[Board Games] Pandemic in a Pandemic

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  • AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist The Skies of HiigaraRegistered User regular
    Dashui wrote: »
    Ah_Pook wrote: »
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Oh. Oh no.

    I’m starting to remember why CCGs are evil.

    *looks at the growing pile of cards from the four booster boxes of Flesh and Blood that he’s picked up over the last month or two...*

    ...but what if it was five....

    Entirely unrelatedly, Marvel Champions is super fun and I definitely ordered all of the expansions for it. I don't know how much more I'll get beyond Rise of the Red Skull, but we'll see. We'll see. The next big box is Groot and Rocket Raccoon, which certainly appeals. Once you're bought in its so easy to justify $15 a month lol. It's like you can't afford NOT to buy the new packs.

    I just bought it. I already have a lot of Arkham's first three cycles, so I don't entirely know why I need another LCG...

    I'm debating sleeving it, too, but these FFG games pile up cards fast.

    I've given up worrying about sleeving by just ordering a thousand of my preferred generic sleeves every few months. Works fine.

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  • DashuiDashui Registered User regular
    Athenor wrote: »
    Dashui wrote: »
    Ah_Pook wrote: »
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Oh. Oh no.

    I’m starting to remember why CCGs are evil.

    *looks at the growing pile of cards from the four booster boxes of Flesh and Blood that he’s picked up over the last month or two...*

    ...but what if it was five....

    Entirely unrelatedly, Marvel Champions is super fun and I definitely ordered all of the expansions for it. I don't know how much more I'll get beyond Rise of the Red Skull, but we'll see. We'll see. The next big box is Groot and Rocket Raccoon, which certainly appeals. Once you're bought in its so easy to justify $15 a month lol. It's like you can't afford NOT to buy the new packs.

    I just bought it. I already have a lot of Arkham's first three cycles, so I don't entirely know why I need another LCG...

    I'm debating sleeving it, too, but these FFG games pile up cards fast.

    I've given up worrying about sleeving by just ordering a thousand of my preferred generic sleeves every few months. Works fine.

    I might buy packs of Sleeve Kings to try. They're 60 microns but apparently sturdy and quite a good fit. Has anyone tried them before? A bundle for ALL of Eldritch Horror is about $50. That's seems pretty good!

    Alternatively, I may move the character cards in Arkham to Dragon Shields and use the FFG sleeves removed from them for the scenario cards. Clear matte, non-glare Dragon Shields feel so gooooood.

    Xbox Live, PSN & Origin: Vacorsis 3DS: 2638-0037-166
  • MrBodyMrBody Registered User regular
    edited September 7
    Root is by no means a game for everyone. As it's been covered already, the hype and shiny paint make it seem like it's a vastly different game than it really is. For better or worse, a lot of the balance comes from the table talk/politicking and just in general the players keeping the balance. That isn't inherently a bad thing, but there are plenty of people that don't like that type of thing.

    Keeping the Vagabond in check can kinda be a job for everyone else collectively. If not, he can potentially just run away with it and nobody can do anything about it. As MrBody mentioned, early on it seems like just beating down the Cats is a good move. But if you just outright smack them down so hard that they're effectively out of the game from the start, then they are no longer around to keep other factions in check, especially the larger ones like Moles or Birds and then they can run away with it. So you come to learn that that isn't exactly the best move either.

    The game is all about maintaining the ecosystem on the board. If you disrupt that ecosystem too much by dumping on one person too heavily, it will quickly shift to favor one player that can then run away with it. Part of the hard part here is basically what the SUSD review covers, you have to know how all the factions work and score to really effectively do this. Anyways, as noted, it's not for everyone, but there is more depth than it seems to it as well. However a lot of that depth is seen the most when playing with a group that is all very familiar with the game. If you are constantly playing with new players the game can very easily suffer.

    I'm just not seeing how it stands out (except for the art) even in its narrow category. I've played asymmetrical games of Cthulhu Wars and Chaos in the Old World where everyone has to not only learn their faction, but the whole ecosystem. But those games had everyone perfectly understand it all after 1-2 games, with the initial explanation taking no more than 10-15 minutes. Root? Good lord, triple that. At least.

    COIN games get around that by everyone knowing they're going to be an investment from the get go.

    Then once everyone does learn, worst case someone pulls ahead early and it's a foregone conclusion they'll win. Best case, everyone stays close until everyone is one turn from hitting 30 points. Since it's impossible to exactly predict who that one is going to be, the winning round is who got picked on the least that final turn and that feels random and unsatisfying. Winning ended up not feeling any more satisfying than losing.

    (the digital version is one of the best ports I've seen though. Very polished, stable, bug free, just enough graphical touches, the best AI you could hope for. So if you're a fan, you definitely want to pick it up. Good to know quality digital ports are still being made after the string of disappointments with Scythe, Terraforming Mars, Blood Rage, and Labyrinth: War on Terror)

    MrBody on
  • Magic PinkMagic Pink Tur-Boner-Fed Registered User regular
    Athenor wrote: »
    Dashui wrote: »
    Ah_Pook wrote: »
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Oh. Oh no.

    I’m starting to remember why CCGs are evil.

    *looks at the growing pile of cards from the four booster boxes of Flesh and Blood that he’s picked up over the last month or two...*

    ...but what if it was five....

    Entirely unrelatedly, Marvel Champions is super fun and I definitely ordered all of the expansions for it. I don't know how much more I'll get beyond Rise of the Red Skull, but we'll see. We'll see. The next big box is Groot and Rocket Raccoon, which certainly appeals. Once you're bought in its so easy to justify $15 a month lol. It's like you can't afford NOT to buy the new packs.

    I just bought it. I already have a lot of Arkham's first three cycles, so I don't entirely know why I need another LCG...

    I'm debating sleeving it, too, but these FFG games pile up cards fast.

    I've given up worrying about sleeving by just ordering a thousand of my preferred generic sleeves every few months. Works fine.

    I've given up worrying about sleeving by not sleeving. I have yet to lose a card in ANY of my games for any messy reason.

    JonBobFryVyolyncetyrantula22
  • ArcSynArcSyn Registered User regular
    I have kids. So if the game would cost more to sleeve than replace, no sleeves. If it would cost more to replace (or isn't replaceable) then I sleeve. It is horrifying to watch them try to shuffle or what they do when they're idling between turns...

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  • Magic PinkMagic Pink Tur-Boner-Fed Registered User regular
    ArcSyn wrote: »
    I have kids.

    hold on i've found the problem

    Hahnsoo1FishmanElvenshae
  • Magic PinkMagic Pink Tur-Boner-Fed Registered User regular
    uncanny

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  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    I sleeve cards 20% to protect them and 80% because shuffling sleeved cards is a delight while shuffling unsleeved cards makes me want to die.

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  • DashuiDashui Registered User regular
    edited September 9
    admanb wrote: »
    I sleeve cards 20% to protect them and 80% because shuffling sleeved cards is a delight while shuffling unsleeved cards makes me want to die.

    This. Also I can't shuffle cards for shit. It's a skill I've never been able to get down. Meanwhile, those Dragon Shield mattes legit feel like I've given my cards an upgrade. Mmm, that slide, that texture...

    I was hesitant about buying Marvel Champions, considering I already own way too many FFG games already with stupid amounts of cards. But it's hit the table six times in two days. I've got another game or two scheduled for tomorrow. I think Arkham Horror still resides at the top of the LCG ladder, at least for now, but there's something to be said for being able to quickly pull out that kind of game and complete a fight in 15 (solo) to 30 minutes. I've already picked up Black Window. Captain America and Doctor Strange should come in the next few days. Shit, I'm going to need more sleeves!

    Dashui on
    Xbox Live, PSN & Origin: Vacorsis 3DS: 2638-0037-166
    FryPMAvers
  • FryFry Registered User regular
    Dashui wrote: »
    I've already picked up Black Window.

    I'll have to look into that.

  • Ah_PookAh_Pook Registered User regular
    Speaking of Marvel Champions, there's a buck wild Tabletop Simulator mod for it. All the official content, plus approximately a billion user created things. Heroes, villains, encounter sets, just on and on. Tons of marvel stuff, and tons of other stuff. Ever wanted to use the MC system to fight Joker from Persona 5 against Shredder? Now you can!

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  • CptHamiltonCptHamilton Registered User regular
    admanb wrote: »
    I sleeve cards 20% to protect them and 80% because shuffling sleeved cards is a delight while shuffling unsleeved cards makes me want to die.

    I have no idea what you're doing. Shuffling (decent quality) unsleeved cards is easy and fun. Shuffling sleeved cards feels like I'm just making a mess. I always end up just swirling them around on the table and then trying to square them up again, or else just pile shuffling.

    PSN,Steam,Live | CptHamiltonian
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  • AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist The Skies of HiigaraRegistered User regular
    Ah_Pook wrote: »
    Speaking of Marvel Champions, there's a buck wild Tabletop Simulator mod for it. All the official content, plus approximately a billion user created things. Heroes, villains, encounter sets, just on and on. Tons of marvel stuff, and tons of other stuff. Ever wanted to use the MC system to fight Joker from Persona 5 against Shredder? Now you can!

    I'm part of a really active Marvel Champions facebook group.

    The custom creations were so over the top that holy crap, they had to specify that custom content should only be posted on certain days, lest it overflow the group!

    pTWAqPb.png
    Looking to get rid of some 2005-2010 era Star Wars vehicles/toys. If interested, please PM me.
    He/Him
  • CantidoCantido Registered User regular
    edited September 11
    Geez, even Wingspan is going digital on Steam.

    Yes, board game industry. Digitize. Digitize all the things. My wall of shame can't take anymore.

    Cantido on
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  • BloodySlothBloodySloth Registered User regular
    edited September 11
    Speaking of Wingspan, I finally bought in after hearing about the Oceania expansion. I'm not ashamed of this. Give me a game where I can play a pukeko and I'm in. Hopefully they'll spoil me with a weka or a fantail.

    Anyway the game is just really nice! I'm already seeing internet backlash at the game for not standing up to the hype, which... I guess I can understand? I don't think the game was really meant to explode the way it did. It doesn't deserve ire, though. I like it a hell of a lot.

    BloodySloth on
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  • GvzbgulGvzbgul Ask me about my scrotalist agenda Registered User regular
    Its always weird to me when games get super popular, because there isn't just one reason. Sometimes the art is really cool, sometimes the game works, sometimes there's someone famous or notable attached. But its not like those are automatically winners, there's hundreds of really good or good looking games that never achieve notability.

    A "good game" is just so hard to judge from the outside. At least with kickstarter miniature heavy games you can look at the minis and see whats cool. But with a game that's not great to look at, eg Sidereal Confluence, you just kinda have to take other people's descriptions of it at face value? But boy, other people can be dreadfully wrong from time to time.

    BloodySlothDirk2112
  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    Speaking of Wingspan, I finally bought in after hearing about the Oceania expansion. I'm not ashamed of this. Give me a game where I can play a pukeko and I'm in. Hopefully they'll spoil me with a weka or a fantail.

    Anyway the game is just really nice! I'm already seeing internet backlash at the game for not standing up to the hype, which... I guess I can understand? I don't think the game was really meant to explode the way it did. It doesn't deserve ire, though. I like it a hell of a lot.

    Not a comment on Wingspan at all but it's a Stonemeier game so it was absolutely meant to explode the way it did.
    Gvzbgul wrote: »
    Its always weird to me when games get super popular, because there isn't just one reason. Sometimes the art is really cool, sometimes the game works, sometimes there's someone famous or notable attached. But its not like those are automatically winners, there's hundreds of really good or good looking games that never achieve notability.

    A "good game" is just so hard to judge from the outside. At least with kickstarter miniature heavy games you can look at the minis and see whats cool. But with a game that's not great to look at, eg Sidereal Confluence, you just kinda have to take other people's descriptions of it at face value? But boy, other people can be dreadfully wrong from time to time.

    Well there's also... taste. A massive number of games are "good" but a game that is "good" for me may be the best for you, while a game that is dreadfully mediocre for you may be the best for me. Sidereal Confluence is a great example of that.

    I would go so far as to say that the more likely a game is to be a perfect 10 for one person the more likely it is to be absolutely hated by another person. The best games are often the most divisive.

    38thDoeCalica
  • CaptainPeacockCaptainPeacock Board Game Hoarder Top o' the LakeRegistered User regular
    Just found out Wolfgang Warsch has a third Clever game coming out: Clever Hoch Drei. Very excited!

    Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular


    The PDF version of the rulebook is up on the website as well.

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  • MrBodyMrBody Registered User regular
    edited September 16
    admanb wrote: »
    Well there's also... taste. A massive number of games are "good" but a game that is "good" for me may be the best for you, while a game that is dreadfully mediocre for you may be the best for me. Sidereal Confluence is a great example of that.

    This is what I don't get about the massive popularity of Terraforming Mars (my vote for THE most overrated game of the decade), in that it seems like (as close as you can get to) objectively an inferior version of other games.

    The actual board element of Terraforming Mars is of minimal importance. If you take away the board, it's basically Race for the Galaxy or numerous other tableau builders, but at 3 times the price and playtime with less interaction and the world's most fiddly components. The only edge it has over Race is the narrative feel of developing Mars over generations, but that wears out after a couple plays.

    MrBody on
  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited September 16
    MrBody wrote: »
    admanb wrote: »
    Well there's also... taste. A massive number of games are "good" but a game that is "good" for me may be the best for you, while a game that is dreadfully mediocre for you may be the best for me. Sidereal Confluence is a great example of that.

    This is what I don't get about the massive popularity of Terraforming Mars (my vote for THE most overrated game of the decade), in that it seems like (as close as you can get to) objectively an inferior version of other games.

    The actual board element of Terraforming Mars is of minimal importance. If you take away the board, it's basically Race for the Galaxy, but at 3 times the price and playtime with less interaction and the world's most fiddly components. The only edge it has over Race is the narrative feel of developing Mars over generations, but that wears out after a couple plays.

    I think what Terraforming Mars accomplished is obfuscating the fundamental loop a lot better than Race for the Galaxy. Engine builders offer a world of possibilities that shrink very quickly as you play them. For a lot of players this is a big disappointment -- see the criticisms of Dominion that as soon as your deck gets rolling, the game ends. Race for the Galaxy reveals in just a few plays that if you're not aiming for victory within a few rounds, you've already lost. For some players, that's going to be the last time they play the game. By giving you the board full of options, TFM does a lot to slow that realization and you can see that evidenced in the number of people who talk about their 2-3 hour games.

    And I'm hesitant to say that makes TFM the "worse" game even though you and I would much prefer to play Race for the Galaxy. If you strip away the price and fiddliness can we reasonably argue that TFM has less depth than RftG? *big shrug*

    admanb on
  • MrBodyMrBody Registered User regular
    Doesn't that just mean it takes a little longer for TM to reveal the narrow possibilities?

  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    MrBody wrote: »
    Doesn't that just mean it takes a little longer for TM to reveal the narrow possibilities?

    Yes, but my claim is that the narrow possibilities aren't a lack of depth but rather a lack of... thrill? You got into them imagining you're going to set up a seven card engine that fires off an infinite combo on turn 13 or whatever the hell and instead you get to turn 4 and the game is almost over. But they doesn't mean they're strategically shallow.

  • ironzergironzerg Registered User regular
    I think that's one thing Wingspan does pretty well as far as a tableau builder. In a lot of games it's not really until the fourth (and final round, which is also the shortest) that you realize not only do your birds suck, but the other guy's birds are so much cooler and you're about to get clobbered.



  • CaptainPeacockCaptainPeacock Board Game Hoarder Top o' the LakeRegistered User regular
    Egg on your face, is how we put it.

    Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
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  • ironzergironzerg Registered User regular
    Hmm. Didn't taste like egg. :bigfrown:



  • Dirk2112Dirk2112 Registered User regular
    I still haven't played Wingspan. My wife loves birds in general, but hates engine building games, so I didn't acquire it. It also doesn't help that our friends that were going gaga for it also were head over heels for Quacks of Quedlinburg. Talk about overrated garbage...

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  • 38thDoe38thDoe lets never be stupid again wait lets always be stupid foreverRegistered User regular
    Aww I like overrated garbage. Granted some of the ingredients are kind of overpowered but you can mix and match. Are there any push your luck games you like better?

    Magic Pink
  • Dirk2112Dirk2112 Registered User regular
    edited September 17
    38thDoe wrote: »
    Aww I like overrated garbage. Granted some of the ingredients are kind of overpowered but you can mix and match. Are there any push your luck games you like better?

    I am not a fan of luck based games at all. A little luck here and there is fine, but not as the major mechanic. I think I would rather play poker or black jack than Quacks. I find all 3 to be unbelievably boring.

    In the game's defense, people built it up before I got to play it and I was let down. Maybe if I didn't hear so many great things about it, I wouldn't have been so disappointed. When I show someone a new game, I might say that I like it, but I won't oversell it or swear up and down it is the best game of 20XX.

    Is Camel Up a push your luck game? I like that one. King of Tokyo is ok.

    Dirk2112 on
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  • MrBodyMrBody Registered User regular
    Overrated garbage? Luck based?

    No one could pay me to touch Betrayal at House on the Hill again.

  • Dongs GaloreDongs Galore Registered User regular
    edited September 17
    any hex-and-chit wargamers in here? I finally got to table my copy of Stalingrad '42, the latest entry in Mark Simonitch's series of operational WW2 games, last weekend.
    It's a surprisingly simple ruleset considering the size and scope of the game. I want to try some of his other entries to see how it stacks up against them, as Stalingrad involves a much larger map and a much longer timescale than Normandy or Market Garden.

    Also I am very partial to the art style GMT uses for their modern wargame maps. It's bright, readable and attractive.

    Dongs Galore on
    ArcticLancer
  • JonBobJonBob Registered User regular
    Dirk2112 wrote: »
    Is Camel Up a push your luck game?
    I'd say no. "Push your luck" is different than "luck-based." It connotes that a player has something good happen to them, and then is given a choice about whether to risk that progress based on the chance of an even greater reward.

    Can't Stop exemplifies that mechanism (and is such an amazing design, especially considering its era).

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  • Jam WarriorJam Warrior Registered User regular
    Pontoon would be the archetypal Push your Luck game. Stick with what you’ve got or risk a gamble on potentially getting more but potentially losing what you currently have instead.

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  • 38thDoe38thDoe lets never be stupid again wait lets always be stupid foreverRegistered User regular
    edited September 17
    Yeah when I think Push your luck I think of:
    Ra, Deep Sea Adventure, Port Royal, Incan Gold, Mystic Vale.

    I love Ra at higher player counts. Calling Ra is so much fun. I like auction games that aren't auctioning turn order. Also I like how you auction the bids themselves so no one ever has all the money and always wins auctions.
    Deep Sea Adventure aka drowning simulator is a good time even if you are going to drown/lose.
    I want to buy Port Royal but I'm having trouble finding a place that carries the original artwork. Which sounds like a silly reason not to buy a game but its the same thing stopping me from grabbing Jaipur.
    Incan Gold is fun but gem division math slows it down a bit.

    38thDoe on
  • CantidoCantido Registered User regular
    Asmodee is having a Steam sale. I'm going to see what all this Gloomhaven fuss is about, now that the digital version has had more time in the oven.

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  • MrBodyMrBody Registered User regular
    Around how close is that to the physical game?

  • Magic PinkMagic Pink Tur-Boner-Fed Registered User regular
    edited September 18
    MrBody wrote: »
    Around how close is that to the physical game?

    Fairly close except it's actually fun ho ho ho

    Also, the whole campaign from the board game isn't implemented yet but is in the pipe

    Magic Pink on
  • ArcticLancerArcticLancer Best served chilled. Registered User regular
    Hey, @Ah_Pook, my copy of Calico arrived last night. The production values are absolutely stellar, but did you also find the cardboard is a noticeably low quality? I'd be wary of actually using the tile bag given how quickly those things want to peel. I really hope they improve this in later printings, because gosh what a nice package overall.

  • AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist The Skies of HiigaraRegistered User regular
    Store was having its customer appreciation and clearance sale today.

    Finally pulled the trigger on Ultimate Werewolf Legacy.

    I'm glad I waited, because this is a game that falls squarely into the "never getting it to the table" spot.

    On the other hand? Holy cow do I want to run this. I just need to find 8-15 more friends and a place where we can all sit in a circle and not make each other sick.

    pTWAqPb.png
    Looking to get rid of some 2005-2010 era Star Wars vehicles/toys. If interested, please PM me.
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  • nwrabenwrabe Insidious Squid Registered User regular
    Athenor wrote: »
    Store was having its customer appreciation and clearance sale today.

    Finally pulled the trigger on Ultimate Werewolf Legacy.

    I'm glad I waited, because this is a game that falls squarely into the "never getting it to the table" spot.

    On the other hand? Holy cow do I want to run this. I just need to find 8-15 more friends and a place where we can all sit in a circle and not make each other sick.

    It could be a good way to spend two weeks if you and a medium group all happen to get exposed at the same time and wind up in quarantine together.

    ArmorocElvenshae
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