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Governor-General will no longer be governing, generally [Canadian Politics Thread]

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Posts

  • AegisAegis Not Quite TorontoRegistered User regular
    Not in BC, so maybe there's some local context to this from the premier, but like:
    Premier John Horgan has no plans to impose travel restrictions between Vancouver Island and the B.C. mainland, despite warnings that a recent spike in COVID-19 infections is at least partly the result of travel.

    ...

    The premier acknowledged the province could restrict ferry travel, and has done so in the past, but he said it was "not necessarily to good effect … I appreciate we want to be like New Zealand, but we can't be."

    ...But why not? You don't want to emulate a country with a similar population to your province? Surely there's a deeper reason buried here.

    We'll see how long this blog lasts
    Currently DMing: None :(
    Characters
    [5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
    CanadianWolverineShadowenShadowhope
  • CorvusCorvus . VancouverRegistered User regular
    Aegis wrote: »
    Not in BC, so maybe there's some local context to this from the premier, but like:
    Premier John Horgan has no plans to impose travel restrictions between Vancouver Island and the B.C. mainland, despite warnings that a recent spike in COVID-19 infections is at least partly the result of travel.

    ...

    The premier acknowledged the province could restrict ferry travel, and has done so in the past, but he said it was "not necessarily to good effect … I appreciate we want to be like New Zealand, but we can't be."

    ...But why not? You don't want to emulate a country with a similar population to your province? Surely there's a deeper reason buried here.

    Because not enough people are dead or sick for him to think it's worth the disruption to the economy.

    He absolutely could do it, the power to do so is contained in the emergency legislation, and we have been in an official state of emergency for over a year.

    This is a choice. This government in BC can move fast, and be agile, when it wants to. It doesn't want to respond rapidly to the pandemic. I can't understand why, considering he has a majority due to the election he called last summer in order to get rid of having to deal with his coalition with the Greens.

    :so_raven:
    CanadianWolverineZibblsnrtCaedwyrGnome-InterruptusShadowenThe Cow King
  • CaedwyrCaedwyr Registered User regular
    If the government keeps on taking ineffectual actions to slow/stop the spread, constantly bemoans people not following any of the guidelines, and does nothing. Then that is a choice and they are willing to accept the outcome.

  • CorvusCorvus . VancouverRegistered User regular
    Caedwyr wrote: »
    If the government keeps on taking ineffectual actions to slow/stop the spread, constantly bemoans people not following any of the guidelines, and does nothing. Then that is a choice and they are willing to accept the outcome.

    It already is a choice.

    Horgan blamed young people for things going badly. And now:



    The NDP is very, very, lucky that their opposition is completely and totally ineffectual.

    :so_raven:
    CaedwyrCanadianWolverineShadowen
  • ZibblsnrtZibblsnrt Registered User regular
    Caedwyr wrote: »
    If the government keeps on taking ineffectual actions to slow/stop the spread, constantly bemoans people not following any of the guidelines, and does nothing. Then that is a choice and they are willing to accept the outcome.

    That and the whole "gradual, highly incremental, highly reactive responses to everything" approach that seems to be the default, since most provincial governments still don't quite understand that slowly scaling responses to whatever's going on only ever keeps case increases steep as opposed to vertical.

    People seem to have a lot of trouble understanding that there's no such thing as "only a little on fire."

    Gnome-InterruptusArcticLancerCanadianWolverine
  • CaedwyrCaedwyr Registered User regular
    Let's say that the government is 100% correct that young people are the main cause of spreading the illness and that the measures to date have been not as effective in halting the spread as they want. So my question is, what actions are they going to take to obtain the outcome they want? Why should I believe that these actions are going to work? They haven't been for quite a while, so why is this time going to be different? If people's behaviours aren't changing as needed with the current measures, why should I expect them to change now, especially at this stage when everyone is exhausted of the COVID world and many have just tuned the government out.

    CanadianWolverine
  • KetBraKetBra Dressed Ridiculously Registered User regular
    apparently a bunch of UCP MLA's are upset because they don't want any new restrictions whatsoever

    What a load of wankers

    KGMvDLc.jpg?1
    BouwsT
  • ShivahnShivahn Unaware of her barrel shifter privilege Western coastal temptressRegistered User, Moderator mod
    Aegis wrote: »
    Not in BC, so maybe there's some local context to this from the premier, but like:
    Premier John Horgan has no plans to impose travel restrictions between Vancouver Island and the B.C. mainland, despite warnings that a recent spike in COVID-19 infections is at least partly the result of travel.

    ...

    The premier acknowledged the province could restrict ferry travel, and has done so in the past, but he said it was "not necessarily to good effect … I appreciate we want to be like New Zealand, but we can't be."

    ...But why not? You don't want to emulate a country with a similar population to your province? Surely there's a deeper reason buried here.

    I mean, tbf, the land borders definitely make it non-NZ like

    But Vancouver Island has none of those, and while it's easier to boat over than airplane, shutting down travel to there makes... sense.....

    There's no reason part of the province couldn't be more NZ-like

    CanadianWolverineShadowenShadowhope
  • CanadianWolverineCanadianWolverine Registered User regular
    edited April 8
    Shivahn wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Not in BC, so maybe there's some local context to this from the premier, but like:
    Premier John Horgan has no plans to impose travel restrictions between Vancouver Island and the B.C. mainland, despite warnings that a recent spike in COVID-19 infections is at least partly the result of travel.

    ...

    The premier acknowledged the province could restrict ferry travel, and has done so in the past, but he said it was "not necessarily to good effect … I appreciate we want to be like New Zealand, but we can't be."

    ...But why not? You don't want to emulate a country with a similar population to your province? Surely there's a deeper reason buried here.

    I mean, tbf, the land borders definitely make it non-NZ like

    But Vancouver Island has none of those, and while it's easier to boat over than airplane, shutting down travel to there makes... sense.....

    There's no reason part of the province couldn't be more NZ-like

    Agreed.

    Though, keep in mind, sections of BC have closed off before, not during the pandemic to my knowledge but mountain passes have been impassible before, river bridges have been shut down before, whole parts of the coast and the Haida Gwaii are also chiefly only accessible by ferry/barge. Regionally, BC can be sectioned off by natural barriers that are only connected by narrow travel corridors. If we wanted to in BC, we definitely could turn into a whole bunch of New Zealand -like protected areas where we have a clear picture of who is traveling between those regions and if they are essential and in safe working conditions IMHO, it definitely isn't as impossible as Horgan and the Covid spreaders he is placating is making it seem.

    This all said though, I am under no illusion that things would be WAY worse if it was the BC Liberals who had formed government, doesn't stop it from needing to be said that Horgan's leadership of the NDP is not rising to the moment (and a number of other moments as well).

    Also, when did our new Canadian become a moderator in PA! Congrats @Shivahn :)

    CanadianWolverine on
    steam_sig.png
    CaedwyrGnome-Interruptus
  • JeanJean Papa bear Gatineau, QuébecRegistered User regular
    Uh oh... new press conference tomorrow at 5PM in Québec.

    News conference at 5PM are never about good news. Apparently the # for Québec City are awful.

    "You won't destroy us, You won't destroy our democracy. We are a small but proud nation. No one can bomb us to silence. No one can scare us from being Norway. This evening and tonight, we'll take care of each other. That's what we do best when attacked'' - Jens Stoltenberg
  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    Jean wrote: »
    Uh oh... new press conference tomorrow at 5PM in Québec.

    News conference at 5PM are never about good news. Apparently the # for Québec City are awful.

    After a week hovering at 240-250 with the occasional one-day jump to 300, we apparently skyrocketed to 400 new cases in one day yesterday.

    Not sure what new measures he can put in place though. Everything is already shut down and curfew is in place. What they need to do is speed up vaccination. Where's the million-vaccines-a-week we were supposed to get?

    sig.gif
  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    Caedwyr wrote: »
    Let's say that the government is 100% correct that young people are the main cause of spreading the illness and that the measures to date have been not as effective in halting the spread as they want. So my question is, what actions are they going to take to obtain the outcome they want? Why should I believe that these actions are going to work? They haven't been for quite a while, so why is this time going to be different? If people's behaviours aren't changing as needed with the current measures, why should I expect them to change now, especially at this stage when everyone is exhausted of the COVID world and many have just tuned the government out.

    Politicians blaming young people for the pandemic isn't about finding solutions, it's about finding a scapegoat.

    Young people have been fucking heroic. They have sacrificed their education, their social lives, their physical activities, and their mental healths, for the cause of saving the older generations from covid. The very same older generation that have crippled their education system, tanked their economy, destroyed their job market, poisoned their politics, strip-mined their natural resources, polluted their environment, and top it up by calling younger generations entitled, disrespectful and ungrateful when they're asked to stop making things worse. Watching politicians turn around and blame younger generations for this wave of covid is sickening. The younger generations deserve monuments in celebration of everything they've endured and done for the older generations.

    sig.gif
    CroakerBCShadowenCaedwyrZibblsnrtGnome-InterruptusCanadianWolverineFencingsaxBionicPenguinArcticLancerShadowBladeShadowhopeDissociaterLordSolarMachariusLord_AsmodeusAutomautocratesMeeqeAnalogWarlordIncenjucar
  • JeanJean Papa bear Gatineau, QuébecRegistered User regular
    Where's the million-vaccines-a-week we were supposed to get?

    well, this week's Québec's getting
    • 230 490 Pfizer
    • 176 400 Moderna
    • 71 600 Astra Zeneca (from the COVAX program)
    • Total : 478 490

    You can see the calender of confirmed delivreries here : https://www.canada.ca/fr/sante-publique/services/maladies/2019-nouveau-coronavirus/prevention-risques/covid-19-vaccins-traitements/deploiement-vaccin.html

    "You won't destroy us, You won't destroy our democracy. We are a small but proud nation. No one can bomb us to silence. No one can scare us from being Norway. This evening and tonight, we'll take care of each other. That's what we do best when attacked'' - Jens Stoltenberg
  • NosfNosf Registered User regular
    Richy wrote: »
    Caedwyr wrote: »
    Let's say that the government is 100% correct that young people are the main cause of spreading the illness and that the measures to date have been not as effective in halting the spread as they want. So my question is, what actions are they going to take to obtain the outcome they want? Why should I believe that these actions are going to work? They haven't been for quite a while, so why is this time going to be different? If people's behaviours aren't changing as needed with the current measures, why should I expect them to change now, especially at this stage when everyone is exhausted of the COVID world and many have just tuned the government out.

    Politicians blaming young people for the pandemic isn't about finding solutions, it's about finding a scapegoat.

    Young people have been fucking heroic. They have sacrificed their education, their social lives, their physical activities, and their mental healths, for the cause of saving the older generations from covid. The very same older generation that have crippled their education system, tanked their economy, destroyed their job market, poisoned their politics, strip-mined their natural resources, polluted their environment, and top it up by calling younger generations entitled, disrespectful and ungrateful when they're asked to stop making things worse. Watching politicians turn around and blame younger generations for this wave of covid is sickening. The younger generations deserve monuments in celebration of everything they've endured and done for the older generations.

    Let's not plan the parade just yet, our local university has about 9 outbreaks in residence and if you walk through the student housing areas, they're out 10 to 12 people in groups on the front lawn drinking and such without masks. An assortment of young and old have been good and bad.

    The only people who deserve a fucking parade are my local favorite pizzeria who still get me pizza in 30 minutes, two mediums, 4 cokes, a lb of wings and a *sigh* salad for my wife all for 34 bucks without a single reported case of covid over the course of all this madness.

    CaedwyrshrykeFencingsaxBouwsTKayne Red Robe
  • ShivahnShivahn Unaware of her barrel shifter privilege Western coastal temptressRegistered User, Moderator mod
    Shivahn wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Not in BC, so maybe there's some local context to this from the premier, but like:
    Premier John Horgan has no plans to impose travel restrictions between Vancouver Island and the B.C. mainland, despite warnings that a recent spike in COVID-19 infections is at least partly the result of travel.

    ...

    The premier acknowledged the province could restrict ferry travel, and has done so in the past, but he said it was "not necessarily to good effect … I appreciate we want to be like New Zealand, but we can't be."

    ...But why not? You don't want to emulate a country with a similar population to your province? Surely there's a deeper reason buried here.

    I mean, tbf, the land borders definitely make it non-NZ like

    But Vancouver Island has none of those, and while it's easier to boat over than airplane, shutting down travel to there makes... sense.....

    There's no reason part of the province couldn't be more NZ-like

    Agreed.

    Though, keep in mind, sections of BC have closed off before, not during the pandemic to my knowledge but mountain passes have been impassible before, river bridges have been shut down before, whole parts of the coast and the Haida Gwaii are also chiefly only accessible by ferry/barge. Regionally, BC can be sectioned off by natural barriers that are only connected by narrow travel corridors. If we wanted to in BC, we definitely could turn into a whole bunch of New Zealand -like protected areas where we have a clear picture of who is traveling between those regions and if they are essential and in safe working conditions IMHO, it definitely isn't as impossible as Horgan and the Covid spreaders he is placating is making it seem.

    This all said though, I am under no illusion that things would be WAY worse if it was the BC Liberals who had formed government, doesn't stop it from needing to be said that Horgan's leadership of the NDP is not rising to the moment (and a number of other moments as well).

    Also, when did our new Canadian become a moderator in PA! Congrats Shivahn :)

    Like a week or two ago

    I decided I might as well upgrade my status in all domains this year :P

    CanadianWolverineFencingsaxShadowhopeBouwsTKetBra
  • ZibblsnrtZibblsnrt Registered User regular
    Richy wrote: »
    Not sure what new measures he can put in place though. Everything is already shut down and curfew is in place. What they need to do is speed up vaccination. Where's the million-vaccines-a-week we were supposed to get?

    A lot of them are already there and just not administered. Ontario's got 1.3 million doses sitting in fridges right now, Quebec's got 800,000, and I think most of the other provinces have proportionately similar things going on.

    NS remains kind of irritating, as we've only administered a little more than half of all the doses we've gotten so far.

  • The Cow KingThe Cow King a island Registered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    Corvus wrote: »
    The pandemic theatre by politicians has gotten very tiresome. Like, we all know you've done the math and decided what level of sickness and death is acceptable to keep an acceptable level of capitalism going.

    Please. They haven't done any math (they aren't that smart or organized) and this has nothing to do with capitalism. They are a bunch of dumb goobers ricocheting between whatever stupid solutions pop into their heads to the immediate problems in front of them. Lockdowns are unpopular. The pandemic raging out of control, and especially stories about the pandemic raging out of control, are also unpopular. You want to get reelected. Ergo you bounce back and forth being locking down (or whatever dumb word you wanna use for it you think might be less politically damaging) and opening up depending on which thing you fear is making you more unpopular at that very moment. There is no thought or long-term planning or data-based analysis going on here.

    It's pretty capitalist in Ontario sorry

    Ford's sitting in 2 billion isn't giving paid sick days cause again the libs traded that for 44 hour overtime and now we have both so why would ford reverse on his first policy change

    Also sitting on 2 billion in funding to slap onto the deficient instead of paying workers to stay home and contain the virus, propping up small business with loans so they can label themselves essential and sell what ever etc etc

    Its very capitialism were just a generation removed from mass employee death so for some reason acceptable infection rates is just the cost of doing business

    icGJy2C.png
  • The Cow KingThe Cow King a island Registered User regular
    edited April 8
    Oh and ya know the whole IP law is more important then vaccines for the world that's pretty fucked up!!

    The Cow King on
    icGJy2C.png
    CanadianWolverine
  • CorvusCorvus . VancouverRegistered User regular
    Shivahn wrote: »
    Aegis wrote: »
    Not in BC, so maybe there's some local context to this from the premier, but like:
    Premier John Horgan has no plans to impose travel restrictions between Vancouver Island and the B.C. mainland, despite warnings that a recent spike in COVID-19 infections is at least partly the result of travel.

    ...

    The premier acknowledged the province could restrict ferry travel, and has done so in the past, but he said it was "not necessarily to good effect … I appreciate we want to be like New Zealand, but we can't be."

    ...But why not? You don't want to emulate a country with a similar population to your province? Surely there's a deeper reason buried here.

    I mean, tbf, the land borders definitely make it non-NZ like

    But Vancouver Island has none of those, and while it's easier to boat over than airplane, shutting down travel to there makes... sense.....

    There's no reason part of the province couldn't be more NZ-like

    There's no reason BC couldn't have the travel restrictions for out of province travel that Manitoba has enacted. Manitoba has the best results right now of Non-Maritime Provinces or the Territories. The decision by governments to not do everything they can to flatten the pandemic is just maddening. I feel like emergency response staff are being thrown into the meat grinder so we can keep fucking Home Depot home.

    :so_raven:
    CanadianWolverineGnome-InterruptusShadowhope
  • MuzzmuzzMuzzmuzz Registered User regular
    Anecdotal evidence, but when many of my regular customers, located in a staunchly ‘Fuck Trudeau and Wynne’ area start complaining that Ford is useless, you know know he’s really fucked up. I mean, these are usually the same people who voted for him, and are realizing that a buck a beer isn’t something you should make a main plank of your platform.

  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited April 8
    shryke wrote: »
    Corvus wrote: »
    The pandemic theatre by politicians has gotten very tiresome. Like, we all know you've done the math and decided what level of sickness and death is acceptable to keep an acceptable level of capitalism going.

    Please. They haven't done any math (they aren't that smart or organized) and this has nothing to do with capitalism. They are a bunch of dumb goobers ricocheting between whatever stupid solutions pop into their heads to the immediate problems in front of them. Lockdowns are unpopular. The pandemic raging out of control, and especially stories about the pandemic raging out of control, are also unpopular. You want to get reelected. Ergo you bounce back and forth being locking down (or whatever dumb word you wanna use for it you think might be less politically damaging) and opening up depending on which thing you fear is making you more unpopular at that very moment. There is no thought or long-term planning or data-based analysis going on here.

    It's pretty capitalist in Ontario sorry

    Ford's sitting in 2 billion isn't giving paid sick days cause again the libs traded that for 44 hour overtime and now we have both so why would ford reverse on his first policy change

    Also sitting on 2 billion in funding to slap onto the deficient instead of paying workers to stay home and contain the virus, propping up small business with loans so they can label themselves essential and sell what ever etc etc

    Its very capitialism were just a generation removed from mass employee death so for some reason acceptable infection rates is just the cost of doing business

    Nah. Trying to find a reason to shoehorn "it's the fault of capitalism" into literally everything is silly and tiresome. This whole thing is just politicians (like Ford) not wanting to do unpopular things or make difficult choices. Lockdowns and shutting downs schools and all that shit make people unhappy so they try and avoid it right up until the point where they have no choice.

    shryke on
    Gnome-InterruptusBouwsTSteelhawkAridhol
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Muzzmuzz wrote: »
    Anecdotal evidence, but when many of my regular customers, located in a staunchly ‘Fuck Trudeau and Wynne’ area start complaining that Ford is useless, you know know he’s really fucked up. I mean, these are usually the same people who voted for him, and are realizing that a buck a beer isn’t something you should make a main plank of your platform.

    Ford is so obviously running scared. Every announcement about doing something feels like he's being dragged in front of the cameras because he has no other choice. He wasn't popular before this all started and now he's fucking it up in a way that pleases no one.

  • JeanJean Papa bear Gatineau, QuébecRegistered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    Muzzmuzz wrote: »
    Anecdotal evidence, but when many of my regular customers, located in a staunchly ‘Fuck Trudeau and Wynne’ area start complaining that Ford is useless, you know know he’s really fucked up. I mean, these are usually the same people who voted for him, and are realizing that a buck a beer isn’t something you should make a main plank of your platform.

    Ford is so obviously running scared. Every announcement about doing something feels like he's being dragged in front of the cameras because he has no other choice. He wasn't popular before this all started and now he's fucking it up in a way that pleases no one.

    gp8pfn0uz9lt.jpg

    "You won't destroy us, You won't destroy our democracy. We are a small but proud nation. No one can bomb us to silence. No one can scare us from being Norway. This evening and tonight, we'll take care of each other. That's what we do best when attacked'' - Jens Stoltenberg
    Gnome-InterruptusImperfectAegisShadowenGiantGeek2020SteelhawkGaddez
  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    Muzzmuzz wrote: »
    Anecdotal evidence, but when many of my regular customers, located in a staunchly ‘Fuck Trudeau and Wynne’ area start complaining that Ford is useless, you know know he’s really fucked up. I mean, these are usually the same people who voted for him, and are realizing that a buck a beer isn’t something you should make a main plank of your platform.

    Complaining is worthless. How many of them will actually vote Ford out, or at least stay home on election day? And how many of them will curse Ford to hell while they vote for him because "owning the libs" is a higher priority for them than having a competent government that won't abandon them to die from a preventable disease? My guess is, the latter number dwarfs the former.

    sig.gif
    ShadowBladeShadowhopeComahawkShadowen
  • ArcticLancerArcticLancer Best served chilled. Registered User regular
    This is maybe something to be cognizant of with the way things are going in parts of the country. I know we're not Brazil in numerous ways, but no part of me would be surprised if Covid (especially the known variants) are becoming more deadly.

  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Richy wrote: »
    Muzzmuzz wrote: »
    Anecdotal evidence, but when many of my regular customers, located in a staunchly ‘Fuck Trudeau and Wynne’ area start complaining that Ford is useless, you know know he’s really fucked up. I mean, these are usually the same people who voted for him, and are realizing that a buck a beer isn’t something you should make a main plank of your platform.

    Complaining is worthless. How many of them will actually vote Ford out, or at least stay home on election day? And how many of them will curse Ford to hell while they vote for him because "owning the libs" is a higher priority for them than having a competent government that won't abandon them to die from a preventable disease? My guess is, the latter number dwarfs the former.

    That's not how Ford got elected. The Liberals got voted out because they'd been in power for over a decade, scandals were piling up and prices on energy were rising.

    Steelhawk
  • JeanJean Papa bear Gatineau, QuébecRegistered User regular
    In more upbeat news, huge lineups for the Astra Zeneca vaccine all over Québec. 500 people in my city got that vaccine today.

    vaccins-aztrazeneca-sans-rendez-vous-palais-des-congres-attente.jpeg

    "You won't destroy us, You won't destroy our democracy. We are a small but proud nation. No one can bomb us to silence. No one can scare us from being Norway. This evening and tonight, we'll take care of each other. That's what we do best when attacked'' - Jens Stoltenberg
    Gnome-InterruptusArcticLancerFencingsaxRichyShadowBladeShadowenElvenshae
  • The Cow KingThe Cow King a island Registered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    shryke wrote: »
    Corvus wrote: »
    The pandemic theatre by politicians has gotten very tiresome. Like, we all know you've done the math and decided what level of sickness and death is acceptable to keep an acceptable level of capitalism going.

    Please. They haven't done any math (they aren't that smart or organized) and this has nothing to do with capitalism. They are a bunch of dumb goobers ricocheting between whatever stupid solutions pop into their heads to the immediate problems in front of them. Lockdowns are unpopular. The pandemic raging out of control, and especially stories about the pandemic raging out of control, are also unpopular. You want to get reelected. Ergo you bounce back and forth being locking down (or whatever dumb word you wanna use for it you think might be less politically damaging) and opening up depending on which thing you fear is making you more unpopular at that very moment. There is no thought or long-term planning or data-based analysis going on here.

    It's pretty capitalist in Ontario sorry

    Ford's sitting in 2 billion isn't giving paid sick days cause again the libs traded that for 44 hour overtime and now we have both so why would ford reverse on his first policy change

    Also sitting on 2 billion in funding to slap onto the deficient instead of paying workers to stay home and contain the virus, propping up small business with loans so they can label themselves essential and sell what ever etc etc

    Its very capitialism were just a generation removed from mass employee death so for some reason acceptable infection rates is just the cost of doing business

    Nah. Trying to find a reason to shoehorn "it's the fault of capitalism" into literally everything is silly and tiresome. This whole thing is just politicians (like Ford) not wanting to do unpopular things or make difficult choices. Lockdowns and shutting downs schools and all that shit make people unhappy so they try and avoid it right up until the point where they have no choice.

    ???

    Ford's literal ideology has been business first and fuck the workers I'm not shoehorning anything the Wests response has clearly been the economy is the most important thing bar none

    Looking at the closest political proxies the UK and USA doesn't exactly disregard this either

    icGJy2C.png
    CanadianWolverineShadowenZibblsnrt
  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    ???

    Ford's literal ideology has been business first and fuck the workers I'm not shoehorning anything the Wests response has clearly been the economy is the most important thing bar none

    Looking at the closest political proxies the UK and USA doesn't exactly disregard this either

    The Ford's would fit right in with the GOP since they're crony capitalists but Shryke is technically correct. He world's problems won't all go away by just by blaming capitalism itself.

    Shadowhope
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    BC has an NDP government that's basically doing the same shit. Politicians are half-assing their response in exactly the same way all over the place if you follow the news.

    Gnome-InterruptusBroloComahawkAridholBouwsTKetBraShadowhopeHarry Dresden
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    edited April 9
    This is exactly the time when, as a politician, you are morally required to sacrifice your election chances to act decisively and save lives. This is exactly the moment when leadership means caring more about people than votes. I never expected Ford to display leadership or understand what it means, in a crisis or anywhere else. He is a gutless, venal crook with neither conviction nor wisdom, and his many and varied failures are killing people daily.

    Evil Multifarious on
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I fucking hate you Canadians.
    ArcticLancerShadowBladeCanadianWolverineshrykeShadowenLord_AsmodeusZibblsnrtGnome-InterruptusShadowhopeThe Cow King
  • CorvusCorvus . VancouverRegistered User regular
    .
    This is exactly the time when, as a politician, you are morally required to sacrifice your election chances to act decisively and save lives. This is exactly the moment when leadership means caring more about people than votes. I never expected Ford to display leadership or understand what it means, in a crisis or anywhere else. He is a gutless, venal crook with neither conviction nor wisdom, and his many and varied failures are killing people daily.

    This is what is maddening to me about Horgan's response in BC. He called an election to get a majority while his opposition was feckless and his minority partner was weak with a recent leadership change. He's got a majority for four years. Fuck the business lobby, they can't do shit to you right now, shut things down and save lives!

    :so_raven:
    ShadowenEvil MultifariousCanadianWolverine
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    Corvus wrote: »
    .
    This is exactly the time when, as a politician, you are morally required to sacrifice your election chances to act decisively and save lives. This is exactly the moment when leadership means caring more about people than votes. I never expected Ford to display leadership or understand what it means, in a crisis or anywhere else. He is a gutless, venal crook with neither conviction nor wisdom, and his many and varied failures are killing people daily.

    This is what is maddening to me about Horgan's response in BC. He called an election to get a majority while his opposition was feckless and his minority partner was weak with a recent leadership change. He's got a majority for four years. Fuck the business lobby, they can't do shit to you right now, shut things down and save lives!

    I think this is an ideological problem. One can argue it isn't "capitalism" causing these problems, but I would say it is neoliberalism — these politicians don't believe in government intervention, in spending lots of money on support or programs, or really in a robust welfare state at all. They believe in market solutions to all problems by default. They don't believe in government.

    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I fucking hate you Canadians.
    The Cow KingGnome-InterruptusFencingsaxArcticLancer
  • CorvusCorvus . VancouverRegistered User regular
    Corvus wrote: »
    .
    This is exactly the time when, as a politician, you are morally required to sacrifice your election chances to act decisively and save lives. This is exactly the moment when leadership means caring more about people than votes. I never expected Ford to display leadership or understand what it means, in a crisis or anywhere else. He is a gutless, venal crook with neither conviction nor wisdom, and his many and varied failures are killing people daily.

    This is what is maddening to me about Horgan's response in BC. He called an election to get a majority while his opposition was feckless and his minority partner was weak with a recent leadership change. He's got a majority for four years. Fuck the business lobby, they can't do shit to you right now, shut things down and save lives!

    I think this is an ideological problem. One can argue it isn't "capitalism" causing these problems, but I would say it is neoliberalism — these politicians don't believe in government intervention, in spending lots of money on support or programs, or really in a robust welfare state at all. They believe in market solutions to all problems by default. They don't believe in government.

    I mean, you'd think an NDP premier wouldn't have that problem.

    :so_raven:
    The Cow KingSteelhawkCanadianWolverine
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Corvus wrote: »
    Corvus wrote: »
    .
    This is exactly the time when, as a politician, you are morally required to sacrifice your election chances to act decisively and save lives. This is exactly the moment when leadership means caring more about people than votes. I never expected Ford to display leadership or understand what it means, in a crisis or anywhere else. He is a gutless, venal crook with neither conviction nor wisdom, and his many and varied failures are killing people daily.

    This is what is maddening to me about Horgan's response in BC. He called an election to get a majority while his opposition was feckless and his minority partner was weak with a recent leadership change. He's got a majority for four years. Fuck the business lobby, they can't do shit to you right now, shut things down and save lives!

    I think this is an ideological problem. One can argue it isn't "capitalism" causing these problems, but I would say it is neoliberalism — these politicians don't believe in government intervention, in spending lots of money on support or programs, or really in a robust welfare state at all. They believe in market solutions to all problems by default. They don't believe in government.

    I mean, you'd think an NDP premier wouldn't have that problem.

    Which is why I think it's fairly obvious not specific to any kind of ideology. It's not "capitalist" or "neoliberal" or "right-wing" or "left-wing" or whatever else. It's the naked self-interest of people who don't wanna have to make hard decisions that might endanger their positions.

    SteelhawkCorvusShadowhopeHarry DresdenFencingsaxGiantGeek2020Aridhol
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    Corvus wrote: »
    Corvus wrote: »
    .
    This is exactly the time when, as a politician, you are morally required to sacrifice your election chances to act decisively and save lives. This is exactly the moment when leadership means caring more about people than votes. I never expected Ford to display leadership or understand what it means, in a crisis or anywhere else. He is a gutless, venal crook with neither conviction nor wisdom, and his many and varied failures are killing people daily.

    This is what is maddening to me about Horgan's response in BC. He called an election to get a majority while his opposition was feckless and his minority partner was weak with a recent leadership change. He's got a majority for four years. Fuck the business lobby, they can't do shit to you right now, shut things down and save lives!

    I think this is an ideological problem. One can argue it isn't "capitalism" causing these problems, but I would say it is neoliberalism — these politicians don't believe in government intervention, in spending lots of money on support or programs, or really in a robust welfare state at all. They believe in market solutions to all problems by default. They don't believe in government.

    I mean, you'd think an NDP premier wouldn't have that problem.

    Which is why I think it's fairly obvious not specific to any kind of ideology. It's not "capitalist" or "neoliberal" or "right-wing" or "left-wing" or whatever else. It's the naked self-interest of people who don't wanna have to make hard decisions that might endanger their positions.

    This is an abiding problem with the NDP (for leftist voters). They are often willing to slide far to the centre to get more votes, and the kind of people who get into power that way don't enact necessary policy when it's unpopular.

    The fact that his position isn't really in danger right now is important. He's got the power! What does he want to do with it? Cave to pressure from short-sighted business interests, apparently.

    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I fucking hate you Canadians.
    The Cow KingCanadianWolverineShadowBlade
  • AridholAridhol Daddliest Catch Registered User regular
    Speaking of voting and popularity it appears the liberals have won over some older folks.





    Source: PJ Fournier is a pollster with 338 Canada

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  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    Interesting. Depending on the agency, in 2019 the Liberals got 32% to 35% of that demographic, to the Con's 35% to 39%. NDP and Bloc were around 10% and Green at 5% in 2019. So it does seem to be a 10% shift from Cons to Libs.

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  • CorvusCorvus . VancouverRegistered User regular
    The opposition parties both have leaders no one generally cares about, so this isn't surprising. Also, the olds are getting their shots, so they're happy with Trudeau probably while the rest of us wait.

    Oh shit, I'm only 11 years outside of that age-group.

    :so_raven:
    Gnome-InterruptusShadowen
  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    Aridhol wrote: »
    Speaking of voting and popularity it appears the liberals have won over some older folks.





    Source: PJ Fournier is a pollster with 338 Canada

    oh weird, you mean the people already vaccinated under the liberal plan are now pro liberal?

    what a coincidence!

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