If you have Twitch prime you have one free subscription you can apply to anyone every month so if you know of a streamer or two that should get paid (I prefer small ones or games done quick, for example) then apply it to them every month.
I don't know of a streamer, period. If there's someone worth giving my free money I didn't even know I had, though, I'm open to suggestion.
Fake edit: I take that back. I do know of that Ninja dude but he seems like an ass-hat I wouldn't want to give free money to and I think there was a PA strip about him leaving Twitch anyway?
Yea, I'm kinda a big deal. One time I streamed Sekiro for 20 mins, got embarrassed how bad I was, and turned it off. So, I'll take my money in the form of cash, now, Mr. Twitch.
Not does not look like/is not the same game..but to me it looks worse. One of the attractions to me of Destiny is just how right they got the general movement and feel of jumping, sliding etc.
With that many FPS and FoV it looks like someone constantly having a some sort of seizure yanking the screen around and players dying from it.
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KalnaurI See Rain . . .Centralia, WARegistered Userregular
I literally can't even tell what's happening in that video. I mean, I see lots of things happening, but I'm not clear on the how or why, and I swear it almost looks like his view skips to each other player instead of just swiveling. I couldn't even finish watching, it was giving me a headache.
I make art things! deviantART:Kalnaur ::: Origin: Kalnaur ::: UPlay: Kalnaur
Is this the K/D farming ppl talked about? Not saying there's not a huge amount of skill, awareness, etc. going on.
Just . . . why suicide when at a huge disadvantage. And why would your teammate suicide when the streamer dies?
Is this the K/D farming ppl talked about? Not saying there's not a huge amount of skill, awareness, etc. going on.
Just . . . why suicide when at a huge disadvantage. And why would your teammate suicide when the streamer dies?
The suicide is tactical. If you're in a situation where you know you can't possibly win (1 vs 3 where the enemy team has several lives left), you can suicide so that the enemy team can't build super from killing you or just waiting around while you play cat and mouse
I literally can't even tell what's happening in that video. I mean, I see lots of things happening, but I'm not clear on the how or why, and I swear it almost looks like his view skips to each other player instead of just swiveling. I couldn't even finish watching, it was giving me a headache.
I remember playing Quakeworld waaaaay back in the day in a computer lab with some other people, some who could play, some who couldn't. We'd run a mod that attached a camera to one of the better players and it was funny to watch some people turn green as they tried to follow all the mouse flick / rocket jump gameplay. I'd was in my early 20s back then and could actually do that shit.
Is this the K/D farming ppl talked about? Not saying there's not a huge amount of skill, awareness, etc. going on.
Just . . . why suicide when at a huge disadvantage. And why would your teammate suicide when the streamer dies?
The suicide is tactical. If you're in a situation where you know you can't possibly win (1 vs 3 where the enemy team has several lives left), you can suicide so that the enemy team can't build super from killing you or just waiting around while you play cat and mouse
It’s also useful in Iron Banner if they have the 3 capped points advantage up, to deny them points. Even better if you can lead a roaming melee super on a wild goose chase to the edge of the map away from your team to waste their energy. It also tosses any special or heavy you might have had
Basically, unless they have no lives left, it’s probably better to deny them the ammo and energy. If they have lives left, all the have to do is protect one token to win when time runs out. If they are stacking intellect, running around for 1:30-2:00 minutes can be half a super recharge.
Edit: it feels pretty unsporting to do, but there’s no penalty for doing it, and it’s pretty generous with what it counts as “this guy recently shot you” when giving credit. Bungie should probably add consequences for doing it, but right now there are definitely situations where the best tactical choice is to throw yourself into the abyss.
I'm the guy who tells our team to harry our final opponent and take potshots but let them live. Chase them around the map, hold the areas where they could suicide, keep them high stressed but don't give the sweet relief of death. That way our team builds 3 supers to their 1, 3 wolves nipping at one deer.
Usually one of my team-mates grows impatient, or merciful, or is just a better human than I and ends it, and then apologizes for their mercy.
Suiciding is absolutely a tactic and I'd somewhat be sad if they penalized the option since it is a case where counter-intuitive play actually works in your favor.
The tragedy here is that you can never be fast enough.
In my experience, my own glorious victories can be solely attributed to aggressively bullshit mobility that leaves me where people don't expect me to be. There is no substitute for going fast. Sometimes I pretend that weapon selection or engagement tactics had some say, but a retreat is just going fast in a different direction.
If you see a warlock, they are running HHSN with contraverse, because its the only thing that makes them remotely competitive with hunters that can jump faster than you can look, some how get a free knife back on a OHKO without a exotic, and get their instant use class ability back on a 9 second cd without an exotic.
meanwhile I've over here with my thumb stuck up my ass trying to use top tree dawn blade for the solar kills section, and boy let me tell you how much fun it is that I have to choose between "the one jump that is only usable one" and "being able to use my super at greater than 5mph".
Hunter's get to dodge the fuck out of death, meanwhile if I somehow manage to find 5-6 whole seconds to drop a rift and get a full over shield, I will still die in 3 shots to their Not Forgotten.
There are too many damn hunters, and I'm going to be sad for the day that their collective bitching gets HHSN taken away from warlocks.
Eh, I think it's equally likely they'll increase the cooldown on Hunter dodge to bring it in line with other class abilities. It wasn't an issue until the Go Fast update, which before the Dodge was mostly used to try to get around corners quickly. They also did that insane thing where they change the class affinity so Hunters just have to max Mobility to get the shortest cooldown... Yeah I'm still confused by that choice.
But as a hunter main, I'll reap the rewards in the meantime
The same people who made the mobility changes for dodge cool down are the same people who thought that just doubling the cd for the void battery was a good idea
Couldn't have just made it a 10 second penalty, oh no, that would be fair to all of the classes. And we can't take away the new hunter toy either, apparently. Instead, 2 of the 3 classes effectively get a dead artifact node
Eh, I think it's equally likely they'll increase the cooldown on Hunter dodge to bring it in line with other class abilities. It wasn't an issue until the Go Fast update, which before the Dodge was mostly used to try to get around corners quickly. They also did that insane thing where they change the class affinity so Hunters just have to max Mobility to get the shortest cooldown... Yeah I'm still confused by that choice.
But as a hunter main, I'll reap the rewards in the meantime
I mean the dodge stuff is egregious but it's really the way the whole kit comes together that makes it miserable on console. I can't make my screen pan up fast enough to even try to follow a hunter that is jumping within a certain distance of me. It is impossible. They might as well be invisible then too.
I know it's been said plenty before - but it is *so* hard for me to believe that Bungie can look at class distribution in the Crucible (and especially beyond a certain skill level) and think "Yes, this is ok. This is how it should be"
I’ve said it before but the biggest tip for fighting hunters CQ is knowing when to not ADS
But yeah the one thing I’d love destiny to change is make vertical ADS speed the same as horizontal instead of way slower
Yeah, but if I'm using a gun that can't hipfire worth a damn it just means I can see them when they kill me.
Edit- And just to reiterate it's not about one specific thing but how all of the above mentioned things combine to make a class that are disproportionately represented in Crucible because they have a disproportionate amount of tools that make them *generally* more effective in their neutral game than the other classes.
Not that things like this haven't been shown before - but classes played on crucible on console. You can see the huge jump with the changes to mobility and insta kill throwing knife. You can also notice a drop in arcstrider play as they presumably switched to gunslinger.
The only class up with the hunters is presumably Contraverse Hold HHSN warlocks.
That's so silly. Gunslingers jumped from "most popular subclass (sometimes tied)" to "overwhelmingly most popular subclass".
It's hilarious that you can see where Season of Dawn started. Gunslinger went even higher, arcstrider lost players to both Gunslingers and Nightstalkers due to changes and seasonal mods.
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surrealitychecklonely, but not unloveddreaming of faulty keys and latchesRegistered Userregular
If you see a warlock, they are running HHSN with contraverse, because its the only thing that makes them remotely competitive with hunters that can jump faster than you can look, some how get a free knife back on a OHKO without a exotic, and get their instant use class ability back on a 9 second cd without an exotic.
meanwhile I've over here with my thumb stuck up my ass trying to use top tree dawn blade for the solar kills section, and boy let me tell you how much fun it is that I have to choose between "the one jump that is only usable one" and "being able to use my super at greater than 5mph".
Hunter's get to dodge the fuck out of death, meanwhile if I somehow manage to find 5-6 whole seconds to drop a rift and get a full over shield, I will still die in 3 shots to their Not Forgotten.
There are too many damn hunters, and I'm going to be sad for the day that their collective bitching gets HHSN taken away from warlocks.
whats wrong with top tree dawnblade it feels super fun&good
icarus dash is a 5s cooldown double charge mobility skill, i love the shooty melee, naturally most handsome subtree, very powerful magician
Maybe I'm in the minority but I don't find the hunter kit oppressive. Hunters have some obvious advantages but they're also predictable, their jump is always the same height and you can bet on them dodging after they take some shots and it's not like it's a magical teleport, you know how far they went. Jumping in CQC is obnoxious but if they're jumping into an engagement you can bait them and if they're jumping out you already have the advantage. The gunslinger knife is obnoxious but it's best in a range that lots of other things one-bang and if they're tossing it at you from farther out then strafing will cause it to miss (and if you're just standing still something's bound to kill you, that's PvP 101). I play mostly Warlock in PvP and some Titan and when I lose I generally feel like the other person was better than me and would probably have kicked my ass no matter what class or subclass they were running.
Edit: thought it would timestamp. 4:45 is the relevant time
I think aim assist just needs to be tuned for the knife. I don't find hunters flat-out oppressive but there is no denying that their kit(s) are probably the best neutral options in the game for pvp.
On the flick sniping vid, yeah, that's pretty much what some PC fights look like a lot of the times. It's interesting seeing the opinions differ - I was mostly like, "Definitely mechanically great, good shots" and was less agape on the movement/flicking. I do some bullshittery with catapult lift zooming around map openings when I'm feeling sweaty.
Neat, according to that chart I get to be the Sentinel hipster (although man those Dawnblade numbers earlier were grim.
Hunters annoy me because the complete kit is so damn solid, but also presumably because they are just so incredibly popular. So saturation point of getting murdered by Hunters in what sometimes feels bullshitty ways increases your annoyance. And yeah, the Class ability is so fantastic and so regularly available paired with the rest of the kit just exacerbates some of the problems. So it's probably just exposure.
That and ranged OHKO melee ability that comes back on success sucks sometimes.
BUT! A Hunter can't get a super as fast as my Doomfangs let me, nor let me regularly get 3 supers a match, nor let me be a hipster, so I suppose Hunters have some downsides.
If you see a warlock, they are running HHSN with contraverse, because its the only thing that makes them remotely competitive with hunters that can jump faster than you can look, some how get a free knife back on a OHKO without a exotic, and get their instant use class ability back on a 9 second cd without an exotic.
meanwhile I've over here with my thumb stuck up my ass trying to use top tree dawn blade for the solar kills section, and boy let me tell you how much fun it is that I have to choose between "the one jump that is only usable one" and "being able to use my super at greater than 5mph".
Hunter's get to dodge the fuck out of death, meanwhile if I somehow manage to find 5-6 whole seconds to drop a rift and get a full over shield, I will still die in 3 shots to their Not Forgotten.
There are too many damn hunters, and I'm going to be sad for the day that their collective bitching gets HHSN taken away from warlocks.
whats wrong with top tree dawnblade it feels super fun&good
icarus dash is a 5s cooldown double charge mobility skill, i love the shooty melee, naturally most handsome subtree, very powerful magician
The actual super itself blows. The blades have very little, if any, tracking and they arc downwards crazy quickly. Plus, when you have burst glide (which is basically the only choice that is remotely competitive for warlock jumps) you move at D2Y1 speeds in your super. You can try to use the dodge to make up the difference, but that drains a bunch of energy now, and if you spam it too fast there’s a bug that basically disables the dash for the rest of the super.
So you’re stuck either moving very slow while not in super, or being a slow aerial target in super. Seriously, go try out the super with burst glide on vs strafe and tell me that seems like an intentional balance move bungie made.
Basically, I want warlocks to have options beyond “good neutral game, bad super” or “non-existent neutral game, good super”. Hunters get several subclass where they have both (mid-arc, bot-arc, mid-void, bot-solar), and even the ones where you have to choose end up being crazy good (either best neutral game in top-void, or best shutdown super in mid-solar)
Warlocks have exactly one subclass that comes close to being that synergistic, top-arc. But right now two of its four perks are bugged. Arc web doesn’t chain like it’s supposed to and transcendence doesn’t actually give you health back (and it requires you to have full grenade and melee before casting! Why! No other super has a restriction like that!).
Most of this is probably due to 90%+ of the competitive being hunters. I play on console, and I feel like I’m basically starting every match with the odds weighted against me. I would change over in a heartbeat, but the luna’s howl quest is old so it’s character specific. It just gets tiring watching all my opponents do crazy hard to track jumping and dodge rolls while all I can do is go fast in a straight line and die to the same number of shots as normal while having an overshield I spent 4.5x the cd time for.
Edit: i forgot to mention, the best warlock super, stormcaller? If a hunter dodges during you hitting them with it, you have stop hitting the trigger and reacquire the hunter, because the dodge completely breaks the damage. Works when they aren’t the primary target too. So most of your targets you’ll have to keep that in mind. Also, stormcaller on consoles has a limit for how vertical you can look, so a totally valid strat is to dodge towards the warlock and then immediately jump as high as you can. I’ll have to turn around since I can’t look up high enough, and unless I have energy to burn to ionic blink, you’re faster running than I am in my super. Just bugs for days on nearly every warlock kit.
Maybe I'm in the minority but I don't find the hunter kit oppressive. Hunters have some obvious advantages but they're also predictable, their jump is always the same height and you can bet on them dodging after they take some shots and it's not like it's a magical teleport, you know how far they went. Jumping in CQC is obnoxious but if they're jumping into an engagement you can bait them and if they're jumping out you already have the advantage. The gunslinger knife is obnoxious but it's best in a range that lots of other things one-bang and if they're tossing it at you from farther out then strafing will cause it to miss (and if you're just standing still something's bound to kill you, that's PvP 101). I play mostly Warlock in PvP and some Titan and when I lose I generally feel like the other person was better than me and would probably have kicked my ass no matter what class or subclass they were running.
Cheeky alternative:
It's just made to the extreme because of the population imbalance. I don't mind playing against hunters. I do however mind playing in a 6v6 mode where there are regularly 9+ hunters across the teams and where I have to play against that same kit over and over and over.
The kit itself I feel is still overtuned for the style of PvP that Destiny offers in comparison to the other classes IMO. Which isn't a *huge* problem until 80% of the people in every match are using roughly the same thing.
Ideally the metagame would exhibit a healthy ebb & flow of class popularity, but going back to Oct 2018 you can sort of observe that it's basically been Hunters + whatever other class is currently pushed (think Nova Warp's initial state or Striker after its rework). So regardless of whether someone feels like the Hunter kit is problematic in the current metagame, the greater longstanding issue is that Hunters have long-held popular prominence in the Crucible (in D1 & D2), which has seemingly been by design.
Some of this comes down to Hunters being the most mundane and easy to control (i.e. your jump is just a jump, not a floof and not a boost), which I reckon allows for a more immediate transfer of mechanical understanding from other FPS, but you also have a greater emphasis on skill-tree perks that are very direct in stating things like YOU RUN FASTER and YOUR GUNS ARE MORE ACCURATE. This is in contrast to the somewhat more obtuse (and conditional) perks like the Warlock's various grenade-eating mechanics that require a calculation of "how often do I want to trade a grenade for this benefit?" and "how often will I even have a grenade to trade?"
In addition, it seems that Hunters tend to get Exotic Armor that is very explicitly PvP-oriented; from Dragon's Shadow to the Jester Pants, Hunters have a wide variety of competitive Exotic Armors, whereas Titans are still almost exclusively using One-Eyed Mask in firm defiance of Bungie's efforts to blindly seek balance. As an aside regarding Contraverse Warlocks, I'd be curious how many of the other Warlock Exotics would see significant play if it weren't for how wholly bugged the Warlock class is.
In short: of course a lot of players are gravitating to the easy-to-use, easy-to-understand, well-equipped, generally non-bugged class. If only we all made rational decisions and didn't torture ourselves with T-Rex arms.
Would a nerf to the dodge or Stompees or whatever fix this issue? Probably not. But it might help some of us sleep better at night.
I do see a lot of hunters, but in Comp is actually see more mixes. There are matches where the whole enemy team is Titans. Not saying warlocks don't need some love, they probably do. And I do think they can extend the cooldown on dodges a few seconds and nothing of value will be lost for the Hunter squad.
The slog you are facing is the Luna's grind, which is a terrible thing in the current Comp vs a year ago, so I don't envy you. I see plenty of good players using Not-Hunters, and I see a lot of just somewhat ok players trying to force hunter play that aren't taking full advantage of the kit. The two most popular subclasses for Hunter? I hardly touch them. Wanna complain about a super? Top Tree Nightstalker super is mostly a fancy way to die for me in Comp. I would say competitive actually allows for more interesting play than the craziness of 6v6, where everyone is going full retard the whole time
I guess my point is, play what you want to play and laugh when those crutching on something get nerfed
Ophidian Aspect or Transversive Steps are other good Warlock exotics. I don't buy into the whole HHSN "thing" because I find it way more effective to just shoot people than crutch on a OHK ability on a stupid cooldown
Ophidian Aspect or Transversive Steps are other good Warlock exotics. I don't buy into the whole HHSN "thing" because I find it way more effective to just shoot people than crutch on a OHK ability on a stupid cooldown
The thing that will get nerfed in the end is Contraverse Hold. HHSN by itself is fine, at least in the same way that shoulder charge and the new throwing knife are fine. Holds takes a solid skill, and then makes you unkillable while charging it. Like you can face tank things most supers can’t. That’s the busted part. Getting grenade energy back on use? Fine, other exotics (skullfort) do the same, and hunters get theirs back by default on a precision hit.
HHSN punishes the shit out of bad positioning and poorly done rushes the same way that erentil does, the difference is that with erentil you still get a split-second window for counterplay where you can maybe at least trade. Holds tankiness removes that, plus it likely eats special ammo/cool downs. It really is that good, if you’re using it correctly. It also builds some very bad habits because you can get away with so much while charging.
I don't like how slow you are when you've charged HHSN with Contraverse. I know it's powerful but the game feels weird when I take Transversives off and if I do it's to use OA while sniping.
I promise I'm not trying to be a dick but I feel like it's important to express other points of view when you have them, everyone's thoughts about the popular stuff are pretty well known.
Basically, this is my summation of my problems with hunter favoritism by bungie:
Bungie: “In season of the dawn, your class ability CD is tied to your classes thematic stat, isn’t that neat!?”
Also Bungie: “Coincidentally, here’s a season of the dawn mod that give +20 mobility just for using the shotgun scavenger/targeting mod you were already using”
One thing I'll say, Ill feel more inclined to run multiple characters once Trials is back. I don't have much reason to bust out my Titan or Warlock in crucible, but once I can collect gear in Trials for them, I'm sure I'll use them more than I have in the last 2 years
I did some elimination a couple of days ago, and it was sweatier than I remember, by a good amount. And, no contest, the most snipers you’ll see in any playlist.
I did some elimination a couple of days ago, and it was sweatier than I remember, by a good amount. And, no contest, the most snipers you’ll see in any playlist.
The Trials hype is starting to really hit fever pitch with all the leaks and in-game bugs that clearly hint at this Empyrean Foundation stuff is likely to start soon
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I don't know of a streamer, period. If there's someone worth giving my free money I didn't even know I had, though, I'm open to suggestion.
Fake edit: I take that back. I do know of that Ninja dude but he seems like an ass-hat I wouldn't want to give free money to and I think there was a PA strip about him leaving Twitch anyway?
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
Not does not look like/is not the same game..but to me it looks worse. One of the attractions to me of Destiny is just how right they got the general movement and feel of jumping, sliding etc.
With that many FPS and FoV it looks like someone constantly having a some sort of seizure yanking the screen around and players dying from it.
Just . . . why suicide when at a huge disadvantage. And why would your teammate suicide when the streamer dies?
The suicide is tactical. If you're in a situation where you know you can't possibly win (1 vs 3 where the enemy team has several lives left), you can suicide so that the enemy team can't build super from killing you or just waiting around while you play cat and mouse
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
I remember playing Quakeworld waaaaay back in the day in a computer lab with some other people, some who could play, some who couldn't. We'd run a mod that attached a camera to one of the better players and it was funny to watch some people turn green as they tried to follow all the mouse flick / rocket jump gameplay. I'd was in my early 20s back then and could actually do that shit.
It’s also useful in Iron Banner if they have the 3 capped points advantage up, to deny them points. Even better if you can lead a roaming melee super on a wild goose chase to the edge of the map away from your team to waste their energy. It also tosses any special or heavy you might have had
Basically, unless they have no lives left, it’s probably better to deny them the ammo and energy. If they have lives left, all the have to do is protect one token to win when time runs out. If they are stacking intellect, running around for 1:30-2:00 minutes can be half a super recharge.
Edit: it feels pretty unsporting to do, but there’s no penalty for doing it, and it’s pretty generous with what it counts as “this guy recently shot you” when giving credit. Bungie should probably add consequences for doing it, but right now there are definitely situations where the best tactical choice is to throw yourself into the abyss.
Usually one of my team-mates grows impatient, or merciful, or is just a better human than I and ends it, and then apologizes for their mercy.
Suiciding is absolutely a tactic and I'd somewhat be sad if they penalized the option since it is a case where counter-intuitive play actually works in your favor.
I went slow once, it was awful.
In my experience, my own glorious victories can be solely attributed to aggressively bullshit mobility that leaves me where people don't expect me to be. There is no substitute for going fast. Sometimes I pretend that weapon selection or engagement tactics had some say, but a retreat is just going fast in a different direction.
If I lose, I know why.
I always know why.
If you see a warlock, they are running HHSN with contraverse, because its the only thing that makes them remotely competitive with hunters that can jump faster than you can look, some how get a free knife back on a OHKO without a exotic, and get their instant use class ability back on a 9 second cd without an exotic.
meanwhile I've over here with my thumb stuck up my ass trying to use top tree dawn blade for the solar kills section, and boy let me tell you how much fun it is that I have to choose between "the one jump that is only usable one" and "being able to use my super at greater than 5mph".
Hunter's get to dodge the fuck out of death, meanwhile if I somehow manage to find 5-6 whole seconds to drop a rift and get a full over shield, I will still die in 3 shots to their Not Forgotten.
There are too many damn hunters, and I'm going to be sad for the day that their collective bitching gets HHSN taken away from warlocks.
But as a hunter main, I'll reap the rewards in the meantime
Hunter 100 mobility: 9s -> 18s
Titan 100 resilience: 14s -> 28s
Warlock 100 Recov: 41s -> 82s
Couldn't have just made it a 10 second penalty, oh no, that would be fair to all of the classes. And we can't take away the new hunter toy either, apparently. Instead, 2 of the 3 classes effectively get a dead artifact node
I mean the dodge stuff is egregious but it's really the way the whole kit comes together that makes it miserable on console. I can't make my screen pan up fast enough to even try to follow a hunter that is jumping within a certain distance of me. It is impossible. They might as well be invisible then too.
I know it's been said plenty before - but it is *so* hard for me to believe that Bungie can look at class distribution in the Crucible (and especially beyond a certain skill level) and think "Yes, this is ok. This is how it should be"
But yeah the one thing I’d love destiny to change is make vertical ADS speed the same as horizontal instead of way slower
Yeah, but if I'm using a gun that can't hipfire worth a damn it just means I can see them when they kill me.
Edit- And just to reiterate it's not about one specific thing but how all of the above mentioned things combine to make a class that are disproportionately represented in Crucible because they have a disproportionate amount of tools that make them *generally* more effective in their neutral game than the other classes.
The only class up with the hunters is presumably Contraverse Hold HHSN warlocks.
I agree. Alas there are no options to adjust them to clearly legible colors.
It's hilarious that you can see where Season of Dawn started. Gunslinger went even higher, arcstrider lost players to both Gunslingers and Nightstalkers due to changes and seasonal mods.
whats wrong with top tree dawnblade it feels super fun&good
icarus dash is a 5s cooldown double charge mobility skill, i love the shooty melee, naturally most handsome subtree, very powerful magician
Cheeky alternative:
Yup:
Edit: thought it would timestamp. 4:45 is the relevant time
I think aim assist just needs to be tuned for the knife. I don't find hunters flat-out oppressive but there is no denying that their kit(s) are probably the best neutral options in the game for pvp.
On the flick sniping vid, yeah, that's pretty much what some PC fights look like a lot of the times. It's interesting seeing the opinions differ - I was mostly like, "Definitely mechanically great, good shots" and was less agape on the movement/flicking. I do some bullshittery with catapult lift zooming around map openings when I'm feeling sweaty.
Hunters annoy me because the complete kit is so damn solid, but also presumably because they are just so incredibly popular. So saturation point of getting murdered by Hunters in what sometimes feels bullshitty ways increases your annoyance. And yeah, the Class ability is so fantastic and so regularly available paired with the rest of the kit just exacerbates some of the problems. So it's probably just exposure.
That and ranged OHKO melee ability that comes back on success sucks sometimes.
BUT! A Hunter can't get a super as fast as my Doomfangs let me, nor let me regularly get 3 supers a match, nor let me be a hipster, so I suppose Hunters have some downsides.
The actual super itself blows. The blades have very little, if any, tracking and they arc downwards crazy quickly. Plus, when you have burst glide (which is basically the only choice that is remotely competitive for warlock jumps) you move at D2Y1 speeds in your super. You can try to use the dodge to make up the difference, but that drains a bunch of energy now, and if you spam it too fast there’s a bug that basically disables the dash for the rest of the super.
So you’re stuck either moving very slow while not in super, or being a slow aerial target in super. Seriously, go try out the super with burst glide on vs strafe and tell me that seems like an intentional balance move bungie made.
Basically, I want warlocks to have options beyond “good neutral game, bad super” or “non-existent neutral game, good super”. Hunters get several subclass where they have both (mid-arc, bot-arc, mid-void, bot-solar), and even the ones where you have to choose end up being crazy good (either best neutral game in top-void, or best shutdown super in mid-solar)
Warlocks have exactly one subclass that comes close to being that synergistic, top-arc. But right now two of its four perks are bugged. Arc web doesn’t chain like it’s supposed to and transcendence doesn’t actually give you health back (and it requires you to have full grenade and melee before casting! Why! No other super has a restriction like that!).
Most of this is probably due to 90%+ of the competitive being hunters. I play on console, and I feel like I’m basically starting every match with the odds weighted against me. I would change over in a heartbeat, but the luna’s howl quest is old so it’s character specific. It just gets tiring watching all my opponents do crazy hard to track jumping and dodge rolls while all I can do is go fast in a straight line and die to the same number of shots as normal while having an overshield I spent 4.5x the cd time for.
Edit: i forgot to mention, the best warlock super, stormcaller? If a hunter dodges during you hitting them with it, you have stop hitting the trigger and reacquire the hunter, because the dodge completely breaks the damage. Works when they aren’t the primary target too. So most of your targets you’ll have to keep that in mind. Also, stormcaller on consoles has a limit for how vertical you can look, so a totally valid strat is to dodge towards the warlock and then immediately jump as high as you can. I’ll have to turn around since I can’t look up high enough, and unless I have energy to burn to ionic blink, you’re faster running than I am in my super. Just bugs for days on nearly every warlock kit.
It's just made to the extreme because of the population imbalance. I don't mind playing against hunters. I do however mind playing in a 6v6 mode where there are regularly 9+ hunters across the teams and where I have to play against that same kit over and over and over.
The kit itself I feel is still overtuned for the style of PvP that Destiny offers in comparison to the other classes IMO. Which isn't a *huge* problem until 80% of the people in every match are using roughly the same thing.
Some of this comes down to Hunters being the most mundane and easy to control (i.e. your jump is just a jump, not a floof and not a boost), which I reckon allows for a more immediate transfer of mechanical understanding from other FPS, but you also have a greater emphasis on skill-tree perks that are very direct in stating things like YOU RUN FASTER and YOUR GUNS ARE MORE ACCURATE. This is in contrast to the somewhat more obtuse (and conditional) perks like the Warlock's various grenade-eating mechanics that require a calculation of "how often do I want to trade a grenade for this benefit?" and "how often will I even have a grenade to trade?"
In addition, it seems that Hunters tend to get Exotic Armor that is very explicitly PvP-oriented; from Dragon's Shadow to the Jester Pants, Hunters have a wide variety of competitive Exotic Armors, whereas Titans are still almost exclusively using One-Eyed Mask in firm defiance of Bungie's efforts to blindly seek balance. As an aside regarding Contraverse Warlocks, I'd be curious how many of the other Warlock Exotics would see significant play if it weren't for how wholly bugged the Warlock class is.
In short: of course a lot of players are gravitating to the easy-to-use, easy-to-understand, well-equipped, generally non-bugged class. If only we all made rational decisions and didn't torture ourselves with T-Rex arms.
Would a nerf to the dodge or Stompees or whatever fix this issue? Probably not. But it might help some of us sleep better at night.
At 1814 glory.
F---!
The slog you are facing is the Luna's grind, which is a terrible thing in the current Comp vs a year ago, so I don't envy you. I see plenty of good players using Not-Hunters, and I see a lot of just somewhat ok players trying to force hunter play that aren't taking full advantage of the kit. The two most popular subclasses for Hunter? I hardly touch them. Wanna complain about a super? Top Tree Nightstalker super is mostly a fancy way to die for me in Comp. I would say competitive actually allows for more interesting play than the craziness of 6v6, where everyone is going full retard the whole time
I guess my point is, play what you want to play and laugh when those crutching on something get nerfed
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
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The thing that will get nerfed in the end is Contraverse Hold. HHSN by itself is fine, at least in the same way that shoulder charge and the new throwing knife are fine. Holds takes a solid skill, and then makes you unkillable while charging it. Like you can face tank things most supers can’t. That’s the busted part. Getting grenade energy back on use? Fine, other exotics (skullfort) do the same, and hunters get theirs back by default on a precision hit.
HHSN punishes the shit out of bad positioning and poorly done rushes the same way that erentil does, the difference is that with erentil you still get a split-second window for counterplay where you can maybe at least trade. Holds tankiness removes that, plus it likely eats special ammo/cool downs. It really is that good, if you’re using it correctly. It also builds some very bad habits because you can get away with so much while charging.
I promise I'm not trying to be a dick but I feel like it's important to express other points of view when you have them, everyone's thoughts about the popular stuff are pretty well known.
Bungie: “In season of the dawn, your class ability CD is tied to your classes thematic stat, isn’t that neat!?”
Also Bungie: “Coincidentally, here’s a season of the dawn mod that give +20 mobility just for using the shotgun scavenger/targeting mod you were already using”
The Trials hype is starting to really hit fever pitch with all the leaks and in-game bugs that clearly hint at this Empyrean Foundation stuff is likely to start soon