So, getting a really good price on an LCD display meant that I didn't get 1080p with it, instead it natively displays 1080i I believe. Will this update scale DVD movies to 1080i, or am I a complete idiot that doesn't know anything about HD displays?
It will over HDMI, but we'll have to wait and see if it can't over component (it would be an arbitrary restriction at that resolution).
Cool, good to know.
Finding this brand new Samsung 42" LCD for less than $700 was positively serendipitous.
WILL THIS FIX THE WESTINGHOUSE PROBLEM It better fix the westinghouse problem.
What is the Westinghouse problem?
Westinghouse makes a 1080p set that does not accept a 1080p signal, I know that much. They are very likely one of the manufacturers that take EITHER 1080i OR 720p on other models instead of accepting either and scaling them to the native resolution. Because both are ATSC broadcast formats, the PS3 should expect an HDTV to support either, therefore a game only needs to support one or the other with no need for a scaler chip in the PS3. Unfortunately, televisions with no tuner sometimes expect your tuner to do the scaling and therefore do not scale themselves. This is why some people are forced to play PS3 games in SD on their HDTV when the game doesn't support their set's native resolution.
Huh. I have a 1080p Westinghouse -- do you know what model it is that does not accept a 1080p signal?
edit: nevermind, looks like mine supports 1080p in (LVM-42w2).
Does this upscale PS3 games? I can't fucking imagine it upscaling ps1, ps2, and dvd's but NOT ps3 games..
That would require HARDWARE or else the update would be stealing performance from the games that expect a certain amount of system resources for the resolution they already support. Obviously, if the game doesn't support 1080p, there were performance issues with that engine/implementation and an unoptimized SOFTWARE upscaler would be far more inefficient than the engine simply doing it anyway at the expense of performance.
It's unreasonable to *expect* PS3 games to support it. The best we can hope for is Sony making support mandatory for future games and making patches for some of the previous games.
Does this upscale PS3 games? I can't fucking imagine it upscaling ps1, ps2, and dvd's but NOT ps3 games..
Can't PS3 games already display in 1080p?
Damn, starting to wish my HDTV did 1080p instead of 1080i
Just like the XBOX 360, most don't support it. Unlike the XBOX 360, there is no hardware scaler that can scale a non-1080p resolution to 1080p. The scaler SHOULD be built into your TV.
WILL THIS FIX THE WESTINGHOUSE PROBLEM It better fix the westinghouse problem.
What is the Westinghouse problem?
Westinghouse makes a 1080p set that does not accept a 1080p signal, I know that much. They are very likely one of the manufacturers that take EITHER 1080i OR 720p on other models instead of accepting either and scaling them to the native resolution. Because both are ATSC broadcast formats, the PS3 should expect an HDTV to support either, therefore a game only needs to support one or the other with no need for a scaler chip in the PS3. Unfortunately, televisions with no tuner sometimes expect your tuner to do the scaling and therefore do not scale themselves. This is why some people are forced to play PS3 games in SD on their HDTV when the game doesn't support their set's native resolution.
Huh. I have a 1080p Westinghouse -- do you know what model it is that does not accept a 1080p signal?
edit: nevermind, looks like mine supports 1080p in (LVM-42w2).
Still no idea what agoaj meant.
The model recently sold on woot.com. I've seen it cheap at Best Buy too. I believe it does accept 1080p over VGA but not HDMI or Component. The PS3 outputs 1080p over component and HDMI, but you would need the $130 HD Fury and an HDMI-DVI converter to output 1080p over VGA from a PS3 (DVI HDCP to VGA converter). As a bonus, it supports HDCP so you can watch 1080p BD movies without relying on the set's telecine deinterlacer (normally limited to 1080i without HDMI+HDCP).
Man, that shit is hot. I can't wait to see what my old games look like upscaled.
Don't get your hopes up. I suspect it's Europe-only unless the new firmware selectively emulates PS2 games on PS3s that include full PS2 hardware.
Actually, 1UP picked up this story and confirms that the upscaling is for all territories, since as mentioned in the OP changes apply worldwide with Sony firmware updates. Either way, we'll find out soon enough!
I can't wait! Sony finally found their upscaling capability! At least...for movies and old games. It's about time.
That STILL doesn't mean that it's not for specific games done through the software emulation. After all, because the hardware differs, the FW clearly just behaves differently on different hardware. Similar to the PSP brightness handling being different on newer PSPs so the downgraded 1.5FW needed to be modified with the higher FW's screen handling code for TA80/TA82/TA86 PSPs.
If it's not done that way then it means that the behavior in PS2 mode has been changed. It was the way it was for security reasons.
Wow that's very interesting, I had no idea the original reason the PS2 mode is at original resolution was due to security reasons. How fascinating! Enlighten me from your clearly vast font of knowledge, CZroe. I'm not kidding, I've been enjoying your posts, I'm also really hopeful for PS2 upscaling for the GoW games and MGS2 and 3.
brynstar on
Xbox Live: Xander51
PSN ID : Xander51 Steam ID : Xander51
Man, the resolution support and such for the PS3 (and to a lesser extent 360 and all HD stuff) is confusing. I pay attention and believe I know what's up... and then I read a bunch and get confused again.
I have a Sony TV that will accept 720p and 1080i over component and DVI. I'm pretty sure it's DVI-HDCP, so I could go HDMI->DVI with a cable I've got.
If I play a 1080p BD, what with my TV not being able to handle 1080p, will it still scale me to 540p, or does this update take care of that and let me scale to 720p (native for my TV) or 1080i? Or did a different update take care of it and I missed it? Once I can get this issue cleared up, then I can just wait on the good games and pick one up without a worry.
schmads on
Battle.net/SC2: Kwisatz.868 | Steam/XBL/PSN/Gamecenter: schmads | BattleTag/D3: Schmads#1144 | Hero Academy & * With Friends: FallenKwisatz | 3DS: 4356-0128-9671
WILL THIS FIX THE WESTINGHOUSE PROBLEM It better fix the westinghouse problem.
What is the Westinghouse problem?
Westinghouse makes a 1080p set that does not accept a 1080p signal, I know that much. They are very likely one of the manufacturers that take EITHER 1080i OR 720p on other models instead of accepting either and scaling them to the native resolution. Because both are ATSC broadcast formats, the PS3 should expect an HDTV to support either, therefore a game only needs to support one or the other with no need for a scaler chip in the PS3. Unfortunately, televisions with no tuner sometimes expect your tuner to do the scaling and therefore do not scale themselves. This is why some people are forced to play PS3 games in SD on their HDTV when the game doesn't support their set's native resolution.
Huh. I have a 1080p Westinghouse -- do you know what model it is that does not accept a 1080p signal?
edit: nevermind, looks like mine supports 1080p in (LVM-42w2).
Still no idea what agoaj meant.
The problem is that PS3 over HDMI will blink on and off on Westinghouse and other smaller brand TV's at any resolution above 480P. I think westinghouse changed HDMI hardware on their newer ones but they're telling customers with older units to wait for an update from Sony.
The problem is that PS3 over HDMI will blink on and off on Westinghouse and other smaller brand TV's at any resolution above 480P. I think westinghouse changed HDMI hardware on their newer ones but they're telling customers with older units to wait for an update from Sony.
Ouch.
I think my westy's about a year old, but the only thing I've noticed is the 1-2 seconds of static and pop that comes with a resolution change. I assumed this was due to HDCP handshaking or something.
The problem is that PS3 over HDMI will blink on and off on Westinghouse and other smaller brand TV's at any resolution above 480P. I think westinghouse changed HDMI hardware on their newer ones but they're telling customers with older units to wait for an update from Sony.
Ouch.
I think my westy's about a year old, but the only thing I've noticed is the 1-2 seconds of static and pop that comes with a resolution change. I assumed this was due to HDCP handshaking or something.
You can check the serial number(back of monitor/box it came in) and find the date of manufacture.
W4202DEM06XX
06 is the year, XX is the week.
If it starts with an A you have newer hardware. Yay!
Man, that shit is hot. I can't wait to see what my old games look like upscaled.
Don't get your hopes up. I suspect it's Europe-only unless the new firmware selectively emulates PS2 games on PS3s that include full PS2 hardware.
Actually, 1UP picked up this story and confirms that the upscaling is for all territories, since as mentioned in the OP changes apply worldwide with Sony firmware updates. Either way, we'll find out soon enough!
I can't wait! Sony finally found their upscaling capability! At least...for movies and old games. It's about time.
That STILL doesn't mean that it's not for specific games done through the software emulation. After all, because the hardware differs, the FW clearly just behaves differently on different hardware. Similar to the PSP brightness handling being different on newer PSPs so the downgraded 1.5FW needed to be modified with the higher FW's screen handling code for TA80/TA82/TA86 PSPs.
If it's not done that way then it means that the behavior in PS2 mode has been changed. It was the way it was for security reasons.
Wow that's very interesting, I had no idea the original reason the PS2 mode is at original resolution was due to security reasons. How fascinating! Enlighten me from your clearly vast font of knowledge, CZroe. I'm not kidding, I've been enjoying your posts, I'm also really hopeful for PS2 upscaling for the GoW games and MGS2 and 3.
It's not just the resolution that is restricted. It's attempting to isolate PS2 execution in a protected "PS2 environment" without significant access to the PS3's resources. It's sorta like how the Wii only supports homebrew in GC mode where it is simulating a GC, but there is no way to get the CPU and GPU speed cranked up and access the WiFi/BT hardware for Wii Remote support, etc. "Sorta like" because it still has a minimal shell running to memory card management, SIXAXIS/DualShock2 conversion, analog button toggling and "exit" (reboot actually) to the XMB. Notice that the SIXAXIS needs to be turned on again when playing a PS2 game but not when turning on a PSone game. This update may very well change that behavior if the PS3 will remain functional for software scaling of the PS2's output.
Man, that shit is hot. I can't wait to see what my old games look like upscaled.
Don't get your hopes up. I suspect it's Europe-only unless the new firmware selectively emulates PS2 games on PS3s that include full PS2 hardware.
Sony said themselves that eventually, all PS3s will be emulating in software, no matter if you've got PS2 hardware in there or not.
I think what they were saying was that all regions will eventually have PS3's with EE software emulation. At least that's what they were saying in the statement I read. That's the same situation as the PS2 where compatability actually decreased, so I knew that when I decided to buy my PS3 (that's one reason why I decided to get a 1st gen unit). It stands to reason that the perfectly emulated games would be emulated on the PS3s that have the EE & GS chips so that they too can take advantage of upscaling, filtering, higher-resolution, etc.
WILL THIS FIX THE WESTINGHOUSE PROBLEM It better fix the westinghouse problem.
What is the Westinghouse problem?
Westinghouse makes a 1080p set that does not accept a 1080p signal, I know that much. They are very likely one of the manufacturers that take EITHER 1080i OR 720p on other models instead of accepting either and scaling them to the native resolution. Because both are ATSC broadcast formats, the PS3 should expect an HDTV to support either, therefore a game only needs to support one or the other with no need for a scaler chip in the PS3. Unfortunately, televisions with no tuner sometimes expect your tuner to do the scaling and therefore do not scale themselves. This is why some people are forced to play PS3 games in SD on their HDTV when the game doesn't support their set's native resolution.
Huh. I have a 1080p Westinghouse -- do you know what model it is that does not accept a 1080p signal?
edit: nevermind, looks like mine supports 1080p in (LVM-42w2).
Still no idea what agoaj meant.
The problem is that PS3 over HDMI will blink on and off on Westinghouse and other smaller brand TV's at any resolution above 480P. I think westinghouse changed HDMI hardware on their newer ones but they're telling customers with older units to wait for an update from Sony.
I've seen that demonstrated on some PC monitors too, so it's not just a problem with Westinghouse LCDs. It is HDCP related. It was kinda random in that it would work some times and not others. When it started blinking, you'd just remove the HDMI cable and reinsert and it should have stopped. If you are unlucky and it just happened to trigger again (failed to properly exchange HDCP heys/complete the HDCP handshake), you just try that again. It sounded like 1 out of 3 attempts would result in blinking, but the CNET video didn't exactly give hard numbers. It's probably a timing issue and timings issues are often rooted in the hardware. The XBOX360 was able to fix their 1080p over component timing problems with a software update, so it's not entirely impossible.
1. DVD-ROM (including DVD Video content) can only be upscaled with HDMI compatible TV sets.
Hmm, wtf? I thought none of that HDCP shit was ever actually turned on. Oh well.
I wonder, though, are PS2 games considered DVD-ROM content?
The PS3 doesn't support a non-HDCP display through HDMI AT ALL, even for games and unprotected content. They allowed high-def Blu-Ray over component (instead of quarter-rezzing it), but they did not remove other HDCP restrictions. They do allow 1080p through component for everything but 1080p Blu-Ray (outputs 1080i and expects your HDTV to reverse-telecine it to 1080p).
The PS3 doesn't support a non-HDCP display through HDMI AT ALL, even for games and unprotected content. They allowed high-def Blu-Ray over component (instead of quarter-rezzing it), but they did not remove other HDCP restrictions. They do allow 1080p through component for everything but 1080p Blu-Ray (outputs 1080i and expects your HDTV to reverse-telecine it to 1080p).
Interesting. So while that doesn't tell me if the PS3 will downscale over HDMI if my TV doesn't support 1080p, it does tell me that the PS3 will work as well as my 360 if I use a component input. I wouldn't want 1080p over component, just 1080i, so their obnoxious restrictions would work in my favor. Still... confusing shit.
I just want to buy good electronics and have them all work so I can play games and watch movies at optimal quality. Stop trying to make it difficult for me. It's not like you're actually preventing piracy, you're just pissing off the consumers. I'm a consumer whore, and when you make me wary of spending money, you're doing something wrong!
I'm not trying to hijack the thread... I really want to know if the PS3 is likely to work out for my configuration (HDMI->DVI-HDCP connection with a 1080i/720p TV that doesn't support 1080p inputs). It's especially obnoxious since places like Gamestop don't allow console returns if they don't work for your TV. Meh!
schmads on
Battle.net/SC2: Kwisatz.868 | Steam/XBL/PSN/Gamecenter: schmads | BattleTag/D3: Schmads#1144 | Hero Academy & * With Friends: FallenKwisatz | 3DS: 4356-0128-9671
I'm not trying to hijack the thread... I really want to know if the PS3 is likely to work out for my configuration (HDMI->DVI-HDCP connection with a 1080i/720p TV that doesn't support 1080p inputs).
If your TV support 1080i, it will work for BD content. There are two scaling problems for the PS3 that have frustrated users:
1. PS3 games that output in 720p will downscale to 480p if your TV is 1080i only.
2. BD movies output in 1080 and will downscale to 540p if your TV is 720p only (there are very few of these) or has no component/HDMI inputs.
Issue #1 has never been fixed, and likely never will be because of the performance issues CZRoe mentioned earlier. This would only change if Sony included a hardware scaler in future PS3 revisions.
Issue #2 is more complex. If your HDTV does 1080i then Blu-ray films will display in full resolution. The complicating factor is the progressive nature. Flat panels--LCD and plasma--are inherently progressive, so even if the PS3 outputs 1080i your TV should turn it 1080p. Some TVs do this well; some do it poorly. But if you have a CRT, you can't get progressive.
The upshot: I have a 720p/1080i LCD TV, and I have watched BD movies on it, and they were in 1080p. Having not gotten this firmware update yet, I don't know how games and movies will act afterward.
Liabe Brave on
My name is Christian Smith.
"I just want people to see my action heart."
it does tell me that the PS3 will work as well as my 360 if I use a component input. I wouldn't want 1080p over component, just 1080i,
I'm pretty sure you're wrong. It sounds like the PS3 will not upscale DVDs to 1080i over component. I base my statement on this quote: "1. DVD-ROM (including DVD Video content) can only be upscaled with HDMI compatible TV sets."
I don't recall - does the 360 upscale DVDs to 1080i over component?
The PS3 doesn't support a non-HDCP display through HDMI AT ALL, even for games and unprotected content.
Well, naturally, since the HDMI spec includes implementation of HDCP.
The problem is that PS3 over HDMI will blink on and off on Westinghouse and other smaller brand TV's at any resolution above 480P. I think westinghouse changed HDMI hardware on their newer ones but they're telling customers with older units to wait for an update from Sony.
Ouch.
I think my westy's about a year old, but the only thing I've noticed is the 1-2 seconds of static and pop that comes with a resolution change. I assumed this was due to HDCP handshaking or something.
My Olevia does that and it scared the fuck out of me the first time it happened. I noticed it only happens when it changes resolution, though. I hope it's nothing really to be afraid of, but every time that pop comes on it just freaks me out.
Dashui on
Xbox Live, PSN & Origin: Vacorsis 3DS: 2638-0037-166
Also I played FF12 in 1080i, with smoothing on and ugh there was something off, also you have to set it to full screen in the ps3 menu and then switch it to widescreen ingame to get it to display right, and it didn't even fill the whole screen for me.
It's not just the resolution that is restricted. It's attempting to isolate PS2 execution in a protected "PS2 environment" without significant access to the PS3's resources. It's sorta like how the Wii only supports homebrew in GC mode where it is simulating a GC, but there is no way to get the CPU and GPU speed cranked up and access the WiFi/BT hardware for Wii Remote support, etc. "Sorta like" because it still has a minimal shell running to memory card management, SIXAXIS/DualShock2 conversion, analog button toggling and "exit" (reboot actually) to the XMB. Notice that the SIXAXIS needs to be turned on again when playing a PS2 game but not when turning on a PSone game. This update may very well change that behavior if the PS3 will remain functional for software scaling of the PS2's output.
Ah, got it. That makes sense, and yeah I had noticed the need to turn the controller back on after leaving PS2 mode. Thanks for the information! I'm always eager to know this stuff.
Good to see the update is out...I have to go try some PS2 games now! I'm trying God of War I and II first and foremost.
brynstar on
Xbox Live: Xander51
PSN ID : Xander51 Steam ID : Xander51
We were having discussions over the changes in the SA PS3 megathread, and one of the users (who we believe has a PAL PS3) actually noticed a far more consistent framerate in SotC, but only when all the new emulation options (smoothing etc) were turned on. When off, it ran exactly the same as the PS2.
Now this makes absolutely zero sense to me, but he has no reason to lie, so theorycraft ahoy, I guess.
Jesus fuck shit it just won't download on the PS3, and I can't find the firmware on the Sony site to download to my PC, which would be quicker. I hope they add MGS3 back to the BC list. Please let Gradius 3/4/5 still be on there too.
The problem is that PS3 over HDMI will blink on and off on Westinghouse and other smaller brand TV's at any resolution above 480P. I think westinghouse changed HDMI hardware on their newer ones but they're telling customers with older units to wait for an update from Sony.
Ouch.
I think my westy's about a year old, but the only thing I've noticed is the 1-2 seconds of static and pop that comes with a resolution change. I assumed this was due to HDCP handshaking or something.
My Olevia does that and it scared the fuck out of me the first time it happened. I noticed it only happens when it changes resolution, though. I hope it's nothing really to be afraid of, but every time that pop comes on it just freaks me out.
It's not that I don't feel for you all, but Westinghouse and Olevia are really lousy brands and this isn't the most astonishing thing I've seen a lousy brand of television pull off.
Jesus fuck shit it just won't download on the PS3, and I can't find the firmware on the Sony site to download to my PC, which would be quicker. I hope they add MGS3 back to the BC list. Please let Gradius 3 still be on there too.
Are you connected by ethernet or wireless? I've heard people trying to connect by wireless were failing outright, whereas with ethernet, well, it still downloaded slow as shit but at least it worked :P
Yeah, it's wireless. Usually I can download everything pretty quickly though. Or in the firmware's case, just get a copy on my PC, then put it on my PS3 from there, which is usually faster.
The problem is that PS3 over HDMI will blink on and off on Westinghouse and other smaller brand TV's at any resolution above 480P. I think westinghouse changed HDMI hardware on their newer ones but they're telling customers with older units to wait for an update from Sony.
Ouch.
I think my westy's about a year old, but the only thing I've noticed is the 1-2 seconds of static and pop that comes with a resolution change. I assumed this was due to HDCP handshaking or something.
My Olevia does that and it scared the fuck out of me the first time it happened. I noticed it only happens when it changes resolution, though. I hope it's nothing really to be afraid of, but every time that pop comes on it just freaks me out.
It's not that I don't feel for you all, but Westinghouse and Olevia are really lousy brands and this isn't the most astonishing thing I've seen a lousy brand of television pull off.
Really? I have been very happy with my Westinghouse purchase, awesome picture and no ghosting. The blinking does get a bit out of hand though. Other than that, I would recommend them to anyone.
Edges look more natural. Bye bye texture shimmering?
victor_c26 on
It's been so long since I've posted here, I've removed my signature since most of what I had here were broken links. Shows over, you can carry on to the next post.
Posts
Cool, good to know.
Finding this brand new Samsung 42" LCD for less than $700 was positively serendipitous.
Can't PS3 games already display in 1080p?
Damn, starting to wish my HDTV did 1080p instead of 1080i
I am a freaking nerd.
I've asked my contact at Sony Canada. I'll let you know if I get an answer.
Huh. I have a 1080p Westinghouse -- do you know what model it is that does not accept a 1080p signal?
edit: nevermind, looks like mine supports 1080p in (LVM-42w2).
Still no idea what agoaj meant.
That would require HARDWARE or else the update would be stealing performance from the games that expect a certain amount of system resources for the resolution they already support. Obviously, if the game doesn't support 1080p, there were performance issues with that engine/implementation and an unoptimized SOFTWARE upscaler would be far more inefficient than the engine simply doing it anyway at the expense of performance.
It's unreasonable to *expect* PS3 games to support it. The best we can hope for is Sony making support mandatory for future games and making patches for some of the previous games.
Just like the XBOX 360, most don't support it. Unlike the XBOX 360, there is no hardware scaler that can scale a non-1080p resolution to 1080p. The scaler SHOULD be built into your TV.
The model recently sold on woot.com. I've seen it cheap at Best Buy too. I believe it does accept 1080p over VGA but not HDMI or Component. The PS3 outputs 1080p over component and HDMI, but you would need the $130 HD Fury and an HDMI-DVI converter to output 1080p over VGA from a PS3 (DVI HDCP to VGA converter). As a bonus, it supports HDCP so you can watch 1080p BD movies without relying on the set's telecine deinterlacer (normally limited to 1080i without HDMI+HDCP).
Wow that's very interesting, I had no idea the original reason the PS2 mode is at original resolution was due to security reasons. How fascinating! Enlighten me from your clearly vast font of knowledge, CZroe. I'm not kidding, I've been enjoying your posts, I'm also really hopeful for PS2 upscaling for the GoW games and MGS2 and 3.
PSN ID : Xander51 Steam ID : Xander51
I have a Sony TV that will accept 720p and 1080i over component and DVI. I'm pretty sure it's DVI-HDCP, so I could go HDMI->DVI with a cable I've got.
If I play a 1080p BD, what with my TV not being able to handle 1080p, will it still scale me to 540p, or does this update take care of that and let me scale to 720p (native for my TV) or 1080i? Or did a different update take care of it and I missed it? Once I can get this issue cleared up, then I can just wait on the good games and pick one up without a worry.
Sony said themselves that eventually, all PS3s will be emulating in software, no matter if you've got PS2 hardware in there or not.
Ouch.
I think my westy's about a year old, but the only thing I've noticed is the 1-2 seconds of static and pop that comes with a resolution change. I assumed this was due to HDCP handshaking or something.
You can check the serial number(back of monitor/box it came in) and find the date of manufacture.
W4202DEM06XX
06 is the year, XX is the week.
If it starts with an A you have newer hardware. Yay!
Hmm, wtf? I thought none of that HDCP shit was ever actually turned on. Oh well.
I wonder, though, are PS2 games considered DVD-ROM content?
SCEA has confirmed that this is not the case. PS2 and PSX games will be fully upscaled using component.
so glad I can't afford a HDTV
PLEASE SONY PLEASE!
Ah well. Maybe next time.
It's not just the resolution that is restricted. It's attempting to isolate PS2 execution in a protected "PS2 environment" without significant access to the PS3's resources. It's sorta like how the Wii only supports homebrew in GC mode where it is simulating a GC, but there is no way to get the CPU and GPU speed cranked up and access the WiFi/BT hardware for Wii Remote support, etc. "Sorta like" because it still has a minimal shell running to memory card management, SIXAXIS/DualShock2 conversion, analog button toggling and "exit" (reboot actually) to the XMB. Notice that the SIXAXIS needs to be turned on again when playing a PS2 game but not when turning on a PSone game. This update may very well change that behavior if the PS3 will remain functional for software scaling of the PS2's output.
I think what they were saying was that all regions will eventually have PS3's with EE software emulation. At least that's what they were saying in the statement I read. That's the same situation as the PS2 where compatability actually decreased, so I knew that when I decided to buy my PS3 (that's one reason why I decided to get a 1st gen unit). It stands to reason that the perfectly emulated games would be emulated on the PS3s that have the EE & GS chips so that they too can take advantage of upscaling, filtering, higher-resolution, etc.
I've seen that demonstrated on some PC monitors too, so it's not just a problem with Westinghouse LCDs. It is HDCP related. It was kinda random in that it would work some times and not others. When it started blinking, you'd just remove the HDMI cable and reinsert and it should have stopped. If you are unlucky and it just happened to trigger again (failed to properly exchange HDCP heys/complete the HDCP handshake), you just try that again. It sounded like 1 out of 3 attempts would result in blinking, but the CNET video didn't exactly give hard numbers. It's probably a timing issue and timings issues are often rooted in the hardware. The XBOX360 was able to fix their 1080p over component timing problems with a software update, so it's not entirely impossible.
The PS3 doesn't support a non-HDCP display through HDMI AT ALL, even for games and unprotected content. They allowed high-def Blu-Ray over component (instead of quarter-rezzing it), but they did not remove other HDCP restrictions. They do allow 1080p through component for everything but 1080p Blu-Ray (outputs 1080i and expects your HDTV to reverse-telecine it to 1080p).
Interesting. So while that doesn't tell me if the PS3 will downscale over HDMI if my TV doesn't support 1080p, it does tell me that the PS3 will work as well as my 360 if I use a component input. I wouldn't want 1080p over component, just 1080i, so their obnoxious restrictions would work in my favor. Still... confusing shit.
I just want to buy good electronics and have them all work so I can play games and watch movies at optimal quality. Stop trying to make it difficult for me. It's not like you're actually preventing piracy, you're just pissing off the consumers. I'm a consumer whore, and when you make me wary of spending money, you're doing something wrong!
I'm not trying to hijack the thread... I really want to know if the PS3 is likely to work out for my configuration (HDMI->DVI-HDCP connection with a 1080i/720p TV that doesn't support 1080p inputs). It's especially obnoxious since places like Gamestop don't allow console returns if they don't work for your TV. Meh!
If your TV support 1080i, it will work for BD content. There are two scaling problems for the PS3 that have frustrated users:
1. PS3 games that output in 720p will downscale to 480p if your TV is 1080i only.
2. BD movies output in 1080 and will downscale to 540p if your TV is 720p only (there are very few of these) or has no component/HDMI inputs.
Issue #1 has never been fixed, and likely never will be because of the performance issues CZRoe mentioned earlier. This would only change if Sony included a hardware scaler in future PS3 revisions.
Issue #2 is more complex. If your HDTV does 1080i then Blu-ray films will display in full resolution. The complicating factor is the progressive nature. Flat panels--LCD and plasma--are inherently progressive, so even if the PS3 outputs 1080i your TV should turn it 1080p. Some TVs do this well; some do it poorly. But if you have a CRT, you can't get progressive.
The upshot: I have a 720p/1080i LCD TV, and I have watched BD movies on it, and they were in 1080p. Having not gotten this firmware update yet, I don't know how games and movies will act afterward.
"I just want people to see my action heart."
I'm pretty sure you're wrong. It sounds like the PS3 will not upscale DVDs to 1080i over component. I base my statement on this quote: "1. DVD-ROM (including DVD Video content) can only be upscaled with HDMI compatible TV sets."
I don't recall - does the 360 upscale DVDs to 1080i over component?
Well, naturally, since the HDMI spec includes implementation of HDCP.
My Olevia does that and it scared the fuck out of me the first time it happened. I noticed it only happens when it changes resolution, though. I hope it's nothing really to be afraid of, but every time that pop comes on it just freaks me out.
My god. PS1 & PS2 games look absolutely gorgeous upscaled.
Granted I'm only going up to 720p, and I've only tried 2 games (Final Fantasy Tactics & Final Fantasy XII), but so far, color me seriously impressed.
DO IT
DO IT NOW
please
Kinda makes me wish I had a PS3 and a HDTV.
Not really worth it to play PS1/PS2 games, though :P
The frame rate will never change EVER. Stop asking for it man you are only going to end up dissapointed.
Let me have my irrational dreams, okay
Besides maybe if they're smashed the 10 year old kid in my brain will stop bugging me to buy one :P
Ah, got it. That makes sense, and yeah I had noticed the need to turn the controller back on after leaving PS2 mode. Thanks for the information! I'm always eager to know this stuff.
Good to see the update is out...I have to go try some PS2 games now! I'm trying God of War I and II first and foremost.
PSN ID : Xander51 Steam ID : Xander51
Now this makes absolutely zero sense to me, but he has no reason to lie, so theorycraft ahoy, I guess.
Does it fix the blinking?
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
Here's one from the SA thread. It's not gameplay, but the difference is pretty evident anyway.
Default PS2 behaviour on the left, all new stuff turned on on the right.
Jesus fuck shit it just won't download on the PS3, and I can't find the firmware on the Sony site to download to my PC, which would be quicker. I hope they add MGS3 back to the BC list. Please let Gradius 3/4/5 still be on there too.
It's not that I don't feel for you all, but Westinghouse and Olevia are really lousy brands and this isn't the most astonishing thing I've seen a lousy brand of television pull off.
猿も木から落ちる
Are you connected by ethernet or wireless? I've heard people trying to connect by wireless were failing outright, whereas with ethernet, well, it still downloaded slow as shit but at least it worked :P
BEFORE:
AFTER:
Really? I have been very happy with my Westinghouse purchase, awesome picture and no ghosting. The blinking does get a bit out of hand though. Other than that, I would recommend them to anyone.
Edges look more natural. Bye bye texture shimmering?