[Battletech] Clan Invasion Kickstarter Canon Character Update (post #2)

14567810»

Posts

  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    H3Knuckles wrote: »
    I don't really think that's a good idea, else the Clan Invasion would be a joke. They're at a massive strategic & logistical disadvantage vs the IS that is only really offset by their tech superiority and individual unit performance advantages. As long as the gameplay is set up to allow opposing sides to bring unequal-size forces, this isn't a game design problem. That said, the solution to the tech inequality problem is the Inner Sphere catching up once the major Clan storylines began to wrap up, which is something they've never really done unfortunately.

    Also, the thing with the whole military shift towards efficiency because of scarce resources, is that letting energy weapons become lostech is like the absolute last thing the science caste would allow.

    Pulse lasers are Star League tech, so they wouldn't diverge too much in function from IS models. If you want a new type of lasers, just make up a new one.

    For a time the fluff was pointing towards the IS catching up to Clan Tech. They even started to produce their own OmniMech variants.

    But for one reason or another the Powers That Be let that idea fall to the wayside.

    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
    H3KnucklesGnome-Interruptus
  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    PGI mainly tried to balance Clan vs IS by making IS mechs more agile, have better hitboxes, and through quirks (the Atlas carries several tons of extra armor according to their system). Clans also have 10 tons less to work with in FW.

    In TT and lore, the Timber Wolf is a terrifying opponent, in MWO you pity the time and C-bills a player put into it as you dismantle it.

    The issue with TT is that people would just put equal tonnages against each other and play as normal. You pretty much have to play with BV and have the Clan player use Zellbrigen.

    Gnome-InterruptusNipsBetsuni
  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    Nought wrote: »
    I've been thinking, how would you rewrite Clan mechs, and some of the lore, to make Clan mechs and tech not be so redunculesly overpowered compared to IS tech?

    What I'm thinking with this is that Clan warfare on the homeworlds was ritualistic to save on resources and lives.
    Wouldn't it then follow that their mech designs should be built around the idea of short engagements, with limited ammo for weapons, but more or bigger weapons for a better alpha strike.
    I think some of this is already a thing, but I'm thinking put a greater emphasis on it, so that a clan mech or star that doesn't cripple an opponent very fast will be exposed to heavy damage in a counter attack.

    To enhance this/explain it, maybe the Clan techbase isn't as complete as it is now. They lost a lot of ships getting to the location of the pentagon worlds. And then they had another exodus and a reconquest.

    Maybe they only have bulky but very good armour, so they have to choose between protection and firepower in a more tangible way than it is currently.

    Maybe they lost the ability to do very high energy transfer, som they are limeted to small and medium lasers. Pulse lasers could then be reworked so the big benifit is that the power drain is drawn out, with the downside that you can't deliver a powerful punch.

    Basicly, is there a way to still give them a tech edge but get away from the space marine syndrome of having a clan mech only die on top of a pile of enemy mechs?

    Some ideas that could work within your premise:
    Clans should still have the full range of weapons
    Clan mechs have double the heat threshold but only half or less heat dissipation, this makes them scary at the start of an engagement but then they start having heat problems.
    For more RTS / FPS games, make Clan weapons have longer cooldown and longer burn times, to bring their dps/ton/range balance closer to IS tech. Again this would keep Clans at great burst / alpha but worse sustained

    steam_sig.png
    MWO: Adamski
  • DiplominatorDiplominator Hardcore Porg Registered User regular
    I really wish PGI had given Clan tech all its usual advantages and done the balancing in the score economy. Clanners are all a bunch of selfish tryhards and they could have implemented a parallel Honorbux currency to encourage Zellbrigen idiocy.

    But I guess that would have been hard. I have no idea why they set the game in the Clan invasion era if they were going to make the least interesting version of the Clans possible.

    ElvenshaeGaddez
  • NipsNips Luxuriating in existential crisis.Registered User regular
    Axen wrote: »
    H3Knuckles wrote: »
    I don't really think that's a good idea, else the Clan Invasion would be a joke. They're at a massive strategic & logistical disadvantage vs the IS that is only really offset by their tech superiority and individual unit performance advantages. As long as the gameplay is set up to allow opposing sides to bring unequal-size forces, this isn't a game design problem. That said, the solution to the tech inequality problem is the Inner Sphere catching up once the major Clan storylines began to wrap up, which is something they've never really done unfortunately.

    Also, the thing with the whole military shift towards efficiency because of scarce resources, is that letting energy weapons become lostech is like the absolute last thing the science caste would allow.

    Pulse lasers are Star League tech, so they wouldn't diverge too much in function from IS models. If you want a new type of lasers, just make up a new one.

    For a time the fluff was pointing towards the IS catching up to Clan Tech. They even started to produce their own OmniMech variants.

    But for one reason or another the Powers That Be let that idea fall to the wayside.

    This...isn't true? The big IS powers reverse-engineered and started producing Omnimechs within a couple of years of the end of the Invasion. And they kept making them. But here's the thing: when an OmniMech costs 1.5 times a regular BattleMech (or whatever), you're not going to arm your militaries with something more expensive unless the payback is worth it. And despite the easing of logistics by their nature, it's not worth it. It's easier, and more efficient, to Buy In Bulk a larger force that can then outnumber and outflank, or simply cover more strategic area by force of numbers.
    Nobody wrote: »
    The issue with TT is that people would just put equal tonnages against each other and play as normal. You pretty much have to play with BV and have the Clan player use Zellbrigen.

    You don't even need Zellbrigen, and in many many published scenarios you don't follow it. BV handles the individual imbalances well enough to get things even across matched forces.

    Tonnage-matching is literally the worst way to balance a scenario when differing tech bases are in play.

    The solution to the convoluted, imbalanced tech base?

    Battletech 2, set centuries after the ilClan era, after whatever controlling Power That Be has normalized the tech base across the Inner Sphere up to Clantech standards and beyond, and the weapons of old have all been relegated to the dust bin of history, or the arenas of jockey warriors as part of the entertainment industry.

    JXUBxMxP0QndjQUEnTwTxOkfKmx8kWNvuc-FUtbSz_23_DAhGKe7W9spFKLXAtkpTBqM8Dt6kQrv-rS69Hi3FheL3fays2xTeVUvWR7g5UyLHnFA0frGk1BC12GYdOSRn9lbaJB-uH0htiLPJMrc9cSRsIgk5Dx7jg9K8rJVfG43lkeAWxTgcolNscW9KO2UZjKT8GMbYAFgFvu2TaMoLH8LBA5p2pm6VNYRsQK3QGjCsze1TOv2yIbCazmDwCHmjiQxNDf6LHP35msyiXo3CxuWs9Y8DQvJjvj10kWaspRNlWHKjS5w9Y0KLuIkhQKOxgaDziG290v4zBmTi-i7OfDz-foqIqKzC9wTbn9i_uU87GRitmrNAJdzRRsaTW5VQu_XX_5gCN8XCoNyu5RWWVGTsjJuyezz1_NpFa903Uj2TnFqnL1wJ-RZiFAAd2Bdut-G1pdQtdQihsq2dx_BjtmtGC3KZRyylO1t2c12dhfb0rStq4v8pg46ciOcdtT_1qm85IgUmGd7AmgLxCFPb0xnxWZvr26G-oXSqrQdjKA1zNIInSowiHcbUO2O8S5LRJVR6vQiEg0fbGXw4vqJYEn917tnzHMh8r0xom8BLKMvoFDelk6wbEeNq8w8Eyu2ouGjEMIvvJcb2az2AKQ1uE_7gdatfKG2QdvfdSBRSc35MQ=w498-h80-no
    H3KnucklesGnome-InterruptusBetsuni
  • see317see317 Registered User regular
    edited June 16
    Nobody wrote: »
    Battletech 2, set centuries after the ilClan era, after whatever controlling Power That Be has normalized the tech base across the Inner Sphere up to Clantech standards and beyond, and the weapons of old have all been relegated to the dust bin of history, or the arenas of jockey warriors as part of the entertainment industry.
    And then: ALIENS from beyond the Spheres!
    Bizarrely using technology that, while completely different, maps nearly indistinguishably onto weapons developed by humanity in regards to damage output, range bands and ammunition needs.
    One of those weird "Universal Constant" type things.

    see317 on
    Ringo wrote: »
    Well except what see317 said. That guy's always wrong.
    Nips
  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    In many ways the IS did indeed start catching up to Clan tech. LFEs are a midway point between IS and Clan XL tech, and the fact that ER lasers and Streak SRMs are now available in different sizes.

    In others they surpassed them (the Gauss and PPC variants, Stealth armor, MRMs, tasers, plasma weapons, etc).

    Of course, it probably helped that the Clans had to jettison a good chunk of their scientist caste and certain Clans started selling/sharing their tech With the Inner Sphere.

  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    According the the IlClan reports we have from the recent sourcebooks, by 3200~ there is no distinction between IS and Clan tech anymore.

    I actually do kind of wonder if maybe they are working toward a Battletech 2. We know IlClan is coming eventually. Honestly I’d be all for it. There is significant rules bloat with Battletech.

    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
    Nips
  • NipsNips Luxuriating in existential crisis.Registered User regular
    edited June 16
    Axen wrote: »
    According the the IlClan reports we have from the recent sourcebooks, by 3200~ there is no distinction between IS and Clan tech anymore.

    I actually do kind of wonder if maybe they are working toward a Battletech 2. We know IlClan is coming eventually. Honestly I’d be all for it. There is significant rules bloat with Battletech.

    If a new rule set is somewhere in the future, which is both completely predictable and yet wildly out there, I can't imagine it happening for at least 5-10 real life years. And I also can't imagine Classic Battletech ever being EOL'd as well; it's been around so very long at this point it'll continue to exist on inertia alone.

    I would love to see a Battletech 2 that's a middle ground between Classic rules and Alpha Strike, that started fresh with slate of new-but-inspired-by-the-past 'Mech designs.
    see317 wrote: »
    Nobody wrote: »
    Battletech 2, set centuries after the ilClan era, after whatever controlling Power That Be has normalized the tech base across the Inner Sphere up to Clantech standards and beyond, and the weapons of old have all been relegated to the dust bin of history, or the arenas of jockey warriors as part of the entertainment industry.
    And then: ALIENS from beyond the Spheres!
    Bizarrely using technology that, while completely different, maps nearly indistinguishably onto weapons developed by humanity in regards to damage output, range bands and ammunition needs.
    One of those weird "Universal Constant" type things.

    I've said it before: Unite humanity, colonize the known galaxy (not just a chunk in the spiral arm of where the Inner Sphere rests, but everything), and go BIG.

    Then repeat the follies of humankind all over again on a galactic scale.

    Robots go stomp stomp pew pew.

    Nips on
    JXUBxMxP0QndjQUEnTwTxOkfKmx8kWNvuc-FUtbSz_23_DAhGKe7W9spFKLXAtkpTBqM8Dt6kQrv-rS69Hi3FheL3fays2xTeVUvWR7g5UyLHnFA0frGk1BC12GYdOSRn9lbaJB-uH0htiLPJMrc9cSRsIgk5Dx7jg9K8rJVfG43lkeAWxTgcolNscW9KO2UZjKT8GMbYAFgFvu2TaMoLH8LBA5p2pm6VNYRsQK3QGjCsze1TOv2yIbCazmDwCHmjiQxNDf6LHP35msyiXo3CxuWs9Y8DQvJjvj10kWaspRNlWHKjS5w9Y0KLuIkhQKOxgaDziG290v4zBmTi-i7OfDz-foqIqKzC9wTbn9i_uU87GRitmrNAJdzRRsaTW5VQu_XX_5gCN8XCoNyu5RWWVGTsjJuyezz1_NpFa903Uj2TnFqnL1wJ-RZiFAAd2Bdut-G1pdQtdQihsq2dx_BjtmtGC3KZRyylO1t2c12dhfb0rStq4v8pg46ciOcdtT_1qm85IgUmGd7AmgLxCFPb0xnxWZvr26G-oXSqrQdjKA1zNIInSowiHcbUO2O8S5LRJVR6vQiEg0fbGXw4vqJYEn917tnzHMh8r0xom8BLKMvoFDelk6wbEeNq8w8Eyu2ouGjEMIvvJcb2az2AKQ1uE_7gdatfKG2QdvfdSBRSc35MQ=w498-h80-no
    BetsuniFuselage
  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    edited June 16
    So I been wondering if CGL's DMCA of all the Thingiverse Battletech stuff actually holds water.

    Apart from the grey area 3d printing is currently in, CGL or Topps doesn't actually own any of sources for that stuff that got DCMA'd. Most (if not all) of the Mech models are ripped from MWO. Microsoft owns the rights to Mechwarrior and ultimately those models. If anyone should be DCMA-ing it'd be Microsoft or PGI.

    Axen on
    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
  • BetsuniBetsuni Insert Disk 4 and Press Any Key to Continue Registered User regular
    Axen wrote: »
    So I been wondering if CGL's DMCA of all the Thingiverse Battletech stuff actually holds water.

    Apart from the grey area 3d printing is currently in, CGL or Topps doesn't actually own any of sources for that stuff that got DCMA'd. Most (if not all) of the Mech models are ripped from MWO. Microsoft owns the rights to Mechwarrior and ultimately those models. If anyone should be DCMA-ing it'd be Microsoft or PGI.

    Probably not, but Thingiverse probably doesn't want to pay to fight it.

    oosik_betsuni.png
    Steam: betsuni7
  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    edited June 16
    Betsuni wrote: »
    Axen wrote: »
    So I been wondering if CGL's DMCA of all the Thingiverse Battletech stuff actually holds water.

    Apart from the grey area 3d printing is currently in, CGL or Topps doesn't actually own any of sources for that stuff that got DCMA'd. Most (if not all) of the Mech models are ripped from MWO. Microsoft owns the rights to Mechwarrior and ultimately those models. If anyone should be DCMA-ing it'd be Microsoft or PGI.

    Probably not, but Thingiverse probably doesn't want to pay to fight it.

    Actually the individual creators would have to fight it, but your point stands.

    Which does kind of upset me.

    However, looking in to past cases of DMCAs on Thingiverse it looks like if no court documents are submitted within 10 (I assume business) days of the DMCA then everything will likely be restored.

    Axen on
    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
    Betsuni
  • DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    I mean, I think the progression to 20 years post Invasion is the simplest thing. Some of the Warden clans integrate with IS groups, and some instead become border forces that fight the Crusader Clans as much as the IS and hold territory. Some of the Crusader clans set up on the periphery, and some remain on the Pentagon worlds. The IS factions smash up a bit. Everyone mixes their tech up real nicely and we just have a new map where the major factions are, but tech is much more standardized.

    What is this I don't even.
    H3Knuckles
  • NipsNips Luxuriating in existential crisis.Registered User regular
    OMFG



    UUUUUNNNNNFFFFFF

    Also, there's shots of some of the new plastics up in the latest KS update.

    They're....whelming. I'm whelmed. Maybe a bit under, but only a smidge.

    Except the Hellbringer. Oof. A pose so bad, I responded in the KS comments.

    JXUBxMxP0QndjQUEnTwTxOkfKmx8kWNvuc-FUtbSz_23_DAhGKe7W9spFKLXAtkpTBqM8Dt6kQrv-rS69Hi3FheL3fays2xTeVUvWR7g5UyLHnFA0frGk1BC12GYdOSRn9lbaJB-uH0htiLPJMrc9cSRsIgk5Dx7jg9K8rJVfG43lkeAWxTgcolNscW9KO2UZjKT8GMbYAFgFvu2TaMoLH8LBA5p2pm6VNYRsQK3QGjCsze1TOv2yIbCazmDwCHmjiQxNDf6LHP35msyiXo3CxuWs9Y8DQvJjvj10kWaspRNlWHKjS5w9Y0KLuIkhQKOxgaDziG290v4zBmTi-i7OfDz-foqIqKzC9wTbn9i_uU87GRitmrNAJdzRRsaTW5VQu_XX_5gCN8XCoNyu5RWWVGTsjJuyezz1_NpFa903Uj2TnFqnL1wJ-RZiFAAd2Bdut-G1pdQtdQihsq2dx_BjtmtGC3KZRyylO1t2c12dhfb0rStq4v8pg46ciOcdtT_1qm85IgUmGd7AmgLxCFPb0xnxWZvr26G-oXSqrQdjKA1zNIInSowiHcbUO2O8S5LRJVR6vQiEg0fbGXw4vqJYEn917tnzHMh8r0xom8BLKMvoFDelk6wbEeNq8w8Eyu2ouGjEMIvvJcb2az2AKQ1uE_7gdatfKG2QdvfdSBRSc35MQ=w498-h80-no
    IoloIanator
  • McGibsMcGibs TorontoRegistered User regular
    I feel like the extra detail on the clan mechs is making them look extra squadgey in plastic. The IS designs seem to be more flat-panels and less deep-cut details, so they work out a bit better.

    website_header.jpg
  • NipsNips Luxuriating in existential crisis.Registered User regular
    McGibs wrote: »
    I feel like the extra detail on the clan mechs is making them look extra squadgey in plastic. The IS designs seem to be more flat-panels and less deep-cut details, so they work out a bit better.

    Agreed. I was worried about the amount of greebly-ness in the new line art in some places, but I thought seeing the renders that some of that had been toned down. Now that you mention it, I think you're right that I'm remembering the IS 'Mechs more than the Clan ones.

    All said though I wasn't expecting every single figure to get knocked out of the park. So long as they're all generally an improvement over the old sculpts, I'm still happy as a clam.

    JXUBxMxP0QndjQUEnTwTxOkfKmx8kWNvuc-FUtbSz_23_DAhGKe7W9spFKLXAtkpTBqM8Dt6kQrv-rS69Hi3FheL3fays2xTeVUvWR7g5UyLHnFA0frGk1BC12GYdOSRn9lbaJB-uH0htiLPJMrc9cSRsIgk5Dx7jg9K8rJVfG43lkeAWxTgcolNscW9KO2UZjKT8GMbYAFgFvu2TaMoLH8LBA5p2pm6VNYRsQK3QGjCsze1TOv2yIbCazmDwCHmjiQxNDf6LHP35msyiXo3CxuWs9Y8DQvJjvj10kWaspRNlWHKjS5w9Y0KLuIkhQKOxgaDziG290v4zBmTi-i7OfDz-foqIqKzC9wTbn9i_uU87GRitmrNAJdzRRsaTW5VQu_XX_5gCN8XCoNyu5RWWVGTsjJuyezz1_NpFa903Uj2TnFqnL1wJ-RZiFAAd2Bdut-G1pdQtdQihsq2dx_BjtmtGC3KZRyylO1t2c12dhfb0rStq4v8pg46ciOcdtT_1qm85IgUmGd7AmgLxCFPb0xnxWZvr26G-oXSqrQdjKA1zNIInSowiHcbUO2O8S5LRJVR6vQiEg0fbGXw4vqJYEn917tnzHMh8r0xom8BLKMvoFDelk6wbEeNq8w8Eyu2ouGjEMIvvJcb2az2AKQ1uE_7gdatfKG2QdvfdSBRSc35MQ=w498-h80-no
  • ToxTox I kill threads Punch DimensionRegistered User regular
    Nips wrote: »
    They're....whelming. I'm whelmed. Maybe a bit under, but only a smidge.

    Except the Hellbringer. Oof. A pose so bad, I responded in the KS comments.

    Maybe it's just because it got to follow the Gargoyle and that Hellbringer, but the Mad Dog looked kinda awesome

    Wishlists! General | Gaming | Comics | Twitter! | Dilige, et quod vis fac
  • HydroSqueegeeHydroSqueegee ULTRACAT!!!™®© Registered User regular
    Nips wrote: »
    OMFG



    UUUUUNNNNNFFFFFF

    Also, there's shots of some of the new plastics up in the latest KS update.

    They're....whelming. I'm whelmed. Maybe a bit under, but only a smidge.

    Except the Hellbringer. Oof. A pose so bad, I responded in the KS comments.

    HOW DARE YOU MOCK THE SWAGGERBRINGER! Can't you tell by the way he walks he's a lady's man and has zero time to talk?

    zW0NKxe.png
    BetsuniH3KnucklesElvenshae
  • ToxTox I kill threads Punch DimensionRegistered User regular
    Nips wrote: »

    Look I know a Warhammer when I see one. That is very clearly a Slughammer (Sledgehammer?) IIC.

    Wishlists! General | Gaming | Comics | Twitter! | Dilige, et quod vis fac
  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    Battlemallet.

    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
    NipsH3KnucklesElvenshae
  • IoloIolo iolo Registered User regular
  • GaddezGaddez Registered User regular
    edited June 21
    Nips wrote: »
    Axen wrote: »
    H3Knuckles wrote: »
    I don't really think that's a good idea, else the Clan Invasion would be a joke. They're at a massive strategic & logistical disadvantage vs the IS that is only really offset by their tech superiority and individual unit performance advantages. As long as the gameplay is set up to allow opposing sides to bring unequal-size forces, this isn't a game design problem. That said, the solution to the tech inequality problem is the Inner Sphere catching up once the major Clan storylines began to wrap up, which is something they've never really done unfortunately.

    Also, the thing with the whole military shift towards efficiency because of scarce resources, is that letting energy weapons become lostech is like the absolute last thing the science caste would allow.

    Pulse lasers are Star League tech, so they wouldn't diverge too much in function from IS models. If you want a new type of lasers, just make up a new one.

    For a time the fluff was pointing towards the IS catching up to Clan Tech. They even started to produce their own OmniMech variants.

    But for one reason or another the Powers That Be let that idea fall to the wayside.

    This...isn't true? The big IS powers reverse-engineered and started producing Omnimechs within a couple of years of the end of the Invasion. And they kept making them. But here's the thing: when an OmniMech costs 1.5 times a regular BattleMech (or whatever), you're not going to arm your militaries with something more expensive unless the payback is worth it. And despite the easing of logistics by their nature, it's not worth it. It's easier, and more efficient, to Buy In Bulk a larger force that can then outnumber and outflank, or simply cover more strategic area by force of numbers.
    Nobody wrote: »
    The issue with TT is that people would just put equal tonnages against each other and play as normal. You pretty much have to play with BV and have the Clan player use Zellbrigen.

    You don't even need Zellbrigen, and in many many published scenarios you don't follow it. BV handles the individual imbalances well enough to get things even across matched forces.

    Tonnage-matching is literally the worst way to balance a scenario when differing tech bases are in play.

    The solution to the convoluted, imbalanced tech base?

    Battletech 2, set centuries after the ilClan era, after whatever controlling Power That Be has normalized the tech base across the Inner Sphere up to Clantech standards and beyond, and the weapons of old have all been relegated to the dust bin of history, or the arenas of jockey warriors as part of the entertainment industry.

    It's also important to note that the nature of a scenario can completely bone someone regardless of their tech advantage; a while back I read a battle report wherein they were trying to emulate the beaches of normandy with the allies getting a single company with a tonage max of around 1000 and the defenders having about the same tonnage but I think it was up to 2 companies, thus the attacker loaded up on a crap load of 100 tonners and went stomping towards the defenders who had far less survivability on paper.

    Problem was, the defender capitalized on his numbers advantages and how he knew his opponent was going to be sending out a bunch of slow moving, poor mobility assault mechs and proceeded to turn the beaches into a hell hole by loading a bunch of LRM carriers with landmines, thus crippling the assault company before they could make it to the bluffs let alone credibly fight back against the defenders mediums and heavy mechs.

    Gaddez on
    Richy wrote: »
    But I think the resistance I’m getting more has to do with “rawr! Loklar said it! Rage!” than anything else.

    No, it has to do with the fact that you're done nothing but throw lies, blatant flasehoods, and downright dumb statements at us so far.
  • OrogogusOrogogus San DiegoRegistered User regular
    Gaddez wrote: »
    It's also important to note that the nature of a scenario can completely bone someone regardless of their tech advantage; a while back I read a battle report wherein they were trying to emulate the beaches of normandy with the allies getting a single company with a tonage max of around 1000 and the defenders having about the same tonnage but I think it was up to 2 companies, thus the attacker loaded up on a crap load of 100 tonners and went stomping towards the defenders who had far less survivability on paper.

    Problem was, the defender capitalized on his numbers advantages and how he knew his opponent was going to be sending out a bunch of slow moving, poor mobility assault mechs and proceeded to turn the beaches into a hell hole by loading a bunch of LRM carriers with landmines, thus crippling the assault company before they could make it to the bluffs let alone credibly fight back against the defenders mediums and heavy mechs.

    Under any points system, BattleTech favors quantity over quality as the points/units increase. A larger force can more efficiently focus attacks, and better dilutes the other side's fire. To balance this, you'd ideally want a video gamey system that imposes an increasing tax on each additional unit, and the whole thing would be calculated by an app. But generally, someone who goes all in on quantity also irritates all the other players, because it doesn't take a lot of units to turn any fight into a six hour slog with just way too much recordkeeping.

  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    I posted an example of such a situation earlier. A guy was showing a couple of people the game, and gave them 4 mechs at Fedcom Civil War level tech while he took 8 mechs at 3025 tech. Notably, they were equivalent BV

    He didn't lose a mech and they lost everything. Granted, part of the problem was he gave them some stinkers (like a base model Anubis), but he also cycled mechs out and they kept shooting at what was closest instead of what was damaged (or had really weak armor).

  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    New Guillotine and Crocket are really good. No real feelings on the rest except one: The new Crab just feels off for some reason.

    I think it’s because it looks like they moved the cockpit to the front rather than the top, and that makes the ejection system really weird.

  • ToxTox I kill threads Punch DimensionRegistered User regular
    I actually really like that Crockett now. It looks surprisingly good. The Lancelot also looks really good. Feels more like a Blackjack/Rifleman/Jagermech style 'mech (which tracks with the lore).

    Wishlists! General | Gaming | Comics | Twitter! | Dilige, et quod vis fac
  • IoloIolo iolo Registered User regular
    Nobody wrote: »
    New Guillotine and Crocket are really good. No real feelings on the rest except one: The new Crab just feels off for some reason.

    I think it’s because it looks like they moved the cockpit to the front rather than the top, and that makes the ejection system really weird.

    Oh dear. Yeah, the Crab is a miss for me. Not feeling this at all.

    11gBzdw.png

  • ToxTox I kill threads Punch DimensionRegistered User regular
    I never really went hard on the Crab so it's fine for me, I don't have any strong feelings either way, but I'll agree that cockpit placement is a bit weird. I'm imaging the pilot laying like they're doing a skeleton luge and just screaming around the battle field the whole time.

    Wishlists! General | Gaming | Comics | Twitter! | Dilige, et quod vis fac
    IanatorNipsBetsuniIoloElvenshae
  • NipsNips Luxuriating in existential crisis.Registered User regular
    The Crockett looks chubby to me, like the Stay Puft Marshmallow Man.

    JXUBxMxP0QndjQUEnTwTxOkfKmx8kWNvuc-FUtbSz_23_DAhGKe7W9spFKLXAtkpTBqM8Dt6kQrv-rS69Hi3FheL3fays2xTeVUvWR7g5UyLHnFA0frGk1BC12GYdOSRn9lbaJB-uH0htiLPJMrc9cSRsIgk5Dx7jg9K8rJVfG43lkeAWxTgcolNscW9KO2UZjKT8GMbYAFgFvu2TaMoLH8LBA5p2pm6VNYRsQK3QGjCsze1TOv2yIbCazmDwCHmjiQxNDf6LHP35msyiXo3CxuWs9Y8DQvJjvj10kWaspRNlWHKjS5w9Y0KLuIkhQKOxgaDziG290v4zBmTi-i7OfDz-foqIqKzC9wTbn9i_uU87GRitmrNAJdzRRsaTW5VQu_XX_5gCN8XCoNyu5RWWVGTsjJuyezz1_NpFa903Uj2TnFqnL1wJ-RZiFAAd2Bdut-G1pdQtdQihsq2dx_BjtmtGC3KZRyylO1t2c12dhfb0rStq4v8pg46ciOcdtT_1qm85IgUmGd7AmgLxCFPb0xnxWZvr26G-oXSqrQdjKA1zNIInSowiHcbUO2O8S5LRJVR6vQiEg0fbGXw4vqJYEn917tnzHMh8r0xom8BLKMvoFDelk6wbEeNq8w8Eyu2ouGjEMIvvJcb2az2AKQ1uE_7gdatfKG2QdvfdSBRSc35MQ=w498-h80-no
  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    The new Crockett reminds me more of a Warhammer IIC, which is an interesting direction to take the mech and one I like more than the original.

    My problem with the Crab:

    The other notable feature of the Crab is its ejection seat, which performs in two different modes. When an explosion is imminent, the top hatch is blown off and the seat ejected up through the roof as commonly seen in other 'Mechs, with seat stabilization thrusters providing a controlled fall some 200 meters away. If more time is allowed, then the seat will instead rotate 90 degrees and eject the pilot out the back of the 'Mech. This is a much briefer and gentler experience for the pilot, with their seat landing some 50 to 90 meters behind the Crab

    I’m not quite seeing how you’re ejecting out the back of that thing.

  • ToxTox I kill threads Punch DimensionRegistered User regular
    Nobody wrote: »
    I’m not quite seeing how you’re ejecting out the back of that thing.

    I'm picturing the tunnel scene from Ragnarok, personally

    Wishlists! General | Gaming | Comics | Twitter! | Dilige, et quod vis fac
    ElvenshaeNips
  • BetsuniBetsuni Insert Disk 4 and Press Any Key to Continue Registered User regular
    Nobody wrote: »
    The new Crockett reminds me more of a Warhammer IIC, which is an interesting direction to take the mech and one I like more than the original.

    My problem with the Crab:

    The other notable feature of the Crab is its ejection seat, which performs in two different modes. When an explosion is imminent, the top hatch is blown off and the seat ejected up through the roof as commonly seen in other 'Mechs, with seat stabilization thrusters providing a controlled fall some 200 meters away. If more time is allowed, then the seat will instead rotate 90 degrees and eject the pilot out the back of the 'Mech. This is a much briefer and gentler experience for the pilot, with their seat landing some 50 to 90 meters behind the Crab

    I’m not quite seeing how you’re ejecting out the back of that thing.

    Yep, we engineered a tube through the engine, ammo compartments, sensors, radio equipment, and coolant tanks just so the mech appears to poop out the pilot upon death. Joe here thought it was hilarious and the rest of the team agreed.

    oosik_betsuni.png
    Steam: betsuni7
    NobodyElvenshaeNips
  • DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    Maybe that's not actually a cockpit up front but just a big sensor system? One of the things I always found odd was the idea of a cockpit that actually faced the real battlefield, rather than was deep inside armor.

    What is this I don't even.
    Gnome-InterruptusFuselageNips
  • BetsuniBetsuni Insert Disk 4 and Press Any Key to Continue Registered User regular
    Darkewolfe wrote: »
    Maybe that's not actually a cockpit up front but just a big sensor system? One of the things I always found odd was the idea of a cockpit that actually faced the real battlefield, rather than was deep inside armor.

    Hmm, that could be. Like Macross mechs have a "cockpit" of cameras and sensors but the pilot is further away or tucked inside with screens showing the battlefield.

    So the crab pilots sit in the "butt" of the mech. Yeah, those pilots should get mocked more than Locust pilots.

    oosik_betsuni.png
    Steam: betsuni7
    Darkewolfe
Sign In or Register to comment.