As was foretold, we've added advertisements to the forums! If you have questions, or if you encounter any bugs, please visit this thread: https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/240191/forum-advertisement-faq-and-reports-thread/

[Metroid] Metroid 5: Dread is live! KEEP SPOILERS HIDDEN! Prime 4 still in the works.

16263646567

Posts

  • Warlock82Warlock82 Never pet a burning dog Registered User regular
    edited November 16
    Note, spoilers for like, last boss and some other stuff, so probably don't watch unless you've beaten it

    Warlock82 on
    Switch: 2143-7130-1359 | 3DS: 4983-4927-6699 | Steam: warlock82 | PSN: Warlock2282
    Big DookieStormwatcherAbsoluteZero
  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular


    Hard mode in 1:15. Spoilers obviously. Skips both Varia and Gravity. Some of the tricks are nuts, especially early Screw Attack. I bet they will whittle this down to sub 1 hour eventually.

    cs6f034fsffl.jpg
    KoopahTroopah
  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    I think the glitch used for skipping Varia and Gravity just got patched out.

    Steam: Polaritie
    3DS: 0473-8507-2652
    Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
    PSN: AbEntropy
  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    Polaritie wrote: »
    I think the glitch used for skipping Varia and Gravity just got patched out.

    Huh. I'm surprised they would patch something out that is highly unlikely to affect normal play-throughs. Seems like taking a risk patching out something that's only used by the speed running community and would otherwise go unnoticed.

    cs6f034fsffl.jpg
  • AshtonDragonAshtonDragon AKA The Nix Registered User regular
    Polaritie wrote: »
    I think the glitch used for skipping Varia and Gravity just got patched out.

    Huh. I'm surprised they would patch something out that is highly unlikely to affect normal play-throughs. Seems like taking a risk patching out something that's only used by the speed running community and would otherwise go unnoticed.

    When I looked it up, the patch notes specifically said that they decided to patch it because it could be done accidentally. IIRC the one that was patched just involves going into morph ball at the right time as you enter an EMMI door, which results in Samus being completely invincible until you change zones. Definitely very unlikely to happen, and I'd hate to risk upsetting the speedrun community, but I can see why they did it.

    Curious to know how well it was received.

  • LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
    A bug is a bug.

    As someone who works in the software industry as a quality tester, I would always push for the quality of the game to go up via a patch. Granted, I do not work in the video game industry, and so I don't have to deal with customers who adopt bugs as part of their play-strategy. But to me, Quality > All. And if a bug is found, patch it and fix it.

    As someone who has watched the Games Done Quick competitions and stuff, it always infuriates me when people use glitches so egregious that they are literally no longer playing the game. Take for example the speed run from a couple years ago on Elder Scrolls Oblivion, where a guy basically uses a reload glitch to get through a locked door at the start of the game, which allows him to bypass like 99.999% of the game and "beat" Oblivion within like 4 minutes and seconds. That isn't playing Oblivion at that point. That stuff bugs me.

    What does impress me is speedrunners who play with 0 glitches and play the game as the devs intended. Even if a bug exists and is not patched out, I'd rather watch someone play the game at a very high level without exploiting glitches to shave time.

    Arteenrahkeesh2000TamerBill
  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    My opinion on glitches basically comes down to how much it breaks it the game and how entertaining it is. Boost ball nonsense in Prime that lets you collect every spawned-in upgrade at once for instance is ridiculously silly to watch.

    Most games will just have categories for things - like OoT has a well known wrongwarp right to the end of the game that reduces it to just clearing the first dungeon. (To say nothing of more recent nonsense that's basically human-feasible ACE)

    Steam: Polaritie
    3DS: 0473-8507-2652
    Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
    PSN: AbEntropy
  • WhelkWhelk Registered User regular
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    A bug is a bug.

    As someone who works in the software industry as a quality tester, I would always push for the quality of the game to go up via a patch. Granted, I do not work in the video game industry, and so I don't have to deal with customers who adopt bugs as part of their play-strategy. But to me, Quality > All. And if a bug is found, patch it and fix it.

    As someone who has watched the Games Done Quick competitions and stuff, it always infuriates me when people use glitches so egregious that they are literally no longer playing the game. Take for example the speed run from a couple years ago on Elder Scrolls Oblivion, where a guy basically uses a reload glitch to get through a locked door at the start of the game, which allows him to bypass like 99.999% of the game and "beat" Oblivion within like 4 minutes and seconds. That isn't playing Oblivion at that point. That stuff bugs me.

    What does impress me is speedrunners who play with 0 glitches and play the game as the devs intended. Even if a bug exists and is not patched out, I'd rather watch someone play the game at a very high level without exploiting glitches to shave time.

    I do think those videos are funny, but I don't think of them as like beating the game

  • jungleroomxjungleroomx It's not a "weapon art", it's an ANIMATION Registered User regular
    The Sekiro speed run where it’s 75% air swimming is so fucking boring, for example

    BigJoeMKoopahTroopah
  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    The Sekiro speed run where it’s 75% air swimming is so fucking boring, for example

    Conversely, I have no issue with the quick kill on the optional endgame boss by baiting into leaping off the level. Good riddance to that thing.

    Steam: Polaritie
    3DS: 0473-8507-2652
    Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
    PSN: AbEntropy
    jungleroomx
  • TcheldorTcheldor Registered User regular
    The Sekiro speed run where it’s 75% air swimming is so fucking boring, for example

    This is why, generally, speedrunners break things down into different categories, so things that aren't really fun don't get done.

    League of Legends: Sorakanmyworld
    FFXIV: Tchel Fay
    Nintendo ID: Tortalius
    Steam: Tortalius
    Stream: twitch.tv/tortalius
    AbsoluteZeroNightslyrIncenjucarNeveronKoopahTroopahFencingsax
  • TaramoorTaramoor Storyteller Registered User regular
    Everybody has a different threshold for how buggy they like their speedruns and it varies from game to game and even from Runner to Runner since I've seen super entertaining runs where the game barely gets played and super boring ones where they 100% it with nothing more than bonkers tactics and madcap skill.

    I mean, the Super Mario World stuff where they're essentially recoding the game on the fly is fascinating, but I'd much rather watch a 100% TAS of Secret of Evermore or some guy who drew the short straw and has to beat Sneak King.

    Also the Super Ghouls 'n Ghosts run where the guy is required to pick up every weapon that drops, so he can't just use the Dagger or whichever one is the best.

    nUzGRMY.gif
    twitch.tv/Taramoor
    @TaramoorPlays
    AbsoluteZero
  • DrovekDrovek Registered User regular
    On the one hand, "warp to credits" might sometimes be boring to watch, but the process of getting there can be really interesting.

    Funnily enough, I just stumbled my way into this video a few days ago and I loved it. The sheer challenge of it is something that could never be tackled by "standard" means.

    steam_sig.png
    ( < . . .
    AbsoluteZero
  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    There is another hidden attack on Kraid if you sequence break. This time for the flash shift. Samus must flash shift into Kraid when his eyes flash to trigger it. Not an insta-kill, but still neat.

    cs6f034fsffl.jpg
    MNC DoverBahamutZEROCurly_BracePolaritieErlecDrovekWhelkStempyAndy JoeKoopahTroopahBigJoeMGennenalyse RuebenSteel AngelCantidoStormwatcherNightslyrjkylefultonTalith
  • MNC DoverMNC Dover Full-time Voice Actor Kirkland, WARegistered User regular
    This is the game that keeps on giving.

    Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
    Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
    Steam ID
    Twitch Page
    AbsoluteZeroIanatorDrovekAndy JoeKoopahTroopahGennenalyse RuebenCantidoStormwatcherjkylefulton
  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    Poor Kraid is just a punching bag for speed runners.

    Steam: Polaritie
    3DS: 0473-8507-2652
    Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
    PSN: AbEntropy
    MNC DoverVyolynceBig DookieAbsoluteZeroDrovekAndy JoeKoopahTroopahAthenorDysOneAngryPossumGennenalyse RuebenSteel AngelNightslyrjkylefulton
  • KoopahTroopahKoopahTroopah The koopas, the troopas. Philadelphia, PARegistered User regular
    The rewarding cinematics for speedrunners is fucking dope.

    Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
    Switch: 1639-6388-9968- PSN: Koopah089 - Extra-Life 2021 Info!
    AbsoluteZeroTomantaOneAngryPossum
  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    The sad thing is that the speedrunners won't do it, because they can get higher DPS by just pressing the fire button once every frame (seriously, I don't know how they manage to spam beam shots like they do, my bones won't support that frequency without shattering under the strain).

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
    MNC DoverAbsoluteZero
  • rahkeesh2000rahkeesh2000 Registered User regular
    klemming wrote: »
    The sad thing is that the speedrunners won't do it, because they can get higher DPS by just pressing the fire button once every frame (seriously, I don't know how they manage to spam beam shots like they do, my bones won't support that frequency without shattering under the strain).

    As I mentioned before, 3rd party controllers with turbo buttons are a thing.

  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    edited November 25
    klemming wrote: »
    The sad thing is that the speedrunners won't do it, because they can get higher DPS by just pressing the fire button once every frame (seriously, I don't know how they manage to spam beam shots like they do, my bones won't support that frequency without shattering under the strain).

    As I mentioned before, 3rd party controllers with turbo buttons are a thing.

    Speedrunners don't use them because they're too slow.

    klemming on
    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
    AbsoluteZero
  • TcheldorTcheldor Registered User regular
    klemming wrote: »
    The sad thing is that the speedrunners won't do it, because they can get higher DPS by just pressing the fire button once every frame (seriously, I don't know how they manage to spam beam shots like they do, my bones won't support that frequency without shattering under the strain).

    As I mentioned before, 3rd party controllers with turbo buttons are a thing.

    usually those are forbidden for runs.

    League of Legends: Sorakanmyworld
    FFXIV: Tchel Fay
    Nintendo ID: Tortalius
    Steam: Tortalius
    Stream: twitch.tv/tortalius
    AbsoluteZeroAshtonDragonNaphtali
  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    So I picked up where I left off and cleaned up the remaining few shinespark puzzles to get 100% and take down the final boss again. It was brutal. I know I haven't played for a couple weeks, but I felt like I had 2 left hands trying to do this shit. Just couldn't get the timing right on inputs to save my life. I kept at it though and eventually persevered.

    I got really, really pissed at those shinespark puzzles. What masochist designed these?

    Welp. I was rather embarrassed to discover I forgot to put my TV into game mode and was doing all this with a ton of input lag. I almost wish I could roll back my save file and try those puzzles again without input lag. I bet they are actually reasonable once you figure out the solution. Oh well.

    cs6f034fsffl.jpg
    IceBurner
  • gavindelgavindel The reason all your software is brokenRegistered User regular
    edited November 26
    This final boss isn't playing around. Kicking my butt one end of the arena to the other.

    Update: Killed the boss. I found the easiest way to consistently deal damage was to focus on evasion into the counter sequence.

    gavindel on
    I've got a book! Angels, innovations, and the hubris of tiny things: Seraphim
    Dark Raven X
  • SageinaRageSageinaRage Registered User regular
    I'm kinda behind, I'm playing through Fusion now for the first time, so I can get to Dread soon hopefully. I'm enjoying it, the extra story bits and explanation help make up for the increased linearity. I was doing pretty well on the bosses, but I just ran into a brick wall
    In the form of the spider boss in the reactor core, underneath where the ship is. This thing is ridiculous! The first time I died in like 3 hits of it dropping me, all right in a row. It happened so quickly I thought it was an intentional loss.

    I really don't know how you're supposed to effectively dodge this thing, the only way I can do it is once it starts moving faster, and stops hitting as much of the ground, and I can just hang out in morph ball mode underneath as it just hits one diagonal line pattern. But by that point I'm already down to like 2 bars.

    It also seems kind of horseshit that it can often grab me twice in a row without me actually getting to escape at all. Last attempt it was 3 times in a row, so I was basically almost dead as soon as I arrived. Combine that with not being able to save before the fight, and if it weren't for the virtual console save states, I'm sure I would have thrown this game out the window already.

    sig.gif
  • CantidoCantido Registered User regular
    I just got the Varia Suit in Samus Returns, and am lost and frustrated. Between the game laying on the parry really thick and a total of four enemies out on the field, I'm thinking of giving up.

    3DS Friendcode 5413-1311-3767
  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    I'm kinda behind, I'm playing through Fusion now for the first time, so I can get to Dread soon hopefully. I'm enjoying it, the extra story bits and explanation help make up for the increased linearity. I was doing pretty well on the bosses, but I just ran into a brick wall
    In the form of the spider boss in the reactor core, underneath where the ship is. This thing is ridiculous! The first time I died in like 3 hits of it dropping me, all right in a row. It happened so quickly I thought it was an intentional loss.

    I really don't know how you're supposed to effectively dodge this thing, the only way I can do it is once it starts moving faster, and stops hitting as much of the ground, and I can just hang out in morph ball mode underneath as it just hits one diagonal line pattern. But by that point I'm already down to like 2 bars.

    It also seems kind of horseshit that it can often grab me twice in a row without me actually getting to escape at all. Last attempt it was 3 times in a row, so I was basically almost dead as soon as I arrived. Combine that with not being able to save before the fight, and if it weren't for the virtual console save states, I'm sure I would have thrown this game out the window already.
    I believe if you morph ball in the left corner it can't grab you. Be patient and take your shots carefully. The game is trying to get you to panic and run around the arena, which puts the spider at an advantage.

    cs6f034fsffl.jpg
  • SageinaRageSageinaRage Registered User regular
    I'm kinda behind, I'm playing through Fusion now for the first time, so I can get to Dread soon hopefully. I'm enjoying it, the extra story bits and explanation help make up for the increased linearity. I was doing pretty well on the bosses, but I just ran into a brick wall
    In the form of the spider boss in the reactor core, underneath where the ship is. This thing is ridiculous! The first time I died in like 3 hits of it dropping me, all right in a row. It happened so quickly I thought it was an intentional loss.

    I really don't know how you're supposed to effectively dodge this thing, the only way I can do it is once it starts moving faster, and stops hitting as much of the ground, and I can just hang out in morph ball mode underneath as it just hits one diagonal line pattern. But by that point I'm already down to like 2 bars.

    It also seems kind of horseshit that it can often grab me twice in a row without me actually getting to escape at all. Last attempt it was 3 times in a row, so I was basically almost dead as soon as I arrived. Combine that with not being able to save before the fight, and if it weren't for the virtual console save states, I'm sure I would have thrown this game out the window already.
    I believe if you morph ball in the left corner it can't grab you. Be patient and take your shots carefully. The game is trying to get you to panic and run around the arena, which puts the spider at an advantage.
    Yeah, I tried it again and managed to beat it in one shot, with basically that strategy. I thought I remembered it grabbing me just as easily in morph ball mode, but I guess not.

    It seems like it's not all that difficult in the end, there's just a specific trick to it - but it's still kind of egregious to me to be so far from a save point. That whole following section where the doors don't open and you can't get to a recharge station also sucks. I don't appreciate having to go back to farming enemies for health again, especially when it's so stingy with it. The X parasite collection is a cool idea but collecting them effectively often requires charging forward into groups of enemies, or into areas you can't really see, which doesn't usually work out well.

    sig.gif
    AbsoluteZeroBahamutZERO
  • BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User regular
    yeah that section is a real pain in the ass

    BahamutZERO.gif
    AbsoluteZero
  • ImperfectImperfect Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    Just beat it. Really enjoyed it in general, but...

    Am I the only one who was upset about how linear it felt? Like, every time I got a new upgrade and I wanted to go around the map, scratching at all the corners, a giant chunk of it was locked off to force me to go forwards, instead.

    Sure, I could have gone and found what limited amount of them that my new upgrade minus the lockoff would allow, but that felt so dispiriting, so I saved it for the end, and then when I got to the end, I just didn't want to go and do a whole lap across all the areas and navigate all the elevators and such to try to figure out what pathways let me actually get where.

  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    Imperfect wrote: »
    Just beat it. Really enjoyed it in general, but...

    Am I the only one who was upset about how linear it felt? Like, every time I got a new upgrade and I wanted to go around the map, scratching at all the corners, a giant chunk of it was locked off to force me to go forwards, instead.

    Sure, I could have gone and found what limited amount of them that my new upgrade minus the lockoff would allow, but that felt so dispiriting, so I saved it for the end, and then when I got to the end, I just didn't want to go and do a whole lap across all the areas and navigate all the elevators and such to try to figure out what pathways let me actually get where.

    I do wish they let you explore a bit more freely at times, but it was appreciated to a degree once I realized what they were intending with the artificial roadblocks (keep you from getting too lost at times on where to progress). I still ran into a few spots where it wasn't entirely obvious as to where to go next, and there are some sequence breaks you can do still if you know what you're doing (see speedruns, at least the ones on the current patch that can't abuse the old tactics of going invulnerable to damage or camera out of bounds tricks).

    B.net: Naphtali#1830 | Steam | Nintendo ID: Naphtali | PSN: EI-Naphtali | Wish List
    BahamutZERO
  • BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User regular
    edited November 30
    I thought they struck an acceptable balance between fusion's "lock you in a small subsection of the map to keep the possibility space of where you need search to progress small" and super's "maybe sometimes we'll get you stuck in a deeper part of the map for a little bit until you find a couple upgrades to be able to backtrack out again"

    not PERFECT but... acceptable

    BahamutZERO on
    BahamutZERO.gif
    IncenjucarNaphtaliAbsoluteZeroCantidoShadow Demon
  • IncenjucarIncenjucar VChatter Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    From an audience acquisition standpoinr, I think they made the right choice. I would have loved more freedom and exploration, but my first exposure to Metroid was *Metroid*.

    KoopahTroopahAbsoluteZeroHappylilElfBahamutZERO
  • KoopahTroopahKoopahTroopah The koopas, the troopas. Philadelphia, PARegistered User regular
    I felt the same way as I was playing it but looking back I enjoyed that it was as linear as it was. So many open world games out now that are just free to do what you want. A little more freedom and less directing could have been fine, but I like the constant changing scenery and directed approach Dread took.

    Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
    Switch: 1639-6388-9968- PSN: Koopah089 - Extra-Life 2021 Info!
  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    I honestly wouldn't mind if they did let you have more freedom, but it wasn't like other Metroid games don't also roadblock you at times (even Super does it, to some extent but not as much as Fusion or Dread).

    B.net: Naphtali#1830 | Steam | Nintendo ID: Naphtali | PSN: EI-Naphtali | Wish List
    BahamutZERO
  • AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist The Skies of HiigaraRegistered User regular
    edited November 30
    With regards to the linearity in Samus Returns, it can not be overstated on how much of that is due to it being a remake of the original Metroid 2, which was probably the most linear Metroid game in the series.

    Because they were taking the basic Metroid formula and giving it a second go-around, only this time on a game boy with a very small screen and shorter overall playtimes, they pretty much eliminated backtracking altogether.

    The structure of the game is built around a single central corridor that goes down through most of the game. This corridor only has 1-2 branching points, and those branches will always be blocked by lava unless you have cleared the previous section's Metroids. So the exploration/backtracking then gets limited to the sub-areas where the Metroids are - which are big, but not enormous. All the better for a system where you don't have a map function like is now standard in this style of game.

    Spoiler: Map of Metroid II:
    KHNmNMmh.gif

    If you can hear the music, you'll always know when you are in the central corridor. One of the best musical themes in the Metroid series is played there. There's a little bit of visual difference as well, but it is harder to pick out on the limited color scheme of the GB game.







    Edit: Looking at that map.. it's actually really cool how much the SR388 map twists over itself. Something you don't see as much with modern 2d metroidvanias in my experience.

    Athenor on
    He/Him
    BahamutZERO
  • DelzhandDelzhand Hard to miss. Registered User regular
    I think the only thing I found frustrating was that I felt like the world closed up behind me too often. I like being able to decide when I want to go back and clean up missed items.

    m44li7vqs3f7.png
    NaphtaliAbsoluteZeroImperfect
  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    Yes! I finally got this new item, now I can go back and... awwww.

    cs6f034fsffl.jpg
    rahkeesh2000
  • HappylilElfHappylilElf Registered User regular
    I finished Metroid II on Gameboy and the weird thing is that it felt incredibly claustrophobic because of the small screen until suddenly... it just didn't.

    At some point, I can't really remember when it happened, it was like I was visualizing entire rooms in my head and seeing them even though the screen was only displaying a tiny bit.

    Of course then I tried to go back and play it a decade and later and I lasted maybe five minutes before noping out :P

  • ImperfectImperfect Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    Yeah, that's a better way to phrase it. Not that it was linear, but that the glee of finally finding the item that unlocks a challenge I _know_ about was usually immediately met with the frustration of knowing that I couldn't actually get back there because like... a heat-powered door just shut or something. I just kinda stopped caring about going back for stuff, because I knew I'd probably be blocked by _something_ along the way.

    BahamutZEROSteel AngelAbsoluteZero
  • BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User regular
    yeah arbitrarily scripted environment block-offs behind you rubbed me a little bit the wrong way, particularly in the first area where they leaned on it heavily to keep you moving forward through the tutorial. Felt inelegant.

    BahamutZERO.gif
    ImperfectAbsoluteZero
Sign In or Register to comment.