[BATTLETECH/MechWarrior] More 'Mech action than you can shake an UrbanMech at!

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  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    Hmm I’m up to the last two missions for the BattleTech base game campaign.

    Currently rocking:

    2xKGC with dual AC/20 and dual SRM-6
    1xHGN-732B with same load out as the KGCs
    2xSTK with dual PPC and dual SRM-6
    1xHGN-733 with quad LRM-15
    1xSTK with dual LRM-15, dual LRM-10
    1xMAD headcapper

    I think I should be good with this no?

    BetsuniNipsH3KnucklesIolo
  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    Nobody wrote: »
    Hmm I’m up to the last two missions for the BattleTech base game campaign.

    Currently rocking:

    2xKGC with dual AC/20 and dual SRM-6
    1xHGN-732B with same load out as the KGCs
    2xSTK with dual PPC and dual SRM-6
    1xHGN-733 with quad LRM-15
    1xSTK with dual LRM-15, dual LRM-10
    1xMAD headcapper

    I think I should be good with this no?

    Yeah, I think you'll be good.

    Though the description is misleading and you don't technically need "two lances" for those last two missions. Like any other consecutive deployment in the game, you can potentially take the same 4 units on both, it's just that you won't be allowed to repair internal damage between missions, so having 8 mechs + pilots available is a worst case recommendation.

    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
    NobodyOrcaIoloGnome-Interruptus
  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    Yeah, figured if I do it right I won’t have to do too much mech or character swapping

  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    With that kind of loadout you'll roflstomp the last couple missions.

    NipsNobodyTynnan
  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    edited September 4
    Orca wrote: »
    With that kind of loadout you'll roflstomp the last couple missions.

    Confirmed. Took the HGN-732B, HGN-733 (missile boat), one of the STK-3F brawlers, and the Marauder headcapper into the first mission so I could potentially preserve the KGCs for the second one.

    Easily completed all of the secondaries, took home a BNC-3M where I just had to hose out the cockpit.

    Second mission I will admit I did restart on, but only because I didn't realize that you cannot headshot the KGC and attempting to do so put my MAD in a very compromising position.

    So now game over, time to start looking into mods and which DLCs I want to get (definitely Heavy Metal, eh on the other two).

    Nobody on
    MorninglordBetsuniIoloH3Knuckles
  • BullheadBullhead Registered User regular
    edited September 4
    Nobody wrote: »
    Orca wrote: »
    With that kind of loadout you'll roflstomp the last couple missions.

    Confirmed. Took the HGN-732B, HGN-733 (missile boat), one of the STK-3F brawlers, and the Marauder headcapper into the first mission so I could potentially preserve the KGCs for the second one.

    Easily completed all of the secondaries, took home a BNC-3M where I just had to hose out the cockpit.

    Second mission I will admit I did restart on, but only because I didn't realize that you cannot headshot the KGC and attempting to do so put my MAD in a very compromising position.

    So now game over, time to start looking into mods and which DLCs I want to get (definitely Heavy Metal, eh on the other two).

    You can however core that bitch out, so the mad is still useful there. I just did this last night on my seoncd playthrough (ironman) - After my MAD had weakened her core (and had already head shot 2 of her lancemates), my KC finally got close enough for a called shot torso with the UAC/20+++ and ac/20++ that it was packing....she ceased to be. We then punched the remaining mech to death who was foolish enough to get in melee range of my KC and my Highlander....


    Edit - I meant to ask, having now done the campaign twice (once save-scumming, once Ironman), is the next step mods I guess? I was going to finish out the flashpoint missions but after that I imagine it gets repetative and roflstomp (with max 10 pilots and absurd lances).

    Bullhead on
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  • IoloIolo iolo Registered User regular
    Next step for me after the campaign was a new career. :)

    Lt. Iolo's First Day
    Steam profile.
    Getting started with BATTLETECH: Part 1 / Part 2
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  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    The flashpoints are definitely roflstomp when you come at them with a maxed out lance, but I still find them entertaining. Probably because I like how quirky some of the writing is.

    Nips
  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    Orca wrote: »
    The flashpoints are definitely roflstomp when you come at them with a maxed out lance, but I still find them entertaining. Probably because I like how quirky some of the writing is.

    Or you could choose to take difficulty-appropriate lances on those missions instead...

    The main issue with continuing onto all the flashpoints after the campaign is the global planet difficulty is permanently higher and you can't find planets below 3 stars any more. If you restart in career mode, you'll have to rebuild your merc company, but planets will have the full spread of difficulties so you can always revisit easier missions if desired.

    And one of the issues with jumping straight to mods is that some of the bigger ones break/disable all the Flashpoint missions. And in my opinion, you'd be missing out on some good story content if you don't play them. Certainly they're more entertaining than grinding random contracts forever, even if modded. I'd recommend sticking with a selection of smaller, individual mods until you've done the Flashpoints then move on to the total overhaul mods or ones like Hades Rim that add their own flashpoints.

    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
    Orca
  • SaldonasSaldonas See you space cowboy...Registered User regular
    I definitely felt like mods were the way to go after my normal story playthrough. Sure it's pretty awesome to just headcap your way through missions with a full group of heavy/assaults since there's not much downside to them in the base game, but I wanted a lot more challenge and variety so mods like Battletech Revised, Battletech Advanced, and such really deliver. They also help with the pretty atrocious AI the game has.

  • IoloIolo iolo Registered User regular
    edited September 7
    Lots of new players cropping up. Been meaning to put this together for a while. Feedback from you experienced lot is welcome:

    GETTING STARTED WITH BATTLETECH
    A walkthrough for the first few hours.

    BATTLETECH is a terrific turn-based, tactical stompy robots game with mech customization and mercenary company management on top.

    It is also very hard to get started, especially if you are not already familiar with some of the underlying systems from the tabletop game or some of the other video games set in the Battletech universe.

    Since the game originally launched, the developer has improved how much important information is given to the player, especially about combat. Unfortunately, the information is often given in text dumps at times when it is not relevant, which is ineffective teaching and frustrating to many players. And a lot of key information is left out altogether, especially about mech customization and merc company management.

    So this guide attempts to serve as a companion to those first few hours, filling in holes as necessary, and serving as a resource while you get your mech fighting, mercenary management legs under you.

    This guide has spoilers for the tutorial missions of the game.

    PART ONE – THE TUTORIALS

    TUTORIAL TRAINING VS DUMMIES
    The first mission has you moving the camera, moving your mech and blowing up a few training dummies. It introduces important concepts such as facing, heat management, jumping and melee. But it does so in ways that are almost completely dissociated from using them in the game.

    Key takeaway here is that movement is a two step process. First click on a destination shows you a whitish firing arc (which you can move around before moving), and red lines to anyone you can hit. After that first click, you can mouseover the opponents you can hit (red lines) and see your to hit chances in the lower right.

    Once you have the firing arc/facing the way you want it and know who you’ll be shooting at, click again and the move order will actually be executed. Then if there’s someone you can hit you’ll move on to firing. Except for one advanced pilot skill, the regular pattern for all your mechs is move then shoot (or brace).

    If you don't like how that move looks, or your odds to hit, escape back and try out another possible move. A huge amount of the combat in the game boils down to positioning and facing. The game gives you good tools for seeing how possible moves will play out, it just doesn't really tell you.

    Get through this and let’s move on.

    TUTORIAL MISSION
    This mission starts with you in your Blackjack (40 tons, jumpjets disabled for this mission) and your lancemates in a Centurion (50) and Kintaro (55).

    When you click on a pilot portrait, you will see the mech paper doll, which shows damage, in the lower left. And you’ll see the mech’s weapons in the lower right.

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    Move up the road to trigger the plot events until you come into contact with your first opponents, a Panther (35) and Shadowhawk (55). You can right click enemies to get some info about them. The Panther, for example, is a variant that has a large laser in the right arm and a short range missile launcher firing in salvos of 4.

    COVER - Move your mechs into cover. You can tell it’s cover by the destination dot being green. Cover provides a 20% reduction in damage to non-melee attacks (except to the rear.)

    RIGHT CLICKING - Right clicking on enemies give you lots of info.

    IXSe82r.jpg

    Fortunately these mechs are damaged – they have almost no armor. Stay in cover, try not to let the enemy attack your rear, and focus fire the enemies down.

    If you start to take damage on one side, use facing to present your other side to the enemies to spread the damage and avoid shots through armor to internal structure and weapons/component.

    After you blow these guys up, there should be a point where there are no enemies in sight or on rader. The game will exit combat mode, and you can move your mechs forward toward the next objective. There’s no clock, so if your mechs generated a lot of heart (orange bar in the lower left), just chill for a few turns to let that cool down.

    Once you start moving, you will get radar blips and reenter combat.

    INITIATIVE – In combat, at the top of the screen, you see the initiative bar. Generally you and your enemies move based on your weight class. 20-35 are light and can move in the first round, 40-55 are medium and so on up to BATTLETECH’s in game max weight of 100 tons. Some pilot skills and rare mech components can affect initiative, but not yet. You can see the three white chevrons – those are your three medium mechs, and three red enemies – a medium and two heavies (tanks, not mechs, fortunately). Eventually this bar will give you a lot of information about who you are facing and when various mechs will take their turns.

    kwFfgCN.jpg

    RESERVE – One advantage lighter mechs have over heavier opponents (and the player has over the AI) is the ability to reserve. See the Reserve button in the bottom center? You’ll be using that a lot to let the enemy come to you. Reserve your turn until your white chevrons are in the last initiative phase and the enemy has moved.

    BRACING – Bracing at the end of movement hunkers your mech down and reduces damage and stability damage taken. If the enemy has moved into sight, you can move into cover and take shots. If the enemy has taken its turn, but isn’t in sight, get your mechs into cover, brace them, and end the turn. Reserve again the next turn and let the enemy come to you. These next four enemies are tanks with reduced armor. If you let them come to you one at a time, they should pose little trouble.

    EVASION – After the four tanks, three mechs will drop. These are all small, fast mechs, so once they start moving they will generate a lot of evasion pips (the little white chevrons over their mechs.) These will make them hard to hit. Each time a mech fires at them (even one weapon), it shaves off an evasion pip. So sequence your firing accordingly. If your Centurion has a 50% chance to hit with its big AC10 at the start of the round, you can get that up to 60% if your Blackjack and Kintaro fire at that target first.

    MULTISHOT – One of the pilot skills is Multishot. Your Centurion and Kintaro both have it. This skill lets you select up to three targets (in your firing arc and within range) to shoot at. Click Multishot at the bottom center of the screen, and then the targets who are A, B and C respectively. Then in the lower right hand corner where the weapons are listed, you can cycle each weapon through targeting A, B, C or off. This is a useful skill throughout the game, but it is especially useful fighting fast opponents. You can Fire a main salvo at one target, and then put one small weapon like a medium laser, against another target. This shaves off an evasion pip and makes it easier to hit for your lancemates later this round.

    bFtuwYx.jpg

    TURNING WEAPONS ON/OFF – Once the Spider, Locust and Cicada get scooting around the map, they will be hard to hit. Down in the lower right, you can turn off weapons that have a low percentage chance to hit. This keeps you from overheating and saves ammo.

    Also autocannons (like the one the Centurion has and the two the Blackjack have) have a refire penalty if you fire them turn after turn. Eventually that goes away as your pilots level up their Guts skill, but for now it is a factor. So don’t take 30% potshots at the fast mechs with your autocannons. Fire your lasers and missiles instead, and wait for the bigger % chance on your autocannons.

    Depending where your mechs are when the new enemy mechs drop, you may get to fire at them before they move. If so, prioritize the ones that are still standing still as you will be much more likely to hit.

    4h7eLuR.jpg

    These small mechs may run around behind you and shoot into your rear armor. Fortunately they aren’t packing much firepower so hopefully they won’t do any lasting damage. This locust made the mistake of only generating three evasion pips to shoot me in the back. Here you can see I’m about to walk backwards and fire my four medium lasers into its rear arc (look at the red circle segment at its feet) with a pretty good chance to hit!

    7b1wQid.jpg

    After those three mechs, you’ve got a couple more tanks. And then finally a Wolverine (55) and two turrets. Stick to cover if you can. If you can get your whole lance hitting the Wolverine in the same arc (right, front or left) it will go down much faster than if you spread your shots around.

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    After that, cut scene. On to…

    B3fajRH.jpg

    THREE YEARS LATER
    At this point the game will start telling you useful things in pop ups and info dumps, like this text about resolve:

    TtWvZ31.jpg

    Unfortunately, your resolve bar is empty at the point at which it tells you this. Not effective pedagogy, game! Soon there will be some whole page blocks of text that is good info at the wrong time. I’ll screenshot them here, and you can come back to them whenever you actually need them.

    This mission is in a Badlands biome, which means you only sink 85% of your heat. So you (and your opponents) will run hotter here than you would in a rainforest or arctic clime. Lots of useful info like this tucked away in the lower left hand corner of the screen. Check in on what it’s telling you from time to time.

    agFo1H0.jpg

    Okay, you are: you in your Blackjack (45, jumpjets reactivated). You have 4 medium lasers and two AC2’s, which don’t do much damage but are very long range and very little heat. Quite good damage output, but you can def. overheat alphaing every turn.

    Glitch in a Vindicator (45). The Vindicator is a solid medium mech with a PPC (powerful energy weapon – good range, good damage, lots of heat), a medium laser, a small laser and a 5 pack of long range missiles. Glitch has the multishot skill. It has jump jets.

    Behemoth in a Shadowhawk (55). The Shadowhawk is an absolute workhorse for you in the early and even mid game. It’s stock loadout is an AC5, a medium laser, an LRM 5 like the vindicator and a 2 pack of short range missiles. It’s also got a secret melee damage boost if you end up getting close. It has jump jets.

    Dekker in a Spider (30). The stock configuration Spider is a deathtrap. It is 8 jump jets and two medium lasers wrapped in tissue paper. Also, for a mech with only two medium lasers, it is surprisingly easy to overheat as jumping near or at full distance generates a ton of heat.

    ZZo1x1g.jpg

    Job one is to take out some turrets. Jump Dekker out of harm’s way to the right behind that rock formation. Move your other three up to those woods in the middle of the image:

    KJsovOi.jpg

    Here are a couple of info dump pop ups about ARMOR & INTERNAL STRUCTURE and FACING that are almost but not quite useful at the moment at which you get them.
    wSjZQZ2.jpg
    LTw0iNg.jpg

    Reserve your turn and let the two light mechs come to your main force. You may get sensor locked by the turrets and take a little indirect missile fire. No worries. Once you’ve reserved all the way but before your other mechs have moved, sneak Dekker around to the woods down the hill of the buildings and fire on the turret generator here:

    HlBNziy.jpg

    Then finish it off with your other long range weapons. Glich's PPC and LRM are good for this. Blowing up the 100 HP building will destroy the 4 turrets. That takes the odds from 4 v. 6 to 4 v. 2 in your favor. Keep Dekker out of harm’s way and use your superior force to blow up the two light mechs, a Commando (25) and Spider (30).

    TO HIT MODIFIERS – BATTLETECH has a lot of information that you don’t know yet. For example, some weapons have minimum range, like PPCs and long range missiles. Autocannons have a refire penalty for firing sequential turns. Being up high gives you a bonus to hit. Range affects your chance. And on and on. If you mouseover a weapon that is aimed at a target and is giving you a percentage change to hit, the game will tell you what is affecting your odds:

    QybT3lQ.jpg

    In this image, for example, our Blackjack is taking a close range shot at one of those two light mechs. It’s AC/2’s are long range weapons (one of the longest in the game.) Firing at something right next to you with AC/2’s gives a substantial penalty to hit (until your pilots level up and bypass it.)

    There is a ton of information in the game just a right click or mouseover away. If you are confused, see if the game is willing to share some useful intel with you.

    INFO DUMPS on HEAT, STABILITY, CALLED SHOTS and RESOLVE
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    After you dispatch the two lights, three more enemies drop in and you are told to go blow up them and a building. The enemies are two tanks and a Shadowhawk (55).

    If you rotate your screen from those woods you were in, it looks like this:

    MGJaqaW.jpg

    Use Reserve to let the Shadowhawk come to you, and then focus fire it with your three mediums. In the future you’ll actually worry about how you destroy a mech, in order to take home more salvage including whole working mechs. But for now, no salvage - blast away! Remember facing – if everyone comes in on the left side of the Shadowhawk, you’ll take off arms and torsos (and their weapons) faster, and beeline for that center torso kill.

    You can probably ignore the tanks until the Shadowhawk is down. One of them may lob some missiles at you. If you are in cover and don’t have exposed internals facing it, you should be fine.

    Move Dekker around the edge of the map far away from everyone. Once the Shadowhawk and tanks are engaged with your other forces, he’s going to pop that building from cover.

    wmXHwyz.jpg

    There are actually four turrets on your side in the little complex where you started. If the tanks come far enough up the road, they may sensor lock the tanks, enabling your Vindicator and Shadowhawk to fire LRMs at it indirectly.

    After the three OpFor are blown up and Dekker has killed the building, head back to base.

    NDajN9V.jpg

    Surprise – your employer is betraying you! Kill the turret generator ASAP. Doing that takes the odds from 4 v. 7 to 4 v. 3. Then mop up the remaining vehicles.

    STOMPING VEHICLES – It may or may not come up here, but I’ll mention that mechs do double melee damage versus vehicles. This is enormously satisfying.

    jxBOKr3.jpg

    It’s a very viable strategy well into the late game. Just be careful that you will get the kill and that doing so doesn’t leave you exposed. The last thing you want to do is stomp one vehicle only to be left out of cover and open to return fire from a mech escort or another vehicle in a convoy.

    Done – let’s get out of Dodge!

    jVjWOLb.jpg

    Having run you through three poor tutorials on combat, the game now unceremoniously dumps you in the deep end of mech repair and configuration, pilot management, contract negotiation, warring faction reputations, finances, interstellar travel, and more with only this to say:

    uBaQlxK.jpg

    Welcome to the deep end. Hope you can swim!

    PART 2: THROWN IN THE DEEP END
    [Under Construction]

    Iolo on
    Lt. Iolo's First Day
    Steam profile.
    Getting started with BATTLETECH: Part 1 / Part 2
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  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    New Tex Talks tonight: the Mackie

    Ianator
  • BRIAN BLESSEDBRIAN BLESSED Maybe you aren't SPEAKING LOUDLY ENOUGHHH Registered User regular
    This is some shit that would get you big ups on GameFAQs back in its heyday, this rules

    BetsuniOrcaIanatorMorninglordGiantGeek2020
  • PeasPeas Registered User regular
    Hey folks I just started out and is enjoying the game a lot but I feel like things suddenly went up a couple of notch and all the enemies are getting too tanky, no much I can do when they just beat me through sheer attrition

    Any tips to increase my damage?

    5myiokloks5d.png
  • see317see317 Registered User regular
    Peas wrote: »
    Hey folks I just started out and is enjoying the game a lot but I feel like things suddenly went up a couple of notch and all the enemies are getting too tanky, no much I can do when they just beat me through sheer attrition

    Any tips to increase my damage?

    What are you using, mech wise?
    How are you modifying them?

    Ringo wrote: »
    Well except what see317 said. That guy's always wrong.
  • cB557cB557 voOOP Registered User regular
    Peas wrote: »
    Hey folks I just started out and is enjoying the game a lot but I feel like things suddenly went up a couple of notch and all the enemies are getting too tanky, no much I can do when they just beat me through sheer attrition

    Any tips to increase my damage?
    Are you making sure to bring an appropriate drop tonnage for a mission's threat rating?

  • PeasPeas Registered User regular
    edited September 7
    see317 wrote: »
    Peas wrote: »
    Hey folks I just started out and is enjoying the game a lot but I feel like things suddenly went up a couple of notch and all the enemies are getting too tanky, no much I can do when they just beat me through sheer attrition

    Any tips to increase my damage?

    What are you using, mech wise?
    How are you modifying them?
    cB557 wrote: »
    Peas wrote: »
    Hey folks I just started out and is enjoying the game a lot but I feel like things suddenly went up a couple of notch and all the enemies are getting too tanky, no much I can do when they just beat me through sheer attrition

    Any tips to increase my damage?
    Are you making sure to bring an appropriate drop tonnage for a mission's threat rating?

    I am actually still using mechs with their default setup because I don't really have anything much of anything. Drooling at all the mechs I couldn't buy at the stores.

    My best mech is the free Centurion which I refitted to it's normal loadout

    Peas on
    5myiokloks5d.png
  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    edited September 7
    The normal loadouts are usually pretty flawed. I highly recommend a few changes:

    Increase the armor. You can just hit the max armor and then pile whatever else fits in, but I find that gives up too much DPS for my liking. My target is a min of 720, preferably around 800 for mediums. Typically max the arms, side torsos get arms + 10 or 60-70 armor, CT gets 20-40 above that, legs get ST + 10-20, max head, and I typically got a bit light on the rear armor (20-30 for the STs, 40-50 for the rear CT). This is going off memory so I might have fucked up things here if someone wants to break open the game to double-check.

    Medium lasers are maximum damage per weight, but have high heat. Going disco ball with medium lasers isn't a bad way to go. I generally prefer to rely on SRM6s if I'm going that route though. SRM6s are basically a low heat shotgun that deal good damage. Medium lasers deal more focused damage, but have extremely high heat. Early game my usual is something like an AC/5 (low heat, long range, almost as much punch as a large laser, but heavy), coupled to a few medium lasers and an SRM6. 4 mechs equipped like that give me plenty of firepower in close and enough punch at range to be useful. I don't like LRMs, but other folks swear by them. People that like LRMs prefer fitting e.g. the Centurion as an LRM boat, which is a role it fulfills admirably well.

    If you have the Heavy Metal DLC, if you can get your hands on some UAC/2s or UAC/5s, those things are ridiculously good., especially in their +damage variants.

    In the medium era I find Jump Jets to be highly useful and usually fit every mech with at least 3, and most I just max it out.

    I tend to target a buildup of no more than 25 heat per turn with a full alpha strike--if I'm netting more heat than that I'll yank off a weapon, add a few heatsinks, etc. In the medium era there isn't a whole lot of extra space between the need for reasonable armor and a loadout heavy enough to do some damage so it's rare that I end up with even a handful of heatsinks.

    If you're having trouble, try to focus down a single target and cycle different mechs to be closer to the hostiles. The AI is generally pretty dumb and often will just shoot at the closest thing to it. Go for side torsos, legs, etc. Yeah, you're losing scrap, but it's worse to end up with weeks of repair on your first mission on a planet. As your pilots skill up, called shot becomes more useful--once you can start blowing legs off, mechs start going down quick since everyone can pile in and core out a mech that has been knocked down. Don't bother trying to decapitate mechs until you hit 18% called shot to the head and have weapons that can do it in one shot--so probably heavy era at the earliest.

    Remember your facing! If you can spread out and nail a mech in the side you can rip off dangerous weapons. If you can sneak in behind them you can frequently core them out with one or two alphas. Just be ready to hightail it outta there if hostiles spawn in behind you.

    Orca on
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  • BullheadBullhead Registered User regular
    Finally remembered to post these -

    First up, we have my first ever flashpoint reward! What's the rare item inside that loot box?!?
    A Flipping Jenner. I run a nearly 400 ton lance and this is my reward??Z6y9d5r.png

    Next, while doing a later flashpoint mission, While i was engaged with one enemy lance, a second lance of a third party dropped in, and happened to drop in driectly on top of one of the enemy mechs. As chance would have it the exact same model mech dropped on top of the one there, leading to two mech standing in one spot! The green one is the second one that dropped in, the red one is the original.
    YDagOVf.jpg

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  • PeasPeas Registered User regular
    I want to mention that the voice actors really did a good job of conveying how horrible dying in a mech is

    5myiokloks5d.png
    IoloNipsJaysonFourElvenshaeTynnan
  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Peas wrote: »
    see317 wrote: »
    Peas wrote: »
    Hey folks I just started out and is enjoying the game a lot but I feel like things suddenly went up a couple of notch and all the enemies are getting too tanky, no much I can do when they just beat me through sheer attrition

    Any tips to increase my damage?

    What are you using, mech wise?
    How are you modifying them?
    cB557 wrote: »
    Peas wrote: »
    Hey folks I just started out and is enjoying the game a lot but I feel like things suddenly went up a couple of notch and all the enemies are getting too tanky, no much I can do when they just beat me through sheer attrition

    Any tips to increase my damage?
    Are you making sure to bring an appropriate drop tonnage for a mission's threat rating?

    I am actually still using mechs with their default setup because I don't really have anything much of anything. Drooling at all the mechs I couldn't buy at the stores.

    My best mech is the free Centurion which I refitted to it's normal loadout

    I did a post a bit ago about fits and it might be worth going back to dredge it up

    In general though the way to not get murdered in battletech is Jump Jets. Each evasion pip is worth -10% to hit for an enemy. Jump jets let you get near sprint quality evasion while still being able to shoot or brace and being able to perfectly set your facing! They eat a lot of heat but they’re worth it.

    Heat management is also highly variable on your pilot skills. With high guts you can make a much larger overheat percentage. And tune some pretty extreme builds.

    This is new and refocuses some of the thoughts from earlier. In general your heat target for a full jump plus a full alpha should be about 2x(heat sinking)-5. Or 2x (heat sinking) - full jump. Note: full jump heat is ~2x average jump heat

    The idea is that you can jump in, alpha, then jump out and not fire or sprint out and not fire and be back down to base heat. (This of course depends on biome). The reason for this cycle is that it tends to be both better in terms of maximizing evasion pips and it frontloads damage to take down mechs faster and its slightly easier on a mechs fitting requirements as it will tend to let you fit higher variance weapons.

    If you have two BattleMech bays you can specialize based on biome. Desert biomes go down to 65% heat sink effectiveness and polar goes up to 1.2. As a result you need more heat sinks for desert biome than you do for polar and fitting based on this will let you maximize for each biome.

    wbBv3fj.png
    Peas
  • IoloIolo iolo Registered User regular
    edited September 18
    Lots of new players cropping up. Been meaning to put this together for a while. Feedback from you experienced lot is welcome:

    GETTING STARTED WITH BATTLETECH
    A walkthrough for the first few hours.

    Part 1 walked through the game’s three tutorial missions.

    Here in Part 2 we’re going to take a high level look at things back on your ship, make a little bit of sense of everything going on, and give you a little bit more direction than the game does for your first 30-90 days.

    Contains very minor spoilers.

    PART TWO – THROWN IN THE DEEP END

    TOP FIVE TIPS
    1. FACING MATTERS – A lot of getting good at BATTLETECH’s combat is about using facing to your advantage. Twist your mechs to control where enemy damage is coming in. Understand where your damage is going to hit. If you are fighting a Hunchback (50) with its terrifying AC/20, you are much, much better off attacking it through its right side to disable the massive source of damage. If you kill it from the left, it has that many more chances to shoot at you. If you kill it from the front, your damage will be spread around and it will have more chances to shoot at you.

    2. UP ARMOR! - Armor damage is repaired instantly and for free after every mission (along with ammo refilling.) As soon as you take damage through armor to internal structure, though, you have to spend money and time repairing that mech before it can be fielded again. In the early game especially this can lead to a lot of idle time orbiting a planet waiting for repairs. That’s time your mechs aren’t on the battlefield earning C-bills. Almost all stock builds have too little armor – bulk them up to increase survivability and earnings over time.

    3. UPGRADE WHILE IN TRANSIT – Traveling from system to system takes time. Use that transit time to make your repairs/upgrades in transit when possible. Sometimes you’ll arrive in a system and have to orbit for a few days for that 18 day rebuild of your Blackjack to finish. But that’s a lot better than just orbiting a planet for 18 days not making any money. In general, do the missions in a system and then do your repairs and upgrades on the way to the next planet.

    4. BAD INTEL – There is a ‘feature’ in the game where bad intel can cause the actual rating of a mission to be +/- 1.5 skulls off the advertised value. So if your two skull weight lance confidently drops in on a two skull escort mission, it could turn out to be a 3.5 skull mission in disguise. Sometimes these are great opportunities to salvage a mech that’s an upgrade for your lance! Sometimes you end up in over your head. In those times…

    5. WITHDRAW/EJECT – The most criminal omission from the tutorials is that you can withdraw from any non-story mission with almost no penalty (just a small reputation hit.) The game difficulty expects that you are going to have to withdraw from at least a few missions. Beats a total party wipe! The button is in the upper right hand corner.

    VQGvloQ.jpg

    On a smaller scale, if just one of your mechs is on the verge of being destroyed, or has rare components exposed to damage, or one of your pilots is in danger of getting killed – you can eject. This destroys the mech’s head but otherwise saves it, and keeps the pilot alive. The red button is a cleverly hidden above the mech paper doll in the lower left:

    rzL5cvu.jpg

    FINANCES
    The only way you can lose the game is not having enough money when the monthly bills come due. Keep an eye on that and everything else – total lance wipes, pilot deaths and what have you – can all be survived.

    Usually if you are at a planet, you can sell some old mechs or parts to have enough money to make payroll. The most dangerous time to be low on cash is when you are in transit since you won’t have access to a store. Check that your finances are okay before you jump to another system.

    One note for the campaign: The story missions all have huge cash payouts, as well as often very generous salvage. There's no clock on them. You can grind missions from the merc board as much as you want and the story missions will wait for you. Sometimes that's a good idea to leve up your pilots and mechs. That said, those storyline missions pay lavishly, so use that to your advantage as needed.

    PILOTS
    SKILLS - After the tutorial missions you have some experience points to spend on your pilots. Head to the Barracks to do some up-skilling:

    9QXMXla.jpg

    Bulwark is the best skill in the game. It massively increases survivability, reducing damage while in cover and reducing stability damage taken. For your first playthrough, I recommend all or nearly all of your pilots take Bulwark as a skill. Guts in general adds pilot health and at higher levels increase your overheat threshold (which lets you put out more damage per turn). Guts also eventually reduces autocannon refire penalties.

    We talked about Multishot in Park 1. It is a very good skill, and having high gunnery helps your pilots hit things which is obviously good.

    Piloting helps land melee hits, increases your unsteady threshold, increases max evasion and at higher levels increases hit defense. (There is a mathematically compelling case to be made that piloting skills are better than Bulwark. This may be true, but in my opinion is viable only as a late game strategy with deep knowledge of the gameplay systems and with access to rare mechs and equipment like +dodge gyros. Stick with Bulwark to get started.)

    Tactics at levels 6 and 9 improves your ability to land precision shots on particular body parts. This is very, very (!) important for the mid and late game. Early on, though, it is not as important as increasing to hit chances and survivability. Tactics also improves your to hit chances on indirect fire. The Sensor Lock ability is very handy, especially if you have other mechs in your lance with LRMs that can fire indirectly.

    EARLY PILOT SKILL RECOMMENDATIONS - I recommend most of your pilots get Multishot (Gunnery 5) and Bulwark (Guts 5). Maybe pick one pilot to have Bulwark and Sensor Lock (Tactics 5).

    After a pilot has its first two skills locked in, get:
    • Gunnery to 5 (if a Sensor Lock pilot)
    • Piloting to 4 (+1 unsteady threshold)
    • Guts to 6 (+15 heat threshold)
    • Piloting to 6 (+1 hit defense)
    • Tactics to 6 (Called shot bonus)

    That’s not written in stone, and under this strategy there are exceptions. If you land an early Trebuchet, for example, maybe you need a pilot with better Tactics to lob those LRMs over hills. If your first heavy is a Grasshopper, maybe you push piloting to make it a punchmaster/hit defense machine. Etc. But this is a good start to get you going if needed.

    HIRING HALL – Pretty straight forward. You can hire more pilots here. From head hits and knockdowns, your pilots will eventually end up in medbay, and you’ll need to rotate others through. It’s not a bad idea to pick up an extra pilot or two, especially if you find one with Bulwark or Multishot already. Here I’ve found one with Bulwark, so I’m going to pick up Oriole

    a9ZB3Xk.jpg

    Don't grab too many pilots, though. You have to pay them all every month whether you field them or not.

    STORE
    It’s a store and you can buy and sell stuff.

    Note most of those mechs being sold are only mech parts – you need three to assemble a full mech. Don’t spend your wad on a Marauder (<3) to find you only bought one third of one. You can see how many parts are available to buy (tiny number above the mech piece) and how many you have (x/3) above the picture of the mech on the right.)

    UR8usBl.jpg

    Understanding the store will come with time. Early on you are probably only going in there when you need something for a mech build before you’ve accumulated a lot of salvaged parts. I did luck out in this campaign to find an AC/5 with +5 damage. Normally I don’t spend a lot on + weapons until my stock mechs are rebuilt and my pilots are leveled up a bit. This is a workhorse weapon with +damage, though, and is going to bump my DPS over time pretty markedly by getting it early. So I’m going to splurge and put it on my Shadowhawk.

    8GnVT4B.jpg

    Early builds are often very constrained by what you have on hand and in the store. For example, I like to drop the LRM 5 and SRM 2 from the starting Shadowhawk, and replace it with an SRM 6. But for this campaign I’ve started, I don’t have one and there are none in the store. Instead I swapped the LRM 5 and its ammo for two more SRM 2s, getting my SRM 6 the hard way.

    Personal note: I tend to buy all the small lasers I see in stores until I have 6+ of them on hand between buying and salvage. They are an incredible utility weapon, and I hate not having them on hand.

    Don’t neglect selling stuff if you need the cash. Before you know it you’ll be swimming in unneeded Locusts and Spiders. Those are a great source of cash if you need it for upgrades, especially when you get the Argo and want to make improvements there.

    MISSIONS
    Mission offerings are very limited early in the campaign. You are an outcast on the periphery of occupied space, so the pickings are slim. Take what you can get and move the story along.

    When you pick a mission you negotiate your contract balancing cash, salvage and reputation. Don’t worry about reputation to start in the campaign. You’ll get a feel for cash v. salvage over time. Even early on, though, when you are fighting infinite Locust, Spiders and light tanks, don’t neglect salvage. You can often get key weapon systems you need for your own upgrades.

    W1zgjlp.jpg

    A complete overview of missions is a little more than this guide is tackling, but a few notes:

    Mind the ‘bad intel’ effect discussed above. Withdraw if you get in over your head rather than lose all your mechs.

    Be sure to check the biome. Missions on Lunar or Martian biomes are much harder for having very little heat sinking. Avoid those out of the gate if you can (except for the story missions which are stupidly in those environments early.)

    If you are defending something, like a base or a convoy, the enemy will be initially very focused on blowing that thing up. Once you hit or even fire at an enemy mech, though, it will fire on your mechs instead. Defensive missions are initially about tagging all enemies to get their attention (multishot is very good at this.), and then focus firing them down. Don’t be frustrated if you lose a building or vehicle early on. Sometimes if the enemy gets to move before you do there’s nothing you can do.

    Reinforcements will often spawn in behind you. That’s BATTLETECH, Baby! In base defense in particular, there is almost always a second wave that will come in from another direction. Don’t overcommit one way and not have anyone back who can at least tag the enemies while the rest of the lance hustles back to help blow them up.

    Assassination missions can be a great chance to encounter an enemy mech that would be an upgrade for your lance. Some of the first heavy and assault mechs you encounter outside the story missions will likely be in Assassination missions. Good opportunity for salvage!

    TRAVEL
    Early on in the campaign your universe is very small:

    Bo7qdTS.jpg

    In most cases you want to be traveling from system to system by taking a mission offered in another system that will pay for your transit.

    Later on, things will open up and you’ll be able to be choosier. Maybe you don’t want another escort mission in a desert biome on a hot and rocky planet. Maybe you want to splurge 30,000 C-Bills to get to that jungle world and see what missions are available there!

    The most important things about travel early on is that it is downtime you can use for repairs and mech refitting.

    EVENTS - You will also sometimes encounter scripted events while in transit. These are generally well written and fun, and sometimes have rewards or losses or boosts/downgrades to various abilities and stats.

    MECHBAY & SAMPLE REBUILD
    Your starting lineup is three solid mediums and two risky lights.

    The Blackjack, Vindicator and Shadowhawk are all solid starting points. All of them are stock builds, though, and could use some tweaking to improve survivability, especially upping front armor in the arms and torso.

    The Spider and Locust are super fragile. Replace these as soon as possible. I recommend keeping them out of combat if you take them (Bring them with a pilot for EXP, but keep them out of harms way.) With stock builds, even a single weapon hit can punch through armor to internals.

    Volumes have been written about Battletech mech configuration and weapon pros and cons. I won’t attempt to summarize it all here. A few pointers for BATTLETECH and then we’ll do one sample build of the starting Blackjack.

    GENERAL MECH CUSTOMIZATION GUIDELINES
    • Add more armor. Armor improves survivability and decrease time in the repair bay not earning C-Bills. Arms, side torsos and head should be maxxed for sure. You can get by with a little less in the center torso, legs and back. Make sure your back can take at least a medium laser hit on your lights, and at least a large laser hit on your mediums and higher.
    • Mouseover tells the story. Mouseover the bars in the upper left hand corner of the mech refit screen to get important information about firepower, durability and heat efficiency.
    • Everybody jumps. I favor a playstyle taking advantage of facing and positioning. Jumping is crucial to this – getting into the right firing arc, or getting out of harms way. It’s also very handy in story missions for getting your whole team where you want them to be on time. For me – everyone jumps.
    • Put ammo in the legs. If ammo takes a critical hit, it explodes and takes that mech section with it. Don’t lose valuable weapons (or have a center torso instant kill) with an ammo explosion. Losing a leg is no picnic, but it’s generally better than losing a torso.
    • Heat management is a fundamental concept in BATTLETECH. It takes some getting used to. How hot you build your mechs is a matter of personal preference. I will say that I recommend building them a little bit hot (firing all weapons generates more heat than can be sinked in one turn.) Heat is damage, so building a heat neutral mech means you are often leaving damage on the table since you won’t be alpha-ing every turn (for range reasons, positioning, melee, etc.) You’ll have to develop your own comfort level with heat. I usually aim for 4-6 over heat sinking, not including support weapon heat. That’s pretty conservative, though, and can definitely be played with (especially as your pilots and gear get upgrades that help mitigate heat.)
    • Hardpoints dictate what weapons you can put on a mech. Your Blackjack (45) with its AC and laser hardpoints is never going to be a missile boat. The Orion (75) mech is fantastic, supports a lot of build variety and you will pump your fist when you score your first one. But it doesn’t have any support weapon hardpoints, so it is never going to be an ideal punchbot.
    • The faster a mech is, the less room there is in it for weapons and components. You can’t change the speed of a mech in BATTLETECH, so that’s just a limiter of the mech type. The Assassin (40) for example, is very, very fast and as such has almost no room for weapons. It’s going to be hard to make a good mech out of it no matter what you do. The Centurion (50) on the other hand has the same plodding speed as a heavy mech. While many of its medium mech peers can move farther per turn, the Centurion allows for more armor and weapons. Sometimes moving more is a virtue, but watch out for the mechs where their speed is a DPS limiter. This happens especially at the bottom of a weight band like the Assassin (40) or Dragon (60).
    • Support weapons – small lasers, machine guns and flamers – fire automatically after you melee. If your mech will be punching things and has support hard points, consider throwing some small lasers on there and it’ll boost your damage and crit seeking.
    • Embrace the dead side. Some mechs have a natural ‘dead’ side that you can present to the enemy without risking your weapons. The Griffin (55) is like this, with both it’s PPC and LRM launcher on one side of its body. Some mechs have their hardpoints evenly distributed cross them, with weapons in both arms and/or torsos. You can make a deadside in those mechs my shifting weapons to one side. Not every mech wants a dead side, but having one and playing it that way with facing the enemy with it can be useful.

    SAMPLE BUILD – BLACKJACK

    How you rebuild your mechs early on will vary according to what weapons and components you have access. Here’s a sample redo of the starter Blackjack to make use of transit time to another system:

    Here is the stock Blackjack:

    QodpuUJ.jpg

    It is somewhat slow for a medium (it has the speed of an average heavy), and so it has a lot of room for weapons and ammo. It has jump jets, and quite good damage output for its weight. It has two autocannon 2’s and 4 medium lasers. It runs hot firing turn after turn, and it has decent but not good armor overall. Also note it is an accident waiting to happen with its AC ammo in the center torso. BOOM!

    Let’s start by stripping the components (except the jump jets, which we know we’re keeping.)

    Wbyku7y.jpg

    Available tonnage is 18 tons for armor, weapons, ammo and components.

    AMMO - To get started, make sure each ammo using weapon has 10-15 shots. Over time you'll get more of a feel where your comfort level is. If you embrace a punchy playstyle, you may use less. If you load up on long range missiile boats with a tanky forward spotter, you might want more.

    Next let’s use the handy MAX ARMOR button:

    El0PDPo.jpg

    pGNoF5i.jpg

    That added 3.31 tons of armor. I want all of that in the arms and side torsos. We can dial that back a touch in the CT, legs and rear.

    SNQFNqU.jpg

    Okay, that’s +2 tons armor from stock, with 16 tons to play with.

    My normal rebuild of the Blackjack is to replace the two low damage AC/2s with a single AC/5. In this campaign we found a +5 damage autocannon 5 in the store, so we’re using that. One ton of ammo is fine for that. And I want at least two medium lasers. That gets us to:

    BcmcI9F.jpg

    Note that I’ve moused over HEAT EFFICIENCY in the upper, left hand corner. A normal mech sinks 30 heat per turn for free. So far we generate 32 heat on an alpha strike with 30 heat sinking. That leaves us some room for more damage.

    zMiFbKE.jpg

    I’ve added another medium laser. I put it in the arm with our autocannon, making one side of our mech more precious and one side a dead side of sorts. We will need to position the mech accordingly in combat.

    Now heat is over where I want it. It's up at 44 alpha over 30 heat sinking. Time to add some heat sinks!

    08qkaeM.jpg

    That’s better. +3 heat sinks gives us +9 heat sinking. So our alpha is only 5 over sinking. That’s right in my comfort zone.

    With one ton left, I want to use the Blackjack’s two support hard points to add small lasers. I don’t factor these into my regular heat assessment since I won’t be in range to fire these most of the time. They have great damage to weight ratio, though, so when I can fire them I’ll be happy to have them. And they fire for free after a melee strike – so if I am warmed up and take a heat break by punching somebody, it’ll boost my damage output there as well.

    C5Xt8Yu.jpg

    Done! Note that it’s 23 days to build, which is a lot in the early game. Transit to another planet is taking 16 days, so I’ll still need to orbit the planet idly for 7 days after we arrive before I can take the mech into battle. That is a bummer, but worthwhile to get all that armor on and have the mech configured in a way I’ll be able to use it for probably 10+ more missions.

    JUST A FEW MORE COMBAT TIPS
    We talked a lot about combat nuts and bolts in Part 1. Just a few more tips as you go out there and get some mech stomping practice in:

    FACING & POSITIONING – If you have ready even a little of this guide to this point, you have heard the gospel of facing and positioning. Pay attention to what side of your mechs you are exposing to fire. Pay attention to what side of enemies you are attacking. Use positioning, especially jump jets, to get the facing/positioning you want.

    ROTATE MECHS OUT OF FIRE – The enemy AI is not scared to focus fire your mechs. If it seems like they are picking on one of yours, fall back and bring other mechs up to take some shots.

    RESOLVE ABILITIES – Your resolve bar fills up in combat. When it is over 50% full, your team gets a blanket accuracy boost. Resolve also powers two special abilities: Precision Shot and Vigilance.

    In the mid to late game, the meta is all about Precision Shot and using it to maximize salvage, bringing home more and better mechs. In the early game, though, it is really only effective as a very mild to hit chance boost. Your low gunnery, low tactics pilots are not going to hit specific parts very often.

    The other resolve ability – VIGILANCE – is hugely useful in the early game and often forgotten. Vigilance braces your mech but still lets them fire that turn. Especially coupled with Bulwark, which boosts the effect of bracing, this lets your front liners move and shoot, even under fire.

    Bracing also completely zeros out your stability meter. As the early game becomes the mid game, you will encounter situations where a whole bunch of enemies shoot at your mech with autocannons and missiles, especially the first time you encounter missile carrier tanks. If you don’t take care of that, they’ll knock you over with stability damage and go to town on your prone mech. Imagine their surprise when you yell “CONSTANT VIGILANCE” Mad Moody style and keep firing merrily away without being knocked down!

    BEWARE THE 'ALMOST DEAD' MECH - Even a weaponless, armless, one legged mech can melee. And the AI loves to melee. Don't factor out some mech that you've nearly killed, or it will stand up and punch your best pilot in the head. That's BATTLETECH, Baby!

    KILL SRM CARRIERS ON SIGHT. These tanks are rude, and will ruin your day. LRM carriers too, but SRM carriers need to die immediately every time.

    30-90 DAY GOALS
    Just a few things to work on in as you get started
    • Improve a few of your mechs while traveling
    • Get a bunch of your pilots up to their first two skills
    • Salvage a better mech than the Spider/Locust
    • Advance the story a bit and get the Argo

    Iolo on
    Lt. Iolo's First Day
    Steam profile.
    Getting started with BATTLETECH: Part 1 / Part 2
    PeasNobodyBetsuniBullheadOrcaFishmanMirkelcB557A Dabble Of TheloniusArk EvensongNipsIanatorExtreaminatusJaysonFourMorninglordironsizideElvenshaeTynnanSneaksBRIAN BLESSEDJedoc
  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    It's pretty rare someone puts out that much verbiage that I have nothing to add to or quibble with, but Iolo, well done. That is a fantastic beginner's guide. The step-by-step "here is how I go about redesigning my mechs" tutorial is an inspired idea. Nicely done.

    @Nips Can we get these linked in the OP?

    MirkelExtreaminatusJaysonFourTynnan
  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    edited September 7
    Goumindong wrote: »
    Peas wrote: »
    see317 wrote: »
    Peas wrote: »
    Hey folks I just started out and is enjoying the game a lot but I feel like things suddenly went up a couple of notch and all the enemies are getting too tanky, no much I can do when they just beat me through sheer attrition

    Any tips to increase my damage?

    What are you using, mech wise?
    How are you modifying them?
    cB557 wrote: »
    Peas wrote: »
    Hey folks I just started out and is enjoying the game a lot but I feel like things suddenly went up a couple of notch and all the enemies are getting too tanky, no much I can do when they just beat me through sheer attrition

    Any tips to increase my damage?
    Are you making sure to bring an appropriate drop tonnage for a mission's threat rating?

    I am actually still using mechs with their default setup because I don't really have anything much of anything. Drooling at all the mechs I couldn't buy at the stores.

    My best mech is the free Centurion which I refitted to it's normal loadout

    I did a post a bit ago about fits and it might be worth going back to dredge it up

    In general though the way to not get murdered in battletech is Jump Jets. Each evasion pip is worth -10% to hit for an enemy. Jump jets let you get near sprint quality evasion while still being able to shoot or brace and being able to perfectly set your facing! They eat a lot of heat but they’re worth it.

    Heat management is also highly variable on your pilot skills. With high guts you can make a much larger overheat percentage. And tune some pretty extreme builds.

    This is new and refocuses some of the thoughts from earlier. In general your heat target for a full jump plus a full alpha should be about 2x(heat sinking)-5. Or 2x (heat sinking) - full jump. Note: full jump heat is ~2x average jump heat

    The idea is that you can jump in, alpha, then jump out and not fire or sprint out and not fire and be back down to base heat. (This of course depends on biome). The reason for this cycle is that it tends to be both better in terms of maximizing evasion pips and it frontloads damage to take down mechs faster and its slightly easier on a mechs fitting requirements as it will tend to let you fit higher variance weapons.

    If you have two BattleMech bays you can specialize based on biome. Desert biomes go down to 65% heat sink effectiveness and polar goes up to 1.2. As a result you need more heat sinks for desert biome than you do for polar and fitting based on this will let you maximize for each biome.

    Jumpjets are quite useful but they generate significant heat. Max jumpdistance = 30 x number of jumpjets. Heat = distance moved / 6. So for example, jumping max distance with 6 jumpjets (180m) will generate 30 heat, consuming all your mech's base heatsinking ability (-30/turn) for the turn. So by your rule, such a mech build (barring any extra heatsinks) would only be able to have a full alpha equal to 2 medium lasers. To me that would be pretty undergunned as a general rule. And if your strategy after every jump and 2 medium lasers is running away for a turn to cool down, in my opinion, you may be better off to run in, fire off 4 medium lasers for slightly less total heat, and run away for a turn to cool down. Twice the damage per period would mean killing things in half the time on average, which to me can be worth more than the 10, 20, 30% extra damage mitigation you'd get via jumping. But then again my general philosophy with this game is not "the best offense is a good defense" that many others have but rather "the best offense is a good offense". So I use jumpjets sparingly for advantageous positioning (rear attacks) or quickly getting around terrain features, not general movement once engaged.


    More jumpjet tips: If you are moving in open terrain, you'll generate as much evasion by walking/sprinting as jumping but without generating heat. So in that case you shouldn't be wasting the heat by jumping. Moving through forest or water however slows you down, so jumping will generate more evasion and allow you to move farther in that case.

    Jumping's other drawback is that it prevents you from regaining stability after your turn. So if you a constantly jumping, while you are less likely to be hit due to evasion, you are more likely to be knocked down and that can be a death sentence. And to mitigate the stability issue, you'll be burning Morale on Vigilance more often which means you can't use it for Precision Strikes as often to help you kill faster.

    SiliconStew on
    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
    Peas
  • Ark EvensongArk Evensong The NetherlandsRegistered User regular
    Jumpjets are quite useful but they generate significant heat. Max jumpdistance = 30 x number of jumpjets. Heat = distance moved / 6. So for example, jumping max distance with 6 jumpjets (180m) will generate 30 heat ...
    Tiny correction: max jump distance is 30 x [jumpjets +1], until you get to 7 jumpjets at max 240/40 distance/heat. 8th jumpjet only offers +15, at max 255/43 distance/heat.
    Of note, the "hexes" / dots on the map are spaced 24 units apart on a straight line, with some odd behind-the-scenes rounding. (Unless they changed this in one of the last patches, since I kinda stopped playing once Urban Warfare hit - PC couldn't handle the urban environments very well, and I haven't upgraded yet.) I made a chart once, and I think it should still be valid:
    egds8psam3eb.png
    (Back to lurking)

    FishmanIoloMirkel
  • NipsNips Luxuriating in existential crisis.Registered User regular
    Orca wrote: »
    It's pretty rare someone puts out that much verbiage that I have nothing to add to or quibble with, but Iolo, well done. That is a fantastic beginner's guide. The step-by-step "here is how I go about redesigning my mechs" tutorial is an inspired idea. Nicely done.

    @Nips Can we get these linked in the OP?

    Papers Pushed!

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  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    Jumpjets are quite useful but they generate significant heat. Max jumpdistance = 30 x number of jumpjets. Heat = distance moved / 6. So for example, jumping max distance with 6 jumpjets (180m) will generate 30 heat ...
    Tiny correction: max jump distance is 30 x [jumpjets +1], until you get to 7 jumpjets at max 240/40 distance/heat. 8th jumpjet only offers +15, at max 255/43 distance/heat.
    Of note, the "hexes" / dots on the map are spaced 24 units apart on a straight line, with some odd behind-the-scenes rounding. (Unless they changed this in one of the last patches, since I kinda stopped playing once Urban Warfare hit - PC couldn't handle the urban environments very well, and I haven't upgraded yet.) I made a chart once, and I think it should still be valid:
    egds8psam3eb.png
    (Back to lurking)

    Yeah, I'm not sure why they have the move table values drop from a consistent 30m/movement point to 15m/movement after 240m and further dropping to 10m/movement and 5m/movement after that. Only a few light mechs are fast enough for it to matter so I can't imagine it hurt balance that much to make sense changing it. The hexes being 24m across instead the 30m from the move table, combined with the fact that real move distance also includes vertical distance that is not accounted for on the hex grid does cause max movement distances to be rather inconsistent in actual play.

    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
  • PeasPeas Registered User regular
    edited September 7
    My crew have to eat grass for a bit and I also got almost game over-ed from bankruptcy but I finally managed to get ahold of one of them famous Marauders.My first heavy! Already starting to make my money back by being able to tackle harder missions. I did also sweat buckets when it almost got destroyed from focus fire by the enemy in it's second mission though.

    Edit:
    46 days of maintenance, someone kill me pls

    Peas on
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  • IoloIolo iolo Registered User regular
    Niiice. The Marauder is the game breaker. Just get a pilot in there with Tactics 9 for that called shot bonus on top of the Marauder's boost to targeting shots, and you're in the land of milk and honey... and 1/3 chance head hits. :)

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  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    edited September 7
    One 61+ damage weapon on the Marauder and a pilot with Tactics 9 breaks the game.

    If you fit it with 3 (edit: 61+ damage weapons) you have much better than even odds of killing via headshots every time you have enough Resolve to take an aimed shot. That little baby you can take with you all the way to the endgame.

    The only issue is you need to make sure it's behind everybody else because hostiles do like to light it up, and it's probably got some of your best weapons on it.

    Orca on
    PeasElvenshae
  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    edited September 8
    Jumpjets are quite useful but they generate significant heat. Max jumpdistance = 30 x number of jumpjets. Heat = distance moved / 6. So for example, jumping max distance with 6 jumpjets (180m) will generate 30 heat, consuming all your mech's base heatsinking ability (-30/turn) for the turn. So by your rule, such a mech build (barring any extra heatsinks) would only be able to have a full alpha equal to 2 medium lasers. To me that would be pretty undergunned as a general rule.

    Yes... and if your mech can fit 6 jump jets and 2 medium lasers and zero additional heat sinks or other, more heat efficient weapons, then its a 20 tonne mech since that is only 5 tonnes of equipment. And while the spider is slightly undergunned 4 jumpjets on a centurion still gets you the majority of its equipment. Especially as you can trade the 10 tonne LRM 10 and 2 tonnes of ammo for a 3 tonne SRM 6, one tonne of ammo, and 6 extra sinks in addition to the 4 jumps.

    If that was a firestarter then you could fit 4 SLAS and 2x MG on the same construction. Not a terribly huge amount of damage... but still 110.
    which to me can be worth more than the 10, 20, 30% extra damage mitigation you'd get via jumping
    But see, its not 10,20, or 30% extra damage reduction.

    Lets say you take 3 incoming shots on average and they have an average hit rate of 80% base. You've got 5 evasion pips vs 3 evasion pips. Lets assume for a second that we are using a mod that fixes the to-hit tables to be more in line with the displayed values.

    OK so walking you take 3 hits at .5, .6, and .7 for total incoming damage of 1.8

    Jumping you take 3 hits at .3, .4, and .5 = 1.2. Which is a 33% dmg reduction.

    70% hit rate? 40% damage reduction

    Using the actual to-hit tables that battletech uses? Its almost 50%. And this ignoring the fact that it becomes easier to take high ground as well as covered positions.

    And the fewer attacks you take? The better it becomes! And the smaller your mech? The better it becomes... Have a gyro? Its better again!
    More jumpjet tips: If you are moving in open terrain, you'll generate as much evasion by walking/sprinting as jumping but without generating heat. So in that case you shouldn't be wasting the heat by jumping. Moving through forest or water however slows you down, so jumping will generate more evasion and allow you to move farther in that case.

    This is... wrong.

    1) Jumping produces more evasion per unit of movement.(Pretty sure its just "distance +1")
    2) Jumping almost always allows the mech to move further than its walk speed by at least one evasion pip

    3) You cannot sprint and shoot or brace at the same time. (And if you've not shot anything recently then you've no reason to worry about heat buildup and so can just jump for more evasion because you're almost certainly under heat buildup when jumping unless you have a lot of jets)

    As a result the general increase in evasion pips for jumping over walking is 2. Or -20% to-hit on every attack. Not to mention the ability to get you into those forests and reorient yourself while maintaining a ridgeline...

    There are times in the early game, before you have unlocked your max evasion pips upgrades from piloting, that you might be close to similar, but in general jumping is superior
    Jumping's other drawback is that it prevents you from regaining stability after your turn.

    Also wrong. Jumping prevents you from using the stability regain by a default walk yes. But you are still allowed to brace at the end of a jump, which reduces stability damage to zero. If you have taken stability damage and are concerned about it you're probably going to want to brace anyway since the default reduction is pretty pitiful. So jumping and bracing vs walking and bracing is generally advantageous unless you've a lot of heat to dump.

    If you're constantly jumping you're less likely to be knocked down because you're less likely to get hit with a bunch of stability damage and also likely to have better attack angles significantly increasing your DPS and decreasing your incoming damage.

    Goumindong on
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  • Inquisitor77Inquisitor77 2 x Penny Arcade Fight Club Champion A fixed point in space and timeRegistered User regular
    Just started this game, and I'm only a handful of missions in, but can someone explain to me what the point of light mechs are? Do missions ever have a tonnage limit, or is the limit just hardcapped to four mechs? What incentive do I have, given the combat mechanics, to not just run the heaviest monstrosities possible?

  • Cobalt60Cobalt60 regular Registered User regular
    Never once bothered with jump jets. I could use that weight on more lasers.

  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Just started this game, and I'm only a handful of missions in, but can someone explain to me what the point of light mechs are? Do missions ever have a tonnage limit, or is the limit just hardcapped to four mechs? What incentive do I have, given the combat mechanics, to not just run the heaviest monstrosities possible?

    Initiative is pretty valuable. Mobility is pretty valuable. Light mechs in particular have spotting bonuses. Some mechs have unique equipment that gives them particular niches.

    Not all lighter mechs maintain viability into the lategame but a good number of them do. The firestarter is perfectly capable of thriving in the highest difficulty missions and its only 35 tonnes (though it is the best light mech). There are a couple of other particularly good ones (not even including the SLDF mediums)

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    RiemannLives
  • RiemannLivesRiemannLives Registered User regular
    edited September 8
    Peas wrote: »
    see317 wrote: »
    Peas wrote: »
    Hey folks I just started out and is enjoying the game a lot but I feel like things suddenly went up a couple of notch and all the enemies are getting too tanky, no much I can do when they just beat me through sheer attrition

    Any tips to increase my damage?

    What are you using, mech wise?
    How are you modifying them?
    cB557 wrote: »
    Peas wrote: »
    Hey folks I just started out and is enjoying the game a lot but I feel like things suddenly went up a couple of notch and all the enemies are getting too tanky, no much I can do when they just beat me through sheer attrition

    Any tips to increase my damage?
    Are you making sure to bring an appropriate drop tonnage for a mission's threat rating?

    I am actually still using mechs with their default setup because I don't really have anything much of anything. Drooling at all the mechs I couldn't buy at the stores.

    My best mech is the free Centurion which I refitted to it's normal loadout

    Once you have the centurion I think you have a decent medium lance going along with the other starting mechs. All four should have jump jets so you can hop around and stay mobile with your whole lance. Just keep moving around the sector doing 1 skull missions and don't push your luck until you start picking up better mechs. Make a note of what good mech parts are for sale on what worlds as you travel around. To raise the money, keep selling salvaged mechs and weapons you aren't using. They add up! It's not hard to get a warhammer or marauder or archer pretty quick if you know where to travel to (cause you wrote it down) to pick up the parts as you can afford them.

    That centurion is your workhorse for a long while. I like using it as a close in basher. Against the light mechs and tanks you will be fighting (again, as long as you don't push your luck on mission difficulty) it can punch apart a locust pretty darn easily. And make sure it has as many machine guns as it can carry. And if you find any parts that give bonuses to melee put them on the centurion.

    If you find a rare AC20+ the centurion can load up one of those and a medium laser and point defense and jump jets and ok armor. Or pack it with close in SRMs.

    RiemannLives on
    DEFUND THE POLICE
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  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    And if you ever see a Hunchback 4G, blow its right side off immediately. You cannot safely absorb even one AC/20 shot when you're in the medium era.

    RiemannLivesMoridin889PeasExtreaminatus
  • RiemannLivesRiemannLives Registered User regular
    Orca wrote: »
    And if you ever see a Hunchback 4G, blow its right side off immediately. You cannot safely absorb even one AC/20 shot when you're in the medium era.

    This. Luckily the odds of hitting a torso with an aimed shot are pretty good even early on.

    DEFUND THE POLICE
  • MirkelMirkel FinlandRegistered User regular
    Just started this game, and I'm only a handful of missions in, but can someone explain to me what the point of light mechs are? Do missions ever have a tonnage limit, or is the limit just hardcapped to four mechs? What incentive do I have, given the combat mechanics, to not just run the heaviest monstrosities possible?

    Light mechs get better initiative and +3 avoidance, mediums get +1 avoidance. They all also have 0.5 ton jump jets. Those are their innate advantages, past that it's a chassis per chassis evaluation what's a good mech and what's a good mech for whatever it is that you are doing. If you want a LRM boat you should take the heaviest mech you can field since none of the advantages lighter mechs get are worth much for that role. If you want a fast and almost invulnerable (due to stacked evasion) scout/melee mech, a Firestarter is better than any assault. All in all heavier mechs are easier to use - just waddle forward and shoot stuff. But if you have the patience to maneuver and know how to keep evasion up, lighter mechs work fine. A special case is the SLDF medium mechs that are mostly far better than heavies/assaults.

    I was kinda bored of the game so I once did a light mechs only career run that did stuff like 3.5 skull Flashpoints just fine. Some hairy moments when I had to face about 1000 tons of enemies with my 140 ton lance but I did win every mission on first try with no pilot/mech losses. That was post Heavy Metal, before HM it would've been a lot harder.

    Anyways, some Flashpoints do have tonnage limits. They are quite generous though (if you bring the max allowed tonnage you tend to crush them easily, especially if you have good pilots/gear as well). If you just want to get through the campaign you can do that in a 400-ton lance if you want.

  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Mediums no longer get +1 avoidance iirc.

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  • MirkelMirkel FinlandRegistered User regular
    Goumindong wrote: »
    Mediums no longer get +1 avoidance iirc.

    Since when? They did when I last played and AFAIK there hasn't been any new patches.

    Cobalt60
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