[Second Impeachment] of the 45th President of the United States | Trial: 1pm 02/08/2021

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  • Inkstain82Inkstain82 Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Then it just looks like Democrats are changing the rules because things arent going their way.

    *looks at the past... ten years of the GOP doing that*

    Okay, and?

    And they seem to be losing a lot of elections

    That's not accurate - they gained seats in the House and nearly held the Senate too. They outperformed everywhere. Pelosi's majority is thin as fuck right now and it's very, very possible she loses it in 2022, depending on how apportionment goes after the 2020 census.

    It’s extremely accurate. They lost more house elections than they won. They lost control of the senate. And they lost the presidency.


    There is a portion of the internet left, for whatever reason, that is obsessed with pretending wins are actually losses because they weren’t literally the best possible option.

    The bolded is a silly thing to say. They gained seats in the House, that's the salient point electorally.

    That’s a pants on head way of framing it. Every house seat is up for grabs every cycle. The score was 0 to 0, and then they lost. The fact that they lost by more the cycle before does not change that. If it is was 435-0 republicans, and then it was 433-2 republicans, you would not say that Democrats won the second cycle

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  • dispatch.odispatch.o Registered User regular
    edited January 10
    moniker wrote: »
    Let me sum up my thoughts this way. Senate rules for the trial are set by the Senate, not McConnell. If he can command 100% of his dwindling majority to withstand that vote, including Romney and Murkowski, then Trump will be acquitted and the trial is a matter of counting traitors so it doesn't matter if he delays it. If McConnell cannot control 100% of his caucus, meaning Romney and Murkowski join Democrats to call for a real trial, then McConnell is effectively minority leader anyway and it doesn't matter having to wait for Georgia. Both realities merit calling for the trial as immediately as possible.

    This is a very convincing argument. No sarcasm.

    I think that counting on very concerned Republicans has always gone so poorly I'm hesitant to believe even their moderates will vote with Dems - because "it's time to heal and move forward".

    dispatch.o on
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  • monikermoniker Registered User regular
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Then it just looks like Democrats are changing the rules because things arent going their way.

    *looks at the past... ten years of the GOP doing that*

    Okay, and?

    And they seem to be losing a lot of elections

    That's not accurate - they gained seats in the House and nearly held the Senate too. They outperformed everywhere. Pelosi's majority is thin as fuck right now and it's very, very possible she loses it in 2022, depending on how apportionment goes after the 2020 census.

    It’s extremely accurate. They lost more house elections than they won. They lost control of the senate. And they lost the presidency.


    There is a portion of the internet left, for whatever reason, that is obsessed with pretending wins are actually losses because they weren’t literally the best possible option.

    The bolded is a silly thing to say. They gained seats in the House, that's the salient point electorally.

    That’s a pants on head way of framing it. Every house seat is up for grabs every cycle. The score was 0 to 0, and then they lost. The fact that they lost by more the cycle before does not change that. If it is was 435-0 republicans, and then it was 433-2 republicans, you would not say that Democrats won the second cycle

    It demonstrates that Republicans gained support relative to the status quo ante baseline of 2018. Even after going full fascist. Rather than more fully losing support as a result of going full fascist.

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  • IlpalaIlpala Just this guy, y'know Texas booniesRegistered User regular
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Then it just looks like Democrats are changing the rules because things arent going their way.

    *looks at the past... ten years of the GOP doing that*

    Okay, and?

    And they seem to be losing a lot of elections

    That's not accurate - they gained seats in the House and nearly held the Senate too. They outperformed everywhere. Pelosi's majority is thin as fuck right now and it's very, very possible she loses it in 2022, depending on how apportionment goes after the 2020 census.

    It’s extremely accurate. They lost more house elections than they won. They lost control of the senate. And they lost the presidency.


    There is a portion of the internet left, for whatever reason, that is obsessed with pretending wins are actually losses because they weren’t literally the best possible option.

    The bolded is a silly thing to say. They gained seats in the House, that's the salient point electorally.

    That’s a pants on head way of framing it. Every house seat is up for grabs every cycle. The score was 0 to 0, and then they lost. The fact that they lost by more the cycle before does not change that. If it is was 435-0 republicans, and then it was 433-2 republicans, you would not say that Democrats won the second cycle

    You WOULD say they're on the upswing. That they're making inroads. That things are getting better for them. All of which are much truer with the margin they currently have compared to '18.

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  • ChanusChanus I've seen things... Registered User regular
    moniker wrote: »
    Let me sum up my thoughts this way. Senate rules for the trial are set by the Senate, not McConnell. If he can command 100% of his dwindling majority to withstand that vote, including Romney and Murkowski, then Trump will be acquitted and the trial is a matter of counting traitors so it doesn't matter if he delays it. If McConnell cannot control 100% of his caucus, meaning Romney and Murkowski join Democrats to call for a real trial, then McConnell is effectively minority leader anyway and it doesn't matter having to wait for Georgia. Both realities merit calling for the trial as immediately as possible.

    if we think it is possible McConnell can't control his caucus, i am on board

    Allegedly a voice of reason.
    dispatch.o
  • dispatch.odispatch.o Registered User regular
    moniker wrote: »
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Then it just looks like Democrats are changing the rules because things arent going their way.

    *looks at the past... ten years of the GOP doing that*

    Okay, and?

    And they seem to be losing a lot of elections

    That's not accurate - they gained seats in the House and nearly held the Senate too. They outperformed everywhere. Pelosi's majority is thin as fuck right now and it's very, very possible she loses it in 2022, depending on how apportionment goes after the 2020 census.

    It’s extremely accurate. They lost more house elections than they won. They lost control of the senate. And they lost the presidency.


    There is a portion of the internet left, for whatever reason, that is obsessed with pretending wins are actually losses because they weren’t literally the best possible option.

    The bolded is a silly thing to say. They gained seats in the House, that's the salient point electorally.

    That’s a pants on head way of framing it. Every house seat is up for grabs every cycle. The score was 0 to 0, and then they lost. The fact that they lost by more the cycle before does not change that. If it is was 435-0 republicans, and then it was 433-2 republicans, you would not say that Democrats won the second cycle

    It demonstrates that Republicans gained support relative to the status quo ante baseline of 2018. Even after going full fascist. Rather than more fully losing support as a result of going full fascist.

    The score doesn't really start 0-0 either.

    Incumbent advantage is a big deal and losing/gaining seats is more of a carrying over the score from the previous game.

    spool32MarathonDrezElvenshaeKana
  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    I guess after a few days to calm down and convinces themselves it's not such a big deal after all it's just business as usual.

    And America's government really is that weak.

    I hope the security next time around is better, because there will be a next time. And now I really fear for the 2024 elections.

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  • dispatch.odispatch.o Registered User regular
    edited January 10
    I'm hopeful that with being forced "underground" and off of their primary organizing social network services, it will be much easier to see just how crazy they are and how closely they resemble terrorist cells worth keeping an eye on. It will also hopefully reduce recruitment, but that's a long time off... it takes a long time to starve a beast that's been that well fed for so long.

    If the infighting continues the FBI can run counter-terrorism operations on the leaders who advocate violence pretty easily. They're not subtle or smart.

    I also don't think the impeachment and/or conviction of Trump is necessary to determine whether or not we take the white nationalists seriously. We can advocate for that independent of Trump being in office or even alive.

    dispatch.o on
  • EncEnc A Fool with Compassion Pronouns: He, Him, HisRegistered User regular
    Orca wrote: »
    I guess after a few days to calm down and convinces themselves it's not such a big deal after all it's just business as usual.

    And America's government really is that weak.

    I hope the security next time around is better, because there will be a next time. And now I really fear for the 2024 elections.

    Maybe take a moment and try not to go all-in on hyperbole. Tomorrow impeachment begins, our legislature is a slow branch of government by design, and things aren't being forgotten by any stretch of the imagination across the internet and beyond. Big, positive changes and developments have been happening literally every 6 hours or so since this insurrection, if not faster. It's easy for us on the forums to lose hope and throw our hands in the air, and even easier for us to accuse our legislature of doing the same, but there are processes that have to be filed, legal documents and materials that have to be researched, and discussions that have to be had with literally hundreds of people in order for impeachment to happen, having them by Monday, just under 5 days from being hidden in goddamn bunkers and losing all of their offices and security, is pretty damn impressive.

    You and I and, frankly, most of the forums have been 24/7ing this news media which makes the timeframes feel longer than it is. Things are moving quickly with the speed of actual democracy and we're still seeing positive momentum.

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  • JavenJaven Registered User regular
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Then it just looks like Democrats are changing the rules because things arent going their way.

    *looks at the past... ten years of the GOP doing that*

    Okay, and?

    And they seem to be losing a lot of elections

    That's not accurate - they gained seats in the House and nearly held the Senate too. They outperformed everywhere. Pelosi's majority is thin as fuck right now and it's very, very possible she loses it in 2022, depending on how apportionment goes after the 2020 census.

    It’s extremely accurate. They lost more house elections than they won. They lost control of the senate. And they lost the presidency.


    There is a portion of the internet left, for whatever reason, that is obsessed with pretending wins are actually losses because they weren’t literally the best possible option.

    The bolded is a silly thing to say. They gained seats in the House, that's the salient point electorally.

    That’s a pants on head way of framing it. Every house seat is up for grabs every cycle. The score was 0 to 0, and then they lost. The fact that they lost by more the cycle before does not change that. If it is was 435-0 republicans, and then it was 433-2 republicans, you would not say that Democrats won the second cycle

    What does this have to do with whether or not Democrats should be trying to change the rules that have been hamstringing them, though

  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    I really don't know how many times the Democratic House leadership has to avoid confrontation and seek to deny their own power and agency before people stop making excuses for them. They need to retire.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
    Warren 2020
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  • evilmrhenryevilmrhenry Registered User regular
    One benefit of starting the trial ASAP is that it ties the GOP to whatever happens next. If, for example, another coup attempt is made at the inauguration, or someone records Trump saying something incriminating, that gets tied to the GOP dismissing it on partisan grounds without months of Fox News spin between the two events. If, on the other hand, the House Democrats set a trial date months away, and something happens, that gets tied to the Democrats. And I don't think this story is over.

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  • spool32spool32 Contrary Library Registered User regular
    edited January 10
    I really don't know how many times the Democratic House leadership has to avoid confrontation and seek to deny their own power and agency before people stop making excuses for them. They need to retire.

    agree, it's really time for some folks who understand the modern communications landscape to take the reins.

    Edit: I'm not even talking about people who would necessarily do things differently - it's just that they're really terrible at getting a message out regarding why they are doing things.

    spool32 on
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  • CelestialBadgerCelestialBadger Registered User regular
    There is no point impeaching after the election. After the election, Trump should become the subject of a criminal investigation.

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  • ChanusChanus I've seen things... Registered User regular
    i'm still not sure what it is Democrats are supposed to be able to do right now that they aren't already doing

    Allegedly a voice of reason.
  • RedTideRedTide Registered User regular
    Democrats need to be increasing the number of sitting house reps, giving DC statehood, putting Puerto Rico on a path towards statehood or independence and piling on voting reforms to increase accessibility and facilitate automatic/same day registration.

    You're working in a system designed to serve the few - who exactly the few are and where they reside has changed slightly over time but they still exist.

    And they've worked the system in their favor further over time. If you're not fighting that inertia, you're not fighting - you're floundering.

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  • SanderJKSanderJK Crocodylus Pontifex Sinterklasicus Madrid, 3000 ADRegistered User regular
    Impeachment if you have the votes would be glorious since it would bar Trump from office. The odds seem slim though.

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  • ChanusChanus I've seen things... Registered User regular
    There is no point impeaching after the election. After the election, Trump should become the subject of a criminal investigation.

    they aren't impeaching after the election

    they are impeaching tomorrow

    Allegedly a voice of reason.
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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Chanus wrote: »
    There is no point impeaching after the election. After the election, Trump should become the subject of a criminal investigation.

    they aren't impeaching after the election

    they are impeaching tomorrow

    But then talking about putting it off for 100 days because it's not actually important it's just something they have to do in a pro forma sense.

    They should have passed a single article along the lines of the draft posted on Thursday morning, because the President of the United States launched a direct and violent attack on democracy itself. Instead they're dithering and trying to convince themselves not to. And it's entirely because leadership is a bunch of dinosaurs stuck in the Reagan era.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
    Warren 2020
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  • monikermoniker Registered User regular
    edited January 10
    Chanus wrote: »
    i'm still not sure what it is Democrats are supposed to be able to do right now that they aren't already doing

    Not advocating for a 100 day pause. Which is basically just Clyburn but presumably he is floating that for colleagues

    moniker on
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  • ElkiElki get busy Moderator, ClubPA mod
    Chanus wrote: »
    i'm still not sure what it is Democrats are supposed to be able to do right now that they aren't already doing

    They could not add a 100 days delay. Something entirely within their power not to do, but they’re choosing to do it anyways.

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  • Dark_SideDark_Side Registered User regular
    edited January 10
    moniker wrote: »
    Let me sum up my thoughts this way. Senate rules for the trial are set by the Senate, not McConnell. If he can command 100% of his dwindling majority to withstand that vote, including Romney and Murkowski, then Trump will be acquitted and the trial is a matter of counting traitors so it doesn't matter if he delays it. If McConnell cannot control 100% of his caucus, meaning Romney and Murkowski join Democrats to call for a real trial, then McConnell is effectively minority leader anyway and it doesn't matter having to wait for Georgia. Both realities merit calling for the trial as immediately as possible.

    I was saying this when I first heard McConnell was going to delay until the 19th or 20th. I agree, I think this move signals that he doesn't have control, and he's not sure he has enough votes to stop removal.

    Dark_Side on
  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    The whip is the one that gets the damn votes. If he's saying it, he's speaking for the majority.

    AbsoluteZeroChanus
  • EncEnc A Fool with Compassion Pronouns: He, Him, HisRegistered User regular
    Chanus wrote: »
    There is no point impeaching after the election. After the election, Trump should become the subject of a criminal investigation.

    they aren't impeaching after the election

    they are impeaching tomorrow

    But then talking about putting it off for 100 days because it's not actually important it's just something they have to do in a pro forma sense.

    They should have passed a single article along the lines of the draft posted on Thursday morning, because the President of the United States launched a direct and violent attack on democracy itself. Instead they're dithering and trying to convince themselves not to. And it's entirely because leadership is a bunch of dinosaurs stuck in the Reagan era.

    This is all misleading, except for one point.

    They are talking about setting the trial to 1) when they have actual control and 2) to when they can set the tone of Biden's presidency to not be defined around Trump but instead on what they can do to help Americans. It also grants them time to shake the trees and find more and more evidence from these insurrectionist fuckheads that "Trump said to do it!" which will make it very, very difficult for GOP in competitive districts to not side to convict. They aren't dithering and trying to convince themselves not to. There is literally no evidence of that. The house has galvanized itself behind the articles over the last four days and has been gaining support in house and senate GOP officials to come out and concur. This is how democracy works.

    House and senate leadership are, in fact, a bunch of Regan era dinosaurs and should be replaced. That doesn't have much to do with the former two points because if you are actually going to take action to remove Trump from politics that's probably the only timeline that will work.

    I don't really fault Pelosi for "waiting" the day to start impeachment proceedings because its clear from the various news reports that they were already underway and it was just a show for the media and Pence to try and force a article 25 solution (which nobody on the inside expected to happen but did its job of keeping the press focused on conservative responses for another day).

    Like, I get the frustration and wanting something done now, but that's not how it works. That's not how anything in the legistlature works. Saying "well they could do it now, nothing is stopping them!" is false, because while the rules technically allow it, the work that happens off the floor doesn't. Look at Thursday, we had dozens of democrats in the house in split districts saying "no impeachment," that's gone now. That's the work that has been happening.

  • Mild ConfusionMild Confusion Smash All Things Registered User regular
    Public pressure is high now and starting the trail too far out gives cover to the GOP.

    That said, there is political calculous in not letting McConnell set the trail rules, and waiting for Schumer to take control of the Senate cuts McConnell out. Remember that the Ukraine impeachment had no witnesses or subpoenas because McConnell rushed the trail on purpose. He will surely do that again if he is Senate leader when the trail starts.

    Trump won’t be convicted by the Senate either way, just too many sycophants and cowards, but making the Senate vote as painful and politically damaging to the GOP should be the goal here. Well, removing Trump is the goal, but that’s very unlikely so the next objective will be to bring forth witnesses, subpoenas, and investigation results in a very public trail to showcase just how complicit the GOP is in this. The investigations part is what will take the most time and should be considered, especially with so many of Trump’s people still in positions to defy Congress. Once Biden is sworn in, he can fire them and direct the DOD, DOJ, and all the other agencies to comply with the Senate trial.

    The instigators of the insurrection can be brought forth to testify, along with investigations into whatever amount of coordination there was between the insurrectionists and the sitting GOP members and Trump appointees will be incredibly damaging.

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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    I am aware of exactly one Democrat who was against impeachment, from Oregon.

    I am very tired of people who change their opinions about the schedule every time Pelosi or Clyburn say something.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
    Warren 2020
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  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    Chanus wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Then it just looks like Democrats are changing the rules because things arent going their way.

    *looks at the past... ten years of the GOP doing that*

    Okay, and?

    And they seem to be losing a lot of elections

    That's not accurate - they gained seats in the House and nearly held the Senate too. They outperformed everywhere. Pelosi's majority is thin as fuck right now and it's very, very possible she loses it in 2022, depending on how apportionment goes after the 2020 census.

    i can guarantee repeatedly impeaching Trump after he's out of office is the quickest path to a red wave in 2022

    No one's talking about trying to impeach Trump over and over again?

    Running an impeachment vote right now is a good thing even if it doesn't succeed, because it puts those motherfuckers on the record.

    If you have an issue with that, then please express your issues with that.

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  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades Class Traitor Smoke-filled roomRegistered User regular
    There are times to be politically calculating and there are times to act with conviction and haste.

    This is one of the latter. Our Congress was almost lynched.

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  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    Yeah let's impeach Trump 100 days after he is already out of office. That sounds smart. I'm sure that won't be a media shit-show painting the Democrats as sore winners and accomplishing zilch. You know what else it does? Immediately squash all my faith in our newly elected government.

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  • EncEnc A Fool with Compassion Pronouns: He, Him, HisRegistered User regular
    I am aware of exactly one Democrat who was against impeachment, from Oregon.

    I am very tired of people who change their opinions about the schedule every time Pelosi or Clyburn say something.

    I've been pretty consistent about the schedule since this thing occurred, but strawman me all you want. I understand why and don't fault you for it.

  • ChanusChanus I've seen things... Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Chanus wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Inkstain82 wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    dispatch.o wrote: »
    Then it just looks like Democrats are changing the rules because things arent going their way.

    *looks at the past... ten years of the GOP doing that*

    Okay, and?

    And they seem to be losing a lot of elections

    That's not accurate - they gained seats in the House and nearly held the Senate too. They outperformed everywhere. Pelosi's majority is thin as fuck right now and it's very, very possible she loses it in 2022, depending on how apportionment goes after the 2020 census.

    i can guarantee repeatedly impeaching Trump after he's out of office is the quickest path to a red wave in 2022

    No one's talking about trying to impeach Trump over and over again?

    Running an impeachment vote right now is a good thing even if it doesn't succeed, because it puts those motherfuckers on the record.

    If you have an issue with that, then please express your issues with that.

    i was specifically responding to HamHamJ who was specifically advocating multiple impeachments

    Allegedly a voice of reason.
    Enc
  • ChanusChanus I've seen things... Registered User regular
    Yeah let's impeach Trump 100 days after he is already out of office. That sounds smart. I'm sure that won't be a media shit-show painting the Democrats as sore winners and accomplishing zilch. You know what else it does? Immediately squash all my faith in our newly elected government.

    that will happen if they have the trial take beyond Jan 21 as well, which is what McConnell is saying he will do

    the only way forcing the Senate trial right now makes any sense is if we believe McConnell doesn't have control of his caucus, which I would assume Schumer to know better than we do

    Allegedly a voice of reason.
  • Mild ConfusionMild Confusion Smash All Things Registered User regular
    edited January 10
    My opinion is impeach tomorrow in the House, then set the trial date in the Senate after McConnell loses control, which is the 23rd at the earliest I think.

    This is about more than just Trump, we need every singe one of his enablers and conspirators to be compelled to testify, which will not happen if McConnell controls the trial. I want Giuliani, Trump Jr, Meadows, Miller, all the other, and even Trump himself to be forced to testify under oath in a public trial.

    I don’t just want Trump, I want them all.

    Edit: Autocorrect keeps spelling it “trail”.

    Mild Confusion on
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  • override367override367 ALL minions Registered User regular
    edited January 10
    Chanus wrote: »
    i'm still not sure what it is Democrats are supposed to be able to do right now that they aren't already doing

    could have thrown out the articles of impeachment immediately after the capitol attack when everyone's blood was still hot and for just a tiny moment they put the twelfth dimensional chessboard away, instead of this made up "We have to not take pressure off pence", Pence was never going to use the 25th amendment, and anyone in Washington who said that was the reason was lying

    Impeach him tomorrow, that's what I want them to do now

    override367 on
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  • ChanusChanus I've seen things... Registered User regular
    Chanus wrote: »
    i'm still not sure what it is Democrats are supposed to be able to do right now that they aren't already doing

    could have thrown out the articles of impeachment immediately after the capitol attack when everyone's blood was still hot and for just a tiny moment they put the twelfth dimensional chessboard away, instead of this made up "We have to not take pressure off pence", Pence was never going to use the 25th amendment, and anyone in Washington who said that was the reason was lying

    the process started when Ilhan Omar drafted articles the morning after the attack

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  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    My opinion is impeach tomorrow in the House, then set the trial date in the Senate after McConnell loses control, which is the 23rd at the earliest I think.

    This is about more than just Trump, we need every singe one of his enablers and conspirators to be compelled to testify, which will not happen if McConnell controls the trial. I want Giuliani, Trump Jr, Meadows, Miller, all the other, and even Trump himself to be forced to testify under oath in a public trial.

    I don’t just want Trump, I want them all.

    Edit: Autocorrect keeps spelling it “trail”.

    This makes way more sense than waiting a hundred fucking days. God damn it how are they so dumb?

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  • ChanusChanus I've seen things... Registered User regular
    to your edit, they are impeaching him tomorrow

    Allegedly a voice of reason.
  • RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    Chanus wrote: »
    to your edit, they are impeaching him tomorrow

    I think we're talking about the colloquial meaning of impeachment which includes the senate doing their part.

    CelestialBadgerAbsoluteZeroMild Confusionnever die101
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    moniker wrote: »
    Chanus wrote: »
    i'm still not sure what it is Democrats are supposed to be able to do right now that they aren't already doing

    Not advocating for a 100 day pause. Which is basically just Clyburn but presumably he is floating that for colleagues

    Yeah, this feels like a trial balloon. High enough in leadership to be taken seriously without actual leadership having to actually take a stand on it.

    It feels like it's coming from some group more scared of McConnell fucking up their ability to get anything done once Biden is seated then anything else.

  • override367override367 ALL minions Registered User regular
    edited January 10
    Chanus wrote: »
    to your edit, they are impeaching him tomorrow

    but we're just going to delay sending it to the senate for 100 days?

    We should delay sending it to the senate until all 50 of our senators are seated, so the senate can hear evidence

    override367 on
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