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The Epic Apple fight

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    JuggernutJuggernut Registered User regular
    Pinfeldorf wrote: »
    Juggernut wrote: »
    The only way to eat a granny Smith apple is with a knife, a salt shaker and sitting in a rocking chair on your front porch.

    Do you use the salt shaker to core out the apple? This is causing me a great deal of eyebrow furrow.

    You slice off a piece of the granny smith, salt it, then eat it. Rock at roughly 4.3 Rocks Per Minute and occasionally say "hmm".

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    IncenjucarIncenjucar VChatter Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    You forgot about the part where you share half the apple with the horse in your yard.

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    JuggernutJuggernut Registered User regular
    That's optional but yes.

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    PinfeldorfPinfeldorf Yeah ZestRegistered User regular
    Juggernut I'm gonna blow your mind here, so make sure you're ready.

    Fuck that, don't put salt on your apple. Use this. Also delicious on oranges, mangos, and many other fruits.

    61TMyYX261L._SX425_PIbundle-8,TopRight,0,0_AA425SH20_.jpg

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    QuantumTurkQuantumTurk Registered User regular
    I have no idea how you split the baby on having consoles that things just work on versus the PC wild west of "build it! you can probably make it work! but it's going to be work!". But then the only consoles I do are nintendo, because I wanna play marios and can't do that on PC, and nintendos online anything is a decade outdated and half backwards anyway.

    Have there been any recent feelings about how EPIC is treating game devs? My last impression was that they were luring them with a bigger cut than steam, tossing cash at them for initial exclusivity, and tossing cash at a lot of older projects that got me a TON of free games over the past year or two. Obviously hard to know if an initial EPIC deal is worth the loss of initial steam sales but that's up to the financial sense of individual games, and money in hand may well be worth missing some sales overall. So while their store still sucks to browse, I'm not finding a lot to hate EPIC on, at least store wise. Fortnight wise they (as far as I know) still need to pay and credit dancers and generally be better about not stealing shit.

    There was a document earlier that showed how much they paid for the free game offers, and there were a few indies that got paid less than $100,000 for games that were downloaded millions of times.

    I'm sure that money was appreciated, but it feels pretty skeevy to me.

    As long as the contract was clear on "we will give you x, and then we are giving that shit away fo freeeee" then I don't mind too much, and what I've seen at RPS and similar seem to indicate it's a clear exchange, not like a bait and switch to them giving away the game for free. It's not like most of those numbers would be actual sales, I have grabbed a LOT of games I frankly probably won't ever play, because, well, it was 2 clicks and it was free. I'll do that. I imagine a lot of people do too, which boosts the number.

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    JuggernutJuggernut Registered User regular
    Pinfeldorf wrote: »
    Juggernut I'm gonna blow your mind here, so make sure you're ready.

    Fuck that, don't put salt on your apple. Use this. Also delicious on oranges, mangos, and many other fruits.

    61TMyYX261L._SX425_PIbundle-8,TopRight,0,0_AA425SH20_.jpg

    You keep to your ways n' I'll be a keepin' to mine, sonny.

    Now if you'll excuse me I have some rocking chair ponderin' what to resumify

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    astrobstrdastrobstrd So full of mercy... Registered User regular
    Pinfeldorf wrote: »
    Hot take: if I'm expected to use a console as my Hulu, Netflix, Amazon Prime, D+, ESPN+, YouTube, Twitch, whatever-the-fuck box?

    The console should put an in-console browsing method instead of forcing me to open each app individually, wait for things to load, and then search for something. A more broad level search from an "All libraries" menu or something, that would show me which of the apps I have access to (maybe even the ones I don't!) has the thing I searched for, and then opening up a button I could push to bring up that app? That would be very nice. As it is it takes like fucking 5 minutes to search Netflix, Prime and Hulu for a movie title, just to find out none of them have it, and it's a colossal waste of time and a good example of what a little collaboration can do to make your users' experience better.

    Justwatch.com does this, but yes, in-console would be nice.

    Selling the Scream Podcast: https://anchor.fm/jeremy-donaldson
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    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    rhylith wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »




    I hate this. The only reason one is "general purpose" and the other isn't is because one company refuses to allow their product to be used in a general purpose manner! THEY ARE ALL COMPUTERS THAT CAN RUN A TON OF DIFFERENT SHIT!

    Wait you actually WANT to deal with more PC style bullshit on a console?

    The entire point is the simplicity!

    That is almost exactly what Apple is arguing for with its iPhone walled garden and that Epic is arguing against except for phones instead of consoles

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    Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    Couscous wrote: »
    rhylith wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »




    I hate this. The only reason one is "general purpose" and the other isn't is because one company refuses to allow their product to be used in a general purpose manner! THEY ARE ALL COMPUTERS THAT CAN RUN A TON OF DIFFERENT SHIT!

    Wait you actually WANT to deal with more PC style bullshit on a console?

    The entire point is the simplicity!

    That is almost exactly what Apple is arguing for with its iPhone walled garden and that Epic is arguing against except for phones instead of consoles

    I dunno, I find a marked difference between a phone which has numerous utility attached to it and usability and a video game console that I want to play video games on exclusively.

    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    edited May 2021
    The biggest reason the phone ever got a huge amount of utility attached to is that they allowed them to be released on their markets.

    Modern consoles have tons of non-gaming stuff to the point where it is perfectly possible for people to use them more for video streaming and music streaming than games.

    You can already browse the internet on them, check email, check weather, have a fitness training app, fitbit stuff, use a Reddit client, etc. That gamers might not use them much doesn't really mean they aren't there.

    Couscous on
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    Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    The thing with consoles is while Sony and Nintendo were pretty content with primarily focusing on gaming, Microsoft always saw the Xbox as an entrypoint into the livingroom, which is why they eventually went all the way down the rabbit hole of being a mediabox during the Xbox One era, and it bit them in the ass something fierce, so now they're back to "It's a game box. You can do media stuff with it, but it's primarily a game box."

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    milskimilski Poyo! Registered User regular
    I have no idea how you split the baby on having consoles that things just work on versus the PC wild west of "build it! you can probably make it work! but it's going to be work!". But then the only consoles I do are nintendo, because I wanna play marios and can't do that on PC, and nintendos online anything is a decade outdated and half backwards anyway.

    Have there been any recent feelings about how EPIC is treating game devs? My last impression was that they were luring them with a bigger cut than steam, tossing cash at them for initial exclusivity, and tossing cash at a lot of older projects that got me a TON of free games over the past year or two. Obviously hard to know if an initial EPIC deal is worth the loss of initial steam sales but that's up to the financial sense of individual games, and money in hand may well be worth missing some sales overall. So while their store still sucks to browse, I'm not finding a lot to hate EPIC on, at least store wise. Fortnight wise they (as far as I know) still need to pay and credit dancers and generally be better about not stealing shit.

    There was a document earlier that showed how much they paid for the free game offers, and there were a few indies that got paid less than $100,000 for games that were downloaded millions of times.

    I'm sure that money was appreciated, but it feels pretty skeevy to me.

    I did math on this and most of those games got the equivalent of 3-9 months of residual steam sales, very approximately.

    I ate an engineer
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    MegaMan001MegaMan001 CRNA Rochester, MNRegistered User regular
    astrobstrd wrote: »
    Pinfeldorf wrote: »
    Hot take: if I'm expected to use a console as my Hulu, Netflix, Amazon Prime, D+, ESPN+, YouTube, Twitch, whatever-the-fuck box?

    The console should put an in-console browsing method instead of forcing me to open each app individually, wait for things to load, and then search for something. A more broad level search from an "All libraries" menu or something, that would show me which of the apps I have access to (maybe even the ones I don't!) has the thing I searched for, and then opening up a button I could push to bring up that app? That would be very nice. As it is it takes like fucking 5 minutes to search Netflix, Prime and Hulu for a movie title, just to find out none of them have it, and it's a colossal waste of time and a good example of what a little collaboration can do to make your users' experience better.

    Justwatch.com does this, but yes, in-console would be nice.

    Roku has this service and not only does it give you a list of services that carry that content, but how much each charges.

    I am in the business of saving lives.
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    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    Epic Games co-founder Mark Rein: "Yeah horribly overselling AR in a way that poisons the well for the industry. They [Microsoft] did this same shit with HoloLens."
    Oh man, remember Minecraft Earth?

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    Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    Incenjucar wrote: »
    You forgot about the part where you share half the apple with the horse in your yard.

    I can’t escape horse discourse

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    BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User, Moderator mod
    Couscous wrote: »
    Epic Games co-founder Mark Rein: "Yeah horribly overselling AR in a way that poisons the well for the industry. They [Microsoft] did this same shit with HoloLens."
    Oh man, remember Minecraft Earth?

    no I don't

    BahamutZERO.gif
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    Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    Oh, God, I love all this dirty laundry airing.

    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    Minecraft Earth is not technically dead. It will be dead in June.

    They blamed covid for it, but that would be a reason to keep it going as covid becomes less of an issue

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    BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited May 2021
    what even was it? I gather some sort of AR thing on iphones from the context?

    e: OH WAIT was it that thing where they showed up displaying a minecraft build in 3D on a table in the real world through AR on a phone or goggles or whatever, like a little model world? and you could scroll around it? That looked cool. I guess that demo was fake?

    BahamutZERO on
    BahamutZERO.gif
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    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    No, that was the Hololens thing. Minecraft Earth is a different AR thing that was like Pokemon Go but Minecraft

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    BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User, Moderator mod
    I'm trying and failing to imagine what you would do in a minecraft pokemon go

    BahamutZERO.gif
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    OlivawOlivaw good name, isn't it? the foot of mt fujiRegistered User regular
    I'm trying and failing to imagine what you would do in a minecraft pokemon go

    Gotta go find redstone out in the real world to bring back and... build... something

    Yeah I don't know what the end of that loop is

    signature-deffo.jpg
    PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
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    Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    Olivaw wrote: »
    I'm trying and failing to imagine what you would do in a minecraft pokemon go

    Gotta go find redstone out in the real world to bring back and... build... something

    Yeah I don't know what the end of that loop is

    Put the gems into the Hadron Collider and end the game.

    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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    MalReynoldsMalReynolds The Hunter S Thompson of incredibly mild medicines Registered User regular
    edited May 2021
    I'll answer since I kinda dig AR stuff:

    You would wander around and collect blocks, which you could then use an AR baseplate (your phone camera would find a spot of level ground/table and you would pick the base size). Then you would place blocks by wandering around essentially a 4x4 foot area using your phone as a 'window' to see the plate and build on it. You could walk towards or away, but as long as your camera was pointed at the location you picked, you could play with it, arrange it, store it. Essentially to show to friends.

    Except you would have to explain all of this to them if they weren't in to AR, and you can't really guide their experience if you hand your phone over since its perspective based.

    It was kinda neat.

    The Harry Potter game had a similar mode except it let you walk around book locations. Hold your phone up, it was like looking through a window into The Leaky Cauldron, etc.

    Edit: Very cool as a concept but I haven't really seen it utilized well. You could, in theory, have a museum tour outdoors using your phones AR mode to view exhibits as you walk around, etc, with a lower cost to entry as smartphones are everywhereish.

    MalReynolds on
    "A new take on the epic fantasy genre... Darkly comic, relatable characters... twisted storyline."
    "Readers who prefer tension and romance, Maledictions: The Offering, delivers... As serious YA fiction, I’ll give it five stars out of five. As a novel? Four and a half." - Liz Ellor
    My new novel: Maledictions: The Offering. Now in Paperback!
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    Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    Oh yeah AR is that thing I immediately disabled and never used in Pokémon Go

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    MalReynoldsMalReynolds The Hunter S Thompson of incredibly mild medicines Registered User regular
    edited May 2021
    Same! I used it to do some holiday photos with Jigglypuff but that was about it.

    There are other, neater ways to use and implement it in games and general apps that just have never been utilized at alllll.

    Edit: For PoGo, you could have geotagged locations which prompt an AR request, and when you look at _______, it's a store.

    Mapping and travel, some apps have trail marking but the feature is hidden or not executed well.

    I find AR to be really, really interesting as a stopgap between VR which no one uses.

    I mean. You augment reality. Do more with it.

    MalReynolds on
    "A new take on the epic fantasy genre... Darkly comic, relatable characters... twisted storyline."
    "Readers who prefer tension and romance, Maledictions: The Offering, delivers... As serious YA fiction, I’ll give it five stars out of five. As a novel? Four and a half." - Liz Ellor
    My new novel: Maledictions: The Offering. Now in Paperback!
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    BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User, Moderator mod
    I wasn't aware you could play pokemon go without the AR lol

    BahamutZERO.gif
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    Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    edited May 2021
    Its only use is catching mythicals

    Captain Inertia on
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    MaddocMaddoc I'm Bobbin Threadbare, are you my mother? Registered User regular
    The problem with AR in phone games is that when I'm playing a game on my phone I don't want to be holding it out in front of me waving it around like a doofus

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    DecomposeyDecomposey Registered User regular
    Its only use is catching mythicals

    If you complete disallow your phone from accessing your camera, you can catch mythicals without it as well.

    Before following any advice, opinions, or thoughts I may have expressed in the above post, be warned: I found Keven Costners "Waterworld" to be a very entertaining film.
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    OptyOpty Registered User regular
    edited May 2021
    MegaMan001 wrote: »
    astrobstrd wrote: »
    Pinfeldorf wrote: »
    Hot take: if I'm expected to use a console as my Hulu, Netflix, Amazon Prime, D+, ESPN+, YouTube, Twitch, whatever-the-fuck box?

    The console should put an in-console browsing method instead of forcing me to open each app individually, wait for things to load, and then search for something. A more broad level search from an "All libraries" menu or something, that would show me which of the apps I have access to (maybe even the ones I don't!) has the thing I searched for, and then opening up a button I could push to bring up that app? That would be very nice. As it is it takes like fucking 5 minutes to search Netflix, Prime and Hulu for a movie title, just to find out none of them have it, and it's a colossal waste of time and a good example of what a little collaboration can do to make your users' experience better.

    Justwatch.com does this, but yes, in-console would be nice.

    Roku has this service and not only does it give you a list of services that carry that content, but how much each charges.

    I know in Microsoft's case this sort of concept was something the Xbox One Guide was eventually supposed to do but since the console and its media-first presentation crashed and burned, all that got thrown out. Also the 3rd party companies do not like a consolidated search, they all want you to have to open their app or go to their webpage to figure out what they offer so they have a chance of catching your eye with a promotion or suggestion.

    Opty on
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    Blake TBlake T Do you have enemies then? Good. That means you’ve stood up for something, sometime in your life.Registered User regular
    Maddoc wrote: »
    The problem with AR in phone games is that when I'm playing a game on my phone I don't want to be holding it out in front of me waving it around like a doofus

    Even if you felt comfortable doing this, I think socially a bit of a Dick thing to do because people can’t tell if you are doing an AR thing or taking photos/videos of strangers.

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    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    edited May 2021
    Apples just aren't as good as oranges


    Getting mad at that is kind of hilarious.

    Fun fact: Epic typically buys ad space for the Google search results of "Unity Engine"

    Couscous on
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    MaddocMaddoc I'm Bobbin Threadbare, are you my mother? Registered User regular
    On one hand, I agree that's obnoxious

    On the other hand, he's not allowed to be annoyed by that for that reason

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    BroloBrolo Broseidon Lord of the BroceanRegistered User regular

    Epic’s lawyer asks if it’s Fischer’s understanding that Google Stadia has mostly shut down, Fischer demurs and says he’s heard it closed down an internal dev studio. Second time in this trial a lawyer has basically assumed Stadia is dead.

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    3cl1ps33cl1ps3 I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    I mean

    they aren't wrong

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    Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    Stadia was dead on arrival. It's been dead. It's a ghost of a console, a Phantom.

    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    For the Stadia to be dead, it must have been alive to begin with.

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    ChallChall Registered User regular
    Your honor, I would like to submit to the court that Google Stadia is trash and now it's dead.

    -I don't see how that applies to the case before the court in any way, but I'll allow it to be entered into evidence.

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