[Star Wars] Take part in the least interesting arguments in this galaxy or any other.

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  • Giggles_FunsworthGiggles_Funsworth Hackerman Bay Area SprawlRegistered User regular
    One more then I’m done. 25 seconds worth of effort.

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    How is making them look like Power Rangers rejects better exactly?

    Kamar
  • Endless_SerpentsEndless_Serpents Registered User regular
    edited May 22
    One more then I’m done. 25 seconds worth of effort.

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    How is making them look like Power Rangers rejects better exactly?

    Well ideally you’d give them visually interesting and distinct designs that give the audience cues as to their personality and function, but what I’m saying is they’re so bland putting a filter on them between sips of my coffee is better than what we got.

    Edit:
    You wouldn’t really go for a bright yellow and red one, and a blue and purple one. You’d still go for black and grey primarily, but a dash of colour and texture would have worked to their advantage.

    Bear in mind Boba Fett is seen as the cool badass merc and he’s far from all black everything.

    Anyway, 60 seconds.

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    Endless_Serpents on
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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited May 22
    Richy wrote: »
    Seriously, it looks like they were designed by a five-year-old. All black, all masks, no details showing a personal history. Just get a child and asks them to draw scary people, and you get this.

    It fits with their personalities and backstories.

    If we go by Kylo Ren as an example, it's cosplay. This is something both TFA and TLJ get really dead on. Snoke mocks him for his helmet at the start of TLJ and tells him to take it off because in the end he doesn't need it. Vader needed the helmet. Kylo just wears it to look grimdark. The all black silliness is part of it.

    shryke on
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  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus premium Registered User regular
  • reVersereVerse Registered User regular
    some garbage

    Ah, so it was the Knights of Ren instead.

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  • VeagleVeagle Registered User regular
    One more then I’m done. 25 seconds worth of effort.

    52t9o12yy5tq.jpeg
    t0s8xj0nm4mp.jpeg

    How is making them look like Power Rangers rejects better exactly?

    Well ideally you’d give them visually interesting and distinct designs that give the audience cues as to their personality and function, but what I’m saying is they’re so bland putting a filter on them between sips of my coffee is better than what we got.

    Edit:
    You wouldn’t really go for a bright yellow and red one, and a blue and purple one. You’d still go for black and grey primarily, but a dash of colour and texture would have worked to their advantage.

    Bear in mind Boba Fett is seen as the cool badass merc and he’s far from all black everything.

    Anyway, 60 seconds.

    8lpvq4t8pwid.jpeg

    And think about Boba Fett's introductory scene. He's a guy with cool armor, but you've also got a dinosaur man, a robot, some bug-thing and a mummy. They're all visually unique and interesting. And they all got built up in EU material in the following decades.

    Forty years from now, how many people are going to remember these guys? I literally just looked at their group photo before writing this, and I can't even remember how many of them there are.

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    It feels like the Knights of Ren were in TROS solely because they were mentioned in TFA and they felt they had to do something with that. Whereas TLJ just ignores them and I think presents the much better option of "We should have never had Knights of Ren in the first place".

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  • Doctor DetroitDoctor Detroit Registered User regular
    The main issue with the Knights is that they wound up being the mookiest bunch of mooks to ever mook. There's nothing else to them.

    Boba Fett at least got a win, and the other Bounty Hunters disappeared after their one scene. The Knights...captured Chewie when he walked around the corner.

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  • Phoenix-DPhoenix-D Registered User regular
    Zonugal wrote: »
    If nothing else, it makes me want a story where a ragtag band of heroes are in a race against time with a ragtag band of villains, with a lot of crossover between their goals and views. Imagine if Ben and Hux had a Poe and Fin, a Chewie and BB8, and they stuck together for three movies.

    I can be down with this.

    What if RoS was a race between the heroes and the Knights of Ren for the Sith Wayfinder?

    What does it do? What does it lead to? Ehhh... Haven't worked that out.

    But a galactic treasure-hunt/race would have been fantastic.

    It could lead straight to Exagol like it does now. Except instead of Palp being a first act ass-pull the movie builds up to revealing him at the end, as the Resistance slowly figures out where TF these ships came from and why Ren is so obsessed with finding them.

    ElvenshaeAbsoluteZero
  • ZonugalZonugal The Holiday Armadillo I'm Santa's representative for all the southern states. And Mexico!Registered User regular
    Phoenix-D wrote: »
    Zonugal wrote: »
    If nothing else, it makes me want a story where a ragtag band of heroes are in a race against time with a ragtag band of villains, with a lot of crossover between their goals and views. Imagine if Ben and Hux had a Poe and Fin, a Chewie and BB8, and they stuck together for three movies.

    I can be down with this.

    What if RoS was a race between the heroes and the Knights of Ren for the Sith Wayfinder?

    What does it do? What does it lead to? Ehhh... Haven't worked that out.

    But a galactic treasure-hunt/race would have been fantastic.

    It could lead straight to Exagol like it does now. Except instead of Palp being a first act ass-pull the movie builds up to revealing him at the end, as the Resistance slowly figures out where TF these ships came from and why Ren is so obsessed with finding them.

    I don't know if I would really bring Palpatine back...

    I think a plot-line I'd adopt is that Hux turned the other high-officers against Kylo Ren, who has been shown to be a terrible leader, and as a result there is a civil war going on within the First Order.

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  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    The main issue with the Knights is that they wound up being the mookiest bunch of mooks to ever mook. There's nothing else to them.

    Boba Fett at least got a win, and the other Bounty Hunters disappeared after their one scene. The Knights...captured Chewie when he walked around the corner.

    The knights of Ren were basically the guys in Snoke's Throne scene, but less interesting.

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  • NobeardNobeard North Carolina: Failed StateRegistered User regular
    Black on black on black on black

    It makes them look more tactical.

    I'm not saying we are going to have an autocratic dystopia, but things keep happening that look like they come from an autocratic dystopia.
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  • ElvenshaeElvenshae Registered User regular
    Nobeard wrote: »
    Black on black on black on black

    It makes them look more tacticool.

    Fix’d.

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  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    The main issue with the Knights is that they wound up being the mookiest bunch of mooks to ever mook. There's nothing else to them.

    Boba Fett at least got a win, and the other Bounty Hunters disappeared after their one scene. The Knights...captured Chewie when he walked around the corner.

    They also beat up on Kylo until he got his lightsaber back, in one of the worst thematic scenes of the movie.

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  • Dark Raven XDark Raven X Laugh hard, run fast, be kindRegistered User regular
    Watching Rise of Skywalker again as background noise. Got up to the first of the fake deaths. What a cowardly fuckin' movie, holy shit. Couldn't let the consequences sit for a full 3 minutes.

    Oh brilliant
    Captain InertiaRichyAbsoluteZero
  • ObiFettObiFett Use the Force As You WishRegistered User regular
    I actually really like RoS, but the fakeout Chewie death was dumb and felt manipulative on a whole nother level and it took me out of the movie as much as Leia's Mary Poppins flying did in TLJ.

    Captain InertiaNobeard
  • AtomikaAtomika Nurse Amy says: “Wear the damn mask.”Registered User regular
    I’m pretty confident the knights of ren won’t survive my edit

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  • RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    Leia's spacewalk would be improved witb the Mary Poppins theme.

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  • PailryderPailryder Registered User regular
  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    Atomika wrote: »
    I’m pretty confident the knights of ren won’t survive my edit

    That'd be what, maybe 12 minutes?

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  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    I always preferred this interpretation:

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  • AtomikaAtomika Nurse Amy says: “Wear the damn mask.”Registered User regular
    edited May 23
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    Atomika wrote: »
    I’m pretty confident the knights of ren won’t survive my edit

    That'd be what, maybe 12 minutes?

    Probably more like 4

    Atomika on
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  • Atlas in ChainsAtlas in Chains Registered User regular
    Leia was the first Jedi Master shown giving her student a hug. As much as RoS sucks, I do like the compassionate master that asks Rey what's wrong. She's looking after her training and her mental well being, like a good teacher. I think it's the only scene I really enjoyed.

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  • ObiFettObiFett Use the Force As You WishRegistered User regular
    Atomika wrote: »
    I’m pretty confident the knights of ren won’t survive my edit

    Without them you lose Kylo doing the shrug, which is arguably one of the best moments in the movie

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  • Endless_SerpentsEndless_Serpents Registered User regular
    Just put the shrug in with some off-screen dialogue.

    Fin: REY!!
    [cut to the shrug]

    Poe: They fly now?!
    [cut to the shrug]

    Grandad: I AM ALL THE SITH!
    Rey: And I am all the Jedi!
    [cut to the shrug]

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  • VoodooVVoodooV Registered User regular
    I want a movie of nothing but luke training leia. That little bit was really cool imo.

    That said. Leia completing her training and immediately having her vision and saying, nah, and retires her saber to do, I guess, General stuff is just...so lame.

    further evidence that prophecies and visions just ruin this franchise.

    Captain Inertia
  • RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    Just put the shrug in with some off-screen dialogue.

    Fin: REY!!
    [cut to the shrug]

    Poe: They fly now?!
    [cut to the shrug]

    Grandad: I AM ALL THE SITH!
    Rey: And I am all the Jedi!
    [cut to the shrug]

    "What about the droid attack on the Wookies?"
    *Shrug*

    ElvenshaeGiggles_Funsworth
  • Endless_SerpentsEndless_Serpents Registered User regular
    I do think it’d be a fun time waster to come up with a scene you’d have put in your cut of the movie. Doesn’t matter if it contradicts it or anything, just come with a scene you think is cool.

    Anyone game? No time limit.

  • Bloods EndBloods End Blade of Tyshalle Punch dimensionRegistered User regular
    Yall just ever think about the choices that went into deciding to get Wedge in the movie. And putting him in the Falcons turret.

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  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    p
    ObiFett wrote: »
    I actually really like RoS, but the fakeout Chewie death was dumb and felt manipulative on a whole nother level and it took me out of the movie as much as Leia's Mary Poppins flying did in TLJ.

    It was exceedingly stupid because the trailer had shown Chewie in scenes that hadn't happened yet, so it wasn't even an effective fake out.

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  • ZavianZavian Senātus Populusque Rōmānus Registered User regular
    edited May 23
    In the end, I’m glad we got a sequel trilogy with the legacy actors/actresses as opposed to none. I just want future films to be their own things with their own characters and lore to focus on. It’s hard to introduce all new characters while still having the legacy cast, they didn’t do a great job of that IMO, but I can’t think of many other examples where it does work.

    Zavian on
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    In the end I feel like the older 3 actors still being alive kinda fucked the ST in a lot of ways because it never let them move past them and forced the ST to constantly turn away from it's new characters and revisit the old ones.

    Tony Zhou from Every Frame a Painting talked about this after The Force Awakens came out and I think a lot of what he says rings true.
    Here it goes: the movie features two stories that fundamentally compete with each other. While each story is fine on its own, the two of them should not be together in the same movie.
    1) Rey, Finn and Poe Dameron search for Luke Skywalker
    2) Han Solo, Leia and the Resistance attack the Starkiller Base, a weapon of the First Order, led by Kylo Ren, Snoke and General Hux.
    In other words, the three new protagonists are in one story, and they’ve been gerry-rigged to another story that isn’t theirs. More importantly, the other story is driven by one person, Han Solo.

    I think he's correct about the diagnose, though I think Starkiller Base is more the problem then Han Solo. But I think there is a degree of truth to the fact that they have to divert attention from the new characters to resolve Han Solo's character arc and that this detracts from their ability to build an independent story. Especially in TFA where there's really no connection between Han Solo and the new cast beyond pure JJ Abrams happenstance. (TLJ I think avoids this mostly because as a setup "Luke trains Rey" just naturally weaves Luke into the story in a way it just can't for Han in TFA)

    And I like Han's arc in TFA outside the dumb Abrams coincidences.

    Doctor DetroitVeagle
  • Atlas in ChainsAtlas in Chains Registered User regular
    If they didn't reset the galaxy, the legacy characters could have been sidelined by station. Leia in the new Senate, Han at her side, and Luke running his own Cheddar Monk monastery. The story can involve them, but they no longer make sense as adventurers.

    ObiFettElvenshae
  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    If they didn't reset the galaxy, the legacy characters could have been sidelined by station. Leia in the new Senate, Han at her side, and Luke running his own Cheddar Monk monastery. The story can involve them, but they no longer make sense as adventurers.

    Which honestly sounds a whole lot better to me than just copying the OT and having all three retiring into what they started out as: Rebel leader, aimless smuggler, hopeless guy stuck on a backwater planet.

    We could've had Leia actually preparing the Republic for the First Order instead of being swept under the rug with a paltry junk fleet, Han gathering info from sleazier sources, and Luke preparing the scattered Jedi temples and scouting for new Jedi to help the galaxy in the coming war (and avoid it if possible). They could've been developed roles with full lives instead of just being cut-and-pasted versions from decades ago who have apparently accomplished nothing whatsoever despite being galactic heroes.

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  • AlphaRomeroAlphaRomero Registered User regular
    If they didn't reset the galaxy, the legacy characters could have been sidelined by station. Leia in the new Senate, Han at her side, and Luke running his own Cheddar Monk monastery. The story can involve them, but they no longer make sense as adventurers.

    Which honestly sounds a whole lot better to me than just copying the OT and having all three retiring into what they started out as: Rebel leader, aimless smuggler, hopeless guy stuck on a backwater planet.

    We could've had Leia actually preparing the Republic for the First Order instead of being swept under the rug with a paltry junk fleet, Han gathering info from sleazier sources, and Luke preparing the scattered Jedi temples and scouting for new Jedi to help the galaxy in the coming war (and avoid it if possible). They could've been developed roles with full lives instead of just being cut-and-pasted versions from decades ago who have apparently accomplished nothing whatsoever despite being galactic heroes.

    Nothing like the First Order should have been able to exist after the efforts required to end the Empire. The Sith needed to start on the backfoot not the front, and set about dismantling the Empire or, ya know, just not going into epic, galactic ownership plots again.

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  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    edited May 23
    If they didn't reset the galaxy, the legacy characters could have been sidelined by station. Leia in the new Senate, Han at her side, and Luke running his own Cheddar Monk monastery. The story can involve them, but they no longer make sense as adventurers.

    Which honestly sounds a whole lot better to me than just copying the OT and having all three retiring into what they started out as: Rebel leader, aimless smuggler, hopeless guy stuck on a backwater planet.

    We could've had Leia actually preparing the Republic for the First Order instead of being swept under the rug with a paltry junk fleet, Han gathering info from sleazier sources, and Luke preparing the scattered Jedi temples and scouting for new Jedi to help the galaxy in the coming war (and avoid it if possible). They could've been developed roles with full lives instead of just being cut-and-pasted versions from decades ago who have apparently accomplished nothing whatsoever despite being galactic heroes.

    Nothing like the First Order should have been able to exist after the efforts required to end the Empire. The Sith needed to start on the backfoot not the front, and set about dismantling the Empire or, ya know, just not going into epic, galactic ownership plots again.
    Exactly. Following the unrelenting brutality of the Empire, there would've been a galaxy-wide effort to stamp out anything resembling the Empire. With resources and organization finally on their side, the Republic/Rebel forces would've had an unlimited supply of willing fighters for years, if not decades, as people got on the bandwagon to get their pound of flesh from the Empire. The Republic abso-fucking-lutely would not have been sitting around letting a significant chunk of the former Empire go around kidnapping children to brainwash them into stormtroopers.

    Then the ST could've done something mind-blowing like having it's own story to follow instead of just ripping off the OT, badly. Now we'll have years of the setting have to sit in the stink of the First Order crap before they finally move the fuck on to a time that isn't garbage (and I mean FURTHER DOWN THE TIMELINE, not reverting to the past).

    Ninja Snarl P on
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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    If they didn't reset the galaxy, the legacy characters could have been sidelined by station. Leia in the new Senate, Han at her side, and Luke running his own Cheddar Monk monastery. The story can involve them, but they no longer make sense as adventurers.

    Which honestly sounds a whole lot better to me than just copying the OT and having all three retiring into what they started out as: Rebel leader, aimless smuggler, hopeless guy stuck on a backwater planet.

    We could've had Leia actually preparing the Republic for the First Order instead of being swept under the rug with a paltry junk fleet, Han gathering info from sleazier sources, and Luke preparing the scattered Jedi temples and scouting for new Jedi to help the galaxy in the coming war (and avoid it if possible). They could've been developed roles with full lives instead of just being cut-and-pasted versions from decades ago who have apparently accomplished nothing whatsoever despite being galactic heroes.

    Nothing like the First Order should have been able to exist after the efforts required to end the Empire. The Sith needed to start on the backfoot not the front, and set about dismantling the Empire or, ya know, just not going into epic, galactic ownership plots again.

    Even the old EU thought the idea that the Empire was just gonna be gone after the second Death Star blew up was wrong. The idea of the First Order makes a good amount of sense. It's just that TFA does a terrible job of explaining and establishing it.

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited May 23
    If they didn't reset the galaxy, the legacy characters could have been sidelined by station. Leia in the new Senate, Han at her side, and Luke running his own Cheddar Monk monastery. The story can involve them, but they no longer make sense as adventurers.

    While a lot of it is that they really wanted to redo the OT dynamic, that kind of setup also leads to the question of what the new characters are going to be doing then if Leia and Luke and the like have this shit on lock already.

    And the bigger issue, really, of the meeting fan expectations. TFA in general seems very concerned with justifying the idea that another Star Wars movie should exist.

    shryke on
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  • Bloods EndBloods End Blade of Tyshalle Punch dimensionRegistered User regular
    The fact that JJ couldn't put together a movie that wasn't "AHN but bigger, louder, and less throught out" seems less on the surviving actors and more on him. Hell He didn't even characterize any of them beyond Han.

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  • AlphaRomeroAlphaRomero Registered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    If they didn't reset the galaxy, the legacy characters could have been sidelined by station. Leia in the new Senate, Han at her side, and Luke running his own Cheddar Monk monastery. The story can involve them, but they no longer make sense as adventurers.

    Which honestly sounds a whole lot better to me than just copying the OT and having all three retiring into what they started out as: Rebel leader, aimless smuggler, hopeless guy stuck on a backwater planet.

    We could've had Leia actually preparing the Republic for the First Order instead of being swept under the rug with a paltry junk fleet, Han gathering info from sleazier sources, and Luke preparing the scattered Jedi temples and scouting for new Jedi to help the galaxy in the coming war (and avoid it if possible). They could've been developed roles with full lives instead of just being cut-and-pasted versions from decades ago who have apparently accomplished nothing whatsoever despite being galactic heroes.

    Nothing like the First Order should have been able to exist after the efforts required to end the Empire. The Sith needed to start on the backfoot not the front, and set about dismantling the Empire or, ya know, just not going into epic, galactic ownership plots again.

    Even the old EU thought the idea that the Empire was just gonna be gone after the second Death Star blew up was wrong. The idea of the First Order makes a good amount of sense. It's just that TFA does a terrible job of explaining and establishing it.

    The Empire wouldn't have vanished, you'd still have competent leaders, but it's major resources and most powerful members were dead and gone. The First Order looks like it has MORE resources than the Empire ever did, and all those resources had to come from somewhere. After two major successes by the Rebels, the forces opposed to the Empire remnants would have been huge. And even if there were Empire pockets out there, they had to have lost significant forces in two Death Star explosions.

    The ST excels at making the first 6 films feel like no one ever actually achieved anything of lasting importance. Except Palpatine.

    I'd honestly have found it more interesting if Kylo Ren and the Knights of Ren were a rising force capable of surviving because of sheer skill and ability when combined together. I don't know what their goal would have been but you could have dug into the lore, the mass Shadow generator on Mandalore, searching for the teachings of Revan. Think how more interesting it would be for the good guys to be following the bad guys as they themselves are following a trail, and then maybe the good guys get ahead and then it's a race against time. It's basically Indiana Jones in space.

    Anyway, the First Order was a lazy story writing crutch and it showed.

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