[Monster Hunter] Rise Demo out today on the switch and it looks awesome!

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  • MechMantisMechMantis Registered User regular
    LD50 wrote: »
    Yeah SnS gives you so much mobility etc - it's a VERY good weapon

    I think the main dink against it for new players is it's not percived as a "Cool" weapon in the way the more grandiose weapons are. Even though it's relative simplicity is perfect for new players.

    But i'm still going to beat the shit out of things with a giant slab that only barely qualifies as being a sword, because that's just how Greatsword rolls.

    Look, you can have a puny sword and shield, or you can have a sword and shield that turn into a giant exploding axe.

    But then they're not a sword and shield anymore.

    This is a problem.

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  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    Personally, i found GS real easy, but i bascially mained it for a large chunk of world, and all of iceborne, so... ???

    It helps when you realize you only need to land about 15 TCS to kill most monsters. I'm not even joking - a good TCS will hit for 1.2k+ pretty reguarly, most monsters you face have like 20k hp.

    Add in that you'll probably do a lot more than just TCS, and Greatsword mulches things hilariously well.

    Thoguh will say, at least in Iceborne, knowing how to use Slinger Bursts after a leaping wide slash so you can reaim and go straight into a TCS is a pretty vital skill.

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  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    I miss slinger burst in Rise something fierce. The weapon feels so slow after losing that.

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  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    What are the silkbind attacks for it?

  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    LD50 wrote: »
    What are the silkbind attacks for it?

    In the demo at least, you get Power Sheathe, which pulls you forward, sheaves your weapon and amps your damage for a short time after, and Hunting Edge, which vaults you forward into the air and lets you do a plunging attack or go into an aerial charged slash. Both are okay as repositioning tools but neither lets you rush into TCS & adjust your aim dramatically like slinger burst did.

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  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    Power Sheathe at least plays into the classic GS crit draw build for sniping monsters, even if it's not going to TCS.

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  • Ratsult2Ratsult2 Registered User regular
    edited January 12
    With GS, when in the air you can do a plunging thrust (ZR) to skip the first charge, into wide slash which skips the second, then go right to the true charge. Not quite as good as the slinger in World, but still pretty decent. You can also set it up with the power sheathe, then do a regular silk jump to start the combo while covering a lot of ground.

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  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    That sounds cool. To be fair, I think the idea of the silkbind attacks was to give people options that weren't as powerful as the iceborn slinger stuff.

  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    Silkbinds are basically hunter arts again, except with a common resource making them more usable. Plus we get some common moves.

    Also there's no evasion+sharpness nonsense art that everyone takes.

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  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    edited January 12
    That and they're actually useful and balanced (Seemingly!)

    I may still be salty about Duals having basically one functional one that was a boring buff. Maybe. There's no evidence, honest.

    They're also just better integrated , rather than having an awkward hit this button thing.

    I really need to dig into the demo properly

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  • Halos Nach TariffHalos Nach Tariff Can you blame me? I'm too famous.Registered User regular
    edited January 12
    The longsword ones are a little weird, being that one is basically just taking the spirit helm splitter from World and putting it on a different button (with a trickier initial animation to boot), and the other one is, like, a third counter/reaction move along with the foreslight slash and iai roundslash, I haven't managed to pull it off yet to work out what utility it offers compared to those two options, looks like it has a longer active window maybe? It costs two silkbug charges to use so its probably pretty beefy in some aspect.

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  • TamerBillTamerBill Registered User regular
    The longsword ones are a little weird, being that one is basically just taking the spirit helm splitter from World and putting it on a different button (with a trickier initial animation to boot), and the other one is, like, a third counter/reaction move along with the foreslight slash and iai roundslash, I haven't managed to pull it off yet to work out what utility it offers compared to those two options, looks like it has a longer active window maybe? It costs two silkbug charges to use so its probably pretty beefy in some aspect.

    The advantage is you don't need to combo into it like the others, you can counter from neutral.

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  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    edited January 12
    TamerBill wrote: »
    The longsword ones are a little weird, being that one is basically just taking the spirit helm splitter from World and putting it on a different button (with a trickier initial animation to boot), and the other one is, like, a third counter/reaction move along with the foreslight slash and iai roundslash, I haven't managed to pull it off yet to work out what utility it offers compared to those two options, looks like it has a longer active window maybe? It costs two silkbug charges to use so its probably pretty beefy in some aspect.

    The advantage is you don't need to combo into it like the others, you can counter from neutral.

    iai roundslash can be held for a bit in stance, but the silkbind I think also has the longest active time of them all. If there's actually a selection of silkbinds (something I've seen speculation of, since there's animations in prior trailers not in the demo options apparently), it would be something that you take or not based on comfort with other defensive options.

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  • Halos Nach TariffHalos Nach Tariff Can you blame me? I'm too famous.Registered User regular
    Mm, I got pretty good with the foresight slash timings in World (though they may have changed it a bit for this one, I don't know, being able to negate a Teostra nova was pretty good...) but now that you can't foresight slash out of the spirit roundslash (as far as I can tell at least), I can see getting more value out of the Iai roundslash too.



  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    Yeah SnS gives you so much mobility etc - it's a VERY good weapon

    I think the main dink against it for new players is it's not percived as a "Cool" weapon in the way the more grandiose weapons are. Even though it's relative simplicity is perfect for new players.

    But i'm still going to beat the shit out of things with a giant slab that only barely qualifies as being a sword, because that's just how Greatsword rolls.

    I really love using SnS, but it took me two or three games to even really try it, because of exactly that. I could use some sort of crazy weapon the size of which makes no logical sense, or I can use the Sword and Shield that I could probably at least lift in real life...

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  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    Brody wrote: »
    Yeah SnS gives you so much mobility etc - it's a VERY good weapon

    I think the main dink against it for new players is it's not percived as a "Cool" weapon in the way the more grandiose weapons are. Even though it's relative simplicity is perfect for new players.

    But i'm still going to beat the shit out of things with a giant slab that only barely qualifies as being a sword, because that's just how Greatsword rolls.

    I really love using SnS, but it took me two or three games to even really try it, because of exactly that. I could use some sort of crazy weapon the size of which makes no logical sense, or I can use the Sword and Shield that I could probably at least lift in real life...

    The other thing about SnS is just practicing your combo strings since it's easy to hit something one too many times.

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  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    Brody wrote: »
    Yeah SnS gives you so much mobility etc - it's a VERY good weapon

    I think the main dink against it for new players is it's not percived as a "Cool" weapon in the way the more grandiose weapons are. Even though it's relative simplicity is perfect for new players.

    But i'm still going to beat the shit out of things with a giant slab that only barely qualifies as being a sword, because that's just how Greatsword rolls.

    I really love using SnS, but it took me two or three games to even really try it, because of exactly that. I could use some sort of crazy weapon the size of which makes no logical sense, or I can use the Sword and Shield that I could probably at least lift in real life...

    I mean you probably could, bit realistically the sword part of SnS is a two hander, and the shield aren't exactly small either

    But if we're applying realism &maths to things then it works out that a great sword wielder would not actually need the weapon, they'd have raw strength to simply pull monsters apart like taffy. (Also you could probably kill anything by dropping a great sword on it because holy crap those things works be heavy)

    What I'm saying is that monster hunter is a very silly game and I love it

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  • CruorCruor Registered User regular
    Brody wrote: »
    Yeah SnS gives you so much mobility etc - it's a VERY good weapon

    I think the main dink against it for new players is it's not percived as a "Cool" weapon in the way the more grandiose weapons are. Even though it's relative simplicity is perfect for new players.

    But i'm still going to beat the shit out of things with a giant slab that only barely qualifies as being a sword, because that's just how Greatsword rolls.

    I really love using SnS, but it took me two or three games to even really try it, because of exactly that. I could use some sort of crazy weapon the size of which makes no logical sense, or I can use the Sword and Shield that I could probably at least lift in real life...

    I mean you probably could, bit realistically the sword part of SnS is a two hander, and the shield aren't exactly small either

    But if we're applying realism &maths to things then it works out that a great sword wielder would not actually need the weapon, they'd have raw strength to simply pull monsters apart like taffy. (Also you could probably kill anything by dropping a great sword on it because holy crap those things works be heavy)

    What I'm saying is that monster hunter is a very silly game and I love it

    You make a good point, they should add a new weapon type that's just a simple set of gloves you wear while you literally wrestle with every monster.

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  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    Brody wrote: »
    Yeah SnS gives you so much mobility etc - it's a VERY good weapon

    I think the main dink against it for new players is it's not percived as a "Cool" weapon in the way the more grandiose weapons are. Even though it's relative simplicity is perfect for new players.

    But i'm still going to beat the shit out of things with a giant slab that only barely qualifies as being a sword, because that's just how Greatsword rolls.

    I really love using SnS, but it took me two or three games to even really try it, because of exactly that. I could use some sort of crazy weapon the size of which makes no logical sense, or I can use the Sword and Shield that I could probably at least lift in real life...

    I mean you probably could, bit realistically the sword part of SnS is a two hander, and the shield aren't exactly small either

    But if we're applying realism &maths to things then it works out that a great sword wielder would not actually need the weapon, they'd have raw strength to simply pull monsters apart like taffy. (Also you could probably kill anything by dropping a great sword on it because holy crap those things works be heavy)

    What I'm saying is that monster hunter is a very silly game and I love it

    Oh for sure, that why I specifically said lift, not swing. XD I might be able to swing the Rathian SnS sword.

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  • IceBurnerIceBurner It's cold and there are penguins.Registered User regular
    edited January 13
    It is bizarre the the game finally uses all four shoulder buttons for main functions again, the R buttons are reversed from how they worked on PS2 (in MH1/MH2 R2 = auto-sheathe+run, R1 = weapon action), and there's no option that swaps them.

    What is it that Capcom has against players who still have muscle memory from the first two games?

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  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    IceBurner wrote: »
    It is bizarre the the game finally uses all four shoulder buttons for main functions again, the R buttons are reversed from how they worked on PS2 (in MH1/MH2 R2 = auto-sheathe+run, R1 = weapon action), and there's no option that swaps them.

    What is it that Capcom has against players who still have muscle memory from the first two games?

    I could have sworn I'd seen an option for that...

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  • EnigmedicEnigmedic Registered User regular
    Am I doing something wrong? When I have my weapon drawn both ls and gl, when I use zl + x it puts a wirebug out then launches me straight up. But in the description at least on the gunlance it says you go forward then do stuff. It's annoying trying to get some forward momentum to get to the monster but instead impotently hop up and down doing nothing.

    Also I killed mizu way faster with gl than the ls.

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  • CarpyCarpy Registered User regular
    edited January 13
    Edit: whoops, completely misread that

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  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    Enigmedic wrote: »
    Am I doing something wrong? When I have my weapon drawn both ls and gl, when I use zl + x it puts a wirebug out then launches me straight up. But in the description at least on the gunlance it says you go forward then do stuff. It's annoying trying to get some forward momentum to get to the monster but instead impotently hop up and down doing nothing.

    Also I killed mizu way faster with gl than the ls.

    The animation has to connect with the monster for the rest of it to work for a lot of those type of wirebug moves.

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  • IceBurnerIceBurner It's cold and there are penguins.Registered User regular
    edited January 13
    Polaritie wrote: »
    IceBurner wrote: »
    It is bizarre the the game finally uses all four shoulder buttons for main functions again, the R buttons are reversed from how they worked on PS2 (in MH1/MH2 R2 = auto-sheathe+run, R1 = weapon action), and there's no option that swaps them.

    What is it that Capcom has against players who still have muscle memory from the first two games?

    I could have sworn I'd seen an option for that...
    I wish. The Player Actions Settings Type 2 is PSP/DS style, where R does everything, contextually. ZR does nothing when that's selected.

    The Dash Settings choices are just L-Click, R, or both. No ZR.

    This seriously screws with my muscle memory. The only thing I can do is swap ZR and R at the Switch OS level, save it as a preset, and remember to change that between games.

    That causes issues with the one Wirebug combo to zip where aimed, but I can likely retrain something I learned yesterday more easily than I can unlearn hundreds of hours of PS2 hunting.

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  • SatsumomoSatsumomo Rated PG! Registered User regular
    Yeah I think it was GU that had the option to swap L/ZL and R/ZR. Rise only has the option to swap L/R.

  • jothkijothki Registered User regular
    IceBurner wrote: »
    What is it that Capcom has against players who still have muscle memory from the first two games?

    You've seen World and Rise in general, right? Muscle memory is pretty far down the list there.

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  • IceBurnerIceBurner It's cold and there are penguins.Registered User regular
    edited January 14
    I had tried SnS, Lance, Longsword, Hammer, and Switch Axe. All of them were fine. I didn't discover hammer's other mode, but I could still hammer as I remembered. Was getting hopeful about the game, and then I discovered the changes to Greatsword and Dual Blades.

    There's no longer a kick. This means there's no longer a Kick > Slap combo, so GS can no longer exhaust/KO effectively. At least it got that tackle in trade.
    Dual Blades though ... they pared down its moveset by one button's worth of moves (~30%) and it got nothing in return. That is far too simple. What the heck?

    Great Izuchi is also incredibly easy. Great Jaggi is downright difficult by comparison. Great Maccao is much more dangerous. Great Fango (forgot its localized name) puts up more of a fight, even though that's not because it's a good monster. I'm ... confused and concerned by this almost-insubstantial tutorial monster.

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  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    GS losing exhaust/ko is not a problem in my book. Punish draw still exists and will only get better with the new wirebug sheathe, and the rest of the changes it got including TCS more than makes up for it.

    Heck they even kept True Charge Slash (Power) from Iceborne. Which is so fucking great

    (Tcs power is triggered by having the first weak hit impact a weak point. Which then triggers MASSIVE DAMAGE)

    What has DB lost? Last I checked it's move set is fine

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  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    IceBurner wrote: »
    Great Izuchi is also incredibly easy. Great Jaggi is downright difficult by comparison. Great Maccao is much more dangerous. Great Fango (forgot its localized name) puts up more of a fight, even though that's not because it's a good monster. I'm ... confused and concerned by this almost-insubstantial tutorial monster.

    It's a demo, I wouldn't assume the balance is 100% there.

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  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    Naphtali wrote: »
    IceBurner wrote: »
    Great Izuchi is also incredibly easy. Great Jaggi is downright difficult by comparison. Great Maccao is much more dangerous. Great Fango (forgot its localized name) puts up more of a fight, even though that's not because it's a good monster. I'm ... confused and concerned by this almost-insubstantial tutorial monster.

    It's a demo, I wouldn't assume the balance is 100% there.

    Demo stats are definitely higher than you'll be running into them with first.

    Also, Great Jaggi is a pushover once you learn its patterns. It does have a hip check, but there's a massive audio cue for it.

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  • BrodyBrody The Watch The First ShoreRegistered User regular
    IceBurner wrote: »
    I had tried SnS, Lance, Longsword, Hammer, and Switch Axe. All of them were fine. I didn't discover hammer's other mode, but I could still hammer as I remembered. Was getting hopeful about the game, and then I discovered the changes to Greatsword and Dual Blades.

    There's no longer a kick. This means there's no longer a Kick > Slap combo, so GS can no longer exhaust/KO effectively. At least it got that tackle in trade.
    Dual Blades though ... they pared down its moveset by one button's worth of moves (~30%) and it got nothing in return. That is far too simple. What the heck?

    Great Izuchi is also incredibly easy. Great Jaggi is downright difficult by comparison. Great Maccao is much more dangerous. Great Fango (forgot its localized name) puts up more of a fight, even though that's not because it's a good monster. I'm ... confused and concerned by this almost-insubstantial tutorial monster.

    Did you use demon mode/arch demon mode?

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  • IceBurnerIceBurner It's cold and there are penguins.Registered User regular
    Polaritie wrote: »
    Naphtali wrote: »
    IceBurner wrote: »
    Great Izuchi is also incredibly easy. Great Jaggi is downright difficult by comparison. Great Maccao is much more dangerous. Great Fango (forgot its localized name) puts up more of a fight, even though that's not because it's a good monster. I'm ... confused and concerned by this almost-insubstantial tutorial monster.

    It's a demo, I wouldn't assume the balance is 100% there.

    Demo stats are definitely higher than you'll be running into them with first.

    Also, Great Jaggi is a pushover once you learn its patterns. It does have a hip check, but there's a massive audio cue for it.
    I took SnS in on my very first Great Izuchi hunt and zero-hits-taken finished it within 3 minutes of engaging the monster. Even with slower weapons and messing around I haven't been in real danger. Can't say the same of Jaggi, Maccao, Arzuros, or even Fango.

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  • CalicaCalica Registered User regular
    I'm very excited for MH: Stories 2, but I'm halfway(?) through the first game and thoroughly bored with the combat. Hopefully if they're trying to strike a more mature tone the actual gameplay will be more interesting too? I know they already said turn-based paper-scissors-rock is coming back, but still...

    I'd love a Stories game with the main series' combat, but obviously that's not going to happen :razz:

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  • jothkijothki Registered User regular
    Turn-based rock-paper-scissors is actually a weirdly faithful representation of main-series Monster Hunter combat.

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  • SatsumomoSatsumomo Rated PG! Registered User regular
    DB are my most used weapon in World, I didn't feel like I lost anything in Rise? I think we lost the infinite combo with X when moving side from side, but I didn't test it too much, so maybe it's still there.

  • CarpyCarpy Registered User regular
    I can't play this with Joycons, not sure if it's the angles or lack of muscle memory but they feel so bad to me trying to hunt. I was so surprised by it that I went and bought Iceborne just to make sure I wasn't misremembering World.

    Side note: I'm now playing Iceborne for the first time and I'd forgotten how much I love this game.

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  • SatsumomoSatsumomo Rated PG! Registered User regular
    Iceborne is a real treat, it adds so many things to the base game, it almost feels like it more than doubles content.

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  • darkmayodarkmayo Registered User regular
    I burnt out on MHW, pretty much got what I wanted out of it, Rise looks interesting but likely will wait and see if a PC version comes out, or see what else happens with MHW.

  • jungleroomxjungleroomx I had a dream of schism, force the rule of nines Registered User regular
    edited January 14
    Rise is fun, I'm definitely missing that 60 fps. I can take the graphical downgrade.

    I hope they keep the lance as hoppy in the next mainline interation, because it's a lot of fun. I especially loved watching the rage gaming dudes bounce off the corpse of an Arzuros.

    10:17 (volume down a bit, trust me, the one guy gets really excited and screechy)

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