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[Legends of Runeterra] A CCG that takes all the good stuff from MtG/HS but is F2P friendly

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  • MNC DoverMNC Dover Full-time Voice Actor Kirkland, WARegistered User regular
    Enigmedic wrote: »
    I've noticed a dumb amount of spiders decks in diamond 3.

    I just started using a nocturne diana deck and pushed up to D2. I have wanted to mess with tahm raka. I sort of tried fiora raka to mixed results as well. Nobody expects the heal 4 and +4 health on a fiora.

    Swim has Spiders as a tier 1 deck on his website. That probably has a lot to do with it.

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    shryke
  • KorrorKorror Registered User regular
    Hello thread!

    I come to you from the MTG thread where there was discussion of LoR and I realized that I should give it a try at least. As an aggro-control player in general (I play rogues in MTG) is there a deck that's similar where you try to stick a threat and then play a bunch of spells to disrupt your opponent and protect your stuff? The shen deck above seems cool and I happen to like the Ionia aesthetic so I might work towards it if it's an affordable deck for new players.

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    MNC Dover
  • I needed a gnome to post.I needed a gnome to post. boom Registered User regular
    what's funny is you just missed that style of deck being the uncontested best deck in the format, but it ate a few nerfs last week

    that said the nature of the card design being based off a moba, quite a few decks wind up having a flavour of "sticking a threat and protecting it", with the threat in question being the champions, so i would go so far as to say that you could sort of play almost whatever you want and get some of that same feeling

    liEt3nH.png
    YiliasThawmus
  • MNC DoverMNC Dover Full-time Voice Actor Kirkland, WARegistered User regular
    Korror wrote: »
    Hello thread!

    I come to you from the MTG thread where there was discussion of LoR and I realized that I should give it a try at least. As an aggro-control player in general (I play rogues in MTG) is there a deck that's similar where you try to stick a threat and then play a bunch of spells to disrupt your opponent and protect your stuff? The shen deck above seems cool and I happen to like the Ionia aesthetic so I might work towards it if it's an affordable deck for new players.

    Ionia as a region is pretty weak right now, but has a couple of key cards to support other decks. Fortunately for you, champions are a central focus of most decks to build around. You should be right at home.

    Also, the game vomits cards at you non-stop, so price is never a problem. If you play a little every day, you’ll have have most of the card library in a few months.

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  • YiliasYilias Registered User regular
    The best aggro-control examples would be Demacia Ionia decks, a very Bant combination, currently either the Shen Jarvan above or Lulu Shen.

    As gnome said, TF Fizz just ate some (deserved) heavy nerfs, but it's still a very playable T2 deck. It's sort of an Izzet flyers decks with a metric ton of cycling and card draw to continually replenish threats and burn based removal to stall counter aggression.

    Shurima also has access to a black style counterspell, so you might also like Thresh Nasus. That's a very mono-black and creature heavy deck though so it's a real stretch.


    The best "Protect the X" deck (and probably the best deck overall) at the moment is Lee Sin. He's more combo than aggro-control, but he still has to stick to the board for 2-3 turns while you stack enchantments on him, meet his flip condition, and hold up mana for interaction. Additionally if you don't draw Lee himself then your gameplan will often shift to building and protecting a large lifelink flyer.

    Some example decklists
    Shen Jarvan: CMCQCAQAAEBAGAAGBYBAIAAIBIBQCARAEUVQIAIABEFRUHIBAEAQEMIBAIAQAJJU
    Lulu Shen: CMCQCAICEAAQEAAKAEBQADQDAMBACAQKAUAQACQLCUOSWAIDAEAASGRFAEAQEAAH
    TF Fizz: CMCQCAQEAMAQGBQRAMAQIAJHGQCAEBQ2EYVS4BADAQCQ2EQZAAAQCAQGFI
    Thresh Nasus: CMCACAQFAQBAIBIDCACAIBYCDIXTWBIBAUFRSMBRGQBACAIFEIAQIB2RAA
    Zoe Lee Sin: CMBAEAQCAMDAOAYJBENSGKBJGNOAIAIBAIYQCAQCBEAQGAQUAIBQSE2VAIAQGCKWAIBAEBII

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    KorrorMNC DoverThawmus
  • MNC DoverMNC Dover Full-time Voice Actor Kirkland, WARegistered User regular
    Yilias wrote: »
    The best aggro-control examples would be Demacia Ionia decks, a very Bant combination, currently either the Shen Jarvan above or Lulu Shen.

    As gnome said, TF Fizz just ate some (deserved) heavy nerfs, but it's still a very playable T2 deck. It's sort of an Izzet flyers decks with a metric ton of cycling and card draw to continually replenish threats and burn based removal to stall counter aggression.

    Shurima also has access to a black style counterspell, so you might also like Thresh Nasus. That's a very mono-black and creature heavy deck though so it's a real stretch.


    The best "Protect the X" deck (and probably the best deck overall) at the moment is Lee Sin. He's more combo than aggro-control, but he still has to stick to the board for 2-3 turns while you stack enchantments on him, meet his flip condition, and hold up mana for interaction. Additionally if you don't draw Lee himself then your gameplan will often shift to building and protecting a large lifelink flyer.

    Some example decklists
    Shen Jarvan: CMCQCAQAAEBAGAAGBYBAIAAIBIBQCARAEUVQIAIABEFRUHIBAEAQEMIBAIAQAJJU
    Lulu Shen: CMCQCAICEAAQEAAKAEBQADQDAMBACAQKAUAQACQLCUOSWAIDAEAASGRFAEAQEAAH
    TF Fizz: CMCQCAQEAMAQGBQRAMAQIAJHGQCAEBQ2EYVS4BADAQCQ2EQZAAAQCAQGFI
    Thresh Nasus: CMCACAQFAQBAIBIDCACAIBYCDIXTWBIBAUFRSMBRGQBACAIFEIAQIB2RAA
    Zoe Lee Sin: CMBAEAQCAMDAOAYJBENSGKBJGNOAIAIBAIYQCAQCBEAQGAQUAIBQSE2VAIAQGCKWAIBAEBII

    I appreciate this post, although having never played much MtG, I only understood about half of it. :)

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  • Lucid_SeraphLucid_Seraph TealDeer MarylandRegistered User regular
    As a very casual MtG player and huge fan of Izzet, I'd say that Aphelios/Zoe hits that feeling of juggling weird shenanigans while being very annoying about poking the enemy, before you eventually bust out a big doom laser. Oddly, it's almost mono-"colored" in LR but honestly no region really fully maps to a color in Magic and that's a good thing.

    The Escape Goat: If there's anywhere that Occam's Razor fails to apply it's Elder Scrolls lore.
    Delduwath: Yeah, gotta use Mehrunes' Razor.
  • EnigmedicEnigmedic Registered User regular
    How is mono fiora since the nerf? Haven't seen much of it since then, but it's not like you ever actually did damage to the girl anyway against that deck. Half the time your stuff is frozen, the other she has barrier or is a 12/12.

    3ds FC: 0645 - 7166 - 9801
  • Lucid_SeraphLucid_Seraph TealDeer MarylandRegistered User regular
    edited April 6
    ok so this lab run was just silly
    rhMFSnu.png

    sometimes I guess RNG be like "why don't we make this simple for you."

    Yes, that meant a random 3/3 Poro was summoned at the start of *every round*. The +2/+2 was the second Boon I picked up, too.

    Lucid_Seraph on
    The Escape Goat: If there's anywhere that Occam's Razor fails to apply it's Elder Scrolls lore.
    Delduwath: Yeah, gotta use Mehrunes' Razor.
    MNC Dover
  • JarsJars Registered User regular
    I had something similar with +2/2 on 1 costs, sapling summoned every attack phase, and rally.

    oh and MF was a 1 cost with a phage

    Lucid_SeraphIvellius
  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    Heimerdinger sucks.

    I said it.

    I hate him and I hate running him in the lab. He's too fucking slow, the deck they give you is shit, it's the only one I've actually lost the first mission with.

    Oh here's a cost-5 Champion with a shitty body who needs you to throw down a fuckton of mana to really see him do anything. Oh also here's a deck with zero cost 1 creatures. Every time I think I found a good fit for him, I'm wrong. Raise health to match attack? Perfect for his turrets! But it'll be a cold day in hell before I can meet the conditions of having him alive on the field and also cast a big fucking spell.

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  • EnigmedicEnigmedic Registered User regular
    Yep his deck doesn't fit the design of the mode and his card costs like 3 too much Mana.

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    Thawmus
  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    Okay thank god I thought it was just me.

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  • JarsJars Registered User regular
    also he's heimerdinger and fuck him

    ThawmusLucid_SeraphMNC Dover
  • MNC DoverMNC Dover Full-time Voice Actor Kirkland, WARegistered User regular
    There's was a short period of time where Heimer was pretty strong. Not tier 1 strong, but he had a solid tier 2 deck that could get out of control fast. It all died though when Flash of Brilliance went to 4 mana and his 3-cost Turrets swapped Elusive for Fearsome. On turn 5, you could drop Heimer, then Burst speed out 1-3 Flash of Brilliance + another 3 or less cost spell, to put out a bunch of Elusive Turrets. The weird part was that it wasn't an uncommon thing to happen either.

    FoB has since went back to 3 mana, but the Turrets remained unchanged, which is for the best. Elusive as a keyword is very dangerous, so the devs need to pay extra attention to it's implementation.

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  • CoinageCoinage Heaviside LayerRegistered User regular
    Spiders are very strong, sometimes I play the 3/2 on one and the 3/2 and 4/1 on two and just say what the fuck to myself as I swing for 10 damage

    t1iylq0d7o1p.png
  • MNC DoverMNC Dover Full-time Voice Actor Kirkland, WARegistered User regular
    edited April 6
    Coinage wrote: »
    Spiders are very strong, sometimes I play the 3/2 on one and the 3/2 and 4/1 on two and just say what the fuck to myself as I swing for 10 damage

    I thought you were talking about Spiders and for the life of me I couldn't figure out what Spiders had those stats. But you mean a Rearguard into Rearguard/Stygian Onlooker. That's a strong opener for sure.

    Oh yeah hey @Bedlam, people on Reddit are saying that Sivir can now transfer Double Strike now after the patch. They must have stealth added/fixed that.

    MNC Dover on
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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    I actually just beat Hard Lab of Legends with Heimer like 1 minute ago. He's not as bad as he seems at first imo. You gotta be pretty aggressive with your spells and trades in the first few levels to get anywhere though. Try and pick a good champ to go with him or even transition into for the tougher parts of the run. Especially something that can finish without a wide-board, which Heimer can already do but is not a great way to beat a few of the levels (Scargrounds and Turrets especially)

    Best power by far for Heimer and his deck imo is the one that gives you full spell mana every turn. Heimer's deck is spell heavy and needs to clear aggressively sometimes and the extra mana makes that possible. Also gives a ton of extra value to your Thermos which helps a lot in getting rid of beef.

    Lucid_Seraph
  • Lucid_SeraphLucid_Seraph TealDeer MarylandRegistered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    I actually just beat Hard Lab of Legends with Heimer like 1 minute ago. He's not as bad as he seems at first imo. You gotta be pretty aggressive with your spells and trades in the first few levels to get anywhere though. Try and pick a good champ to go with him or even transition into for the tougher parts of the run. Especially something that can finish without a wide-board, which Heimer can already do but is not a great way to beat a few of the levels (Scargrounds and Turrets especially)

    Best power by far for Heimer and his deck imo is the one that gives you full spell mana every turn. Heimer's deck is spell heavy and needs to clear aggressively sometimes and the extra mana makes that possible. Also gives a ton of extra value to your Thermos which helps a lot in getting rid of beef.

    as my recent run shows, sometimes the lab is literally just RNG.

    The Escape Goat: If there's anywhere that Occam's Razor fails to apply it's Elder Scrolls lore.
    Delduwath: Yeah, gotta use Mehrunes' Razor.
  • MNC DoverMNC Dover Full-time Voice Actor Kirkland, WARegistered User regular
    Playing Taliah in lab is painful and I can only imagine her Ranked experience is worse. She needs some buffs and/or a slight rework.

    My suggestion is to give her normal for the rock throw on attack. It’s just 2 extra damage to her blocker, so not OP on a 2/4. When she flips, I’d make her attack with two rocks baseline and if she has a Landmark out, it becomes 4 rocks.

    Even with these changes, she’d still be bad which says how underpowered she is compared to other Champions. Her high cost, bad stats, and reliance on Landmarks while flipped is just too much.

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  • YiliasYilias Registered User regular
    I think her fundamental issue is the nature of landmarks.

    Most landmarks you only want one of, the loss of two board slots usually isn't worth the diminished return on the value of having the second one in play. Even decks that are expressly built around a landmark like Star Spring or Scargrounds will probably not want to develop a second copy over having more units in play. The only landmark I've been actively happy to get in multiples was prenerf Veiled Temple, which made up for not being able to go wide by directly allowing you to go tall.

    As a mana cheating ability it's also reliant on how much mana you can cheat with it, but the expensive landmarks are largely not constructed viable. So realistically you're not getting more than 3 mana out of her play effect, while you'd probably need to cheat around 5 for it to be unfair enough for constructed.

    As a result, her most powerful use case is comboing with Stasis. It's not the worst combo, they target your threat with removal, you Stasis in response, then copy it and get a 2nd copy of the threat. But it's still a 7 mana combo and you could also just spend 7 mana developing threats normally. I've only been impressed with it when I played against someone playing Taliyah TF Deep and they got 3 copies of flipped TF into play (and then proceeded to draw themselves to death with blue cards).

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  • I needed a gnome to post.I needed a gnome to post. boom Registered User regular
    they had intense fear of taliyah cloning a countdown landmark the turn before it flips and it's like y'all, that's fine, the tempo is awful before that so you probably lose

    liEt3nH.png
    IvelliusshrykeThawmusYiliasLucid_Seraph
  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    Running Miss Fortune (w/ Gangplank as a buddy) for the first time and oh my god it's night and day holy shit she's good.

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    MNC Dover
  • EnigmedicEnigmedic Registered User regular
    Mf and gangplank together is basically a meta deck in constructed. It's generally known as pirate aggro.

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    ThawmusMNC Dover
  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    All I know is I got a whole bunch of catharsis bringing Miss Fortune to the spider level.

    I couldn't help but notice that these spiders have...1 Health? Oh noooo.....

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    Ivellius
  • I needed a gnome to post.I needed a gnome to post. boom Registered User regular
    waiting patiently for the scargrounds "OH NOOOOO!"

    liEt3nH.png
    ThawmusLucid_SeraphshrykeMNC Dover
  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    waiting patiently for the scargrounds "OH NOOOOO!"

    Yeah I'm not looking forward to that!

    steam_sig.png
  • Lucid_SeraphLucid_Seraph TealDeer MarylandRegistered User regular
    waiting patiently for the scargrounds "OH NOOOOO!"

    it is the one nice thing about the Taliyah Lab deck; it's a 4-drop but the deck still comes with landmark removal.

    "Go AWAY scargrounds >\ "

    The Escape Goat: If there's anywhere that Occam's Razor fails to apply it's Elder Scrolls lore.
    Delduwath: Yeah, gotta use Mehrunes' Razor.
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Things that are scary, courtesy of Lab of Legends:

    A 28/24 leveled Lucian

    The game ended very quickly after that.

    ThawmusMNC DoverLucid_SeraphIvellius
  • BedlamBedlam Registered User regular
    MNC Dover wrote: »
    Oh yeah hey Bedlam, people on Reddit are saying that Sivir can now transfer Double Strike now after the patch. They must have stealth added/fixed that.
    That deck was kind of jank anyway. But I was thinking that an elusive version could work. Maybe with Vi since sticking Elusive on her can also end the game. Just never got around to it.



  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    edited April 8
    Yes.

    Fuck Yes.
    fz4muig62ct6.jpg
    Hell fucking yes!

    Thawmus on
    steam_sig.png
    MNC DoverLucid_Seraph
  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    edited April 8
    Got up to Vault 13+3 this week:
    3rmffbg0m0s9.jpg

    Once again, that small shard count is actually a good thing. Added like 40 cards to my collection, probably more.

    Thawmus on
    steam_sig.png
    MNC Dover
  • Mongrel IdiotMongrel Idiot Registered User regular
    Hot damn, but my vault was good today: TWO random champion upgrades, netting me a first copy of LeBlanc and a third Vladimir. Good stuff.

    I've been enjoying my dragons deck a fair bit lately, and that combined with a Nautilus-based expedition made me think sea monsters might also be up my alley, so I threw together a quick Nautilus/Maokai "toss everything and let giant serpents eat them" deck. It's fun in a similar way to dragons: the early game scratches the "play carefully" itch as you think through blocks and trades to stay alive long enough to get your beasties out, while the late game scratches the "BIG MONSTER SMASH" itch for obvious reasons. The extra wrinkle of keeping an eye on when you'll go deep, and potentially surprising them by going deep mid-combat, is a nice touch. I had a couple of really fun mirror matches, one of which involved both of us emptying our decks completely and refilling them using some card-creation trick or another. I ended up losing, but it was still a lot of fun.

    The other deck I've been fiddling with is Ionia/Shadow Isles with an ephemeral focus. I'd played the Hecarim ephemeral archetype before, and wanted to see how the Ionia ephemeral stuff played. It's pretty fun and fast, and Death Mark leads to some entertaining scenarios. Overall I think that it's missing some tricks, but it's not completely helpless and at my level (middle-silver or unranked) it does the job well enough.

    MNC DoverThawmus
  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    My current resources:
    kwu3ngi729um.jpg
    Trying to resist the urge to craft a deck, I'm only up to stage 9 on most of the tracks. On the other hand, with this many common wildcards maybe I should get to crafting so I start reaping shards=champions?

    steam_sig.png
  • MNC DoverMNC Dover Full-time Voice Actor Kirkland, WARegistered User regular
    VAULT DAY!!

    4nme3rd9fufq.png

    This is a surprisingly good week for me as well. 2 new Commons, 2 Common WC, 1 Rare WC, my last missing Epic (+another for 250 shards), and a Renekton alongside my Champion WC. The 3.1k Shards is just icing on the cake. That brings me to:

    erl8zvcd7ahu.png
    Nice!

    Only 3 Champions left to acquire (Lissandra, Renekton, and Kindred), but 53 Commons and 46 Rares left to go. Given the sheer quantity of cards around, getting these last cards randomly is going to be pretty tough. I'm guessing one day I'll just spend some of my bloated resources to craft them. But looking over them, I'm not seeing a lot of "must have" cards to whip up. They all seem pretty niche or are just bad, so there's no hurry.

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  • ThawmusThawmus Registered User regular
    Thawmus wrote: »
    My current resources:
    kwu3ngi729um.jpg
    Trying to resist the urge to craft a deck, I'm only up to stage 9 on most of the tracks. On the other hand, with this many common wildcards maybe I should get to crafting so I start reaping shards=champions?

    Actually, got to looking at the meta decks on mobalytics, and it cost 1 champion wildcard, and like 2 rares and 9 commons to craft a Burn Aggro deck so, like, fuck it.

    steam_sig.png
    MNC Dover
  • IvelliusIvellius Registered User regular
    edited April 8
    I've been enjoying my dragons deck a fair bit lately, and that combined with a Nautilus-based expedition made me think sea monsters might also be up my alley, so I threw together a quick Nautilus/Maokai "toss everything and let giant serpents eat them" deck. It's fun in a similar way to dragons: the early game scratches the "play carefully" itch as you think through blocks and trades to stay alive long enough to get your beasties out, while the late game scratches the "BIG MONSTER SMASH" itch for obvious reasons. The extra wrinkle of keeping an eye on when you'll go deep, and potentially surprising them by going deep mid-combat, is a nice touch. I had a couple of really fun mirror matches, one of which involved both of us emptying our decks completely and refilling them using some card-creation trick or another. I ended up losing, but it was still a lot of fun.

    I like the idea of sea monsters, and the variant I've been playing is Bilgewater / smidge of Targon with Nautilus and TF as champions instead of Shadow Isles. The card draw is better with what I've been running / doubles as TF win-condition, and having a bit of healing / draw from Pale Cascade and Guiding Touch gets through early game a little better. I don't know if it's that much better than the "traditional" Toss deck, but it feels better to me.

    Edit: Forgot to attach the deck code I've been using: CMBACAYJGMFQEBQBC4NB2HRFE4US6NJYAIAQEBRMAEBQSIYA

    Ivellius on
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    Mongrel IdiotMNC Dover
  • Mongrel IdiotMongrel Idiot Registered User regular
    Ivellius wrote: »
    I've been enjoying my dragons deck a fair bit lately, and that combined with a Nautilus-based expedition made me think sea monsters might also be up my alley, so I threw together a quick Nautilus/Maokai "toss everything and let giant serpents eat them" deck. It's fun in a similar way to dragons: the early game scratches the "play carefully" itch as you think through blocks and trades to stay alive long enough to get your beasties out, while the late game scratches the "BIG MONSTER SMASH" itch for obvious reasons. The extra wrinkle of keeping an eye on when you'll go deep, and potentially surprising them by going deep mid-combat, is a nice touch. I had a couple of really fun mirror matches, one of which involved both of us emptying our decks completely and refilling them using some card-creation trick or another. I ended up losing, but it was still a lot of fun.

    I like the idea of sea monsters, and the variant I've been playing is Bilgewater / smidge of Targon with Nautilus and TF as champions instead of Shadow Isles. The card draw is better with what I've been running / doubles as TF win-condition, and having a bit of healing / draw from Pale Cascade and Guiding Touch gets through early game a little better. I don't know if it's that much better than the "traditional" Toss deck, but it feels better to me.
    I could definitely see that working. Weirdly, I don't find Maokai it be that helpful a secondary champion in Sea Monsters. On the surface it looks like he dovetails nice, but I rarely manage to get much value out of him when I play him. He attracts removal spells and blocks well enough, but I don't often level him up or manage to get very much use out of his saplings. I may need to give the Targon version a try!

    Ivellius
  • Lucid_SeraphLucid_Seraph TealDeer MarylandRegistered User regular
    I gotta say... actually pulling off the Zoe/Aphelios deck is *very difficult* and I think the real reason behind its high winrate is because it's got a very high skill floor and ceiling, and you have to juggle not just RNG, but knowing *what to pick* from each RNG. Eg: which Moon Weapon to pick first, and then which to cycle it into, and then keeping in mind you won't get the Cycled weapon until next round; not to mention all the Celestial stuff

    But holy crap when you pull off combos the combos are *incredibly sick* and it feels slick as hell. I'll need to explore other decks sometime to find out what else has quite that feel.

    The Escape Goat: If there's anywhere that Occam's Razor fails to apply it's Elder Scrolls lore.
    Delduwath: Yeah, gotta use Mehrunes' Razor.
  • YiliasYilias Registered User regular
    If you want control decks with similar playstyles I'd recommend Majiinbae's Zoe Karma, Rubinzoo's Zoe Viktor, or Drezbo's Viktor Heimer Vi.

    Majiinbae: CMBQCAICFEBAEAQDAUCQGCIJKRQNOAO5AEBQCAICGEBAEAQCBACAGCJDGNKVMAICAMBAKFA
    Rubinzoo: CMBQCAIEGQAQGBAFAQBQSCKUK3OQCBABAICACAQBAQNSOAQDBFKVYAQDAQBQ2BABAECCMAICAQEACAYECICQGCIXEMUTGYA
    Drezbo: CMDACAICGEAQCBA3AEBAECIBAICACAIDAIKACAYEAQDACAIEHAAQEBAIAIAQEDBFAIBQEBIIAIBQIAYFAMBAEAQDAUAA

    Note that none of these are meta decks and they're not easy to play. Rubin is currently sitting at rank 10 NA with his list though.

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    MNC DoverLucid_Seraph
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