Governor-General will no longer be governing, generally [Canadian Politics Thread]

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  • BlazeFireBlazeFire Registered User regular
    It's bullshit that she went regardless of whether she hid it from the party or not.

    ImperfectRichyBouwsTArcticLancerBionicPenguinDisco11Steelhawk
  • oldmankenoldmanken Registered User regular
    All of these politicians should be stripped of their portfolios and positions, and enjoy a indefinite existence in the backbenches. Of course, right up until voters remember their bullshit and have an opportunity to vote them out.

    The whole idea of essential travel is ludicrous right now, and seems to have a far different meaning depending on your societal position. I understand how you can make the decision to travel for deaths/illness with family, though I still think it is not OK because of what we are being asked to do. However, more egregious are these f***ers who travel for property reasons... what a load of bullshit, and what a ridiculous cover for just wanting to go on vacation.

    ArcticLancerBouwsTCanadianWolverineOmnomnomPancake
  • darkmayodarkmayo Registered User regular
    edited January 5
    oldmanken wrote: »
    All of these politicians should be stripped of their portfolios and positions, and enjoy a indefinite existence in the backbenches. Of course, right up until voters remember their bullshit and have an opportunity to vote them out.

    The whole idea of essential travel is ludicrous right now, and seems to have a far different meaning depending on your societal position. I understand how you can make the decision to travel for deaths/illness with family, though I still think it is not OK because of what we are being asked to do. However, more egregious are these f***ers who travel for property reasons... what a load of bullshit, and what a ridiculous cover for just wanting to go on vacation.

    https://www.assembly.ab.ca/members/related-resources/mla-remuneration/2019-2020-mla-remuneration?fbclid=IwAR26PoIadAEpvekil87XUvZcSrJ_LNnT6R9aR2cxMWqTsoRPE_wJicmF8_g

    In Alberta All MLA's get 120,936.00 per year and depending on what their role is they may have additional allowances.
    MLAs aren't compensated if they are apart of a committee unless they are the chair or a presiding member who is acting as a the chair, and that is $200 per meeting.

    So lets potentially go through what the current list of offenders may have lost for cashola bucks.


    Tracy Allard was Minister of Municipal Affairs and now she isn't. I assume that means she was listed as a Minister with portfolio which would get her an additional $60,468.00 per year, and I assume she is now Minister without Portfolio? which drops down to $27,216.00 or maybe she isn't a minister at all which bumps her back to just the default for an MLA

    These ones I don't seem to see a listing for additional pay for these guys

    Jamie Huckabay was Chief of Staff
    Jeremy Nixon was Parliamentary Secretary for Civil Society
    Jason Stephen was on the Treasury Board
    Tanya Fir was on a committee
    Pat Rehn was on a committee
    Tany Yao was on a committee

    So unless they were Chairing comittee meetings there was no additional pay (at least according to the link above)

    So ... not really even a slap on the wrist unless you were Tracy Allard... but she was visiting her sick relative King Kamehameha so we should cut her some slack :D

    darkmayo on
    OmnomnomPancake
  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    On the positive side, I've rarely heard Alberta this pissed about anything.

    even if you are an anti-lockdown yahoo the pure hypocrisy of them telling YOU not to do things that they are clearly bending over backwards to do is stunning.

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  • darkmayodarkmayo Registered User regular
    Disco11 wrote: »
    On the positive side, I've rarely heard Alberta this pissed about anything.

    even if you are an anti-lockdown yahoo the pure hypocrisy of them telling YOU not to do things that they are clearly bending over backwards to do is stunning.

    yea, its pretty awesome. Of course that doesn't mean they will switch their vote to anyone but a conservative party but ill enjoy the anger at the UCP

  • BouwsTBouwsT Wanna come to a super soft birthday party? Registered User regular
    darkmayo wrote: »
    Disco11 wrote: »
    On the positive side, I've rarely heard Alberta this pissed about anything.

    even if you are an anti-lockdown yahoo the pure hypocrisy of them telling YOU not to do things that they are clearly bending over backwards to do is stunning.

    yea, its pretty awesome. Of course that doesn't mean they will switch their vote to anyone but a conservative party but ill enjoy the anger at the UCP

    f7d5zvbb46ow.jpg

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  • CanadianWolverineCanadianWolverine Registered User regular
    darkmayo wrote: »
    Disco11 wrote: »
    On the positive side, I've rarely heard Alberta this pissed about anything.

    even if you are an anti-lockdown yahoo the pure hypocrisy of them telling YOU not to do things that they are clearly bending over backwards to do is stunning.

    yea, its pretty awesome. Of course that doesn't mean they will switch their vote to anyone but a conservative party but ill enjoy the anger at the UCP

    That's not entirely true, people switched their votes to NDP previously in Alberta. Its not out of the realm of possibility it can happen again, just the next time it happens, I hope it sticks longer than one term so the NDP have a chance to do more than just repairs.

    steam_sig.png
  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    darkmayo wrote: »
    Disco11 wrote: »
    On the positive side, I've rarely heard Alberta this pissed about anything.

    even if you are an anti-lockdown yahoo the pure hypocrisy of them telling YOU not to do things that they are clearly bending over backwards to do is stunning.

    yea, its pretty awesome. Of course that doesn't mean they will switch their vote to anyone but a conservative party but ill enjoy the anger at the UCP

    That's not entirely true, people switched their votes to NDP previously in Alberta. Its not out of the realm of possibility it can happen again, just the next time it happens, I hope it sticks longer than one term so the NDP have a chance to do more than just repairs.

    There was some serious vote splitting between the Wildrose/PC. Hence why they merged right after so that would not happen again ....

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  • darkmayodarkmayo Registered User regular
    darkmayo wrote: »
    Disco11 wrote: »
    On the positive side, I've rarely heard Alberta this pissed about anything.

    even if you are an anti-lockdown yahoo the pure hypocrisy of them telling YOU not to do things that they are clearly bending over backwards to do is stunning.

    yea, its pretty awesome. Of course that doesn't mean they will switch their vote to anyone but a conservative party but ill enjoy the anger at the UCP

    That's not entirely true, people switched their votes to NDP previously in Alberta. Its not out of the realm of possibility it can happen again, just the next time it happens, I hope it sticks longer than one term so the NDP have a chance to do more than just repairs.

    yea.... as a protest vote because the Cons were mean to them. They didn't think the NDP would actually win and when they did win by a landslide they freaked the fuck out

    BouwsT
  • ArcticLancerArcticLancer Best served chilled. Registered User regular
    Disco11 wrote: »
    On the positive side, I've rarely heard Alberta this pissed about anything.

    even if you are an anti-lockdown yahoo the pure hypocrisy of them telling YOU not to do things that they are clearly bending over backwards to do is stunning.
    Ah yes, as opposed to all those other times they don't do that. ;P

    I know this whole thing might be a flash in the pan, but along with the fracture of the right in the US, it's kind of nice to see these people/groups getting burned after spending so long stoking flames. I'll also keep my fingers crossed that the outrage lasts long enough to get Alberta back under an NPD government.

  • BlarghyBlarghy Registered User regular
    edited January 5
    Disco11 wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Corvus wrote: »
    BC Minister of State for Infrastructure Bowinn Ma sums this up succinctly.



    It doesn't matter that travel wasn't illegal, or that they told people before hand. If you are elected to office you have chosen to be a leader and have to model the behavior your government or party is asking of the populace. To do otherwise is to undermine the confidence of the public in government, politics, etc. And we'd seen how well that is going around the world!

    Also, as a career public servant, this garbage is enraging to me because I know that staff people doing this would get in deep shit!

    No, but the travel advisory is against all non-essential travel. You can still travel for essential reasons, which include business and compassionate reasons. People going on vacation definitely deserve being knocked for it. My knock against this response is particular to Niki Ashton (Manitoba NDP MP), who travelled to Greece to see her ailing grandmother. She applied for and received an essential visit waiver from the Greek government (who also forbid non-essential travel) and there is no indication that she didn't follow quarantine procedures. She still got stripped of her critic position because general outrage, not because of any evidence that she broke any rules or even moral guidelines.

    My aunt and mother both got COVID in the spring. My aunt died and my mother was hospitalized on a ventilator.... I did not travel to visit them because our government asked me to. All in this together, right? I have friends that parents passed and they did not even get to say goodbye because of restrictions.

    So Nikki Ashton can go right to hell. She literally hid it from her own party did she not?

    She did not. I feel for you, my dude. But I cannot and will not wish ill upon anyone who wants to be with a severely ill loved one, pandemic or not. Especially if they broke no actual rules to do so.

    Blarghy on
    Gnome-InterruptusshrykeCanadianWolverinedarkmayo
  • BlazeFireBlazeFire Registered User regular
    edited January 5
    The CBC article from 4 days ago ( https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/ndp-niki-ashton-greece-grandmother-sick-1.5859494 ) says she did not. Can you share a correction?


    Also, that part still doesn't matter to me. Many other people are making this sacrifice.

    BlazeFire on
    Disco11
  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    Meanwhile, in Québec: despite increased confinement measures since mid-December including a ban on holiday gatherings and a complete shutdown of non-essential businesses since boxing day, the daily number of cases is still increasing. Health officials are calling the pandemic "out of control". Legault is expected to announce a new total confinement, complete with school shutdowns and curfews, tomorrow. They're also vaccinating at maximum capacity, not saving second doses for the follow-up shot, which is risky but they're desperate to stop the spread of the virus.

    It's starting to feel like they're just stabbing in the dark at this point. Restaurants limited to family groups and separated by plexiglass walls were safe, as were movie theaters operating at well under seating capacity, and regular stores are no more or less risky than grocery stores. The government shut all those down without explanation, and produced no result as the number of cases still climbed relentlessly. They needed to be seen doing something, so they did something without actually looking for something useful to do.

    sig.gif
  • Phoenix-DPhoenix-D Registered User regular
    Richy wrote: »
    Meanwhile, in Québec: despite increased confinement measures since mid-December including a ban on holiday gatherings and a complete shutdown of non-essential businesses since boxing day, the daily number of cases is still increasing. Health officials are calling the pandemic "out of control". Legault is expected to announce a new total confinement, complete with school shutdowns and curfews, tomorrow. They're also vaccinating at maximum capacity, not saving second doses for the follow-up shot, which is risky but they're desperate to stop the spread of the virus.

    It's starting to feel like they're just stabbing in the dark at this point. Restaurants limited to family groups and separated by plexiglass walls were safe, as were movie theaters operating at well under seating capacity, and regular stores are no more or less risky than grocery stores. The government shut all those down without explanation, and produced no result as the number of cases still climbed relentlessly. They needed to be seen doing something, so they did something without actually looking for something useful to do.

    re bold: No they aren't. Especially movies! Indoors, relatively small room, lots of time for air to circulate...decent risk. High ceilings help but only so much. And that's before you get into the problem of one group leaving and the next walking into the same unchanged air.

    re italics: Food isn't optional. Most other stores are. If things get worse the thing to do would be to shut grocery. Delivery and pickup only.

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  • BouwsTBouwsT Wanna come to a super soft birthday party? Registered User regular
    If anyone is wanting a rough risk calculator (because 2 meter separation with masks indefinitely is not universally "safe") I have found this website useful

    https://indoor-covid-safety.herokuapp.com/

    It takes some very rough transmission and modelling data, and allows people to put in parameters like room size, filtration, group size, humidity, etc, and spit out a guideline for how long you could stay safe in that room for. I've used it a couple times in my business groups to illustrate why getting back together for in-person meetings is a TERRIBLE idea.

    The "About Page" reads thus:
    About
    To mitigate the spread of COVID-19, official public health guidelines have recommended limits on: person-to-person distance (6 feet / 2 meters), occupancy time (15 minutes), maximum occupancy (25 people), or minimum ventilation (6 air changes per hour).

    There is growing scientific evidence for airborne transmission of COVID-19, which occurs when infectious aerosol droplets are exchanged by breathing shared indoor air. While public health organizations are beginning to acknowledge airborne transmission, they have yet to provide a safety guideline that incorporates all the relevant variables.

    This app, developed by Kasim Khan in collaboration with Martin Z. Bazant and John W. M. Bush, uses a theoretical model to calculate safe exposure times and occupancy levels for indoor spaces. By adjusting room specifications, ventilation and filtration rates, face-mask usage, respiratory activities, and risk tolerance (in the other tabs), you can see how to mitigate indoor COVID-19 transmission in different indoor spaces.

    The science behind the app is also taught in a free, self-paced massive, open online course (MOOC) on edX: 10.S95x Physics of COVID-19 Transmission

    I hope people find it as useful as I did.

    Gnome-InterruptusCanadianWolverine
  • FireflashFireflash Montreal, QCRegistered User regular
    The point is not that grocery stores are safer that other kinds of store. It's to remove as many situations as possible where people are together in a public space. Shopping for clothes, toys, electornics, furniture, etc isn't a necessity and it can wait a few more weeks.

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  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Disco11 wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Corvus wrote: »
    BC Minister of State for Infrastructure Bowinn Ma sums this up succinctly.



    It doesn't matter that travel wasn't illegal, or that they told people before hand. If you are elected to office you have chosen to be a leader and have to model the behavior your government or party is asking of the populace. To do otherwise is to undermine the confidence of the public in government, politics, etc. And we'd seen how well that is going around the world!

    Also, as a career public servant, this garbage is enraging to me because I know that staff people doing this would get in deep shit!

    No, but the travel advisory is against all non-essential travel. You can still travel for essential reasons, which include business and compassionate reasons. People going on vacation definitely deserve being knocked for it. My knock against this response is particular to Niki Ashton (Manitoba NDP MP), who travelled to Greece to see her ailing grandmother. She applied for and received an essential visit waiver from the Greek government (who also forbid non-essential travel) and there is no indication that she didn't follow quarantine procedures. She still got stripped of her critic position because general outrage, not because of any evidence that she broke any rules or even moral guidelines.

    My aunt and mother both got COVID in the spring. My aunt died and my mother was hospitalized on a ventilator.... I did not travel to visit them because our government asked me to. All in this together, right? I have friends that parents passed and they did not even get to say goodbye because of restrictions.

    So Nikki Ashton can go right to hell. She literally hid it from her own party did she not?

    She did not. I feel for you, my dude. But I cannot and will not wish ill upon anyone who wants to be with a severely ill loved one, pandemic or not. Especially if they broke no actual rules to do so.
    Visiting a terminally ill relatives is an edge case to me, which can possibly be tightened up after all the recreational travel has been stopped.

    I personally wouldn’t break my bubble for it, but I won’t hold someone’s feet to the fire for doing so.

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  • darkmayodarkmayo Registered User regular
    I had a coworker say they didnt understand what the big deal was regarding the government people going on vacation out of the country (saying that as they noticed the reporters at the airport as they themselves came back from their tropical vacation)

    I mentioned that people aren't happy because these guys are elected officials who have been saying hunker down, no non-essential travel, stay at home for the holidays and don't see your family, as well that one of them is the boss of the folks who doing the vaccination rollout (which is going really slow)

    Response to that was.

    "Meh"

    Ladies and Gentleman I give you the common clay of the new west.

    Disco11AridholImperfect
  • CanadianWolverineCanadianWolverine Registered User regular
    Common? I doubt that very much, that is someone trying to justify to themselves why its ok when the person they like does it but its not ok when a person they don't like does it, you get "meh".

    You want to hear "meh" more commonly, try explaining to US citizens why Universal Healthcare works better than their workplace health insurance plans. Its the discussion equivalent of "I don't want to explain why I am dismissing your valid points, I just know I should to still be consider this as a part of my identity".

    steam_sig.png
  • AridholAridhol Daddliest Catch Registered User regular
    You can't use that phrase and not do the video, it's the rule.

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  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    edited January 6
    https://www.slavelake.ca/CivicAlerts.aspx?AID=1227

    Slave Lake , Ab has had enough of their MLA's bullshit.

    "The biggest fundamental issue is that you fail to recognize that you were elected to be our representative at the Provincial level, not be the Province's representative to our Region. "

    Disco11 on
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  • BouwsTBouwsT Wanna come to a super soft birthday party? Registered User regular
    Disco11 wrote: »
    https://www.slavelake.ca/CivicAlerts.aspx?AID=1227

    Slave Lake , Ab has had enough of their MLA's bullshit.

    "The biggest fundamental issue is that you fail to recognize that you were elected to be our representative at the Provincial level, not be the Province's representative to our Region. "

    I was JUST coming here to post this, that letter was the schadenfreude to get me through today.

    "We have several grievances with your performance, but here are a few listed below."

    Just a big fuckin' take-down. *chefs kiss*

    darkmayo
  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    So there's a headline that just popped up that Maxime Bernier is also one of the politicians who went on vacation in Florida, in his case back in November.

    This is fake news, of course. Maxime Bernier is not a politician, he's unemployed.

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  • darkmayodarkmayo Registered User regular
    I hope recent developments will have certain politicians think twice about being wishy washy in regards to conspiracy bullshit.

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  • ShivahnShivahn Unaware of her barrel shifter privilege Western coastal temptressRegistered User regular
    darkmayo wrote: »
    I hope recent developments will have certain politicians think twice about being wishy washy in regards to conspiracy bullshit.

    I hope so too, but my suspicion is that "it can't happen here" is nearly universal until people with guns are trying to break into your workplace.

    I might be totally wrong! It's hard not to project my own experiences onto a different country/culture. But... I dunno. It takes a lot for politicians to reconsider the fire they're playing with, I think, even while their neighbor's house is ashes.

    darkmayoFencingsaxArcticLancerShadowen
  • mrondeaumrondeau Montréal, CanadaRegistered User regular
    We have to be vigilant, and all that, but we already had multiple people with guns getting into legislatures and killing. This is already taken seriously.
    We also still have formal mourning for Polytechnique, as we should, instead of it just being one of many massacres. The baseline level of violence is much, much lower than in the States.

    ArcticLancerGnome-InterruptusCanadianWolverineHandkor
  • PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    Shivahn wrote: »
    darkmayo wrote: »
    I hope recent developments will have certain politicians think twice about being wishy washy in regards to conspiracy bullshit.

    I hope so too, but my suspicion is that "it can't happen here" is nearly universal until people with guns are trying to break into your workplace.

    I might be totally wrong! It's hard not to project my own experiences onto a different country/culture. But... I dunno. It takes a lot for politicians to reconsider the fire they're playing with, I think, even while their neighbor's house is ashes.

    It probably helps that everybody holding a weapon in that case is committing an offence, even if they're just standing around doing nothing else

    mrondeaushrykeGnome-Interruptus
  • NosfNosf Registered User regular
    darkmayo wrote: »
    I hope recent developments will have certain politicians think twice about being wishy washy in regards to conspiracy bullshit.

    Naw, people like Pollivere are trash and will still dip into the shallow end of the gene pool to get ahead and then cry and wonder when it bites us all in the ass.

  • OmnomnomPancakeOmnomnomPancake OttawaRegistered User regular
    That Quebec curfew is absolutely fucked and a line too far.

    Like we have given up our right to freely associate with others, but banning outdoor movement from 8pm to 5am is just so so wrong.

    People should not be okay with that kind of restriction of our rights.

  • BlazeFireBlazeFire Registered User regular
    I disagree.

    HerrCronHandkorElaro
  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    I'm indifferent. I mean, with everything shut down, what is there even to do outside at 8pm in the middle of January?

    sig.gif
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  • CorvusCorvus . VancouverRegistered User regular
    How many dead seniors is enough to allow outdoor movement restrictions?

    Also, it’s fucking January, just stay inside until spring, vaccines are on the way.

    :so_raven:
    CanadianWolverine
  • ShadowenShadowen Snores in the morning Registered User regular
    Shivahn wrote: »
    darkmayo wrote: »
    I hope recent developments will have certain politicians think twice about being wishy washy in regards to conspiracy bullshit.

    I hope so too, but my suspicion is that "it can't happen here" is nearly universal until people with guns are trying to break into your workplace.

    I might be totally wrong! It's hard not to project my own experiences onto a different country/culture. But... I dunno. It takes a lot for politicians to reconsider the fire they're playing with, I think, even while their neighbor's house is ashes.

    There were simultaneous pro-Trump protests across Canada today, so...probably not wrong.

    CanadianWolverine
  • OmnomnomPancakeOmnomnomPancake OttawaRegistered User regular
    edited January 7
    Corvus wrote: »
    How many dead seniors is enough to allow outdoor movement restrictions?

    Also, it’s fucking January, just stay inside until spring, vaccines are on the way.

    Yeah, the same government that egregiously bungled this pandemic is gonna handle the vaccine roll out super well.

    OmnomnomPancake on
  • FireflashFireflash Montreal, QCRegistered User regular
    Richy wrote: »
    I'm indifferent. I mean, with everything shut down, what is there even to do outside at 8pm in the middle of January?
    I've been taking night walks by myself, high on weed and listening to music. There's no reason I should get ticketed for doing that. I'm not putting anyone at risk of infections by doing that.

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  • OmnomnomPancakeOmnomnomPancake OttawaRegistered User regular
    Fireflash wrote: »
    Richy wrote: »
    I'm indifferent. I mean, with everything shut down, what is there even to do outside at 8pm in the middle of January?
    I've been taking night walks by myself, high on weed and listening to music. There's no reason I should get ticketed for doing that. I'm not putting anyone at risk of infections by doing that.

    I hear that.

    Feels like we're living in a crazy world where I cannot go for a jog at 9PM without being fined at minimum 1,000$. I've done these jogs through most of this utterly awful year, and have sacrificed so fucking much to keep at-risk people alive and hospitals from being overwhelmed.

    I'm giving up multiple years of my twenties for others, willingly sacrificed and respected the rules, so the least this incompetent, corrupt, bloated government could do is not just COMPLETELY fuck us with utterly draconian measures.

    Like, you already fucked up Ford. Go fuck yourself. You and your holiday travelling colleagues will break curfew too.

    Fireflash
  • CorvusCorvus . VancouverRegistered User regular
    Corvus wrote: »
    How many dead seniors is enough to allow outdoor movement restrictions?

    Also, it’s fucking January, just stay inside until spring, vaccines are on the way.

    Yeah, the same government that egregiously bungled this pandemic is gonna handle the vaccine roll out super well.

    Even if done poorly, within the space of a few months there will be large numbers of the most vulnerable vaccinated. This will affect the restrictions governments are putting in place.

    Ontario administered twice the doses today of the next highest province.

    I mean, Doug Ford is still garbage but for some reason your province voted for him so you’re kind of stuck until your next election.



    :so_raven:
    Gnome-Interruptus
  • OmnomnomPancakeOmnomnomPancake OttawaRegistered User regular
    Corvus wrote: »
    Corvus wrote: »
    How many dead seniors is enough to allow outdoor movement restrictions?

    Also, it’s fucking January, just stay inside until spring, vaccines are on the way.

    Yeah, the same government that egregiously bungled this pandemic is gonna handle the vaccine roll out super well.

    Even if done poorly, within the space of a few months there will be large numbers of the most vulnerable vaccinated. This will affect the restrictions governments are putting in place.

    Ontario administered twice the doses today of the next highest province.

    I mean, Doug Ford is still garbage but for some reason your province voted for him so you’re kind of stuck until your next election.

    15 years in power for the other party tends to lead to new garbage settling in!

    I would certainly hope Ontario administered double the doses of anyone else - it's got nearly double the population of the second largest province. Like, if my dumb province sucked up 200k of the 500k doses Canada and fucked this up even worse I'd be furious; the people in other province don't deserve the pain of how stupid and greedy the Ford government truly is.

    But, to your credit, once the most vulnerable are helped, hopefully they fuck right off with this curfew business. We really should not be giving any of these fools a post-pandemic polls bump.

  • HerrCronHerrCron It that wickedly supports taxation Registered User regular
    That Quebec curfew is absolutely fucked and a line too far.

    Like we have given up our right to freely associate with others, but banning outdoor movement from 8pm to 5am is just so so wrong.

    People should not be okay with that kind of restriction of our rights.

    Ah, it's grand.
    People already spend most of January and February hiding indoors anyway, so not a lot has changed.

    sig.gif
  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    Canadian physios overwhelmed as nation injured patting itself on the back
    “Watching the Capitol Security stand by and even take selfies with the oncoming rioters made me feel pretty good that something like that couldn’t happen in my own country,” said Smitty Terder, standing outside Sports Physio Waterloo and ignoring the RCMP’s inaction in the recent Mi’kmaq lobster dispute.

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