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[Half-Life] Black Mesa: Definitive Edition Out Now!

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Posts

  • Trajan45Trajan45 Registered User regular
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    SyphonBlue wrote: »
    None of these games were even made FOR VR. They were traditional games that had VR added on to them. I can't think of a single AAA made-for VR game.

    You know how long it takes to make an AAA game, right? You're aware they don't bang out a Witcher or Assassin's Creed in two years? VR has been out for literally three years. If a gigantic dev started a full AAA game in early 2017, they'd literally only just now maybe be done. Probably not, though.

    So all of this garbage being spouted by you, @cloudeagle @Trajan45, etc, is just that; garbage.

    AAA game devs haven't given up on VR, they haven't STARTED in VR yet. Because AAA games take a longass time to make! HL:Alyx has been in development since 2017!

    It's like you believe that all the AAA devs went hard into VR, got nowhere, and gave up! Based on what?

    Not sure what this is in reference to? What garbage? That I asked what AAA games are out? It was just a question man, might need to chill a bit.

    AAA games take around 5 years to make. You're right, most studios wouldn't have something ready by now. However we always see trailers and demos of upcoming games. Some we know about from the beginning like the next Dragon Age. My understanding is HL:Alyx is going to be the first out and is the only one we've heard anything about. Even something like Microsoft Flight Simulator is adding it in later. At this point, we've not seen anything from any studio's that tells us they are investing AAA resources into a VR game.

    I think the hope most folks who are excited for VR have is that this game will do well and prompt other companies to take a harder look.

    Origin ID\ Steam ID: Warder45
  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    edited November 2019
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    VR is not a grand any more than smartphones are a grand. You're literally outright repeating a lie, over and over and over.

    The Rift S has 98% of the function of the Index and costs a third.

    They aren't lying, they are in a different market paying a different premium in a currency that is valued differently with an entirely different set of opportunity cost benefit ratios.

    Meanwhile, I am over here waiting for Games to go on 70-90% sales on Steam in a cramped apartment on a PC rig that was considered a "potato" when I got it years ago where the thing to take the most of my income each month is rent, food, and utilities. VR is abundantly not anywhere even in the price point of consideration for an entertainment hobby in my remote location, I get way more value with my daughter just by watching someone else stream games over Twitch or Youtube while we comment away together.

    Punishing the super powered Brain Slugs for killing Alyx's dad is just not in the cards for this British Columbian resident. I'll happily watch the people who stream this though who can afford it, looking forward to all the VR antics.

    Does seem odd that Valve thinks this couldn't be done with anything other than VR though, that whole example with the door partially open and tossing a grenade in and then slamming the door ... could have sworn we've already been doing things very similar or exactly like that for years in the ArmA and Rainbow Seige series? Especially in ArmA 3, the ways in which the player got to change their stance and interact with their enviroment was easily accomplished with KBAM?

    hi5 other BC friend!

    but yes their excuse for why this had to be VR and that being the specific example is insane. i'm sure it's super super cool in VR, but I'm also sure they could design a traditional FPS around this same idea in 2 years or whatever once this is done and they've sold their indexes.

    like there is no fucking way this is true:
    z2cz5w5d8687.png

    I get it, they want to move these things, it just sucks for me!

    Hardtarget on
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    CanadianWolverine
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited November 2019
    The game trailer shows usage of pretty accurate hand controllers, and something like room scale? I bet you can play it without those, but it's not as good.

    Since I really, really loved HL, I'd love to play its successor the way it's meant to be played. But that way is the valve index.

    Every current VR headset can do those things. The Rift S, along with WMR headsets, all have hand controls, and roomscale tracking.

    The unique selling points of the Index is a higher refresh rate (120hz vs 80hz), a slightly larger field of view, and five finger tracking instead of three finger tracking. All of those things are advantages but not in any way that would be conceivably core to gameplay.

    This isn't 2016 where you had the Rift doing seated VR and the Vive uniquely doing room scale.

    I really don't understand why you, someone who clearly does not follow, understand, or care about VR, is trying to dictate to me, someone who DOES follow, understand, and care about VR, what does and doesn't require the Index to be played.

    Dhalphir on
    Elvenshae
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    Normally I like to be around when people play VR at my place so I can be sure to "babysit" them and prevent them from hurting themselves (my area is a little smaller than I would like it to be). During this time I can joke with them and watch what they are doing. It's definitely not a anti-social experience unless you want it to be.

    Zilla360OneAngryPossumApogeeElvenshae
  • SniperGuySniperGuy SniperGuyGaming Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    \
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    lol ok man you guys really zero in

    1 - I can't play VR because i would throw up in any VR situation
    2 - whether you guys think it's anti-social or not it's not a thing I want to be doing with my family at this point and I will never have a friend over to play vr games, it's already hard enough to have somebody over and just play NHL or something
    3 - valve's preferred solution costs 1300, a rift s costs 550, a quest costs 550, a Vive Cosmos costs 939, a Vive Pro Kit costs 2,150. so ya I think me throwing out a "grand" is decent shorthand

    So, the reason I'm sad is cause I can't play this cool new half-life story game.

    It certainly sucks you get VR sickness. I don't know your situation but I do know that most people have to spend a bit of time in VR to get their "VR Legs" as it were, and once they do sickness happens a lot less often or not at all. I had queasy moments at first but now am absolutely fine after a minute or two of the headset on.

    People are saying "valve's preferred solution" and sure, that's the luxury idea. But a 2080TI is the luxury idea for most PC games and that's a 1200 dollar video card.

    Also for the social thing, people who aren't in the headset can see what you're doing on screen of whatever device is hooked up, in case that wasn't clear. They can also hear you and you can hear them. I've had some very fun social times playing VR with my wife and a friend. I've streamed VR games before, it works pretty well. (Except for some people having trouble watching since watching the head movement can be weird. It works great for beat saber though.)

    The Index is supposedly quite good, but I can't imagine that it really does all that much that the Vive won't be able to give me a pretty similar experience. The Windows Mixed Reality headsets are often touted as better than a vive and work with that stuff too so I imagine it's sort of like playing on high instead of ultra.

    If VR is totally not possible for you, I get it, and it sucks. But there's a lot of "people shouldn't make VR games" sentiment in this thread that is kind of baffling. Lots of people can and do enjoy VR stuff. Over time it's definitely going to get more popular, and cheaper. This is a good thing! The more cool games and more ways to play, the better.

    I might try to get some of the index controllers before this launches. After all, apparently I'll get this game for free with them so that's a nice 60 dollar discount. But I'm not expecting to have a terrible inferior experience with the vive.

    SniperGuy on
    Twitch Streaming basically all week
    SniperGuyGaming on PSN / SniperGuy710 on Xbone Live
    DhalphirElvenshae
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    @Hardtarget I was going to post the Steam top sellers but held off because I agree, it seems a bit unbelievable, and certainly Valve has every reason to fudge the numbers and it's not like anyone has any oversight on their data.

    If true, it certainly bodes well.

  • BloodySlothBloodySloth Registered User regular
    I could be wrong, but I think I remember reading that "top selling" on Steam is by money the product is bringing in, and not units. It's still a really strong sign for Valve's Index, but its ranking on the top selling board would make more sense if that were the case.

    rahkeesh2000TychoCelchuuu
  • Mr_GrinchMr_Grinch Registered User regular
    The game trailer shows usage of pretty accurate hand controllers, and something like room scale? I bet you can play it without those, but it's not as good.

    Since I really, really loved HL, I'd love to play its successor the way it's meant to be played. But that way is the valve index.

    I posted it on the other page, but this is from a dev:
    We’ve really tried to make the best use of Index Controllers for those who have them, while also ensuring that those who don’t still have a great experience with Half-Life: Alyx. There’s a small set of things that Index Controllers can do that other controllers can’t do at all, and they’re fun but not required – like being able to crush a can that you’re holding in your hand. But there’s a larger set of things that work on any tracked controllers, yet end up being better on Index Controllers because we were developing them in concert with the game. The most obvious example is the core interaction players have with objects in Half-Life: Alyx – picking up, holding, dropping, throwing, and manipulating. Players perform these basic actions many times throughout the game, and over our years of playtesting, we’ve found that combining the player’s trigger usage with their tracked finger locations was the most successful method of supporting their intentions. So while you can perform most actions with just a trigger or a button, we just think it feels more natural with the way the Index Controllers operate. Finally, the ability for the player to relax their hands without dropping their controller turned out to be a significant factor in our Half-Life: Alyx playtests. As our Index Controller prototypes started replacing our older controllers in playtests, we started seeing players able to play for longer and longer stretches of time, because they weren’t required to hold onto a real-world object the entire time. This wasn’t really something we saw as a problem in our early days of VR development, but now that VR games are becoming longer and more fully featured, we think it’s becoming more important.

    It's honestly fairly minor stuff. I've a fair bit of VR gaming under my belt there and nothing in that trailer appeared room scale or something that couldn't be done with the Rift controllers without any impact on immersion. You could do pretty much everything there seated (but standing would be better). There's a difference between room-scale and standing. The way they describe picking up items above sounds as though, even with the Index, you still need to pull the trigger.

    The website shows the different methods of play. Seating, standing, different methods of locomotion. It looks extremely well thought out. I'll probably go for standing, it's how I played Arizona Sunshine.

    It's probably akin to nvidia Hairworks, nice if you can run it but makes very very little difference. But we'll see when it releases.

    Steam: Sir_Grinch
    PSN: SirGrinchX
    Oculus Rift: Sir_Grinch
    DhalphirZilla360
  • Trajan45Trajan45 Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    I don't think any one here is saying not to be sad or angry if your life situation doesn't allow you to get a luxury item to play the next Half Life game to come out in over a decade. It's quite the opposite and I think most of us can relate. I mentioned pages back when Crysis came out how bad I wanted to play it. But I had just started my job and didn't have the funds for a video card that could handle it. I was a huge Star Wars fan, consuming the original VHS tapes all the time and reading a ton of EU books, and seeing how Lucas treated the material in the prequels, pissed me off.

    What I don't do is go after folks that liked the prequels. So lets calm down a bit on the VR stuff. The story will be available via YouTube play through's for anyone to enjoy. And Valve wants to use VR to improve gameplay in ways you can't do with a normal controller or keyboard. So this game would never be made for normal consoles.

    The best thing that can happen is that this does well, drives more money into VR which will drop prices and improve the technology. Perhaps it'll also bolster Valves courage to start working on Episode 3 or HL3 outside of VR.

    Trajan45 on
    Origin ID\ Steam ID: Warder45
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    Alright it's time for me to bow out of this thread. I'll likely pop back in when it's closer to release! But I feel like this thread is heading down the path of arguing whether or not VR is worth it for each person for the next 15 pages and I really don't want to contribute to that.

    Trajan45Mr_GrinchZilla360
  • BremenBremen Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    I could be wrong, but I think I remember reading that "top selling" on Steam is by money the product is bringing in, and not units. It's still a really strong sign for Valve's Index, but its ranking on the top selling board would make more sense if that were the case.

    Yeah, and the chart seems reasonable enough to me. Sure, it's easy to go "OMG they're claiming it's outselling Jedi: Fallen Order" but that released a week ago; I suspect most people that wanted to buy it on release bought it on, well, release, so the Index is competing against latecomers and those who were busy a week ago - much more reasonable. Also I know I've seen lots of people say "I like the idea of VR, but I'm waiting on a big title to buy it" and that's probably what we're seeing here.

    Bremen on
  • ForarForar #432 Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    edited November 2019
    How about looking at it from another perspective?

    ~1% of Steam users have a VR headset according to the survey, and maybe 5% of those have an Index.

    Is Valve going to gamble another steaming pile of shit landing in their laps on something that 99% of users don't have, and 99.95% of users don't have the assumed to be best experience with?

    It feels awfully uncharitable for people to just assume that Valve is literally making something that only 0.05% of their existing userbase can even play.

    Oh, and remember, they've giving those users the game free, so 0 purchases from them (though at ~1k US apiece, those users were already 'whales' to begin with).

    According to a cursory Google search, steam has 1 billion accounts, and 90 million active users. I have to assume bots are also inflating those numbers.

    1% of 90 million is 900,000 users with a VR headset of any sort. 5% of those is ~45,000 users with an Index.

    I'm sure the number of Index and VR owners is going up every day, though who knows how fast it is going up in comparison to the total number of Steam users in general.

    So, let's ask ourselves, what is more likely? That Valve, a company that has been through some controversy of late, that is finally putting out a new game in the Half Life franchise for the first time in over 12 years, is catering to ~45,000 users, or perhaps might aim to at least give a close approximation of a good experience to the larger 'closer to 1 million' users pool?

    I'm sure they hope to sell a shitload of Indexes off this announcement, but we're talking years of work and presumably millions of dollars in resources for... less than 0.1% of the userbase?

    Maybe, just maybe, we should wait to see what happens at launch before declaring this an utter betrayal?

    And yes, consider this a giant asterisk, that these numbers are subject to change based on a number of things, including how many dead/fake/bot/banned accounts are in that pool, what counts as active, how many real people actually have a headset (I'm sure it'll go up a bit or two after black friday), etc. I'm simply applying the numbers we have and drawing my own personal conclusions. (edit: oh, and those numbers are half a year old. And they could be 10 times that number if it's 1% of 1 billion+ accounts have a VR headset)

    Forar on
    First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    Trajan45 wrote: »
    I don't think any one here is saying not to be sad or angry if your life situation doesn't allow you to get a luxury item to play the next Half Life game to come out in over a decade. It's quite the opposite and I think most of us can relate. I mentioned pages back when Crysis came out how bad I wanted to play it. But I had just started my job and didn't have the funds for a video card that could handle it. I was a huge Star Wars fan, consuming the original VHS tapes all the time and reading a ton of EU books, and seeing how Lucas treated the material in the prequels, pissed me off.

    What I don't do is go after folks that liked the prequels. So lets calm down a bit on the VR stuff. The story will be available via YouTube play through's for anyone to enjoy. And Valve wants to use VR to improve gameplay in ways you can't do with a normal controller or keyboard. So this game would never be made for normal consoles.

    The best thing that can happen is that this does well, drives more money into VR which will drop prices and improve the technology. Perhaps it'll also bolster Valves courage to start working on Episode 3 or HL3 outside of VR.

    so here is the problem that a lot of people can't fathom, this post is perfect. It's not that I can't afford VR, or that it's a luxury item. I could buy a index tonight and I wouldn't even notice it.

    it's that I DON'T want VR. And i'm sad the next HL game is VR only. that's it!

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    PreacherCanadianWolverineyossarian_lives
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    And the part that those of us into VR are annoyed about is that you can be sad that the next HL game is VR only without making sweeping false generalizations about how dead VR is or how AAA devs have abandoned it

    apologies if you personally didn't make those generalizations, it's hard to keep track of who exactly is making the sweeping statements here

    Elvenshae
  • GarickGarick Registered User regular
    As someone with even an old VR set, I'm hyped as hell a triple AAA game is going to be coming out for VR! It has badly needed more then just indie dev's making games to really bring out it's incredible potential. I don't get the hate from the people that don't have VR, it really just seems like sour grapes.

  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    VR is not a grand any more than smartphones are a grand. You're literally outright repeating a lie, over and over and over.

    The Rift S has 98% of the function of the Index and costs a third.

    They aren't lying, they are in a different market paying a different premium in a currency that is valued differently with an entirely different set of opportunity cost benefit ratios.

    Meanwhile, I am over here waiting for Games to go on 70-90% sales on Steam in a cramped apartment on a PC rig that was considered a "potato" when I got it years ago where the thing to take the most of my income each month is rent, food, and utilities. VR is abundantly not anywhere even in the price point of consideration for an entertainment hobby in my remote location, I get way more value with my daughter just by watching someone else stream games over Twitch or Youtube while we comment away together.

    Punishing the super powered Brain Slugs for killing Alyx's dad is just not in the cards for this British Columbian resident. I'll happily watch the people who stream this though who can afford it, looking forward to all the VR antics.

    Does seem odd that Valve thinks this couldn't be done with anything other than VR though, that whole example with the door partially open and tossing a grenade in and then slamming the door ... could have sworn we've already been doing things very similar or exactly like that for years in the ArmA and Rainbow Seige series? Especially in ArmA 3, the ways in which the player got to change their stance and interact with their enviroment was easily accomplished with KBAM?

    hi5 other BC friend!

    but yes their excuse for why this had to be VR and that being the specific example is insane. i'm sure it's super super cool in VR, but I'm also sure they could design a traditional FPS around this same idea in 2 years or whatever once this is done and they've sold their indexes.

    like there is no fucking way this is true:
    z2cz5w5d8687.png

    I get it, they want to move these things, it just sucks for me!

    Amazon had units of the Index in stock yesterday; today they don't.
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    I'm also kind of surprised people are surprised that the new half life game is VR. Half-life was a huge thing in the world of games and did really innovative stuff. Half-life 2's effect on games are still felt today, that thing was massively influential. I always expected the next half-life game would try to have that sort of massive effect on games again and VR seems like the only space they have to do something like that.

    I think you're getting "unhappy" confused with "surprised." You can still be unhappy over something that you knew was going to happen.
    urahonky wrote: »
    No one's asking anyone to spend $1k on a single game. There are a ton of great VR games out there. Head over to the VR thread and ask around if you want a list of games.

    I mean, those games cost even more money. To someone just looking just to play the latest Half-Life game, that's just increasing the price to justify buying the headset. Over a device they may not even like or be able to use properly.

  • SyngyneSyngyne Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    like there is no fucking way this is true:
    z2cz5w5d8687.png

    I get it, they want to move these things, it just sucks for me!

    I wonder if they're doing it not by number of units sold but by amount of revenue, because it might be possible in that case. They only get 30% of the revenue for games sold, but with the index they're getting 100% of the revenue for something that's the cost equivalent of like 15+ games.

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  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited November 2019
    it's definitely ranked by dollars, but it would be gross sales not net revenue.

    incidentally if Divinity 2 is on sale everyone should go buy that

    Dhalphir on
    Trajan45Apogee
  • rahkeesh2000rahkeesh2000 Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    The alternative is the Switch eshop top sales list getting flooded with 95% discounted games trying to get their name out there. Overall Valve has the better approach here.

    rahkeesh2000 on
  • RoyallyFlushedRoyallyFlushed Registered User regular
    The vitriol towards VR in regards to this game in particular should be the least surprising thing. VR is still very much a niche market at best; so, as I said before, for most people it's like Half Life is throwing a party and you're not invited. When the series has been otherwise completely dead in the darkest of waters for over a decade, you are absolutely inviting caustic behavior against you by making this your big return to glory. A lot of people still had various hopes that the series might breath again one day, and those who would have wanted it as a VR-only revival would be very few indeed.

    On a side note, I really don't buy this whole spiel of "Every HL installment has to be some revolutionary effort to redefine the genre or it's not really HL!" nonsense either. If that was truly the case they should have sucked it up and made the episodes conclude back when episodic content was actually a new concept as opposed to, well, losing the plot. Leaving things undone for so long only to create something new that will reach so few is, at best, insulting to fans who would have loved to buy in on more conventional means (which the previous games all had, by the way - including basic console ports).

    yossarian_livesCanadianWolverine
  • Linespider5Linespider5 ALL HAIL KING KILLMONGER Registered User regular
    Given all the concerns, I just think that Valve is gonna need to support the hell out of HLA. If they can convey an ecosystem the way they did with prior Half Life titles, there’s got to be more going on here, long term.

    autono-wally, erotibot300CanadianWolverinepainfulPleasance
  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    An entire generation has grown up not ever knowing what a “Half-life 2” is.

    I suppose Valve had to do something to keep the brand alive for another generation.

    See you all in 20 years for Half-Life Alyx Episode 2: Barney!

    Axen on
    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
    PreacherpainfulPleasanceElvenshae
  • autono-wally, erotibot300autono-wally, erotibot300 love machine Registered User regular
    Axen wrote: »
    An entire generation has grown up not ever knowing what a “Half-life 2” is.

    I suppose Valve had to do something to keep the brand alive for another generation.

    See you all in 20 years for Half-Life Alyx Episode 2: Barney!

    Case in point, almost no one 22 or younger at work has played it. And that's a tech company.

    kFJhXwE.jpgkFJhXwE.jpg
  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    Fire all those people

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  • autono-wally, erotibot300autono-wally, erotibot300 love machine Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    Fire all those people

    Half life 2 came out when they were 6 years old. That's like a game from the very early 90s for me. It's older for them than doom 2 was for me!

    But I agree with that assertion above. Much like they did with steam, they need to make vr a big market to make it work.

    I hope they can do it

    kFJhXwE.jpgkFJhXwE.jpg
  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    I've been looking to get in to VR since, well, since it has been a thing. However I've never really had a good reason to, but the number of decent reasons to are starting to reach critical mass. Alyx certainly falls in the "decent reason" category for me. We'll see come Black Friday/Cyber Monday what prices look like for the VR options. Though I am leaning more towards and Oculus Rift S over other choices.

    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
  • Linespider5Linespider5 ALL HAIL KING KILLMONGER Registered User regular
    Does Steam have its own VR marketplace? I could imagine a new HL with its own level editing suite could usher in a separate VR storefront. Given how older storefronts become swamped with stuff that’s hard to stand out in, and how newer ones (like the Switch) become havens for new titles to shine and thrive in, it would make a ton of sense for Valve to do something like this in conjunction with their March launch.

    It’s entirely possible they could have four or five other things waiting to be unveiled to make that storefront. Certainly not anything in-house as big as HLA but I could find jt feasible Valve could have some other deals in place. Maybe Valley of the Gods would have a playable demo, and who knows. Cyan has that Firmament game and I could believe Valve attracting them as a potential launch.

    AxenTrajan45
  • FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    The vitriol towards VR in regards to this game in particular should be the least surprising thing. VR is still very much a niche market at best; so, as I said before, for most people it's like Half Life is throwing a party and you're not invited. When the series has been otherwise completely dead in the darkest of waters for over a decade, you are absolutely inviting caustic behavior against you by making this your big return to glory. A lot of people still had various hopes that the series might breath again one day, and those who would have wanted it as a VR-only revival would be very few indeed.

    On a side note, I really don't buy this whole spiel of "Every HL installment has to be some revolutionary effort to redefine the genre or it's not really HL!" nonsense either. If that was truly the case they should have sucked it up and made the episodes conclude back when episodic content was actually a new concept as opposed to, well, losing the plot. Leaving things undone for so long only to create something new that will reach so few is, at best, insulting to fans who would have loved to buy in on more conventional means (which the previous games all had, by the way - including basic console ports).

    I for one am very happy that Valve is allowed to make the games they want to make, and that they don't have to "suck it up" and make things just due to toxic fandom demanding it from them. You can not buy the stuff about Half Life games needing to be revolutionary, but you're just conveniently ignoring their last 15 years of action as well as what everyone at Valve involved in the project has said so far. Go watch the interview they gave after the announcement of Alyx -- it doesn't jive with anything you're saying at all.

    It's pretty absurd that they're on video saying "None of us wanted to make Half Life 3 -- the prospect was miserable and terrifying" and the response is "Suck it up".

    Fiatil on
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  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    Alyx runs on the Source 2 engine. A couple other (non-VR) games currently use the Source 2 engine as well.

    As I understand it the Source 2 engine was designed with VR in mind. It isn't exclusively a VR engine of course, but unlike a number of other popular engines that can run in VR this one actually takes VR in to account as part of its basic design.

    So yeah, I can see a scenario where the Source 2 engine does for VR what the Source engine did for PC gaming in general. This may not come to pass of course, but I suspect this is at least one of Valve's goals with Alyx.

    Axen on
    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
    Linespider5Trajan45
  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    That's like a game from the very early 90s for me.
    *twitch*

    fire yourself!


    :p

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  • CanadianWolverineCanadianWolverine Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    That's like a game from the very early 90s for me.
    *twitch*

    fire yourself!


    :p

    Or instead of all these out of work people, distribute paid for copies of the games the next time it goes on a cheap Steam sale, have a company bonding "training" exercise as they all play the series together and report back like its a book club :)

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    eelektrikElvenshae
  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    Don't do that, you won't like the results of their book reports I guarantee.

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  • SyphonBlueSyphonBlue Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    Don't do that, you won't like the results of their book reports I guarantee.

    "Game opens with a train ride and I have to pick up a can??? and I have no idea what to do with it??? there's no glowing arrow telling me what to do and no explosions what do I do!? This game sucks 3 Khloe Kardashians out of 10 Influencers"

    SyphonBlue on
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  • Linespider5Linespider5 ALL HAIL KING KILLMONGER Registered User regular
    Axen wrote: »
    Alyx runs on the Source 2 engine. A couple other (non-VR) games currently use the Source 2 engine as well.

    As I understand it the Source 2 engine was designed with VR in mind. It isn't exclusively a VR engine of course, but unlike a number of other popular engines that can run in VR this one actually takes VR in to account as part of its basic design.

    So yeah, I can see a scenario where the Source 2 engine does for VR what the Source engine did for PC gaming in general. This may not come to pass of course, but I suspect this is at least one of Valve's goals with Alyx.

    Yeah. I don’t want to set anyone up for false expectations, but it would be mind boggling to me if Valve decide; to release a new entry into the series that made them, and just drop it into the ether where after reviews it is never seen again.

    There must be plans they have for Source 2. There must be plans they have for encouraging and enticing a community around HLA. It would make a staggering amount of sense to set up the building blocks to allow users to make a thriving mod community of cool things you can only do in VR. Then the next thing you know, VR might have its Day of Defeat or Team Fortress moment, and all that potential can metastasize into something exciting and valuable that players are gonna want to explore for real.

    Axen
  • RoyallyFlushedRoyallyFlushed Registered User regular
    Fiatil wrote: »
    The vitriol towards VR in regards to this game in particular should be the least surprising thing. VR is still very much a niche market at best; so, as I said before, for most people it's like Half Life is throwing a party and you're not invited. When the series has been otherwise completely dead in the darkest of waters for over a decade, you are absolutely inviting caustic behavior against you by making this your big return to glory. A lot of people still had various hopes that the series might breath again one day, and those who would have wanted it as a VR-only revival would be very few indeed.

    On a side note, I really don't buy this whole spiel of "Every HL installment has to be some revolutionary effort to redefine the genre or it's not really HL!" nonsense either. If that was truly the case they should have sucked it up and made the episodes conclude back when episodic content was actually a new concept as opposed to, well, losing the plot. Leaving things undone for so long only to create something new that will reach so few is, at best, insulting to fans who would have loved to buy in on more conventional means (which the previous games all had, by the way - including basic console ports).

    I for one am very happy that Valve is allowed to make the games they want to make, and that they don't have to "suck it up" and make things just due to toxic fandom demanding it from them. You can not buy the stuff about Half Life games needing to be revolutionary, but you're just conveniently ignoring their last 15 years of action as well as what everyone at Valve involved in the project has said so far. Go watch the interview they gave after the announcement of Alyx -- it doesn't jive with anything you're saying at all.

    It's pretty absurd that they're on video saying "None of us wanted to make Half Life 3 -- the prospect was miserable and terrifying" and the response is "Suck it up".

    You're missing the point. If the argument is "HL games have to be revolutionary or they aren't really HL games" then yes, they should have finished what they set in motion years ago. That's what they should have "sucked it up" for. There will always be new tech you could apply to make new games without abandoning an on going story for so long. Half Life 2 had a reasonable end point itself, but they decided to try out episodic content and then ended it with one of the biggest cliff hangers you could possibly end on for over a decade. That is absolutely, definitively, NOT how you treat an IP you care about OR a fanbase you care about.

    I'm not ignoring their last 15 years of action - it is, in fact, their lack of reasonable action in regards to Half Life that justifies the complaints. If they don't want to make Half Life games anymore, then don't! I'm not toxic; I'm not demanding anything of them in this sense. It was of their own volition they made a new Half Life game (it's what they wanted to make!), but it comes off real insulting to a lot of the fanbase thanks to, you know, the whole "total abandonment" thing. And an interview here or there is not going to change that.

    I hate to repeat myself, but again, if you're one of those who is already VR capable or ready to buy in, more power to you. Be happy that Valve made a game they wanted to make; it will probably be an enjoyable experience. But I hardly think it requires such dismissiveness towards those who are less than happy with how the series has been handled since Episode 2's non-conclusive conclusion when the bright new return is an effort to push VR sales.

    CanadianWolverine
  • augustaugust where you come from is gone Registered User regular
    The way they describe the development of this game, where they created the gameplay first and the decided that Half-Life was they best ip they had to fit that gameplay, makes me think we won't see another Half-Life product for another 15 years or so.

  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    Does this mark a full return to the series? Should we expect more?

    Yes. It’s probably no surprise that many people at Valve have been wanting to get back to the Half-Life universe for a long time, and this experience has only reinforced that. In the process of creating Half-Life: Alyx, we’ve had to explore new ways to tell stories with these characters and this world, and we’ve discovered a lot of new gameplay experiences that go beyond what we’ve been able to do before. Of course, we’ll have to wait and see how people react to Half-Life: Alyx once it’s out, but we’d love to continue pushing forward.

    https://www.theverge.com/2019/11/21/20975423/half-life-alyx-vr-price-release-date-screenshots-trailer-valve-steam

    Granted, I'm sure they were positive they were making Episode 3 and that fell through, and I'm sure they were positive they were making Half-Life 3 and that hasn't gone anywhere after like a decade, so we'll see if this is anything more than wishful thinking.

  • rahkeesh2000rahkeesh2000 Registered User regular
    edited November 2019
    Yeah "insulting" is where I draw the line. You don't have to be happy about a VR game or a prequel when what you want is HL 3, but Valve doesn't owe anyone a product they haven't already paid for, any more than Sega owes me Phantasy Star V instead of those "insulting" online spinoffs. Companies are not obligated to sustain the same goddamn franchise forever in more or less the same exact way, and its really tiring seeing the internet predictably jump beyond criticism into outrage when an old IP gets adapted to some different venue they don't care for. And even when they screw up and disappoint fans with a crappy product, barring scammy monetization practicies, it does not amount to a moral transgression.

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  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    I don't mind people feeling insulted. You can't dictate how people feel, that's what makes them feelings and not facts.

    It's just weird that there seems to be a bunch who then go on to justify their feeling insulted with a bunch of untrue sweeping statements about VR, like "it costs $1k" or "it needs a $2k gaming PC" or "there are no games for it".

    It's okay for VR to be something that isn't for you, but at least have an accurate picture of the thing you're saying isn't for you.

  • XantomasXantomas Registered User regular
    People aren't mad because Valve just decided that they didn't want to make Half Life games forever in the exact same way, they are mad because they paused on a massive cliffhanger after making a big deal about their new episodic long term content in smaller bites idea after just 2 of them. 2! Those aren't episodes! Those are halves!

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