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The Suicide Squad is going to blow your mind [open spoilers]

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  • cursedkingcursedking Registered User regular
    edited August 2021
    Maddoc wrote: »
    Stallone was 100% just stunt casting, that voice role could have been played by basically anyone

    You mean like Vin Diesel as Groot?

    Actually, now that I think about it, is it just me or do Gunn's interpretations of Groot and King Shark bear a lot of similarities? Big lumbering CGI characters with childlike demeanors and limited vocabulary voiced by famous actors? They're not identical of course, but they're closer than I had realized at the time.

    There are several ways in which suicide squad is a distorted picture of guardians. Like Weasel is 100% a rocket racoon/animal sidekick joke.

    cursedking on
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  • ToxTox I kill threads he/himRegistered User regular
    edited August 2021
    I've decided that once we started seeing the flowers and stuff in the Harley fight scene, anything we see after that it's safe to assume is unreliable narrator territory. We're functionally in her head at that point, and in her mind she's a super hero, so of course she'd have ended up doing something that you wouldn't expect from just Harley.

    e: Also my head canon for Harley/Ivy is that Ivy was a TA in college for Harley's freshmen biology class and that's how they first met.

    Tox on
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  • Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    cursedking wrote: »
    Maddoc wrote: »
    Stallone was 100% just stunt casting, that voice role could have been played by basically anyone

    You mean like Vin Diesel as Groot?

    Actually, now that I think about it, is it just me or do Gunn's interpretations of Groot and King Shark bear a lot of similarities? Big lumbering CGI characters with childlike demeanors and limited vocabulary voiced by famous actors? They're not identical of course, but they're closer than I had realized at the time.

    There are several ways in which suicide squad is a distorted picture of guardians. Like Weasel is 100% a rocket racoon/animal sidekick joke.

    …the movie had an animal sidekick

    Why is that rat waving at me

    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
  • Bloods EndBloods End Blade of Tyshalle Punch dimensionRegistered User regular
    Justice for Milton

  • MvrckMvrck Dwarven MountainhomeRegistered User regular
    Bloods End wrote: »
    Justice for Milton

    Why does he need justice?
    He survived and blackmailed Waller and everything.

    Matev3cl1ps3GnizmoOlivawnever dieCojo Mojo
  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    Ok so

    WOW

    So I fucking HATED the beginning of this movie. Almost made me turn it off. Really set off the existential dread I have whenever I think about the CIA. I know that Amanda Waller will be getting some comeuppance for being little human garbage but I can't imagine she possibly gets enough to make my stomach stop turning.

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  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    If it helps, pretty much the entire movie agrees that she's a monstrous dickbag who isn't even that great at her job.

  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    If it helps, pretty much the entire movie agrees that she's a monstrous dickbag who isn't even that great at her job.

    Oh I have no doubt especially with how subtle her getting all the rebels killed was. Malice or stupidity? With American foreign policy being what it is who can say?

    With my limited spoilers I know she's going to get some comeuppance but she isn't going to die after seeing everything she has ever wanted stripped from her and also verbally destroyed by someone with actual moral character so I'm still going to be frustrated in the end.

    I'm impressed with this movie's willingness to have these people be truly despicable and actually let you stew with with what that means but lord is it hard to watch.

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  • Dark Raven XDark Raven X Laugh hard, run fast, be kindRegistered User regular
    The movie plays it as oopsie whoopsies but given how Waller acts towards the end of the movie, I think she deffo knew she was sending them after the freedom fighters.

    Oh brilliant
    MatevGnizmoMysst
  • OlivawOlivaw good name, isn't it? the foot of mt fujiRegistered User regular
    The movie plays it as oopsie whoopsies but given how Waller acts towards the end of the movie, I think she deffo knew she was sending them after the freedom fighters.

    Honestly I get the same vibe, but since she apparently also didn't know Weasel couldn't swim...

    Well American foreign policy's incompetence is often indistinguishable from its malice, so who can say

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  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    Yeah I liked this movie but Waller remains firmly in her position and that sucks.

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  • Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    The movie plays it as oopsie whoopsies but given how Waller acts towards the end of the movie, I think she deffo knew she was sending them after the freedom fighters.

    I don’t think she cared.

    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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  • StraightziStraightzi Here we may reign secure, and in my choice, To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered User regular
    Yeah I liked this movie but Waller remains firmly in her position and that sucks.

    This feels to me like being disappointed that Bruce Wayne is still Batman at the end of one of those movies

    She's the main character of the Suicide Squad, this is an Amanda Waller movie

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  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    Straightzi wrote: »
    Yeah I liked this movie but Waller remains firmly in her position and that sucks.

    This feels to me like being disappointed that Bruce Wayne is still Batman at the end of one of those movies

    She's the main character of the Suicide Squad, this is an Amanda Waller movie

    I don't think that there is any definition of main character that really applies to Amanda Waller in these movies. Hell in this one she is literally and antagonist.

    That seems besides the point though. Even if she was the main character that seems a pretty pointless comparison. That entire thematic thrust of this movie is that Amanda is leagues worse than the people she employs. This movie very intentionally paints the picture of a horrifyingly incompetent mass murderer and she gets away with it because she is a metaphor for American foreign policy. I understand that but at the same time am disgusted by her and her continued success. I want for her what I want for the real people that you represents which is at least for them not to be able to hurt people anymore. It disappoints me that she wasn't.

    I suppose the comparison would be apt if we were talking about a Batman movie in which the thrust of the movie was that Batman makes everything worse and we shouldn't have a Batman.

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  • DepressperadoDepressperado I just wanted to see you laughing in the pizza rainRegistered User regular
    edited August 2021
    I suppose the comparison would be apt if we were talking about a Batman movie in which the thrust of the movie was that Batman makes everything worse and we shouldn't have a Batman.

    that's basically what The Dark Knight Rises was, wasn't it?

    I legitimately ask, not having seen any part of the movie that wasn't Bane doing Bane stuff.

    Depressperado on
  • StraightziStraightzi Here we may reign secure, and in my choice, To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered User regular
    I suppose the comparison would be apt if we were talking about a Batman movie in which the thrust of the movie was that Batman makes everything worse and we shouldn't have a Batman.

    Oh you mean a Chris Nolan film?

    More seriously, Waller is absolutely one of the main characters of the Suicide Squad (comics and film alike) to me, and was one of my main draws of seeing this movie. Viola Davis does a good job even when they write very dumb shit for her. Suicide Squad is a series about people doing things that are at minimum morally gray in a world full of black and white superheroics, and that is ultimately what I want out of it - I want to see people struggle with moral quandaries along the way still of course, I want there to be tension there, but I don't think that should necessarily lead to things shaking back out into evildoers being punished and all that jazz.

  • shoeboxjeddyshoeboxjeddy Registered User regular
    Yeah, ending a movie about villain protagonists with a mega happy ending would feel disingenuous and naive. I would not like it at all.

  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    Yeah, ending a movie about villain protagonists with a mega happy ending would feel disingenuous and naive. I would not like it at all.

    You don't think that this is maybe a wild extrapolation from my much more mild take of "Waller is so disgustingly horrifyingly evil in this movie that even though she faces consequences for her actions they are so mild that they do not erase my feeling of discomfort and unease created by the start movie and I didn't like that"?

    Quire.jpg
  • shoeboxjeddyshoeboxjeddy Registered User regular
    Yeah, ending a movie about villain protagonists with a mega happy ending would feel disingenuous and naive. I would not like it at all.

    You don't think that this is maybe a wild extrapolation from my much more mild take of "Waller is so disgustingly horrifyingly evil in this movie that even though she faces consequences for her actions they are so mild that they do not erase my feeling of discomfort and unease created by the start movie and I didn't like that"?

    I never said your feelings were unreasonable, only that I can't imagine a version of the movie where the evil program that is the basis for the series is eliminated. Kind of removes the intended thematic bite if "and any individual person can stop the evils of the US government just by trying for a few seconds" is an option.

  • GnizmoGnizmo Registered User regular
    Yeah, ending a movie about villain protagonists with a mega happy ending would feel disingenuous and naive. I would not like it at all.

    You don't think that this is maybe a wild extrapolation from my much more mild take of "Waller is so disgustingly horrifyingly evil in this movie that even though she faces consequences for her actions they are so mild that they do not erase my feeling of discomfort and unease created by the start movie and I didn't like that"?

    I never said your feelings were unreasonable, only that I can't imagine a version of the movie where the evil program that is the basis for the series is eliminated. Kind of removes the intended thematic bite if "and any individual person can stop the evils of the US government just by trying for a few seconds" is an option.

    This is where I am with it as well. The Suicide Squad program is monstrous. Anyone running it is going to come off as irredeemably evil. Unless you want to cycle through people running the program every movie then it won't be a satisfying end by these standards. If you do then it is a different kind of evil program that also sparks similar problems. The Suicide Squad is a premise about bad people doing, at best, questionably good things in an extremely bad way.

    I am not saying it is wrong to want this. I am saying that it is probably best to just skip the movies of that will leave you not liking the movies.

  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    I feel like Waller getting her comeuppance is the kind thing you reserve for the third movie in a trilogy.

    Magell
  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    I feel like Waller getting her comeuppance is the kind thing you reserve for the third movie in a trilogy.

    Well as long as it comes.

    I want to clarify here that I did in fact like the movie. Movies that depict extremely realistic casual disregard for human being like the beginning did however give me lots of unpleasant feelings to sort through. I would have preferred if Waller really got taken is all I'm saying.

    Also I would in general argue that this Waller is unusually evil for a Waller depiction. Gunn went ahead and took examples from real people that are in every way the worst people alive and because of that it's more visceral and gross.

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  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    edited August 2021
    For one thing there is no good thing that Waller is trying to do in this movie. People keep describing this as bad people trying to do ostensibly good things through bad means but that is actually not at all a description of this movie's plot. I don't remember much of the first suicide squad so it might be accurate when describing that one but definitely not this one. In this story Waller's goal is to do nothing more or less than hide war crimes and in order to do it she releases a literal kaiju monster upon the world and then tries to shrug and go away. That is also not something that I would describe as gray morality. Waller is the worst person in this entire movie of very terrible people and I don't think it's particularly close.

    nightmarenny on
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  • shoeboxjeddyshoeboxjeddy Registered User regular
    Everyone maybe forgets this because of how terrible the movie as a whole was, but in the first one, Waller cold bloodedly executes an entire room full of (presumably) civil servants like herself to... keep the secret of how utterly bankrupt and shitty her schemes have been? The movie version of her has always been an irredeemable sack of crap.

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  • Bloods EndBloods End Blade of Tyshalle Punch dimensionRegistered User regular
    I suppose the comparison would be apt if we were talking about a Batman movie in which the thrust of the movie was that Batman makes everything worse and we shouldn't have a Batman.

    that's basically what The Dark Knight Rises was, wasn't it?

    I legitimately ask, not having seen any part of the movie that wasn't Bane doing Bane stuff.

    No. Not even a little bit?

    KanaOlivawEvilCake
  • StraightziStraightzi Here we may reign secure, and in my choice, To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered User regular
    I will note that, in being here for the movie as a Suicide Squad and Amanda Waller fan, I've also been critical of how cavalier she was about Starro. I think that made her too openly villainous and made the whole situation too black and white, and would have preferred a version where, when the team refused to follow her extraction orders, she switched to a different plan that would also work out to her advantage (which I also think would have worked better for the comments about Bloodsport turning into a decent leader after all).

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  • DepressperadoDepressperado I just wanted to see you laughing in the pizza rainRegistered User regular
    Bloods End wrote: »
    I suppose the comparison would be apt if we were talking about a Batman movie in which the thrust of the movie was that Batman makes everything worse and we shouldn't have a Batman.

    that's basically what The Dark Knight Rises was, wasn't it?

    I legitimately ask, not having seen any part of the movie that wasn't Bane doing Bane stuff.

    No. Not even a little bit?

    I mean, to be fair, Batman fucking sucks in both Batman Begins and The Dark Knight, I assumed it was going to be a trilogy-spanning thing.

  • Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    let the the suicide squad suicide squad meet the arrow suicide squad

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  • PoorochondriacPoorochondriac Ah, man Ah, jeezRegistered User regular
    Suicide Squad, Doom Patrol, Avengers, Hellfire Club

    Everyone's having such a bad time

    Why not a team called The Group for Good Times and Good Vibes

  • Dex DynamoDex Dynamo Registered User regular
    Suicide Squad, Doom Patrol, Avengers, Hellfire Club

    Everyone's having such a bad time

    Why not a team called The Group for Good Times and Good Vibes

    I too wish there was a Justice League International movie

    Lost Canuck
  • Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    Suicide Squad, Doom Patrol, Avengers, Hellfire Club

    Everyone's having such a bad time

    Why not a team called The Group for Good Times and Good Vibes

    oh, you mean dc's legends of tomorrow

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  • shoeboxjeddyshoeboxjeddy Registered User regular
    Suicide Squad, Doom Patrol, Avengers, Hellfire Club

    Everyone's having such a bad time

    Why not a team called The Group for Good Times and Good Vibes

    This would be the Teen Titans Go.

    DepressperadoDex Dynamo
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