThe Geek Oh-Two Crew, Omeganaut Registered User, ClubPA regular
    Also also, I found this gate dialing flash program thingy on the interwubs many years ago and took a video of it because it was pointless but fun. I don't have it any more, but I suppose with some googling I could find it again.

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  • EtiowsaEtiowsa Registered User regular
    SimBen wrote: »
    Did they ever write a book or something to resolve Universe?

    If you don't remember, that series ended with everyone except Eli frozen in cryosleep and Eli resigned to living the rest of his life alone on the ship with no prospect of rescue.

    I'm pretty sure it was a few years, not a lifetime. The problem was that there wasn't enough life support to last the entire trip between galaxies and if he didn't fix the problem he'd die.

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  • The GeekThe Geek Oh-Two Crew, Omeganaut Registered User, ClubPA regular
    @Mysst get in here

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  • SimBenSimBen Registered User regular
    see317 wrote: »
    SimBen wrote: »
    Uriel wrote: »
    Wasn't a lot of sg1 shot in Canada or am I imagining things

    All in Vancouver, which is why every planet is a pacific redwood forest planet and the desert planets look suspiciously damp.

    In retrospect, it's a liiiiittle problematic that the Norse gods turn out to be good guys and all the mediterranean gods are evil, huh

    (then again at the end of the series the bad guys are Extremely The Catholic Church so, give and take)

    Maybe the Ancients just preferred pacific redwood forest planets and damp deserts?
    Can hardly fault them for that.

    Could even assume that the only reason that the desert planet in the movie had a gate was because it possessed a rare natural resource that the Ancients required for their technology, unknowingly setting events in motion that would lead to an oppressive theocracy in the future.

    I mean yeah, Abydos is literally a Naquadah mine. Abydos also looks a lot damper in the series than it did in the movie. :P

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  • SimBenSimBen Registered User regular
    klemming wrote: »
    Assumes facts not in evidence. The replicators were already unstoppable and making their way across one galaxy, and coming to this one was only a matter of time. Anubis was out there and had the knowledge he needed already, so galactic domination was happening one way or another.

    Sure, Earth escalates things because they don't know what they're getting into, or because the urgent short-term solution creates a bigger problem down the line. But the problems were there already, and if they hadn't come along, they'd have been no less screwed.

    I'm pretty sure Thor at one point says black on white "we thought we had time to prepare and y'all humans just precipitated everything".

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  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    SimBen wrote: »
    klemming wrote: »
    Assumes facts not in evidence. The replicators were already unstoppable and making their way across one galaxy, and coming to this one was only a matter of time. Anubis was out there and had the knowledge he needed already, so galactic domination was happening one way or another.

    Sure, Earth escalates things because they don't know what they're getting into, or because the urgent short-term solution creates a bigger problem down the line. But the problems were there already, and if they hadn't come along, they'd have been no less screwed.

    I'm pretty sure Thor at one point says black on white "we thought we had time to prepare and y'all humans just precipitated everything".

    In which case? Because the replicators were about to eat their home planet at the start of season 4, if not for the dumb humans. And that was the first they'd heard about them, so that couldn't be caused by them.

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  • The GeekThe Geek Oh-Two Crew, Omeganaut Registered User, ClubPA regular
    It was kinda hilarious how the Asgard were all, "oh well dang, we never thought of guns."

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  • The GeekThe Geek Oh-Two Crew, Omeganaut Registered User, ClubPA regular
    The Replicators are basically what you get if you cross The Borg with Tribbles

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  • MvrckMvrck Registered User regular
    klemming wrote: »
    SimBen wrote: »
    klemming wrote: »
    Assumes facts not in evidence. The replicators were already unstoppable and making their way across one galaxy, and coming to this one was only a matter of time. Anubis was out there and had the knowledge he needed already, so galactic domination was happening one way or another.

    Sure, Earth escalates things because they don't know what they're getting into, or because the urgent short-term solution creates a bigger problem down the line. But the problems were there already, and if they hadn't come along, they'd have been no less screwed.

    I'm pretty sure Thor at one point says black on white "we thought we had time to prepare and y'all humans just precipitated everything".

    In which case? Because the replicators were about to eat their home planet at the start of season 4, if not for the dumb humans. And that was the first they'd heard about them, so that couldn't be caused by them.

    But key there is that the Replicators did not have a society or the concept of hate/vengeance until Humans got involved. There was a small but decent chance that peaceful dialogue could have been established, but we burned that bridge and the result was an extra-galactic threat becoming an intergalactic one. SG-1 broke their promise to Fifth and his resulting rampage was a direct result of that.

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  • SimBenSimBen Registered User regular
    klemming wrote: »
    SimBen wrote: »
    klemming wrote: »
    Assumes facts not in evidence. The replicators were already unstoppable and making their way across one galaxy, and coming to this one was only a matter of time. Anubis was out there and had the knowledge he needed already, so galactic domination was happening one way or another.

    Sure, Earth escalates things because they don't know what they're getting into, or because the urgent short-term solution creates a bigger problem down the line. But the problems were there already, and if they hadn't come along, they'd have been no less screwed.

    I'm pretty sure Thor at one point says black on white "we thought we had time to prepare and y'all humans just precipitated everything".

    In which case? Because the replicators were about to eat their home planet at the start of season 4, if not for the dumb humans. And that was the first they'd heard about them, so that couldn't be caused by them.

    I think it was specifically in reference to the Goa'uld.

    The Asgard didn't think they'd be a concern for a long time but human interference actually caused the Goa'uld to escalate much faster than the Asgard anticipated and eventually to become a threat to them too.

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  • SimBenSimBen Registered User regular
    There's a lot to be said of Asgard arrogance that not only did they extremely underestimate how much trouble the Replicators would be, they were also perfectly content to just let generations of humans and Jaffa be enslaved and killed in service to the Goa'uld until they thought they had shoes big enough to challenge them.

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  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    Universe was so dumb. They ruin the premise instantly by having those stupid rocks that let them talk to Earth whenever they want to.

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  • SimBenSimBen Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    Universe was so dumb. They ruin the premise instantly by having those stupid rocks that let them talk to Earth whenever they want to.

    Nah, the fact that they're not TOTALLY stranded really opens up the storytelling possibilities. Universe could have easily been the best Stargate show if they'd had more seasons to keep developing. It was getting REALLY good in the second half of season 2.

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  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    Also all the stupid romance drama garbage.

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  • SleepSleep Registered User regular
    Mvrck wrote: »
    klemming wrote: »
    SimBen wrote: »
    klemming wrote: »
    Assumes facts not in evidence. The replicators were already unstoppable and making their way across one galaxy, and coming to this one was only a matter of time. Anubis was out there and had the knowledge he needed already, so galactic domination was happening one way or another.

    Sure, Earth escalates things because they don't know what they're getting into, or because the urgent short-term solution creates a bigger problem down the line. But the problems were there already, and if they hadn't come along, they'd have been no less screwed.

    I'm pretty sure Thor at one point says black on white "we thought we had time to prepare and y'all humans just precipitated everything".

    In which case? Because the replicators were about to eat their home planet at the start of season 4, if not for the dumb humans. And that was the first they'd heard about them, so that couldn't be caused by them.

    But key there is that the Replicators did not have a society or the concept of hate/vengeance until Humans got involved. There was a small but decent chance that peaceful dialogue could have been established, but we burned that bridge and the result was an extra-galactic threat becoming an intergalactic one. SG-1 broke their promise to Fifth and his resulting rampage was a direct result of that.

    5th only existed because the asgard gave the replicators a time dialation device that gave them thousands of years to perfect themselves. SG-1s only prior interaction with such beings was reese and that didn't go so well. I think the choice on 5th made sense in the moment. Him going full psycho afterwards pretty much confirms, he was never gonna totally "get" humanity and risking keeping him around would have been the same risk as keeping reese alive. It's an emotionally incompetent being that may and totally can just decide to destroy the planet it is on at a whim if it isn't quite groking what's going on around it or is made a little upset. Like yeah they double cross 5th, but bringing 5th out of there would have been an incalculable risk to multiple galaxies.

  • GONG-00GONG-00 Registered User regular
    The Geek wrote: »
    It was kinda hilarious how the Asgard were all, "oh well dang, we never thought of guns."

    In their defense, it was more of a "our pistols cannot punch holes in their bulletproof vests. We did not realize a simple knife could cut through the kevlar" situation.

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  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    edited January 6
    Peaceful dialogue is a bit much to assume, given their stated goal was 'torture you for information then consume your entire galaxy'. Betraying Fifth totally came back to bite them, but again; short term solution was needed, so they'll worry about the future after making sure there is one.

    You can nitpick the choices they make (and that's what the IOA was there for), but it's always with 20/20 hindsight. In the moment, you can understand the decisions they make as being the best/only practical solution to the problem in front of them. It's only when the top bosses get involved that they make the really dumb calls, generally with things like preemptive strikes that ensure a retaliation they're not ready for.

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  • SimBenSimBen Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    Also all the stupid romance drama garbage.

    Yes okay that part sucks (though it did give us one of the earlier unambiguous queer pairings in mainstream sci-fi).

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  • GnizmoGnizmo Registered User regular
    The allies of Earth make a lot of noise about how terrible humans are, but honestly I just don't see it. Admittedly at this point I have watched and rewatched the series enough that I could be transposing mental facts all over the place. That said, I can't think of a single ally of Earth that does any heavy lifting for them when they need it the most.

    The Tokra are probably the worst of the bunch. For all their whining about knocking of system lords being a problem they sure don't seem concerned about what happens to the humans and Jaffa in the mean time. A Tokra loses their shit over 2 dead operatives who were killed when SG-1 decided not to let Apophis wipe them off the map. They were all too happy to watch billion of humans die in the name of their slow ass plan. This says nothing of the multiple times they betrayed, lied to, and experimented on members of the SGC AFTER repeatedly having their lives saved repeatedly by SG-1 and others. Honestly I don't know they are that different from the Goa'uld based on what is seen on screen. This especially jumps to my head after Selmak is kicked out because the humans of Earth aren't as easy to control.

    The Asgard are more than happy to agree that humans primary purpose is to be slaves and host of the Goa'uld. It's right there in the peace treaty! I get they couldn't come deal with the problem, but you don't get to complain when someone else feels like stepping up. To their credit they ultimately seem to realize Earth is doing what needs to be done, and deserves a spot at the universal cool kids club.

    The Nox are awesome and I love them. I wish they were around more.

    Really the complaint that the system lords are getting more violent was a consequence of Earth not rolling over, and other races fucking up. Apophis is first deposed because he attacks Earth and they don't just die for him like the rest of the major galactic powers seem to want at the time. Apophis comes back because the Tokra fucked up. He gets to be a super power because they fucked up AGAIN. Both times they drag SG-1 along for the ride and pin the blame for their shitty plan backfiring on them.

    They knock off Apophis at the request of the Tokra as well. Anubis rises to power in that vacuum cause the Tokra fucked up a third time and the Ancients decided to fuck over all life in the Galaxy to teach one ascended being a lesson. Anubis gets a huge tech advantage when the Asgard fuck up leading to more consolidation of power until the humans manage to crush his fleet. Asgardians fuck up making the replicator problem way worse and SG-1 does not quite stick the landing on solving that problem on their first try. They then take out the replicators, and Anubis once and for all by getting everyone to focus on the problem at hand for 5 minutes.

    The Ori was just the Ancients unfinished business coming back to bite the universe in the ass AGAIN. Admittedly by the time of the series it had gotten so big that no one could manage it so I don't think there is a ton we can blame on individual galactic powers. Everyone did their best and sucked.

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  • ToxTox I kill threads Punch DimensionRegistered User regular
    The Geek wrote: »
    Also, SG-1 has one of the best Time Loop episodes of all time.

    Not only is Window of Opportunity fucking amazing, but anytime SG-1 does time travel, the results are very, very entertaining.

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  • SimBenSimBen Registered User regular
    This reminds me, Carmen Argenziano, who played Jacob Carter/Selmak, passed away just a couple days ago...

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  • SimBenSimBen Registered User regular
    You’d think the Lucian Alliance would try to be nicer to Earth considering they created the power vacuum that facilitated their rise in under a decade AND they essentially rose up from slavery thanks to them AND they don’t have the excuse of having been around for millennia and seeing humans as basically livestock (being HUMANS THEMSELVES) that the rest of the galaxy has.

    Like if it made any sense they’d try to have a seat at the table in early season 9 to make a Federation with Earth, the Jaffa and the Tok’ra.

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  • SleepSleep Registered User regular
    SimBen wrote: »
    You’d think the Lucian Alliance would try to be nicer to Earth considering they created the power vacuum that facilitated their rise in under a decade AND they essentially rose up from slavery thanks to them AND they don’t have the excuse of having been around for millennia and seeing humans as basically livestock (being HUMANS THEMSELVES) that the rest of the galaxy has.

    Like if it made any sense they’d try to have a seat at the table in early season 9 to make a Federation with Earth, the Jaffa and the Tok’ra.

    Their leadership was mostly dumb and cruel. Like that was the lucien alliance biggest problem. They allowed rulership through fear rather than rulership via methodology and results. They didn't necessarily put the smartest criminals in charge just the most ruthless.

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  • The GeekThe Geek Oh-Two Crew, Omeganaut Registered User, ClubPA regular
    I maintain that Vala was a really, really poor fit for the show as part of the later main cast.

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  • GnizmoGnizmo Registered User regular
    The Geek wrote: »
    I maintain that Vala was a really, really poor fit for the show as part of the later main cast.

    I loved her as a part of the cast, but I do see what you mean. I would have vastly preferred having her join the team at the start of season 9 and then have Cam come in never. Maybe as a guest star.

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  • timspork's ghosttimspork's ghost Master Librarian and Ghostbuster Registered User regular
    edited October 2019
    I refuse that idea because it softened the blow of Farscape being canceled by giving me more Ben Browder/Claudia Black on screen.

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  • Blake TBlake T Registered User regular
    This just reminded me that this series continued the great nineties of naming someone kawolski and having them killed off quickly.

  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    How did we make it to page 2 without this being posted?


    I love the point they make that it's not flashy, and it's not super advanced, but kinetic energy is still energy and explosions are still explosions, and there's a lot you can do with that.

    I like their growth over the whole series. They encounter a new enemy, they get their ass kicked and barely survive, but they learn what works and they build on it.
    Earth going from scrappy underdog to major galactic power in a decade is pretty good going.

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  • SimBenSimBen Registered User regular
    A colleague came in today dressed as an SGC team member and she has a zat and I love it.

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  • timspork's ghosttimspork's ghost Master Librarian and Ghostbuster Registered User regular
    edited October 2019
    Blake T wrote: »
    This just reminded me that this series continued the great nineties of naming someone kawolski and having them killed off quickly.

    Point of order. Kawolski was one of the only other characters to cross over from the movie! Kill him was supposed to serve as showing the seriousness of the thing since he was one of the few survivors from team in the movie.

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  • SimBenSimBen Registered User regular
    Blake T wrote: »
    This just reminded me that this series continued the great nineties of naming someone kawolski and having them killed off quickly.

    Point of order. Kawolski was one of the only other characters to cross over from the movie! Kill him was supposed to serve as showing the seriousness of the thing since he was one of the few survivors from team in the movie.

    The part that fucks me up is they chose a French Stewart-looking guy to play Kawalsky in the series but French Stewart was Ferretti in the movie and the series Ferretti looks more like movie Kawalsky.

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  • The GeekThe Geek Oh-Two Crew, Omeganaut Registered User, ClubPA regular
    The Stargate movie was the only thing I'd ever seen James Spader in until I watched the first couple seasons of that Blacklist show and the difference was incredibly jarring.

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  • KamiroKamiro Registered User regular
    The Geek wrote: »
    The Stargate movie was the only thing I'd ever seen James Spader in until I watched the first couple seasons of that Blacklist show and the difference was incredibly jarring.

    I had watched the Stargate movie when it came out and then saw Blacklist when it first aired. Then I rewatched Stargate randomly and was like holy shit that's James Spader! It was bizarre.

  • SoggybiscuitSoggybiscuit At the edge of spacetime lies a path with no end.Registered User regular
    Norgoth wrote: »
    There’s a book series I read, Expeditionary Force by Craig Alanson, which, whilst is a solidly 6-7/10 series is very SG-1 in its tone and that’s something I very much miss in Sci-if currently. Just you know, a sense of fun.

    Yeah, I found these on audible and was just listening while doing housework/lawn work/etc.

    Book 1 gets very interesting about 1/2 though. After that, I was addicted. Eagerly awaiting the audio book for book 8 which comes out next week I think.
    Note that if you have a favorite voice actor, and you enjoyed The Martian on audiobook, these have the same voice actor.

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  • expendableexpendable Silly Goose Registered User regular
    First off:



    I think the Nox summed up the relationship of Earth with the various allies pretty well "The very young do not always do as they're told." Bunch of young upstarts upsetting all the legal treaties and such. I enjoyed the aspect of "We'd like to help you, but legally we make things a lot worse if we break these treaties we have." from the Asgard and Nox. Like, the Nox could have done a lot more, but they still had their beliefs and principals about the right way to go about things, and there's a struggle to find ways to help; ie: I can HIDE the ion cannon, but not FIRE it.

    In the later seasons I remember thinking that the episodes centered around the politics of the Free J'affa Nation were the worst. It's been a number of years though, so maybe I see it differently.

    Other good episodes I haven't seen mentioned yet: S5 had Proving Ground, which was a nice combination of the Star Trek:TNG episode Lower Decks and DS9s Whispers.

    S6 had The Other Guys.

    SG-1 had a LOT of clipshows though. They made fun of this, and pretty much everything else, a little bit in 200.

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  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    I wish they'd had more discussions with the Nox.
    Yeah, fighting even to defend yourself or others is bad, I get it. How does that work out for you if you can't raise your dead and hide your incredibly advanced cities?

    I could see the Ori coming along and not being impressed.

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  • timspork's ghosttimspork's ghost Master Librarian and Ghostbuster Registered User regular
    I always appreciated the running gag of "Check out this sick ass starship we just built!" Ship is immediately destroyed somehow.

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  • expendableexpendable Silly Goose Registered User regular
    klemming wrote: »
    I wish they'd had more discussions with the Nox.
    Yeah, fighting even to defend yourself or others is bad, I get it. How does that work out for you if you can't raise your dead and hide your incredibly advanced cities?

    I could see the Ori coming along and not being impressed.

    The Nox philosophies are part of what enabled them to develop those skills. Sharing that tech and knowledge with less advanced, or "younger", races who don't share those values is dangerous and contributes to the things they abhor. It's why they buried their Stargate, and why they agreed to help the Tollan. Similar values: the Tollan were willing to die instead of give technology to Earth that they weren't ready for.

    The Asgard behaved similarly for the most part. I hadn't realized before this moment that a common theme of the show was Earth being on the shitty end of the Prime Directive.

    I think the Nox would have listened and politely debated the initial Ori Priors if they were somehow discovered, but when pressed for not converting, would have simply disappeared. The Ori had no use for empty planets.

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    So the servers suddenly decide to cramp up during the last six percent.
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  • SimBenSimBen Registered User regular
    expendable wrote: »
    First off:



    I think the Nox summed up the relationship of Earth with the various allies pretty well "The very young do not always do as they're told." Bunch of young upstarts upsetting all the legal treaties and such. I enjoyed the aspect of "We'd like to help you, but legally we make things a lot worse if we break these treaties we have." from the Asgard and Nox. Like, the Nox could have done a lot more, but they still had their beliefs and principals about the right way to go about things, and there's a struggle to find ways to help; ie: I can HIDE the ion cannon, but not FIRE it.

    In the later seasons I remember thinking that the episodes centered around the politics of the Free J'affa Nation were the worst. It's been a number of years though, so maybe I see it differently.

    Other good episodes I haven't seen mentioned yet: S5 had Proving Ground, which was a nice combination of the Star Trek:TNG episode Lower Decks and DS9s Whispers.

    S6 had The Other Guys.

    SG-1 had a LOT of clipshows though. They made fun of this, and pretty much everything else, a little bit in 200.

    The Jaffa politics arc seemed like it was gesturing towards being a commentary on US foreign policy but it was muddled.

    It served more to turn the Jaffa into an entire race of Worfs to get taken over by the Ori to show how serious a threat they were.

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