Just have to make it through the first half of the first season. That was bit rough.
+2
minor incidentexpert in a dying fieldnjRegistered Userregular
Rebels has at least 2 of my favorite lightsaber fights in all of Star Wars. It did a great job of always having those feel weighty and super well choreographed.
Everything looks beautiful when you're young and pretty
0
Tynnanseldom correct, never unsureRegistered Userregular
Just have to make it through the first half of the first season. That was bit rough.
Is it skippable or necessary for context?
I think it's helpful to watch for context, but the gist of it is that Ezra is almost a complete Aladdin expy and he only joins the Ghost crew grudgingly until Kanan realizes he has Force affinity.
It also does a lot to establish Lothal as a setting, which becomes important later.
+9
Bloods EndBlade of TyshallePunch dimensionRegistered Userregular
The last 3 episodes of season 3 of rebels is maybe the most star wars and I am 9 years old again whenever I watch them.
And its where Kevin kiner gets a lot more experimental with the soundtrack which lead to the auditory bliss of totj and bad batch
I've loved Mon Mothma since I saw ROTJ for the first time. I loved her in all the EU stuff I read a hundred years ago and oh my God I love this incarnation in Andor.
Which person, exactly, decided that the rebellion's military leaders should be senators?
Just..why
The most likely answer? They were the highest “ranking” folks who managed to stay hidden and alive. The actual military leaders of various cells in the rebellion mostly get murdered real hard (as Andor and Rogue One demonstrated).
Everything looks beautiful when you're young and pretty
Which person, exactly, decided that the rebellion's military leaders should be senators?
Just..why
They aren’t the top of the military chain of command per se, but why would the folks with access to capital and planetary authority, with networks built over a lifetime in power at the Galactic level not be calling some of the shots?
It is neat fantasy how the majority of the cool regal aristocrats and most of the long established bureaucracy somehow ended up not being fascists , it's probably the part of star wars that reeks the most of fantasy to me
+1
FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
It is neat fantasy how the majority of the cool regal aristocrats and most of the long established bureaucracy somehow ended up not being fascists , it's probably the part of star wars that reeks the most of fantasy to me
Most of the bureaucracy became the Empire what the fuck are you talking about?
It is neat fantasy how the majority of the cool regal aristocrats and most of the long established bureaucracy somehow ended up not being fascists , it's probably the part of star wars that reeks the most of fantasy to me
Most of the bureaucracy became the Empire what the fuck are you talking about?
Would you prefer "this is a bad take"? Or "I dispute your conclusion, because"?
The Rebel Alliance includes political leaders who are genuinely concerned and committed to freedom and the common good. If you find this more fantastic than the laser swords, starfighters, and the mystical energy binding all living things, I don't know what to tell you.
Commander Zoom on
Steam, Warframe: Megajoule
+2
DepressperadoI just wanted to see you laughingin the pizza rainRegistered Userregular
How about just, "I don't think that's true. Most of the bureaucracy became the Empire."
0
minor incidentexpert in a dying fieldnjRegistered Userregular
I always distinctly got the impression the non-fascist abiding political leaders in the senate were the smaller minority and were, as Andor showed, largely considered to be ineffectual and not worth the blowback of actively crushing.
Everything looks beautiful when you're young and pretty
+13
FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
I apologize, I did not mean for that to come off as hostile
+2
LasbrookIt takes a lot to make a stewWhen it comes to me and youRegistered Userregular
It would be kinda hard to have carried over a lot of the existing military leaders from the clone wars considering the Jedi purge and all.
minor incidentexpert in a dying fieldnjRegistered Userregular
Jedi weren’t that ubiquitous when they were around. Like, what, a few hundred? A few thousand at most? In a galaxy of hundreds of systems and trillions of beings? Most people had probably never been on the same planet as Jedi before.
Everything looks beautiful when you're young and pretty
The 20 years from Jedi purge to Han saying it's all nonsense in A New Hope only became a thing when the prequels became very specific about the timeline.
So I just count it as one of the many things the prequels screwed up and try to disregard it.
+4
Zonugal(He/Him) The Holiday ArmadilloI'm Santa's representative for all the southern states. And Mexico!Registered Userregular
Jedi weren’t that ubiquitous when they were around. Like, what, a few hundred? A few thousand at most? In a galaxy of hundreds of systems and trillions of beings? Most people had probably never been on the same planet as Jedi before.
Jedi are so rare prior to the Clone Wars that Anakin only knows them through the context of galactic mythology.
Anakin: You're a Jedi Knight, aren't you? Qui-Gon Jinn: What makes you think that? Anakin: I saw your laser sword. Only Jedi carry that kind of weapon. Qui-Gon Jinn: Perhaps I killed a Jedi and took it from him. Anakin: I don't think so. No one can kill a Jedi. Qui-Gon Jinn: I wish that were so.
The Clone Wars really throws a wrench in it all, because apparently Obi-Wan & Anakin becomes galactic superheroes for their war-time deeds.
+3
Olivawgood name, isn't it?the foot of mt fujiRegistered Userregular
Honestly the timeline being so short both helps and hurts in different ways
On the one hand it implies that for a lot of people life under the Republic wasn’t much different, that certain systems were already in place and the transition to empire was merely a heightening and amplification of forces that were already there
On the other hand the fact that the timeline is so short means that people lived under the yoke of the Emperor for all of like… 17 years or so, which just feels weird! Like it should be longer, it feels like it should be this monolithic and entrenched thing that our heroes must fight against, and the scale of time for an entire Galaxy especially just seems like it should be longer for that
The Jedi stuff doesn’t bother me as much because like, if there was one Jedi temple, even if the temple held like a hundred thousand Jedi, galaxies are big! Jedi being mythical figures almost never seen basically makes sense, if you think about it at scale, but it’s just that in the movies we see, Jedi are a dime a dozen and flash their sabers around constantly, so it’s way less special to us. Which is a legit problem if you want to have that worldbuilding, because the audience’s experience is so different it makes it seem silly
It would be kinda hard to have carried over a lot of the existing military leaders from the clone wars considering the Jedi purge and all.
That's where the whole timeline falls apart for me and I have to just kind of ignore it.
I had to wiki this, but bear with me.
19 BBY Order 66 launches and then 5 BBY, fourteen years later, Andor starts. 0 BBY, A New Hope Happens.
It just feels all so fast. Everyone goes from 'Jedi are Everywhere' to 'Jedi are a Legend' in 20 years.
Jedi were never everywhere. Even at their peak they were like 10,000 people in the entire galaxy. And most of those weren't Knights, but low level functionaries and what not.
The average person has almost certainly never seen a Jedi in action. So when they all get wiped out and likely the empire starts a propaganda campaign about how they were all seditious traitors and their religion is bullshit and magic tricks, most people believe them, especially someone like Han who literally grew up in a post-Jedi environment.
Honestly the timeline being so short both helps and hurts in different ways
On the one hand it implies that for a lot of people life under the Republic wasn’t much different, that certain systems were already in place and the transition to empire was merely a heightening and amplification of forces that were already there
On the other hand the fact that the timeline is so short means that people lived under the yoke of the Emperor for all of like… 17 years or so, which just feels weird! Like it should be longer, it feels like it should be this monolithic and entrenched thing that our heroes must fight against, and the scale of time for an entire Galaxy especially just seems like it should be longer for that
The Jedi stuff doesn’t bother me as much because like, if there was one Jedi temple, even if the temple held like a hundred thousand Jedi, galaxies are big! Jedi being mythical figures almost never seen basically makes sense, if you think about it at scale, but it’s just that in the movies we see, Jedi are a dime a dozen and flash their sabers around constantly, so it’s way less special to us. Which is a legit problem if you want to have that worldbuilding, because the audience’s experience is so different it makes it seem silly
Against the millennial span of the Republic, the 20 years of Palpatine's Empire is like... an interregnum. A blip.
Honestly the timeline being so short both helps and hurts in different ways
On the one hand it implies that for a lot of people life under the Republic wasn’t much different, that certain systems were already in place and the transition to empire was merely a heightening and amplification of forces that were already there
On the other hand the fact that the timeline is so short means that people lived under the yoke of the Emperor for all of like… 17 years or so, which just feels weird! Like it should be longer, it feels like it should be this monolithic and entrenched thing that our heroes must fight against, and the scale of time for an entire Galaxy especially just seems like it should be longer for that
The Jedi stuff doesn’t bother me as much because like, if there was one Jedi temple, even if the temple held like a hundred thousand Jedi, galaxies are big! Jedi being mythical figures almost never seen basically makes sense, if you think about it at scale, but it’s just that in the movies we see, Jedi are a dime a dozen and flash their sabers around constantly, so it’s way less special to us. Which is a legit problem if you want to have that worldbuilding, because the audience’s experience is so different it makes it seem silly
Against the millennial span of the Republic, the 20 years of Palpatine's Empire is like... an interregnum. A blip.
The thing is for a lot of places, the difference between the Republic and the Empire is that the Empire flies more ships and you see Imperial Army patrolling the streets instead of whatever local peacekeeping force you used to have. Maybe if some shit goes down, a squad of Stormies shows up and everyone shits the bed.
Honestly, other than it being more overtly fashy, the Empire was much "Meet the New Boss, same as the old boss" for the galaxy at large unless you live on Coruscant or another galactic hotspot, or have to constantly engage with galactic bureaucracy/politics.
"Go down, kick ass, and set yourselves up as gods, that's our Prime Directive!"
Hail Hydra
+3
Olivawgood name, isn't it?the foot of mt fujiRegistered Userregular
Honestly the timeline being so short both helps and hurts in different ways
On the one hand it implies that for a lot of people life under the Republic wasn’t much different, that certain systems were already in place and the transition to empire was merely a heightening and amplification of forces that were already there
On the other hand the fact that the timeline is so short means that people lived under the yoke of the Emperor for all of like… 17 years or so, which just feels weird! Like it should be longer, it feels like it should be this monolithic and entrenched thing that our heroes must fight against, and the scale of time for an entire Galaxy especially just seems like it should be longer for that
The Jedi stuff doesn’t bother me as much because like, if there was one Jedi temple, even if the temple held like a hundred thousand Jedi, galaxies are big! Jedi being mythical figures almost never seen basically makes sense, if you think about it at scale, but it’s just that in the movies we see, Jedi are a dime a dozen and flash their sabers around constantly, so it’s way less special to us. Which is a legit problem if you want to have that worldbuilding, because the audience’s experience is so different it makes it seem silly
Against the millennial span of the Republic, the 20 years of Palpatine's Empire is like... an interregnum. A blip.
The thing is for a lot of places, the difference between the Republic and the Empire is that the Empire flies more ships and you see Imperial Army patrolling the streets instead of whatever local peacekeeping force you used to have. Maybe if some shit goes down, a squad of Stormies shows up and everyone shits the bed.
Honestly, other than it being more overtly fashy, the Empire was much "Meet the New Boss, same as the old boss" for the galaxy at large unless you live on Coruscant or another galactic hotspot, or have to constantly engage with galactic bureaucracy/politics.
See but then they undercut that by showing us imperial outposts being set up that are cruel to indigenous folks and all of this sort of stuff, and it feels like it belongs in a universe where the empire has been around for at least a whole generation, maybe a century
I think part of the reason Star Wars has problems like this is when you have things that invite deeper analysis, alongside stuff that completely rebuffs the idea of deeper analysis, it can’t fit together as a cohesive whole and we should just stop trying to make it fit, y’know
ShadowenSnores in the morningLoserdomRegistered Userregular
The timeframe ended up having to be so short because of "No, Luke. I am your father."
Either Luke (and later Leia) were about the same age (up to nine-ish months younger) as Anakin's fall from grace, or their mom was evil too and he was able to love someone after becoming Vader (which kind of undercuts the "son's love turns him good" thing, and also would probably mean that Ben and Yoda straight up kidnapped Luke and Leia from their parents)...or the story has implications.
Those are good points about the size of the galaxy, but that galaxy (until Andor) has always felt so small. You can't swing a dead wamp rat on Tatooine without hitting a Jedi.
Those are good points about the size of the galaxy, but that galaxy (until Andor) has always felt so small. You can't swing a dead wamp rat on Tatooine without hitting a Jedi.
I mean you could if Ben would just learn to fucking duck out of the way every once in a while
Lanz on
+1
DepressperadoI just wanted to see you laughingin the pizza rainRegistered Userregular
I once sent a short story in to be put up on some Star Wars website and I was telling my actual published friend about how I specifically didn't use any established planets and he was like "Star Wars. You wrote a Star Wars story that was entirely original material?" "Well, I mean it's got blasters and stuff, I reference a lot of old Star Wars media." "You should really have set it on Tatooine or something, they're not gonna use it."
I think the transition is supposed to be mostly drastic during the Clone Wars, there wasn't even a standing army before then, just a big ol' corrupt bureacracy that comes off as less oppressive than it is just kinda shitty and ineffectual. Then you have a big war, Republic army is in more and more places and more and more harsh, and by the end of it the transition to Empire is mostly just a name change and new uniforms. I liked how Andor showed that a bit as well in some of the flashbacks-
Clem getting killed and young Cassian ending up in jail was against clone troopers, not yet stormtroopers.
I clearly remember a time, all the way until I was working in my first job out of college in fact, where the US military was an entirely defensive, static, “peacekeeping” force that, barring a couple weekends of misadventure in Central America, were really not in the business of actively dealing death.
Today I work with more than one person for whom the US military has been actively holding formerly sovereign ground, policing the locals there, killing people and blowing things up for inscrutable reasons and without much accountability to the people being policed and/or blown up, for the entirety of their lives. That’s just what “the US military” is to them.
Granted, I live on Coruscant in the USA so I experience very little of the actual difference in the first person, but it’s no less real for my insulation from it.
That change is only twenty years’ difference. Luke is not even twenty when we meet him in ANH. Palpatine never quite got to the “…and then, we shall have peace” he desired in Revenge of the Sith; things would have gotten so much, much worse.
If anything, the fact that most of the Republic was in a state where all it took to fall to corporatist and fascist dystopia was a dedicated push to put the right people at the controls of all the existing systems is an even stronger condemnation of the Jedi Order’s final stagnation, rather than a stretching of credulity, for me.
_
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+9
Olivawgood name, isn't it?the foot of mt fujiRegistered Userregular
edited December 2022
Hey, real question: is Andor the first time a “canonical” thing has used the BBY dating system? At least, on film and not in a novel?
Because frankly it’s neat and all but I do wish Star Wars had a better universal calendar system, it’s my one big worldbuilding quibble with a setting that I normally avoid being pedantic about because it feels like something the people in the universe would have and they just… somehow never mention it for the audience’s benefit!
Hey, real question: is Andor the first time a “canonical” thing has used the BBY dating system? At least, on film and not in a novel?
Because frankly it’s neat and all but I do wish Star Wars had a better universal calendar system, it’s my one big worldbuilding quibble with a setting that I normally avoid being pedantic about because it feels like something the people in the universe would have and they just… somehow never mention it for the audience’s benefit!
pretty sure it's the first time they've put BBY/ABY onscreen
weirdly enough there is an in-setting calendar that also shows up in Andor (it's on the important bricks). It's been around for a while but is, irritatingly, super underutilized.
Hey, real question: is Andor the first time a “canonical” thing has used the BBY dating system? At least, on film and not in a novel?
Because frankly it’s neat and all but I do wish Star Wars had a better universal calendar system, it’s my one big worldbuilding quibble with a setting that I normally avoid being pedantic about because it feels like something the people in the universe would have and they just… somehow never mention it for the audience’s benefit!
pretty sure it's the first time they've put BBY/ABY onscreen
weirdly enough there is an in-setting calendar that also shows up in Andor (it's on the important bricks). It's been around for a while but is, irritatingly, super underutilized.
and was invented almost entirely because someone noted the absence of one and that it was weird.
but I suppose that's the inevitable (out of universe) result of starting the entire setting "in the middle" with an exciting and in-universe significant event. Especially for those of us who were around in 1977, it always comes back around to what we now call Episode IV, but was once simply Star Wars (all of it).
Posts
It wasn't perfect but when it hit its high notes it was easily some of the best Star Wars of the time.
Is it skippable or necessary for context?
I think it's helpful to watch for context, but the gist of it is that Ezra is almost a complete Aladdin expy and he only joins the Ghost crew grudgingly until Kanan realizes he has Force affinity.
It also does a lot to establish Lothal as a setting, which becomes important later.
And its where Kevin kiner gets a lot more experimental with the soundtrack which lead to the auditory bliss of totj and bad batch
Which person, exactly, decided that the rebellion's military leaders should be senators?
Just..why
The most likely answer? They were the highest “ranking” folks who managed to stay hidden and alive. The actual military leaders of various cells in the rebellion mostly get murdered real hard (as Andor and Rogue One demonstrated).
They aren’t the top of the military chain of command per se, but why would the folks with access to capital and planetary authority, with networks built over a lifetime in power at the Galactic level not be calling some of the shots?
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Most of the bureaucracy became the Empire what the fuck are you talking about?
That level of hostility isn't really necessary.
The Rebel Alliance includes political leaders who are genuinely concerned and committed to freedom and the common good. If you find this more fantastic than the laser swords, starfighters, and the mystical energy binding all living things, I don't know what to tell you.
Steam, Warframe: Megajoule
Steam
That's where the whole timeline falls apart for me and I have to just kind of ignore it.
I had to wiki this, but bear with me.
19 BBY Order 66 launches and then 5 BBY, fourteen years later, Andor starts. 0 BBY, A New Hope Happens.
It just feels all so fast. Everyone goes from 'Jedi are Everywhere' to 'Jedi are a Legend' in 20 years.
Also Obi-wan develops selective amnesia and doesn’t recognize Leia, R2 and C-3PO.
Steam
It depends on a couple things.
We're seeing a very jedi and senate centric point of view in the late republic and we see that information technology isn't the same as in our world,
fascist destruction of culture and history happens very quickly.
Guess where the largest library in the world on human sexuality and lgbt thought/research was.
So I just count it as one of the many things the prequels screwed up and try to disregard it.
Jedi are so rare prior to the Clone Wars that Anakin only knows them through the context of galactic mythology.
The Clone Wars really throws a wrench in it all, because apparently Obi-Wan & Anakin becomes galactic superheroes for their war-time deeds.
On the one hand it implies that for a lot of people life under the Republic wasn’t much different, that certain systems were already in place and the transition to empire was merely a heightening and amplification of forces that were already there
On the other hand the fact that the timeline is so short means that people lived under the yoke of the Emperor for all of like… 17 years or so, which just feels weird! Like it should be longer, it feels like it should be this monolithic and entrenched thing that our heroes must fight against, and the scale of time for an entire Galaxy especially just seems like it should be longer for that
The Jedi stuff doesn’t bother me as much because like, if there was one Jedi temple, even if the temple held like a hundred thousand Jedi, galaxies are big! Jedi being mythical figures almost never seen basically makes sense, if you think about it at scale, but it’s just that in the movies we see, Jedi are a dime a dozen and flash their sabers around constantly, so it’s way less special to us. Which is a legit problem if you want to have that worldbuilding, because the audience’s experience is so different it makes it seem silly
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
Jedi were never everywhere. Even at their peak they were like 10,000 people in the entire galaxy. And most of those weren't Knights, but low level functionaries and what not.
The average person has almost certainly never seen a Jedi in action. So when they all get wiped out and likely the empire starts a propaganda campaign about how they were all seditious traitors and their religion is bullshit and magic tricks, most people believe them, especially someone like Han who literally grew up in a post-Jedi environment.
Against the millennial span of the Republic, the 20 years of Palpatine's Empire is like... an interregnum. A blip.
Steam, Warframe: Megajoule
The thing is for a lot of places, the difference between the Republic and the Empire is that the Empire flies more ships and you see Imperial Army patrolling the streets instead of whatever local peacekeeping force you used to have. Maybe if some shit goes down, a squad of Stormies shows up and everyone shits the bed.
Honestly, other than it being more overtly fashy, the Empire was much "Meet the New Boss, same as the old boss" for the galaxy at large unless you live on Coruscant or another galactic hotspot, or have to constantly engage with galactic bureaucracy/politics.
See but then they undercut that by showing us imperial outposts being set up that are cruel to indigenous folks and all of this sort of stuff, and it feels like it belongs in a universe where the empire has been around for at least a whole generation, maybe a century
I think part of the reason Star Wars has problems like this is when you have things that invite deeper analysis, alongside stuff that completely rebuffs the idea of deeper analysis, it can’t fit together as a cohesive whole and we should just stop trying to make it fit, y’know
…I mean I know that’s impossible, I’m just saying
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
Either Luke (and later Leia) were about the same age (up to nine-ish months younger) as Anakin's fall from grace, or their mom was evil too and he was able to love someone after becoming Vader (which kind of undercuts the "son's love turns him good" thing, and also would probably mean that Ben and Yoda straight up kidnapped Luke and Leia from their parents)...or the story has implications.
I mean you could if Ben would just learn to fucking duck out of the way every once in a while
and indeed they did not use it.
Today I work with more than one person for whom the US military has been actively holding formerly sovereign ground, policing the locals there, killing people and blowing things up for inscrutable reasons and without much accountability to the people being policed and/or blown up, for the entirety of their lives. That’s just what “the US military” is to them.
Granted, I live on Coruscant in the USA so I experience very little of the actual difference in the first person, but it’s no less real for my insulation from it.
That change is only twenty years’ difference. Luke is not even twenty when we meet him in ANH. Palpatine never quite got to the “…and then, we shall have peace” he desired in Revenge of the Sith; things would have gotten so much, much worse.
If anything, the fact that most of the Republic was in a state where all it took to fall to corporatist and fascist dystopia was a dedicated push to put the right people at the controls of all the existing systems is an even stronger condemnation of the Jedi Order’s final stagnation, rather than a stretching of credulity, for me.
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Because frankly it’s neat and all but I do wish Star Wars had a better universal calendar system, it’s my one big worldbuilding quibble with a setting that I normally avoid being pedantic about because it feels like something the people in the universe would have and they just… somehow never mention it for the audience’s benefit!
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
weirdly enough there is an in-setting calendar that also shows up in Andor (it's on the important bricks). It's been around for a while but is, irritatingly, super underutilized.
and was invented almost entirely because someone noted the absence of one and that it was weird.
but I suppose that's the inevitable (out of universe) result of starting the entire setting "in the middle" with an exciting and in-universe significant event. Especially for those of us who were around in 1977, it always comes back around to what we now call Episode IV, but was once simply Star Wars (all of it).
Steam, Warframe: Megajoule