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Who is the best HololiveEN member? Find out in the Vtuber thread!

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    azith28azith28 Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    So...I've been falling down the rabbit hole for about 3 months now. Something I'm curious about is that there are obviously some of the girls who appear to be heavily underused.

    Like...I started with the EN members(Gura, then branched out), and youtubes suggestive algorithm lead me to many of the girls that have had some cross interaction with EN, (Pekora was one of the earliest colabs with kiara), and I'm amazed at how many other girls got suggested to me solely because of pekora. The girls i know little to nothing about because they have yet to show up in a suggested playlist or were not in a pekora clip (or may have been in the clip without standing out) are:

    Roboco , Azki, Mel, Choco, Risu
    These are like...the lowest tier of involvement with the rabbit hole for what i think is a pretty standard introduction to hololive (using myself as an example) Sora also kinda belongs in this tier mainly because even when she shows up shes like mostly a bystander. But i know who she is more than these.

    Next tier of people who rarely show up in my suggested list.
    Fubuki....(yes i know thats insane but I've had to go looking for her stuff from the small amount i saw her), Shion, Ayame (starting to see her a bit more often now), Korone/Okayu (two more insane ones but same as Fubuki). Luna, Towa, Watame, Nene, Iofe, Anya, Mio.

    Next tier is only a bit above the last one which would be Lamy, Botan, Flare, Noel.

    Everyone else is pretty much solidly on my suggested list.

    I find it odd that that lowest tier exists. Of course i know little to nothing of how involved Cover is with encouraging colabs but I think its odd that They are not encouraging the most successful to colab at least occasionally with the least successful in terms of sub count. Same situation with Gura...this Success Story Shark has barely stepped outside of Holo EN with only a few very early exceptions and I have to wonder if they are worried at how her runaway success may effect the older generations relationships with her. I get that shes not Japanese fluent but it certainly can be worked around. I personally think Cover got caught flatfooted by her success and just didnt know the proper way to deal with it.


    Stercus, Stercus, Stercus, Morituri Sum
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    Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    Mori Calliope
    I'm kind of surprised that Risu is on your lowest tier list there. She talks most in English, and she has done a decent amount of collabs.

    Check out this clip, I think it's amazing.

    https://youtu.be/q0Y-XuaSwqU

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    JayKaosJayKaos Registered User regular
    Azki I think does more idol-y stuff and less game streaming so fewer opportunities to get clipped+translated by youtubers and the Algorithm.

    Steam | SW-0844-0908-6004 and my Switch code
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    PaladinPaladin Registered User regular
    azith's ranking is Youtube's algorithm. Consider that the people who make clips are totally unaffiliated with Cover, and therefore things like clip author and view popularity determine what gets recommended.

    Marty: The future, it's where you're going?
    Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
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    miscellaneousinsanitymiscellaneousinsanity grass grows, birds fly, sun shines, and brother, i hurt peopleRegistered User regular
    edited January 2021
    Gawr Gura
    azki is specifically a virtual music artist, her channel is mostly music videos and promos for her albums/concerts but she does do a little bit of karaoke/Q+A streams

    mel took an extended hiatus due to harassment which impacted her channel growth, she only hit the hundreds-of-thousands subscriber count last year despite being gen1

    ayame from what i understand streams pretty infrequently compared to others

    aside from risu, korone, okayu, and fubuki being big outliers my experience seems along similar lines, tho i get a good amount of 3rd/4th/5th gen represented in my recommendations

    edit: roboco, mel, choco, akirose, ayame, flare are probably the ones i've seen the least of/know the least about, mio and anya i usually only see in group settings

    miscellaneousinsanity on
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    shoeboxjeddyshoeboxjeddy Registered User regular
    edited January 2021
    Gawr Gura
    The algorithm will shift around the actions you take, to some degree. If you go directly to Fubuki's channel and watch a few videos, the algorithm will starting sliding Fubuki videos your way more often. It would be interesting to see how completely different the home pages of our respective Youtube channels are, just for the people engaging with this stuff in the thread.

    Rather than that, I do find it interesting who gets clip and translator coverage versus who doesn't. One channel in particular is eternally devoted to Subaru, but they are pretty healthily popular and produce videos at a fever pitch, so Subaru videos get recommended to me all the time. Meanwhile, while collab Mio is extremely common to see, solo Mio streams are not subbed very often at all, just as an example.

    Regarding Gura, I think that's a combination of unfortunate factors. 1) She doesn't have enough Japanese language skills to feel confident speaking it as the primary focus of a stream. 2) She's shy. 3) She feels strongly about doing things "correctly", whether this means not throwing her weight around as the largest Hololive Youtube channel by a mile now or doing a stream that may or may not work out the way she wants (she just now this month put up a karaoke that will actually stay archived on her channel for more views, which is kind of insane considering how incredibly popular her singing streams are). The way seniority culture functions in the Japanese workplace, it's kind of threatening for one of the new members to be visibly more successful, profitable, and valuable than established and respected members (this is one of the reasons why seniority culture is bullshit). I don't doubt that makes certain things difficult for her and for EN in general.

    shoeboxjeddy on
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    TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    edited January 2021
    Mori Calliope
    The algorithm will shift around the actions you take, to some degree. If you go directly to Fubuki's channel and watch a few videos, the algorithm will starting sliding Fubuki videos your way more often. It would be interesting to see how completely different the home pages of our respective Youtube channels are, just for the people engaging with this stuff in the thread.

    Rather than that, I do find it interesting who gets clip and translator coverage versus who doesn't. One channel in particular is eternally devoted to Subaru, but they are pretty healthily popular and produce videos at a fever pitch, so Subaru videos get recommended to me all the time. Meanwhile, while collab Mio is extremely common to see, solo Mio streams are not subbed very often at all, just as an example.

    Regarding Gura, I think that's a combination of unfortunate factors. 1) She doesn't have enough Japanese language skills to feel confident speaking it as the primary focus of a stream. 2) She's shy. 3) She feels strongly about doing things "correctly", whether this means not throwing her weight around as the largest Hololive Youtube channel by a mile now or doing a stream that may or may not work out the way she wants (she just now this month put up a karaoke that will actually stay archived on her channel for more views, which is kind of insane considering how incredibly popular her singing streams are). The way seniority culture functions in the Japanese workplace, it's kind of threatening for one of the new members to be visibly more successful, profitable, and valuable than established and respected members (this is one of the reasons why seniority culture is bullshit). I don't doubt that makes certain things difficult for her and for EN in general.

    Is also that they are on different markets. A big thing is the Japanese online video market being split between YouTube and Niconico, while the English market is mostly dominated by YouTube. "Yeah, but the English streaming market has Twitch". But is the YouTube algorithm that makes YouTube content popular, so a market more dominated by YouTube has it's participants with a bigger advantage. And the big dirty secret is that Hololive started by poaching several popular content creators from Niconico.

    If Clover's marketing team is halfway competent enough they had to realize that the English talent was always going to overtake the Japanese talent on YouTube. Think that the big surprise is how fast it happened and which talent did it.

    TryCatcher on
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    WeedLordVegetaWeedLordVegeta Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    FBK also is/was huge on bilibili

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    TNTrooperTNTrooper Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    Gura also has the whole time zone problem. If she wants to throw her followers down the rabbit hole by doing something with a JP member then they would want to schedule it at a time good for NA viewers but that means the JP member has to stream in the morning and that is going to be real hard to schedule if it's someone who takes singing and dancing lessons or has something like radio show or an advertisement deal like the curry one Aqua, Subaru, and Pekora had a little while ago.

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    azith28azith28 Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    Honestly it would be foolish for any of the other girls to not want to colab with Gura. Getting 2 million views of you on her stream WILL translate to a portion of that subbing your channel as a result.

    Stercus, Stercus, Stercus, Morituri Sum
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    shoeboxjeddyshoeboxjeddy Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    TNTrooper wrote: »
    Gura also has the whole time zone problem. If she wants to throw her followers down the rabbit hole by doing something with a JP member then they would want to schedule it at a time good for NA viewers but that means the JP member has to stream in the morning and that is going to be real hard to schedule if it's someone who takes singing and dancing lessons or has something like radio show or an advertisement deal like the curry one Aqua, Subaru, and Pekora had a little while ago.

    The sponsorship thing is an interesting side point. From Cover's point of view, viewcount might not matter too much, but the ability to collab with gacha games, sell concert tickets, and hock instant Ramen makes you company royalty. And this could be an area of difficulty for EN members who might have a lot more trouble pulling off Japanese brand deal arrangements. I'm curious to see brand deals with US companies. Like... sponsored streams for upcoming Western games should be a layup.

    Which is actually a point of concern. Stepping aside from my enthusiast feelings towards these members, I'm much more of a Jim Sterling "this industry sucks and needs to be bullied and held to account as often as possible" perspective generally. And I feel like corporate streamers like these are uniquely poorly suited to the challenges of that situation. Other, Western streamers I follow would confidently state their feelings about an iffy sponsor or disappointing major release, it seems like these guys might need to toe a company line instead.

    This became a ramble, but it's just the kind of thing I've been thinking about since getting hooked on this type of stream.

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    WeedLordVegetaWeedLordVegeta Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    azith28 wrote: »
    Honestly it would be foolish for any of the other girls to not want to colab with Gura. Getting 2 million views of you on her stream WILL translate to a portion of that subbing your channel as a result.

    There is absolutely something to be said for maintaining as much control over the growth of your own channel as possible, especially on a platform as unfriendly to moderation as youtube

    I can understand why someone (or their management) would balk at collabing with gura

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    Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    Mori Calliope
    As far as sponsored content, it seemed the Princess Connect streams went fairly well from what I saw

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    shoeboxjeddyshoeboxjeddy Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    As far as sponsored content, it seemed the Princess Connect streams went fairly well from what I saw

    Princess Connect was interesting because Ame kind of exposed the game in a couple of ways that she probably would not have if she was more familiar with the genre. Ina was also good because she was very realistic and frank about how gacha games work (although at one point, she stated that she didn't believe addiction to gacha was "real" and I was curious what exactly she meant by that). As memey jokes, I'm amused with how the Japanese members do gacha but like... the memey attitudes and jokes are those of a problem gambler. I sincerely hope vulnerable viewers don't buy into "summoning rituals" or "desire sensors" or even just "luck", it's all bullshit and people need to realize that before putting money into the slots.

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    ElendilElendil Registered User regular
    edited January 2021
    Gawr Gura
    azith28 wrote: »
    Honestly it would be foolish for any of the other girls to not want to colab with Gura. Getting 2 million views of you on her stream WILL translate to a portion of that subbing your channel as a result.
    i actually don't know how much this is the case. mind you, it'll help but

    i feel like part of the reason gura exploded like she did is that she broke out into non-vtuber audiences in a way the others haven't. i don't know how well that translates to following anybody else. especially JP members.

    Elendil on
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    RadiusRadius Registered User regular
    Watson Amelia
    EN Collab postponed so Gura and Calli can rest

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wotwlpvCvPg

    Now it's Chess Collab time.

    My money's on Kiara, surely she can't sabotage herself that badly 3 times in a row.

    Everyday we stray further from God's light
    Steam Switch FC: 2799-7909-4852
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    Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    Mori Calliope
    you can't play chess with three people!

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    ElendilElendil Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    i'm not sure at least two of them can play chess, period

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    MadicanMadican No face Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    If they combine their brain cells they'll average out to two people, rounding up, so it's fine.

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    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
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    shoeboxjeddyshoeboxjeddy Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    They're actually playing Mahjong. Which only Ina knows how to play. So it may as well be 3 person chess.

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    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    Takanashi Kiara
    Christ I have such a hard time learning the rules to Mahjong. They added it to FFXIV at the Gold Saucer and it's a whole thing you can tournament with. I LOST THE TUTORIAL.

    All this to say, when Amelia a few minutes ago made her joke about having a sandwich, that's exactly where my brain was at.

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    ElendilElendil Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZ3tDmOit-0

    moona collecting CEOs

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    OlivawOlivaw good name, isn't it? the foot of mt fujiRegistered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    https://youtu.be/j241hdqWAKA

    I haven’t watched Calliope’s stream yet so this was my first time seeing this

    The payoff at the end is worth the buildup

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    PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
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    shoeboxjeddyshoeboxjeddy Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    https://youtu.be/giyY4xmybnw
    Returning to an older discussion, this is just old fashioned horniness. She's gay and their vocab for discussing it is trash. Wanting to watch hot girl youtubers isn't an "oji side"...

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    MadicanMadican No face Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura


    Okay now I see what you mean about Ironmouse being...more than Silver and Nyanners

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    Werewolf2000adWerewolf2000ad Suckers, I know exactly what went wrong. Registered User regular
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    EVERYBODY WANTS TO SIT IN THE BIG CHAIR, MEG!
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    OptyOpty Registered User regular
    Ninomae Ina'nis
    Elendil wrote: »
    azith28 wrote: »
    Honestly it would be foolish for any of the other girls to not want to colab with Gura. Getting 2 million views of you on her stream WILL translate to a portion of that subbing your channel as a result.
    i actually don't know how much this is the case. mind you, it'll help but

    i feel like part of the reason gura exploded like she did is that she broke out into non-vtuber audiences in a way the others haven't. i don't know how well that translates to following anybody else. especially JP members.

    I remember seeing a statistics analysis in November or December (God I just spent way too long trying to find it again and failed) that touched on this to some degree: that a large percent (like 30-40%) of Gura's viewers who participate in her chat only ever showed up in her chat and didn't show up on any of the other Hololive channels' chats. Mind you this was measuring chatters instead of viewers since scraping the Youtube chat archives of publicly available videos is pretty much the only way someone external to Youtube/Hololive can do this sort of analysis, so you can't really expand it to make statements about her viewers at large. Also since Gura's chat is a whirlwind on the best of days she may also have a disproportionate amount of people who just view and never bother chatting for her but do chat for the others with slower chats where they can be noticed more easily.

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    TNTrooperTNTrooper Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    Opty wrote: »
    Elendil wrote: »
    azith28 wrote: »
    Honestly it would be foolish for any of the other girls to not want to colab with Gura. Getting 2 million views of you on her stream WILL translate to a portion of that subbing your channel as a result.
    i actually don't know how much this is the case. mind you, it'll help but

    i feel like part of the reason gura exploded like she did is that she broke out into non-vtuber audiences in a way the others haven't. i don't know how well that translates to following anybody else. especially JP members.

    I remember seeing a statistics analysis in November or December (God I just spent way too long trying to find it again and failed) that touched on this to some degree: that a large percent (like 30-40%) of Gura's viewers who participate in her chat only ever showed up in her chat and didn't show up on any of the other Hololive channels' chats. Mind you this was measuring chatters instead of viewers since scraping the Youtube chat archives of publicly available videos is pretty much the only way someone external to Youtube/Hololive can do this sort of analysis, so you can't really expand it to make statements about her viewers at large. Also since Gura's chat is a whirlwind on the best of days she may also have a disproportionate amount of people who just view and never bother chatting for her but do chat for the others with slower chats where they can be noticed more easily.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Hololive/comments/kqnhvc/exclusive_chat_user_percentages_june_december_2020/

    I think this is the one you are talking about.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Hololive/comments/kpuqop/common_chat_user_percentages_december_2020/

    And I found this while looking for it that tracks the cross YTC pollination in more detail.

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    OptyOpty Registered User regular
    Ninomae Ina'nis
    TNTrooper wrote: »
    Opty wrote: »
    Elendil wrote: »
    azith28 wrote: »
    Honestly it would be foolish for any of the other girls to not want to colab with Gura. Getting 2 million views of you on her stream WILL translate to a portion of that subbing your channel as a result.
    i actually don't know how much this is the case. mind you, it'll help but

    i feel like part of the reason gura exploded like she did is that she broke out into non-vtuber audiences in a way the others haven't. i don't know how well that translates to following anybody else. especially JP members.

    I remember seeing a statistics analysis in November or December (God I just spent way too long trying to find it again and failed) that touched on this to some degree: that a large percent (like 30-40%) of Gura's viewers who participate in her chat only ever showed up in her chat and didn't show up on any of the other Hololive channels' chats. Mind you this was measuring chatters instead of viewers since scraping the Youtube chat archives of publicly available videos is pretty much the only way someone external to Youtube/Hololive can do this sort of analysis, so you can't really expand it to make statements about her viewers at large. Also since Gura's chat is a whirlwind on the best of days she may also have a disproportionate amount of people who just view and never bother chatting for her but do chat for the others with slower chats where they can be noticed more easily.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Hololive/comments/kqnhvc/exclusive_chat_user_percentages_june_december_2020/

    I think this is the one you are talking about.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Hololive/comments/kpuqop/common_chat_user_percentages_december_2020/

    And I found this while looking for it that tracks the cross YTC pollination in more detail.

    Thank you, it was driving me crazy not being able to find that.

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    Caulk Bite 6Caulk Bite 6 One of the multitude of Dans infesting this place Registered User regular
    edited January 2021
    Gawr Gura
    Radius wrote: »
    EN Collab postponed so Gura and Calli can rest

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wotwlpvCvPg

    Now it's Chess Collab time.

    My money's on Kiara, surely she can't sabotage herself that badly 3 times in a row.

    The game Kiara is describing at about 8:20 minutes in, is I think a weird mahjong solitaire that was on a lot of windows computers back in the day.

    Correction: it is now still a thing and I’m downloading it to my iphone

    Caulk Bite 6 on
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    Caulk Bite 6Caulk Bite 6 One of the multitude of Dans infesting this place Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    Olivaw wrote: »
    https://youtu.be/j241hdqWAKA

    I haven’t watched Calliope’s stream yet so this was my first time seeing this

    The payoff at the end is worth the buildup

    I can’t really get into Zen, because the voices are the biggest part for me, and she just... sounds like Siri

    jnij103vqi2i.png
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    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    Takanashi Kiara
    So this isn't just Vtuber related:

    If you or anyone you know watches people stream video games, and your reaction is to backseat or yell at them for not being pro-players that are winning all the time, etc...

    Stop fucking watching and get the fuck out.

    Case in point: in the recent Apex tournament, Matsuri got bullied by her chat and that fucking sucks.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Fj8jllVSFk

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    Caulk Bite 6Caulk Bite 6 One of the multitude of Dans infesting this place Registered User regular
    edited January 2021
    Gawr Gura
    This isn’t Twitch Plays ____, if they want help, they will ask for it

    Edit: used to do it too, until I realized how shitty it is

    Caulk Bite 6 on
    jnij103vqi2i.png
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    Houk the NamebringerHouk the Namebringer Nipples The EchidnaRegistered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    anyone who backseat games fucking sucks, and they ESPECIALLY suck when they do it in a stressful, high-tension situation like an online multiplayer game

    not only does it add to the player's pressure, but getting bombarded with "helpful" advice by dozens or hundreds or thousands of people in the middle of a match isn't actually going to do any good anyway

    i just don't understand people sometimes. i know i'm preaching to the choir here, but fuck

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    Caulk Bite 6Caulk Bite 6 One of the multitude of Dans infesting this place Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    Ayame is very good and has an incredibly cute regional accent

    https://youtu.be/Ggi7JtCwZ2k
    https://youtu.be/vm41hDf1sx4

    jnij103vqi2i.png
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    azith28azith28 Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    TNTrooper wrote: »
    Gura also has the whole time zone problem. If she wants to throw her followers down the rabbit hole by doing something with a JP member then they would want to schedule it at a time good for NA viewers but that means the JP member has to stream in the morning and that is going to be real hard to schedule if it's someone who takes singing and dancing lessons or has something like radio show or an advertisement deal like the curry one Aqua, Subaru, and Pekora had a little while ago.

    The sponsorship thing is an interesting side point. From Cover's point of view, viewcount might not matter too much, but the ability to collab with gacha games, sell concert tickets, and hock instant Ramen makes you company royalty. And this could be an area of difficulty for EN members who might have a lot more trouble pulling off Japanese brand deal arrangements. I'm curious to see brand deals with US companies. Like... sponsored streams for upcoming Western games should be a layup.

    Which is actually a point of concern. Stepping aside from my enthusiast feelings towards these members, I'm much more of a Jim Sterling "this industry sucks and needs to be bullied and held to account as often as possible" perspective generally. And I feel like corporate streamers like these are uniquely poorly suited to the challenges of that situation. Other, Western streamers I follow would confidently state their feelings about an iffy sponsor or disappointing major release, it seems like these guys might need to toe a company line instead.

    This became a ramble, but it's just the kind of thing I've been thinking about since getting hooked on this type of stream.

    There are plenty of american foods and products that are sold in both america and japan pretty much as-is. They could easily target those companies and products that would hit both US and JP audiences. As for the industry 'sucking'....its practically still Brand New. until Gura came along only a few girls were nearing 1 million subs, and I'm sure that her meteoric rise had something to do with All the other girls getting a boost in viewership even without a colab. Before Her, 1 million views was pretty Meh from an Advertising perspective. It's just starting to grow to the point that both vendors and hololive should be thinking about this more seriously.

    Stercus, Stercus, Stercus, Morituri Sum
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    shoeboxjeddyshoeboxjeddy Registered User regular
    Gawr Gura
    azith28 wrote: »
    TNTrooper wrote: »
    Gura also has the whole time zone problem. If she wants to throw her followers down the rabbit hole by doing something with a JP member then they would want to schedule it at a time good for NA viewers but that means the JP member has to stream in the morning and that is going to be real hard to schedule if it's someone who takes singing and dancing lessons or has something like radio show or an advertisement deal like the curry one Aqua, Subaru, and Pekora had a little while ago.

    The sponsorship thing is an interesting side point. From Cover's point of view, viewcount might not matter too much, but the ability to collab with gacha games, sell concert tickets, and hock instant Ramen makes you company royalty. And this could be an area of difficulty for EN members who might have a lot more trouble pulling off Japanese brand deal arrangements. I'm curious to see brand deals with US companies. Like... sponsored streams for upcoming Western games should be a layup.

    Which is actually a point of concern. Stepping aside from my enthusiast feelings towards these members, I'm much more of a Jim Sterling "this industry sucks and needs to be bullied and held to account as often as possible" perspective generally. And I feel like corporate streamers like these are uniquely poorly suited to the challenges of that situation. Other, Western streamers I follow would confidently state their feelings about an iffy sponsor or disappointing major release, it seems like these guys might need to toe a company line instead.

    This became a ramble, but it's just the kind of thing I've been thinking about since getting hooked on this type of stream.

    There are plenty of american foods and products that are sold in both america and japan pretty much as-is. They could easily target those companies and products that would hit both US and JP audiences. As for the industry 'sucking'....its practically still Brand New. until Gura came along only a few girls were nearing 1 million subs, and I'm sure that her meteoric rise had something to do with All the other girls getting a boost in viewership even without a colab. Before Her, 1 million views was pretty Meh from an Advertising perspective. It's just starting to grow to the point that both vendors and hololive should be thinking about this more seriously.

    Sorry, I didn't make that point clearly. I was meaning the videogame industry, not the streaming industry. While I still have concerns about how their streaming business is run, I was more talking about being sponsored by gaming companies.

This discussion has been closed.