@urahonky I had a similar problem. After losing for 30 minutes straight, I just went back and collected 100% of the items. My next try against the boss went off without a hitch. Each of the bosses phases only have 4 or so attacks to memorize, so I just focused on what he was doing and had no further problems.
So yeah, take some time away from it and give it another try. And it's totally fine to watch a quick video to pick up a strat or two. I did for some of the bosses and it helped me out a lot.
Need a voice actor? Hire me at bengrayVO.com
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051 Steam ID Twitch Page
I think the toned down difficulty in Zero Mission was an overcorrection following Fusion's difficulty.
Really I think Super, Fusion and Dread just about have the difficulty spot on.
As a moderate-skill player I'm really finding Dread to be perfect. I am not great at it, but it's fast and fair enough that I don't get frustrated too long. I do have to take breaks, and sometimes even wander off for upgrades before coming back to try again, but my progress is still pretty steady.
I do think it might be a good idea to add some story modes to the game for low skill or hampered players, though. Exploration is fun on its own, and nobody should be blocked from this wonderful game experience
I think one reason the difficulty/frustration spikes annoy me more than they might in other games is that a big thing I enjoy in the series is the feeling of movement. Spin jump wonkiness aside, Samus has consistently felt great to maneuver through the environment and then suddenly spending half an hour Thunderdomed in a small room with a boss that eats 50 missiles is a big interruption of that.
I remember Phantoon, Draygon and Ridley all fucking up my shit back in the day. Phantoon was probably the worst because my stupid ass kept using super missiles.
I think the 2D games have varied dramatically in difficulty. Fusion was very difficult in a lot of areas and fights. Zero Mission was a lot more toned down in comparison. It makes it hard to predict what a given game will play like.
I know the last boss of Samus Returns gave me some trouble but I don't recall any of the Super Metroid bosses taking me more than a try or two
But then those were the days where you'd beat your head against a boss without complaint because what else were you going to do you already finished the half dozen games you owned and you weren't getting another one until christmas or your birthday or whatever :P
I was on winter break in college when I played Fusion. I definitely do not have that kind of time anymore.
Yeah I'm on the last boss and I'm going to go ahead and quit. I can get his first form very easily but the second one is just too much for me and apparently there's a third. I can't do it. I just spent 1 and a half hours trying but I wasn't getting any closer to beating him. My hats off to you fine folks that can do this but it's completely unfun and I hope the next Metroid game isn't this ball busting. I really, really enjoy the game when I'm exploring and not fighting bosses.
Don't you quit on me.
Man my blood pressure can't handle this. I play games as an escape from bullshit lol
Dread has toed the line between the games I'll play on a weeknight to unwind and ones I have to reserve for weekends when I have more time and start out in a more relaxed state. I can see this being pushed into the latter camp for many and I'm pretty sure a large part of why I'll still plug away on a worknight is that I'm addicted to collecting upgrade items.
This only works if you've only made the one run like I have, but the discrepancy between in-game time and total play time suggests just how much of my life was lost to EMMis and bosses:
I think the toned down difficulty in Zero Mission was an overcorrection following Fusion's difficulty.
Really I think Super, Fusion and Dread just about have the difficulty spot on.
As a moderate-skill player I'm really finding Dread to be perfect. I am not great at it, but it's fast and fair enough that I don't get frustrated too long. I do have to take breaks, and sometimes even wander off for upgrades before coming back to try again, but my progress is still pretty steady.
I do think it might be a good idea to add some story modes to the game for low skill or hampered players, though. Exploration is fun on its own, and nobody should be blocked from this wonderful game experience
I'd argue that the only thing that makes Dread not unplayably difficult is the checkpoints immediately outside of bosses. If it worked like any other Metroid game, it would be horrible.
Didn't think they could top the ending of Super Metroid, but having a giant-ass fuck-off laser at the end that beats out the Hyper Beam is definitely one way to do it.
Didn't think they could top the ending of Super Metroid, but having a giant-ass fuck-off laser at the end that beats out the Hyper Beam is definitely one way to do it.
The risk here is that laser spectacle creep will take place. Next mission she is going to be firing off her laser from atop her gunship on the pirate base underneath Independence Day Style. The following game she is going to go full Death Star Laser on yet another poor planet.
Didn't think they could top the ending of Super Metroid, but having a giant-ass fuck-off laser at the end that beats out the Hyper Beam is definitely one way to do it.
The risk here is that laser spectacle creep will take place. Next mission she is going to be firing off her laser from atop her gunship on the pirate base underneath Independence Day Style. The following game she is going to go full Death Star Laser on yet another poor planet.
See, that's one thing that bugs me about Metroid. It seems REALLY easy to blow up planets in this series. You hit it with an airship or a space station, and suddenly, the who planet explodes in two minutes. Not sure how these planets survived long enough to form an ecosystem in the first place if they're that fragile.
Didn't think they could top the ending of Super Metroid, but having a giant-ass fuck-off laser at the end that beats out the Hyper Beam is definitely one way to do it.
The risk here is that laser spectacle creep will take place. Next mission she is going to be firing off her laser from atop her gunship on the pirate base underneath Independence Day Style. The following game she is going to go full Death Star Laser on yet another poor planet.
See, that's one thing that bugs me about Metroid. It seems REALLY easy to blow up planets in this series. You hit it with an airship or a space station, and suddenly, the who planet explodes in two minutes. Not sure how these planets survived long enough to form an ecosystem in the first place if they're that fragile.
Man I've said it before but this game has some good boss design.
In my speedrun:
With Z-57 I got good enough that I actually reloaded my save to see if I could it faster and faster. Once you've figured out a boss you can take them apart. I took it down in about eighty seconds. And this was on hard mode. (I know you can shinespark the second phase, but I didn't do it. I've heard it does enough damage to instakill on normal but I wonder if it still holds true on hard because the bosses both hit harder and have a bit more health.)
Anyways, I'm definitely gonna finish with a sub four hour clear time but I'm definitely not gonna get sub 3 this run. Also gotta find time to try some proper "all in one go" speedruns.
So, prior conversion about whether a specific QTE is actually meaningful* led me to discover in my third(!) playthrough, while battling Corpius, that during those big Melee Counter scenes that you can trigger against bosses... you aren't compelled to fire. At all. You can just grab the boss monster by the neck, drag it around the arena, do all kinds of backflips and spin-kicks and just... point at it menacingly the entire time.
* It's literally impossible not to escape the final EMMI's forced grab. If you don't push the button, Samus counters it anyway.
My favorite musical instrument is the air-raid siren.
I'm pretty far in the game now, and I've decided I actually kinda hate the EMMI sections. I don't mind that they're hard - some of the bosses are hard, and I don't mind dying five times in a row after a good fight, getting a little better each time.
But the gameplay in the EMMI sections - especially later on - just grinds everything to a halt while I replay the same 50 yard stretch of game 20 times until I luck out and the fucking robot happens to jog left instead of right. It doesn't feel like I'm getting past them because I'm getting better, it feels like I'm getting lucky, and the environments are often such that making a single mistake is just fatal.
I'm trying to get through one section where the EMMI can see through walls and has basically infinite range on its vision and the whole section is underwater, so if it happens to ever glance in your direction, it'll catch you and there's nothing to be done about it. It just feels kinda bullshit.
The sections are mercifully short, but the implementation just makes it so it's not tense or scary, just irritating. Everything else about the game is great, but I definitely don't see myself ever replaying this. It's like playing Super Metroid if, every half hour, Jim Carrey showed up to make The Most Annoying Sound in the World for a couple minutes.
The first few sections felt pretty good, so I don't know if they were handled better, or if the novelty just wore off. Either way, blergh.
Maddie: "I named my feet. The left one is flip and the right one is flop. Oh, and also I named my flip-flops."
Seems to have to with phase transitions or if a boss is almost dead. Basically it seems the game is programmed not to give you a counter cutscene in some fights if the boss is on very, very low health. (K is one that I think does this.) Also if you don't fire, or have no missiles against a boss that can only be damaged by missiles in the cutscene (most bosses) then you won't get it.
+2
AbsoluteZeroThe new film by Quentin KoopantinoRegistered Userregular
I'm pretty far in the game now, and I've decided I actually kinda hate the EMMI sections. I don't mind that they're hard - some of the bosses are hard, and I don't mind dying five times in a row after a good fight, getting a little better each time.
But the gameplay in the EMMI sections - especially later on - just grinds everything to a halt while I replay the same 50 yard stretch of game 20 times until I luck out and the fucking robot happens to jog left instead of right. It doesn't feel like I'm getting past them because I'm getting better, it feels like I'm getting lucky, and the environments are often such that making a single mistake is just fatal.
I'm trying to get through one section where the EMMI can see through walls and has basically infinite range on its vision and the whole section is underwater, so if it happens to ever glance in your direction, it'll catch you and there's nothing to be done about it. It just feels kinda bullshit.
The sections are mercifully short, but the implementation just makes it so it's not tense or scary, just irritating. Everything else about the game is great, but I definitely don't see myself ever replaying this. It's like playing Super Metroid if, every half hour, Jim Carrey showed up to make The Most Annoying Sound in the World for a couple minutes.
The first few sections felt pretty good, so I don't know if they were handled better, or if the novelty just wore off. Either way, blergh.
If it makes you feel any better
Purple is secretly the final EMMI, and therefore the hardest.
Also a tip for dealing with purple EMMI
The underwater sections feature copious spider magnet walls and ceilings. Use the grapple beam to quickly zip through the water when possible. While purple EMMI can see through walls, it still can't detect you when using the shadow cloak, so use it as much as possible.
I'm pretty far in the game now, and I've decided I actually kinda hate the EMMI sections. I don't mind that they're hard - some of the bosses are hard, and I don't mind dying five times in a row after a good fight, getting a little better each time.
But the gameplay in the EMMI sections - especially later on - just grinds everything to a halt while I replay the same 50 yard stretch of game 20 times until I luck out and the fucking robot happens to jog left instead of right. It doesn't feel like I'm getting past them because I'm getting better, it feels like I'm getting lucky, and the environments are often such that making a single mistake is just fatal.
I'm trying to get through one section where the EMMI can see through walls and has basically infinite range on its vision and the whole section is underwater, so if it happens to ever glance in your direction, it'll catch you and there's nothing to be done about it. It just feels kinda bullshit.
The sections are mercifully short, but the implementation just makes it so it's not tense or scary, just irritating. Everything else about the game is great, but I definitely don't see myself ever replaying this. It's like playing Super Metroid if, every half hour, Jim Carrey showed up to make The Most Annoying Sound in the World for a couple minutes.
The first few sections felt pretty good, so I don't know if they were handled better, or if the novelty just wore off. Either way, blergh.
I feel similarly plus the dimmer lighting in the zones has gotten in the way at times. I love stealth games but the EMMI implementation feels too trial-and-error a lot of the time, especially if an EMMI is camping the small room you need to go through. And scary monsters in games lose a lot of that tension after they kill you once (a tip floated around for horror games is specifically to let the monster kill you once so it's not as frightening anymore) so the multiple deaths players often have to a given EMMI quickly rob them of the actual fear.
yeah they had to go out of their way to make that one collectable without unlocking the item
I think they did it because
I think they wanted to not make every item behind a power bomb block just be a power bomb tank. If power bomb is the last item you unlock in the sequence at the very end of the game, suddenly you have 10 power bomb tanks to go backtrack for and clean up around the map cough zero mission cough.
+8
Handsome CostanzaAsk me about 8bitdoRIP Iwata-sanRegistered Userregular
Btw if anyone is wondering what the Chozo Gallery in the extras menu is:
Spoilers for how it works:
they're unlocked by 100%ing each section, with 1 section equalling 1 art piece. I checked and I've unlocked NONE of them. Looks like I've got some work left to do!
AbsoluteZeroThe new film by Quentin KoopantinoRegistered Userregular
Ok after letting it stew for a while, here's my 2D Metroid ranking.
1. Super
2. Dread
3. Fusion
4. Samus Returns
5. Zero Mission
6. Metroid II
7. Metroid
Dread nearly took the top spot, but the EMMI encounters crank my anxiety levels too high. If I could skip EMMI encounters then Dread would be #1. It gets so much right, but is hampered by a gameplay design that was realized a little too well, because I truly do dread encountering an EMMI. Though to be fair, this is all just a matter of personal preference. I could see Dread being someone's #1.
+3
jungleroomxIt's never too many graves, it's always not enough shovelsRegistered Userregular
Dreads my #1.
The EMMI's on my third time through were cake and just felt like getting a particularly nasty part of a race track down.
I definitely feel Dread would be my #1 if not for the EMMI bits.
Pretty solid list, though I don't know if I've ever played Metroid II. I'd probably put Metroid s little higher, but probably for nostalgia reasons. I played it enough that I had the whole map memorized, which helped.
Maddie: "I named my feet. The left one is flip and the right one is flop. Oh, and also I named my flip-flops."
The Goose of War isn't wrong about saying that destructible terrain blocks showing no indication that they can be broken until you randomly fire at them or use the radar pulse is potentially problematic design. That's pretty much why they added the radar pulse, and I'm sure I was pinging it near constantly after I acquired it, so maybe it would be nice to more intuitively spot every single breakable tile without it. I'm not saying it needs Zelda style cracked walls, but maybe having only a portion of the indistinguishably pristine looking floor be breakable might upset players that play Metroid like Jump N'Shoot Man 1 and refuse to experiment (that video was painful to watch).
0
jungleroomxIt's never too many graves, it's always not enough shovelsRegistered Userregular
The Goose of War isn't wrong about saying that destructible terrain blocks showing no indication that they can be broken until you randomly fire at them or use the radar pulse is potentially problematic design. That's pretty much why they added the radar pulse, and I'm sure I was pinging it near constantly after I acquired it, so maybe it would be nice to more intuitively spot every single breakable tile without it. I'm not saying it needs Zelda style cracked walls, but maybe having only a portion of the indistinguishably pristine looking floor be breakable might upset players that play Metroid like Jump N'Shoot Man 1 and refuse to experiment (that video was painful to watch).
You all should look carefully at the walls and floors. The vast majoirty of them are different tiles, or have background elements lighting them up or demarcating them in a certain way.
jungleroomx on
+5
AbsoluteZeroThe new film by Quentin KoopantinoRegistered Userregular
The Goose of War isn't wrong about saying that destructible terrain blocks showing no indication that they can be broken until you randomly fire at them or use the radar pulse is potentially problematic design. That's pretty much why they added the radar pulse, and I'm sure I was pinging it near constantly after I acquired it, so maybe it would be nice to more intuitively spot every single breakable tile without it. I'm not saying it needs Zelda style cracked walls, but maybe having only a portion of the indistinguishably pristine looking floor be breakable might upset players that play Metroid like Jump N'Shoot Man 1 and refuse to experiment (that video was painful to watch).
You all should look carefully at the walls and floors. The vast majoirty of them are different tiles, or have background elements lighting them up or demarcating them in a certain way.
Or you can clearly see something on the other side of the wall, like an open space or a collectible item, that indicates there has to be a way to get through. Dread signposts the shit out of breakable blocks.
There was always something telling you there was a hidden item around and it was time to use the pulse.
Either an item you could see but couldn't reach, a flashing white square on the map, or a space on the map with no apparent route to it.
I managed 100% without having to look anything up, and I never had to just spam missiles everywhere.
edit: compared to Super where I swear I X-rayed every single tile and only ever found 99%. I've even looked up guides, still can't find what I missed.
I know obviously a bunch of people feel differently but I don't think the EMMI bits ever felt super tense for me. Maybe the first real one just from the novelty. Part of it is that, aside from the clever use of their "ping, ping" sound as a cue they're nearby, they are like, not very conceptually scary to me.
Robutts aren't scary to me, even robutts that can kill me.
Posts
So yeah, take some time away from it and give it another try. And it's totally fine to watch a quick video to pick up a strat or two. I did for some of the bosses and it helped me out a lot.
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
Steam ID
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I think one reason the difficulty/frustration spikes annoy me more than they might in other games is that a big thing I enjoy in the series is the feeling of movement. Spin jump wonkiness aside, Samus has consistently felt great to maneuver through the environment and then suddenly spending half an hour Thunderdomed in a small room with a boss that eats 50 missiles is a big interruption of that.
I was on winter break in college when I played Fusion. I definitely do not have that kind of time anymore.
Dread has toed the line between the games I'll play on a weeknight to unwind and ones I have to reserve for weekends when I have more time and start out in a more relaxed state. I can see this being pushed into the latter camp for many and I'm pretty sure a large part of why I'll still plug away on a worknight is that I'm addicted to collecting upgrade items.
Steam Profile
3DS: 3454-0268-5595 Battle.net: SteelAngel#1772
Approximately one work day for me.
AC:NH Chris from Glosta SW-5173-3598-2899 DA-4749-1014-4697
I'd argue that the only thing that makes Dread not unplayably difficult is the checkpoints immediately outside of bosses. If it worked like any other Metroid game, it would be horrible.
Steam: pazython
Steam: pazython
Turns out my TV wasn't on Game Mode so there was a bit of lag on my button presses! I found out by playing Golf Story and I couldn't hit ANY shot.
Honestly he wasn't that hard once I turned it on. First try I got to his 3rd form. Second try I killed him. Feeling really good about it!
https://www.denofgeek.com/games/metroid-dread-david-jaffe-difficulty-rant-controversy-reactions/
Dude
First, congrats!
Second, what is it with you an accidentally handicapping yourself?
I remember that DS2 run
In my speedrun:
Anyways, I'm definitely gonna finish with a sub four hour clear time but I'm definitely not gonna get sub 3 this run. Also gotta find time to try some proper "all in one go" speedruns.
The universe hates me.
I dunno, I feel like we could all do with giving that man less attention.
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
Steam ID
Twitch Page
But the gameplay in the EMMI sections - especially later on - just grinds everything to a halt while I replay the same 50 yard stretch of game 20 times until I luck out and the fucking robot happens to jog left instead of right. It doesn't feel like I'm getting past them because I'm getting better, it feels like I'm getting lucky, and the environments are often such that making a single mistake is just fatal.
The sections are mercifully short, but the implementation just makes it so it's not tense or scary, just irritating. Everything else about the game is great, but I definitely don't see myself ever replaying this. It's like playing Super Metroid if, every half hour, Jim Carrey showed up to make The Most Annoying Sound in the World for a couple minutes.
The first few sections felt pretty good, so I don't know if they were handled better, or if the novelty just wore off. Either way, blergh.
If it makes you feel any better
Also a tip for dealing with purple EMMI
Give me my Power Bombs god damn it! I stole them fair and square!
I feel similarly plus the dimmer lighting in the zones has gotten in the way at times. I love stealth games but the EMMI implementation feels too trial-and-error a lot of the time, especially if an EMMI is camping the small room you need to go through. And scary monsters in games lose a lot of that tension after they kill you once (a tip floated around for horror games is specifically to let the monster kill you once so it's not as frightening anymore) so the multiple deaths players often have to a given EMMI quickly rob them of the actual fear.
Pretty sure letting you grab those upgrades before unlocking the item itself is a series tradition at this point.
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3DS: 3454-0268-5595 Battle.net: SteelAngel#1772
No the tradition is you get the fucking upgrade. You grab any random early super missile, congrats, you just unlocked super missiles.
Zero Mission forcing you to pick up the "unknown items" was a one-off, and wasn't even a resource.
I think they did it because
Spoilers for how it works:
Resident 8bitdo expert.
Resident hybrid/flap cover expert.
1. Super
2. Dread
3. Fusion
4. Samus Returns
5. Zero Mission
6. Metroid II
7. Metroid
Dread nearly took the top spot, but the EMMI encounters crank my anxiety levels too high. If I could skip EMMI encounters then Dread would be #1. It gets so much right, but is hampered by a gameplay design that was realized a little too well, because I truly do dread encountering an EMMI. Though to be fair, this is all just a matter of personal preference. I could see Dread being someone's #1.
The EMMI's on my third time through were cake and just felt like getting a particularly nasty part of a race track down.
Pretty solid list, though I don't know if I've ever played Metroid II. I'd probably put Metroid s little higher, but probably for nostalgia reasons. I played it enough that I had the whole map memorized, which helped.
You all should look carefully at the walls and floors. The vast majoirty of them are different tiles, or have background elements lighting them up or demarcating them in a certain way.
Or you can clearly see something on the other side of the wall, like an open space or a collectible item, that indicates there has to be a way to get through. Dread signposts the shit out of breakable blocks.
Either an item you could see but couldn't reach, a flashing white square on the map, or a space on the map with no apparent route to it.
I managed 100% without having to look anything up, and I never had to just spam missiles everywhere.
edit: compared to Super where I swear I X-rayed every single tile and only ever found 99%. I've even looked up guides, still can't find what I missed.
Metroid Zero Mission
Metroid Fusion
Another Metroid 2 Remake
Super Metroid
Metroid Dread
Metroid 2: Return of Samus
Metroid
Metroid: Samus Returns
Metroid: Other M
Robutts aren't scary to me, even robutts that can kill me.