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US Rental Eviction Moratorium Ends: SE Mutual Aid Action Station

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    PinfeldorfPinfeldorf Yeah ZestRegistered User regular
    I've been waiting multiple threads just to read this discussion for the tenth fucking time this summer. Maybe this time we can finally come to a consensus!

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    DouglasDangerDouglasDanger PennsylvaniaRegistered User regular
    Pinfeldorf wrote: »
    I've been waiting multiple threads just to read this discussion for the tenth fucking time this summer. Maybe this time we can finally come to a consensus!

    Pizza is an open-faced sandwich after all!

    Joy to world

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    OghulkOghulk Tinychat Janitor TinychatRegistered User regular
    lmao

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    JragghenJragghen Registered User regular
    Pinfeldorf wrote: »
    I've been waiting multiple threads just to read this discussion for the tenth fucking time this summer. Maybe this time we can finally come to a consensus!

    Pizza is an open-faced sandwich after all!

    Joy to world

    What about pizza rolls?

    https://youtu.be/wHIej9j7xyM

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    DJ EebsDJ Eebs Moderator, Administrator admin
    pizza rolls are tiny calzones

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    Goose!Goose! That's me, honey Show me the way home, honeyRegistered User regular
    Was gonna put this in the captialism thread but: $1661/month is a lot to pay for a 1 bedroom apartment. But that is the lease I find myself entering into starting today. So...yay for having a place to live, I guess?

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    Brovid HasselsmofBrovid Hasselsmof [Growling historic on the fury road] Registered User regular
    That extra $1 just seems like they're having a laugh

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    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited August 2022
    Heffling wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Heffling wrote: »
    Oghulk wrote: »
    It would be very cool if when someone says "it wasn't enough" the immediate response is "well it's decent enough what'd you expect"

    Like, this will benefit me substantially and I've still been against it (except for the new changes announced about interest on payments for those people 225% poverty) specifically because it doesn't address the structural problems in higher ed. I think most people recognize it's a good thing but we have to push the powerful to get more.

    What would you have Biden do via Executive Order? Fixing systematic education issues is a bit beyond that scope. And sure you can say Dems control Congress but if Manchin or Sinema are against the reform then no they actually don't.

    Yeah see this. This right here. This is what I'm talking about.

    Oghulk,

    I get it. I really do. This is a temporary patch at best and does nothing to address the underlying issues that created the problem in the first place. I am both very happy that anything at all happened and very frustrated that my party is incapable of doing more.
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    You don't get to talk about what a big tent you've got pitched and then blame everything on the clowns you invited inside.

    Why not? Would you rather we simply not have enough votes so we couldn't pass any legislation or fill any positions requiring Senate approval?

    Single Payer was killed by Leiberman because we were in the same position on the ACA. This is going to be an issue any time we need votes because despite being in a nominally two party system we are reliant on our coalitions within the party.

    All a non-big tent approach would do is have us lose to Republicans.

    The Democrats sucking less is going to lead to the Republicans winning more?

    Do tell!

    DarkPrimus on
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    Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    Democrats arent a big tent! They aggressively police their ideological makeup!

    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
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    Speed RacerSpeed Racer Scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratchRegistered User regular
    Democrats arent a big tent! They aggressively police their ideological makeup!

    Ah don't be silly they welcome anyone and everyone to vote for them

    And to otherwise shut the fuck up

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    tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    Democrats arent a big tent! They aggressively police their ideological makeup!

    Now, now. You can be a pro-abortion capitalist neolib OR an anti-abortion capitalist neolib, there's room for both!

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    Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    Democrats arent a big tent! They aggressively police their ideological makeup!

    Ah don't be silly they welcome anyone and everyone to vote for them

    And to otherwise shut the fuck up

    Got white neo liberals, black neo liberals, gay neo liberals

    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
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    CoinageCoinage Heaviside LayerRegistered User regular
    The important thing is the Republican chairman of the Federal Reserve is working hard to time a recession right before the midterms

    Happiness is within reach!
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    Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    Coinage wrote: »
    The important thing is the Republican chairman of the Federal Reserve is working hard to time a recession right before the midterms

    That cant be, the Fed is nonpartisan!

    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
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    BucketmanBucketman Call me SkraggRegistered User regular
    All this is cool, I guess Biden's admin increased the amount and time period you can go back for getting loans discharged for a fraudulent school. My wife's bachelor's was from a fraud school. But the thing is she already paid it off, current admin has made it so she can get some of that back. It will take around 30 months to process it, but that's fairly cool

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    Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    Fraud School should be where you go to learn crimes. Like a feeder college for the Thieves Guild

    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
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    KadithKadith Registered User regular
    Fraud School should be where you go to learn crimes. Like a feeder college for the Thieves Guild

    yeah it's also called ivy league schools

    heyoooo

    zkHcp.jpg
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    Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    Kadith wrote: »
    Fraud School should be where you go to learn crimes. Like a feeder college for the Thieves Guild

    yeah it's also called ivy league schools

    heyoooo

    No no something more specialized so you dont have to waste time learning economics and how to do war crimes.

    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
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    BahamutZEROBahamutZERO Registered User, Moderator mod
    I think the school I went to was just enough of not a fraud to not get caught so I'm fucked

    BahamutZERO.gif
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    BucketmanBucketman Call me SkraggRegistered User regular
    Coinage wrote: »
    The important thing is the Republican chairman of the Federal Reserve is working hard to time a recession right before the midterms

    So I've heard this a few times in the last couple days, but I don't know enough about economics, how is he doing this? By raising interest rates?

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    Beef AvengerBeef Avenger Registered User regular
    Content warning for if you just really don't want to engage in right wing propaganda at all



    This shit is wild and unintentionally hilarious

    Steam ID
    PSN: Robo_Wizard1
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    CoinageCoinage Heaviside LayerRegistered User regular
    Bucketman wrote: »
    Coinage wrote: »
    The important thing is the Republican chairman of the Federal Reserve is working hard to time a recession right before the midterms

    So I've heard this a few times in the last couple days, but I don't know enough about economics, how is he doing this? By raising interest rates?
    Yes, if the interest rates are "too high" it can crush demand, creating a feedback loop that causes a recession. Now to play devil's advocate, everything is fake, so he could be just trying to get rich assholes to calm down about inflation and we can squeak through this with just a few quarters of limited growth. Everything else aside, everyone has always been bad at predicting the future.

    Happiness is within reach!
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    Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    Coinage wrote: »
    Bucketman wrote: »
    Coinage wrote: »
    The important thing is the Republican chairman of the Federal Reserve is working hard to time a recession right before the midterms

    So I've heard this a few times in the last couple days, but I don't know enough about economics, how is he doing this? By raising interest rates?
    Yes, if the interest rates are "too high" it can crush demand, creating a feedback loop that causes a recession. Now to play devil's advocate, everything is fake, so he could be just trying to get rich assholes to calm down about inflation and we can squeak through this with just a few quarters of limited growth. Everything else aside, everyone has always been bad at predicting the future.

    Because shit is dumb, his credibility about being willing to raise rates is only slightly less important than him actually doing so, so yes

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    JokermanJokerman Everything EverywhereRegistered User regular
    Coinage wrote: »
    Bucketman wrote: »
    Coinage wrote: »
    The important thing is the Republican chairman of the Federal Reserve is working hard to time a recession right before the midterms

    So I've heard this a few times in the last couple days, but I don't know enough about economics, how is he doing this? By raising interest rates?
    Yes, if the interest rates are "too high" it can crush demand, creating a feedback loop that causes a recession. Now to play devil's advocate, everything is fake, so he could be just trying to get rich assholes to calm down about inflation and we can squeak through this with just a few quarters of limited growth. Everything else aside, everyone has always been bad at predicting the future.

    Haven't interest rates been at all time lows for awhile now?

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    StericaSterica Yes Registered User, Moderator mod
    Yeah my private loans are all fucked due to the rate hikes. And those won’t go away, to the point where if we ever invent a Lazarus machine in this capitalist hellhole, it will be to revive people who died with outstanding Sallie Mae loans.

    YL9WnCY.png
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    MrMonroeMrMonroe passed out on the floor nowRegistered User regular
    That extra $1 just seems like they're having a laugh

    I've never gotten one to admit it, but my suspicion is that realtors/landlords set prices at non-round numbers pretty much entirely to create the impression that they've used some kind of highly scientific methodology for determining the "correct" or "fair" price for a home to disguise the fact that they are in fact pulling every estimate straight out of their buttholes.

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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    MrMonroe wrote: »
    That extra $1 just seems like they're having a laugh

    I've never gotten one to admit it, but my suspicion is that realtors/landlords set prices at non-round numbers pretty much entirely to create the impression that they've used some kind of highly scientific methodology for determining the "correct" or "fair" price for a home to disguise the fact that they are in fact pulling every estimate straight out of their buttholes.

    Wouldn’t surprise me, pretty common negotiation tactic thanks to our dumb lizard brains.

    Round numbers seem adjustable, specific numbers do not.

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    LadaiLadai Registered User regular
    Jragghen wrote: »

    I can literally remember exactly where I was when I first saw that Harris tweet. I was in a bar and I think I laughed for a solid minute.

    It's such a perfect example of a centrist Democrat "solution" that's specifically designed to help as few people as possible.

    ely3ub6du1oe.jpg
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    ProhassProhass Registered User regular
    TryCatcher wrote: »

    For those wondering, that comes in response to this "analysis":


    EDIT: Nate Bronze is wrong there because is not that PPP is bad, is that the same people that got PPP loans than then were forgiven are attacking the student debt relief, which makes them a bunch of hypocrites. Is obvious, but needs to be said.

    My god. How can he be so thick, it has to be wilful.

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    JokermanJokerman Everything EverywhereRegistered User regular
    Content warning for if you just really don't want to engage in right wing propaganda at all



    This shit is wild and unintentionally hilarious

    Holy shit they straight up plagiarized the trailer for Vice

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g09a9laLh0k

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    OghulkOghulk Tinychat Janitor TinychatRegistered User regular
    Ladai wrote: »
    Jragghen wrote: »

    I can literally remember exactly where I was when I first saw that Harris tweet. I was in a bar and I think I laughed for a solid minute.

    It's such a perfect example of a centrist Democrat "solution" that's specifically designed to help as few people as possible.

    Up until just now I thought when everyone brought it up it was a satire of the kind of bullshit centrist Dems do.

    Jesus fucking christ.

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    NarbusNarbus Registered User regular
    edited August 2022
    Bucketman wrote: »
    Coinage wrote: »
    The important thing is the Republican chairman of the Federal Reserve is working hard to time a recession right before the midterms

    So I've heard this a few times in the last couple days, but I don't know enough about economics, how is he doing this? By raising interest rates?

    The most straightforward definition of inflation is "too much money chasing after too few goods". Right now there's a lot of money in the economy as we have really low unemployment and people are spending the record level of savings they built up during lockdown. That really low unemployment means A: a lot of people earning wages, 2: There's a lot of pressure driving up those wages. On the other side, we have a lot fewer goods thanks to COVID knackering up supply chains and Russia fucking up energy and food prices which spill over into a lot of other parts of the economy. Inflation is really getting hit from both ends.

    What the Fed is trying to do here is slow down spending - slow down that chase - giving the economy the chance to balance itself out and realign demand to the actual supply of stuff out there. They're doing this by raising interest rates, so it costs more to borrow money to buy stuff for both consumers and businesses, which means spending slows, which means inflation comes down, in theory, at least. It's not the Fed trying to gin up a recession, they're aiming for what they're calling a "soft landing"\ where the economy keeps on going, just a little slower. If you think of GDP on a graph, the idea is that they want to keep the line going up, just not as sharp a slope. This will likely have the side effect of a slightly higher unemployment rate, but 4-5% unemployment is still "healthy". I mean, there's always going to be people aging into and out of the labor force, people who leave/reenter the work force because of children or caring for sick relatives, folks who move because their spouse got a job, etc etc. Some level of turnover is normal. At 4-5% unemployment, it's usually the case that people who want a job can get one, it just takes a little time.

    As a side note, the chair of the Fed doesn't set interest rates. The twelve-member Federal Open Market Committe (FOMC) does that with a majority vote, and the chair gets just the one vote. Of those twelve members, four were directly nominated by Democrats, with four others taking their seats during Democratic administrations. Also, ever since the Great Recession the Fed has gone out of their way to be as apolitical as possible, a lot of folks on the hill weren't happy when they found out just how much power the Fed had. All in all the idea that they're trying to intentionally cause a recession to fuck the midterms over to Republicans is not something that's actually attached to reality in any way.

    Narbus on
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    OghulkOghulk Tinychat Janitor TinychatRegistered User regular
    It would be very difficult for the Fed to raise interest rates in such a way right now that it creates unemployment significant enough to fuck the midterms in two months from now.

    Like, they started raising rates two quarters ago and we're only now seeing that reduction in inflation.

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    I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
    conservatives also don't understand how economics work so they have a hard time manipulating it

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    OghulkOghulk Tinychat Janitor TinychatRegistered User regular
    I'll also say, from everything I've read about Jerome Powell, he's much more of a bureaucrat than an economist/policy-wonk so the idea that he specifically is pushing for a recession doesn't really line up -- if anything he's probably deferring to the FOMC more extensively than past chairs.

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    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    Looking at the the Fed Chair's own words certainly doesn't make things less frustrating.
    Without price stability, the economy does not work for anyone. In particular, without price stability, we will not achieve a sustained period of strong labor market conditions that benefit all. The burdens of high inflation fall heaviest on those who are least able to bear them.
    Restoring price stability will take some time and requires using our tools forcefully to bring demand and supply into better balance. Reducing inflation is likely to require a sustained period of below-trend growth. Moreover, there will very likely be some softening of labor market conditions. While higher interest rates, slower growth, and softer labor market conditions will bring down inflation, they will also bring some pain to households and businesses. These are the unfortunate costs of reducing inflation. But a failure to restore price stability would mean far greater pain.
    The labor market is particularly strong, but it is clearly out of balance, with demand for workers substantially exceeding the supply of available workers.
    That brings me to the third lesson, which is that we must keep at it until the job is done. History shows that the employment costs of bringing down inflation are likely to increase with delay, as high inflation becomes more entrenched in wage and price setting. The successful Volcker disinflation in the early 1980s followed multiple failed attempts to lower inflation over the previous 15 years. A lengthy period of very restrictive monetary policy was ultimately needed to stem the high inflation and start the process of getting inflation down to the low and stable levels that were the norm until the spring of last year. Our aim is to avoid that outcome by acting with resolve now.


    We're in a strong labor market right the fuck now, but it's too lopsided for workers instead of employers, and the economy is supposed to work for the benefit of employers, not workers. So we have to punish the workers with higher inflation in order to get them to accept lower wages in order to not starve. This will make the economy do better, which is good for America even though the American worker will be worse off.

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    ProhassProhass Registered User regular
    All hail the economy, feed your children into its maw and be grateful

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    LanzLanz ...Za?Registered User regular
    edited August 2022
    It seems difficult to accept the idea that inflation is truly being caused by supply crunch when company after company just, coincidentally, crows about their record high profits, and further buy each other out and consolidate market control into themselves. Coincidentally.

    Surely it’s not a symptom of a cancerous level of oligopoly, where the top players can demand whatever price they want and distort the market accordingly

    Lanz on
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    ProhassProhass Registered User regular
    Lanz wrote: »
    It seems difficult to accept the idea that inflation is truly being caused by supply crunch when company after company just, coincidentally, crows about their record high profits, and further buy each other out and consolidate market control into themselves. Coincidentally.

    Surely it’s not a symptom of a cancerous level of oligopoly, where the top players can demand whatever price they want and distort the market accordingly

    No, it’s the workers who are wrong

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